Bohra SMS Duniya

The one and only free public forum for Bohras. The focus of this forum is the reform movement, the Dawoodi Bohra faith and, of course, the corrupt priesthood. But the discussion is in no way restricted to the Bohras alone.
AgnosticIndian
Posts: 446
Joined: Sat Feb 08, 2014 6:10 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#931

Unread post by AgnosticIndian » Sat Mar 01, 2014 9:26 am

Latest whatsapp
Illiteracy, Food security, malnutrition, terrorism, health care, security, hunger, poverty alleviation etc etc,,,, so many problems.. The entire world is fighting. However, we the Dawoodi Bohras residing in all parts of the world are completely free from all these ills of society. Spread this message to as many people as possible and let the world know, what it means to be a Dawoodi Bohra...
In the larger context one will agree but when narrowed down,

1) Illiteracy- We have padha likha jahils who can't see through the game of powers to be.
2) Food security/malnourishment - Aka thali I guess. The taste sucks but then we have to eat saying Khuda nu Shukr not everywhere is the meal complete. In many areas its only complementary to what you make in your house.
3) terrorism- well agree that our community is not into this but I will not absolve our community of radical thoughts or more generally narrow minded thoughts. The so called progressives suddenly become radical when it comes to Hindus as I've seen many times in posts about Ramdev etc.
But in a different aspect, the community is terrorized from within by Aamils right up the power chain.

4) Healthcare? I wider what that person had in mind. We have no health care in our community. We are asked to not even take health insurance. They say keep Narul Makam to keep illness away. Still you fall ill. They say illness is gods way of curing your sins. Then again keep Nazrul Makam for shifa but you have to go show a doctor who will take his fees. If its serious in nature, you have to foot the hospital bill. So that's that.

5) security? I don't know if we are getting free security. Again its Nazrul Makam that's to protect you.

6) hunger,poverty? One had to go out and look at those who are hand to mouth.

We Bohris live in a self made bobble.

james
Posts: 586
Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:06 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#932

Unread post by james » Sat Mar 01, 2014 9:57 am

AgnosticIndian wrote: 4) We are asked to not even take health insurance.
Islam commands insurance is haram . Why would an Islamic sect go against the tenets of Islam ? It would lunacy to suggest otherwise. A basic read up on Islam would help you a lot.

AgnosticIndian
Posts: 446
Joined: Sat Feb 08, 2014 6:10 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#933

Unread post by AgnosticIndian » Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:07 am

james wrote:
AgnosticIndian wrote: 4) We are asked to not even take health insurance.
Islam commands insurance is haram . Why would an Islamic sect go against the tenets of Islam ? It would lunacy to suggest otherwise. A basic read up on Islam would help you a lot.
Its funny from all the points you picked out only this point but not others.

If I call it Medicare & not medical insurance will it become Islamic?

james
Posts: 586
Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:06 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#934

Unread post by james » Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:28 am

Its funny from all the points you picked out only this point but not others.
You expressed a lot of personal opinions ( taste sucks, padha likha jahil , terrorism of Aamils ) in your post which is not topic of debate for me . To each their own . But when you attribute halal to haram as decreed by Islam , then it becomes a fair grounds for debate . Again , you may express your personal opinion that you see no harm in insurance.I don't really don't hold much weight to your personal opinions.
If I call it Medicare & not medical insurance will it become Islamic?
It is still UnIslamic according to Dawoodi Bohra Doctrine .

faalse_ka_faasla
Posts: 36
Joined: Mon Jan 06, 2014 5:28 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#935

Unread post by faalse_ka_faasla » Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:40 am


think
Posts: 1838
Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2011 10:15 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#936

Unread post by think » Sat Mar 01, 2014 2:10 pm

charter a plane go from bombay to karachi to najaf. pray morning prayers in bombay, afternoon prayers in karachi and evening prayers in najaf. this is what you get. Moula tu malaj che. su eni nirali shan. su mojezo thaio.

