Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

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QutbiBohra
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Joined: Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:46 am

Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#31

Unread post by QutbiBohra » Sat Feb 13, 2016 10:28 pm

Where is SKQ is right now?
Even we are unaware of his Mazoon and Mukasir yet.
Also he should pronounce his Mansoos by now.

allbird
Posts: 473
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#32

Unread post by allbird » Sun Feb 14, 2016 12:12 am

Al-Noor wrote:this whole family from STS to SKQ and Muffy are corrupt and liars, I feel sorry for those girls who jumped of plan thinking they are doing right thing by abandoning their husbands and now they lost their children as well. this is a power game and it is so filthy that these guys are even ready to abandon their own blood.

this community is now at dead end...slowly people will realize and move on.

Biggest losers are those who really thinks muffy as a religion man and follows him blindly, these are the worst of all.
I understand what you are saying. SKQ sons are most arrogant, badtamiz, foul mouthed, filthy and ungrateful namak haram kids. I have heard several stories about them from contact. It like saying goes "Kaali kutte ka bhai safeed kutta" translates "Brother of black dog is a white dog"

:mrgreen: :mrgreen:

Al-Noor
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Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#33

Unread post by Al-Noor » Sun Feb 14, 2016 12:17 am

allbird wrote:
Al-Noor wrote:this whole family from STS to SKQ and Muffy are corrupt and liars, I feel sorry for those girls who jumped of plan thinking they are doing right thing by abandoning their husbands and now they lost their children as well. this is a power game and it is so filthy that these guys are even ready to abandon their own blood.

this community is now at dead end...slowly people will realize and move on.

Biggest losers are those who really thinks muffy as a religion man and follows him blindly, these are the worst of all.
I understand what you are saying. SKQ sons are most arrogant, badtamiz, foul mouthed, filthy and ungrateful namak haram kids. I have heard several stories about them from contact. It like saying goes "Kaali kutte ka bhai safeed kutta" translates "Brother of black dog is a white dog"

:mrgreen: :mrgreen:
muffy is also one of those kutta so if you are following him be careful :wink:

qutub_mamajiwala
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Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#34

Unread post by qutub_mamajiwala » Sun Feb 14, 2016 3:40 am

bhai saif
why do u want to hear abdealis waez in first place?
is it not haram and prohibited by muffy?
or do u have special permission from him to listen and do critical analysis?

allbird
Posts: 473
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#35

Unread post by allbird » Sun Feb 14, 2016 5:21 am

Al-Noor wrote:
allbird wrote:
I understand what you are saying. SKQ sons are most arrogant, badtamiz, foul mouthed, filthy and ungrateful namak haram kids. I have heard several stories about them from contact. It like saying goes "Kaali kutte ka bhai safeed kutta" translates "Brother of black dog is a white dog"

:mrgreen: :mrgreen:
muffy is also one of those kutta so if you are following him be careful :wink:
Oh do i need your advice now :oops:

Al-Noor
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Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2015 9:55 am

Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#36

Unread post by Al-Noor » Sun Feb 14, 2016 5:50 am

allbird wrote:
Al-Noor wrote: muffy is also one of those kutta so if you are following him be careful :wink:
Oh do i need your advice now :oops:
I knew muffy abde will feel uneasy on that comment :lol: learn to face truth and reality. :wink:

husena
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2016 5:27 pm

Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#37

Unread post by husena » Wed Feb 17, 2016 8:08 pm

Informants say that SKQ is in US since a long time now. He is undergoing speech correction treatments and surgeries. And latest news says that his voice has recovered quite a lot though not completely coherent! Informants also say that the court case has turned slightly into SKQ's favor which is making earth shake under saifee mahal forcing the mafia bosses to rush to Delhi on frequent occasions off lately!
QutbiBohra wrote:Where is SKQ is right now?
Even we are unaware of his Mazoon and Mukasir yet.
Also he should pronounce his Mansoos by now.

