Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

The one and only free public forum for Bohras. The focus of this forum is the reform movement, the Dawoodi Bohra faith and, of course, the corrupt priesthood. But the discussion is in no way restricted to the Bohras alone.
fayyaaz
Posts: 528
Joined: Tue Oct 28, 2014 5:40 pm

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#61

Unread post by fayyaaz » Sun May 24, 2015 11:33 pm

Jai wrote: Either you call Allah as Al Ali, ya Ali all both acceptable.
That is unacceptable. I explained this in my previous post.

You can call Allah al-Ali but summon Him using "Ya Ali" . These are two different activities. Naming and Summoning.

It would be foolish to shout Ya Ali in public to mean Ya Allah. Ya Ali, referring to Allah, is best done as part a dua in private. Like I said, Bohras never do this as far as I know.

In public you would use it to call a person named Ali.

humanbeing
Posts: 2195
Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2011 2:30 am

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#62

Unread post by humanbeing » Mon May 25, 2015 3:01 am

asad wrote: Can we leave Ali has a human being and try to emulate his character rather than putting him on the same pedestal as Allah.
This POV can get you a label of wahabi !

DisillusionedDB
Posts: 379
Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 7:20 am

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#63

Unread post by DisillusionedDB » Mon May 25, 2015 4:01 am

humanbeing wrote:
asad wrote: Can we leave Ali has a human being and try to emulate his character rather than putting him on the same pedestal as Allah.
This POV can get you a label of wahabi !
But asad is perfectly right though. And who cares about people passing narrow-minded biased judgements.

fayyaaz
Posts: 528
Joined: Tue Oct 28, 2014 5:40 pm

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#64

Unread post by fayyaaz » Mon May 25, 2015 9:41 am

Jai wrote: Ali means most high and is one of the attributes of Allah swt and is mentioned in 99 names as Al Ali and Quran.
I apologize for continuing this subject. I fear that most people are bored by it. But, for completeness, I must comment on the quote above.

The quote by Jai is accurate. There is however a danger in translation from Arabic.

In Arabic, "Allahu aliyyun" is a full sentence meaning "Allah is the most high". Here "Allah" is a definite noun and "aliyyun" is an indefinite noun thus satisfying grammar rule for an Arabic sentence. Note "aliyyun" with the lower case "a". (The translation of indefinite "aliyyun" into the definite "the most high" is necessitated by the station that Allah holds).

But if you translate the sentence as "Allah is Ali" that could be mistakenly taken to mean that Allah and Ali (ibn Abi Talib) are the same. That is precisely what our friend Jai has done here:
Jai wrote: All the muslims will have to accept Allah as Ali or else they will be out of the fold of islam. In short "Ali is not Allah but Allah is Ali".

Jai
Posts: 26
Joined: Sun May 17, 2015 1:41 pm

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#65

Unread post by Jai » Mon May 25, 2015 3:31 pm

asad wrote: Br. Jai,

As far as my understanding goes word Ya is added to something which is present and can listen to you. Hence Shias say Ya Mohammed, Ya Ali etc. but Sunnis only say Ya Allah because only Allah is ever present and not other personalities including the Prophet.
Br. asad, permissibility to call upon Ya muhammad, Ya Ali has been proved on numerous websites. I have seen that sunni brothers call rasulallah for help (madad ya rasulallah) and even Ali a.s.. In Fact as per the waaz of one shia brother he had mention that "Naad e Ali" (call on Ali a.s) short dua was brought by Hazrat Jibraeel a.s to Muhammad sws to recite at the time when muslim army could not advance after several attemps against the enemies at khaybar. Below is the translation of dua from duas.org
Call on Ali,
(He) is able to bring about the extraordinary.
You will find him an effective
supporter in all calamities.
(All) worries and sorrows will soon disappear .
by Your greatness of O Allah, By Your Prophethood O Mohammed, By your Vicergency
O Ali! O Ali! O Ali!

And as soon as Rasulallah sws finished reciting He sws saw Ali coming. There after khaybar was conquered. everybody saw Ali lifting the khaybar gate with one finger and other superhuman/extraordinary feats in that battle.


