Wasilah /Intercession- Quran i.e. Dawoodi Bohras perspective

The one and only free public forum for Bohras. The focus of this forum is the reform movement, the Dawoodi Bohra faith and, of course, the corrupt priesthood. But the discussion is in no way restricted to the Bohras alone.
Rabeha Solar
Posts: 104
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2012 10:50 pm

Re: Wasilah /Intercession- Quran i.e. Dawoodi Bohras perspec

#61

Unread post by Rabeha Solar » Wed Jul 04, 2012 12:28 am

aliabbas_aa wrote:Our top bori mullah says that every year about 100 people leave the bori fold. Anyways i am not even talking about overseas reverts , they are very huge in number ! I am talking about reverts in India and more specifically Mumbai and Gujarat . 3 such families live in raudat tahera st alone!.
why dont u publish number of people who enters bohra fold every year?

long live syedna muhammed burhanuddin(tus)

sixfeetunder
Posts: 433
Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2010 8:48 am

Re: Wasilah /Intercession- Quran i.e. Dawoodi Bohras perspec

#62

Unread post by sixfeetunder » Wed Jul 04, 2012 4:57 am

Rabeha Solar wrote:
aliabbas_aa wrote:Our top bori mullah says that every year about 100 people leave the bori fold. Anyways i am not even talking about overseas reverts , they are very huge in number ! I am talking about reverts in India and more specifically Mumbai and Gujarat . 3 such families live in raudat tahera st alone!.
why dont u publish number of people who enters bohra fold every year?

long live syedna muhammed burhanuddin(tus)
Through love marriages?

Rabeha Solar
Posts: 104
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2012 10:50 pm

Re: Wasilah /Intercession- Quran i.e. Dawoodi Bohras perspec

#63

Unread post by Rabeha Solar » Wed Jul 04, 2012 7:57 am

sixfeetunder wrote:
Rabeha Solar wrote: why dont u publish number of people who enters bohra fold every year?

long live syedna muhammed burhanuddin(tus)
Through love marriages?
bohras must be having some qualities that people falls in love with them isnt it?

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am

Re: Wasilah /Intercession- Quran i.e. Dawoodi Bohras perspec

#64

Unread post by Muslim First » Wed Jul 04, 2012 8:11 am

Rabeha Solar wrote:
aliabbas_aa wrote:Our top bori mullah says that every year about 100 people leave the bori fold. Anyways i am not even talking about overseas reverts , they are very huge in number ! I am talking about reverts in India and more specifically Mumbai and Gujarat . 3 such families live in raudat tahera st alone!.
why dont u publish number of people who enters bohra fold every year?

long live syedna muhammed burhanuddin(tus)
Love is blind.

Raaja ne gami Raani ane Chaana vinta laavi
( Raaja liked Raani who was collecting dung)

Jab dil lagaa to Ghadhi se to Pari kya jeez he.

sixfeetunder
Posts: 433
Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2010 8:48 am

Re: Wasilah /Intercession- Quran i.e. Dawoodi Bohras perspec

#65

Unread post by sixfeetunder » Wed Jul 04, 2012 10:27 am

sixfeetunder wrote:Through love marriages?
rabeha solar wrote:bohras must be having some qualities that people falls in love with them isnt it?
Sure. But entering Bohra fold through accident of love marriage is one thing and entering bohra fold through conviction of faith is another :)

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Wasilah /Intercession- Quran i.e. Dawoodi Bohras perspec

#66

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:50 pm

Rabeha Solar wrote:why dont u publish number of people who enters bohra fold every year?
I think it would be better if you or someone else published the number of people who entered bohra fold due to the dai's efforts, he is a "Dai" which means a person who gives "Daawat", so lets figure out how many people were given "daawat" by the current as well as the 51st dai !!

Hanif
Posts: 188
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2012 11:11 pm

Re: Wasilah /Intercession- Quran i.e. Dawoodi Bohras perspec

#67

Unread post by Hanif » Wed Jul 04, 2012 5:25 pm

sixfeetunder wrote:
Rabeha Solar wrote: why dont u publish number of people who enters bohra fold every year?

long live syedna muhammed burhanuddin(tus)
Through love marriages?

Only through love marriages, of course, and that too under the threat of the baraat and witholdin nika rasam. If nikah is not performed by the bohora clergy, nikah is not recognised. Then comes the barat of the parents, the couple, and family who associate with them. The only way out is a fat encelope. So people convert. Once the nikah is performed they can go and get married in their partners faith, whether it means going around agni or Sunni kazi, or church. They don't care.

Is this called conversion or just a game o show!

