Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

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Mubarak
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Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#1

Unread post by Mubarak » Sat Aug 21, 2010 9:12 am

Refer Quran: 2: 182 - 185

(English translation by Abdullah Yusuf Ali 2:184): Fast for a fixed number of days;...

Unambiguously and categorically Quran in 2:184 is instructing (during Ramadan) to fast for fixed number of days.

Only Dawoodi Bohras Hizri calendar can ALWAYS have fixed number of days. Non-Dawoodi Bohras struggles with citing moon which NEVER gives fixed number of days reading i.e. it always gives variable reading - in some year 29 days, some year 30 days; in same year - some part of world mark 29 days other mark 30 days.

This year in Gulf countries (especially UAE) Sunni begun fasting from 2nd of Hizri calendar where as Ithnashari Shia started fasting from 3rd day of Hizri calendar (for month of Ramadan) as their Mufti citied moon two days later! Few years back in Mumbai - one sect declared Eid other declared 30 days Ramadan = no fixed number of days = against order of Quran!

All sects agrees that month of Ramadan bears especial mercy of Allah. For non-Dawoodi Bohras in some part of the world there will be 29 days of Ramadan and in other part of the world 30 days of Ramadan. Now person residing in former location can complain of unjustice from Allah that others were blessed with 30 days and they were alloted only 29 days of Ramadan! Allah never does unjustice hence every part of the world should have same number of days in Ramadan.

Hence to follow the order of Quran 2:184 we need a calendar as citing moon to decide days approach is unable to execute Quran order.

Dawoodi Bohras per Quran order have fixed number of days in Ramadan (i.e. calendar) and rest sects are not blessed to execute Quran order under 2:184.

incredible
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#2

Unread post by incredible » Sat Aug 21, 2010 9:36 am

Now question arise here did rasulullah and other masomeen including imam Ali follwed some hijri calender or he use to see moon for start and end of holy month of ramadan.

Muslim First
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#3

Unread post by Muslim First » Sat Aug 21, 2010 9:03 pm

Unambiguously and categorically Quran in 2:184 is instructing (during Ramadan) to fast for fixed number of days.

But
Other translations use certain numbers of days instead of fixed numbers of days;

Shakir 2:184] For a certain number of days; but whoever among you is sick or on a journey, then (he shall fast) a (like) number of other days; and those who are not able to do it may effect a redemption by feeding a poor man; so whoever does good spontaneously it is better for him; and that you fast is better for you if you know.


[Pickthal 2:184] (Fast) a certain number of days; and (for) him who is sick among you, or on a journey, (the same) number of other days; and for those who can afford it there is a ransom: the feeding of a man in need - but whoso doeth good of his own accord, it is better for him: and that ye fast is better for you if ye did but know -


[Pooya/Ali Commentary 2:184]
Fasting is prescribed "for a certain number of days" - and as per the next verse they are the days of the month of Ramadan. The deeper benefits of fasting are gained when one is in good health. However, both in sickness and travel, these benefits are unlikely to be realised, therefore, exemption from fasting is provided, but a number of other days should be selected to fast in lieu of the obligatory fasts that have not been observed due to sickness or travel, and also a redemption (fidyah) should be effected by feeding a poor man for every missed fast. Aged people, nursing mothers and other cases in which the health is sure to be harmed by fasting can forego fasting altogether, but feed the poor instead, giving away the equivalent of one man's food daily for each fast missed.

It is better to fast as well as feed the poor to obtain a greater return from Allah. The fidyah is a concession allowed to the sick and the old but if they know the deeper benefits of fasting they must fast instead of availing the concession. The Holy Prophet and the holy Imams used to give away whatever they had in the way of Allah but in the month of Ramadan, they were more liberal and open-handed, because the month of Ramadan is the month of Allah
Now question arise here did rasulullah and other masomeen including imam Ali follwed some hijri calender or he use to see moon for start and end of holy month of ramadan.
They followed Quran and Sunnah,

Google
Start of month as per Sunnah and Quran
http://www.google.com/#q=Start+of+month ... 12389e3c08

and read

Also see Word by word translation here
http://www.islamicstudies.info/wordtran ... ch=2&v=183

porus
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#4

Unread post by porus » Sun Aug 22, 2010 1:28 am

The actual phrase used in the ayat is أَيَّامًا مَعْدُودَات.

The word ma'adudaat is past participle of the verb 'adda. It means that the number of days have already been determined and are fixed, presumably, by Allah.

Leaving aside various interpretations of Sunna and practices of Imams Ahlul Bayt, and taking the Quran literally, I agree with Mubarak.

In any case, 'fixed number of days' and 'a certain number of days' mean much the same thing in English. However, we should be concerned with the Arabic of the Quran only.

Allah wants you to start the month by observing the moon. I interpret that to mean that the calendar months are to be based on the Lunar cycle. In other ayats, notably in Surah YaSeen, Allah states that orbits of the Moon and the Sun are fixed. Therefore the number of days in the lunar month are fixed.

However, duration of the lunar orbit does not always coincide with mean solar day. Hence, for a fixed calendar like the Misri Calendar that Bohras use, periodic adjustment to the days of the month must be made. Bohras generally adjust the days of Dhul Haj by one every so many years.

incredible
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#5

Unread post by incredible » Sun Aug 22, 2010 3:50 am

this is what i found on some shia website...



What does fixed number of days mean to you? 30 days or 29 days?

The truth is, one lunar cycle = 29.53059 days. It is neither 29 nor 30 days.

I am actually aware of the Ismaili Egyptian calendar that contains 30 days. I thought it was a neat idea . I have asked here (before), can all the Muslims in the world (Shia or Sunni) migrate to the Ismaili calendar? Then we would have a true unity when we fast and celebrate the Eid together.

I am told it is too artificial to set a precise number of days because the lunar cycle is neither 29 nor 30 days. It has to be based on moon sighting. And we also need to consider that our days starts at dusk and not at midnight or dawn.

Muslim First
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#6

Unread post by Muslim First » Sun Aug 22, 2010 9:41 am

Good reading

The Calendar of Mecca
http://www.meccacalendar.org/en/calIntroduction.php

Suggested global Islamic calender
http://moonsighting.com/global-calendar.html

Moon Sighting
http://moonsighting.com/

Muslim First
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#7

Unread post by Muslim First » Sun Aug 22, 2010 9:54 am

can all the Muslims in the world (Shia or Sunni) migrate to the Ismaili calendar?
No No Never (personally I hope some day)

Majority of Muslims do not have governing authority and they have only advisory authority.

Even though we have fiqh council in USA we have mosqus begining fasting on 2 different days and they are only 10 miles apart.

Muslims who run Masjids are easily swayed by their local Imam, espcially educated in some Darul.

It is useless to butt head with them. Go to Masjid, pray, put some money in Box and go home happy.

Wasalaam

porus
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#8

Unread post by porus » Sun Aug 22, 2010 10:59 am

incredible wrote:this is what i found on some shia website...

What does fixed number of days mean to you? 30 days or 29 days?

The truth is, one lunar cycle = 29.53059 days. It is neither 29 nor 30 days.
How does Quran define a day? Does anyone know?

All over the world a day is defined as a period from one sunrise to the following sunrise. (That includes night too). This period is known as a Solar Day. If we all used sundials, there would be no confusion about how ‘long’ that period is.

We, however, use artificial clocks which step in equal increments. According to these artificial clocks a Solar Day is on average 24 hours, that is, the duration from sunrise to the next sunrise is arbitrarily divided up into 24 equal increments or 24x60 increments or 24x60x60 increments called hours, minutes and seconds respectively. This average day is defined as a Mean Solar Day.

Supposing a Mullah issues a fatwa that the days should be reckoned on the basis of his personal clock that hangs in his palace. Then clearly, the Solar Day is going to differ from a Mullah Day.

Enter the Quran. It does not actually define what a day is but it appears to define what a month is. It is a period from one new moon to the next new moon. Muslims ought to divide this period into say 30 days or 29 days. Any division would be arbitrary. However, Muslims do not divide this period but still use a day to be the universal 24 hours. The Sun and the Moon do not care how humans define a day. They just go rolling along.

Muslims believe that Allah does define a day as being from sunrise to sunset and night from sunset to sunrise. This is deduced from the times of namaaz and the command to fast from sunrise to sunset.

So, here is the confusion. Month is defined as Lunar Month and Day is defined as Solar Day.

I suggest that Muslims change the definition of the Day to align with their definition of the Month. Instead of a Solar Day they should use a Lunar Day. That is, it should be the duration from one moonrise to the next. They should start their fast in Ramadan from New Moon and end it at the following New Moon. During this period they should not eat or drink from sunrise to sunset and do other things like prayers etc. (In fact, all Muslims including Bohras, do this anyway but non-Bohras, despite knowing that New Moon can be predicted to a millisecond, insist on observing the New Moon by a Mullah.)

Once this is accepted, then we will all have a fixed Muslim Calendar. Why? Because times of moonrise are already known for all future dates and times of New Moon are already known for all future dates. Then, all Muslims and Bohras will have the same day for Eid.

Smart
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#9

Unread post by Smart » Mon Aug 23, 2010 12:16 pm

@Br. Porus,
What you have defined as Solar Day or Mean Solar day is right, however there is a small correction. Astronomically, the day changes when the Sun is supposed to be at the Nadir, i.e. midnight.

Secondly, in Islam the diurnal cycle starts at sunset. I don't know why, but I presume it is the easiest point in the movement of the Sun, that can be precisely measured, especially in the olden times when there were not many precise instruments.

Please make these corrections and I agree with your contentions.

Thirdly, you have correctly noted that the day is a solar cycle, whereas the month is a lunar cycle. In Islam we follow the lunar cycle as the primary cycle, whereas in the western calendar, they follow the solar as the primary cycle. So for muslims the year is just 12 lunar cycles and has no serious relationship with the revolution of the earth round the sun, i.e. the year. In the western calendar, the month is only approximately the length of lunar month, and it is not very significant, whereas the revolution around the sun is precisely measured and the year set accordingly.

There is a third system which is widely prevalent and is followed by Indian religions, like Hinduism, Buddhism etc. This is the Luni-Solar system, where both the Sun and Moon are considered significant. The day is the tithi, which is from moonrise to moonrise and has nothing to do with the sun. The month is also Lunar, from new moon to new moon, but the year is Solar. This requires their calendar to be much more complicated, with adhik (extra) month approximately every three years and sometimes adhik days too.

porus
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#10

Unread post by porus » Mon Aug 23, 2010 12:49 pm

Thank you smart for your observations and valuable input regarding the Luni-Solar Calendar. When you choose to identify the start of the day is arbitrary. Position of the Sun is not an issue and the Sun is not always at Nadir at midnight. The latter is defined in accordance with artificial clock to be 12 o'clock. Precision with which we can measure the solar and lunar movements is also not an issue.

My concern here is to identify the position of the Quran with respect to the start of Ramadan and the number of days we should fast.

Let me simplify the explanation. The period from new moon to the next new moon is 29.53 Days (i.e. Solar Days). Remember, fasting is between this period between two new moons and you must fast between sunrise and sunset.

All we need to do is to calculate how many sunrises and sunsets occur during this period between two new moons or the period of 29.53 Solar Days. Regardless of whether the Sun rises before or after the Moon on the 1st of Ramadan, you end up having 30 sunrises. However, the last sunset of Ramadan may occur after the moon has set. In that case, we should be generous and complete the fast until sunset on the last day.

This, I think, is in accordance with the Quran. Remember, Allah does not err in His computations. However, a Mullah may err in observing the New Moon. The New Moon, in any case, is invisible as it is directly in line with the Sun. It will take a few days after the New Moon for its crescent to become visible. This is fraught with potential errors as it relies on human observation. It may become visible to a Mullah after one day or after two days depending upon his sight, the power of his telescope and the weather conditions. Allah has already given us the intelligence to know when the New Moons occur. So, we should go along with the calculation rather than observation and fast for 30 days.

For Bohras, this issue is moot as they already observe 30-day fast. I think that Misri Calendar has it right and other Muslims ought to adopt it.

Muslim First
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#11

Unread post by Muslim First » Mon Aug 23, 2010 2:03 pm

Br.Porus
I think that Misri Calendar has it right and other Muslims ought to adopt it.
Can you elaborate how Misri calander is calculated?

What is base city? Cairo or Bombay?

JAK in advance

porus
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#12

Unread post by porus » Mon Aug 23, 2010 7:06 pm

Muslim First wrote: Can you elaborate how Misri calander is calculated?

What is base city? Cairo or Bombay?
I believe that the base of the Misri calendar is the location of Madina Munawwara. Bohras call it a Misri (Egyptian Calendar). That is because the calendar originally used by Imam Jafar al-Sadiq in Madina was re-applied during the Fatimid Khalifat in Egypt. I am not sure about this but Fatimid Scholars may have recalculated the calendar so that it is now based on Cairo.

Some very basic information about the Misri Calendar is in this pdf available from this website:

http://dawoodi-bohras.com/pdfs/conversi ... -dates.pdf

However, while the history of the calendar may be of academic interest, it is irrelevant to current Muslim practice. What is important is that some consistency be brought to the start of the month in line with the Quran.

Quran states that there are twelve months in a year (9:36) and that the crescent moon should be the guide for timing (2:189). Thus, in Islam, we have a purely Lunar calendar. Personally, I would not have any objection to starting the month following the actual observation of the crescent. However, as I pointed out above, this is fraught with potential for human errors. Hence, it is better to rely on calculation.

Smart
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#13

Unread post by Smart » Tue Aug 24, 2010 1:44 am

porus wrote:Thank you smart for your observations and valuable input regarding the Luni-Solar Calendar. When you choose to identify the start of the day is arbitrary. Position of the Sun is not an issue and the Sun is not always at Nadir at midnight. The latter is defined in accordance with artificial clock to be 12 o'clock. Precision with which we can measure the solar and lunar movements is also not an issue.

My concern here is to identify the position of the Quran with respect to the start of Ramadan and the number of days we should fast.

Let me simplify the explanation. The period from new moon to the next new moon is 29.53 Days (i.e. Solar Days). Remember, fasting is between this period between two new moons and you must fast between sunrise and sunset.

All we need to do is to calculate how many sunrises and sunsets occur during this period between two new moons or the period of 29.53 Solar Days. Regardless of whether the Sun rises before or after the Moon on the 1st of Ramadan, you end up having 30 sunrises. However, the last sunset of Ramadan may occur after the moon has set. In that case, we should be generous and complete the fast until sunset on the last day.

This, I think, is in accordance with the Quran. Remember, Allah does not err in His computations. However, a Mullah may err in observing the New Moon. The New Moon, in any case, is invisible as it is directly in line with the Sun. It will take a few days after the New Moon for its crescent to become visible. This is fraught with potential errors as it relies on human observation. It may become visible to a Mullah after one day or after two days depending upon his sight, the power of his telescope and the weather conditions. Allah has already given us the intelligence to know when the New Moons occur. So, we should go along with the calculation rather than observation and fast for 30 days.

For Bohras, this issue is moot as they already observe 30-day fast. I think that Misri Calendar has it right and other Muslims ought to adopt it.
i agree with you in this matter. Just adding my observations. Thanks. The whole problem with defining various terms is that they are always in the context of something else. I entirely agree with your observation that the Sun is not always at the Nadir, because the instrumental time we measure is based on the mean solar day, also corrected for the local time zone, in which the place is located.

Muslim First
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#14

Unread post by Muslim First » Tue Aug 24, 2010 7:05 am

Br. Porus
AS
JAK for link to pdf. Now I understand Misri Calander. It does not have to be based on any City. It started on July 15th, 622 AD and since then it is all math. Keeping it in sink with 11 leap days in 30 year cycle. It has nothing to do with birth of moon or sighting of moon or Hadith of Prophet.

I am all for having fixed calander for all Muslims to follow. It is very important to know that for our children so a holiday is given on Eid day and all Muslims can celebrate on that daay. Here in America School districts are willing to give Muslim Kids off and not to schedule tests on those days.

This Global Islamic Calander paper was presented in a conference ( http://moonsighting.com/global-calendar.html ).

What do you think?

