Kissing hands and feet

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incredible
Posts: 1034
Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2010 11:44 pm

Kissing hands and feet

#1

Unread post by incredible » Fri Jul 16, 2010 9:08 am

I was just wondering that there is always a rush of females to kiss hands of shezadaas(tho they are naa mehram),so do this shehzadaaz also allowed gents to kiss their wives hands and feet? :idea:

mukhlis52
Posts: 44
Joined: Sat Jul 10, 2010 10:35 am

Re: Kissing hands and feet

#2

Unread post by mukhlis52 » Fri Jul 16, 2010 9:34 am

the intentions matter more than the action. Bein the sons of Aqa Mola tus, the intentions of ladies as well as men, according to the dawoodi bohra faith, is to recieve blessings of those who are in such a close contact with Aqa Mola tus, this happens in the midst of scores of ppl. If the concept of kissing in the above post points towards gaining sensuality, then the thought is altogether unethical for mention in this context and does not deserve clarification. The other intent of kiss is the way of displaying respect to the thing which is kissed. Just for an EXAMPLE(not to be taken for comparing), the way muslims kiss the black stone in the kabaa, its not to attain sensual satisfaction, but to show reverence for that. This is how this kissing is done.

incredible
Posts: 1034
Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2010 11:44 pm

Re: Kissing hands and feet

#3

Unread post by incredible » Fri Jul 16, 2010 9:39 am

mukhlis52 wrote:the intentions matter more than the action. Bein the sons of Aqa Mola tus, the intentions of ladies as well as men, according to the dawoodi bohra faith, is to recieve blessings of those who are in such a close contact with Aqa Mola tus, this happens in the midst of scores of ppl. If the concept of kissing in the above post points towards gaining sensuality, then the thought is altogether unethical for mention in this context and does not deserve clarification. The other intent of kiss is the way of displaying respect to the thing which is kissed. Just for an EXAMPLE(not to be taken for comparing), the way muslims kiss the black stone in the kabaa, its not to attain sensual satisfaction, but to show reverence for that. This is how this kissing is done.

it is not even allowed in islam to touch naa mehram,how do u explain in context of islam? being son of syedna makes them what?

incredible
Posts: 1034
Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2010 11:44 pm

Re: Kissing hands and feet

#4

Unread post by incredible » Fri Jul 16, 2010 9:40 am

so u mean to say even gents are allowed to kiss hands and feet of shehzaadis for showing them respect?

incredible
Posts: 1034
Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2010 11:44 pm

Re: Kissing hands and feet

#5

Unread post by incredible » Fri Jul 16, 2010 10:24 am

mukhlis52 wrote:the intentions matter more than the action. Bein the sons of Aqa Mola tus, the intentions of ladies as well as men, according to the dawoodi bohra faith, is to recieve blessings of those who are in such a close contact with Aqa Mola tus, this happens in the midst of scores of ppl. If the concept of kissing in the above post points towards gaining sensuality, then the thought is altogether unethical for mention in this context and does not deserve clarification. The other intent of kiss is the way of displaying respect to the thing which is kissed. Just for an EXAMPLE(not to be taken for comparing), the way muslims kiss the black stone in the kabaa, its not to attain sensual satisfaction, but to show reverence for that. This is how this kissing is done.

you sound to be intellectual and well versed in bohra litreture can u please lemme know any instance in which rasullullah(saw) allowed any naa mehram lady to kiss his hands and foot.

mumin
Posts: 398
Joined: Tue Dec 12, 2000 5:01 am

Re: Kissing hands and feet

#6

Unread post by mumin » Fri Jul 16, 2010 6:48 pm

was also wondering how the husband would feel when he sees his wife kissing the hands and knees of the zadas. also in the same context how does the wife of the zada feel when her husband is kissed by all these young and married women. I have also seen young boys not only kissing the zadas hand but also his knees and then also his feet. >The child doing this on the instructions of the parents is not realizing tghat this will have a drastic submission effect on the child in every walk of life.The child will loose completely his worth as a human being. we must desist from such slave like actions.

mukhlis52
Posts: 44
Joined: Sat Jul 10, 2010 10:35 am

Re: Kissing hands and feet

#7

Unread post by mukhlis52 » Sat Jul 17, 2010 1:18 am

Incredible- your questions are genuine and valid. I shall surely inquire into this custom, regarding non blood related women.
About the children kissing the hands and feet of Shehzadas, it takes the reader to an absurd conclusion. Kissing of hands and feet is the longer version of Salaam. This is how it is done in the community and also elsewhere in islamic oriented cultures where only the hand is kissed. In our community, children even kiss their own parent's hands and feet, also there teacher's. At least i have been doing as such since my childhood. It never did affect my self respect. Kissing the feet and hands (Salaam) of Shehzadas by children has got nothing to do with his self respect. Not just Shehzadas but also their respective religious teacher's are done salam like tht. Its not an exclusive action restricted to Shehzadas. Its a custom of the community. Its a gesture of respect. The post points towards the Shehzadas being done tht way therefore creating a rift in the mind but actually rest assured, not they but every elder is treated like that by the younger in our community. There has never been any sense of the loss of self respect in that. If someone else feels that way, thn every religion has something or the other which might be senseless or abusive to another. That will not lead the religion or its customs to be changed.

S. Insaf
Posts: 1494
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2003 4:01 am

Re: Kissing hands and feet

#8

Unread post by S. Insaf » Sat Jul 17, 2010 5:20 am

Dear mukhlis52,
Since from posts I find you sensible and truth-seeker I am making an attept to differ from your above submission.
We take pride in calling ourselves as Shi'a of Maula Ali. Therefore I am quoting just one incident from "Nahjul Balaga' (Peak of Eloquence" to highlight the slavery that has gone in our blood:
'Harish-ibne-Sohail, one of the governors of the provinces, was in Koofa, once he was riding through the city and saw Hazrat Ali (A.S.) also riding.
He got down from his horse to accompany the caliph on foot. Hazrat Ali stopped his horse and said:
"It ill-becomes a man to lower down himself before any body but Allah, please get upon your horse, even had you not been an officer of the state, I would not have
you allowed yourself to lower down like this. The sight of such humiliation of man before man never pleases Allah. It is the worst form of tyranny which can be practised."


So according to Maula Ali what you are calling respect is in fact humiliation and Kothari Amils and Shahzadas are the worst kind of tyrants.

mukhlis52
Posts: 44
Joined: Sat Jul 10, 2010 10:35 am

Re: Kissing hands and feet

#9

Unread post by mukhlis52 » Sat Jul 17, 2010 11:56 am

Could you please brief me with the page number of this kalaam from nehj? If u have the copy edited by Sheikh Muhammad Abduh, it'l be easy for me to refer to this kalaam. Thank you.

S. Insaf
Posts: 1494
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2003 4:01 am

Re: Kissing hands and feet

#10

Unread post by S. Insaf » Sat Jul 17, 2010 2:30 pm

I have the English translation of 'Nahjul Balaga' compiled by Syed Razi and published by Islamic Seminary - Bombay.
and Commentry on Nahjul Balaga by modern thinker, Shaikh Mohammad Abdahoo.

S. Insaf
Posts: 1494
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2003 4:01 am

Re: Kissing hands and feet

#11

Unread post by S. Insaf » Sat Jul 17, 2010 2:38 pm

This incident of Haris-ibne-Sohail is reported on page 21 under 'Ali amongst his subjects': (v).

mumin
Posts: 398
Joined: Tue Dec 12, 2000 5:01 am

Re: Kissing hands and feet

#12

Unread post by mumin » Sat Jul 17, 2010 5:59 pm

I have another copy of nahjul balagha entitled sermons letters and sayings of hazarat Ali printed by associated printers ,karachi.
this same incident is described on page 17 and paragraph 4.

S. Insaf
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Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2003 4:01 am

Re: Kissing hands and feet

#13

Unread post by S. Insaf » Sun Jul 18, 2010 1:02 am

Dear mukhlis52
Also please go through the "zaroori Hidayat" given by Syedna Saheb in writing to his accompanying Bohras during his recent visit to Karbala and Najaf which says No Sajda, No kissing of hands, No salaam to Shahzadas and Shahzadis, No chanting of Maula Maula, No bowing down before any one etc. because he was on the Islamic land of Maula Ali and not in his darbar where he can get away with his double face.

mumin
Posts: 398
Joined: Tue Dec 12, 2000 5:01 am

Re: Kissing hands and feet

#14

Unread post by mumin » Sun Jul 18, 2010 10:00 am

this type of hypocrisy by the clergy is food for thought for the abdes.