Raudat Tahera Incident

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lawgraduate
Posts: 261
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2015 3:31 pm

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#31

Unread post by lawgraduate » Mon Mar 02, 2015 7:53 am

point 3 from james bond was hilarious in other words he said "shut the f*** up and just follow us and never ever try to use your common sense"

HAHA abdes totally deserves this :D

which is totally against Quran, because Quraan repeatedly says follow with understanding and follow with respect.

UnhappyBohra
Posts: 599
Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2014 2:23 pm

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#32

Unread post by UnhappyBohra » Mon Mar 02, 2015 7:59 am

James the difference is that Syedna Khuzaima Qutbuddin TUS prays for Allah Subhanahu's justice on Mufaddal Saifuddin. He did not incite his followers to go beat up Mumineen who came for ziyarat. Nor has he taken it in his own hands to mete out punishment to MS followers. His entreaty is for them to open their eyes to the fraudster who is sucking them dry and making merry on the spoils. In my opinion it is public service of the highest kind!

zinger
Posts: 2031
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:40 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#33

Unread post by zinger » Mon Mar 02, 2015 9:10 am

james wrote:
zinger wrote: very well, let me not change the goalposts. let me tackle what you say.

Point no. 1: Lack of condemnation? Well, i think that part of the question has been answered for you. I have myself heard Burhanuddin Maula say that we must not wish ill will for fellow mumineen and not take the law into your hand.

Point no. 2: There has to be condemnation because the other camp of ex-Mazun Maula is not in anyways, coming in the way or obstructing what Mufaddal Maula is doing. They are not going around saying Mufaddal Maula is wrong, he is a so and so, his children are so and so, laanat on him etc etc etc. what i do see is a dignified silence

Point no. 3: forget condemnation, the least Mufaddal Maula could do is ask his people "aa su lagawu che. apne mumineen che. aa badhu apne na soubhe". do you hear that? forget condemnation, do you even hear a peep of restraint? i dont.

this is why my back was broken with that particular straw
And so you keep flogging the proverbial horse.


Point 1

Don't twist the words of Syedna RA. What you heard was " fellow mumineen" which would be a wrong analogy in this instance.REALLY? WHY IS IT A FALSE ANALOGY? It's true Syedna RA mentioned "upholding the law of the land" umpteenth of times.The alleged victims of the Raudat Tahera incident took legal remedy and that should have been the end of the matter,What that incident has got to do with your "Iman" is something I don't understand. AND YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO, BECAUSE I HAVE A CONSCIENCE.

Someone allegedly get attacked in Raudat Tahera so you stop believing in the incumbent Dai Mutlaq? Do you realize how puerile this sounds? In the same breath, you should cease to be a Muslim altogether in face of the recent atrocities of ISIS. PLEASE DO SHOW ME WHERE I HAVE STOPPED BELIEVING. I MAINTAIN THAT HE HAS BEEN CHOSEN, AMBIGUOUS AS IT MAY BE


Point 2

I laughed. GOOD. IM GLAD I COULD POUR SOME HUMOUR INTO YOUR LIFE

After Wafat of Syedna RA,mumineen received Auto messages from Whatsapp which compares Syedna Mufaddal Saifuddin TUS and other members of his family and mumineen to Awwal Thani Thalith of Rasulullah SAW's era.(Nauzobillah) STRANGELY, I CONTINUE TO GET MESSAGES FROM BOTH SIDES BUT I CERTAINLY DO NOT REMEMBER GETTING THIS.The message also said and I quote directly "Je haq na saahib ne maula burhanuddin na gusul aney dafan si roka yeh dushmano ne khuda taala jald-si-jald pakadjo! " More : " Do not dismiss what he (Khuzaima) has to say,go to FatemiDawat.com.

Sent on behalf of Khuzaima Qutbuddin."

To this date,fatemidawat.com states the following " Shahzada Mufaddal Bhaisaheb false claim of Syedna Burhanuddin proclaiming Nass and his exploitation of Syedna’s condition for material gain " (Nauzobillah) THIS MIGHT SOUND REALLY STRANGE TO YOU, BUT MANY HARD CORE ABDES, THE KINDS WHO WOULD PUT PEOPLE LIKE YOU TO SHAME IN THEIR DEVOTION ARE ACTUALLY FEELING THIS. BUT YOU DONT NEED TO TAKE MY WORD FOR IT. I HAVE NO PROOF OF IT EXCEPT WHAT I HAVE HEARD AND EXPERIENCED MYSELF

The internet ( Youtube in particular : Husain Qutbuddin Videos/Taher Qutbuddin's Sermons),newspapers are rife with the followers of Khuzaima Qutbuddin indulging in the character assassination of Syedna Mufaddal Saifuddin TUS PLEASE DO SHOW SOME TO ME. TELLING PEOPLE THAT HE IS NOT THE TRUE DAI IS VASTLY DIFFERENT FROM CALLING HIM A DEVIL, A DOG, HIS CHILDREN SONS OF DOGS, BURNING HIS EFFIGY, KICKING DOGS IN HIS NAME ETCand mumineen who believe in the Nass conferred by Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin RA.

