poverty among bohras

The one and only free public forum for Bohras. The focus of this forum is the reform movement, the Dawoodi Bohra faith and, of course, the corrupt priesthood. But the discussion is in no way restricted to the Bohras alone.
SBM
Posts: 6241
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

poverty among bohras

#1

Unread post by SBM » Sat Oct 18, 2008 6:55 am

To all those Kotharis who on this board have said that there is no poverty among Bohras and all Bohras are doing very well because of Aqua Moula's leadership visit the following website:
http://khidmatguzaars.org/photogallery.htm
amazingly if you read the Food grain distribution, the Khidmatguzars had problem finding a place to distribute the food. How about all those Jamaat Khannas .
The shame is while this is a noble cause done by these people, the FAT CAT Shezadas are no where to be seen helping these people with MAAL AND JAAN what Syedna tells every one to do.
If only Syedna can tell all the Aamils to cut one niyaz and have that money send to this organization that can feed lot of deserving people in our community might be that is too much of asking.

accountability
Posts: 1640
Joined: Sat Oct 15, 2005 4:01 am

Re: poverty among bohras

#2

Unread post by accountability » Sun Oct 19, 2008 7:51 pm

Oma I have just said in my post about Syedna Saheb's helicopter tours. This relflect apathy on the part of present bohra administration. While they indulge in such exorbitant and luxurious life styles, many of our fellow bohras are going hungry and sinking in poverty. Administration has a part to play in it, and a big one.

Bohras have become lethargic towards their own brothers and sisters. They dole out money day in and day out to royal family, but hardly help their own kith and kins.

Smart
Posts: 1388
Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 4:01 am

Re: poverty among bohras

#3

Unread post by Smart » Mon Oct 20, 2008 10:30 am

@Omabharati
It is law of nature, that when the leaders are rich, the common man is poor. History shows us that where ever the kings were rich the common folk were poor. The Nizam of Hyderabad was the richest man on earth and the poorest districts in India, like the Prakasam district were under his dominion.

Today we find more poor Bohras, staying in slums or begging, than what was to be seen even 25 years ago.

Humsafar
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Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2000 5:01 am

Re: poverty among bohras

#4

Unread post by Humsafar » Mon Oct 20, 2008 10:37 am

Smart wrote: It is law of nature, that when the leaders are rich, the common man is poor. ...
Smart, I beg to differ. This is no law of nature but plain human greed.

ghulam muhammed
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Re: poverty among bohras

#5

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Mon Oct 20, 2008 4:06 pm

I have stated in my earlier post as to how important is Humanity and that humanity is the very foundation of every religion on this earth. In todays fanatic bohras we see that this basic fundamental requirement is lacking. There are bohras who dole out Rs.27 to Rs.52 lacs just for obtaining a title of Shekh and NKD and there are others who also willingly give wajebat in crores of rupees. They willingly incur expenses to the tune of not less then Rs.75 lacs towards the cost of one single mola's ziafat. These same bohras will refuse to give even a few thousand to a real needy fellow bohra for starting a petty business thru which he could sustain his whole family, willl refuse to undertake the expense of a poor bohra child's higher education, will refuse to provide free medical aid to the needy. And there are scores of bohras living in poor and unhygenic conditions in slums and places like mumbra, dharavi etc.

The titles of Sheikhs and NKD's are purchased for self glorification and I dont think there is even an iota of religous or spiritual benefits in it. It is cheaper to become an I.T. or mechanical engineer or even an I.A.S. officer then to be a sheikh etc. This title does not have any significance in the eyes of Allah nor does it have any recognition in the outside world. Still, these mad and gullible bohras jump over each other to get these titlles. They dont realise that at the cost of one sheikh you can uplift umpteen number of needy and poor families.

Smart
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Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 4:01 am

Re: poverty among bohras

#6

Unread post by Smart » Mon Oct 20, 2008 9:07 pm

Bro Humsafar,
Agree with you. It is greed. However from the victims point of view, it is the law. The total productivity of a society is finite. If the leaders and the powerful take away the lion's share, the weaker sections / followers are left with crumbs.

East Africawalla
Posts: 374
Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:01 am

Re: poverty among bohras

#7

Unread post by East Africawalla » Sun Oct 26, 2008 4:09 pm

Its all to do with status , a lot of this people feel good that they have made it when they walk with pagris and get their name mentioned that they are rich, its vanity nothing else but then if they want to glorify themselves in such a wat then its their problem, one can't force people to do things your way, its easy to critise but then you see people in Uk pay for their OBE's /MBE's etc, its human nature

ozmujaheed
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Joined: Mon Oct 20, 2008 6:14 am

Re: poverty among bohras

#8

Unread post by ozmujaheed » Mon Oct 27, 2008 10:00 pm

The titles of Sheikhs and NKD's are purchased for self glorification and I dont think there is even an iota of religous or spiritual benefits in it.

There is religious benefit if the crowd is brainwashed to believe that by having the pagri allows them to pray in the 1st saf and thereby daraja in Janaat will probably be in the expensive suburb. Crowd mentality is contagious.

Secondly we are emant live in our own cocoon , expect Orthodox to believe that the suroundings are irrelevant Janaat and rules to Janaat are our own ther rest Jahanam ma jalse !

It is cheaper to become an I.T. or mechanical engineer or even an I.A.S. officer then to be a sheikh etc. This title does not have any significance in the eyes of Allah nor does it have any recognition in the outside world.

It is all to do as a social stature why do people by gold plated Rolex when they know a simple quartz $20 watch will keep the same time and accuracy.

Still, these mad and gullible bohras jump over each other to get these titlles. They dont realise that at the cost of one sheikh you can uplift umpteen number of needy and poor families.

Capitalist man like rich bohras would probably spend Rp 5,000 on their pet dog than pay their servants Rp 4,000 for one month of hard labour. Now givng the poor is more like out of sight out of mind.

ozmujaheed
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Re: poverty among bohras

#9

Unread post by ozmujaheed » Sat Nov 01, 2008 2:53 am

What is the best way to send cash donations to Bohra brothers in India and Pakistan.

Is there a way someone with integrity can create a paypal account to receive overseas sadaqa, fitr, zakat, and distribute on the behalf of persons living in richer nations ?

I prefer to avoid Orthodox institutions or arrangements as I have no trust on their honesty !

aftabm
Posts: 131
Joined: Wed Sep 06, 2006 4:01 am

#10

Unread post by aftabm » Sat Nov 01, 2008 4:35 am

ozmujaheed wrote:What is the best way to send cash donations to Bohra brothers in India and Pakistan.

Is there a way someone with integrity can create a paypal account to receive overseas sadaqa, fitr, zakat, and distribute on the behalf of persons living in richer nations ?

I prefer to avoid Orthodox institutions or arrangements as I have no trust on their honesty !
Dear Oz,

you can send your contribution to Dawoodi Bohra Jamaat , mumbai. They disribute foodgrains, books and money to needy bohras in month of Ramadan(every sat-sun).

I have been there and i have seen lines of such people waiting for these stuff. No Wonder where all the money submitted on the name zakat by high priest goes....

Admin
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Joined: Fri Dec 08, 2000 5:01 am

Re: poverty among bohras

#11

Unread post by Admin » Sat Nov 01, 2008 4:52 pm

ozmujaheed, You can donate online here http://dawoodi-bohras.com/donations/ and let us know where you want you donations to go.

ozmujaheed
Posts: 889
Joined: Mon Oct 20, 2008 6:14 am

Re: poverty among bohras

#12

Unread post by ozmujaheed » Sun Nov 02, 2008 11:03 pm

Admin have you also thought of using Pay pal account in addition to your current setup, if available in India, where you can receive small donations too...

It is a suggestion only ! Many of us would not mind donating small token amounts once we have visited this site ...many of the sharewhere sites have these and depending on the number of visits you could probably gets several hundred dolasrs a week.

Admin
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Joined: Fri Dec 08, 2000 5:01 am

Re: poverty among bohras

#13

Unread post by Admin » Mon Nov 03, 2008 7:51 pm

We're not sure we understand you correctly. We already have a PayPal account and people from anywhere in the world can make a donation.

ozmujaheed
Posts: 889
Joined: Mon Oct 20, 2008 6:14 am

Re: poverty among bohras

#14

Unread post by ozmujaheed » Tue Nov 04, 2008 7:36 am

Salaams

The paypal account and the description reads as for the benefit of the website.

I was requesting a separate one or where we can prescribe during the transaction that the funds less processing charges are to be given to the poor or a charity fund.

