Dawoodi Bohra Forum

*खबरदार*

बोहरा समाज के लिए मोहर्रम का इज्तिमा यानी दुनियाभर से हमारे समाज के लोगों का एक जगह जमा होना, करोड़ों रूपयों के बड़े इवेंट मैं बदल गया है।

जिस तरह कोरोना वायरस और लॉक डाउन की हद ने आम आदमी को अपने रोज़मर्रा के काम में तब्दीली लाने पर मजबूर कर दिया है। उसी तरह वो लोग, जिन्होंने इमाम हुसैन की शहादत के नाम पर, जज़्बात का फायदा लेने का कारोबार चला रखा है और अपनी कमाई का साधन बना लिया है, उन्हें यह डर है कि, कहीं यह बदलाव लोगों में नई तब्दीली की तरफ ना चला जाए और आने वाले वक्त में उन्हें इस तरह इजतिमा करना ही मुश्किल हो जायेा।

इसलिए उन्होंने तरह-तरह के फरमान और लोगो को फोन कर के रजिस्ट्रेशन और फार्म भरने और घरों को सजाने की फिज़ूलियात में लगा रखा है। इन सब फरमानो से आम आदमी को कोई तकलीफ भी नहीं है।

मगर एक फरमान कि, वाकई क्या अपने घर में लिबास जैसा वो चाहते हैं, आपने पहना है? घर को जैसा वह चाहते हैं ऐसा आपने बनाया है? आप वाअज़ के वक्त में घर पर मौजूद हैं? इसके लिए नुमाइंदे घर पर पुलिसिया चैकिंग करने आएंगे।

यह फरमान किसी के गले नहीं उतर रहा है। यह कैसे मुमकिन है कि, कोई भी अनजान, अजनबी शख्स घर में घुस आए और कई घर ऐसे भी है जहां सिर्फ औरतें ही रहती है। किसी काम की वजह से मर्द शहर से ही बाहर हैं तो कैसे ऐसे हालात में किसी को भी फौजदार की तरह पुलिसिया काम करने की इजाजत दी जा सकती है?
यह बहुत खतरनाक काम की शुरुआत है।

अभी तक तो यह हुआ है कि, रहो हमारी तरह, खाओ हमारी मर्ज़ी का, पहनो भी हमारी मर्ज़ी का, मगर अब, इन सब के बावजूद गुलामी के शिकंजे से आज़ाद तो नहीं हो गया, इसे देखने के लिए आपके घर की जासूसी करने के लिए कुछ नुमाइंदों को बगैर तकल्लुफ आपके घर भेजने के बहाने, घर में भी दखल देने की कोशिश शुरू की जा रही है।

इसकी इजाजत देना अच्छे अख्लाक के भी खिलाफ है कि, कोई जब चाहे घर में घुस जाएं और मौजूदा हालात में, चोर- उचक्के भी घर में घुस सकते है और लूट कर चले जाएं। (वैसे भी जमात में भी एक से बढ़कर एक नटवर लाल है)

इन सब से इनकार नहीं किया जा सकता, इसलिए अब वक्त है कि, ऐसे तुगलकी फरमान को ना माना जाए और जो भी जमात के नुमाइंदे अगर गलती से घर की तरफ आ जाएं तो उन्हें घर में घुसने ना दिया जाए और सख्ती से मना कर दिया जाए।