I do not think it will happen in my life time. (BTW I am living on bonus time and on a kind of life support. Alhamdo Lillah, thanks to Modern medical Tech and thanks to bein the city considered Medical Mecca of USA)

Wasalaam

porus
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#15

Unread post by porus » Tue Aug 24, 2010 10:57 am

Muslim First wrote:
Now I understand Misri Calander. It does not have to be based on any City. It started on July 15th, 622 AD and since then it is all math. Keeping it in sink with 11 leap days in 30 year cycle. It has nothing to do with birth of moon or sighting of moon or Hadith of Prophet.
Brother Muslim First,

السلام عليكم

When you asked me about the base city, I had in mind both the city in which it was first used and also the fact that the moonrise occurs at different times throughout the world. In the link you posted about the Global Islamic Calendar, the city it is based on is Makkah Mukarramah.

Saudi Arabia now has two calendars. It uses a fixed lunar calendar based on astronomical calculation for secular activities and Umm ul-Qura calendar for religious purposes.

Similarly, it is useful to make distinction between Islamic Calendar and Lunar Calendar. Islamic Calendar is tied up with the Quran and Prophetic Hadith. Pre-Islamic Arabia used a Luni-Solar Calendar for intercalations and this was prohibited by Quran and Prophet during his farewell pilgrimage. A very useful historical background is in the following wikipedia article:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_calendar

I think that Misri Calendar was the attempt to bring Islamic Calendar in line with Lunar Calendar. Global Muslim Calendar has the same intentions but retains traditional moon-sighting for those who want to stick to that tradition.

Finally, I wish you the very best in your struggle for recovery. It must be hard. I ask you to forgive me for all the harsh words I have said to you on these forums for many years.

الله يشفيك و الله ويبارك فيك

canadian
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#16

Unread post by canadian » Tue Aug 24, 2010 8:05 pm

Brother Muslim First:

Salam alaikum.
My prayers are for your speedy recovery to health and happiness.

accountability
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#17

Unread post by accountability » Tue Aug 24, 2010 10:09 pm

brother Muslim First: If my prayers are any worth, they are all for you. Inshallah you will be here on this forum for a long long time to come.
I only wish I could do something. But I know that you will get well soon.

Fatwa Banker
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#18

Unread post by Fatwa Banker » Tue Aug 24, 2010 11:10 pm

MF,

I wish you the best in your recovery and when you say "thanks to bein the city considered Medical Mecca of USA", I hope that you are in Houston.

Muslim First
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#19

Unread post by Muslim First » Wed Aug 25, 2010 6:18 am

FB
AS
JAK. I am in NE. Alhamdo Lillah, I am doing well on Device Implant, hope to survive till life of the Implant'. Inshah Allah newer devices will be better and newer treatment will restore organ function. Instead of 6' under I am still breathing and barring power or Mech. failure (Gone in five minutes of failure) hope to be around for till life of device.

Wasalaam and Ramadan Karim

porus
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#20

Unread post by porus » Wed Aug 25, 2010 9:37 am

Brother MF,

My prayers are with you. May Allah bless you with long and healthy life.

Alaykum as-Salaam and Allah Hafiz.

ghulam muhammed
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#21

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Wed Aug 25, 2010 4:15 pm

Muslim First wrote:I am still breathing and barring power or Mech. failure (Gone in five minutes of failure) hope to be around for till life of device.
Bro Muslim First,

Power failure or no failure, there is no dearth of miracles in Allah's khazana and if He wishes you will survive come what may so have faith in Him which I know you have in abundance. There is no device which Allah cant repair.

Ramzan Mubarak and my best wishes for your speedy recovery.

Aarif
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#22

Unread post by Aarif » Wed Aug 25, 2010 4:23 pm

Br Muslim First
AS,

Ramadan Mubarak and wish you a speedy and successful recovery.

anajmi
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#23

Unread post by anajmi » Wed Aug 25, 2010 11:54 pm

Br. Muslim First,

Hope your mechanical device is not the "lite" version. :wink:

Hope you lead a believer's life the rest of the way and end up in the highest levels of jannah.