Hanif
Posts: 188
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2012 11:11 pm

Re: Wasilah /Intercession- Quran i.e. Dawoodi Bohras perspec

#68

Unread post by Hanif » Wed Jul 04, 2012 5:38 pm

ghulam muhammed wrote:
Rabeha Solar wrote:why dont u publish number of people who enters bohra fold every year?
I think it would be better if you or someone else published the number of people who entered bohra fold due to the dai's efforts, he is a "Dai" which means a person who gives "Daawat", so lets figure out how many people were given "daawat" by the current as well as the 51st dai !!
[/color]Dai cannot go out and preach because people would get offended. However, what he and his family could do is attract others by practicing ethical Islam, helping poor, being humble instead of being stiff necked - this is in reference to his family. We saw a plea today by a garib masi who went to Saifee hospital and was turned away. What Dai and his family can do is make provisions for the poor people who come to the hospital. They can do so as they have millions of dollars stashed away. There are a lot of ways of attracting people to faith. By reciting lanaats on Khalifas and Progressives, they are turning away people who are already turned off.

And finally, they have to stop milking people. Let people give what they want. Which religion sets amounts for the followers to submit to the clergy.

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am

Re: Wasilah /Intercession- Quran i.e. Dawoodi Bohras perspec

#69

Unread post by Muslim First » Wed Jul 04, 2012 5:53 pm

Hanif wrote:
Only through love marriages, of course, and that too under the threat of the baraat and witholdin nika rasam. If nikah is not performed by the bohora clergy, nikah is not recognised. Then comes the barat of the parents, the couple, and family who associate with them. The only way out is a fat encelope. So people convert. Once the nikah is performed they can go and get married in their partners faith, whether it means going around agni or Sunni kazi, or church. They don't care.

Is this called conversion or just a game o show!
:wink:
Nikah
Main article: Nikah
Nikah (Arabic: نكاح, literally: contract[2]) is the first, and most common, form of marriage for Muslims. It is described in the Qur'an in 4:4.[3]
A Muslim bride signing the nikkah nama or marriage certificate.
Regulations:
It is aimed to be permanent, but can be terminated by the husband engaging in the divorce process or the wife seeking a divorce.
The couple inherit from each other.
A legal contract is signed when entering the marriage. However it is not a requirement that the contract be in writing, it may be oral especially amongst illiterates.
If an agreed end-date is determined in the Nikah contract: (happen only in Shia madhab)
In Sunni jurisprudence, the contract is voided.
In Shia jurisprudence, the contract is transformed into a nikah mut'ah.
Requirement of witnesses:
Sunni: Either, 2 Muslim male adult. Or 1 Muslim male adult and 2 Muslim female adult[citation needed].
Shia: 2 Muslim male adult.[4]
Permission from Wali[5]:
Sunni - Maliki, Shafi'i, Hanbali: Compulsory. Hanafi: Strongly recommended, but not compulsory.
Shia - Depending on the scholar, it is either obligatory or obligatory based on precaution.
[edit]Nikah mut‘ah
From wakipedia
Br Hanif

Kaheko Sunni Islam Ko badnaam kar rahe ho?
If Bora clergy refusing to marry two adults who has a wali can be married by Sunni Kazi.

Hanif
Posts: 188
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2012 11:11 pm

Re: Wasilah /Intercession- Quran i.e. Dawoodi Bohras perspec

#70

Unread post by Hanif » Wed Jul 04, 2012 7:55 pm

Brother MF,

I have no problem with Sunni Kazi. Bohoras do not recognise any Nikah that is not performed by their Amil, or Saifee Mahal or according to their faith. They have to get raza first and then go through the rigmaroo. In the case of non-bohori marrying a bohori, permission for conversion comes from Saifee Mahal - non-bohori must convert whether he/she likes it or not. If the Nikah is not performed according to the bohori faith, children are considered illegitimate. Go firgure, brother!
Conversion comes via Misaq. Then the Nikah is performed. Once the Nikah is performed, say a girl married a hindu and the Guy converted for the sake of Nikah and keeping the girl's family out of trouble, they can go to hindu mandal and have an agni ceremony performed. I have seen this with my own eyes. The guy never steps into Bohora masjid ever again.

children born are hindus and raised as such. As long as you push fat envelopes, they look the other way.

I have no problem with any religious ceremony. However, nobody forces you to convert.

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Wasilah /Intercession- Quran i.e. Dawoodi Bohras perspec

#71

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Thu Jul 05, 2012 5:00 pm

Hanif wrote:If the Nikah is not performed according to the bohori faith, children are considered illegitimate.
This is by far the most ridiculous sunnah of burhani abdes :mrgreen: :mrgreen: