Salam to bohra's .. need answer

The one and only free public forum for Bohras. The focus of this forum is the reform movement, the Dawoodi Bohra faith and, of course, the corrupt priesthood. But the discussion is in no way restricted to the Bohras alone.
Ja'afari
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Jun 11, 2011 12:49 am

Salam to bohra's .. need answer

#1

Unread post by Ja'afari » Sat Jan 07, 2012 2:32 pm

salam alikum all ....

we alway's heard rumors about bohra's and im here to be sure about what i hear ..

is that true that non- bohra not allowed to convert to bohra??

for example if shia twelver or sunni decided to convert to bohra sect he is allowed?? or not

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am

Re: Salam to bohra's .. need answer

#2

Unread post by Muslim First » Sat Jan 07, 2012 3:37 pm

You must be nuts to convert to Bohri religion!!!

You convert only if;
Either you want to merry a Bohri or you have foot fatish.

Kaka Akela
Posts: 477
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Salam to bohra's .. need answer

#3

Unread post by Kaka Akela » Sat Jan 07, 2012 4:13 pm

Brother Ja'afri: Welcome to this forum and don't pay attention to Brother Muslim First's rant against Dawoodi Bohras (whether orthodox or progressive). As you realize that the doors to any religion are always open, either to enter or to exit. Before you enter our doors please read a lot about the historical background of our religion and then assess your intention to see if you would want to be a part of this sect. A good book to start with in english language is " Mullahs on the main frame" by Jonas Blank. he covers the history and also both perspectives of orthodox as well as progressive with an even handed treatment. You also have to assess deeply your reasons for leaving the religious sect of forefathers.

anajmi
Posts: 13506
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Salam to bohra's .. need answer

#4

Unread post by anajmi » Sat Jan 07, 2012 7:16 pm

No one in their right minds would want to convert to bohra-ism because it is a great religion. People want to convert to bohra-ism either because they want to marry someone who is a bohra or because they've lost their marbles.

Hussain_KSA
Posts: 874
Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2007 4:01 am

Re: Salam to bohra's .. need answer

#5

Unread post by Hussain_KSA » Sun Jan 08, 2012 4:37 am

Bro Jaafari

Please pm me to get pdf version of " Mullas on Main Frame".

Ja'afari
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Jun 11, 2011 12:49 am

Re: Salam to bohra's .. need answer

#6

Unread post by Ja'afari » Sun Jan 08, 2012 9:27 am

Thanks for whom all answerd me ... and for these whom racist pls be far

Al Zulfiqar
Posts: 4618
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2006 5:01 am

Re: Salam to bohra's .. need answer

#7

Unread post by Al Zulfiqar » Sun Jan 08, 2012 2:21 pm

jaafari,

please read my replies below in red.
Ja'afari wrote:salam alikum all ....

we alway's heard rumors about bohra's and im here to be sure about what i hear ..

is that true that non- bohra not allowed to convert to bohra??

there is no such rule. all non-bohras are gladly welcomed to convert if they wish. in fact bohras take pride in pointing out such converts esp. when such converted bohras show great devotion and aqeeda for dai. they consider it a feather in their topi.

for example if shia twelver or sunni decided to convert to bohra sect he is allowed?? or not

already answered above. all they need to is to undergo misaq at the hands of an amil or appointed functionary of the dai.

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Salam to bohra's .. need answer

#8

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Sun Jan 08, 2012 7:57 pm

Bro jaafri,

Religion is something which is very sacred and hence conversion should be only for the purpose of seeking a way to come closer to Allah (swt) if at all the alternate religion seems to provide an avenue for achieving such goals. Embracing a faith only in order to satisfy the worldly greeds can never prove to be beneficial. I say this because in case of bohras (as Bro.anajmi rightly pointed out) people convert mostly for the sake of marriage and not for attaining inner peace, especially the other muslim sects to whom bohraism doesnt appeal. If there was any appeal then we would have witnessed mass conversions which is hugely lacking. The dai whose prime duty is to give daawat has himself not taken any pains in inviting people to his fold thereby failing miserably in his PRIME duty. He is too busy glorifying himself and his so called achievements which are nothing but some insignificant titles, travelling in concorde and the luxury liner QE II etc etc. The diehard bohras themselves are at pain in identifying areas wherein the dai has ever contributed towards the cause of Islam and its Ummah

think
Posts: 1838
Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2011 10:15 am

Re: Salam to bohra's .. need answer

#9

Unread post by think » Mon Jan 09, 2012 1:06 pm

jaafri; you are welcome to read the book by jonas blank; but think again to the published matter. This english writer was paid to write this book. The dawaat could not find any bohra writer. this in itself should be enough for you.