Al-Noor
Posts: 1075
Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2015 9:55 am

Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#38

Unread post by Al-Noor » Thu Feb 18, 2016 12:50 am

husena wrote:Informants say that SKQ is in US since a long time now. He is undergoing speech correction treatments and surgeries. And latest news says that his voice has recovered quite a lot though not completely coherent! Informants also say that the court case has turned slightly into SKQ's favor which is making earth shake under saifee mahal forcing the mafia bosses to rush to Delhi on frequent occasions off lately!
QutbiBohra wrote:Where is SKQ is right now?
Even we are unaware of his Mazoon and Mukasir yet.
Also he should pronounce his Mansoos by now.
I hope this is all true....SKQ is still ok to be in dawat office...muffy is like curse.

Al-Noor
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Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#39

Unread post by Al-Noor » Tue Feb 23, 2016 12:53 pm

I need help here and I am sure like me many has same question...

can any SKQ follower please explain how come SKQ remain oppressed even after having a post of Mazoon for 50 years?

please be honest was there some factor from SMB which kept him under pressure?

how come a bunch of jokers like muffy and his alike hijacked whole dawat for years and years?

I need some clear and honest understanding over here.

Thank you in advance!!!


Wajid
Posts: 87
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2015 2:52 pm

Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#40

Unread post by Wajid » Tue Feb 23, 2016 2:18 pm

Noor bhai,
I am not here to argue over the past 100 years of dawat where many may have qualms about. Nor am I a SKQ (TUS) insider. But I am at peace with my conviction that he is the rightful dai after SMB (RA). We need to see TODAY and what is going wrong in our Dawat.

Now coming to your question : Why did SMB (RA) not intervene when his Mazoon and "Manssos" was being destroyed by his sons.
Below are my 2 cents on the subject :
You need to seek your answers in the Quran. I invite you to read Surah Yousuf. If your intention is to seek a response in good faith ...

Why did Yaqoob (AS) not sanction his sons for their injustices on Yousuf (AS). Although knowing very well the situation through Allah's ilhaam, he did not eschew / throw out his sons for the sins they had committed. He knew that his sons lied and made false allegations on Yousuf. He on the contrary tried endlessly to mend their ways.

وَجَآؤُوا عَلَى قَمِيصِهِ بِدَمٍ كَذِبٍ قَالَ بَلْ سَوَّلَتْ لَكُمْ أَنفُسُكُمْ أَمْرًا فَصَبْرٌ جَمِيلٌ وَاللّهُ الْمُسْتَعَانُ عَلَى مَا تَصِفُونَ (12:18)
and they produced his tunic with false blood upon it. [But Jacob] exclaimed: "Nay, but it is your [own] minds that have made [so terrible] a happening seem a matter of little account to you! [17] But [as for myself,] patience in adversity is most goodly [in the sight of God]; and it is to God [alone] that I pray to give me strength to bear the misfortune which you have described to me." [18] - 12:18

Yaqoob (AS) helplessness can be best described in this Quranic ayah later in the same Surah -

قَالَ إِنَّمَا أَشْكُو بَثِّي وَحُزْنِي إِلَى اللّهِ وَأَعْلَمُ مِنَ اللّهِ مَا لاَ تَعْلَمُونَ (12:86)
He answered: "It is only to God that I complain of my deep grief and my sorrow: for I know, from God, something that you do not know. [87] - 12:86

STS (RA) called upon his son Khuzaima as his Yousuf. This is on records.
SMB (RA) in his first misaaq addressed SKQ (TUS) as his Mazoon and his Most Beloved Son. Why not any of his his biological sons ?
SMB (RA) in one of his bayans clearly mentioned something that I have personally heard and will never forget. Mane badhu khabar che pan mei koi diwas bolo nathi and bolis bhi nahi... This reflects clearly the above ayah of Yaqoob (AS).