Bohra spring
Posts: 1309
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2012 8:37 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#937

Unread post by Bohra spring » Sat Mar 01, 2014 2:51 pm

james wrote:
Its funny from all the points you picked out only this point but not others.
You expressed a lot of personal opinions ( taste sucks, padha likha jahil , terrorism of Aamils ) in your post which is not topic of debate for me . To each their own . But when you attribute halal to haram as decreed by Islam , then it becomes a fair grounds for debate . Again , you may express your personal opinion that you see no harm in insurance.I don't really don't hold much weight to your personal opinions.
If I call it Medicare & not medical insurance will it become Islamic?
It is still UnIslamic according to Dawoodi Bohra Doctrine .
Jimmy boy people like you have the least economic knowledge and make ad hoc comments throw a few words like doctrine and haram to make the point and just because it is something your type of people don't understand you should stay out of it. It is pity that you pool money with kardhan for petty events but basic health is not something your SMS can pool regular money to help the thousands who live in regions where the government does not provide accessible quality health, that excludes the expensive not free saifee hospital. You would be a better abde if you went and gave this idea to kothar and if they implemented it reformist will not get in the way even if it was idea as long as poor Bohras benefited.

Is it not a pity too SMB was kept going until a 100 by the best medical facilities and a doctor by his side full time while this is not a dream of thousands of Bohras whose life expectancy is less than 80.
Insurance is the equitable transfer of the risk of a loss, from one entity to another in exchange for payment. It is a form of risk management primarily used to hedge against the risk of a contingent, uncertain loss.
Life insurance where the beneficiary is not the person or is a way of making money on death is questionable, While health insurance is something different
Health insurance is insurance against the risk of incurring medical expenses among individuals. By estimating the overall risk of health care and health system expenses, among a targeted group, an insurer can develop a routine finance structure, such as a monthly premium or payroll tax, to ensure that money is available to pay for the health care benefits specified in the insurance agreement.

james
Posts: 586
Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:06 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#938

Unread post by james » Sun Mar 02, 2014 12:03 am

Bohra spring wrote:
Jimmy boy people like you have the least economic knowledge and make ad hoc comments throw a few words like doctrine and haram to make the point and just because it is something your type of people don't understand you should stay out of it. It is pity that you pool money with kardhan for petty events but basic health is not something your SMS can pool regular money to help the thousands who live in regions where the government does not provide accessible quality health, that excludes the expensive not free saifee hospital. You would be a better abde if you went and gave this idea to kothar and if they implemented it reformist will not get in the way even if it was idea as long as poor Bohras benefited.

Is it not a pity too SMB was kept going until a 100 by the best medical facilities and a doctor by his side full time while this is not a dream of thousands of Bohras whose life expectancy is less than 80.
Insurance is the equitable transfer of the risk of a loss, from one entity to another in exchange for payment. It is a form of risk management primarily used to hedge against the risk of a contingent, uncertain loss.
Life insurance where the beneficiary is not the person or is a way of making money on death is questionable, While health insurance is something different
Health insurance is insurance against the risk of incurring medical expenses among individuals. By estimating the overall risk of health care and health system expenses, among a targeted group, an insurer can develop a routine finance structure, such as a monthly premium or payroll tax, to ensure that money is available to pay for the health care benefits specified in the insurance agreement.
Being a prolific Arm Chair Warrior , you could research into the ruling of Health Insurance by various fiqh of Islam . Islam has deemed it haram . If you believe you know better than Allah Ta'ala ( Nozubillah ) , then you can do what pleases your intellect . This could be a new idea for a petition ! :mrgreen:

SBM
Posts: 6352
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#939

Unread post by SBM » Sun Mar 02, 2014 1:32 am

If you believe you know better than Allah Ta'ala ( Nozubillah ) , then you can do what pleases your intellect . This could be a new idea for a petition ! :mrgreen:
But you JAMES and your abdes do think that Dai is Ilah Ul Ardh and Bolta Qura (Nozubillah) then can you say about doing tawaaf of Raudat Tahera is equivalent of doing Tawaat of Kaabah (Nozubilaha) What do you say about doing Ziyaraat of of STS and SMB is equivalent of doing Hajj (Nozubillah) so what do you say JAMES do you believe doing tawaaf of Raudat Tahera and doing Ziyaraat of STS and SMB is equal to Hajj :mrgreen: (Nozubillaha)

james
Posts: 586
Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:06 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#940

Unread post by james » Sun Mar 02, 2014 2:09 am

SBM wrote: But you JAMES and your abdes do think that Dai is Ilah Ul Ardh and Bolta Qura (Nozubillah)
What is Ilah Ul Ardh ?