Their proselytizing is ugly AGAIN, I BEG TO DIFFER. UGLINESS AND BEAUTY LIE IN THE EYES OF THE BEHOLDERand without any substance.Why? There is not even an iota of evidence of Khuzaima's claim so they resorted to mud-slinging and false analogies and lies. NOW THIS PART REALLY MADE ME LAUGH.

The above has been brought to your attention.Do you still believe they maintain " Dignified silence"? IT IS DEFINITELY MORE DIGNIFIED THAN THE SHOW OF SOLIDARITY THAT WE HAVE SHOWN MUFFADDAL MAULA

Point 3

Again you resort to "Could have done this.Should have done this." Syedna Mufaddal Saifuddin TUS is the Dai Mutlaq and you're not. AND IM GLAD IM NOT. ITS A CROWN NOT EVERYONE IS FIT TO WEARDon't do airaz on his actions or words lest you become part of the party of the likes of Ibn Khuwaisara.You accept Nass has taken place on Syedna Mufaddal Saifuddin TUS YES I DO and you owe unwavering loyalty and belief in the actions of Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin RA as you keep saying. YES I DO BUT THAT DOES NOT MEAN KEEPING QUIET WHEN THINGS ARE WRONG
Brother James, on this topic, i am giving my replies and calling this debate closed from my end. you are free to continue.

What i would like to know however is why do you hide behind pseudonyms. you have nothing to fear, unlike cowards like me. you will probably be rewarded for the strong defence you put up every day. i guess you have your reasons for it though.

james
Posts: 586
Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:06 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#34

Unread post by james » Tue Mar 03, 2015 2:16 am

zinger wrote: AND YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO, BECAUSE I HAVE A CONSCIENCE.
Your conscience allows you to be responsible for the actions of others? How can you live knowing what your fellow Muslim brethren (ISIS) are doing to the world at large? Don't feel any responsibility there?
STRANGELY, I CONTINUE TO GET MESSAGES FROM BOTH SIDES BUT I CERTAINLY DO NOT REMEMBER GETTING THIS.
Would you like proof of the same? Strangely your Maula and his family members are being called "Awwal Thalis Thanith" (Nauzobillah) and you don't have any comment/condemnation towards it?
THIS MIGHT SOUND REALLY STRANGE TO YOU, BUT MANY HARD CORE ABDES, THE KINDS WHO WOULD PUT PEOPLE LIKE YOU TO SHAME IN THEIR DEVOTION ARE ACTUALLY FEELING THIS. BUT YOU DONT NEED TO TAKE MY WORD FOR IT. I HAVE NO PROOF OF IT EXCEPT WHAT I HAVE HEARD AND EXPERIENCED MYSELF
Meh.Don't bring personal opinions into the mix.What the people you mingle with "feel" has absolutely no bearing on this discussion. You lied that there was "dignified silence" from Khuzaima and his followers.I have brought it to your attention that they have compared Syedna Mufaddal Saifuddin TUS to "Awwal Thani Thalith" (Nauzobillah), In the same message they have referred to Maula TUS as "dushman"(Nauzobillah),They have accused Syedna TUS of manipulating Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin RA (Nauzobillah) which is a direct attack on both Maula.And in response to that,you chose to post personal attack on me and compare me to the people who you socialize with.Yet not an iota of condemnation from you.Aren't you a fan of condemnation?
PLEASE DO SHOW SOME TO ME. TELLING PEOPLE THAT HE IS NOT THE TRUE DAI IS VASTLY DIFFERENT FROM CALLING HIM A DEVIL, A DOG, HIS CHILDREN SONS OF DOGS, BURNING HIS EFFIGY, KICKING DOGS IN HIS NAME ETC
Deflect,Deflect,Deflect is your game here.Jump from one branch to another in the hope that you won't have to comment on the nefarious actions of Khuzaima and his followers.
NOW THIS PART REALLY MADE ME LAUGH.
So you believe that Khuzaima has evidence of Nass? I ask because a statement of fact made you laugh.

IT IS DEFINITELY MORE DIGNIFIED THAN THE SHOW OF SOLIDARITY THAT WE HAVE SHOWN MUFFADDAL MAULA
Here,you put your approval on the actions of Khuzaima and his followers. Basically in your view it is okay for our Maula TUS to be called vile names (Nauzobillah) ?

Brother James, on this topic, i am giving my replies and calling this debate closed from my end. you are free to continue.

What i would like to know however is why do you hide behind pseudonyms. you have nothing to fear, unlike cowards like me. you will probably be rewarded for the strong defence you put up every day. i guess you have your reasons for it though.

