Why Mufaddal did not accept MUBAHILA challenge?

[qutub_mamajiwala]

Can someone please reference cite from fatemidawat.com where SKQ actually asked for this mubahila. an audio clip? or in writing? I couldn't find anything on their website.

I found this link: http://fatemimadrasa.com/evidence-of-nass/shahzadas/ where you can read the following paragraph from the letter written/addressed to SMS:

I write with the conviction that I am with Truth, that I am the 53rd Da’i. If there is anyone who wishes to put forward a different claim, I am ready to debate with him and conduct with him a ‘mubahala’ [standing in front of God and beseeching God to send his wrath on the one who is wrong]. “And God is our witness to all we say” (Quran Yusuf 66, Qasas 28).

it is in the video of KQ addressed first after wafat of SMB and in some other video few days after it

[kimanumanu]

Yes he might be in Colombo but he came rushing, while KQ was in house and run away blushing? Surprising?

I thought he was in Saifee Mahal paying last respects?

KQ could do dawa for successorship even after once SMB was dafan in kubba, he waited for 50 years could not wait few more hours?

I am no expert but one thing that gets repeated often is that even for a blink of an eye we cannot have a situation where an Imam (or in his absence Dai) is not present on earth. So the moment Burhanuddin Moula RA closed his eyes for the last time, it is the same moment a new 53rd Dai would have manifested. If SKQ is that person then it is incumbent on him to declare it. It's a no brainer really.

[YaHussain]

Yes he might be in Colombo but he came rushing, while KQ was in house and run away blushing? Surprising?

I thought he was in Saifee Mahal paying last respects?

KQ could do dawa for successorship even after once SMB was dafan in kubba, he waited for 50 years could not wait few more hours?

I am no expert but one thing that gets repeated often is that even for a blink of an eye we cannot have a situation where an Imam (or in his absence Dai) is not present on earth. So the moment Burhanuddin Moula RA closed his eyes for the last time, it is the same moment a new 53rd Dai would have manifested. If SKQ is that person then it is incumbent on him to declare it. It's a no brainer really.

wow another blunder from KQ team, ok lets say he is dai and earth should not remain empty without him, but there is a catch, when SMB died he automatically became dai but he could have waited till SMB is madfun for his respect and then declare his daiship.

was it hard to do?

[Akhtiar Wahid]

Ya hussain,
If he had done dawa (claim) after burying Burhanuddin Moula (RA) would you have accepted his dawa (claim)?!
There were a lot of mumineen who were not able to make it for the Janaza (funeral prayers), so IS Muffadal saab pointing out those people to be Mushrikeens, munafaqeens etc?!
Muffadal Saab and the entire family had received letters from SKQ saheb that he will do tawali (funeral rites) for Marhoom beloved Burhanuddin Moula (RA) if Muffadal Saab had a big heart and Infallible soul he would have allowed him to come and do it, why didn't he step down, he would have won millions of hearts by allowing then Mazoon e dawat of Burhanuddin Moula (RA) do the last rites.
Ignorance and arrogance was on Muffadal Saab sides, if he could pass a statement in his sermons that he will hug SKQ saheb, he could have let him do the tawali and hugged him.
IT IS ALL HOGWASH JUST TO FOOL ABDES MORE AND MORE EMOTIONAL, HIS HATRED WAS ALREADY OUT AND OPEN WHEN TAIZOON BS MENTIONED ABOUT HIM IN HIS ZAAHIR BAATIN EPISODES, MUFFADAL SAAB PERSONALITY IS SIMILAR TO LAEEN SAANI WHO DID NOT ALLOW PROPHET MOHAMMED TO WRITE DOWN THE NAME OF HIS SUCCESSOR.

[kimanumanu]

wow another blunder from KQ team, ok lets say he is dai and earth should not remain empty without him, but there is a catch, when SMB died he automatically became dai but he could have waited till SMB is madfun for his respect and then declare his daiship.

was it hard to do?

I don't get why you want him to have waited? If he is Dai then he is Dai one second after wafat as he is 24 hours after. If he is Dai then one of his duties automatically became to perform last rites on previous Dai. How can he do that and yet not declare that he is 53rd Dai?