If some one reads your above post he can understand in what context you have mentioned
Either you call Allah as Al Ali, ya Ali all both acceptable
but the problem with Shias is that they will be more than happy to only read this part, i have heard my Shia friends say InshaAli.
If shias are happy then they do not have the problem but who are unhappy are having the problem. I have never heard InshaAli to be honest. If they uttered in front of me then I would Ask them, by Ali in InshaAli who they are referring to is it Allah or Ali ibn Abi Taleb? If they reply Allah then there should not be a problem. You can call or refer to Allah by all the beautiful names. but If they meant Ali ibn abi taleb then I would inquire context, reason, reference before coming to any conclusion.

They say that Prophet is above Ali but in the very next minute will equate Ali with Allah having all kinds of superhuman qualities. And for Bohras their Dai is above everyone.
Can you site few examples to better understand what beliefs of shias has made you think which equates Ali a.s to Allah swt (nauzobillah). I have very limited knowledge with Regard to bohra Dai.
My reply in Green

Jai
Posts: 26
Joined: Sun May 17, 2015 1:41 pm

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#66

Unread post by Jai » Mon May 25, 2015 5:09 pm

fayyaaz wrote: In the couplet, the author actually says that Ali is Allah's name. That is not true.
For discussions sake, Atleast in context of summoning both Allah and Ali "Ya Ali" is same. .
However Bohras have a habit of calling upon Panjatan, Imams and Dai by using the vocative particle Ya. So when they say Ya Ali, they actually mean Ya Ali ibn Abi Talib. No Bohra uses Ya Ali to refer to Allah.
It is not just limited to Bohras except for dais. If that is the case then I will be an exception cause I call/summon Allah swt with all his beautiful names including Ya Ali at times and I use Ya Ali also to call/summon Ali ibn abi talib. For arguments sake atleast in context of summoning it is same. Rest I leave upto you. Regarding summoning Ya Ali (ibn Abi Taleb) and panjatan and its permissibility it has been proven on the web and also you can refer to my previous post.

I agree that Bohras ordinarily do not believe Ali to be Allah but I am not so sure about Bohras in advanced stages getting their education in Jaamea.
So far my knowledge about the advanced graduates of Jameea, i have never heard from any of the them that Ali is Allah (nauzobillah). But i have come to know about few other worldly advance stage graduates who have renounced Allah swt all together.


** I have consulted Arabic Grammar books in connection with "Ya", the vocative particle (harfun nidaa).

Jai
Posts: 26
Joined: Sun May 17, 2015 1:41 pm

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#67

Unread post by Jai » Tue May 26, 2015 3:13 am

fayyaaz wrote:
Prophet's journey popularly known as Meraj consists of two events, Isra and Meraj. Isra is his journey from Makkah to Jerusalem and is mentioned in the Quran. Meraj is his journey to heaven described in a Sunni Hadith, which of course does not mention Ali at all. Both the Sunni Hadith and your description of Meraj are, in my opinion, obviously the works of fanciful imagination which a Muslim must accept or he is a blasphemer. In other words they are popular mythology.
No comments.

Can you further elaborate on your assertion that ""Ali is not Allah but Allah is Ali"? I think you mean that Allah is al-Ali, the latter being one of the 99 names of Allah. But saying Allah is al-Ali is the same as saying Allah is Allah. Now why would you say that?
Ali a.s is not Allah swt but Allah swt is Ali (Most High)
You should never ever say that Allah is Ali. I have made this clear, with explanations, in several posts on this forum.
Why not? I say it in the same manner as I say Allah is Rahman, Allah is Raheem and so on.
Another myth you are stating is about noor. Quran does not say that MuhamMmad and Ali are noor of Allah. In fact, Allah says in Surah Noor that He is the noor of the heavens and the earth. You may have hadith about this 'noor' business but it is mythology of your sect, created to give enhanced status to Ali. It is ghulu, extremism.
It is not myth but according to several Hadith it is mentioned that Mohamed sws and Ali a.s are Nur. By Allah's Nur I do not mean Part of Allah swt but created Nur the First creation. Shias believe Mohamed, Ali and Imams to be Allahs nur. Even some sunnis believe Rasulallah was Nur also and referring to him as Allah's nur in the right context was permissible. I apologize since I do not have the proper reply at present and references to support my claim and I do not want to quote Quran cause I have very limited knowledge and I may misinterpret it. I will request you to refer to the reply by shias and sunnis before labelling it as Ghulu.