Bolta Quran belief stems right from Asadullah Ali ibn Abi Talib AS . Amirul Mumineen AS placed Quran e Majeed on his head and called upon it to speak three times . After that , he referred to Quran as " Quran e Samit " ( Silent Kitab ) and himself as " Quran e Natiq " ( Kitab with a voice : Bolta Kitab ) . The blessed Panjatan AS and his noble progeny of Imams and during the period of Satr their faithful Duat Mutlaqeen are the Voiced Kitab and various surahs . It is rightly said Imam uz Zaman AS is the Quran e Natiq and his Dai Zaman TUS is a surah of Quran .
then can you say about doing tawaaf of Raudat Tahera is equivalent of doing Tawaat of Kaabah (Nozubilaha) What do you say about doing Ziyaraat of of STS and SMB is equivalent of doing Hajj (Nozubillah) so what do you say JAMES do you believe doing tawaaf of Raudat Tahera and doing Ziyaraat of STS and SMB is equal to Hajj :mrgreen: (Nozubillaha)
It is said the sawab of doing the zyarat of Syedi us Shohada Imam Husain AS equals to 100 Haj and 100 Umrah. That doesn't mean one shouldn't go towards Haj and Umrah if one has the means. It is said praying in Quba Masjid ( Oldest Masjid ) is equal to performing one Umrah . This hadith is agreed upon by most of the fiqh of Islam . That doesn't mean the Muslims have stopped performing Umrah and just flock to Quba Masjid and be done with it .It is said by Rasulullah SAW that praying in his masjid ( Masjid e Nabawi ) is better than one thousand prayers offered elsewhere except Baitullah. That would be around 200 days worth of prayers . That doesn't mean that the people of Madina just go twice to Masjid e Nabawi and fulfill their obligation of prayers for a year's worth .

It is said that going to the Hazrat of Imam AS and Dai RA is no less than Haj itself.That doesn't mean people stop going for Haj . The comparison is show the importance in going towards the Imam uz Zaman AS or his Duat Mutlaqeen .

wise_guy
Posts: 700
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 5:52 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#941

Unread post by wise_guy » Sun Mar 02, 2014 5:18 am

faalse_ka_faasla wrote:[img]http://s22.postimg.org/4rwgejbot/IMG_20 ... WA0016.jpg[/img]

Latest business idea

this is similar to the PDS or commonly known as Ration shops run by Indian govt. These stores sell subsidized foodgrains.... But most of which is sold in black market to other shops for a profit by the owner of the ration shop as the govt supplies the grains at subsidized rate.. Here also in the case, the middlemen will make merry again

Fatema MN
Posts: 61
Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2014 1:26 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#942

Unread post by Fatema MN » Sun Mar 02, 2014 6:27 am

James said: "The blessed Panjatan AS and his noble progeny of Imams and during the period of Satr their faithful Duat Mutlaqeen are the Voiced Kitab and various surahs . It is rightly said Imam uz Zaman AS is the Quran e Natiq and his Dai Zaman TUS is a surah of Quran . "

James bhai, do you really believe that Mufaddal bhaisab is 'bolta Quran' or even one surah of the Quran???? His bayaans over the past 3 years have been quite disappointing. He only keeps reading the bayaans of past duats and has little or no content of his own. If he tries to convey a message which is not scripted, he fails miserably. He is unable to convey any idea/thought clearly. He leaves sentences midway. If the masjid goes silent after hearing a shocking bayaan, he says "tamare bhari to nathi lagu?". If nothing else works, he falls back on the glory of Burhanuddin Aqa! If the videos hadn't been taken off, I would be able to provide proof of all my observations. If you have access, please watch his bayaans again. Watch the recording of his first waaz after the wafat of burhanuddin moula and tell me honestly, do you think he is 'bolta quran'?

true_bohra
Posts: 719
Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2013 4:19 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#943

Unread post by true_bohra » Sun Mar 02, 2014 9:52 am

@fatema mn:

As you are a kq abde....can you tell that his waaz has that strong content.

