Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

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Adam
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Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#1

Unread post by Adam » Sat Jul 21, 2012 2:23 pm

QUESTION:
Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?
Proggies/Reformies (Engineer S.Insaf, Doctor etc)

They claim to follow Fatimid/Dawoodi Bohra Scriptures. (Daim ul Islam, Kitab al Himmah)
These texts clearly define the difference between the Fatimi practice from other sects, that there must be someone (a leader) to collect the Zakaat from his followers, and not for the people to give the Zakaat directly to the 8 categories (which some other sects do).

P.S This is in accordance to the Quran, stating خذ من اموالهم صدقة
(Oh Mohammed, take Sadaqah (Zakaat) from them)

So, who do the Proggies/Reformies give their Zakaat to?
Ahmed Ali Raj is dead, so who takes?
Or do you not believe in giving to someone (which in turn shows you don't follow the Fatimid texts)
Or, since you don't have someone to give it to, do you not give Zakat in the first place?

(I would be nice to hear the Proggy version, instead of "others" trying to justify their own practice. This is just a simple question about how they do it.)

anajmi
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#2

Unread post by anajmi » Sat Jul 21, 2012 2:36 pm

Mohammad (saw) is no longer there to accept your zakat.

There are eight categories mentioned in the Quran that are eligible for zakat. These are

The poor (fuqara), the needy (masaqeen), those who collect zakat for distribution and not for their own comforts and pleasures, those who are close to accepting Islam, for freeing of a slave, those in debt and who cannot pay their debt, in the cause of Allah (according to scholars these are those who go out in the path of Allah either to fight or to give dawah and that rules out the Dai for sure) and the wayfarer who is stranded and cannot get back home without help.

I am sure that anyone who wishes to give zakat will be able to find enough people who can accept your zakat. Following of Fatimid texts against the commands of the Quran is kufr.

SBM
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#3

Unread post by SBM » Sat Jul 21, 2012 2:53 pm

Adam
Would the poor Bohras in Ahmedabad qualify for Zakat and can you get your Masters in Kothar to look after them. After almost 6 months of exposing, no help has gone to them from Kothari Goons who collect your zakat to fly First Class on Ziyafaat Hunting.

ghulam muhammed
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#4

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Sat Jul 21, 2012 7:21 pm

Adam wrote: These texts clearly define the difference between the Fatimi practice from other sects, that there must be someone (a leader) to collect the Zakaat from his followers, and not for the people to give the Zakaat directly to the 8 categories (which some other sects do).

P.S This is in accordance to the Quran, stating خذ من اموالهم صدقة
(Oh Mohammed, take Sadaqah (Zakaat) from them)
Bro Adam,

On a serious note, can you tell me if Mola Ali (a.s.) took zakat from his followers after the demise of Rasul Allah (s.a.w.) and if Imam Hasan/Imam Hussain (a.s.) took zakat from their followers after the demise of Mola Ali (a.s.) ?

Thanks.

Adam
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#5

Unread post by Adam » Sat Jul 21, 2012 8:40 pm

ghulam muhammed wrote:
Adam wrote: These texts clearly define the difference between the Fatimi practice from other sects, that there must be someone (a leader) to collect the Zakaat from his followers, and not for the people to give the Zakaat directly to the 8 categories (which some other sects do).

P.S This is in accordance to the Quran, stating خذ من اموالهم صدقة
(Oh Mohammed, take Sadaqah (Zakaat) from them)
Bro Adam,
On a serious note, can you tell me if Mola Ali (a.s.) took zakat from his followers after the demise of Rasul Allah (s.a.w.) and if Imam Hasan/Imam Hussain (a.s.) took zakat from their followers after the demise of Mola Ali (a.s.) ?
Thanks.
YES. (even 1 & 2 collected Zakaat from their people)

The "Others" are replying... Proggies ( ie: those who claim to follow Fatimi Dawoodi Bohra texts and practices)? Anyone (Proggy) going to answer?

Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

SBM
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#6

Unread post by SBM » Sat Jul 21, 2012 9:42 pm

Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

Adam

Posts: 645
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2011 7:50 am
To the poor, needy Muslims anywhere and Mumineens of Ahmedabad which people like you ignore and live in illusion that Kothari Goons will help them
Kothari Goons do not qualify for Zakkat :lol: Why does not Kothar show the amount of Zakaat collected and in what form are they distributed.

aliabbas_aa
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#7

Unread post by aliabbas_aa » Sat Jul 21, 2012 10:59 pm

first the imamuzzaman has to testify that the dai is haq na dai only then he can qualify to accept zakat

Examiner
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#8

Unread post by Examiner » Sun Jul 22, 2012 12:35 am

aliabbas_aa wrote:first the imamuzzaman has to testify that the dai is haq na dai only then he can qualify to accept zakat
why do u testify laailaha illallah muhammed rasullullah? have u seen Allah or Muhammed(s)?

