Since the time i am on the forum, have observed one thing :-
Whenever there is debate going on with Non bohra forum members such as Anajmi, Muslim First or anyone over Shia-Sunni Faith or Ismaili Faith -
Be it debate over the succession of Moula Ali (a.s.), Be it over Imamat, Be it on praying combining namaz, Be it on Fasting 30 days in Ramadan. Why is that always Orthodox side has to come forward and defend the dawoodi bohra beliefs ??
Why It is always has to be Adam, Profastian, Ala Makaam, Aqs or etc. If you will observe then can easily find out that progressives minded members hardly came forward and put up their points in support. Infact, passively they like to be in support of opposition. Yes, "Porus" is an exception among them.
I'm not asking progressives to support the last two da'is or current administration or oppose the issues raised by reformist but If you call yourself dawoodi-bohra then why can't support it being one ?
Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
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Kaka Akela
- Posts: 477
- Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 4:01 am
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
In answer to your question, " Why It is always has to be Adam, Profastian, Ala Makaam, Aqs or etc. If you will observe then can easily find out that progressives minded members hardly came forward and put up their points in support. Infact, passively they like to be in support of opposition. Yes, "Porus" is an exception among them"---- I must say the knowledge of the younger generation (the children of the 70's progressives) is very minimal regarding their father's religion. Because once their father got out of the religious fold they were so upset at the religious establishment they didn't send their kids to madrasa or didn't enforce their attendance to vaez, bayan or sabaqs etc. etc.
I have noticed this lack of their knowledge in the kind of questions they ask or in their responses to the questions raised. How can you expect them to defend when they are unaware of their own heritage.
I have noticed this lack of their knowledge in the kind of questions they ask or in their responses to the questions raised. How can you expect them to defend when they are unaware of their own heritage.
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Ala maqaam
- Posts: 318
- Joined: Wed Sep 14, 2011 8:23 am
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
I partially agree with you,but I dont agree to blame it whole on administration,it depends on the interest of an individual,I have talked with many young guys of my age and i am so disopinted by there vview about the religion,they think just attending darees and taking part in different juloos is enough to be called a muslim.Kaka Akela wrote:In answer to your question, " Why It is always has to be Adam, Profastian, Ala Makaam, Aqs or etc. If you will observe then can easily find out that progressives minded members hardly came forward and put up their points in support. Infact, passively they like to be in support of opposition. Yes, "Porus" is an exception among them"---- I must say the knowledge of the younger generation (the children of the 70's progressives) is very minimal regarding their father's religion. Because once their father got out of the religious fold they were so upset at the religious establishment they didn't send their kids to madrasa or didn't enforce their attendance to vaez, bayan or sabaqs etc. etc.
I have noticed this lack of their knowledge in the kind of questions they ask or in their responses to the questions raised. How can you expect them to defend when they are unaware of their own heritage.
most youngsters are busy discussing about face book and recent movies,but they have no interest to know what exactly happened 1400 years back,and what is our faith based on.
I have already raised this point some time back,for progressive its high time to stop chassing syedna and his work,instead shud concentrate in educating new generation of progs,and give them proper information about the ahlul bayt.
if the leaders of the movement dont take this step soon,i am affried many progs will lose the path of ahlul bayt.
.
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
Kaka Akela,Kaka Akela wrote: I must say the knowledge of the younger generation (the children of the 70's progressives) is very minimal regarding their father's religion. Because once their father got out of the religious fold they were so upset at the religious establishment they didn't send their kids to madrasa or didn't enforce their attendance to vaez, bayan or sabaqs etc. etc.
I have noticed this lack of their knowledge in the kind of questions they ask or in their responses to the questions raised. How can you expect them to defend when they are unaware of their own heritage.
I don't think that this is the valid reason because most of the Progressives minded members present on the forum still belong to orthodox stream and accessible to Vaez, Majlis and all. So unaware of their own heritage does not hold true. Its just that thought wise they have choose themselves being progressives !
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
Silence on the thread ?
Do Progressives have nothing to say on it ?
Do Progressives have nothing to say on it ?