More personal attacks on me.Hardly surprising since your back is pressed firmly against the wall.

lawgraduate
Posts: 261
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2015 3:31 pm

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#35

Unread post by lawgraduate » Tue Mar 03, 2015 2:38 am

james wrote:
zinger wrote:


More personal attacks on me.Hardly surprising since your back is pressed firmly against the wall.
Nothing surprising

This is what mufaddal and his chamchas doing with the whole community, back pressing them to the wall if they dont agree with them.

zinger
Posts: 2031
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:40 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#36

Unread post by zinger » Tue Mar 03, 2015 4:07 am

james wrote:
zinger wrote: AND YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO, BECAUSE I HAVE A CONSCIENCE.
Your conscience allows you to be responsible for the actions of others? How can you live knowing what your fellow Muslim brethren (ISIS) are doing to the world at large? Don't feel any responsibility there? LIKE I SAID, I HAVE A CONSIENCE, WHICH IS WHY YOU WILL NOT UNDERSTAND WHAT IM SAYING. AND SPEAKING OF DEFLECTING, YOU HAVE JUST DONE A MASTER DEFLECTION BY BRINGING ISIS INTO IT
STRANGELY, I CONTINUE TO GET MESSAGES FROM BOTH SIDES BUT I CERTAINLY DO NOT REMEMBER GETTING THIS.
Would you like proof of the same? Strangely your Maula and his family members are being called "Awwal Thalis Thanith" (Nauzobillah) and you don't have any comment/condemnation towards it? YES. IF YOU HAVE IT, PLEASE SHARE IT. BECAUSE I HAVE COME ACROSS NONE YET

THIS MIGHT SOUND REALLY STRANGE TO YOU, BUT MANY HARD CORE ABDES, THE KINDS WHO WOULD PUT PEOPLE LIKE YOU TO SHAME IN THEIR DEVOTION ARE ACTUALLY FEELING THIS. BUT YOU DONT NEED TO TAKE MY WORD FOR IT. I HAVE NO PROOF OF IT EXCEPT WHAT I HAVE HEARD AND EXPERIENCED MYSELF
Meh.Don't bring personal opinions into the mix.What the people you mingle with "feel" has absolutely no bearing on this discussion. You lied that there was "dignified silence" from Khuzaima and his followers.I have brought it to your attention that they have compared Syedna Mufaddal Saifuddin TUS to "Awwal Thani Thalith" (Nauzobillah), LIKE I SAID, LETS SEE THE PROOF. BESIDES, ITS CERTAINLY LESSER THAN THE ABUSES HEAPED ON EX-MAZUN MAULA In the same message they have referred to Maula TUS as "dushman"(Nauzobillah),They have accused Syedna TUS of manipulating Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin RA (Nauzobillah) LET ME SAY IT OPENLY THEN. YES. I AND MANY LIKE ME BELIEVE THAT IN THE LAST 3 YEARS OF HIS LIFE, BURHANUDDIN MAULA WAS MANIPULATED. SUE ME!!!
which is a direct attack on both Maula.And in response to that,you chose to post personal attack on me and compare me to the people who you socialize with. DONT TWIST MY WORDS. I EXPECT MORE FROM YOU THAN CHEAP TACTICS. I HAVE SAID I KNOW PEOPLE WHO'S DEVOTION WOULD SHAME YOU EVEN, WHICH MEANS THEY WERE FAR FAR MORE DEVOTED TO MUFADDAL MAULA THAN YOU DOYet not an iota of condemnation from you.Aren't you a fan of condemnation?
PLEASE DO SHOW SOME TO ME. TELLING PEOPLE THAT HE IS NOT THE TRUE DAI IS VASTLY DIFFERENT FROM CALLING HIM A DEVIL, A DOG, HIS CHILDREN SONS OF DOGS, BURNING HIS EFFIGY, KICKING DOGS IN HIS NAME ETC
Deflect,Deflect,Deflect is your game here.Jump from one branch to another in the hope that you won't have to comment on the nefarious actions of Khuzaima and his followers. TWISTING WORDS AGAIN, MY CONTEXT WAS COMPLETELY DIFFERENT. IT WAS IN RETALIATION TO WHAT YOU SAID THAT EX-MAZUN HAS ABUSED MUFADDAL MAULA. PRAY TELL ME, WHAT DID WE DO TO BEGIN WITH???
NOW THIS PART REALLY MADE ME LAUGH.
So you believe that Khuzaima has evidence of Nass? I ask because a statement of fact made you laugh. UNFORTUNATELY, THAT IS FOR A COURT TO DECIDE, LET ME SAY IT OPENLY THEN. THE NUSS WAS AMBIGOUS. SUE ME AGAIN!!!


IT IS DEFINITELY MORE DIGNIFIED THAN THE SHOW OF SOLIDARITY THAT WE HAVE SHOWN MUFFADDAL MAULA
Here,you put your approval on the actions of Khuzaima and his followers. Basically in your view it is okay for our Maula TUS to be called vile names (Nauzobillah) ? LET US TAKE A LONG HARD LOOK WHERE IT ALL STARTED. AND I CLAIM ONCE AGAIN, I SEE NO ABUSES FROM THE OTHER CAMP. PEOPLE ON THIS SITE DONT COUNT. ANONYMITY GIVES A FALSE SENSE OF BRAVERY TO ALL


Brother James, on this topic, i am giving my replies and calling this debate closed from my end. you are free to continue.

What i would like to know however is why do you hide behind pseudonyms. you have nothing to fear, unlike cowards like me. you will probably be rewarded for the strong defence you put up every day. i guess you have your reasons for it though.

