Moharrum and Ashara 2015

The one and only free public forum for Bohras. The focus of this forum is the reform movement, the Dawoodi Bohra faith and, of course, the corrupt priesthood. But the discussion is in no way restricted to the Bohras alone.
New
Posts: 440
Joined: Fri Jan 24, 2014 9:49 pm

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#121

Unread post by New » Wed Aug 12, 2015 7:49 pm

Brother SBM: The educator has an equal stake. They would like to see their schools excel and the bright students graduate. When parents do not behave wisely, let the educators help. Yes they will not drag the children out from their homes. They should strictly follow the school policies and guide lines period. It is their moral responsibility and they are being paid for that. Government gives grant and the tax payers must see that their money is not wasted. The parents must be warned of the consequences which may be and up to expulsion. Yes the children will be the victims. No one can rescue them from the parents. In the US the Social Service will step in to protect the interests of the minors. The teachers and principals should send warning letters with copies to media.

Other wise describe your solution. Muffy will do anything to fight, including bribes.

SBM
Posts: 6241
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#122

Unread post by SBM » Wed Aug 12, 2015 7:58 pm

In the US the Social Service will step in to protect the interests of the minors.
That is not true since parents can always use HOME SCHOOLING and unfortunately many evangelical and conservative Jews as well as some orthodox Muslim do the same.
other then persuading parents about the importance of education to their children, there is not much anyone can do.

Reporter
Posts: 237
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:34 am

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#123

Unread post by Reporter » Wed Aug 12, 2015 8:23 pm

Yes, close all shops for 10 days...
Attachments
AUD-20150812-WA0005.m4a
(601.21 KiB) Downloaded 3659 times

anajmi
Posts: 13402
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#124

Unread post by anajmi » Wed Aug 12, 2015 8:34 pm

The problem is that the bohras will suffer far more at the hands of their Dai than they will at the hands of child services. Bohraism is nothing more than a cult with the current administration the head. The dai is too stupid to be the one with the controls. It seems the power is in the hands of the top few generals hiding behind this fools back who is just happy to get a ride in a palkhi.

dal-chaval-palidu
Posts: 544
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 12:46 am

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#125

Unread post by dal-chaval-palidu » Thu Aug 13, 2015 1:23 am

New wrote:Please,use this short version on Whatsup for world wide circulation. Stop, stop befor he drags you down. He has no education and no regards for education...Business and service people, you are on your own and use your common sense and better judgement.

Open Letter Officials of Educational Intuitions (August 2015)
Concerning the Fatwa of Sayedna Muffadal Saifuddin
http://www.mumbaimirror.com/mumbai/cove ... 407367.cms
NO SCHOOL FOR 10 DAYS; MUHARRAM PRAYERS ARE A MUST, SAYS SYEDNA


Dear Sir / Madam
As a concerned citizen I would like to bring to your attention that if you comply with this Edict (Fatwa), you will be violating:
1. The Indian Constitution and the recent Supreme Court ruling.
2. The trust the Society and the parents have put in you and your institution for providing a high quality education.
You also may be liable for breaking school policies and as a consequence legal action may be taken against you if the students suffer a setback.
Please, consider this: The pupils have no one to protect them as their parents may be under tremendous pressure as well. My request to you is very simple “NO”. Please, report any inappropriate action to the media.
Please, Note that there is Muharram as a one day holiday. If every religion, sect, sub sect, tribe want their holidays, we will be closing 365 days. Also parents should evaluate their priorities. The religious school of Bohras in Surat would welcome them with open arms.
New,

As you say, the children have nobody to speak for them. The parents may also be under pressure. It is precisely when it is "nobody's business but it affects everybody" that it becomes the "government's business": that is when the Indian state should get involved. This is not about religious freedom - Why all of a sudden all 10 days everything has to be closed, when it was not for so many years before.

dawedaar
Posts: 844
Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2014 4:40 pm

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#126

Unread post by dawedaar » Thu Aug 13, 2015 10:14 am

The Indian government has more larger and pressing issues that this issue may not be on its radar or it may not even consider to look at this matter. Bohras make a very minuscule population and in that minority, a very few people are opposing the juggernaut. Add to it, political connections and the proper monetary oiling of various government machinery by the Kothar, nothing is going to happen!
dal-chaval-palidu wrote:
New,

As you say, the children have nobody to speak for them. The parents may also be under pressure. It is precisely when it is "nobody's business but it affects everybody" that it becomes the "government's business": that is when the Indian state should get involved. This is not about religious freedom - Why all of a sudden all 10 days everything has to be closed, when it was not for so many years before.

dawedaar
Posts: 844
Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2014 4:40 pm

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#127

Unread post by dawedaar » Thu Aug 13, 2015 10:19 am

You still don't get it.. If people don't close their shops for 10 days, how will the Kothar run their 10 day business expo! I am sure, the Kothar may lay low in collecting funds in Ashara this time (After all the opposition) but then strike back with bigger fund raising scheme some other time when no1 is expecting or opposing!