SBM
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#24

Unread post by SBM » Thu Aug 26, 2010 5:28 am

Br. Muslin First
May Allah give you the recovery from the illness, May Allah give the patience and strength to your family for the difficulties they are facing. You and your family will be in our Dua inshallah.
As you said you are in the best Medical Town of the World, the good old Boston.

Mubarak
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#25

Unread post by Mubarak » Sun Sep 05, 2010 10:34 am

Allah commands in Sura Al Baqarah: Verse 184 refering Ramadan to "Fast for a fixed number of days". It is only possible if one follows Dawoodi Bohras Hizri Calendar. Rest sects incorrect dependence on citing moon makes their Ramadan period variable (29 or 30 days) and not fixed which is against Allah order.

Allah has prescribed (pre decided) the number of days in Ramadan and not left it subjective to followers discretion of moon citing, refer Al Baqarah: Verse 185: "Ramadan…(Allah wants you) to complete the prescribed period,..."

"Al Baqarah: Verse 189: They ask thee concerning the New Moons. Say: They are but signs to mark fixed periods of time in (the affairs of) men,..."
In above verse Allah declared Moon periods/movements are fixed and only Dawoodi Bohras Hizri Calendar exactly resemble this quality of moon. Hence prima facie per Quran 2:189 a fixed calendar system should be the right approach and not otherwise.

Sura YaSeen verse 39 & 40: Allah states that orbits of the Moon and the Sun are fixed. Therefore the number of days in the lunar month have to be fixed: in Dawoodi Bohras Hizri Calendar number of days are fixed whereas for rest sects their Ramadan days are not fixed (29/30 days). Thus Dawoodi Bohras is the only sect to align as per Sura YaSeen command.

Alhamdolillah

anajmi
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#26

Unread post by anajmi » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:41 pm

Mubarak,

You should answer incredible's question where he asks if the prophet Muhammad (saw) was following the Dawoodi Bohra hijri calendar?

Mubarak
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#27

Unread post by Mubarak » Mon Sep 06, 2010 12:11 pm

anajmi wrote:Mubarak,

You should answer incredible's question where he asks if the prophet Muhammad (saw) was following the Dawoodi Bohra hijri calendar?
Not only all Islamic sects are in unison but also the most dumb in all sects will tell you loudly and clearly, provided you have Islamic ears to listen that Prophet Mohammed (s.a.) acted only as per Quran with no deviations.

And to learn what Quran orders about Ramadan period please refer my last post. Quran verses unambiguously conveys that excpet Dawoodi Bohras all sects have structural defects in their Ramadan period counting.

anajmi
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#28

Unread post by anajmi » Mon Sep 06, 2010 3:42 pm

Let me repeat the question that incredible posted one more time. It is a simple question. Was the prophet (saw) following the Dawoodi Bohra hijri calendar?

porus
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#29

Unread post by porus » Mon Sep 06, 2010 5:05 pm

anajmi wrote:Let me repeat the question that incredible posted one more time. It is a simple question. Was the prophet (saw) following the Dawoodi Bohra hijri calendar?
anajmi,

Mubarak did not suggest or imply that the Prophet was following Dawoodi Bohra Hijri (i.e. Misri) Calendar. He is saying that the Prophet followed the Quran. He is also saying that, in his opinion, Misri Calendar is in line with the recommendations of the Quran and hence Misri calendar follows both the Quran and the Prophet. So you see, it is the other way around.

Hence, your question is an attempt to create a controversy where none exists.

It has been pretty quiet here since you decided to take a vacation and I must say I like it. Could you please extend your vacation another month? Thank you.

I hope you have had a blessed Ramadan. I wish you a very happy Eid a bit 'baakiran', but meant sincerely.

anajmi
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Re: Quran 2:184 - Bohras v/s rest sects

#30

Unread post by anajmi » Mon Sep 06, 2010 6:43 pm

porus,

Both you and Mubarak are nothing but a couple of decievers. The simple answer to the question is that the prophet wasn't following any calendar. The prophet was following the sighting of the moon. That is the recommendation of the Quran. Misri calendar isn't following the prophet. Misri calendar doesn't follow the sighting of the moon. It follows the orbit of the moon. And if you and mubarak stop participating on this board, things will get even better. You will take away 90% of my motivation to be here!!