Anwar
Posts: 200
Joined: Sun Dec 31, 2000 5:01 am

Re: poverty among bohras

#15

Unread post by Anwar » Tue Nov 04, 2008 4:01 pm

helping bohras during the month of ramzan with grain and money distrubution is no solutuíon to eradicting poorty. I have seen and know of people who help the poor distrubute grain and money collected through NRI bohris. The only answer to reduce poorty in the long term is EDUCATION. Yes school in India specially for girls is free but the state of education is questionable. The best thing to do in long term is donate to schools, who not only provide free education but also distrubute free school uniform and other material.

ozmujaheed
Posts: 889
Joined: Mon Oct 20, 2008 6:14 am

Re: poverty among bohras

#16

Unread post by ozmujaheed » Tue Nov 04, 2008 7:01 pm

Anwar is not wrong but poverty is solved in 2 methods tactical and strategic

..immediate releif where there is desparate need for medicine which means handouts is crtical, they cannot wait until theoir kids finsih school and then they can afford cancer therapy...the poor at time live a life where they are not sure whether they will have food tomorrow or whether their rent is overdue and will be thrown on the streets the next day..these problems will always require small token sadaqa

the long term solutions is education (zakat options) but I wouldnot encourage withdrawing from public schools as I myself am a benficiary of state school...provide funding for necssities and investments where their is no low cost option such as technical training , job creation, small capital investment making people live a better lifestyle.

SBM
Posts: 6241
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: poverty among bohras

#17

Unread post by SBM » Thu Nov 20, 2008 7:53 am

Those Kotharis who visit this forum and say there is no poverty among Bohras, Read the following:
Why Jamats can not offer the Karde Hasanah for these kind of needs but will extend you Qarde Hasanah to do Ziyarat of Syedna Saifuddin's Qabar or his wife's in London. They will even give you Qarde Hasanah to do DEEDAR of Syedna
What a screwed up priority.
Gulpie DONOT ASK FOR PROOF. THIS IS STRAIGHT FROM THE MALUMAAT LINK

SALAME JAMIL,
MY NAME IS ALIASGAR FAKHRUDDIN PATEL (EJAMAAT ID NO 60409999) I NEED FINANCIAL HELP OR KARDAN HASANA AT THIS TIME MY FAMILY FACING BIG PROBLEMS BECOS OF DEN, PLS IF ANYBODY HELP ME OR GIVE ANY DETAILS FOR SUCH PEOPLE I CAN"T FORGIVE THEM FOR WHOLELIFE,FOR MORE DETAIL PLS CONTACT ME ON MY MOBILE(+919924233527) MY SORT DETAIL IS;
ME ARTIFICIAL IMETATION NO MARKETS MA THELO LAGAVI VEPAR KARU CHU MARA BAVAJI NE 4 MAHENA PAHELA PARELISIS NO MAJOR ATTACK AYO CHE,DAN THAI GAYU CHE ,MAMLUKE SAYEDNA GHANO MUSKIL MA CHU,VEPAR NA SAGLO MAAL GHAR NA KHRCH A GHALO GAYO CHE TO VEPAR MA GHANI TAKLIF THAI GAI CHE,AAP MANE MADAD KARI SAKTA HOI TO MADAD KARJO KAI NA BANI SAKE TO MARA FAMILY VASTE DUA TO ZARUR KARJO.
MAY AIIAH GRANT OUR MOULA(T.U.S.)HEALTHY AND LONG LIFE AMEEN..
VASSALAM
ALIASGAR FAKHRUDDIN PATEL FROM JAMNAGAR.

SBM
Posts: 6241
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: poverty among bohras

#18

Unread post by SBM » Thu Nov 20, 2008 8:00 am

Can we as Progressive create some kind of scheme thru Saifuddin Insaf or anyone in India who can help these people.
I am ready to send a donation thru some established person like Saif Insaf or thru this forum.(cut on giving Wajebaats and help this person, I think this person is Zakat eligible) We do not need large sums. If NRI in USA or UK contribute $50.00 each this can help this person and also bring some change in his thinking
Change starts from here, Any thoughts.............

