ex bohra's

[incredible]

Bismillah al rahman al rahim...


any ex bohra on this board who became shia ithna ashari or any other community? if yes then please share your experiance and how do u feel after leaving this knit tight community?do u have positive or negetive remarks?

[incredible]

No ex bohras on the board?

[Muslim First]

Br anajmi is ex Bohra

He in my opinion is a plain Muslim

Wasalaam

[anajmi]

Br. muslim first is correct. I am an ex-bohra. The beauty about becoming an ex-bohra is that when you become an ex-bohra, you cannot become a shia ithna ashari or anything else unless you go register with those clans. When you become an ex-anything-shia, you automatically become a muslim. It is quite liberating. I think you all should try it.

I had someone say a good thing once. How do you feel when you go to the mosque? Do you feel like a fish in water or do you feel like a criminal in jail wanting to get out? When I used to go to the markaz, I felt like a criminal in jail wanting to run to freedom. I now go to the mosque at least twice a day, fajr and isha and feel like a fish in water.

[incredible]

Br. muslim first is correct. I am an ex-bohra. The beauty about becoming an ex-bohra is that when you become an ex-bohra, you cannot become a shia ithna ashari or anything else unless you go register with those clans. When you become an ex-anything-shia, you automatically become a muslim. It is quite liberating. I think you all should try it.

I had someone say a good thing once. How do you feel when you go to the mosque? Do you feel like a fish in water or do you feel like a criminal in jail wanting to get out? When I used to go to the markaz, I felt like a criminal in jail wanting to run to freedom. I now go to the mosque at least twice a day, fajr and isha and feel like a fish in water.

no doubt about tht....but i wonder from where did u created this concept of awwal sanni salis and yazid.

[anajmi]

awwal sani salis is not a concept but a fact.

the concept of yazid is based upon lost iranian legends from nagpada.

[aqs]

Kudos to you Anajmi, atleast you are honest enough to accept that you are no more a Bohra now, Others should learn from you and start following the right path according to their heart.

[anajmi]

You are correct aqs. But the heart holds dear many things. Family, friends, attachment, society, religion etc. Most of the times these things are at war with each other in the heart. It is not easy to follow your hearts desire at all times. We all have to make compromises. When making a particular compromise becomes impossible, choices become easier. It was impossible for me to deal with the things going on within the bohra community. I couldn't compromise with the idol worship and hence, It became easier for me to get out.

[asif786]

You are correct aqs. But the heart holds dear many things. Family, friends, attachment, society, religion etc. Most of the times these things are at war with each other in the heart. It is not easy to follow your hearts desire at all times. We all have to make compromises. When making a particular compromise becomes impossible, choices become easier. It was impossible for me to deal with the things going on within the bohra community. I couldn't compromise with the idol worship and hence, It became easier for me to get out.

Anajmi
have you openly announced that you are a sunni now ? Are you close relatives still DBs ? Do you still participate in jamaat activities?

[aqs]

You are correct aqs. But the heart holds dear many things. Family, friends, attachment, society, religion etc. Most of the times these things are at war with each other in the heart. It is not easy to follow your hearts desire at all times. We all have to make compromises. When making a particular compromise becomes impossible, choices become easier. It was impossible for me to deal with the things going on within the bohra community. I couldn't compromise with the idol worship and hence, It became easier for me to get out.

Anajmi,

I would have really loved to hear your experience. but i dont think this is the platform

In my home town one person has converted to Salafism, his family was not much of a Jamaat attending people and they were also not in good books of society, but what is interesting is that this person has turned up into quite a devout Muslim and infact he is running a small madarsa on his farm house teaching poor children from the nearby villages, gradually his immediate family has also started following him.

He did what his heart said and gradually society accepted it, DB's took time but they did

[anajmi]

Yes, I have openly announced that I have denounced the bohra practices and their idol worshipping ways. Some of my family members have been persecuted, but they didn't pay much attention. My mother was told to proclaim that I am not her son and she gave them the finger. They cannot persecute me as I do not care about attending jamaat activities, marriage or burial in a bohra cemetry. I haven't attended any jamaat activity in 15 years. When I go to the markaz with my friend, I stay outside. I cannot bring myself to go inside. It has become just as easy to avoid the jamaat as it is to avoid a shiva lingam temple. My children also do not have to worry as they will be raised as Muslims and not bohras inshaallah. My wife had a lot of attachment initially but it has waned. She is now studying to become an Alima. May Allah bless her and help her succeed.

[anajmi]

My sister, brother-in-law and their kids and my niece's husband are all ex-bohras. My sister's family changed a few years after I did. They kept it hidden for some time but then the clergy found out that my brother-in-law was attending the sunni mosque. When his mother passed, she was still a bohra and they put a condition that if he didn't want any trouble during her burial, he should not attend. He didn't. The evil clergy prevented the son from attending his own mother's funeral.