[YaHussain]

Ya hussain,
If he had done dawa (claim) after burying Burhanuddin Moula (RA) would you have accepted his dawa (claim)?!

No, and even now 99% bohras have rejected his claim specially when he showed no sympathy for late syedna Muhammed burhanuddin, if he would have waited for some more time story would have been little more interesting, but now he lost it completely.

[YaHussain]

wow another blunder from KQ team, ok lets say he is dai and earth should not remain empty without him, but there is a catch, when SMB died he automatically became dai but he could have waited till SMB is madfun for his respect and then declare his daiship.

was it hard to do?

I don't get why you want him to have waited? If he is Dai then he is Dai one second after wafat as he is 24 hours after. If he is Dai then one of his duties automatically became to perform last rites on previous Dai. How can he do that and yet not declare that he is 53rd Dai?

I will give you historical reply, Imam Ali did all rituals of prophet Muhammed(s) without declaring that he is successor, he didnt fight with people first on janaza, he performed all his duties as a successor and after that when every thing was settled he claimed for his position.

[kimanumanu]

I will give you historical reply, Imam Ali did all rituals of prophet Muhammed(s) without declaring that he is successor, he didnt fight with people first on janaza, he performed all his duties as a successor and after that when every thing was settled he claimed for his position.

Ghadeer e Khum meant he did not have to right?

[rational_guy]

MS was not even in Bombay while SMB RA wafaat thaya. He was very busy purchasing his bungalow in Colombo.

[YaHussain]

I will give you historical reply, Imam Ali did all rituals of prophet Muhammed(s) without declaring that he is successor, he didnt fight with people first on janaza, he performed all his duties as a successor and after that when every thing was settled he claimed for his position.

Ghadeer e Khum meant he did not have to right?

yes since there is no ghadeer a khum in this episode KQ claim is futile.

[rational_guy]

Even if there was a gadeer Khum MS would give gaali. Because YN has taught him to do it

[Universaldad]

Even if there was a gadeer Khum MS would give gaali. Because YN has taught him to do it

Here is what KQ learned from his reformist friends.... all ilm given by STS and SMB RA went from one ear and out from the other.

The corrupt man that KQ is does not only give gaali he also beats mumineen..... Here is a testimony.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znRrSWnq ... Ln&index=7

KQ per khuda ne Laanat ....

[qutub_mamajiwala]

I don't get why you want him to have waited? If he is Dai then he is Dai one second after wafat as he is 24 hours after. If he is Dai then one of his duties automatically became to perform last rites on previous Dai. How can he do that and yet not declare that he is 53rd Dai?

I will give you historical reply, Imam Ali did all rituals of prophet Muhammed(s) without declaring that he is successor, he didnt fight with people first on janaza, he performed all his duties as a successor and after that when every thing was settled he claimed for his position.

yes dear ali did final rites of prohet.
KQ also wanted to do final rites of SMB, but he was prevented from doing so.
in this arguement awwal sani salaas seem better than MS, that atleast they allowed ali to do final rites of prophet,
even when not acknowledging him as sucessor

[fustrate_Bohra]

Can someone please reference cite from fatemidawat.com where SKQ actually asked for this mubahila. an audio clip? or in writing? I couldn't find anything on their website.

I found this link: http://fatemimadrasa.com/evidence-of-nass/shahzadas/ where you can read the following paragraph from the letter written/addressed to SMS:

I write with the conviction that I am with Truth, that I am the 53rd Da’i. If there is anyone who wishes to put forward a different claim, I am ready to debate with him and conduct with him a ‘mubahala’ [standing in front of God and beseeching God to send his wrath on the one who is wrong]. “And God is our witness to all we say” (Quran Yusuf 66, Qasas 28).

Kq saheb had challenged for both things Debate and Mubahala. He had made proper approach to convince people that he is on haq but it is this [DELETED] MS dirty politics that is not allowing people to answer his call and making people believe that MS is true. I personally feel why MS does not accept this challenges from kqs because internally he knows 2 things that

1) His knowledge is limited or none and hence cannot win DEBATE (Manazara) and secondly
2) He is a liar and hence god wrath will fall on him if he accepts MUBAHALA.