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
When my son asked me how we can be so sure our belief is the right one among hundreds or thousand other beliefs.What are the chances of us being wrong.% wise.
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Kaka Akela
- Posts: 477
- Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 4:01 am
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
RELIGION: The true purpose of it.
“This is my simple religion. There is no need for temples; no need for complicated philosophy. Our own brain, our own heart is our temple; the philosophy is kindness.”
-Dalai Lama
What is definition of Religion? According to Swami Vivekananda definition of religion is: “Religion is the idea which is raising the brute unto man, and man unto God.” The brute sees thousands suffering and around but doesn’t care. We become true human beings when we see look around and feel; show love and concern; do our best to alleviate suffering.
In fact religion is realization of the unity of life; this is the supreme purpose for which we have come into human context. In verse 11 of Ch 4 of Bhagavad Gita, one of the most marvelous in the Gita, the Lord says, with his infinite love, that it does not matter what religion you profess.
Functional definitions are so common that most academic definitions of religion can be categorized as either psychological or sociological in nature. Psychological definitions focus upon the ways in which religion plays a role in the mental, emotional, and psychological lives of believers.Sociological definitions define religion by the ways in which it either has an impact upon society or the ways in which it is expressed socially by believers.
What is religion, really? In the words of Osho: “It is an individual approach towards truth. One has to go alone; one has to find one’s own way. You cannot follow another; you can not move on beaten path. The more you search your own path, the closer you will be to God, or truth, or I say to reality.” In fact the path is created as you walk.
Religion originates in an attempt to represent and order beliefs, feelings, imaginings and actions that arise in response to direct experience of the sacred and the spiritual. As this attempt expands in its formulation and elaboration, it becomes a process that creates meaning for itself on a sustaining basis, in terms of both its originating experiences and its own continuing responses.
True religion is not what we get from outside, from scriptures and Gurus.It is not the religion of routine which we adopt as a matter of habit. It is the aspiration of every human soul, that which unfold within oneself, that which is built by one’s life-blood. It is the fulfillment of our nature in which there is joy which overflows into world’s service. All religions affirm that man is confronted by something greater than himself, which is contrast to human nature and all other phenomena. The transcendent Reality is immanent in the human soul. The Upanisad, saying ‘That thou art,’ refers to this fact of Divine Immanence. The essence of the Buddha is present in every being. ‘The Kingdom of God is within you,’ according to Jesus.The Quran says that God is nearer to us than our artery in the neck.
“Religion is not only way to God, but the way to man.”
The purpose of religion as revealed from the heaven of God’s holy Will is to establish unity and concord amongst the people of the world; make it not the cause of dissension and strife. Religion thus corresponds to the practice of piety toward God as Creator of the universe. (Etym. probably Latin religare, to tie, fasten, bind, or relegere, to gather up, treat with care)
The religion of God and His divine law are the most potent instruments and the surest of all means for the dawning of the light of unity amongst men. The progress of the world, the development of nations, tranquility of peoples, and the peace of all who dwell on earth are among the principles and ordinances of God. The religion bestows upon man the moral virtue by which a person is disposed to render to God the worship and service He deserves. The purpose of religion arise from a human being's relationship to God as the author of his or her being, even as love is a cluster of all the virtues arising from human response to God as the destiny or his or her being.
Sikhism instructs that our life has a purpose and a goal. It offers an opportunity for self and God realization. Moreover man is responsible for his own actions. He cannot claim immunity from the results of his actions. He must therefore be very vigilant in what he does. The goal of human life to merge with God is accomplished by meditation on God and performance of acts of service and charity. Sikhism emphasizes the path of devotion. It also lays stress on the need for earning God's Grace in order to reach the spiritual goal.
Religions should cooperate with each other: The time has arrived when religions, instead of antagonizing each other because of what we once thought were religious convictions, should cooperate with each other in order to contribute to the cause of mankind and world peace, because, in the final analysis, all sectors of religion are bound together by the common aspiration for human happiness and ‘moksha.’The source of conflicts is not the diversity of religions but the lack of toleration. Toleration is open-mindedness. We may follow different roads but our goal is the same. Toleration doesn’t mean indifference born of secret pride or contempt for others. It follows from the conviction that the Absolute Reality is a mystery of which no more than fraction has ever yet been penetrated.