Syedna Mufaddal Saifuddin atleast glorifies the Dai in his bayaan rather than self glorification done by KQ on all events.

SBM
Posts: 6352
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#944

Unread post by SBM » Sun Mar 02, 2014 9:59 am

true_bohra wrote:@fatema mn:

As you are a kq abde....can you tell that his waaz has that strong content.

Syedna Mufaddal Saifuddin atleast glorifies the Dai in his bayaan rather than self glorification done by KQ on all events.
I will let Sr Fatema MN reply but my observation to your post. She asked a very simple question about SMB's bayan why did you have to bring someone else. Instead of answering her question why you abdes have to always bring and compare with others. Just answer to her questions simple :roll:

james
Posts: 586
Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:06 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#945

Unread post by james » Sun Mar 02, 2014 11:04 am

Fatema MN wrote:James said: "The blessed Panjatan AS and his noble progeny of Imams and during the period of Satr their faithful Duat Mutlaqeen are the Voiced Kitab and various surahs . It is rightly said Imam uz Zaman AS is the Quran e Natiq and his Dai Zaman TUS is a surah of Quran . "

James bhai, do you really believe that Mufaddal bhaisab is 'bolta Quran' or even one surah of the Quran???? His bayaans over the past 3 years have been quite disappointing. He only keeps reading the bayaans of past duats and has little or no content of his own. If he tries to convey a message which is not scripted, he fails miserably. He is unable to convey any idea/thought clearly. He leaves sentences midway. If the masjid goes silent after hearing a shocking bayaan, he says "tamare bhari to nathi lagu?". If nothing else works, he falls back on the glory of Burhanuddin Aqa! If the videos hadn't been taken off, I would be able to provide proof of all my observations. If you have access, please watch his bayaans again. Watch the recording of his first waaz after the wafat of burhanuddin moula and tell me honestly, do you think he is 'bolta quran'?
Yes , very much so. It is his ehsan ( benevolence ) that he delivers sermons from the awraq of past Duat Mutlaqeen RA , It says a lot about you that you find the sermons of past Duat Mutlaqeen RA " disappointing " .

Haqq_Prevails
Posts: 73
Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2014 5:51 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#946

Unread post by Haqq_Prevails » Sun Mar 02, 2014 11:13 am

James,

If SMS didnt have access to awraq of past Duat mutlaqeen, he would have nothing, because he certainly does not have any taeed flowing to him. The lack of it is quite evident. See if he can complete 5 sentences of his own without reading. Compare that to How SMB (before old age set in) and SKQ can go on for hours without referring to any text in front of them!

MMH
Posts: 312
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 2:22 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#947

Unread post by MMH » Sun Mar 02, 2014 1:05 pm

Haqq_Prevails wrote:James,

If SMS didnt have access to awraq of past Duat mutlaqeen, he would have nothing, because he certainly does not have any taeed flowing to him. The lack of it is quite evident. See if he can complete 5 sentences of his own without reading. Compare that to How SMB (before old age set in) and SKQ can go on for hours without referring to any text in front of them!

To add to this James bhai...do you recall that bayan of SMS where he forgot the dua prayed after dafil aafat and let that pass as a trivial thing to forget about... how do you you justify that? The truth is that there is an expectation is that he has to be at par if not greater in the amount of knowledge he has to impart because of a standard we have set with Aqa Moula and he does not even come close to that level!!!! I had heard as a child that Aqa Moula (RA) used to research and refer to various kitaabs for the material that he wanted to speak about during his discourses but there is a sheer lack of content in the information given by SMS....

Haqq_Prevails
Posts: 73
Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2014 5:51 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#948

Unread post by Haqq_Prevails » Sun Mar 02, 2014 1:16 pm

james wrote:
Fatema MN wrote:James said: "The blessed Panjatan AS and his noble progeny of Imams and during the period of Satr their faithful Duat Mutlaqeen are the Voiced Kitab and various surahs . It is rightly said Imam uz Zaman AS is the Quran e Natiq and his Dai Zaman TUS is a surah of Quran . "

James bhai, do you really believe that Mufaddal bhaisab is 'bolta Quran' or even one surah of the Quran???? His bayaans over the past 3 years have been quite disappointing. He only keeps reading the bayaans of past duats and has little or no content of his own. If he tries to convey a message which is not scripted, he fails miserably. He is unable to convey any idea/thought clearly. He leaves sentences midway. If the masjid goes silent after hearing a shocking bayaan, he says "tamare bhari to nathi lagu?". If nothing else works, he falls back on the glory of Burhanuddin Aqa! If the videos hadn't been taken off, I would be able to provide proof of all my observations. If you have access, please watch his bayaans again. Watch the recording of his first waaz after the wafat of burhanuddin moula and tell me honestly, do you think he is 'bolta quran'?
Yes , very much so. It is his ehsan ( benevolence ) that he delivers sermons from the awraq of past Duat Mutlaqeen RA , It says a lot about you that you find the sermons of past Duat Mutlaqeen RA " disappointing " .
James,
Do not twist sister Fatema's words, she is not saying she is disappointed in the bayans of the past duat's, but specifically in the bayans of MS. Lack of content in his own words and very poor delivery is very glaring. He uses SMB's glory as a prop, to compensate for his own deficiencies thus showing the lack of sincerity in his bayans.

salsabeel
Posts: 51
Joined: Thu Jan 30, 2014 2:38 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#949

Unread post by salsabeel » Sun Mar 02, 2014 3:02 pm

james wrote:
Fatema MN wrote:James said: "The blessed Panjatan AS and his noble progeny of Imams and during the period of Satr their faithful Duat Mutlaqeen are the Voiced Kitab and various surahs . It is rightly said Imam uz Zaman AS is the Quran e Natiq and his Dai Zaman TUS is a surah of Quran . "

James bhai, do you really believe that Mufaddal bhaisab is 'bolta Quran' or even one surah of the Quran???? His bayaans over the past 3 years have been quite disappointing. He only keeps reading the bayaans of past duats and has little or no content of his own. If he tries to convey a message which is not scripted, he fails miserably. He is unable to convey any idea/thought clearly. He leaves sentences midway. If the masjid goes silent after hearing a shocking bayaan, he says "tamare bhari to nathi lagu?". If nothing else works, he falls back on the glory of Burhanuddin Aqa! If the videos hadn't been taken off, I would be able to provide proof of all my observations. If you have access, please watch his bayaans again. Watch the recording of his first waaz after the wafat of burhanuddin moula and tell me honestly, do you think he is 'bolta quran'?
Yes , very much so. It is his ehsan ( benevolence ) that he delivers sermons from the awraq of past Duat Mutlaqeen RA , It says a lot about you that you find the sermons of past Duat Mutlaqeen RA " disappointing " .
You miss the point completely james, as usual.
it is only from the awraq that he makes sense at times, and by the way, we know who twists the words of duat mutlaqeen and rewrites those awraaq for him. whenever he attempts to say something on his own thats when he blunders big time.

fulan ibn fulan
Posts: 51
Joined: Sun Feb 09, 2014 8:39 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#950

Unread post by fulan ibn fulan » Sun Mar 02, 2014 3:39 pm

I remember posting something about double standards on another thread before as well but I will do it again seeing as it has worn of quite quick.
Do you agree that certain things are Zahir and others Batin which means it is knowledge which is unavailable to the general public without raza of raza na saheb?
If you do then I think it is safe to say that over the 102 glorious years of Syedna Taher Saifuddin (RA) and Syedna Mohammed Burhannudin (RA) that most if not all of the zahir zikars will have been done at some point in the life of every mumin over the age of 25 - 30. If that is the case then obviously Muffadal Maula (TUS) will be quoting bayans done by both previous dais and so therefore if he was to take credit for it I am sure you people would turn around and say that these bayaans have already been done before why is He (TUS) taking credit for it. Why doesn't every bhaisaab do a different shahadat? If you remember Imam uz Zamaans milad, the shahadat done on that day was one which was used by another Dai, the backbone was the same as the one we hear today but certain things were missing while others were there which we hadn't heard, over time certain zikars are done in different ways. The shahadat of Imam Hussain we hear today is Burhannudin Maula's and if you hear shahadat done by a Mumin anywhere it is that one. It is Burhanuddin Maula's waaz, not ours, but the only difference is that we just don't say it is his anymore, it is not as though we are taking credit for saying it are we?
Secondly, there were some zikars which my dad (50+ years) had never heard before which muffadal maula did; the one about the Shaheed before Imam Hussain who, like Hazrat Abbas lost both his arms defending Imam Hussain, and also the zikar of imam Hussain talking to the ghoro, but what happened when the latter of the two was said? You people laughed and questioned it and I can only assume the response would be the same with other zikars too.
Thirdly, Burhanuddin maula (RA) has just passed away, Maula, in my mind, is just trying to honour his father and grand father and what they have given to the community. It is not because he doesn't himself have knowledge, it is just about respect. Allowing people to grieve properly. If he completely stops talking about his father, mumineen will start to forget and that isn't what he wants and isn't what Burhannudin Maula wanted. If you remember His (RA)'s waaz, 'mumineen mane koi waar na bhuljo, kai bhi mushkil awe to mane yaad karjo, me zaroor awis ane me na awu, to me Imam no Dai nathi' Muffadal Muala (TUS) merely wants to keep his fathers memory alive. Something you could easily see if you took the hatered out of your eyes.

Of topic: Can someone who actually knows what the are talking about, perhaps ghulam Mohammed, actually tell me why the progressives left or direct me to an article which says that, because I am really confused, from some people I get the impression they want to come back but on their own terms, while from others I get the impression they just want to bring the Dawoodi Bohra community down.
Thanks

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#951

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Sun Mar 02, 2014 4:06 pm

fulan ibn fulan wrote: Of topic: Can someone who actually knows what the are talking about, perhaps ghulam Mohammed, actually tell me why the progressives left or direct me to an article which says that, because I am really confused, from some people I get the impression they want to come back but on their own terms, while from others I get the impression they just want to bring the Dawoodi Bohra community down.
Thanks
Br Humsafar or Bro Insaf would be a better person to answer your query as Iam not an official member of reformist group but from whatever I know, I can safely say that reformists would come back but on certain terms and conditions and in no way do they want the community to come down.

fulan ibn fulan
Posts: 51
Joined: Sun Feb 09, 2014 8:39 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#952

Unread post by fulan ibn fulan » Sun Mar 02, 2014 4:20 pm

I thought that too, but like I said, from some, not most, I just get that impression. And I know reformists in my city who were anti-Maula before any of this happened but I want to know for sure what it is they stand for and why they split initially

M Taha
Posts: 372
Joined: Fri Feb 07, 2014 10:56 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#953

Unread post by M Taha » Sun Mar 02, 2014 5:35 pm

Fatema MN wrote:James said: "The blessed Panjatan AS and his noble progeny of Imams and during the period of Satr their faithful Duat Mutlaqeen are the Voiced Kitab and various surahs . It is rightly said Imam uz Zaman AS is the Quran e Natiq and his Dai Zaman TUS is a surah of Quran . "