More personal attacks on me.Hardly surprising since your back is pressed firmly against the wall. DONT KNOW WHY YOU ARE SO TOUCHY. I CALLED MYSELF A COWARDS, NOT YOU. ANYWAYS, FORGET IT. NOT INTERESTED IN KNOWING WHO YOU ARE. YOU ARE PROBABLY SOMEONE AS "INCONSEQUENTIAL" AS I AM

true_bohra
Posts: 719
Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2013 4:19 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#37

Unread post by true_bohra » Tue Mar 03, 2015 4:41 am

zinger

How can nuss be ambigous when it was absolute.

Upto my knowledge, there was a thread with the name "why they hate mazoon Saheb" where many people claimed that KQ had writings of Syedna Taher Saifuddin RA where he instructed that KQ would be 53rd Dai. Not an iota of that has been shown.

On contrary to that every possible proof has been shown from Syedna Mufaddal Saifuddin TUS. It is KQ who is bragging on manipulated facts and documents.

You are saying of your conscience but I am sorry that your conscience is leading you to a wrong side. It is not showing you the clear thing.

if you take reformist view then the reformist who are shouting on the nass of Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin RA have already denied the nass of Syedna Abdul Qadir Najmuddin RA. So whats more to say....

zinger
Posts: 2031
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:40 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#38

Unread post by zinger » Tue Mar 03, 2015 6:02 am

true_bohra wrote:zinger

How can nuss be ambigous when it was absolute.

Upto my knowledge, there was a thread with the name "why they hate mazoon Saheb" where many people claimed that KQ had writings of Syedna Taher Saifuddin RA where he instructed that KQ would be 53rd Dai. Not an iota of that has been shown.

On contrary to that every possible proof has been shown from Syedna Mufaddal Saifuddin TUS. It is KQ who is bragging on manipulated facts and documents.

You are saying of your conscience but I am sorry that your conscience is leading you to a wrong side. It is not showing you the clear thing.

if you take reformist view then the reformist who are shouting on the nass of Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin RA have already denied the nass of Syedna Abdul Qadir Najmuddin RA. So whats more to say....
TB bhai, we have been hearing of this letter even when Burhanuddin Maula was healthy. i remember an incident of some 10 or 12 years ago when some insect had bitten Maula on his leg and he was very critical, when this letter was mentioned in hushed tones, but nothing occoured of it so i dont know if its an urban legend or what

of the nuss being ambigous, there is more than ample proof of it. YES, I HAVE BEEN LIVING IN DENIAL for very long now, but no more. the nuss is unclear. the audio of Raudat Tahera is clearly unclear. sorry you had to hear this from me on an open forum but i have been living in denial for too long now.

let me also make it very clear. the mess that we are in is unfortunate because nuss is not clean on either of the parties i believe. i do not believe that nuss is made on ex-Mazun Maula either because while on one hand the proof is extremely murky, on the other hand the proof is almost non-existent.

as for the reformist stand, i think it is the stand of some participants. i dont think that that is the official stand of reformists

adna_mumin
Posts: 193
Joined: Fri Feb 07, 2014 3:43 pm

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#39

Unread post by adna_mumin » Tue Mar 03, 2015 4:23 pm

Adam wrote:
2. These people aren't "mumineen". They are the enemies of Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin RA, because they have refused to follow his Mansoos, Syedna Mufaddal TUS.
Just imagined what if

* the wahabi keepers of Masjid un Nabawi in Madinah Munawwara, Haram in Makkah
* the ithna ashari shia keepers of Haramain in Karbala Moalla

considered us Dawoodi Bohras in your words (These people aren't "mumineen", which they might but that is not the point) and started to beat us up when we go there as zuvvaar!

Besides there has been an admission in court on the lines of "no one is being stopped from visiting" etc...
Haathi na daant? Or arrogance of power? Or disregard for petty numbers? Or unable to control mafia gang inside Raudat? Or all of the above and more?

james
Posts: 586
Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:06 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#40

Unread post by james » Wed Mar 04, 2015 5:31 am

zinger wrote: LIKE I SAID, I HAVE A CONSIENCE, WHICH IS WHY YOU WILL NOT UNDERSTAND WHAT IM SAYING. AND SPEAKING OF DEFLECTING, YOU HAVE JUST DONE A MASTER DEFLECTION BY BRINGING ISIS INTO IT
Merely saying "I have a conscience! I have a conscience!" doesn't cut it.You're a part of Dawoodi Bohra Community.A handful of members (1,10,50 Take your pick) did something wrong according to your "conscience".Fair's fair.Explain how the actions of handful of community members influence your belief system in the Dai Mutlaq and the community?

In the same vein,you're part of the wider Muslim community.Do the likes of ISIS partake in wrong actions according to your "conscience"? If yes,then do these actions influence your belief system in Prophet Mohammed SAW and Islam?
YES. IF YOU HAVE IT, PLEASE SHARE IT. BECAUSE I HAVE COME ACROSS NONE YET
Alright,I guess you will condemn after seeing the proof.