Only such a view of cooperation & harmony among all religions can be the basis of a civilized society where we strive with passion to understand other religions and serve their followers. The last hymn of the Rig Veda has the following words:
sarh gacchadhvam sam vadadhvam.
samvo mandmsi janatam.
Samani va akutih,samana hrdayyani vah
Samanam astu vo manah
Yatha vah susahasati. –(X191)
It means:
Walk together; speak in concord; Let you minds comprehend alike, let your efforts be united; let your hearts be in agreement, let your minds be united, that we all may be happy.
All the great religions have infinite wisdom and beauty to share. Instead of trying to increase the number of followers, religions should create an environment in which one may wisely accept the noble ideals of any religions. Lending a helping to a neglected soul, feeding the hungry, a compassionate smile towards the sad and dejected—this is the real language of religion. We should invoke God’s compassion in our own hearts and hands. Living only for oneself is not life, but death.
Religion is not for us so much doctrinal conformity or ceremonial piety as the re-charging of our nature, the transforming of our personality—becoming something different from what we are. It is the participation in ultimate mystery of the world. When we identify religion with such an outlook, doctrinal rivalries and creedal conflicts become irrelevant.
“Anwal Allah noor upaiya kudrat ke sabh bande”(Raga Prabhati, Kabir, on page 1349 of
‘Guru Granth Sahib’)
Col Gurnam Singh
“This is my simple religion. There is no need for temples; no need for complicated philosophy. Our own brain, our own heart is our temple; the philosophy is kindness.”
-Dalai Lama
What is definition of Religion? According to Swami Vivekananda definition of religion is: “Religion is the idea which is raising the brute unto man, and man unto God.” The brute sees thousands suffering and around but doesn’t care. We become true human beings when we see look around and feel; show love and concern; do our best to alleviate suffering.
In fact religion is realization of the unity of life; this is the supreme purpose for which we have come into human context. In verse 11 of Ch 4 of Bhagavad Gita, one of the most marvelous in the Gita, the Lord says, with his infinite love, that it does not matter what religion you profess.
Functional definitions are so common that most academic definitions of religion can be categorized as either psychological or sociological in nature. Psychological definitions focus upon the ways in which religion plays a role in the mental, emotional, and psychological lives of believers.Sociological definitions define religion by the ways in which it either has an impact upon society or the ways in which it is expressed socially by believers.
What is religion, really? In the words of Osho: “It is an individual approach towards truth. One has to go alone; one has to find one’s own way. You cannot follow another; you can not move on beaten path. The more you search your own path, the closer you will be to God, or truth, or I say to reality.” In fact the path is created as you walk.
Religion originates in an attempt to represent and order beliefs, feelings, imaginings and actions that arise in response to direct experience of the sacred and the spiritual. As this attempt expands in its formulation and elaboration, it becomes a process that creates meaning for itself on a sustaining basis, in terms of both its originating experiences and its own continuing responses.
True religion is not what we get from outside, from scriptures and Gurus.It is not the religion of routine which we adopt as a matter of habit. It is the aspiration of every human soul, that which unfold within oneself, that which is built by one’s life-blood. It is the fulfillment of our nature in which there is joy which overflows into world’s service. All religions affirm that man is confronted by something greater than himself, which is contrast to human nature and all other phenomena. The transcendent Reality is immanent in the human soul. The Upanisad, saying ‘That thou art,’ refers to this fact of Divine Immanence. The essence of the Buddha is present in every being. ‘The Kingdom of God is within you,’ according to Jesus.The Quran says that God is nearer to us than our artery in the neck.
“Religion is not only way to God, but the way to man.”