The discussion can go endless. But the crux of the matter is "what does your heart say". It is all in the niyah of a person - seek knowledge or seek conjuncture.
The rest ' Allahu Alam.

Fi Amanillah

qutub_mamajiwala
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Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#41

Unread post by qutub_mamajiwala » Wed Feb 24, 2016 4:45 am

on which record it is that he called khuzaima as yousef?
i have not heard of this

Wajid
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Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#42

Unread post by Wajid » Wed Feb 24, 2016 9:39 am

Salam Qutub bhai,
I do not have in my possession the document. May be somebody in the forum does. However, one piece of evidence that cannot be refuted is the hand written personal letter from STS (RA) to SKQ (TUS). I invite you to read this letter and ponder a little over it.

The letter makes some bold statements whereby there can be no doubt that SKQ (TUS) was the next dai in line after SMB (RA).

"I bestow my peaceful greetings—a peaceful greeting whose minaret in the house of pure honor is elevated, whose soaring vistas in the horizons of authentic nobility are vast—upon you, [my] most beloved, most precious, most radiant, most magnanimous, most devoted/virtuous son, apple of my eye [lit. piece of my liver]and joy of my heart, the bright luminary and an auspicious star in the firmament of high distinction, a Dawat rank-holder with a great destiny, one who walks the path of truest guidance, and has gathered in his heart the gems and pearls of the ultimate realities of knowledge, one who shines in rightly guided Dawat (Da’wat-e Hadiya’s) sky as a shining moon on the night of its fullness, and takes action appropriately through exemplary policies and considered judgment, whose name is Khuzaima and whose surname (laqab) is Qutbuddin...

The letter further goes in to say "that you delivered sermons in Muharram in the first flush of youth, with God’s aid and a flowing stream of ta’yid [divineinspiration] from his chosen one, the Imam of the Age" ...

Where is any room for further arguments. In MS's own words "only a Dai can receive the ta'yid from the Imam - none else".

I challenge anyone on the forum to dispute the interpretation that STS (RA) did not refer to SKQ (TUS) as a future Dai in the making. Who besides a Dai can be referred to as the one who shines in rightly guided Dawat (Da’wat-e Hadiya’s) sky as "a shining moon on the night of its fullness, ...

يُرِيدُونَ أَن يُطْفِئُوا نُورَ اللَّهِ بِأَفْوَاهِهِمْ وَيَأْبَى اللَّهُ إِلَّا أَن يُتِمَّ نُورَهُ وَلَوْ كَرِهَ الْكَافِرُونَ

Fain would they extinguish Allah's light with their mouths, but Allah will not allow but that His light should be perfected, even though the Unbelievers may detest (it).

Fi Amanillah
Attachments
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humanbeing
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Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#43

Unread post by humanbeing » Wed Feb 24, 2016 9:56 am

Kothar family takes easy liberty to compare themselves with historic islamic personalities. drop of a hat compare situations with previous prophets and imams. does SKQ really qualify to be compared with prophet yousef ? do these guys really go through hard realities of life, the way previous personalities did.

kothar family is so pansy or shrewd, they relate slight inconvenience to great hardships and shed crocodile tears. STS rose to the scene very well, STS ensured financial prosperity for his family and since then kotharies have lived in life of luxury, flattery and pampered by the community.

SKQ was witness or part of kothar and enjoyed the spoils of the loot. All these ball talks of valor, courage, patience and jalaal is useless when they cant amend thier own materialistic showy lifestyle. it is depressing to see SKQ and SMS side still hanging on to depressing human flattery by words or actions bowing, bending, feet kissing, salaami, talaqqi, sajda crap .. shrewdly using such gestures to thump their supremacy over the masses.

Wajid
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Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#44

Unread post by Wajid » Wed Feb 24, 2016 10:41 am

Bhai Humanbeing,
I have already mentioned in my earlier post : I am not here to address the qualms of community over the past 100 years. Things may have gone wrong and certainly have gone wrong during the last 40+ years. My concern is TODAY.
If you feel that getting out of the D.Bohra fold is a better option, by all means. May Allah bless you. Anyways : لاَ إِكْرَاهَ فِي الدِّينِ THERE SHALL BE no coercion in matters of faith.

The points that I try to make is for the large mass of population who are either blinded by the glitter and glory or are in the state of slumber or denial.

Al-Noor
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Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#45

Unread post by Al-Noor » Wed Feb 24, 2016 11:24 am

problem with SKQ and muffy followers is, as soon as you start asking real life question you guys start proving letters about how is right and who is wrong. mara bhai please try to understand.

yaha kon dai che ehni wat chej nahi kem ke STS potej ghana ulta sidha kam kidha che, so doesnt metters what he writes in his letters. question is how do you justify all the wrong doings in kothar and dawat when SKQ was mazoon himself.

bhai forget about the letter and histrory,, if I want I can prove using Quran that I am DAI as well, do you want me to do that? Nauzobillah I will never use Quran for such purpose, but the thing is I am trying to say its easy to confuse people with text what matters is real life action.

I am not here to fight but to understand.

Al-Noor
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Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#46

Unread post by Al-Noor » Wed Feb 24, 2016 11:27 am

ok now I have one more question can SKQ prove by some means that he is dai of IMAM? does he have any sign which can say he is getting ilhaam or is in contact with Imam? because here IMAM is important and not what these guys SMB/STS writes for each other.

it is obvious they will praise their own son and daughters, but does he have any proof from IMAM himself?


Wajid
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Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#47

Unread post by Wajid » Wed Feb 24, 2016 1:05 pm

Salam Noor bhai,
I am too young to know what happened 100 years ago or 50 years ago !
What I care is the current situation of our community. STA (RA) or SMB (RA) era may have seen many injustices in eyes of many. Even in then, to the questions like, why SMB (RA) not correct the situation; we can only make speculations : Allahu-Aalam.

Please refer to my earlier post. Everything and every action of Waliullah cannot be rationalized. I guess that the helplessness of Yaqoob (mentioned in my earlier post) can give us some response. If you believe that STA (RA) or SMB (RA) were wrong and did not do the needful, you can make different conjunctures without any conclusion ...
Only Allah knows what is in the hearts of a person!

To your question; Where is the IMAM ? Again, every response has a counter argument and a rebuttal. The Quranic ayah tells a lot : يَوْمَ نَدْعُو كُلَّ أُنَاسٍ بِإِمَامِهِمْ - every Islamic sect leader will jump to prove that he is the right IMAM.
In the end, the question lies with ones faith and if one finds peace with his conviction. If you do not find peace within yourself, please seek elsewhere. May Allah help you.

Moreover, please do not compare SKQ (TUS) followers with MS and his troop. I must say that we are being subjected to equal hardship if not more than the Reformists when they opted out of the mainstream. A handful of SKQ (TUS) followers (probably less than 100 families in open) are giving nightmares to the mainstream bohra clergy. Not a single discourse of theirs in public finishes without remembering us :).
Abandoned by close families and friends, bi-hamdillah, they stick firm to the core conviction that they took upon : without seeking any favors or recompense from anyone else but Allah : جَزَاء مِّن رَّبِّكَ عَطَاء حِسَابًا (78:36) [All this will be] a reward from thy Sustainer, a gift in accordance with [His Own] reckoning [17] – - 78:36

Fi Amanillah

Al-Noor
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Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2015 9:55 am

Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#48

Unread post by Al-Noor » Thu Feb 25, 2016 12:46 am

I am too young to know what happened 100 years ago or 50 years ago !

you are too young to know what happened 50 to 100 years ago, but you do compare SKQ with yousef? how do you know Yousef and his life and every single moment of his life?

how do you AYYUB knew every thing about yusef brothers yet kept quite? while Quran says "ALLAH only disclose to his prophet which he wants to disclose"

while here SMB himself did many ayyashi like hunting/worldwide tours/ birthday bashes / colored safai chithis to humiliate momeenin... this proves SMB was not on HAQ and now if SMB wasnt on HAQ his successor cant be on HAQ.

think_for_yourself
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Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#49

Unread post by think_for_yourself » Thu Feb 25, 2016 4:59 am

Al-Noor wrote:
I am too young to know what happened 100 years ago or 50 years ago !

you are too young to know what happened 50 to 100 years ago, but you do compare SKQ with yousef? how do you know Yousef and his life and every single moment of his life?

how do you AYYUB knew every thing about yusef brothers yet kept quite? while Quran says "ALLAH only disclose to his prophet which he wants to disclose"

while here SMB himself did many ayyashi like hunting/worldwide tours/ birthday bashes / colored safai chithis to humiliate momeenin... this proves SMB was not on HAQ and now if SMB wasnt on HAQ his successor cant be on HAQ.
You Al Noor are most definitely not on haq. Our Quranic scholar friend is quoting from the Quran, THAT is how he knows what happened to Yousuf Nabi. You don't even appear to be Bohra as you are pushing some ithna ashari agenda here. Why don't you leave this forum for those that wish to be Bohra.

Al-Noor
Posts: 1075
Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2015 9:55 am

Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#50

Unread post by Al-Noor » Thu Feb 25, 2016 5:42 am

You Al Noor are most definitely not on haq. Our Quranic scholar friend is quoting from the Quran, THAT is how he knows what happened to Yousuf Nabi. You don't even appear to be Bohra as you are pushing some ithna ashari agenda here. Why don't you leave this forum for those that wish to be Bohra.
how is KQ followers different from muffy followers? as soon as real questions are asked reply is>>>leave?

you must be an idiot to think I am not bohra, but any ways I was expecting better from KQ followers. disappointed.

BTW let me polish your Quranic knowledge.

In Quran it never says that AYYUb nabi was aware of every thing yet he kept quite, can you post some ayat, stating AYYUB nabi was aware of every thing yet he kept quite?

if it was like that AYYUB would not cry so much that he LOST HIS EYES.

Wajid
Posts: 87
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Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#51

Unread post by Wajid » Thu Feb 25, 2016 8:25 am

Salams

Are Yaar Noor bhai,
Must you have a say in every post and every subject discussed on this forum. Sometimes "speech is silver but silence is gold".
Let me help you...

First of all - It was not Nabi Ayyub (AS) but Yaqoob (AS) who was Yousuf's (AS) father.

Secondly, before going in the details, I must mention clearly that NOBODY but ALLAH has the knowledge of Gaib (unknown) - unlike multitudes of Bohra men and women who are made to believe that the Dai is Gaib na Maalik and knows everything on the earth - past, present or future. This is complete nonsense and was introduce to give credence to the misdeeds of the Kothar in the name of SMB (RA). The poor gullible bohras buy into this - even the most educated ones. You would never hear SMB (RA) or any true waliullah making such a claim. Somebody may correct me if I am wrong.

Having said that, it is also clear that Allah may choose from amongst his messengers, wali and impart SOME knowledge of the things to happen through what we call in our layman term as "intuition" ...

Read Surah Al-Jinn
عَالِمُ الْغَيْبِ فَلَا يُظْهِرُ عَلَى غَيْبِهِ أَحَدًا (72:26) He [alone] knows that which is beyond the reach of a created being's perception, and to none does He disclose aught of the mysteries of His Own unfathomable knowledge, [20] - 72:26

إِلَّا مَنِ ارْتَضَى مِن رَّسُولٍ فَإِنَّهُ يَسْلُكُ مِن بَيْنِ يَدَيْهِ وَمِنْ خَلْفِهِ رَصَدًا (72:27) unless it be to an apostle whom He has been pleased to elect [there for]: [21] and then He sends forth [the forces of heaven] to watch over him in whatever lies open before him and in what is beyond his ken [22] – - 72:27


Now coming to your question of what details did Yaqoob (AS) know about what was happening behind his back. Again, in the light of the above 2 ayats, it is clear that we cannot determine the extent of his knowledge. Nevertheless, Al Quran clearly says that he knew was happening wrong ...