LET ME SAY IT OPENLY THEN. YES. I AND MANY LIKE ME BELIEVE THAT IN THE LAST 3 YEARS OF HIS LIFE, BURHANUDDIN MAULA WAS MANIPULATED. SUE ME!!!
Like I said,jumping from one branch to another is your debating tactic.You change your stance whenever it suits you or when you have no real justification for your ill-conceived opinions.First you claimed there was dignified silence and now you adopted a "measuring stick" and diverted it to comparisons on level of abuse .I have yet to see you condemn the vilified attacks on the incumbent Dai TUS and on top of that,you have the nerve to bring along make-believe "hardcore abdes" in to the mix so as to justify the attacks from the side who you think are keeping a dignified silence.

zinger
Posts: 2031
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:40 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#41

Unread post by zinger » Wed Mar 04, 2015 6:23 am

UNTIL YOU REMOVE THE BLINDERS OF BLIND FAITH, I CAN NEVER EXPLAIN MYSELF.
I AM MERELY VOICING AN OPINION, I AM NOT MAKING A PERSONAL ATTACK ON YOU
james wrote:
zinger wrote: LIKE I SAID, I HAVE A CONSIENCE, WHICH IS WHY YOU WILL NOT UNDERSTAND WHAT IM SAYING. AND SPEAKING OF DEFLECTING, YOU HAVE JUST DONE A MASTER DEFLECTION BY BRINGING ISIS INTO IT
Merely saying "I have a conscience! I have a conscience!" doesn't cut it.You're a part of Dawoodi Bohra Community.A handful of members (1,10,50 Take your pick) did something wrong according to your "conscience".Fair's fair.Explain how the actions of handful of community members influence your belief system in the Dai Mutlaq and the community?

In the same vein,you're part of the wider Muslim community.Do the likes of ISIS partake in wrong actions according to your "conscience"? If yes,then do these actions influence your belief system in Prophet Mohammed SAW and Islam?
YES. IF YOU HAVE IT, PLEASE SHARE IT. BECAUSE I HAVE COME ACROSS NONE YET
Alright,I guess you will condemn after seeing the proof.




LET ME SAY IT OPENLY THEN. YES. I AND MANY LIKE ME BELIEVE THAT IN THE LAST 3 YEARS OF HIS LIFE, BURHANUDDIN MAULA WAS MANIPULATED. SUE ME!!!
Like I said,jumping from one branch to another is your debating tactic.You change your stance whenever it suits you or when you have no real justification for your ill-conceived opinions.First you claimed there was dignified silence and now you adopted a "measuring stick" and diverted it to comparisons on level of abuse .I have yet to see you condemn the vilified attacks on the incumbent Dai TUS and on top of that,you have the nerve to bring along make-believe "hardcore abdes" in to the mix so as to justify the attacks from the side who you think are keeping a dignified silence.

noor5253
Posts: 92
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2014 5:36 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#42

Unread post by noor5253 » Thu Mar 05, 2015 9:26 am

UnhappyBohra wrote:James the difference is that Syedna Khuzaima Qutbuddin TUS prays for Allah Subhanahu's justice on Mufaddal Saifuddin. He did not incite his followers to go beat up Mumineen who came for ziyarat. Nor has he taken it in his own hands to mete out punishment to MS followers. His entreaty is for them to open their eyes to the fraudster who is sucking them dry and making merry on the spoils. In my opinion it is public service of the highest kind!
Allahs justice ? That we are seeing daily and will see even more.. KQ is aptly named DAWEDAAR. He did his dawedaari upon wafaat of Burhanuddin Maula RA. He is such a laeen that he didnt have the guts to do his dawedaari when Burhanuddin Maula RA was hayat but raised his venomous hood upon Maula RA wafaat..within hours.
and then within hours got involved in kidnapping of children, claiming dawat properties, splitting families..etc etc.

Even if he wanted he couldnt mete out any punishment...Ehni Auqaat aj nathin.
Aliqadr Mufaddal Saifuddin is aptly named 'Saif'udddin.. Just wait and watch.. We are all watching.

All these others.. Craterlake etc have disappeared like rats. All their hujjats are over. Shaqqniwaat disappeared. He is of the same category of KQ and his ilk.. Born in the home of Burhanuddin Maula RA and upon wafaat became a haram khor just like his leader KQ.

All 1 million of us are watching Allah Subhanahus insaaf daily.. God works in Miraculous ways.

Crater Lake
Posts: 347
Joined: Thu Mar 20, 2014 10:46 pm

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#43

Unread post by Crater Lake » Thu Mar 05, 2015 11:16 am

Still very much here Noorie. What's going on? All you people looking for me? First Adam with his slimy "Hi baby. Where are you?" and now you...

I just have not seen any interesting arguments from you guys worth responding to. Just a lot of pomp and show and tall claims....yawn. Can't be bothered. Even UnhappyBohra is doing a great job with his hujjat. I'll leave him to it and get back to my work.

Adam
Posts: 1260
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#44

Unread post by Adam » Fri Mar 06, 2015 1:14 pm

@Zinger
LET ME SAY IT OPENLY THEN. YES. I AND MANY LIKE ME BELIEVE THAT IN THE LAST 3 YEARS OF HIS LIFE, BURHANUDDIN MAULA WAS MANIPULATED. SUE ME!!!

Have a look at the pictures posted in this link, and tell me whether Syedna RA was being manipulated, was not aware of the "enemies" around him, and or missed his "true" Mansoos, KQ.
http://qutbibohras.blogspot.com/2014/07 ... story.html

UNFORTUNATELY, THAT IS FOR A COURT TO DECIDE, LET ME SAY IT OPENLY THEN. THE NUSS WAS AMBIGOUS. SUE ME AGAIN!!!