The purpose of religion as revealed from the heaven of God’s holy Will is to establish unity and concord amongst the people of the world; make it not the cause of dissension and strife. Religion thus corresponds to the practice of piety toward God as Creator of the universe. (Etym. probably Latin religare, to tie, fasten, bind, or relegere, to gather up, treat with care)
The religion of God and His divine law are the most potent instruments and the surest of all means for the dawning of the light of unity amongst men. The progress of the world, the development of nations, tranquility of peoples, and the peace of all who dwell on earth are among the principles and ordinances of God. The religion bestows upon man the moral virtue by which a person is disposed to render to God the worship and service He deserves. The purpose of religion arise from a human being's relationship to God as the author of his or her being, even as love is a cluster of all the virtues arising from human response to God as the destiny or his or her being.
Sikhism instructs that our life has a purpose and a goal. It offers an opportunity for self and God realization. Moreover man is responsible for his own actions. He cannot claim immunity from the results of his actions. He must therefore be very vigilant in what he does. The goal of human life to merge with God is accomplished by meditation on God and performance of acts of service and charity. Sikhism emphasizes the path of devotion. It also lays stress on the need for earning God's Grace in order to reach the spiritual goal.
Religions should cooperate with each other: The time has arrived when religions, instead of antagonizing each other because of what we once thought were religious convictions, should cooperate with each other in order to contribute to the cause of mankind and world peace, because, in the final analysis, all sectors of religion are bound together by the common aspiration for human happiness and ‘moksha.’The source of conflicts is not the diversity of religions but the lack of toleration. Toleration is open-mindedness. We may follow different roads but our goal is the same. Toleration doesn’t mean indifference born of secret pride or contempt for others. It follows from the conviction that the Absolute Reality is a mystery of which no more than fraction has ever yet been penetrated.
Only such a view of cooperation & harmony among all religions can be the basis of a civilized society where we strive with passion to understand other religions and serve their followers. The last hymn of the Rig Veda has the following words:
sarh gacchadhvam sam vadadhvam.
samvo mandmsi janatam.
Samani va akutih,samana hrdayyani vah
Samanam astu vo manah
Yatha vah susahasati. –(X191)
It means:
Walk together; speak in concord; Let you minds comprehend alike, let your efforts be united; let your hearts be in agreement, let your minds be united, that we all may be happy.
All the great religions have infinite wisdom and beauty to share. Instead of trying to increase the number of followers, religions should create an environment in which one may wisely accept the noble ideals of any religions. Lending a helping to a neglected soul, feeding the hungry, a compassionate smile towards the sad and dejected—this is the real language of religion. We should invoke God’s compassion in our own hearts and hands. Living only for oneself is not life, but death.
Religion is not for us so much doctrinal conformity or ceremonial piety as the re-charging of our nature, the transforming of our personality—becoming something different from what we are. It is the participation in ultimate mystery of the world. When we identify religion with such an outlook, doctrinal rivalries and creedal conflicts become irrelevant.
“Anwal Allah noor upaiya kudrat ke sabh bande”(Raga Prabhati, Kabir, on page 1349 of
‘Guru Granth Sahib’)
Col Gurnam Singh
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Ala maqaam
- Posts: 318
- Joined: Wed Sep 14, 2011 8:23 am
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
this is just because he dont trust u,he has not seen any quality of believer in you,this is why he is not sure if he shud follow the religion which u are following.seeker110 wrote:When my son asked me how we can be so sure our belief is the right one among hundreds or thousand other beliefs.What are the chances of us being wrong.% wise.
if u was strong enough in ur own faith,ur child would now have any such doubts.
think about it.
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
^
It means if you are completely brainwashed, your children will also be brainwashed. Just like you they will also not question and search fr the truth.
It means if you are completely brainwashed, your children will also be brainwashed. Just like you they will also not question and search fr the truth.
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
and how would you know that what is truth ?Smart wrote:^
It means if you are completely brainwashed, your children will also be brainwashed. Just like you they will also not question and search fr the truth.
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
Truth lives in the slums,Wrong lives in the mahail.
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Ala maqaam
- Posts: 318
- Joined: Wed Sep 14, 2011 8:23 am
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
many prophets like sulaimaan,yusuf lived in palace as well....its all about the duty given to them by Allah subhanu.seeker110 wrote:Truth lives in the slums,Wrong lives in the mahail.