*Andehr Nagri Chupat Raj*
15 years ago when Shk Asgar Obri came to Kuwait he was a penniless beggar. By the means of extreme Ji- huzuri of Amils he became part of various committees and organizations, including top position of commander in Burhani guards International.Finally as reward for his services he was nominated as one of the four Dawat Trsutees in Kuwait. He along with late Sheikh Qutbuddin Rasheed who was also one of the four recently nominated Trustees of Dawaat, started siphoning of millions of KD by forging signatures of Shk Saifuddin Katabji(an old but Trustworthy Trustee), and to hide their misdeeds they use to audit the accounts by their bribed auditor. Unfortunately this year in Ramazan due to a surprise audit by an unknown auditor his fraud came out. Then Shz Husain BS authorized an invasive audit for last 10 years and they found that he has looted millions of Kuwait Dinars, immediate action was taken against him and he was banned from stepping his foot in the Jamaat premises, and was forced to agree to pay all the amount in fixed amount of time, information leaked and news of his frauds started circulating on social media.
At first he sat silent for ĺsometime, then one day he suddenly flew to India, and sent a message to Dawat administration that if things will not be made cordial for him once again and his name would not be cleared then he will reveal all the dawat secrets related to financial matters(Hawala trading etc) to government authorities in Kuwait and in India, and will become a witness in money laundering case against them. He also threatened to go and join Taher Fakhruddin group, thus for greater good of the *Fayda group* an urgent message was sent out and on ITS another letter with signatures of Jamaat 8Secretary and Trustee in his support issued and rejecting all the allegations against him as wicked rumours.
No sooner the message was released all of the cobeneficiaries and chamchas of Shk Obri started a social media campaign in his support.
How shameful off this people to do such a things, when they know very well what he has done.
Today Shk. Asghar is thinking that due to his cunningness he has escaped, but he does not know that by his deeds, he has invited the curse on him and mehrum from the door of mercy. The fate of such people is the pit of snakes and scorpions.
May Allah give our people soon a conducive and favourable environmentl to kick such betrayers of public fund and cleanse dawoodi bohras from many such rodents and snakes. Ameen.

kudos to him for conning the con artists... laanat on him and everyone else who has stolen and steal from Bayt al Maal...

objectiveobserver53 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 15, 2020 6:48 am

zinger wrote: ↑Fri Aug 14, 2020 8:00 am

believe me sister when i say this, there was plenty and more outrage and the ridiculous and crass shenanigans of some jamea people in that video of abusing an innocent animal.

and like i said, calling someone out for their behaviour is fair game as you put it, so you are entitled to call him a liar and thief. but going on their looks is not kosher

thats all i have to say on this

i think i had said something about Trump too once before here, comparing him to an animal. i take those words back too

BTW - it’s brother not sister. And you are just hilarious taking your words back about Trump. Were your principles on holiday when you made your comment about Trump or are these newly formed “principles” pulled out of thin air because you can’t bear to confront the fact that MS looks like a rat.
People on this forum have maligned private citizens who were not present. This guy, is a public figure. He makes himself a target when he tries to control his public image as different from his real self. No pictures with recently shot dead endangered species. Only allow pictures with SMB. His public image is a fraud and hence everything about it is a target. Your outrage smacks of hypocrisy.

im sorry about the sister part. i may have mixed you up with someone else.

yes, ill admit my principles were on holiday that day.
they are back now, which is why i was atleast man enough to admit that i am guilty of the same crime in the past.

anyways, its the new year for us, so i am going to end this topic here.

Pehli Raat Mubarak, Bestu Waras Mubarak and Thaal nu Waras Mubarak to you, everyone at home and to everyone on this forum too

zinger wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 7:18 am

objectiveobserver53 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 15, 2020 6:48 am

BTW - it’s brother not sister. And you are just hilarious taking your words back about Trump. Were your principles on holiday when you made your comment about Trump or are these newly formed “principles” pulled out of thin air because you can’t bear to confront the fact that MS looks like a rat.
People on this forum have maligned private citizens who were not present. This guy, is a public figure. He makes himself a target when he tries to control his public image as different from his real self. No pictures with recently shot dead endangered species. Only allow pictures with SMB. His public image is a fraud and hence everything about it is a target. Your outrage smacks of hypocrisy.

im sorry about the sister part. i may have mixed you up with someone else.

yes, ill admit my principles were on holiday that day.
they are back now, which is why i was atleast man enough to admit that i am guilty of the same crime in the past.

anyways, its the new year for us, so i am going to end this topic here.

Pehli Raat Mubarak, Bestu Waras Mubarak and Thaal nu Waras Mubarak to you, everyone at home and to everyone on this forum too

I think that there is nothing manly about apologizing for criticizing a public figure. It’s naïveté at best and stupidity at worst. Public figures are accountable to the people and should be called out if they portray an image inconsistent with their behavior! If Muffy tries to provide subliminal messages that he is same as SMB then it is fair to Counter that he actually looks like rat.

objectiveobserver53 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 1:29 pm

zinger wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 7:18 am


im sorry about the sister part. i may have mixed you up with someone else.

yes, ill admit my principles were on holiday that day.
they are back now, which is why i was atleast man enough to admit that i am guilty of the same crime in the past.

anyways, its the new year for us, so i am going to end this topic here.