If you think the clear and multiple Nass, along with witnesses is "Ambigious", then you should at least agree that the alleged Nass on KQ is non existent. Something is better than nothing, wouldn't you agree?

No. It's NOT for the court to decide. If you follow the courts decision (Whether for Syedna TUS or KQ), your belief system is distorted.

LET US TAKE A LONG HARD LOOK WHERE IT ALL STARTED. AND I CLAIM ONCE AGAIN, I SEE NO ABUSES FROM THE OTHER CAMP. PEOPLE ON THIS SITE DONT COUNT. ANONYMITY GIVES A FALSE SENSE OF BRAVERY TO ALL

Cherry picking?
Have a look at the Fatemi Dawat site.
They've stooped to comparing using words such has, Taliban, Wahabi, Radical, Liar.
Need I say anymore?


@Crater Lake
Welcome back.
You haven't been able to answer anything since you last left. Why so scared?

SBM
Posts: 6352
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#45

Unread post by SBM » Fri Mar 06, 2015 1:34 pm

If you follow the courts decision (Whether for Syedna TUS or KQ), your belief system is distorted.
Adam
So here is the question for you:
As per court order SMS is visiting his grand children in LA instead of grand children in Saify Mahal Is SMS belief system is distorted?
What,if Court decides that he is not the rightfully appointed Dai, is he going to abide be court decision?
Why did he agree to even go to court for grand children custody if his belief system is not distorted?

Adam
Posts: 1260
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#46

Unread post by Adam » Sat Mar 07, 2015 4:55 am

@SBM.
You're not too smart now are you?

As per court order SMS is visiting his grand children in LA instead of grand children in Saify Mahal Is SMS belief system is distorted?

Can you understand English?
Court Order said no such thing, nor does it even talk about the Grand Father. It just says the father can take the Children back to India later.
When the father gets visitation rights, they bring them home, and that's where they meet their Grandfather?
Why so ignorant? Why so jealous?


What,if Court decides that he is not the rightfully appointed Dai, is he going to abide be court decision?

Why you asking ME this question?
If the [Mumbai] Court decides that Syedna, accoriding to their judgement is not the rightful Dai, and KQ is. Then KQ will most likely get what he claims, the Properties under the Dai Mutlaq.
Is that what your asking?
The Qutbis have said it many times, that irrelevant of the court's decision, their belief in KQ remains the same.


Why did he agree to even go to court for grand children custody if his belief system is not distorted?

1. It was Taha Bs & Ibrahim Bs who were at court. Not Syedna TUS
2. Please look up the dictionary to learn the meanings of the words PETITIONER (KQ's Daughters) & RESPONDENT (Taha Bs & Ibrahim Bs)

To make it easier for you:

Petitioner: One who PRESENTS a formal, written application to a court, officer, or legislative body that requests action on a certain matter.

Respondent: A party AGAINST whom a petition is filed, especially one in an appeal or a divorce case.
----


Now, go back to hating Dawoodi Bohra belief. Trying to act smart doesn't suit you.

anajmi
Posts: 13403
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#47

Unread post by anajmi » Sat Mar 07, 2015 12:51 pm

Your conscience allows you to be responsible for the actions of others? How can you live knowing what your fellow Muslim brethren (ISIS) are doing to the world at large? Don't feel any responsibility there?
:mrgreen: Even when two abde idiots fight one gets labelled an ISIS supporter. ISIS was a gift from God for those weak on anonymous forums.

lawgraduate
Posts: 261
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2015 3:31 pm

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#48

Unread post by lawgraduate » Sat Mar 07, 2015 12:55 pm

anajmi wrote:
Your conscience allows you to be responsible for the actions of others? How can you live knowing what your fellow Muslim brethren (ISIS) are doing to the world at large? Don't feel any responsibility there?
:mrgreen: Even when two abde idiots fight one gets labelled an ISIS supporter. ISIS was a gift from God for those weak on anonymous forums.
those who think ISIS is gift from god should join them in syria so finally somebody can bomb them all together.

anajmi
Posts: 13403
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#49

Unread post by anajmi » Sat Mar 07, 2015 1:11 pm

Right, and since you are pretty weak, having to change ids after every slap, you should join them there.

araz5253
Posts: 236
Joined: Fri Jan 23, 2015 1:18 pm

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#50

Unread post by araz5253 » Sat Mar 07, 2015 1:49 pm

noor5253 wrote:
UnhappyBohra wrote:James the difference is that Syedna Khuzaima Qutbuddin TUS prays for Allah Subhanahu's justice on Mufaddal Saifuddin. He did not incite his followers to go beat up Mumineen who came for ziyarat. Nor has he taken it in his own hands to mete out punishment to MS followers. His entreaty is for them to open their eyes to the fraudster who is sucking them dry and making merry on the spoils. In my opinion it is public service of the highest kind!
Allahs justice ? That we are seeing daily and will see even more.. KQ is aptly named DAWEDAAR. He did his dawedaari upon wafaat of Burhanuddin Maula RA. He is such a laeen that he didnt have the guts to do his dawedaari when Burhanuddin Maula RA was hayat but raised his venomous hood upon Maula RA wafaat..within hours.
and then within hours got involved in kidnapping of children, claiming dawat properties, splitting families..etc etc.