Adam
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#9

Unread post by Adam » Sun Jul 22, 2012 12:46 am

aliabbas_aa wrote:first the imamuzzaman has to testify that the dai is haq na dai only then he can qualify to accept zakat

Typical off topic answer.

I am just asking who the Proggies/Reformist give Zakaat to. That's all. Not very complicated.
Do they even give Zakaat?

aliabbas_aa
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#10

Unread post by aliabbas_aa » Sun Jul 22, 2012 1:29 am

why do u testify laailaha illallah muhammed rasullullah? have u seen Allah or Muhammed(s)?

I have read Quran and Quran has convinced me the truthfulness of Islam and falsehood of shiism

humanbeing
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#11

Unread post by humanbeing » Sun Jul 22, 2012 1:44 am

Dear Adam
I will appreciate if you help me understand following queries.

Is collector of Zakaat (appointed leader) accountable to people from whom Zakaat is collected ?

By what rules and regulations can Zakaat collector dispense monies collected ? The 8 ways to spend zakaat, can he/she spend as he/she wishes or it has to be as mentioned in Quran or Sunnah.

Does it become abiding on Zakaat donor to know and be responsible for his source of income and expend in way of zakaat ?

humanbeing
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#12

Unread post by humanbeing » Sun Jul 22, 2012 1:49 am

few more queries.

Was Prophet Muhammad (saw) accountable to its people for monies collected in Zakat ?
Was Imam Ali (saw) accountable to its people for monies collected in Zakaat ?

Examiner
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#13

Unread post by Examiner » Sun Jul 22, 2012 2:03 am

humanbeing wrote:few more queries.

Was Prophet Muhammad (saw) accountable to its people for monies collected in Zakat ?
Was Imam Ali (saw) accountable to its people for monies collected in Zakaat ?
its a common sense, once u accept these personality as ur leader and Imam, there is no question of accountability, if they wish they would give if they dont they dont.

either u accept them as your leader or u just reject it.
Last edited by Examiner on Sun Jul 22, 2012 2:05 am, edited 1 time in total.

Examiner
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#14

Unread post by Examiner » Sun Jul 22, 2012 2:03 am

aliabbas_aa wrote:why do u testify laailaha illallah muhammed rasullullah? have u seen Allah or Muhammed(s)?

I have read Quran and Quran has convinced me the truthfulness of Islam and falsehood of shiism
how u know quraan is truth and word of GOD?

Adam
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#15

Unread post by Adam » Sun Jul 22, 2012 2:16 am

Examiner. I understand your intentions, but you're derailing the topic because "others" are trying to divert it. So please refrain and ignore, or take it to another thread.

The Question is very simple.
Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?
Do they even give Zakat?

aliabbas_aa
Posts: 320
Joined: Mon Feb 15, 2010 2:21 am

Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#16

Unread post by aliabbas_aa » Sun Jul 22, 2012 8:18 am

Examiner wrote:
aliabbas_aa wrote:why do u testify laailaha illallah muhammed rasullullah? have u seen Allah or Muhammed(s)?

I have read Quran and Quran has convinced me the truthfulness of Islam and falsehood of shiism
how u know quraan is truth and word of GOD?
I have read Quran and Quran has convinced me the truthfulness of Quran and it being word of God at the same time Quran is also a Furqaan (Criteria) which helped me in arriving to the conclusion that the Ismaili tayyebi literature was inspired by none but satan.

Examiner
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#17

Unread post by Examiner » Sun Jul 22, 2012 8:22 am

aliabbas_aa wrote:
Examiner wrote: how u know quraan is truth and word of GOD?
I have read Quran and Quran has convinced me the truthfulness of Quran and it being word of God at the same time Quran is also a Furqaan (Criteria) which helped me in arriving to the conclusion that the Ismaili tayyebi literature was inspired by none but satan.
let Adam bhai continue here, as far as satan is concern, just look at ur self in mirror :mrgreen:

aliabbas_aa
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#18

Unread post by aliabbas_aa » Sun Jul 22, 2012 8:44 am

I guess this satan (examiner) got frightened and left this thread THIS Ramadan

Adam
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#19

Unread post by Adam » Sun Jul 22, 2012 1:48 pm

Thank you Brother Examiner, for understanding.

Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?
Do they give Zakaat?