قَالَ بَلْ سَوَّلَتْ لَكُمْ أَنفُسُكُمْ أَمْرًا فَصَبْرٌ جَمِيلٌ عَسَى اللّهُ أَن يَأْتِيَنِي بِهِمْ جَمِيعًا إِنَّهُ هُوَ الْعَلِيمُ الْحَكِيمُ (12:83) [AND WHEN they returned to their father and told him what had happened,] he exclaimed: "Nay, but it is your [own] minds that have made [so terrible] a happening seem a matter of little account to you! But [as for myself,] patience in adversity is most goodly; God may well bring them all [back] unto me: [85] verily, He alone is all-knowing, truly wise!" - 12:83

فَلَمَّا أَن جَاء الْبَشِيرُ أَلْقَاهُ عَلَى وَجْهِهِ فَارْتَدَّ بَصِيرًا قَالَ أَلَمْ أَقُل لَّكُمْ إِنِّي أَعْلَمُ مِنَ اللّهِ مَا لاَ تَعْلَمُونَ (12:96) But when the bearer of good tidings came [with Joseph's tunic], he laid it over his face; and he regained his sight, [and] exclaimed: "Did I not tell you, `Verily, I know, from God, something that you do not know'?" [95] - 12:96

Lastly, I am by no means comparing SKQ (TUS) to Nabi Yousuf (AS). However we can draw parallels from the teachings of the Quran that things alike may happen and as the Book is timeless, so may be the events ...
As the surah ends eloquently asking us to reflect upon ...

لَقَدْ كَانَ فِي قَصَصِهِمْ عِبْرَةٌ لِّأُوْلِي الأَلْبَابِ مَا كَانَ حَدِيثًا يُفْتَرَى وَلَـكِن تَصْدِيقَ الَّذِي بَيْنَ يَدَيْهِ وَتَفْصِيلَ كُلَّ شَيْءٍ وَهُدًى وَرَحْمَةً لِّقَوْمٍ يُؤْمِنُونَ (12:111) ]Indeed, in the stories of these men there is a lesson for those who are endowed with insight. [As for this revelation, it could not possibly be a discourse invented [by man]: nay indeed, it is [a divine writ] confirming the truth of whatever there still remains [of earlier revelations], clearly spelling out everything, and [offering] guidance and grace unto people who will believe. - 12:111[/color] (Asad)

So Dear friend Noorbhai, lastly I advise you to use your time constructively with good intention of seeking knowledge in lieu of ranting on every post on this forum. Do not be the one amongst those mentioned here :

وَإِذَا رَأَوْهُمْ قَالُوا إِنَّ هَؤُلَاء لَضَالُّونَ (83:32) and whenever they see those [who believe,] they say, "Behold, these [people] have indeed gone astray!" - 83:32 [/color]

وَمَا أُرْسِلُوا عَلَيْهِمْ حَافِظِينَ (83:33) But they had not been sent as keepers over them!. . . [13] - 83:33
[/quote][/quote]


Fi AmanIllah.

Al-Noor
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Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#52

Unread post by Al-Noor » Thu Feb 25, 2016 8:45 am

MR WAJID as usual nice dish out of Quran ayats to fit in your purpose but yes I am getting the ultimate point that its useless to ask real life question to KQ and muffy followers both will dance around and finally declare "bhatkaa huaa" and astray person to those who ask genuine question....

how dare you to fit those last ayat on me while I am believer in ALLAH and his messenger, its a shame you posted these ayat to fit in this situation to prove your point....

as I said I am deeply disopinted in KQ followers and it is proved they have no answers to real question.

and yes it was YAKUB and not AYYUB, my mistake.