Pehli Raat Mubarak, Bestu Waras Mubarak and Thaal nu Waras Mubarak to you, everyone at home and to everyone on this forum too

I think that there is nothing manly about apologizing for criticizing a public figure. It’s naïveté at best and stupidity at worst. Public figures are accountable to the people and should be called out if they portray an image inconsistent with their behavior! If Muffy tries to provide subliminal messages that he is same as SMB then it is fair to Counter that he actually looks like rat.

I agree that public figures are accountable to the people but you're wrong to consider Dai al Mutlaq a public figure.

Dai is a spiritual figure and hence the position demands respect and decency. You can criticize modi because you (and your fellow citizens) elected him based on promises he made. But you didn't choose dai and you don't have the right to do so. I hope you agree that much. I mean even the general website of this forum doesn't blame Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin directly. You have to understand that this is not just about SMS/SMB/STS but all the way upto Syedna Zoeb. If you say that today's dais are corrupted well bring a replacement. Just saying that they are not the rightful dai doesn't help your case. If you don't have a replacement then maybe state your beliefs. Do you believe Imam's line is in continuation? Will Imam ever do zuhoor? If yes then how will he communicate with the community that he's the imam? Does Imam ever try to establish a connection to the community?

It might seem that we are brainwashed but atleast we all have answers to these questions. And having answers to these questions is one of the main reason a lot of people "on the line" are still a part of the community. Lack of leadership for the movement is the biggest reason for its failure. And that had led you astray into mocking the position of dai and commiting personal attacks on dai's appearance.

Now if the things you want to see changed in dawat will you ever come back into the community? Will you teach your children to join the community if things get better or leave them to make their own choices? Will you teach them to be loyal to the imam in hiding. When Sulaiman did his fitnat during Syedna Dawood, a lot of people said Syedna dawood was not on haq. A lot of people said Syedna Qutbuddin was claiming to be khuda. But today your movement doesn't consider them that. Someday in future there might be dissidents who might say that STS/SMB/SMS were like bright stars but the dai of their time is corrupt. You see its just difference of opinions not brainwashing, as you claim.

Hohoho Muffy ain’t no dai. He is not calling anyone to dawat. He did not even show his face the entire month a Shehre Ramadan! He cannot make up his mind about any policy! Is the best food that which you cook at home? Sure, but we will send you this mass produced second rate stuff anyway......Should one obey the law of the land? Yes! But please cut your little seven year old girls up.....I could go on. He flips flops worse than my summer sandals on every topic and they have been listed here many times. He cannot make an extemporaneous speech without putting his foot in his mouth! They cannot afford to broadcast his speeches because he invariably sticks his foot in his mouth. Dai my ass.
You may have all the (wrong) answers but it is clear as daylight that you guys have put your brains aside and have accepted a liar, a flip flopper and an utter nincompoop of a Baba NutJob as your Dai. I think the pre requisite for being a good mumin is that you use your God-given brain first. Just because you are socially and perhaps economically trapped to follow the fool does not mean that you are right in doing so. We did not go searching for an alternative. Muffy distanced us first with his suffocating instructions and his stupidity. You were too lazy to admit that something was wrong. You instead thought it would be smart to kick dogs and make videos of people using the foulest language for one to whom SMB said people should not be prevented from doing sajda to and whose name he took in misaq for not a few days but for 50 years! How many years did he take Muffy’s name in misaq?

And why are you going on about the progressive movement? Not everyone who is in this forum is part of it? I am not. You certainly aren’t.

objectiveobserver53 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 1:29 pm Will Imam ever do zuhoor?

Brother Qadir,
It has been more than 800 years (may be around 1000 years) since the Imam went into the seclusion. That too, the imam was only a 2 year old child. His upbringing was left to whoever and whatever the people then believed. Do you think over the 1000 year period the line of imams is still in continuation? Do we know if there are no splits internally within the line of Imams like we had in past?
More ever, do you believe that the Dais in last 200-300 years have been in regular contact with the hidden Imam?
Why hasn't Imam come back to resolve the disputes in who is real Dai?

Thank you.

bohra_manus wrote: ↑Wed Aug 19, 2020 8:54 am

objectiveobserver53 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 1:29 pm Will Imam ever do zuhoor?