I then had a spat with them on email and the comparison I was given was how Hazrat Ali buried Fatima without telling anyone. Hazrat Ali didn't want outsiders. Hazrat Ali was family. Her son was family. This is how the clergy uses the Ahle Bayt to spread their terror to humans and to animals.

[anajmi]

I would have really loved to hear your experience. but i dont think this is the platform

Unlike most reformists, I personally didn't have any bad experiences with the clergy before I became an ex-bohra. An opportunity presented itself in the form of a Yusuf Ali translation of the Quran (is there any wonder why the idol worshippers hate Yusuf Ali so much?) I read a little and got more interested. Got some more books and realized that the clergy isn't just taking us for a ride, it is actually riding us.

[mumin]

Anajmi, I salute you. you did what every prosecuted bohra should muster up the courage to do. Then only will this evil kothar learn its lesson. They talk big about ahle bait , but have they ever thought about how they led their lives. Here is a paragraph from the books of imam zainul abedeen. " sins is made up of several levels. the first is disobedience to Allah by arrogance; and this was the sin of shaitan when he denied and was proud. the second level is envy; which is the sin of the child of adam,when he envied his brother and killed him. From these two levels there came, love of leadership,love of comfort,love of vain talk,love of sublimity and love of wealth. these became the seven levels which all were connected to the love of this world,so that the prophets and scholars said after knowing this,love of this world is the root of all sin. and this is exactly what is practised by the bohra clergy. money talks every step of the way and the more they get the greedier they get. One can refute if one so wishes but what i state is my personal experiences with the local amil, and right up the ladder and their goonda committee .

[aqs]

I would have really loved to hear your experience. but i dont think this is the platform

Unlike most reformists, I personally didn't have any bad experiences with the clergy before I became an ex-bohra. An opportunity presented itself in the form of a Yusuf Ali translation of the Quran (is there any wonder why the idol worshippers hate Yusuf Ali so much?) I read a little and got more interested. Got some more books and realized that the clergy isn't just taking us for a ride, it is actually riding us.

kindly ignore my inquisitiveness if you deem it personal in nature to answer.

How do you pray, as DB's differ in the way they have lot of Duas in arabic between and after prayers, personally i dont know what other sects read or what their Duas are while they offer Salaat.

DB's have a distinct cultural traits attached to them, like eating in a thal, dressing for women, have you shunned them also.

[SBM]

Aqs
Even though above post is for Anjami but I am go to butt in.
Unlike Anjami, I am still card carrying DB and I do pray at Sunni or Jafferia Mosque depending where I am working. I have not missed any Friday Jummah be it at Sunni or Jafferia. My local Aamill is very much aware of it, but to his credit, he rather have people pray Namaz than to force them otherwise.
As far as Namaz is concerned, the Sunni form of Namaz including Arkaans are very much similar to DB except Maatam and longer version of Tashud,
Compare that to Jafferia, they really have differnt duas for Rukku, Sujjud and Qiyam and it some times gets confusing praying with them but with Sunni, it feels like you are praying DB except some of the DB Aamils rush thru the Namaaz (our Aamil is very good in that he will not rush doing his Imamat Namaz)
Sunnis do not have any Dua-e-Qunnut in Fajar prayers while Jafferia do it during Jummah, beside Jummah prayers which is two Rakats in Jafferia they also perform Duhur prayers without Imamat while Jummah is done with Immamat, not the case with Sunnis
Others can add more or correct me if I am mistaken. The part of USA i live, we have very harmonius relationship amongs Shias and Sunnis and they do pray at each other's Mosque without creating a fuss and dis-unity

[anajmi]

aqs wrote:
kindly ignore my inquisitiveness if you deem it personal in nature to answer.

How do you pray, as DB's differ in the way they have lot of Duas in arabic between and after prayers, personally i dont know what other sects read or what their Duas are while they offer Salaat.

DB's have a distinct cultural traits attached to them, like eating in a thal, dressing for women, have you shunned them also.

aqs,

You said that you follow the prophet. I only care what and how the prophet did. Can you cite references that the dua you do in arabic are the duas that the prophet did? The cultural traits that you talk about, can you tell me that the prophet followed the same? Was rida worn by the wives of the prophet and Hazrat Fatima? Please cite shia's sunnah references.

[Aarif]

The beauty about becoming an ex-bohra is that when you become an ex-bohra, you cannot become a shia ithna ashari or anything else unless you go register with those clans.

Please do not start a war of words Anajmi. The sunnis are also idol and grave worshippers. If your anything else part covers the sunni clans as well than I am sorry for the mis-understanding...