Look at all the meanings of 'noor' showing all the instances of 'noor' in the Quran in this link of the Quran dictionary, http://corpus.quran.com/qurandictionary.jsp?q=nwr .

Frankly, I have no idea what you mean by "noor" and I do not understand by what Allah means when He says that He is the "noor". I have yet to come across a satisfactory explanation despite numerous available interpretations.[/quote]
Nur refers to Light. There are different spectrums of light and degrees of intensity and travels in waves or particle according to physics. But Light is finite and Allah is infinite and is above all this. It could be a divine or spiritual light he could be referring or it could be symbolic, even i dont know.
If there is anything right is from Allah swt grace and all the mistakes are from me. I seek forgiveness from Almighty for my mistakes.

Jai
Posts: 26
Joined: Sun May 17, 2015 1:41 pm

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#68

Unread post by Jai » Tue May 26, 2015 4:36 am

fayyaaz wrote:
Jai wrote: Ali means most high and is one of the attributes of Allah swt and is mentioned in 99 names as Al Ali and Quran.
I apologize for continuing this subject. I fear that most people are bored by it. But, for completeness, I must comment on the quote above.
Thank God

The quote by Jai is accurate. There is however a danger in translation from Arabic.

In Arabic, "Allahu aliyyun" is a full sentence meaning "Allah is the most high". Here "Allah" is a definite noun and "aliyyun" is an indefinite noun thus satisfying grammar rule for an Arabic sentence. Note "aliyyun" with the lower case "a". (The translation of indefinite "aliyyun" into the definite "the most high" is necessitated by the station that Allah holds).

But if you translate the sentence as "Allah is Ali" that could be mistakenly taken to mean that Allah and Ali (ibn Abi Talib) are the same. That is precisely what our friend Jai has done here:
I am too bad in grammar and its rules. Check out the transliteration and translation of Aliyun both are in upper case. And many times after Allah the attributes are written with uppercase. http://quran.com/2/255 check out the link. And if still I am wrong then my apologies cause that would have been due to my poor grammar.
Jai wrote: All the muslims will have to accept Allah as Ali or else they will be out of the fold of islam. In short "Ali is not Allah but Allah is Ali".

fayyaaz
Posts: 528
Joined: Tue Oct 28, 2014 5:40 pm

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#69

Unread post by fayyaaz » Tue May 26, 2015 10:02 am

Jai wrote: I am too bad in grammar and its rules. Check out the transliteration and translation of Aliyun both are in upper case. And many times after Allah the attributes are written with uppercase. http://quran.com/2/255 check out the link. And if still I am wrong then my apologies cause that would have been due to my poor grammar.
Please look at the transliteration carefully. Uppercase "AA" is transliteration for the Arabic letter "ain". Uppercase "AA" occurs everywhere there is "ain" as in "allatheeyashfaAAu AAindahu illa bi-ithnihi yaAAlamu".

Look at the last sentence of the ayat 2:255. "huwa al-aliyyu".

I could translate that as "He is al-ali", which is correct but not as "He is Ali" which is incorrect.

I have said all I want say to you about this "al-ali/ali" business. I wish you well in your further education.

SBM
Posts: 6242
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#70

Unread post by SBM » Tue May 26, 2015 10:06 am

Admin
Could you kindly move some of the postings between Jai and Fayyaz to Islam Today as this has totally diverted from the original post and turned into religious dialog
They are interesting but does not belong in this thread

fayyaaz
Posts: 528
Joined: Tue Oct 28, 2014 5:40 pm

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#71

Unread post by fayyaaz » Tue May 26, 2015 10:28 am

SBM wrote:Admin
Could you kindly move some of the postings between Jai and Fayyaz to Islam Today as this has totally diverted from the original post and turned into religious dialog
They are interesting but does not belong in this thread
This thread belongs here because it is about the cult in general and especially about the cult of Ali among Bohras and Aga Khanis.

JavedhJuma
Posts: 403
Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2014 2:47 pm

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#72

Unread post by JavedhJuma » Wed May 27, 2015 9:15 pm

Why don't you also defend yourself at the statements of Kamran Afridi. He has plenty of discussions with prominent Aga Khanis ,all available on you tube. Prominent Aga Khanis do not have time for this pig. His videos are altered to suit his agenda and you fools are the buyers. he has put forward all the facts with proof of pictures and videos. However till now, not a single one of the Aga Khan follower that he has talked to was able to refute his words. No Aga Khani would talk to him. What he does is he coaches his cocroaches and tapes the conversation to make it genuine.So if you think that you can defend the Aga Khan and his cancellation of Islamic practices then why don't you engage in a conversation with him. Circ du soleil! Aga Khan has not cancelled any Islamic practices. You and your Kafir Idi have. We have gone over this too but you have a short memory because of all the Kafir Idi's and your Most Merciful's gunk in your head. How do you people sleep at night? No remorse for lies you are creating? You are burning because Aga Khan and Ismailis are praised the world over and you choke!His sites are very popular considering the hits that he receives. Hits are from people like you who are ignorant and jealous of Aga Khan. You alone can keep hitting thousand times a day. Who is there to check? Keep burning as I can smell burning meat. Check out the divorce dates and the marriage date of Aly Khan and then compare the date of Birth of the Aga Khan. All court procedings are now available online. This will give you the proof of the illicit affair of Prince Aly Khan that resulted in your current Imam. Infact the last Aga Khan was so upset with the playboy lifestyle of prince Aly Khan that he was overridden for imamate in favour of his son the Prince Karim. You consider yourself as Mr. Know it all huh? You are as ignorant as some fools on this forum. Jalte raho mere bhai!
. This has been dealt with many times and these court documents are false and were admitted in the court as such otherwise your "most merciful and Mir Bhose would not have admitted they lied and altered the documents. You post the same stuff.

As for Kafir Idi, do you still see his video where he threatened Ismailis? No. We don't talk to dogs, we do not bark at them, we hit them where it hurts most. Barking at him would be stooping to his and your level and would be no difference between them and us and you are one of Kafir Idis progenies. You be my guest and visit his site because you like to play with his shit. Who am I to stop you. this is my last post to you. I won't even read your post.

All I smell is your burning soul.

KA786110
Posts: 360
Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2014 9:20 am

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#73

Unread post by KA786110 » Wed May 27, 2015 11:20 pm

Wow. Trying to confine Imam Ali (as) name with limited understanding. As Holy Prophet (pbuh) said 'Ali and I are from same Nur'.
The entire creation is because of that Nur.

Hadith e Qudsi: "Were it not for you (O Muhammad), I would not have created the universe(s)"
Last edited by KA786110 on Wed May 27, 2015 11:25 pm, edited 2 times in total.

KA786110
Posts: 360
Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2014 9:20 am

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#74

Unread post by KA786110 » Wed May 27, 2015 11:21 pm

To sunni forum members: to understand the high station of Imam Ali(as) ask someone from any sunni sufi order.

mnoorani
Posts: 425
Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2012 3:05 am

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#75

Unread post by mnoorani » Thu May 28, 2015 8:54 am

JavedhJuma wrote:
Why don't you also defend yourself at the statements of Kamran Afridi. He has plenty of discussions with prominent Aga Khanis ,all available on you tube. Prominent Aga Khanis do not have time for this pig. His videos are altered to suit his agenda and you fools are the buyers. he has put forward all the facts with proof of pictures and videos. However till now, not a single one of the Aga Khan follower that he has talked to was able to refute his words. No Aga Khani would talk to him. What he does is he coaches his cocroaches and tapes the conversation to make it genuine.So if you think that you can defend the Aga Khan and his cancellation of Islamic practices then why don't you engage in a conversation with him. Circ du soleil! Aga Khan has not cancelled any Islamic practices. You and your Kafir Idi have. We have gone over this too but you have a short memory because of all the Kafir Idi's and your Most Merciful's gunk in your head. How do you people sleep at night? No remorse for lies you are creating? You are burning because Aga Khan and Ismailis are praised the world over and you choke!His sites are very popular considering the hits that he receives. Hits are from people like you who are ignorant and jealous of Aga Khan. You alone can keep hitting thousand times a day. Who is there to check? Keep burning as I can smell burning meat. Check out the divorce dates and the marriage date of Aly Khan and then compare the date of Birth of the Aga Khan. All court procedings are now available online. This will give you the proof of the illicit affair of Prince Aly Khan that resulted in your current Imam. Infact the last Aga Khan was so upset with the playboy lifestyle of prince Aly Khan that he was overridden for imamate in favour of his son the Prince Karim. You consider yourself as Mr. Know it all huh? You are as ignorant as some fools on this forum. Jalte raho mere bhai!
. This has been dealt with many times and these court documents are false and were admitted in the court as such otherwise your "most merciful and Mir Bhose would not have admitted they lied and altered the documents. You post the same stuff.