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Ala maqaam
- Posts: 318
- Joined: Wed Sep 14, 2011 8:23 am
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
again commenting NOT SO SMART comments.Smart wrote:^
It means if you are completely brainwashed, your children will also be brainwashed. Just like you they will also not question and search fr the truth.
u have no idea what is truth and what search I have done.so please comment some thing sensible next time.
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
Allah gave them the duty and it was Allah who gave them the palaces as well. Yusuf (as) suffered in Jail for a time before he got into the palace after he got thrown into a well by his brothers. He was responsible for the crops of Egypt for years. Sulaiman (as) took his armies to fight against those that worshipped the sun and the moon. He was responsible for his entire kingdom. What has your Dai done lately, other than pay money to the enemies of Islam and have the bohras do sajda to them? His palaces weren't given to him by Allah but have been squeezed out of his miserable abdes!!many prophets like sulaimaan,yusuf lived in palace as well....its all about the duty given to them by Allah subhanu.
Any reason why your Dai chooses to follow in the footsteps (only as far as living in the palaces is concerned) of the prophets who lived in palaces rather than the footsteps of prophets like prophet Muhammad (saw) or Prophet Musa (as) (who left a palace to live on the streets) or Prophet Isa (as)?
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Ala maqaam
- Posts: 318
- Joined: Wed Sep 14, 2011 8:23 am
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
can give a very good reply to this scum bag,but as i was suggested i will prefer to ignore all ur posts and ur alikesanajmi wrote:Allah gave them the duty and it was Allah who gave them the palaces as well. Yusuf (as) suffered in Jail for a time before he got into the palace after he got thrown into a well by his brothers. He was responsible for the crops of Egypt for years. Sulaiman (as) took his armies to fight against those that worshipped the sun and the moon. He was responsible for his entire kingdom. What has your Dai done lately, other than pay money to the enemies of Islam and have the bohras do sajda to them? His palaces weren't given to him by Allah but have been squeezed out of his miserable abdes!!many prophets like sulaimaan,yusuf lived in palace as well....its all about the duty given to them by Allah subhanu.
Any reason why your Dai chooses to follow in the footsteps (only as far as living in the palaces is concerned) of the prophets who lived in palaces rather than the footsteps of prophets like prophet Muhammad (saw) or Prophet Musa (as) (who left a palace to live on the streets) or Prophet Isa (as)?
thats the best reply to jhahil.
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
Mr Ala, the truth is that you do not have an answer.
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Al Zulfiqar
- Posts: 4618
- Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2006 5:01 am
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
exactly! when cornered and embarassed, abdes profess ignorance or pretend to take the high road and act all holier-than-thou.
what can one expect from an abde whose leader's greatest achievements are to travel on the concorde airliner and the super-luxury cruise ship queen elizabeth at our expense, who shamelessly and proudly brags about his hunting prowess in murdering wild animals whose very existence is at stake in this world, whose humanity and love for his parents is measured by his burying all memories of his mother and refusing to acknowledge her existence? who foolishly utters laanats on past islamic figures and then runs under police protection to save his own life while his followers are being looted, assaulted and murdered?
whose leader watches while his women followers are being attacked, molested and abused in front of his own eyes? who hobnobs with known goondas, corrupt politicians, tyrants and lowlifes to save his own properties and incomes?
need i say more???
what can one expect from an abde whose leader's greatest achievements are to travel on the concorde airliner and the super-luxury cruise ship queen elizabeth at our expense, who shamelessly and proudly brags about his hunting prowess in murdering wild animals whose very existence is at stake in this world, whose humanity and love for his parents is measured by his burying all memories of his mother and refusing to acknowledge her existence? who foolishly utters laanats on past islamic figures and then runs under police protection to save his own life while his followers are being looted, assaulted and murdered?
whose leader watches while his women followers are being attacked, molested and abused in front of his own eyes? who hobnobs with known goondas, corrupt politicians, tyrants and lowlifes to save his own properties and incomes?
need i say more???
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
Ala, it doesn't look like you ignored my post. If you had ignored it, you wouldn't know if you can give a "very good" reply or not. It's too bad that people who visit this board won't be able to read your "very good" reply. Good for them!!can give a very good reply to this scum bag,but as i was suggested i will prefer to ignore all ur posts and ur alikes
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
Truth is available to those who are skeptics and willing to question. It is not the monopoly of some persons and kissing their feet is not going to get you there.stranger wrote:and how would you know that what is truth ?Smart wrote:^
It means if you are completely brainwashed, your children will also be brainwashed. Just like you they will also not question and search fr the truth.
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
Angry with me? It just goes to prove my contention. As Sadiqali Saheb says "Je dali phal bhari chhe te daim nama kare" If there was any substance in your search, you would have shared it, instead of calling me names.Ala maqaam wrote:again commenting NOT SO SMART comments.Smart wrote:^
It means if you are completely brainwashed, your children will also be brainwashed. Just like you they will also not question and search fr the truth.
u have no idea what is truth and what search I have done.so please comment some thing sensible next time.
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
and who will give you the answer ?Smart wrote: Truth is available to those who are skeptics and willing to question. It is not the monopoly of some persons and kissing their feet is not going to get you there.
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ghulam muhammed
- Posts: 11653
- Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
A person with Rightous Deeds................least of all the present day corrupt bohra clergy.stranger wrote:Smart wrote:
Truth is available to those who are skeptics and willing to question. It is not the monopoly of some persons and kissing their feet is not going to get you there.
and who will give you the answer ?
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
Bhai Stranger,stranger wrote:Since the time i am on the forum, have observed one thing :-
Whenever there is debate going on with Non bohra forum members such as Anajmi, Muslim First or anyone over Shia-Sunni Faith or Ismaili Faith -
Be it debate over the succession of Moula Ali (a.s.), Be it over Imamat, Be it on praying combining namaz, Be it on Fasting 30 days in Ramadan. Why is that always Orthodox side has to come forward and defend the dawoodi bohra beliefs ??
Why It is always has to be Adam, Profastian, Ala Makaam, Aqs or etc. If you will observe then can easily find out that progressives minded members hardly came forward and put up their points in support. Infact, passively they like to be in support of opposition. Yes, "Porus" is an exception among them.
I'm not asking progressives to support the last two da'is or current administration or oppose the issues raised by reformist but If you call yourself dawoodi-bohra then why can't support it being one ?
I beg to differ on your contention above.
Forum members affiliated to Bohra Shabab like brother aqs has came almost always to cover only Bade Mulla Ji Burhanuddin sahab. Likewise brother Adam has only advocated the innovative practices of Kothar. Brother Profastian is the first to initiate a thread to attack non-DB on Hajj/Eid days, otherwise all his posts too are to cover Bade Mulla Ji Burhanuddin sahab practices.
I sincerely believe Doctor/Mubarak from Dawoodi Bohra Youth has more defended the Dawoodi Bohras/Fatimi Dawat faith than any DB Shabab on this forum. Please note: Doctor/Mubarak contribution is very small in compare to contribution from other DB Youth members on this forum.
There are many DB Progressives who have sincerely defended selective aspects of DB faith like brother Porus, brother Asif786, etc.
In my personal opinion, I will acknowledge that unfortunately progressive like brother Humsafar sahab feel happy when DB faith is attacked!
Respected forum members like brother Accountability and brother Omabharti- in my opinion they are loyal to DB faith. Though they have sincere grudges against ill behavior of Kothar.
Hence, bhai Stranger your contention that no one from DB Youth defends attacks on DB faith is incorrect. Indeed; contrary to your contention: DB Youth forum members defends DB faith more than DB Shabab!
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
Bro ,Bhai Stranger,
I beg to differ on your contention above.
Forum members affiliated to Bohra Shabab like brother aqs has came almost always to cover only Bade Mulla Ji Burhanuddin sahab. Likewise brother Adam has only advocated the innovative practices of Kothar. Brother Profastian is the first to initiate a thread to attack non-DB on Hajj/Eid days, otherwise all his posts too are to cover Bade Mulla Ji Burhanuddin sahab practices.
Thats absolutely wrong. You can cross check the older posts and then will come to know that we do not
only come up to defend Sydena(t.u.s) but DB practices and facts also. Yes Profastian has initiated the thread and you can see the trail that who came to defend DB and who came to attack. Check yourself !