Fi Amanillah

Al-Noor
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Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#53

Unread post by Al-Noor » Thu Feb 25, 2016 8:53 am

Since KQ and Muffy abdes loves to use Quran for their own agendas lets answer them in their own terms

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=11059

Wajid
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Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#54

Unread post by Wajid » Thu Feb 25, 2016 9:10 am

Here we go again ...

Are bhai, naaraz kyoun hote ho !
You asked me questions, I answered you point by point. Taking 30 min of my time. Kam se kam Thanks to kaho yaar. And Salaam ka jawab to dijye bhai.

Again, read carefully and digest before you spill out. I did not call you as gone astray. I am not a judge over you !

The Ayah says :

وَإِذَا رَأَوْهُمْ قَالُوا إِنَّ هَؤُلَاء لَضَالُّونَ (83:32) and whenever they see those [who believe,] they say, "Behold, these [people] have indeed gone astray!" - 83:32

So in light of the ayah, in your eyes, WE are the ones gone astray. SubhaanAllah

But the next Ayah gives a fitting response.
وَمَا أُرْسِلُوا عَلَيْهِمْ حَافِظِينَ But they had not been sent as keepers over them!. . . [13] - 83:33

So Chill brother and take time off.
Khuda Hafiz

Al-Noor
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Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2015 9:55 am

Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#55

Unread post by Al-Noor » Thu Feb 25, 2016 9:39 am

So Chill brother and take time off.

I am always chill, and now its time for STS khaandaan (samiri's) to take off,,,, :wink:

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=11059

Khuda Hafiz

Wajid
Posts: 87
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2015 2:52 pm

Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#56

Unread post by Wajid » Thu Feb 25, 2016 3:09 pm

Salaam o Alaikum (hopefully you know to respond to the Salaams) ...

I have no more arguments to make. I quote Allama Iqbaal who has a few fitting couplets for you :

Qoum Mazhab Se Hai, Mazhab Jo Nahin, Tum Bhi Nahin
Jazb-e-Baham Jo Nahin, Mehfil-e-Anjum Bhi Nahin

Jin Ko Ata Nahin Dunya Mein Koi Fann, Tum Ho
Nahin Jis Qoum Ko Parwaye Nasheman, Tum Ho


Fi AmanIllah

anajmi
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Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#57

Unread post by anajmi » Thu Feb 25, 2016 4:57 pm

The analogy presented by bro Wajid between SKQ and Prophet Yusuf (as) is not completely valid. One can present many arguments against it. For example, Yusuf (as) was a biological son of Yaqoob (as).

Second, after Yusuf (as) was thrown in the well, (which SKQ never was. He was just not allowed to sit on the throne!!) Yaqoob (as) immediately chastized them and told them "Nay, but it is your [own] minds that have made [so terrible] a happening seem a matter of little account to you!". He had also warned Yusuf (as) before hand that this might happen.

Third, Yusuf (as) did not want to become the king of Egypt. He was made the king because of his wisdom. SKQ wants to be the Dai and has gone to court to establish his claim!! Yusuf (as) was in jail for seven years. He was a slave too. Has either of the two Dais ever had to do any work to feed themselves or their families? Yusuf (as) after becoming the king of Egypt distributed his wealth amongst all and sundry, even his brothers who threw him in the well. Ever see the Dais doing this?

The bohras should stop comparing their Dais with the great prophets of Allah. They are not worthy of it. Not even a little bit!!

Wajid
Posts: 87
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2015 2:52 pm

Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#58

Unread post by Wajid » Thu Feb 25, 2016 5:49 pm

Salaams Anajmi bhai,

You say Yusuf (as) was a biological son of Yaqoob (as) - How is the contradictory : SKQ (tus) is the biological son of STS (ra). But this is not my point. I have already mentioned, I am not making any comparisons between prophets of the Quraan and the Douaats - I am drawing similitude between the events - then and now.
If not, then the Quraan becomes a mere story book and we do not gain any wisdom / ibrat from the Kalaam ...