James bhai, do you really believe that Mufaddal bhaisab is 'bolta Quran' or even one surah of the Quran???? His bayaans over the past 3 years have been quite disappointing. He only keeps reading the bayaans of past duats and has little or no content of his own. If he tries to convey a message which is not scripted, he fails miserably. He is unable to convey any idea/thought clearly. He leaves sentences midway. If the masjid goes silent after hearing a shocking bayaan, he says "tamare bhari to nathi lagu?". If nothing else works, he falls back on the glory of Burhanuddin Aqa! If the videos hadn't been taken off, I would be able to provide proof of all my observations. If you have access, please watch his bayaans again. Watch the recording of his first waaz after the wafat of burhanuddin moula and tell me honestly, do you think he is 'bolta quran'?
Fatema ben,

it is useless to expect any honesty from james or his alike, it is clear they are here with agenda and spreading lies, and not normal people who comes to know and find truth, no matter how many dalil you bring up, either they will try to manipulate it or just simply run away and start talking on some other thread.

they are kothari installed puppets.

bohri
Posts: 185
Joined: Tue Oct 13, 2009 3:12 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#954

Unread post by bohri » Sun Mar 02, 2014 9:48 pm

ghulam muhammed wrote:
fulan ibn fulan wrote: Of topic: Can someone who actually knows what the are talking about, perhaps ghulam Mohammed, actually tell me why the progressives left or direct me to an article which says that, because I am really confused, from some people I get the impression they want to come back but on their own terms, while from others I get the impression they just want to bring the Dawoodi Bohra community down.
Thanks
Br Humsafar or Bro Insaf would be a better person to answer your query as Iam not an official member of reformist group but from whatever I know, I can safely say that reformists would come back but on certain terms and conditions and in no way do they want the community to come down.
While I don't speak for all reformists, I can say that there is almost nothing in the current Bohra community that would attract me to rejoin. I live in a country with a thriving close knit Reformist community, that meets all our spiritual and social needs. We observe all the key Islamic and Bohra events, organized by a committee, elected by the jamaat. Apart from the dues to meet our operating costs, no one is obliged to pay more. Most of us look forward to attending majlis and other celebrations, to learn more about our religion, socialise with our brothers and sisters and being true Bohra, the good food!

Why in the world would we give up this wonderful world we have built for 'abde-hood' ?

As for wanting to bring the 'community down', we would like the Bohras to be freed from the greedy grip of the Kothar and return it to the glorious days, when Bohras were free to run their local communities as well as well as their personal affairs such as clothes, food and money without interference from the priestly class. Of course the Dai and Kothar has its place. We respect the seat of the Dai as a spiritual guide, not as a dictator. As for the Kothar, we have no interest in financing their lavish lifestyles, but recognize that some (reasonable) administrative organization must exist and be supported. How would this be bringing the community down?

Again, this is an individual opinion.

M Taha
Posts: 372
Joined: Fri Feb 07, 2014 10:56 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#955

Unread post by M Taha » Sun Mar 02, 2014 10:48 pm

joining reformists will be the last thing a muslim should do, if I am not wrong few years back there was a so called "majlis" in reformist camp, and it was in london, dance music and girls in jeans and guys in suits. wow, now that was a new defination of ISLAMIC gathering I ever witnessed.

actually it was a match making program I guess.

Haqq_Prevails
Posts: 73
Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2014 5:51 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#956

Unread post by Haqq_Prevails » Sun Mar 02, 2014 11:32 pm

Regarding last few posts on the quality or lack there of in the MS bayans.

1) No objection to recollecting the glory of SMB, and singing his praise, even SKQ does it, but he does it with so much sincerity and grace where as, it looks like a tamasha and if I may say again, a prop when MS does the same. The difference is very evident to a few of us who watch bayans from both sides.

2) Fulan_ibn_Fulan raised a point about how all zikars are in some form repeated in part or whole and they can all be traced back (most of them) to earlier duats. Very true, but the point I and Fatema ben were making earlier is the inability of MS to create an entire context of the bayan on his own unless he is reading from a script word for word. As soon as he waivers from the script he finds it difficult to compose a complete sentence or express his thought in a comprehensible manner. Hence he needs to rely on all sorts of props like chants of "Mola Mola Muffy Mola" from the crowd or referring to SMB every now and then even where not relevant in the context.