Brother Qadir,
It has been more than 800 years (may be around 1000 years) since the Imam went into the seclusion. That too, the imam was only a 2 year old child. His upbringing was left to whoever and whatever the people then believed. Do you think over the 1000 year period the line of imams is still in continuation? Do we know if there are no splits internally within the line of Imams like we had in past?
More ever, do you believe that the Dais in last 200-300 years have been in regular contact with the hidden Imam?
Why hasn't Imam come back to resolve the disputes in who is real Dai?

Thank you.

Yes, and i can't stress this enough, but the line of Imam continues. If you go to higher sabaqs they even tell you name of Imams after 21st Imam.

If you think of Imam as just a normal 2 year old child, i don't think you believe he was Imam. Imam Hussain only a day old helped a firishta in distress.

Why do you or I should care if there were splits, the dai knows who is the rightful imam. Communication happens through ilham, not a WhatsApp group. So he would know the rightful and the haqiqi Imam only.

There were disputes in times of nabis and moulana Ali so why didn't Allah come to solve the problems? Can you answer that?

objectiveobserver53 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 1:29 pm

zinger wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 7:18 am


im sorry about the sister part. i may have mixed you up with someone else.

yes, ill admit my principles were on holiday that day.
they are back now, which is why i was atleast man enough to admit that i am guilty of the same crime in the past.

anyways, its the new year for us, so i am going to end this topic here.

Pehli Raat Mubarak, Bestu Waras Mubarak and Thaal nu Waras Mubarak to you, everyone at home and to everyone on this forum too

I think that there is nothing manly about apologizing for criticizing a public figure. It’s naïveté at best and stupidity at worst. Public figures are accountable to the people and should be called out if they portray an image inconsistent with their behavior! If Muffy tries to provide subliminal messages that he is same as SMB then it is fair to Counter that he actually looks like rat.

Navu Waras Mubarak.
Bolu Chaalu Maaf
Dua Maa Yaad

objectiveobserver53 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 19, 2020 5:30 am Hohoho Muffy ain’t no dai. He is not calling anyone to dawat. He did not even show his face the entire month a Shehre Ramadan! He cannot make up his mind about any policy! Is the best food that which you cook at home? Sure, but we will send you this mass produced second rate stuff anyway......Should one obey the law of the land? Yes! But please cut your little seven year old girls up.....I could go on. He flips flops worse than my summer sandals on every topic and they have been listed here many times. He cannot make an extemporaneous speech without putting his foot in his mouth! They cannot afford to broadcast his speeches because he invariably sticks his foot in his mouth. Dai my ass.
You may have all the (wrong) answers but it is clear as daylight that you guys have put your brains aside and have accepted a liar, a flip flopper and an utter nincompoop of a Baba NutJob as your Dai. I think the pre requisite for being a good mumin is that you use your God-given brain first. Just because you are socially and perhaps economically trapped to follow the fool does not mean that you are right in doing so. We did not go searching for an alternative. Muffy distanced us first with his suffocating instructions and his stupidity. You were too lazy to admit that something was wrong. You instead thought it would be smart to kick dogs and make videos of people using the foulest language for one to whom SMB said people should not be prevented from doing sajda to and whose name he took in misaq for not a few days but for 50 years! How many years did he take Muffy’s name in misaq?

And why are you going on about the progressive movement? Not everyone who is in this forum is part of it? I am not. You certainly aren’t.

Wow that was quite an incoherent rant. What stuck out for me was this: "the pre requisite for being a good mumin is that you use your God-given brain first".
I wonder why the god-given brain of a true Mumim like you kickstarted only with Mufaddal, before that with STS and SMB it had been lying dormant? Either you are not a true Mumin or your brain works only at your convenience. In either case your protestations are insincere. Admit that these two grandees -- STS and SMB -- are stuck in your craw, you can't swallow them nor spit them out. You can rail against Mufaddal all you want and call him names and worse but remember that you all are cut from the same rag, just that your side of piece is a little less dirty and tattered -- nothing to be super proud of.

Well done!

zinger: If you must use Gujarati then be correct.

Your: "Bolu Chaalu Maaf" should be "Bolwu Chaalwu Maaf".

Humsafar wrote: ↑Wed Aug 19, 2020 1:15 pm

objectiveobserver53 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 19, 2020 5:30 am Hohoho Muffy ain’t no dai. He is not calling anyone to dawat. He did not even show his face the entire month a Shehre Ramadan! He cannot make up his mind about any policy! Is the best food that which you cook at home? Sure, but we will send you this mass produced second rate stuff anyway......Should one obey the law of the land? Yes! But please cut your little seven year old girls up.....I could go on. He flips flops worse than my summer sandals on every topic and they have been listed here many times. He cannot make an extemporaneous speech without putting his foot in his mouth! They cannot afford to broadcast his speeches because he invariably sticks his foot in his mouth. Dai my ass.
You may have all the (wrong) answers but it is clear as daylight that you guys have put your brains aside and have accepted a liar, a flip flopper and an utter nincompoop of a Baba NutJob as your Dai. I think the pre requisite for being a good mumin is that you use your God-given brain first. Just because you are socially and perhaps economically trapped to follow the fool does not mean that you are right in doing so. We did not go searching for an alternative. Muffy distanced us first with his suffocating instructions and his stupidity. You were too lazy to admit that something was wrong. You instead thought it would be smart to kick dogs and make videos of people using the foulest language for one to whom SMB said people should not be prevented from doing sajda to and whose name he took in misaq for not a few days but for 50 years! How many years did he take Muffy’s name in misaq?

And why are you going on about the progressive movement? Not everyone who is in this forum is part of it? I am not. You certainly aren’t.

Wow that was quite an incoherent rant. What stuck out for me was this: "the pre requisite for being a good mumin is that you use your God-given brain first".
I wonder why the god-given brain of a true Mumim like you kickstarted only with Mufaddal, before that with STS and SMB it had been lying dormant? Either you are not a true Mumin or your brain works only at your convenience. In either case your protestations are insincere. Admit that these two grandees -- STS and SMB -- are stuck in your craw, you can't swallow them nor spit them out. You can rail against Mufaddal all you want and call him names and worse but remember that you all are cut from the same rag, just that your side of piece is a little less dirty and tattered -- nothing to be super proud of.

Firstly, if it was that incoherent, you would not have had such a substantial reaction You are getting quite illogical lately.

Hamasafar I am sorry you had a bad experience with SMB. I did not. I do not have to dismiss the many positive experiences I had being part of SMB’s daawat just because you had a ghastly experience. Your characterization of my sentiments towards SMB are quite off. I find Muffy abhorrent and his behavior and mindset quite contrary to SMB’s. So I find it very easy to rail against Muffy and to revere SMB.

Mkenya wrote: ↑Wed Aug 19, 2020 2:17 pm zinger: If you must use Gujarati then be correct.

Your: "Bolu Chaalu Maaf" should be "Bolwu Chaalwu Maaf".

I haven't heard Bolwu chaalwu maaf. What does it mean?

Even I've always said bolu chalu maaf

objectiveobserver53 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 19, 2020 7:48 pm
Firstly, if it was that incoherent, you would not have had such a substantial reaction You are getting quite illogical lately.

Hamasafar I am sorry you had a bad experience with SMB. I did not. I do not have to dismiss the many positive experiences I had being part of SMB’s daawat just because you had a ghastly experience. Your characterization of my sentiments towards SMB are quite off. I find Muffy abhorrent and his behavior and mindset quite contrary to SMB’s. So I find it very easy to rail against Muffy and to revere SMB.

As I said it was just one statement in that diatribe that stood out for me.

No Sir, I did not have any bad experience with SMB or STS or for that matter with Mufaddal or Modi or Mussolini or Hitler or Trump or Bush or Netanyahu or ... you get the drift... but I know from history and from well documented facts that they were/are despicable men whose actions need to be condemned on one moral ground or another. If you make your value judgements on personal experiences alone then your world is very limited and your moral compass, I'm sorry to say, is quite out of whack. But I understand that you Qutbis are in a tight spot, you cannot criticise the mafia clergy without criticising the past and the past actors. Mufaddal did not spring out of nowhere! Him and your current Sayedna and his father were part of the same rotten system. It's like criticising Trump but not acknowledging the white supremacist and anti-immigrant and neocon anti-poor movements that produced him. You are smart enough to get the point and I won't belabour it any more. You don't need to reply.

Qadir wrote: ↑Wed Aug 19, 2020 10:27 am
Yes, and i can't stress this enough, but the line of Imam continues. If you go to higher sabaqs they even tell you name of Imams after 21st Imam.

If you think of Imam as just a normal 2 year old child, i don't think you believe he was Imam. Imam Hussain only a day old helped a firishta in distress.

Why do you or I should care if there were splits, the dai knows who is the rightful imam. Communication happens through ilham, not a WhatsApp group. So he would know the rightful and the haqiqi Imam only.

There were disputes in times of nabis and moulana Ali so why didn't Allah come to solve the problems? Can you answer that?

This is a load of bullcrap. Just say you don't know and stop hemming and hawing. There is no ilham but only bad intentions and deception. Splits happen because these crooks are hungry for power, prestige and wealth. If there were a Imam he would be hazir by now and put and end to all these petty feuding dais.

Qadir: The word 'bol' means 'to speak or utter'; and 'chal' means 'to move or start'.
When one says 'bolu', the person is asking permission to speak or utter; and 'chalu', the person is asking permission to leave or move.
In the context of our topic neither words are inapplicable.

'Bolwu': 'my utterances', and 'chalwu': 'my actions'; convey that you are asking for forgiveness for your choice of words or actions should they have hurt him.

Mkenya wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:31 pm Qadir: The word 'bol' means 'to speak or utter'; and 'chal' means 'to move or start'.
When one says 'bolu', the person is asking permission to speak or utter; and 'chalu', the person is asking permission to leave or move.
In the context of our topic neither words are inapplicable.

'Bolwu': 'my utterances', and 'chalwu': 'my actions'; convey that you are asking for forgiveness for your choice of words or actions should they have hurt him.

Good explanation. The phrase is meant to indicate that "please forgive my words and actions". Clearly, over a period of time the word "chalwu" morphed into "chalu" which makes no sense in this context.

Putting aside the linguistics of this phrase there is an important point that many people forget. It is not enough to say "please forgive my words and actions". You must also say what words and actions you are asking forgiveness for. For example, you need to say, "I was very rude to you on so-and-so day and said words I should not have said. Please forgive me". A generic blanket forgiveness can't be obtained like that. In general, Allah will forgive sins against Him, but the sins between believers need to be enumerated and forgiveness granted. Hence, it is commonly said in Islam that the sins between believers are hardest to get forgiveness for. Best to avoid these sins in the first place.

Mkenya wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:31 pm Qadir: The word 'bol' means 'to speak or utter'; and 'chal' means 'to move or start'.
When one says 'bolu', the person is asking permission to speak or utter; and 'chalu', the person is asking permission to leave or move.
In the context of our topic neither words are inapplicable.

'Bolwu': 'my utterances', and 'chalwu': 'my actions'; convey that you are asking for forgiveness for your choice of words or actions should they have hurt him.

Br Mkenya
Unfortunately Qadir goes to Sabaq and they do not teach these kinds of MANNERS there so you understand where he is coming from

Humsafar wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 3:50 pm

Qadir wrote: ↑Wed Aug 19, 2020 10:27 am
Blah blah

This is a load of bullcrap. Just say you don't know and stop hemming and hawing. There is no ilham but only bad intentions and deception. Splits happen because these crooks are hungry for power, prestige and wealth. If there were a Imam he would be hazir by now and put and end to all these petty feuding dais.

Well said, Humsafar. The reality of the matter is that this cohort of "dai's" are truly petty. Let's think about the 3-4 we know of (and perhaps there are dozens we do not know of).

One guy is in love with wealth and luxury and flies from vacation spot to another. He loves to hunt exotic, endangered animals and supports his parasite family of thousands on money he obtains from his followers. He whips them into a fanatical frenzy, sometimes reducing them to spoon and plate licking morons and at other times screeching and screaming jahils. He is seriously confused: should one do FGM or not? Should women sit in the corner of the house or not? Should you tattle-tale on your neighbor or not? I mean, in one bhaashan sabha he even said he is not sure if people will receive the benediction of Malatona Fatema! In another, he invites a hardcore Hindu politician to give a election rally, turning the days of mourning into a political spectacle and farce. I mean, he is probably the lowest-IQ moron to usurp the position of the da'i.