Again : لَقَدْ كَانَ فِي قَصَصِهِمْ عِبْرَةٌ لِّأُوْلِي الأَلْبَابِ مَا كَانَ حَدِيثًا يُفْتَرَى وَلَـكِن تَصْدِيقَ الَّذِي بَيْنَ يَدَيْهِ وَتَفْصِيلَ كُلَّ شَيْءٍ وَهُدًى وَرَحْمَةً لِّقَوْمٍ يُؤْمِنُونَ (12:111)
Indeed, in the stories of these men there is a lesson for those who are endowed with insight. [As for this revelation, it could not possibly be a discourse invented [by man]: nay indeed, it is [a divine writ] confirming the truth of whatever there still remains [of earlier revelations], clearly spelling out everything, and [offering] guidance and grace unto people who will believe. - 12:111 (Asad)

Do you always understand the Quran in its literal meaning? For me, throwing in the well would also mean throwing in the darkness, into oblivion, taking one away from the limelight and attention / love of people ...
And then the shirt of Yousuf (as) was presented to Yaqoob (as) with false blood - character assassination, all false accusations etc ...
All the above was true with SKQ (tus) for the past 30 to 40 years. He endured all with patience without any complains. This is in itself an epitome of his tawakkal on Allah.

How do you conveniently conclude that Yousuf (as) did not desire to become a King ?
قَالَ اجْعَلْنِي عَلَى خَزَآئِنِ الأَرْضِ إِنِّي حَفِيظٌ عَلِيمٌ (12:55) [Joseph] replied: "Place in my charge the store-houses of the land; behold, I shall be a good and knowing keeper.
What Yousuf (as) did is known to you and me and because it is mentioned in the Quraan. For the sacrifices of our Douaat, you may have to read some Dawat history. Do not get blocked by the events of the past 30 to 40 years ... There has been too many sacrifices by too many selfless people and of the past Douaats - you are I are privileged to discuss today.
Going to the Court for Worldly Justice is not something new. Again, Surah Yousuf, he has been to the court of law where he failed to make his case and spent years in the prison. Only Allah knows what is in his Hikmat.

Fi AmanIllah

anajmi
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Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#59

Unread post by anajmi » Thu Feb 25, 2016 6:25 pm

Yusuf (as) went to court to defend himself. That is slightly different from what SKQ went to court for.

When you mention 12:55, you should also mention 12:54.

Here the king is telling Yusuf (as)

وَقَالَ الْمَلِكُ ائْتُونِي بِهِ أَسْتَخْلِصْهُ لِنَفْسِي فَلَمَّا كَلَّمَهُ قَالَ إِنَّكَ الْيَوْمَ لَدَيْنَا مِكِينٌ أَمِي
And the King said: "Bring him unto me, so that I may attach him to my own person." And when he had spoken with him, [the King] said: "Behold, [from] this day thou shalt be of high standing with us, invested with all trust!"

So he had the king's trust in all matters. He chose to handle the store-houses since he knew he would be a good and knowing keeper. The stories of the prophet's are there to learn from. Not to justify actions that cannot be otherwise justified. The Arabs have a saying that on the day of judgement even the Devil will use the Quran as his witness!!

anajmi
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Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics) - 2016

#60

Unread post by anajmi » Thu Feb 25, 2016 6:27 pm

There has been too many sacrifices by too many selfless people and of the past Douaats - you are I are privileged to discuss today.
You are right about that. I just wish the current Dais learn from the acts of those selfless people as well. Nothing that these two are doing can be considered selfless!! Or what the last one did for that matter. He was the one who laid the foundation of this fitnah.