I request to all those who are with MS as just to give a thought about this.

MS does not wants to talk with kq saheb but keep on saying he is dai and throw laanats on him whereas kq saheb is trying hard to make people believe that he is on haq by all possible ways he can and last when nothing come out he had to knock the door of court.

Court will work on evidences and ms is having n nos of physical evidences whereas kq sheb has none and plus ms is having all required powers on earth so it is more likely that ms will win the case but the question still remains same if MS is true dai than it means he is more knowledgeable and fearless than Why is he not facing kq saheb upfront?

I still urge people to think on this.

If you are with MS because of fear than its ok (there are many including me) but if you really feel MS is on haq than just give a thought.

[humanbeing]

Invitation to debate and mubahila, pledging on quran this are much simpler in addition to the orchestrating a fancy nuss drama. If SMS is Haq-na-dai he must save the few bohra souls who are “misguided” into SKQ camp and bring them to Haq. a DAI does not do DAWAA for his DAAWAT and worse, keeps loosing more.

SMS is not emulating ahle-bayt and Imam in many ways,

Prophet Muhammed, always encouraged debates to spread Islam
Imam Ali encourages debates and defeated / converted many to Islam
Imam Hasan debated with Muawiya and concluded a peace treaty
Imam Hussein went all the way to karbala inspite of challenges to fight for truth and principles
Dai Qutbuddin Shaheed debated with Aurangzeb at cost of his life
Syedi Fakhruddin Shaheed travelled by and far in hardship to spread knowledge
Many more Duaats, whose rivayats of hujjat, debates are narrated by Kothari mullahs
Imams who trained Dais to go far places spreading Islam

Here we have a loud, short tempered, grumpy shambu shikari grandpa SMS living in pomp and opulence basking in the euphoria of rabid abdes swaying in trance of promises of heaven, salvation and piety just by darshan(deedar), chants(maula maula mufaddal maula), aarti(wadhaavni), bhajans (ghanu jeevo) and doling out charaavas (fakhera rakams).

[Dumbledore]

Shambhu shikari...too good

[kimanumanu]

yes since there is no ghadeer a khum in this episode KQ claim is futile.

Very good. And that is why he had to assert his claim immediately.

[YaHussain]

yes since there is no ghadeer a khum in this episode KQ claim is futile.

Very good. And that is why he had to assert his claim immediately.

look brother keep all your arguments aside and think about it.

some one whom you loved so dearly all your life dies and in such situation first thing in your head is to make him rest in his final place and not to fight over successorship and other bull shiit.

it is obvious this was planned by KQ long back and he was waiting for SMB to take his last breath so that he can play out his game plan.

if this is not clear to you, I am not sure what will make it clear.

[YaHussain]

even KQ daughters who elope with kids are totally wrong according to islamic laws, first of all in all situation they should have to stick with their husbands and not run away to father house, specially without talking with their husbands and taking their permission, taking kids with them is more serious crime they have committed.


I am surprise such high profile members have no knowledge of islamic rules and basic humanity.

[UnhappyBohra]

Very good. And that is why he had to assert his claim immediately.

look brother keep all your arguments aside and think about it.

some one whom you loved so dearly all your life dies and in such situation first thing in your head is to make him rest in his final place and not to fight over successorship and other bull shiit.

it is obvious this was planned by KQ long back and he was waiting for SMB to take his last breath so that he can play out his game plan.

if this is not clear to you, I am not sure what will make it clear.

Yes MS should have agreed to pray janaza namaz behind the true mansoos of Burhanuddin Aqa if he cared so much about putting his father to rest peacefully. Why was he so hung up on establishing his successorship that he had to conduct a nass drama in Raudat Tahera and parade our ailing Burhanuddin Aqa in a drugged state all over Raudat Tahera and masajid? The man will pay dearly for the behurmati he did of Burhanuddin Aqa RA.

