Ashara 1436 Surat

The one and only free public forum for Bohras. The focus of this forum is the reform movement, the Dawoodi Bohra faith and, of course, the corrupt priesthood. But the discussion is in no way restricted to the Bohras alone.
haqniwaat
Posts: 516
Joined: Wed Aug 06, 2014 6:06 pm

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#271

Unread post by haqniwaat » Sat Nov 01, 2014 12:37 am

Rehmat and aeb dhaankwu - things muffy cannot do. Video attached.
Attachments
rehmat_and_aeb_dhankwu.mp4
(15.67 MiB) Downloaded 2072 times

maddy
Posts: 73
Joined: Sat Nov 23, 2013 9:12 am

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#272

Unread post by maddy » Sat Nov 01, 2014 5:27 am

In today waayez QJ bs said that he received call from Taher bs and he said they will send their kids to SMS back ???????

Spectator
Posts: 52
Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2014 7:08 pm

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#273

Unread post by Spectator » Sat Nov 01, 2014 5:45 am

Maddy I heard no such thing. Perhaps I was asleep?

maddy
Posts: 73
Joined: Sat Nov 23, 2013 9:12 am

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#274

Unread post by maddy » Sat Nov 01, 2014 6:25 am

It was before waayez

humanbeing
Posts: 2195
Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2011 2:30 am

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#275

Unread post by humanbeing » Sat Nov 01, 2014 6:34 am

maddy wrote:In today waayez QJ bs said that he received call from Taher bs and he said they will send their kids to SMS back ???????
In today’s Live Tamasha Relay : There was a old man, who started a vote of thanks speech, narrating SMS’s pain of separating from grandkids ! during that short speech, this old man said something about taha bhai saab assuring well being of the grand kids in Amreeka !

Spectator
Posts: 52
Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2014 7:08 pm

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#276

Unread post by Spectator » Sat Nov 01, 2014 6:37 am

Oh that explains it. Can anyone confirm if QJ said this? Anyway I don't really trust what spews out from various shezaadas' mouths. A lot of hearsay.

kimanumanu
Posts: 607
Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2014 2:16 pm

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#277

Unread post by kimanumanu » Sat Nov 01, 2014 6:55 am

I heard that they have visitation rights - whatever that means. Sounds like something that is part of separation/divorce proceedings? It was indeed spoken off as a "miracle" due to the dua that was done the previous day.

EDIT: The "old man" I am presuming is a reference to QJ.

Kharas_Mithas
Posts: 54
Joined: Tue Jun 17, 2014 11:20 am

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#278

Unread post by Kharas_Mithas » Sat Nov 01, 2014 8:49 am

Al Zulfiqar wrote:
haqniwaat wrote: it seems to me like the Quraan itself is promoting what you call shirk.
spoken like a true mushriq. can anyone fall to a lower and more disgusting level of idol worship than this nut case? admin, its high time this jaahil idiot was banned from this forum once and for all.
Bro AZ
When People revolve around KABA and when the black cloth is raised, I have seen people rubbing rumaal and treasure that for years. My colleges, from sunni sect did the same on returning from umra and indeed feeling proud that they got this opportunity.
People die to kiss Hajare Aswad stone, many get injured while pulling there face out. Do we call this shirk??
Why millions is spent on changing kaba cloth? I don't know if it's done every year?

I would appreciate respectful answers from the learned folks on this forum. I have raised the above to clear my doubts and not with an intention of disrespect.

fustrate_Bohra
Posts: 678
Joined: Mon Nov 25, 2013 6:46 am

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#279

Unread post by fustrate_Bohra » Sat Nov 01, 2014 9:36 am

In Islam, shirk (Arabic: شرك‎ širk) refers to the sin of practising idolatry or polytheism, i.e. the deification or worship of anyone or anything other than the singular God i.e. Allah. Literally, it means the establishment of "partners" placed beside God. It is the vice that is opposed to the virtue of Tawhid (monotheism).[1]

Within Islam, shirk is an unforgivable crime if remained unpardoned before death: God may forgive any sin if one dies in that state except for committing shirk.[1][2]


The word širk comes from the Arabic root Š-R-K (ش ر ك), with the general meaning of "to share".[3] In the context of the Quran, the particular sense of "sharing as an equal partner" is usually understood, so that polytheism means "attributing a partner to Allah". In the Qur'an, shirk and the related word mušrikūn (مشركون), — those who commit shirk and plot against Islam — often refer to the enemies of Islam (as in verse 9.1–15).