Even if he wanted he couldnt mete out any punishment...Ehni Auqaat aj nathin.
Aliqadr Mufaddal Saifuddin is aptly named 'Saif'udddin.. Just wait and watch.. We are all watching.

All these others.. Craterlake etc have disappeared like rats. All their hujjats are over. Shaqqniwaat disappeared. He is of the same category of KQ and his ilk.. Born in the home of Burhanuddin Maula RA and upon wafaat became a haram khor just like his leader KQ.

All 1 million of us are watching Allah Subhanahus insaaf daily.. God works in Miraculous ways.

Well the dawedar party can say the same thing like Mufaddal is laeen (of course he is no doubt) and behaving like Yazid , even Yazid had full following , even bayat of notable sahabas, Hussain was in minority and was humiliated , for Ali RA it is prove that he was cursed on pulpet for 30 years on each Jummah Khutba , so what?? And ALso know that even after yazid died his sons and various near relatives got the throne while the hussainis decendants continued to be prosecuted and utterly humiliated till they themselves got misguided. Again so what???

araz5253
Posts: 236
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Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#51

Unread post by araz5253 » Sat Mar 07, 2015 1:59 pm

Also the subjects of Pharoah and NImrood loved him , gifted them, bowed to them actually they loved them. Does this change the fact that Pharoah\Nimrod were utter Mushriks. Muffy his father etc also belong to this same league of Pharoah and NImrood albiet worse then them as they are misusing Islamic jargon and names to obfuscate their shirk and decieving jahil followers who well deserve hell for following such an evil cult.

May Allah guide us all

Adam
Posts: 1260
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#52

Unread post by Adam » Sun Mar 08, 2015 1:00 pm

@SBM
No reply from you?

SBM
Posts: 6352
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#53

Unread post by SBM » Sun Mar 08, 2015 3:14 pm

Adam wrote:@SBM
No reply from you?
About What :?:

Adam
Posts: 1260
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#54

Unread post by Adam » Mon Mar 09, 2015 12:47 pm

@SBM: This
Adam wrote:@SBM.
You're not too smart now are you?

As per court order SMS is visiting his grand children in LA instead of grand children in Saify Mahal Is SMS belief system is distorted?

Can you understand English?
Court Order said no such thing, nor does it even talk about the Grand Father. It just says the father can take the Children back to India later.
When the father gets visitation rights, they bring them home, and that's where they meet their Grandfather?
Why so ignorant? Why so jealous?


What,if Court decides that he is not the rightfully appointed Dai, is he going to abide be court decision?

Why you asking ME this question?
If the [Mumbai] Court decides that Syedna, accoriding to their judgement is not the rightful Dai, and KQ is. Then KQ will most likely get what he claims, the Properties under the Dai Mutlaq.
Is that what your asking?
The Qutbis have said it many times, that irrelevant of the court's decision, their belief in KQ remains the same.


Why did he agree to even go to court for grand children custody if his belief system is not distorted?

1. It was Taha Bs & Ibrahim Bs who were at court. Not Syedna TUS
2. Please look up the dictionary to learn the meanings of the words PETITIONER (KQ's Daughters) & RESPONDENT (Taha Bs & Ibrahim Bs)

To make it easier for you:

Petitioner: One who PRESENTS a formal, written application to a court, officer, or legislative body that requests action on a certain matter.

Respondent: A party AGAINST whom a petition is filed, especially one in an appeal or a divorce case.
----


Now, go back to hating Dawoodi Bohra belief. Trying to act smart doesn't suit you.

SBM
Posts: 6352
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#55

Unread post by SBM » Mon Mar 09, 2015 1:50 pm

Adam
So you are smart person calling respected ladies as Baby in your Private E mail
So let us see if you understood court order, it said that the grand kids CAN NOT leave California and that is why your CON MASTER decided to spent 10 days ( the number of days provided for Paternal Visitation Rights by the Court)
What kind of son will parade his sick father during his advance age to collect money and PR
What kind of Grand Father would parade his grand Children in Stretch Limo and Band Baja to collect more money and PR
OH YES IT HAS TO BE SELFISH CUNNING PERSON KNOWN AS SMS.
A caring father and Grand father would have spent quality time discreetly with his son and grand son to bond with them instead of parading them and humiliating them in public. But we already know the qualities of your Master who had no problem parading his sick father in his last days to benefit him. Forget that you could not find 10 qualities to justify him to become a DAI can you list 5 good qualities of being a good Grand Father?

BTW your Masters are trying very hard to find your identity to reward you for your defense of your Con Master, would you please provide your real name and title and address so a new SHAWL can be put on you. You can PM that information to me and I will forward it to them.