[kimanumanu]

look brother keep all your arguments aside and think about it.

some one whom you loved so dearly all your life dies and in such situation first thing in your head is to make him rest in his final place and not to fight over successorship and other bull shiit.

it is obvious this was planned by KQ long back and he was waiting for SMB to take his last breath so that he can play out his game plan.

It is because I am thinking - the game plan was first played at Raudat Tahera when Dr. Moiz lied.

if this is not clear to you, I am not sure what will make it clear.

[YaHussain]

even KQ daughters who elope with kids are totally wrong according to islamic laws, first of all in all situation they should have to stick with their husbands and not run away to father house, specially without talking with their husbands and taking their permission, taking kids with them is more serious crime they have committed.


I am surprise such high profile members have no knowledge of islamic rules and basic humanity.

You sound like Taliban
Who certified you as Islamic Scholar?

that is not my problem its just you who dont have idea about Islam but still you call your self Muslim.

and this is the case of most on this forum.

[YaHussain]

look brother keep all your arguments aside and think about it.

some one whom you loved so dearly all your life dies and in such situation first thing in your head is to make him rest in his final place and not to fight over successorship and other bull shiit.

it is obvious this was planned by KQ long back and he was waiting for SMB to take his last breath so that he can play out his game plan.

It is because I am thinking - the game plan was first played at Raudat Tahera when Dr. Moiz lied.

if this is not clear to you, I am not sure what will make it clear.

if KQ thinks Dr moiz lied than as a murde momeen he should have stood up with his claim, and not wait like a traitor for death of SMB.

[kimanumanu]

if KQ thinks Dr moiz lied than as a murde momeen he should have stood up with his claim, and not wait like a traitor for death of SMB.

I am confused now Isn't that what he is doing?

[YaHussain]

if KQ thinks Dr moiz lied than as a murde momeen he should have stood up with his claim, and not wait like a traitor for death of SMB.

I am confused now Isn't that what he is doing?

stood up on that time (while mansoos was declared) not on janaza of SMB.

[kimanumanu]

stood up on that time (while mansoos was declared) not on janaza of SMB.

Stood up in what capacity? He was not Dai - Dai was still alive. Am amazed you are heaping blame on him rather than those who lied.

[YaHussain]

stood up on that time (while mansoos was declared) not on janaza of SMB.

Stood up in what capacity? He was not Dai - Dai was still alive. Am amazed you are heaping blame on him rather than those who lied.

stood up with capacity and authority of mansoos, since dai was still alive peace would have prevailed and those who "lied" would have been punished?

ab rone se kyaa fayda jab chidiya chug gayi khet

[kimanumanu]

stood up with capacity and authority of mansoos, since dai was still alive peace would have prevailed and those who "lied" would have been punished?

ab rone se kyaa fayda jab chidiya chug gayi khet

Says a lot about your character if you are finding something funny in the fact that someone lied in front of Burhanuddin Moula RA. I am not going to respond any further to you as there is no point in doing so.

[YaHussain]

stood up with capacity and authority of mansoos, since dai was still alive peace would have prevailed and those who "lied" would have been punished?

ab rone se kyaa fayda jab chidiya chug gayi khet

Says a lot about your character if you are finding something funny in the fact that someone lied in front of Burhanuddin Moula RA. I am not going to respond any further to you as there is no point in doing so.

he lied for you(in your knowledge) not for 99% population of dawoodi bohras so joke is on you not on Dr moiz.

KQ preferred to stay in his comfort zone all this time, but now he knew his scheme wont run long time, so he decided to move on with few selected brain washed KQ abdes who bought his fake story, and those who wanted free western life where they can do as they want and no one would stop them


most KQ followers are those who hates shariya and those who wants to live as they want but still want a community as a part of social life.

they dislike SMS because he has strict and correct view about Islam and he is not showing flexibility in Islamic and dawoodi bohra belief.

this is truth of this whole dawedaar story

[YaHussain]

coming back to thread topic, asking for MUBAHILA was unislamic and KQ should not expect any reply from SMS on this.

and since now he has gone to worldly court he should wait for reply from honorable judge for his decision and once decision is given he should close his dawat shop and go back to US where he was hiding from all these years while SMB was sick.