As for Kafir Idi, do you still see his video where he threatened Ismailis? No. We don't talk to dogs, we do not bark at them, we hit them where it hurts most. Barking at him would be stooping to his and your level and would be no difference between them and us and you are one of Kafir Idis progenies. You be my guest and visit his site because you like to play with his shit. Who am I to stop you. this is my last post to you. I won't even read your post.



All I smell is your burning soul.
The fact remains that the Aga Khan has cancelled the Shariat . They do not offer namaz or Salat as the way prophet Mohammed instructed. The Wudu has been done away as mere ritual. The Quran has been replaced with Jinans and the Mosques has been totally done away with. The Aga Khan now has jamaat khaanas only , where the water is sprayed by hand ,called chaantas. Who is the Aga Khan to forgive the sins of the people ? Is that not the job for Allah. The Mumbai Agha Khanis sell alcohol. The Aga Khanis in Nairobi have meat shops and they sell Pork. This is because they claim that the shariat is not for them. very soon the bohras will follow the way of the Aga Khaans. Atleast they are not born out of adulterous affairs. Just go on to You tube and look at the logical reasoning of Afridi with prominent Aga Khan followers around the world. They just talk in circles. There is no azaan in the Aga khaans prayer and their burials and funerals are kept top secret. Afridi exposes all the non islamic practices on his videos on you tube and gives evidences also. However till now none of the Aga Khan Ismailis that he talks to online has been able to defend himself.
You talk about hitting Afrididi. Forget hitting him ,just answer his questions, Otherwise just give him your number and he will call you. Please note the number of hits his videos receive. A lot of Aga Khanis are seeing the truth once they watch his video and listen to his conversations.

KA786110
Posts: 360
Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2014 9:20 am

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#76

Unread post by KA786110 » Thu May 28, 2015 3:04 pm

To understand 'walayat'(Imamat) and high station of Imams you will need to fully give your obedience to Allah, the Rasul(pbuh) and Imams. Otherwise as an outsider (non-shia), with a closed mind you will be dumbfounded. You and your fellow Ahle-Sunnah chose not to obey last commands of Allah and His Rasul(pbuh). Are you being asked or forced to change? No, right. So let shias (Ithnas, Bohras, Ismailis etc) follow their interpretations in peace.

Their practices are not non-Islamic, they are following their Imam's guidance. You are stuck with your four frozen sunni schools of thoughts.

SBM
Posts: 6242
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#77

Unread post by SBM » Thu May 28, 2015 4:18 pm

KA786110 wrote:To understand 'walayat'(Imamat) and high station of Imams you will need to fully give your obedience to Allah, the Rasul(pbuh) and Imams. Otherwise as an outsider (non-shia), with a closed mind you will be dumbfounded. You and your fellow Ahle-Sunnah chose not to obey last commands of Allah and His Rasul(pbuh). Are you being asked or forced to change? No, right. So let shias (Ithnas, Bohras, Ismailis etc) follow their interpretations in peace.

Their practices are not non-Islamic, they are following their Imam's guidance. You are stuck with your four frozen sunni schools of thoughts.
KA786110

What is happening in Bohra Clergy about who is true Dai, many have argued where is the IMAM? Why Imam is not revealing himself and save a section of Shia community? Why Imam is letting a NON MUSLIM decide who is the true representative of him on this earth?
So it is no only Sunni asking the relevance of Imam but many in SHIA BOHRA Community are also questioning of Imam's wisdom to keep silent while his followers are be badgered everywhere

KA786110
Posts: 360
Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2014 9:20 am

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#78

Unread post by KA786110 » Thu May 28, 2015 5:07 pm

You raise very valid points. Any rational mind will reject hidden or secluded imam.

JavedhJuma
Posts: 403
Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2014 2:47 pm

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#79

Unread post by JavedhJuma » Thu May 28, 2015 5:30 pm

mnoorani wrote:
JavedhJuma wrote: . This has been dealt with many times and these court documents are false and were admitted in the court as such otherwise your "most merciful and Mir Bhose would not have admitted they lied and altered the documents. You post the same stuff.

As for Kafir Idi, do you still see his video where he threatened Ismailis? No. We don't talk to dogs, we do not bark at them, we hit them where it hurts most. Barking at him would be stooping to his and your level and would be no difference between them and us and you are one of Kafir Idis progenies. You be my guest and visit his site because you like to play with his shit. Who am I to stop you. this is my last post to you. I won't even read your post.



All I smell is your burning soul.
The fact remains that the Aga Khan has cancelled the Shariat . They do not offer namaz or Salat as the way prophet Mohammed instructed. The Wudu has been done away as mere ritual. The Quran has been replaced with Jinans and the Mosques has been totally done away with. The Aga Khan now has jamaat khaanas only , where the water is sprayed by hand ,called chaantas. Who is the Aga Khan to forgive the sins of the people ? Is that not the job for Allah. The Mumbai Agha Khanis sell alcohol. The Aga Khanis in Nairobi have meat shops and they sell Pork. This is because they claim that the shariat is not for them. very soon the bohras will follow the way of the Aga Khaans. Atleast they are not born out of adulterous affairs. Just go on to You tube and look at the logical reasoning of Afridi with prominent Aga Khan followers around the world. They just talk in circles. There is no azaan in the Aga khaans prayer and their burials and funerals are kept top secret. Afridi exposes all the non islamic practices on his videos on you tube and gives evidences also. However till now none of the Aga Khan Ismailis that he talks to online has been able to defend himself.
You talk about hitting Afrididi. Forget hitting him ,just answer his questions, Otherwise just give him your number and he will call you. Please note the number of hits his videos receive. A lot of Aga Khanis are seeing the truth once they watch his video and listen to his conversations.
It has all been discussed before. You are too old to remember. I smell BBQ.

Please get treatment for your dementia.

Looks like you and others are retired people here and hence nothing better to do. What a waste of time for and you and your akhira. Jalte raho!

mnoorani
Posts: 425
Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2012 3:05 am

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#80

Unread post by mnoorani » Fri May 29, 2015 8:14 am

JavedhJuma wrote:
mnoorani wrote: The fact remains that the Aga Khan has cancelled the Shariat . They do not offer namaz or Salat as the way prophet Mohammed instructed. The Wudu has been done away as mere ritual. The Quran has been replaced with Jinans and the Mosques has been totally done away with. The Aga Khan now has jamaat khaanas only , where the water is sprayed by hand ,called chaantas. Who is the Aga Khan to forgive the sins of the people ? Is that not the job for Allah. The Mumbai Agha Khanis sell alcohol. The Aga Khanis in Nairobi have meat shops and they sell Pork. This is because they claim that the shariat is not for them. very soon the bohras will follow the way of the Aga Khaans. Atleast they are not born out of adulterous affairs. Just go on to You tube and look at the logical reasoning of Afridi with prominent Aga Khan followers around the world. They just talk in circles. There is no azaan in the Aga khaans prayer and their burials and funerals are kept top secret. Afridi exposes all the non islamic practices on his videos on you tube and gives evidences also. However till now none of the Aga Khan Ismailis that he talks to online has been able to defend himself.
You talk about hitting Afrididi. Forget hitting him ,just answer his questions, Otherwise just give him your number and he will call you. Please note the number of hits his videos receive. A lot of Aga Khanis are seeing the truth once they watch his video and listen to his conversations.
It has all been discussed before. You are too old to remember. I smell BBQ.

Please get treatment for your dementia.

Looks like you and others are retired people here and hence nothing better to do. What a waste of time for and you and your akhira. Jalte raho!

You keep contradicting yourself. You had stated that you will not respond but you did.
Aga Khanis do not call themselves muslims but only ismailis. The Aga Khan has abolished the muslim prayer as prescribed by the Rasul but they read duas and jinans prepared by humanbeings instead of reading the Holy Quran. Aga Khanis do not recite the kalima shahada and most of them do not know the simple suras of the Quran like the Sura Al Fateha. This is because the Aga Khan has denounced the Islamic Shariat in favour of his firmans. Worry obout your akhira as you have stopped fatsing in Ramzaan. Have done away with masjids and the Islamic salat also known as namaaz, There is no reading of the Holy Quran becuase of your firm beleif that chaantas will redeem your sins. Is the Aga Khan God ? that his chaantas will forgive you of your sins ? Is not that the job of Allah ? Is dasond greater than zakat ? Is selling of alcohol and pork allowed for muslims ?