Reporter wrote:Yes, close all shops for 10 days...

alam
Posts: 712
Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2013 8:15 pm

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#128

Unread post by alam » Thu Aug 13, 2015 5:38 pm

Reporter wrote:Yes, close all shops for 10 days...

I'm waiting for the Part 2 of this audio, where SMS goes OFF script and commands something like:

"We are also closing our shop of ASHURA for 10 days and not collecting any money from anyone for anything. And asking that nobody should donate money to Maula in the name of anything. Maula and Maula's khidmatguzaars will not accept hubs for anything during the 10 days."

Will that get SMS fired from his Daiship job?

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#129

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Thu Aug 13, 2015 6:14 pm

Labbaik Ya Daiallah Maaraz On Ohbat Of Ashara 1437 AH Organized By Madarasa Burhaniya Farzando Bhiwandi.

24th Shawwal, 1436


Image

Image

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#130

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Thu Aug 13, 2015 6:54 pm

Mola, you cry about your parents and grandparents and sing their praises and telling how they traveled and how they sat. When are you going to talk about Prophet (s.a.w.) and Molana Ali (a.s.) ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KfHeRSi ... e=youtu.be

anajmi
Posts: 13402
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#131

Unread post by anajmi » Thu Aug 13, 2015 7:18 pm

:mrgreen: :mrgreen:

alam
Posts: 712
Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2013 8:15 pm

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#132

Unread post by alam » Thu Aug 13, 2015 9:48 pm

There is more than one way to skin a cat,
or squeeze a Bohra's pocketbook
or establish cultlike zombie behavior

Similarly
there is more than one way to show resistance. No point undermining different forms of resistance.

The two approaches mentioned by SBM and NEW each have tremendous merit and should be SERIOUSLY considered by anyone unhappy with the bullying and coercion in the name of Imam Husain's.
  • 1. New' (mainly) and some other's too, suggestion of letters to government officials, school officials informs the larger society in which our Bohra community lives
Please,use this short version on Whatsup for world wide circulation. Stop, stop befor he drags you down. He has no education and no regards for education...Business and service people, you are on your own and use your common sense and better judgement.

Open Letter Officials of Educational Intuitions (August 2015)
Concerning the Fatwa of Sayedna Muffadal Saifuddin
http://www.mumbaimirror.com/mumbai/cove ... 407367.cms
NO SCHOOL FOR 10 DAYS; MUHARRAM PRAYERS ARE A MUST, SAYS SYEDNA

Dear Sir / Madam
As a concerned citizen I would like to bring to your attention that if you comply with this Edict (Fatwa), you will be violating:
1. The Indian Constitution and the recent Supreme Court ruling.
2. The trust the Society and the parents have put in you and your institution for providing a high quality education.
You also may be liable for breaking school policies and as a consequence legal action may be taken against you if the students suffer a setback.
Please, consider this: The pupils have no one to protect them as their parents may be under tremendous pressure as well. My request to you is very simple “NO”. Please, report any inappropriate action to the media.
Please, Note that there is Muharram as a one day holiday. If every religion, sect, sub sect, tribe want their holidays, we will be closing 365 days. Also parents should evaluate their priorities. The religious school of Bohras in Surat would welcome them with open arms.
  • 2. SBM suggestion of Just say No, similar to Nancy Raegan Era of saying "just say no" to drugs
It should be the parents who should send their children to school and if Kothari Goons take any action they should consider filling Police Report or to the Civil Right Organizations.
A school can not force against the Parent's wishes, PERIOD.

There are many levels of resistance, and no one really can predict how any revolution unfolds, or the "methodologies" involved, for there are no known "standard" protocols for the revolutions that we know of from history.

People should expand their worldview and not get boxed-in with the idea that there is a SINGLE OUTCOME of this revolution. People should consider small outcomes, process outcomes, intermediary outcomes, and MULTIPLE outcomes to this " revolution". People can begin to take steps from wherever they are at presently, and do what they can or must or willing.

Both approaches are really brilliant, and requires courage and determination. There will be short term inconveniences, traumas, and also a sense of fulfillment of staying true to your sense of dignity, no matter what approach you take.

think
Posts: 1834
Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2011 10:15 am

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#133

Unread post by think » Fri Aug 14, 2015 12:47 am

muffy scouts are on the loose trying to find a lucrative place for moharram mela. Muffy went to misr for the same reason, if govt. would provide security but no dice. Africa , mombasa is a may be, they are eyeing america since there is alot of moulai that can be made. watch out america jamaats, canada is out of league, govt will give muffy a cold shoulder.

New
Posts: 440
Joined: Fri Jan 24, 2014 9:49 pm

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#134

Unread post by New » Fri Aug 14, 2015 1:15 am

Thanks, Brother Alam for recognizing my thoughts. All I am asking is to send this letter to the Schools and to the media. The Schools should not make any adjustment in their policies and warn the parents of the consequences.

Can someone translate in to Gujarati, Hindi etc.?

Please, circulate on Whatsup to your list. Any one can contact Mumbai Mirror?

SBM
Posts: 6241
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#135

Unread post by SBM » Fri Aug 14, 2015 9:24 am

[quote=, they are eyeing america since there is alot of moulai that can be made. watch out america jamaats, canada is out of league, govt will give muffy a cold shoulder.[/quote]
No Dice in USA
Due to upcoming elections and fear of Muslim Extremists, will be difficult to get VISAS to many Abdes/Amtes from India/Pakistan as well as many American Bohras are not going to take 9 days off from their school and work. Also one has to recognize that SKQ has a strong influence with many local politicians in USA as his daughter is in Academia as well Taher is very influential businessman.
SMS is not going to get any special welcome like he used to with other countries. May be the Vice Mayor of the city will meet him privately, which in USA is not a big deal. In USA even Congressman and Senators will visit common person's house to chit chat.

think
Posts: 1834
Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2011 10:15 am

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#136

Unread post by think » Fri Aug 14, 2015 10:22 am

yes, it is true, any senator, mayor or even the president will give audience to the public . But these private or public audiences are ballooned way out of proportion by the kothar machinery and the abdes and amtes of India . Pakistan and Africa lap it up . To them it is shown as a very big affair. View the mombasa pictures. This guy was hugging muffy and muffy could not say a word. but how dare an abde hug muffy, no , no , no , an abde is far far from hugging muffy like this african did. Although an abde and this african are still flesh and bones, but an abde has to stand with folded hands and bow and do sajda and give away half his life's savings before he would even be allowed to kiss muffy's hand. To such an extent is this brain washing for the ignorant that they have a happy feeling that everything will be hunky dori and allah will not harm them because they are paying big money wajebaats etc to muffy. People give money thinking it will cure their problems and this is the weakness of the ignorant mumin that the muffy gang relies on , and makes this belief stonger every day. Ashura 9 day mela is one of them.

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#137

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Fri Aug 14, 2015 4:38 pm

Bhiwandi Amil Saheb Shk. Shabbir Yamani and Anjuman-E-Najmi Jamaat visited School for leave during Ashara 1437

28th Shawwal, 1436

Image

Image

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#138

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Fri Aug 14, 2015 6:49 pm

watsup msg

Forwarded as Received :

Laanat-Malaamat bahut ki Mola ki khaatir
Rishte tod diye logo se Mola ki khaatir

School chhudwayi baccho ki Moharrum ke dino mein
Chhod di naukri mola ka naam lekar Moharrum mein

Dekha jab Masjid me ki Panjatan nahi hai ab bayano mein
Islam kahin se bhi nahi dikhta unki baato mein

Yeh kya nadaani kar di maine mola ki khushi ke khaatir
Khuda ko chhod diya maine mola ke khaatir.

bohrabhai
Posts: 401
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2014 11:16 am

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#139

Unread post by bohrabhai » Sat Aug 15, 2015 8:13 pm

الاخبار الانوار Ohbat Ashara Mubaraka H.1437 (58days to go)
We are Dawoodi Bohra, followers of 53rd Fatemi Dai-Al-Mutlaq, a shining pearl in the treasures of Imam Uz Zaman AS, Aqiq Al Yemen Syedna wa Maulana Abu Jaferus Sadiq Aaliqadr Mufaddal Saifuddin TUS, mansoos and janasheen of Mansur Al Yemen Syedna wa Maulana Abul Qaid Johar Mohammed Burhanuddin RA (52nd Dai) & pray Lanat on Khuzema Mudai & do barat with his followers.
Khuda ta'ala Huzurala TUS ni umar sharif ne qayamat na din lag daraz karjo. Ameen.