Now to your second point about SKQ wins the case he gets the properties, I do not know that I have said all along that may be possible but currently it is SMS who is collecting money under the guise of Dai Ul Mutluq and not SKQ. so who is biggest CROOK at the present time

As far your last point, it was your CROOK Masters who accused mothers of kidnapping children and they had no other option then to file Restraining order in US Courts as it seems they are US Residents/Citizen otherwise US Courts would not have intervened if they were foreign citizens, KAPPISH

Even though you do not want to give your id but my sources are suspecting that you may be Taha Hakimuddin from Saify Mahal who is been planted here to discredit this forum. Are you Taha Hakimuddin? You know that you have accused SKQ people of lying so let us see if you are going to be honest
Last edited by SBM on Mon Mar 09, 2015 2:42 pm, edited 2 times in total.

fustrate_Bohra
Posts: 678
Joined: Mon Nov 25, 2013 6:46 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#56

Unread post by fustrate_Bohra » Mon Mar 09, 2015 2:12 pm

Br. SBM, even after knowing this CHEAP Adam how can you think that he would be able to reply you. There are many pending list of questions which went unanswered.

Adam small suggestion if you are planted by MS or if you are any one belonging to dacoit family go and tell ur sardar to do minimum 5 good things to the community so that you would be in position to reply this LONG LONG AWAITING QUESTION.

hello52
Posts: 45
Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 6:14 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#57

Unread post by hello52 » Mon Mar 09, 2015 2:30 pm

I m just thinking why the khuzaima is not coming out of his house in thane.
and secondly he tells his daughters to lie in the court of law in usa against her husbands to get the custody of childrens . Is this what khuzaima wants to teach his followers to lie .
A Dai never speaks lie atleast and this men just keeps on.
Thirdly .
What was the need of the for the followers of khuzaima to take media with them to the raudat tahera when ever they go there. They can go directly and do the ziyarat of both the Dai . They don't check ur its52 card .
and its not written on ur face whom you people are following . So if you people actually wanted to do the ziyarat of both the syedna you could have gone without letting then know who U actually are by not taking police or the media every where .
Every time you people try to gather sympathies for urself and make fool of urself actually.
I can understand if the sons of khuzaima takes police or media with him because every one knows him that he is the son of the claimant. So he will not be allowed .
But the followers you also just want to get limelight by bringing media with you . You people don't have any feelings or intentions of doing ziyarat you people just want to tarnish the image of the community and get the limelight and gain sympathy .
Not just you people are tarnishing the our image but your image also is being tarnished .
Just don't think from the point of being the enemy .
I just want to tell you that is you people ever had any faith in any of the Dai go and ask him the answers with the pure heart .
I m not telling you to believe either on any one let the Dai himself guide you so just think and ask the question to the Dai instead of doing this type of acts of publicity. Its gonna not help you hereafter. Media just needs spicy news to make money .
So think and act what you people are doing .
And do sympathize with khuzaima not because he is right or wrong but because his own childrens . Be it tahera , Aziz, taher , they are doing all this not for there father but for themselves. He has got the devil as his children the worst one could get.

SBM
Posts: 6352
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#58

Unread post by SBM » Mon Mar 09, 2015 2:34 pm

They don't check ur its52 card
What kind of PSYCHOTROPIC drugs are you taking?

dawedaar
Posts: 844
Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2014 4:40 pm

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#59

Unread post by dawedaar » Mon Mar 09, 2015 2:41 pm

So now the abdes are getting burt hurt to see their leaders getting negative publicity. I guess, its karma hitting them back (Remember, how abdes used to throw abuses and insult on other people like Ali asger engineer, the 4 ustads of jamea, family of peerbhoy etc)... hello52: aap ne toh suna hoga... Jaisi karni Waisi bharni!
hello52 wrote:I m just thinking why the khuzaima is not coming out of his house in thane.
and secondly he tells his daughters to lie in the court of law in usa against her husbands to get the custody of childrens . Is this what khuzaima wants to teach his followers to lie .
A Dai never speaks lie atleast and this men just keeps on.
Thirdly .
What was the need of the for the followers of khuzaima to take media with them to the raudat tahera when ever they go there. They can go directly and do the ziyarat of both the Dai . They don't check ur its52 card .
and its not written on ur face whom you people are following . So if you people actually wanted to do the ziyarat of both the syedna you could have gone without letting then know who U actually are by not taking police or the media every where .
Every time you people try to gather sympathies for urself and make fool of urself actually.
I can understand if the sons of khuzaima takes police or media with him because every one knows him that he is the son of the claimant. So he will not be allowed .
But the followers you also just want to get limelight by bringing media with you . You people don't have any feelings or intentions of doing ziyarat you people just want to tarnish the image of the community and get the limelight and gain sympathy .
Not just you people are tarnishing the our image but your image also is being tarnished .
Just don't think from the point of being the enemy .
I just want to tell you that is you people ever had any faith in any of the Dai go and ask him the answers with the pure heart .
I m not telling you to believe either on any one let the Dai himself guide you so just think and ask the question to the Dai instead of doing this type of acts of publicity. Its gonna not help you hereafter. Media just needs spicy news to make money .
So think and act what you people are doing .
And do sympathize with khuzaima not because he is right or wrong but because his own childrens . Be it tahera , Aziz, taher , they are doing all this not for there father but for themselves. He has got the devil as his children the worst one could get.

SBM
Posts: 6352
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Raudat Tahera Incident

#60

Unread post by SBM » Wed Mar 11, 2015 3:13 pm

Adam
aka Taha Hakimuddin

Where are you? You asked questions I responded so where are you?