Gulf
Posts: 674
Joined: Thu Feb 08, 2007 5:01 am

Re: poverty among bohras

#19

Unread post by Gulf » Thu Nov 20, 2008 1:27 pm

Actually you are just showing your hypocracy.. If is there anything that you did wish, you would have done it, because there is a donation option on this site.

rejoice for you that Govindacharya have returned in your party again :wink:

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: poverty among bohras

#20

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Thu Nov 20, 2008 4:27 pm

Gulf wrote:Actually you are just showing your hypocracy.. If is there anything that you did wish, you would have done it, because there is a donation option on this site.
Great idea, so why dont you make the move and contribute to that needy person ?

like_minded
Posts: 1260
Joined: Fri Oct 20, 2006 4:01 am

Re: poverty among bohras

#21

Unread post by like_minded » Fri Nov 21, 2008 7:35 am

ghulam muhammed wrote:
Gulf wrote:Actually you are just showing your hypocracy.. If is there anything that you did wish, you would have done it, because there is a donation option on this site.
Great idea, so why dont you make the move and contribute to that needy person ?

GM

These guys would never do that, simply because there is no RETURN here!!

Sometime back when I along with my friends took an initiative to help needy bohras in my city, and subsequently approached the community folks, the question asked by them was... tamara paase raza che?? Bloody pathetic!!!!!

East Africawalla
Posts: 374
Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:01 am

Re: poverty among bohras

#22

Unread post by East Africawalla » Fri Nov 21, 2008 10:46 am

On some of this sad stories you hear , they have to be validated so not give until you are absulutulety sure that they are genuine cases, I have in the past given or sent money and collected money for such causes and then find out that it was a con , the guys get the money and buy cars etc with that money . I guy wrote to be that his son had cancer and we raised money and it was lie.I am not suggesting all the cases will be similat but I am warning you to check.

SBM
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Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: poverty among bohras

#23

Unread post by SBM » Fri Nov 21, 2008 10:59 am

^
That is why in my post I suggested if some one from India can make arrangements for this specific person and help him though contribution collected at this forum. I agree with you and that is why I am waiting for some one to verify the story and we can collect funds thru DB Net here and forward to one of the progressive members who can distribute the fund.

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: poverty among bohras

#24

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Fri Nov 28, 2008 6:39 pm

There is a news item on the front page with a glaring headline in the leading Gujarati Daily of Saurashtra and Gujarat
‘Divya Parakash’ on 5th September 2008. (click here to view the cutting.)

This indicates the rampant corruption in today’s Bohra administration.

The welcome change is that the Bohras are coming out openly and have learned to take help of the media to expose the true side of the plight of the suffering community vis a vis the hi fi tamasha of glorifying the image of a repressive administration.

Here is its English translation:-

The Bohra High Priest's help not reached to 19 villages

Divya Parakash Daily - 5th September 2008: In the matter of the Sayedna's help not reaching to the Bohra families of Amreli, Khanbha, Gadhkada, Jaiser and other 19 villages - Demand to investigate in the functioning of the local bodies.

The religious head of the Dawoodi Bohra community Sayedna Saheb had recently sent Rs. 51 crores 96 lakhs 52 thousand with a farman that this amount be distributed among the poor Dawoodi Bohra families. But the financially crushed poor Bohra families of 19 villages of Amreli, Bhavnagar, Rajkot districts while complaining about the patrician attitude of the local authorities are still waiting for the help. Right now the holy month of Ramazan is going on. Therefore it is necessary to fulfill the Sayedna Saheb's obligation for the charity in this month.

The youth of Dawoodi Bohra community which is serving the humanity here are giving full support to Sayedna Saheb. But it is unfortunate that the information regarding of such selfless dedicated Bohra youth is not reaching to Sayedna Saheb. Therefore the responsibility of distributing the donations, help, relief package sent by Sayedna Saheb are always given to locally appointed Amils. It is because of the patrician attitude of these Amils that the poor Bohra families of 19 villages like Amreli, Khanbha, Gadhkada, Jaiser, Veenchia, Sarsiya, halol, Mota Dadhwa, gunderni are awaiting help.

On the other side the local authorities has presented a rosy pictures of the villages that have influence with Sayedna Saheb and thus misguided him. Therefore the Bohras here demand that Sayedna Saheb should get the true picture from the selfless youths of Saurashtra and institute an inquiry by the honest and respected members into the affair of local Jamats and see to it that the help sent by him reaches to the deserving poor Bohras.