Humsafar
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#20

Unread post by Humsafar » Sun Jul 22, 2012 2:10 pm

Welcome back Adam, how was the Haqiqi Yoga bootcamp? Looks like they taught you ask the question about zakat. To answer your question:
Reformists are free to give their zakat according to their free will as the Quran prescribes. Some in Udaipur choose to give it to the Jamat which then distributes it to the poor and needy.

canadian
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#21

Unread post by canadian » Sun Jul 22, 2012 8:18 pm

Adam saheb:

As Humsafar says Progressives pay zakaat to their jamaat or to whomever they choose to. Now will you kindly answer, "Do abdes pay zakaat?". For the last nember of years whenever I have gone to the masjid to pay my dues, no one has ever talked to me about zakat. All they want is "wajebaat"- presumably they (the Kothar) then decides how much, if any, to allocate to zakaat. Every time there is bargaining about the amount--- the amil and his people want me to pay more than the previous year and I try (sometimes in vain) to stick to the same amount. No body asks me about or mentions the word, "zakaat".

I pay as much minimal amount as possible, then at home I work out my actual zakaat dues and send the money to India and Africa to be distributed to poor and orphans

Examiner
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#22

Unread post by Examiner » Mon Jul 23, 2012 12:06 am

actually all progs are fateh haal so i dont think they even qualify to give zakaat.

mnoorani
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#23

Unread post by mnoorani » Mon Jul 23, 2012 2:01 am

Examiner wrote:actually all progs are fateh haal so i dont think they even qualify to give zakaat.
This is the fact. In Mumbra the Vohras are very poor but still Mola is making them pay for everything.This is because they are not fateh haal.
So the Kothar has to implemant The policy of givng Zakat only to Fateh Haal. They are just doing this to make the Mumbra citizens fateh haal so that next year they will all qualify for receiving zakat. we should have gareeb in the community so that zakat can be given o someone. This is why the Mumbra Vohras are being charged for everything. This is haqiqat.

"Biradar tu nasihat sun,
haqiqat na gulo tu chun"...

progticide
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#24

Unread post by progticide » Mon Jul 23, 2012 2:06 am

Humsafar wrote:Welcome back Adam, how was the Haqiqi Yoga bootcamp? Looks like they taught you ask the question about zakat.
Humsafar,
You and the other reformists failed to answer the question on Zakat last time too. Here's the link to refresh your memory.

http://dawoodi-bohras.com/forum/viewtop ... 902#p78164

Let's see if you have the answers this year.

Adam
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#25

Unread post by Adam » Mon Jul 23, 2012 2:58 am

Thanks Progticide.
I didn' t know it was discussed before.
Same situation as always. Diversion diversion.

Adam
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#26

Unread post by Adam » Mon Jul 23, 2012 3:06 am

@HUMSAFAR
Reformists are free to give their zakat according to their free will as the Quran prescribes.

The Quran and FATIMI DAWOODI BOHRA TEXTS (which the Proggies claim to follow), doesn't allow this. There must be a Leader (Haq na Saheb) who collects the Zakaat, just like the Prophet and Imams did.
So they (+you) are wrong?

Some in Udaipur choose to give it to the Jamat which then distributes it to the poor and needy.

As mentioned above, which one in the Jamat is the Haq na Saheb? (In according to the Quran and Fatimi texts).
So they (+you) are wrong?


HUMSAFAR:
1. Which of the above to do you practice?
2. If you'll don't accept the interpretation of the Daim ul Islam about giving it to the LEADER of the time, then what is the "correct" Proggy definition about giving Zakaat?
Last edited by Adam on Mon Jul 23, 2012 3:15 am, edited 2 times in total.

MurtazaVds
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#27

Unread post by MurtazaVds » Mon Jul 23, 2012 3:09 am

Adam bhai there is saying which suite with these proggie
"History repeat itself"

Na to ye pehle jawab de paye or na hi aaj inke pass answer hai

let me repeat question once again
WHO DO THE PROGGIES GIVE ZAKA TO?

aliabbas_aa
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#28

Unread post by aliabbas_aa » Mon Jul 23, 2012 3:34 am

Prove first that your dai is haq na saheb

mnoorani
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#29

Unread post by mnoorani » Mon Jul 23, 2012 3:58 am

aliabbas_aa wrote:why do u testify laailaha illallah muhammed rasullullah? have u seen Allah or Muhammed(s)?

I have read Quran and Quran has convinced me the truthfulness of Islam and falsehood of shiism
Does the holy Quraan allow the following? You have read it. So why did the Salafi Masters in Saudi aloow this?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... uwait.html

MurtazaVds
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Re: Who do the Proggies give Zakat to?

#30

Unread post by MurtazaVds » Mon Jul 23, 2012 4:24 am

aliabbas_aa wrote:Prove first that your dai is haq na saheb
ALERT ALERT ALERT
TOPIC DIVERSION TOPIC DIVERSION

ALERT ALERT ALERT
CAUTION A VIRUS (FITNATI) HAS BEEN DETECTED IN A TOPIC
Last edited by MurtazaVds on Mon Jul 23, 2012 4:30 am, edited 1 time in total.