Email: [DELETED]

Please note that this poll is private and is only for the limited purpose of gauging readiness of members. Further, we pray that Allah ta’ala make it possible for us to attend Zikre Husain AS with His Dai Syedna wa Maulana Abu Jafer us Sadiq Aqiqul Yemen Aaliqadr Mufaddal Saifuddin TUS whichever venue He choses by Ilham of Imam Uz Zaman AS.

*Required
Have you done azam to attend Ashara waaz from 1st waaz & come before time? *
لبيك يا داعي الله
Yes
Please visit [DELETED]
Any guesses for Ashara Mubaraka H.1437 venue (moze)...? *
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Where will you attend Ashara Mubaraka H.1437 waaz? *
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In my moze only, will attend Ashura maktal
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Can't attend this year
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Example. Burhani Mohalla, Burhani Masjid, Khokha bazar, Mumbai, Mumbai jamiyat.

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Screen reader support enabled.الاخبار الانوار




Ohbat Ashara Mubaraka H.1437
[DELETED]

Al-Noor
Posts: 1075
Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2015 9:55 am

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#140

Unread post by Al-Noor » Sun Aug 16, 2015 1:42 am

ghulam muhammed wrote:watsup msg

Forwarded as Received :

Laanat-Malaamat bahut ki Mola ki khaatir
Rishte tod diye logo se Mola ki khaatir

School chhudwayi baccho ki Moharrum ke dino mein
Chhod di naukri mola ka naam lekar Moharrum mein

Dekha jab Masjid me ki Panjatan nahi hai ab bayano mein
Islam kahin se bhi nahi dikhta unki baato mein

Yeh kya nadaani kar di maine mola ki khushi ke khaatir
Khuda ko chhod diya maine mola ke khaatir.
wow well written.

Al-Noor
Posts: 1075
Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2015 9:55 am

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#141

Unread post by Al-Noor » Sun Aug 16, 2015 2:00 am

I knew this STS ship will sink sooner or latter but I never knew this guy muffy will shoot in his foot this soon. :lol:


allbird
Posts: 462
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#142

Unread post by allbird » Sun Aug 16, 2015 4:49 am

Reporter wrote:Yes, close all shops for 10 days...

What you are asking is not possible. Aa tu dhanda no time che. " Agar Ashara ma nahi kamei kare tu rest of the year shu Jamsu. Na na bhai /behan te wastte hamey chaheya che ke sagala aawe taake dhando maximum thai "

allbird
Posts: 462
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#143

Unread post by allbird » Sun Aug 16, 2015 7:02 am

This dude Yamani was secretary of ex-Mazoon now he is awarded Amalat of Bhiwandi. Loyalty pays... :)

qjbj
Posts: 157
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2014 5:47 pm

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#144

Unread post by qjbj » Sun Aug 16, 2015 11:48 am

To me the Ashara will be in Mumbai. Looks like all of Mumbai and suburbs are in frenzy to get kids off school. MS and kothar want to make sure this new policy of Ashara timings and 10 days off gets off to good start so they are making all this efforts. This will fail as nothing that is forced on people will work over long term. Look at the FMB initiative....its dying a slow death by a 1000 cuts.

anajmi
Posts: 13402
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#145

Unread post by anajmi » Sun Aug 16, 2015 3:34 pm

There is a difference between normal people and abde people. Have you heard about the stockholm syndrome. Abde people suffer from that.

Al-Noor
Posts: 1075
Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2015 9:55 am

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#146

Unread post by Al-Noor » Mon Aug 17, 2015 1:19 am

qjbj wrote:To me the Ashara will be in Mumbai. Looks like all of Mumbai and suburbs are in frenzy to get kids off school. MS and kothar want to make sure this new policy of Ashara timings and 10 days off gets off to good start so they are making all this efforts. This will fail as nothing that is forced on people will work over long term. Look at the FMB initiative....its dying a slow death by a 1000 cuts.
how can you say FMB is dying as far as I understand every abde is taking dabba? do you have some more information about it?

dal-chaval-palidu
Posts: 544
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 12:46 am

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#147

Unread post by dal-chaval-palidu » Mon Aug 17, 2015 1:31 am

I have heard on this forum that the goal is to get the maximum number of people to attend to show the strength (of SMS side) in the court case/any settlement.

In that case, would you not hold the majlis at the most convenient time (evening) so that maximum number of folks would attend? So why is the majlis held in daytime? What am I missing (not understanding) here?

dal-chaval-palidu
Posts: 544
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 12:46 am

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#148

Unread post by dal-chaval-palidu » Mon Aug 17, 2015 1:56 am

alam wrote:There is more than one way to skin a cat,
or squeeze a Bohra's pocketbook
or establish cultlike zombie behavior

Similarly
there is more than one way to show resistance. No point undermining different forms of resistance.

The two approaches mentioned by SBM and NEW each have tremendous merit and should be SERIOUSLY considered by anyone unhappy with the bullying and coercion in the name of Imam Husain's.
  • 1. New' (mainly) and some other's too, suggestion of letters to government officials, school officials informs the larger society in which our Bohra community lives
Please,use this short version on Whatsup for world wide circulation. Stop, stop befor he drags you down. He has no education and no regards for education...Business and service people, you are on your own and use your common sense and better judgement.

Open Letter Officials of Educational Intuitions (August 2015)
Concerning the Fatwa of Sayedna Muffadal Saifuddin
http://www.mumbaimirror.com/mumbai/cove ... 407367.cms
NO SCHOOL FOR 10 DAYS; MUHARRAM PRAYERS ARE A MUST, SAYS SYEDNA

Dear Sir / Madam
As a concerned citizen I would like to bring to your attention that if you comply with this Edict (Fatwa), you will be violating:
1. The Indian Constitution and the recent Supreme Court ruling.
2. The trust the Society and the parents have put in you and your institution for providing a high quality education.
You also may be liable for breaking school policies and as a consequence legal action may be taken against you if the students suffer a setback.
Please, consider this: The pupils have no one to protect them as their parents may be under tremendous pressure as well. My request to you is very simple “NO”. Please, report any inappropriate action to the media.
Please, Note that there is Muharram as a one day holiday. If every religion, sect, sub sect, tribe want their holidays, we will be closing 365 days. Also parents should evaluate their priorities. The religious school of Bohras in Surat would welcome them with open arms.
  • 2. SBM suggestion of Just say No, similar to Nancy Raegan Era of saying "just say no" to drugs
It should be the parents who should send their children to school and if Kothari Goons take any action they should consider filling Police Report or to the Civil Right Organizations.
A school can not force against the Parent's wishes, PERIOD.

There are many levels of resistance, and no one really can predict how any revolution unfolds, or the "methodologies" involved, for there are no known "standard" protocols for the revolutions that we know of from history.

People should expand their worldview and not get boxed-in with the idea that there is a SINGLE OUTCOME of this revolution. People should consider small outcomes, process outcomes, intermediary outcomes, and MULTIPLE outcomes to this " revolution". People can begin to take steps from wherever they are at presently, and do what they can or must or willing.

Both approaches are really brilliant, and requires courage and determination. There will be short term inconveniences, traumas, and also a sense of fulfillment of staying true to your sense of dignity, no matter what approach you take.
Can various people put here addresses/contact info for letters to editors of various newspapers, govt. organisations,and others. Then people can write to them as they wish.

New
Posts: 440
Joined: Fri Jan 24, 2014 9:49 pm

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#149

Unread post by New » Mon Aug 17, 2015 9:47 am

Thanks brother DCP, for your comments. To me it seems that people are looking for an ultimate solution. That is not going to happen. I am not in India and I do not have a Whatsup list. I request all the readers to do participate to circulate, or are we just going to talk about it? There is also education minister in each state. It is very appropriate to send a copy to him or her. Sending to media is a must otherwise Muffy knows how to buy every one.

I have nothing at stake in this. Just I do not want to see the community getting fooled. OK accept this Fatwa now and next year it may extend to 40 days and then...

qjbj
Posts: 157
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2014 5:47 pm

Re: Ashara Oppression 2015

#150

Unread post by qjbj » Mon Aug 17, 2015 2:56 pm

"how can you say FMB is dying as far as I understand every abde is taking dabba? do you have some more information about it?"

Many adbes who are taking it is because its not by their choice. For many its because of repercussions from Amils and system. I know for sure in my jamaat almost 70% not taking it as Amil has no means to pressure anyone. The remaining 30% are because they are sheikhs and/or in jamaat committee and are bound by the system. Many of these are fed up with the thaali when they discuss in private.