[anajmi]

And that is why I didn't say that I became a "sunni". However, if you want to be a sunni idol/grave worshipper, you do not need to register with idol/grave worshipping sunni clans. You can do it on your own.

[ghulam muhammed]

While on the subject of "ex-bohras" I would like to mention that there was one Mr.Fakhrudin Motiwala who was an extremely staunch bohra during the 51st dai's era. He was more fanatic then what we see of bohras today. During that time when hardly 5% bohras sported a beard, he had one and was always dressed in sherwani/feta. He was extremely close to the 51st dai. For reasons best known to him, one day he left the bohra sect and became a 'bahai'. He is a resident of Nasik and all his children are staunch bahais.

There are many bohras especially from nasik/devlali belt who have embraced bahaism, even the son of the ex principal of Lookmanya High school (bohra school), Mumbai has embraced bahaism and is at present residing at panchgani. An aged lady and a close relative of khorakhiwala family has also converted to bahai.

The above facts are kept away from bohras who are made to believe that all is well in the community and to substantiate their claims, the dai is forever conducting some tamashas and more importantly the mohurrum tamasha wherein a huge crowd is gathered for various reasons although it is the same crowd which keeps on rotating everytime be it mohurrum, zikra, urus or salgirah functions. This way the ignorant bohra feels "har varas kitli moti taadat maa mumineen aave chhe".

[Aarif]

And that is why I didn't say that I became a "sunni". However, if you want to be a sunni idol/grave worshipper, you do not need to register with idol/grave worshipping sunni clans. You can do it on your own.

Well the confusion emerged because none of your posts ever mention idol worshipping sunnis. It always talks about idol worshipping shias. In case its a co-incidence than its a strange one...

[anajmi]

I would mention idol worshipping sunnis on a sunni forum. This is a bohra forum so I keep my discussion limited to idol worshipping bohras.

[Muslim First]

Sunnis do not have any Dua-e-Qunnut in Fajar prayers

One of 4 fiqu o f Ahle sunnah does have Dua-e-Qunnut in Fajar prayers

[Aarif]

This is a bohra forum so I keep my discussion limited to idol worshipping bohras.

That sounds good.. But please refrain from branding all shias as idol worshipping since this is not an authentic shia forum just as it is not a sunni forum. It is a DB forum and bohras are neither shias nor sunnis... They are just dawoodi bohras. I hope you get the point..

[anajmi]

Actually, all shias are idol worshippers in one way or another. Every shia says "Ya Ali" assuming that Ali has Allah's quality of being an All Hearer. They also believe that Hazrat Ali can come to their aid more easily than Allah can. Also, haven't you read lost Iranian legends?

It is a DB forum and bohras are neither shias nor sunnis

I am not sure if bohras will agree with you.

[Aarif]

Actually, all shias are idol worshippers in one way or another.

Now you are talking what you wanted to talk. I am pretty good at getting out the facts aint I?

Well I do consider myself a shia but do not invoke Yaa Ali. I differ only in terms of rightful succession after prophet's(pbuh) death. And there are many broad minded participants like AZ, OB, Br. Insaf etc. on this forum itself who speak strongly against idol worshipp... A shia is suppose to love the ahle-bait and not worshipp them. So I belong to the category of non-idol worshipping shias and believe me there are lot of people around with my kind of philoshopy...

And for the second part if you have read Aqs post on the other thread according to DBs they are the only true followers of Islam. They do not associate themselves with Shias or Sunnis. In fact if a local Aamil comes to know that a DB is attending shia or sunni mosque he will be done...

[anajmi]

Now you are talking what you wanted to talk. I am pretty good at getting out the facts aint I?

Oops!! you are right. I wanted to hide the fact that I believed all shia are idol worshippers from the participants on this board. I didn't want them to find out. But you got it out of me. You are really smart.

Well I do consider myself a shia but do not invoke Yaa Ali.

Good for you.

[Aarif]

Oops!! you are right. I wanted to hide the fact that I believed all shia are idol worshippers from the participants on this board. I didn't want them to find out. But you got it out of me. You are really smart.

Well this was in reply to your last few posts where you were trying to protect the grave worshipping sunnis by claiming that this is not a sunni forum and that is why you are not discussing their grave worshipping talents. The fact that you were trying to hide was your "Holier than though" belief that sunnis are not idol worshippers and only shias are. And that was what I was trying to get out from you.

And yes I am really smart

[anajmi]

Damn. I tried so hard to hide the fact that sunnis are also grave worshippers. But you found out. You are really smart. I might be "Holier than thou" but I am definitely not holier than you. Good catch.

[Aarif]

Damn. I tried so hard to hide the fact that sunnis are also grave worshippers. But you found out. You are really smart. I might be "Holier than thou" but I am definitely not holier than you. Good catch.

Nope my friend.. You were not trying to "hide" but you were trying very hard "not to accept"..