The other guy wishes he could do everything his lower-IQ cousin is doing. He sits in his house in US and gives lectures which rack up couple of hundred or perhaps a few thousand views. Probably 1% of those actually hear the whole thing, and even fewer really care about his "movement" and "dawaat". His followers are blind as bats and put all ills at the feet of the low-IQ cousin, forgetting conveniently that the problems in the community are decades old and caused due to the limitless greed and love of luxury of their predecessors.

Then we have one other guy living in Varodra and another somewhere in Saudi Arabia. Both of these, though leaders of minuscule communities think they are the "real" da'i and that salvation is only through them.

Coming to the so-called imam. The reality is that there is no such person. Consider the following: in the 1000 years since he went into "hiding" we have had pestilences, major wars, mass murders, holocausts, economic collapse, abject poverty, extreme suffering, pandemics of unbelievable proportions and the world appears on the brink of chaos. Yet, this man is so terrified of some imaginary enemies that he is hiding, behind his mummy's rida, from god-knows what! Meanwhile, his "representatives" say they get telepathic messages from him, each of them claiming the opposite of the other.

The reality is that Islam is an incredibly rich religion with many (all equally valid) paths to achieve union with the Divine Beloved. Islam is not the property of some luxury-loving property developer in Mumbai, or some bloviating hedge-fund manager. There are thousands of Awliya who guide their followers on the Straight Path, without asking for a dime in return. There are giants of Islamic thought who have left their works for everyone to read and benefit from and have not hidden knowledge in so-called "sabak" or "secret" soporific books full of obscure and abstruse doctrines which are meaningless in the modern world. I mean, apparently, we are to believe that the burial process of some random dude is supposed to be highest knowledge one can obtain! Meanwhile, there are Sufi's whose mazaar is open to all, without any need for a dress-code, bribes or even without regard to religion, cast, creed or color. They welcome people with open arms and for hundreds of years have provided solace and a place of rest and spiritual upliftment.

It is sad what the modern Bohras have come to. Instead of embracing the truly egalitarian nature of Islam, in which there is no caste or rank, they have created a fanatical, inward-looking cult that excludes and discriminates, a cult in which one can buy indulgences and expensive hats to fund the truly grotesque lifestyle of the cult leader and his family. And of course, we have fatuous and petty mullahs who fanatically defend their master without thinking for a moment how pathetic they actually sound. Sad.

Imam will come not just because of bohras, but because the whole world needs him, on top there are so much importance in hadith about the Imam and his coming, timing is some thing only Allah will decide.

coming of Imam is as sure as death, just like death we knowit will come but we just dont know when. time will be decided by Allah only.

as we can already see fake so called intellectuals are already denying Imam, this is a good sign, it just shows these people are stupid and cant see the big picture yet. this will hasten coming of Imam.

Mkenya wrote: ↑Wed Aug 19, 2020 2:17 pm zinger: If you must use Gujarati then be correct.

Your: "Bolu Chaalu Maaf" should be "Bolwu Chaalwu Maaf".

thank you for pointing that out.

yes you are right,

@ OO53 Bolwu, Chaalwu maaf

All Shia sects alavi,ishnarshari, Nagpurwala and Qutubis all have live relays of vaez except for mola mola muffadal mola who refuses to show his face to his community.

Biradar
wow- I had to make sure that you wrote this post. Thank you for a great analysis.

Agreed. Excellent post Biradar. Exactly my sentiments but as always expressed more eloquently than I ever could. Thanks.

Humsafar wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 3:43 pm

objectiveobserver53 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 19, 2020 7:48 pm
Firstly, if it was that incoherent, you would not have had such a substantial reaction You are getting quite illogical lately.

Hamasafar I am sorry you had a bad experience with SMB. I did not. I do not have to dismiss the many positive experiences I had being part of SMB’s daawat just because you had a ghastly experience. Your characterization of my sentiments towards SMB are quite off. I find Muffy abhorrent and his behavior and mindset quite contrary to SMB’s. So I find it very easy to rail against Muffy and to revere SMB.

As I said it was just one statement in that diatribe that stood out for me.