I agree and accept that you often come up in defend Fatimi Dawat tradition and faith. Offcourse, Porus is also very proactive and i appreciate his knowledge and commitment to it.I sincerely believe Doctor/Mubarak from Dawoodi Bohra Youth has more defended the Dawoodi Bohras/Fatimi Dawat faith than any DB Shabab on this forum. Please note: Doctor/Mubarak contribution is very small in compare to contribution from other DB Youth members on this forum.
There are many DB Progressives who have sincerely defended selective aspects of DB faith like brother Porus, brother Asif786, etc.
Not only Humsafar, what about AZ, Safiuddin, Ghulam Mohammed.In my personal opinion, I will acknowledge that unfortunately progressive like brother Humsafar sahab feel happy when DB faith is attacked!
Accountability is not much active but yeah he is reasonable and loyal to DB faith.Respected forum members like brother Accountability and brother Omabharti- in my opinion they are loyal to DB faith. Though they have sincere grudges against ill behavior of Kothar.
and Oma Bharti...Lol you are kidding bro. He remain upfront on attack. He finds Practise of Maatam questionable, He defends first 3 Caliphs and so on.
Few DB youth defends and most of them remain bussy in attack rather. and I believe you will not find a single orthodox DB attacking their own faith anyway. Leave apart the issue of administration and leadership of Da'i,Hence, bhai Stranger your contention that no one from DB Youth defends attacks on DB faith is incorrect. Indeed; contrary to your contention: DB Youth forum members defends DB faith more than DB Shabab!
we are purely talking about Ismaili/fatemi Dawat/DB faith.
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
STRANGER. Correct observation. I have made this clear a few times. There are those who insult everything beginning of the Ahlul Bayt AS.
My understanding of why the Progs seize to defend Shia/Fatimid/DB belief when the time arises, is their hate for Syedna TUS unites them with the Wahabi/Sunnis. So, they keep quiet and observe.
They are probably under the understanding of "the enemy of my enemy is my friend", but fail to see that the "enemy of their enemy", is also "their own enemy".
They have chosen not to defend DB faith. Alas. What can we do about it? Shows how much they really care about it.
Just like to clear one thing mentioned by DOCTOR regarding me :
This is incorrect. I have stated it many times that my presence on this forum is not to advocate or preach. I try to only clarify & correct true DB beliefs when they are being deliberately distorted. That is my stance.
My understanding of why the Progs seize to defend Shia/Fatimid/DB belief when the time arises, is their hate for Syedna TUS unites them with the Wahabi/Sunnis. So, they keep quiet and observe.
They are probably under the understanding of "the enemy of my enemy is my friend", but fail to see that the "enemy of their enemy", is also "their own enemy".
They have chosen not to defend DB faith. Alas. What can we do about it? Shows how much they really care about it.
Just like to clear one thing mentioned by DOCTOR regarding me :
Likewise brother Adam has only advocated the innovative practices of Kothar.
This is incorrect. I have stated it many times that my presence on this forum is not to advocate or preach. I try to only clarify & correct true DB beliefs when they are being deliberately distorted. That is my stance.
Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
So then it would be accurate to say that the current Dai and his kothar is not following the correct DB faith right?
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Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
yes ,when it comes to money spending....and comforts acquiring.anajmi wrote:So then it would be accurate to say that the current Dai and his kothar is not following the correct DB faith right?
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Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
yes world have progressed and people do need to change life style,but what right now is happening with kothar this have break all the limits,all this kind of money spending does not suit to even a simple muslim forget about DAI of Imam(s).
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Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
leader shud be example for his followers,this is the only reason mola Ali followed simplicity in his life though he had all possible comforts if he really wanted to acquire.
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Re: Orthodox v/s Progressive - A Slight Observation.
even a youngest KID in saifi mahal rides mercedes benz?
while few dawoodi bohra kids cant even efford public transport to go school,and they ride bicycle for the same.
while few dawoodi bohra kids cant even efford public transport to go school,and they ride bicycle for the same.