Honestly, there is no comparison between MS and SKQ in terms of Ilm of Ale Mohammed, MS will struggle all his life, but he won't ever stand a chance against the eloquence and grace of SKQ.

yuzarsif
Posts: 157
Joined: Wed Nov 20, 2013 12:40 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#957

Unread post by yuzarsif » Mon Mar 03, 2014 12:54 am

Fatema MN wrote:James said: "The blessed Panjatan AS and his noble progeny of Imams and during the period of Satr their faithful Duat Mutlaqeen are the Voiced Kitab and various surahs . It is rightly said Imam uz Zaman AS is the Quran e Natiq and his Dai Zaman TUS is a surah of Quran . "

James bhai, do you really believe that Mufaddal bhaisab is 'bolta Quran' or even one surah of the Quran???? His bayaans over the past 3 years have been quite disappointing. He only keeps reading the bayaans of past duats and has little or no content of his own. If he tries to convey a message which is not scripted, he fails miserably. He is unable to convey any idea/thought clearly. He leaves sentences midway. If the masjid goes silent after hearing a shocking bayaan, he says "tamare bhari to nathi lagu?". If nothing else works, he falls back on the glory of Burhanuddin Aqa! If the videos hadn't been taken off, I would be able to provide proof of all my observations. If you have access, please watch his bayaans again. Watch the recording of his first waaz after the wafat of burhanuddin moula and tell me honestly, do you think he is 'bolta quran'?
He is Chillata and Confused Quran...

james
Posts: 586
Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:06 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#958

Unread post by james » Mon Mar 03, 2014 1:30 pm

MMH wrote:
Haqq_Prevails wrote:James,

If SMS didnt have access to awraq of past Duat mutlaqeen, he would have nothing, because he certainly does not have any taeed flowing to him. The lack of it is quite evident. See if he can complete 5 sentences of his own without reading. Compare that to How SMB (before old age set in) and SKQ can go on for hours without referring to any text in front of them!

To add to this James bhai...do you recall that bayan of SMS where he forgot the dua prayed after dafil aafat and let that pass as a trivial thing to forget about... how do you you justify that? The truth is that there is an expectation is that he has to be at par if not greater in the amount of knowledge he has to impart because of a standard we have set with Aqa Moula and he does not even come close to that level!!!! I had heard as a child that Aqa Moula (RA) used to research and refer to various kitaabs for the material that he wanted to speak about during his discourses but there is a sheer lack of content in the information given by SMS....
Let's educate you then . Pick up an Iqtebasat of this year or last year,Go through it and get back to me again. :D

Haqq_Prevails
Posts: 73
Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2014 5:51 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#959

Unread post by Haqq_Prevails » Mon Mar 03, 2014 1:58 pm

If anyone needs to be educated, it you bro!
Think with an open mind, you will see the difference. We are listening to both sides and it is quite clear to us where Haqq is and where money is!

way2go
Posts: 181
Joined: Thu Feb 06, 2014 10:30 pm

Seriously!!! Is this the 'ajab shaan'!

#960

Unread post by way2go » Mon Mar 03, 2014 2:45 pm

Latest sms just received...

BUSHRA : BUSHRA : BUSHRA

Our Aka Moula Syedna Mufaddal has purchased a property in Colombo @ Sri Lankan Rs.170 crores
( US$13 million) for his personal comfort. House is located on the Beach Road which is the most upmarket locality in Colombo. Current market value of the house was S. Lankan Rs 120 crores and the owner of the house was not willing to sell but our Aka Moula ( su ehni ajab Shaan chhe) offered 50 crores more and acquired this 1.5 acres property.

This is a very big Mozizaa and Shaanaat of our Syedna Mufaddal.

Mufaddal Moula Zindabad.
This deal was done when Mufaddal Moula was in Colombo just when Burhanuddin Moula expired!