KA786110
Posts: 360
Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2014 9:20 am

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#81

Unread post by KA786110 » Fri May 29, 2015 10:49 am

mnoorani wrote:they do not call themselves muslims anymore.
Do you live in a cocoon? :P Read this one more time.


It is not true that Ismailis do not call themselves muslims anymore. You have read or heard wrong. Bohras and Ismailis have a great deal in common as far Imams and concept of Imamat are concerned. But in your heart you knew that.

Excerpt from the Present Living Imam's address to the Canadian Parliament:

I was born into a Muslim family, linked by heredity to the Prophet Muhammad (may peace be upon him and his family). My education blended Islamic and Western traditions, and I was studying at Harvard some 50 years ago (yes 50 years ago — actually 56 years ago!) when I became the 49th hereditary Imam of the Shia Imami Ismaili Muslims.

The Ismaili Imamat is a supra-national entity, representing the succession of Imams since the time of the Prophet. But let me clarify something more about the history of that role, in both the Sunni and Shia interpretations of the Muslim faith. The Sunni position is that the Prophet nominated no successor, and that spiritual-moral authority belongs to those who are learned in matters of religious law. As a result, there are many Sunni imams in a given time and place. But others believed that the Prophet had designated his cousin and son-in-law, Ali, as his successor. From that early division, a host of further distinctions grew up — but the question of rightful leadership remains central. In time, the Shia were also sub-divided over this question, so that today the Ismailis are the only Shia community who, throughout history, have been led by a living, hereditary Imam in direct descent from the Prophet.

The role of the Ismaili Imam is a spiritual one; his authority is that of religious interpretation. It is not a political role. I do not govern any land. At the same time, Islam believes fundamentally that the spiritual and material worlds are inextricably connected. Faith does not remove Muslims — or their Imams — from daily, practical matters in family life, in business, in community affairs.

link to the full speech:
http://www.akdn.org/Content/1253/Addres ... ber-Ottawa

JavedhJuma
Posts: 403
Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2014 2:47 pm