Another form of shirk mentioned in the Qur'an is to take scholars of religion, monks, divines, or religious lawyers as Lord(s) in practice by following their doctrines, and/or by following their rulings on what is lawful when it is at variance to the law or doctrines prescribed by God's revelation.[5][6]

The above is taken from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shirk_(Islam)

The paragraph in green is what we do.

kimanumanu
Posts: 607
Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2014 2:16 pm

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#280

Unread post by kimanumanu » Sat Nov 01, 2014 10:28 am

We have "Walayat" as one of the pillars in our doctrine and I can see how that can be interpreted/mis-interpreted. With that then comes "ta'at" and then the sajda, absolute obedience to "farmaans", etc

Is this what the accusation around shirk stem from?

WiththenameofAllah
Posts: 230
Joined: Sat May 24, 2014 9:13 am

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#281

Unread post by WiththenameofAllah » Sat Nov 01, 2014 10:39 am

I was talking to a Mola lover and told them that this sajda is shirk and they should avoid. They started by asking me do you do salam to your parents. I said yes. They asked do you kiss their lap I said yes and they said same way We respect our spiritual leader by kissing hand and i told them that now you do sajdahs and then said yes but community people have started sajdah and it has become a trend :D They agreed . This is for brother Fayyaz , topiwala , taheermaka , etc.

kimanumanu
Posts: 607
Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2014 2:16 pm

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#282

Unread post by kimanumanu » Sat Nov 01, 2014 10:41 am

Add to that gudda chumwanu :)

fustrate_Bohra
Posts: 678
Joined: Mon Nov 25, 2013 6:46 am

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#283

Unread post by fustrate_Bohra » Sat Nov 01, 2014 10:56 am

WiththenameofAllah wrote:I was talking to a Mola lover and told them that this sajda is shirk and they should avoid. They started by asking me do you do salam to your parents. I said yes. They asked do you kiss their lap I said yes and they said same way We respect our spiritual leader by kissing hand and i told them that now you do sajdahs and then said yes but community people have started sajdah and it has become a trend :D They agreed . This is for brother Fayyaz , topiwala , taheermaka , etc.
For blind followers DAI is god and hence for them its not SHIRK. Infact for them DAI is superior than GOD though they wont accept this but theirs behavior tells everything.

maddy
Posts: 73
Joined: Sat Nov 23, 2013 9:12 am

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#284

Unread post by maddy » Sat Nov 01, 2014 12:14 pm

Aaje SMS ye shahadat ma ek aur turning point laaya
Aaj tak sunu hatu ke Jung ma gaya bad Ali Akbar pachha aaya pani ni talab vaste par aaj to Kasim bhi aaya pachha for same purpose .

Par samaj ma ye na aayu ke jivare Ali Akbar aaya tha to Imam Husain(a.s) ye aapni sukhi zuban chusavi lidhi ane Nana Nabi ni anguthi aapi ke aa jivar lag hase piyas nahii lage to aa j same amal vo kasim sath bhi kari sakte . . . . .
2)
SMS ye kidhu ke Kasim ni age 11 years hati , to agar kasim ni umar 11 year to Abdullah ni kitni age thi ? Kitni age ma Abdullah na nikah padhi aapa ?? And what about Kasim ?? Ehna nikah ??

3)
Shahadat ma kidhu ke Kasim ye ajab shaan si jehad kidhi ane kidhu ke aap ye ek pahelvan na 4 farzando ane pachi vo pahelvan ne qatal kidha
Have socho ke agar ek ne qatal karva ma min 5-7 min bhi thai to total 5 mili ne qatal karva ma min 30-40 min to thai , to total kitno time only Kasim na jehad ma thayo and baki sab na time count thai to kai tarah ??
Fazar ma harubharu ghar thu ane asar ma 18 zanaza nikla to agar ek ek ma itno time to kai tarah possible ????

Rebel
Posts: 434
Joined: Tue Feb 11, 2014 10:42 pm

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#285

Unread post by Rebel » Sat Nov 01, 2014 12:25 pm

maddy wrote:Aaje SMS ye shahadat ma ek aur turning point laaya
Aaj tak sunu hatu ke Jung ma gaya bad Ali Akbar pachha aaya pani ni talab vaste par aaj to Kasim bhi aaya pachha for same purpose .

Par samaj ma ye na aayu ke jivare Ali Akbar aaya tha to Imam Husain(a.s) ye aapni sukhi zuban chusavi lidhi ane Nana Nabi ni anguthi aapi ke aa jivar lag hase piyas nahii lage to aa j same amal vo kasim sath bhi kari sakte . . . . .
2)
SMS ye kidhu ke Kasim ni age 11 years hati , to agar kasim ni umar 11 year to Abdullah ni kitni age thi ? Kitni age ma Abdullah na nikah padhi aapa ?? And what about Kasim ?? Ehna nikah ??

3)
Shahadat ma kidhu ke Kasim ye ajab shaan si jehad kidhi ane kidhu ke aap ye ek pahelvan na 4 farzando ane pachi vo pahelvan ne qatal kidha
Have socho ke agar ek ne qatal karva ma min 5-7 min bhi thai to total 5 mili ne qatal karva ma min 30-40 min to thai , to total kitno time only Kasim na jehad ma thayo and baki sab na time count thai to kai tarah ??
Fazar ma harubharu ghar thu ane asar ma 18 zanaza nikla to agar ek ek ma itno time to kai tarah possible ????
LOL...most of the things that you hear from these mullahs is nothing more than fiction...most of the people who listen to these stories are mindless zombies whose mind cannot process deductive reasoning...I have met even very educated people sitting in the majlis and agreeing to what the mullahs throws out at us.

salaar
Posts: 635
Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2014 8:36 am

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#286

Unread post by salaar » Sat Nov 01, 2014 1:01 pm

Zalzalo mai dunya this aasma larazta tha... Rayeg garm sehra par Shah e deen ka laasha tha...
bae qarar moujey thi shoola baar darya tha... Ibn e Saqi e Kausar teen din se piyasa tha...
Har qadam pae thoukar thi dil mae dard uthta tha... Shah ki naatawani thi noujawan ka laasha tha...
Qalb fouj mae utthi inqilab ki lehrayn... Dast e Shah par piyasa sheer khawar bacha tha...
Tishna lab won mehmaan thae Karbala ke jungle mae... jinkay wastay paani khoon se bhi mehnga tha...
Qatal ho gae Abbas aas tooti piyaso ki... Mashk tukray tukray thi khoon mae tarr pharayra tha...
Ab lahoo mae doubay gi noujawani Akbar ki... Maa ki chashm e hasrat thi subh ka sitara tha...
Ab woh chaand Banu ka zaeyr e khaak pinhaa hae... Dil ki Jo tassalli thi aankho ka ujala tha...
Khayma haae Sarwar ki kiya bayaan ho veerani... Har taraf udaasi thi har taraf andhera tha...
Uff woh shab shabe aakhir uff woh subh e ashura... RAAT THI QAYAMAT KI HASHR KA SAWERA THA.

salaar
Posts: 635
Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2014 8:36 am

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#287

Unread post by salaar » Sat Nov 01, 2014 3:12 pm

If Karbala is a story for you then why not everything why not qasasul anbia mentioned in Quran also stories. Pls don't make us feel that this is a wahabi forum rather then progressive bohra forum..

pheonix
Posts: 210
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2012 1:32 am

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#288

Unread post by pheonix » Sat Nov 01, 2014 3:27 pm

maddy wrote:Aaje SMS ye shahadat ma ek aur turning point laaya
Aaj tak sunu hatu ke Jung ma gaya bad Ali Akbar pachha aaya pani ni talab vaste par aaj to Kasim bhi aaya pachha for same purpose .

Par samaj ma ye na aayu ke jivare Ali Akbar aaya tha to Imam Husain(a.s) ye aapni sukhi zuban chusavi lidhi ane Nana Nabi ni anguthi aapi ke aa jivar lag hase piyas nahii lage to aa j same amal vo kasim sath bhi kari sakte . . . . .
Samajwa naa liye haji ghani aur waaz and sabaq lewa parse.

2)
SMS ye kidhu ke Kasim ni age 11 years hati , to agar kasim ni umar 11 year to Abdullah ni kitni age thi ? Kitni age ma Abdullah na nikah padhi aapa ?? And what about Kasim ?? Ehna nikah ??
Qasim was the younger son not Abdullah.


3)
Shahadat ma kidhu ke Kasim ye ajab shaan si jehad kidhi ane kidhu ke aap ye ek pahelvan na 4 farzando ane pachi vo pahelvan ne qatal kidha
Have socho ke agar ek ne qatal karva ma min 5-7 min bhi thai to total 5 mili ne qatal karva ma min 30-40 min to thai , to total kitno time only Kasim na jehad ma thayo and baki sab na time count thai to kai tarah ??
Fazar ma harubharu ghar thu ane asar ma 18 zanaza nikla to agar ek ek ma itno time to kai tarah possible ????
Not everyone went in sequence. Like aun and Mohammad went together, similarly other ashab and ahle bait might have went together

alam
Posts: 713
Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2013 8:15 pm

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#289

Unread post by alam » Sat Nov 01, 2014 3:33 pm

These are narratives with reliance on historians, who are and were many, with their own versions and slants.
The nohas, marsiya's purpose is to create or reenact verbally - so as to inspire grief and remember Imam Husain's sacrifice.
no point micro-analyzing

salaar
Posts: 635
Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2014 8:36 am

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#290

Unread post by salaar » Sat Nov 01, 2014 3:54 pm

Initially the battle was fought jointly as according to an agreement between Abbas Allamdar and their army chief it was decided that since Hussain army is so small arrows will not be used and both the armies would fight with swords. As we hear in majlis that the 72 were divided into three portions the right flank left flank and the centre called qalb. I am not sure but I think right side was led by Habib ibn mazahir, the left by Muslim bin Ausaja and center by Abbas Allamdar, the small army to the enemies surprise attacked ferociously and disperse and killed many yazeedis and many among Hussains army were also martyred, on seeing this the yazeed army started throwing arrows with fire and lancers on Hussains camp. Seeing this the attack was halted to save women and children in the camp and it was decided not to attack together but small groups kept going like Abbas allamdar went out with his other four brothers. Most of the fights ended quickly as after knowing that soldiers of Hussain could not be dealt single handedly they were pounced over by hundreds and how much time do you think was needed to kill 72 who were without food and water by an army of thousands of laeen. It was not a battle of power it was a battle of determination between haq and baatil.

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#291

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Sat Nov 01, 2014 5:19 pm

The battle of Karbala is indeed a great tragedy and the world can take many lessons from it but the way this entire battle is projected with a huge dose of emotional touch and listeners feeling only a sense of sympathy for one of the greatest warriors rather then reflecting on his bravery nullifies the entire message that Imam Hussain (a.s.) passed on to the coming generations. One most important thing to note is that even as per Shia/Sunni doctrines, the intricate details of the battle were penned down by one Tabari, a jew convert and that too 239 years after the battle took place. Hence its anyones guess as to on what level history must have been distorted, fabricated and manipulated to suit respective agendas. Hence its best to take the larger lessons from this incident rather then crib over some fanciful events which are questionable and the unanimous verdict as expressed by historians and scholars of every sect is "ISLAM zinda hota hai har Karbala ke baad" so please thrive to make this a reality in whatever little way that we can.