No Sir, I did not have any bad experience with SMB or STS or for that matter with Mufaddal or Modi or Mussolini or Hitler or Trump or Bush or Netanyahu or ... you get the drift... but I know from history and from well documented facts that they were/are despicable men whose actions need to be condemned on one moral ground or another. If you make your value judgements on personal experiences alone then your world is very limited and your moral compass, I'm sorry to say, is quite out of whack. But I understand that you Qutbis are in a tight spot, you cannot criticise the mafia clergy without criticising the past and the past actors. Mufaddal did not spring out of nowhere! Him and your current Sayedna and his father were part of the same rotten system. It's like criticising Trump but not acknowledging the white supremacist and anti-immigrant and neocon anti-poor movements that produced him. You are smart enough to get the point and I won't belabour it any more. You don't need to reply.

Sorry Pal,
Us Qutbis are not at all in a tight spot. We say it exactly as we see it which is that SMB was righteous and Muffy is a jackass and that gets your goat.

juzer esmail wrote: ↑Fri Aug 21, 2020 10:17 am All Shia sects alavi,ishnarshari, Nagpurwala and Qutubis all have live relays of vaez except for mola mola muffadal mola who refuses to show his face to his community.

yes, any particular reason for it is still not yet known.

There were disputes in times of nabis and moulana Ali so why didn't Allah come to solve the problems? Can you answer that?

If Allah would have come to solve the problem there would have no 2 major firkas in Islam. Like wise if Imam
would have come to solve the problem there would have no 4-5 splits in Bohras.

*વહોરાઓની માનસિક દરિદ્ધ્રતા :*

અશરા શરુ થવાના એક મહિના અગાવથી ફોન અને વોટ્સઅપ મારફતે વહોરાઓ પર સૂચના અને ફરમાનોનો મારો ચલાવવો શરુ થઇ ગયો. 

અહોબાત, 1000 વાર તસ્બી, ઘરનાં એક રૂમને મસ્જિદના જેવો સાંજ-શણગાર કરી માહોલ ઉભો કરવો, સવારથી સાંજ સુધીમાં ક્યારે શું શું કરવું, અને આ સાલ અશરાના જમણની જે લોગોએ ઉમ્મીદ કીધી હોય એ લોકોને ઘરે ઘરે ક્યારે  ટીફીન પહોંચાડવાનું અને એમાં શું શું મૂકવું એની પણ સૂચના આપવામાં આવી !
કોઈએ નોકરી ધંધે જવાનું નહિ અને બચ્ચાંઓએ ઓનલાઇન પણ સ્ટડી કરવાની નહિ !
બે કલાક ટીવી સામે બેસા રહેવાનું, કોઈની કમાણીનું બે ટાઈમ ખાધે રાખવાનું અને આળસુ બની પડયા રહેવાનું !

આખો સમાજ આટ આટલી જહેમત ઉઠાવે પછી એમને અશરાના નામ પર મળ્યું શું ?  
51, 52 અને 53 ની જમાના જૂની ઘીસી પીટી બયાનોની સીડી જોવા મળી !
સોસીયલ મીડિયાના જમાનામાં રેકોર્ડેડ બયાનો જ્યારે ઈચ્છો ત્યારે જોઈ શકાય છે!
એને માટે સેટબોક્સના ખર્ચા કરાવવાની અને આઇટીએસ સ્કેન કરાવવાના ફટવા કાઢવાની કોઈ જરૂર જ નથી ! 
*સિવાય કે ઘેટાંઓની ગણતરી રાખવાની હોય !*

સામેપક્ષે કોમના પૈસે એશોઆરામ કરતાં આમીલોથી માંડીને કસરેઆલીમાંથી કોઈએ લોકડાઉન દરમિયાન કે અશરાની તૈયારીમાં કોમને નામ પૂરતી પણ મદદ કરી નથી.
*ખુદ દાઈએ પણ છેલ્લાં અમૂક મહિનાથી એક પણ વખત પબ્લિકમાં આવીને મહામારીનાં સમયમાં દોરવણી આપી નથી લાઈવ બયાનમાં આવીને કોમને દોરવણી આપી નથી !*
*એમ છતાં જૂજ વ્યક્તિઓને બાદ કરતાં કોઈએ  સવાલ ઉઠાવ્યા વગર તમામ સૂચનાઓ અને ફરમાંનોંનો અમલ કરે રાખવો એ માનસિક કંગાલિયત છે.*