Re: Save the Bohras from Bahai Cult

#82

Unread post by JavedhJuma » Sat May 30, 2015 12:21 am

Aga Khanis do not call themselves muslims but only ismailis. Actually we call ourselves Shia Imami Ismaili Muslims. You don't know anything about us and hence your hyperbol. The Aga Khan has abolished the muslim prayer Now tell me something. What is a Muslim prayer? The one the Bohoras offer, Sunnis offer, twelver Shias offer, wahabis offer? Are all these prayers the same. The only common thing you all have is standing up and ruku. Is this a prayer or just actions. Some of you do not even know the meanings of what you recite. our Du'a is made up of 6 suras of the Qur'an, and the rest is composed of prayers offered by Prophet SAW. You don't recite those and tell us we do not follow the Sunnah of the Prophet. Do we care.? see previous.but they read duasYou should not attack for the sake of attacking. We do not read Dua's but recite them, big difference and jinans prepared by humanbeings instead of reading the Holy Quran. What is jinans?? If you mean ginans then even ginans is not correct word. Actually it is gnan meaning knowledge and they were written by Pirs or Dais when they converted Hindus who did not understand Arabic and so they had to teach them little by little through the languages they understood. Aga Khanis do not recite the kalima shahadaOn what planet do you reside? After every Du'a we recite Shahada and after the zikras. We recite Shada more than six or seven times after and between our Du'as. Please do not make a fool of yourself by talking nonsense. and most of them do not know the simple suras of the Quran like the Sura Al Fateha.
You are a real ignoramus. Our every Du'a starts with Sura al-Fateha and ends with Suratul Ikhlas and in between those we recite Sura Maida, Sura Fatah, Sura Anfal: I bet you have not heard of those, eh? Before you open your ignorant mouth, why don't you go on line and look up Ismaili Du'a ? I think Maherally has played a real number on you and you are making a fool of yourself here
This is because the Aga Khan has denounced the Islamic Shariat in favour of his firmans. Only a Jahil talks like that. Sharia is very much there but not the way you all call it. Even Hazarat Umar had denounced part of it and you can see it in Islamic countries, but it is still laid out in the Qur'an. We have been through it. Islam was not or is not that which it was 1400 years ago. Thirty years after the Prophet's demise, Azan was changed both by Sunnis and Shias (so can you tell me which one is correct); talak is done in one sitting whereas the Qur'an says it should be done in three sittings; Thieves hands were to be chopped off at the wrist, but Hazarat Umar cancelled it; Distribution of karze hasana was confined to Muslims only and not to the enemies as prescribed in the Qur'an because Hazarat Umar claimed Muslims were stronger. All this has been stated many times, but you seniors have your senior moments so I am repeating it.Worry obout your akhira as you have stopped fatsing in RamzaanReally? Says who? Maherally? Ismailis do fast and like other Muslims there are among us who do not but let me tell you something. In Ramzan you guys get up in the middle of the night to eat and sleep through prayers. This is not what the Prophet SAW did. He had khajoor and water, and the rest of the night he spent in Ibada. Now listen what Ismailis do. They eat something and drink water and shower and run to the JK at 3 a.m. (albeit not all of them) and do Ibada until fajar because we are required to do Ibada everyday and even more so during Ramadhan. We are advised not to eat heavy meals, like samosa, biriyan etc. when breaking fast because it is not healthy so Imam advises (issued a farman) to eat light food. . Have done away with masjidsDo you know what is a masjid even? Masjid = Ma = In; sjid = sajda, hence, Place where sajada is performed. Let me tell you one thing, Ismailis do at least 8 sajadas in one prayer. Their prayer house is known as Jamat Khana, just as other Muslim sects call their places of worship as Khaneka; Rabat; Zawiya, etc. and the Islamic salat also known as namaaz,Namaz is a Persian word for fire worship, Du'a is pure arabic. However, we know you all are not doing fire worship. Unlike you we have sense as to what you mean. During the Prophet's time prayers were known as Salat or Du'a and not namaz. Dua means to beg. You decide Namaz is better word or Du'a. I have no problem with either. There is no reading of the Holy Quran becuase of your firm beleif that chaantas will redeem your sins. This is such crap. What is the point in reciting the Qur'an when you do not understand it? When your heart is filled with gunk, and you and your brothers are prime example here. If you read or have ever read the Qur'an, Allah SWT gave the right to forgive sins to the Prophet and after the Prophet we believe the right was given to Imam. Chanta was first performed by the Prophet SAW on Panjatan Pak under the cloak and he declared "oh Ahley Bait we have purified you today." This is not from Ismaili history but from Anne Marie Schimmel's book, "Mystical Dimensions of Islam"Is the Aga Khan God ? that his chaantas will forgive you of your sins ? You are 100% correct. Aga Khan is not God. Now tell me, was the Prophet God that he purified his Ahle Bait, and the Qur'an also states if Prophet forgives Allah SWT will forgive. You should know this because you claim to read and know the Qur'an better.Is not that the job of Allah ?I wonder then why does Allah SWT asks the Prophet in Qur'an to forgive people's sins and with the Prophet gone, who can forgive your sins? Why do you have to question everything we do? Most of the time you don't even know what we do and don't but read comic books of Most Merciful who pulled his books from Shelf. Is dasond greater than zakat ? By all means. Dasond is 10% whereas Zakah is 2.5%. Plus we pay 2.5% Now you do the math. Tithe is mentioned in Injil and Torah. It is also mentioned in Hindu literature. Although it is not clarified in the Qur'an but there is Ushr mentioned on crops. Ask your fellows on this board to guide you to the posts he posted sometime back in which it stated that Tunisia, Turkey and Saudi Arabia all paid Ushr but later on removed them except for Saudi Arabia. Please ask MF to produce that article I have it but I don't have time to educate you all the time. By the way, where does it say in the Qur'an that you have to do charity only in the month of Ramadhan. What if you died before that month so you did not pay your zakah and did not do charity during the previous months? Isn't that haramkhori, but we do not say anything to you. Qur'an repeatedly says, "establish prayers and practice regular charity". Regular means regular or daily. It does not say charity should be done only in the month of Ramadan. We pay our dasond five times your zakah, and we pay it as we go. If I delay by one day, I pray to God to please forgive me. I pay the day I get paid. The proof of our charity is in front of you, if only you move your blinkers.Is selling of alcohol and pork allowed for muslims ?
It is not allowed to consume but educate me where it states in the Qur'an it is not allowed to sell. I do not want ahadith, but the Sura or Ayat because I might have missed it.