These are my 2 cents.

seeker110
Posts: 1727
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:01 am

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#292

Unread post by seeker110 » Sat Nov 01, 2014 5:59 pm

If they would have agreed with the thousands of others, they could have had a life of ayashi. They preferred rather to give the heads than to bow to to a culture of haramkhori.

"Nahi mumkin ameri mei fakiri". Iqbal

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#293

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Sat Nov 01, 2014 6:08 pm

CAN ANYONE PLEASE EXPLAIN WHAT IS HE DOING DURING VAYEZ ???

Image

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#294

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Sat Nov 01, 2014 6:09 pm

THE THEATRE EFFECT IN MASJID AT KARACHI !!

Image

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#295

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Sat Nov 01, 2014 6:12 pm

WHY DO YOU NEED A SMALL SIZE TELEVISION SET RIGHT BELOW THE GIANT SCREEN ??

Image

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#296

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Sat Nov 01, 2014 6:18 pm

May Allah (swt) give us the strength and wisdom to walk on the path of Imam Hussain (a.s.) who is the true definition of Sacrifice, Patience, Faith and Trust. On this last day of Ashura I pray for peace, happiness, love and success for all forum members. I seek your forgiveness for any words spoken or any deed at my end which may have hurt you. Please do remember me and all forum members in your prayers.

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#297

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Sat Nov 01, 2014 6:23 pm

seeker110 wrote:If they would have agreed with the thousands of others, they could have had a life of ayashi. They preferred rather to give the heads than to bow to to a culture of haramkhori.

"Nahi mumkin ameri mei fakiri". Iqbal
Please don't tell this to "Hussain na Dai" or his abdes as they will never agree with you, their teachings are just the opposite of what Hussain (a.s.) preached !

salaar
Posts: 635
Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2014 8:36 am

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#298

Unread post by salaar » Sat Nov 01, 2014 8:57 pm

Bhai GM you are right about learning and concentrating the broader perspective of Karbala but then for some it becomes aray gham kiya baat Thai woh tou shaheed hue tum gham kiyo kartay ho... the reason is that they start feeling uncomfortable when the hardships and masaibs of Dahl e bayt is glorified. The history of Karbala was narrated by the live witness Imam Ali Zainul Abideen who wept over this tragedy for 40 years and kept mentioning abt this to his ashaabs, people must have made additions and subtraction later but the main course is the same and generally agreed upon by all school of thoughts.

Dumbledore
Posts: 275
Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2014 12:30 am

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#299

Unread post by Dumbledore » Sat Nov 01, 2014 9:10 pm

ghulam muhammed wrote:THE THEATRE EFFECT IN MASJID AT KARACHI !!

Image
GM Bhai

The 9mi raat live relay was the worst majalis i had ever been.

WiththenameofAllah
Posts: 230
Joined: Sat May 24, 2014 9:13 am

Re: Ashara 1436 Surat

#300

Unread post by WiththenameofAllah » Sat Nov 01, 2014 9:13 pm

ghulam muhammed wrote:May Allah (swt) give us the strength and wisdom to walk on the path of Imam Hussain (a.s.) who is the true definition of Sacrifice, Patience, Faith and Trust. On this last day of Ashura I pray for peace, happiness, love and success for all forum members. I seek your forgiveness for any words spoken or any deed at my end which may have hurt you. Please do remember me and all forum members in your prayers.
Same here guys ! I will remember you in prayers . Please remember me too may i find a way to escape this cult :( . May Allah give us all courge to fight and win the battle against tyrant ruler.

GM bhai , thanks for karachi pics . As no body speaks against clergy , he makes good use of salves in khi .
Last edited by WiththenameofAllah on Sat Nov 01, 2014 9:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.