Al Zulfiqar
Posts: 4618
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2006 5:01 am

Re: Salam to bohra's .. need answer

#10

Unread post by Al Zulfiqar » Mon Jan 09, 2012 1:43 pm

so jaafri,

have you given your misaq and already converted to a bohra?

when are you throwing a ziyafat for syedna?

are we forum members, who helped you with your queries, invited to said ziyafat?

have you got your first starter std kit stitched and got your ejamaat card? your aim should be to obtain a green colored one, as that is the magic color which will open doors to the best suites and get you vip treatment all over the world.

if you need help making connections within the top zaad echelons in mumbai, then pm me and i will have you set up with the head honcho himself.

all the best.

think
Posts: 1838
Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2011 10:15 am

Re: Salam to bohra's .. need answer

#11

Unread post by think » Mon Jan 09, 2012 2:09 pm

jaafri; all the best. Be ready to be manipulated, intimidated and dominated.

candela
Posts: 49
Joined: Tue Jul 29, 2008 4:01 am

Re: Salam to bohra's .. need answer

#12

Unread post by candela » Tue Jan 10, 2012 3:41 pm

Kaka Akela wrote: A good book to start with in english language is " Mullahs on the main frame" by Jonas Blank. he covers the history and also both perspectives of orthodox as well as progressive with an even handed treatment. You also have to assess deeply your reasons for leaving the religious sect of forefathers.
This book was not written by a Bohra, nor was it endorsed by the Syedna, the primary and singular human spiritual leader of the Bohra sect. To the devout Bohras and to the non-Bohras, but especially the devout Bohras, is it not telling that an "outsider" came to ask questions about the sect and he was primarily referred to a book about the Bohras not even written by a Bohra?

Bohras, have you no shame? Are you going to let non-Bohras tell your story for the rest of Time? Are you too lazy to write your own books about your sect? Is the claim about your openness just lip-service... do you *really* care to spread the faith?

Kaka Akela
Posts: 477
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Salam to bohra's .. need answer

#13

Unread post by Kaka Akela » Tue Jan 10, 2012 3:57 pm

Dear Candela: Instead of shaming all Bohras, why don't you please give out the name of a book that is written by a bohra. For this book Jonas visited the Saifee mahal, interviewed many zaadas and was allowed to visit jamea and talk to anybody there and best of all, the zaadas did not put any conditions of censorship on his work. If you and I were to do the similar thing there will be 1000 conditions and the book will be reviewed at several levels and it would be so sanitized that it will not resemble to what you or I wrote, also in your book they will not allow any chapters about Progressive bohras. So, I thought it was best to suggest this book for a balanced view, if you have an alternate book please mention it here so we all can be enlightened.

SBM
Posts: 6507
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Salam to bohra's .. need answer

#14

Unread post by SBM » Tue Jan 10, 2012 4:03 pm

the zaadas did not put any conditions of censorship on his work.
As per Jonas Blank he only met Syedna for very few minutes and he was not free to discuss without the presence of his Zaadas

Smart
Posts: 1388
Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 4:01 am

Re: Salam to bohra's .. need answer

#15

Unread post by Smart » Tue Jan 10, 2012 4:11 pm

I have read this book, which has been written with the razaa of the dai. While reading through all the chapters, it is clear to a discerning mind that the this razaa has ensured that the version projected by the author has been clearly slanted, with mild praise of the establishment and hints of criticism of the reformists.
The author is by no means perfectly objective. He creates a rosy picture about the community and is dismissive about the criticism.
The fact is that a PhD student from Harvard has been co-opted by the Kothar to whitewash their deeds and to do a PR exercise for them. From the author and his writings, it is clear that expenses have not been spared.

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Salam to bohra's .. need answer

#16

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Tue Jan 10, 2012 4:27 pm

It is like Narendra Modi of BJP writing a book on RSS. In fact Jaafri should also read some literature written by Asghar Ali Engineer as his works covers all the aspects of religiousity, rituals and history of bohras as well as throws light on the conduct of the administration under the present dai.

candela
Posts: 49
Joined: Tue Jul 29, 2008 4:01 am

Re: Salam to bohra's .. need answer

#17

Unread post by candela » Tue Jan 10, 2012 4:43 pm

Kaka Akela wrote:So, I thought it was best to suggest this book for a balanced view, if you have an alternate book please mention it here so we all can be enlightened.
Hi Kaka Akela,

I *don't* really have alternate books about Bohras by Bohras to suggest, that's exactly the point. Actually when I thought about it, two books came to mind: "I Speak for Myself" (http://www.ispeakformyself.com/) edited by Maria M Ebrahimji and Zahra T Suratwala, and an English translation of the Qur'an by Abdullah Yusuf Ali. Both of these are very noble undertakings, but the point remains that I can't think of major instances of Bohras writing about Bohraism for the benefit of humankind. Apparently somebody else has to do it for them...

Fwiw, if a non-Bohra wanted to learn about Bohraism, I too think "Mullahs on the Mainframe" is a decent place to start, the valid comments about it on this thread notwithstanding (indeed, though, it's kind of one of the *only* places to start).

SBM
Posts: 6507
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Salam to bohra's .. need answer

#18

Unread post by SBM » Tue Jan 10, 2012 5:00 pm

Without the cooperation of the dawat, no meaningful research could be conducted in the community, so I am grateful for their permission and assistance; I hope, however, that I have presented a fair-minded work,
Jonas Blank in reply to my letter.

Reporter
Posts: 272
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:34 am

Re: Salam to bohra's .. need answer

#19

Unread post by Reporter » Fri Jan 13, 2012 3:36 pm

"The Bohras" by Asghar Ali Engineer is a good alternative.