bohras, please post all examples of the kothar's evils

[Al Zulfiqar]

let us use this thread to post all the facts and file all the reports from around the world which show how evil, mean and corrupt the syedna, his entire family and the ruling establishment is, instead of starting new threads everytime someone has something new to report.

to start the ball rolling, i am re-posting the following which i had posted on another thread yesterday. please let me request everyone not to get sidetracked by useless debates and be diverted by the abde-seydna's who have nothing else to do except come here to heckle, post nonsense and demonstrate their mental retardation. non-bohras are welcome only if they wish to add any reports, but not to use this topic to engage in their usual bigotry. esp. those 2 red-assed, nit-picking, teeth-grinding monkeys whose sole purpose in life is to deposit dollops of hate-filled garbage on every possible place they can find.

in the whole of africa, there used to be only one and sole ziyarat which naturally became the focal point for all bohras throughout east africa and beyond during the annual urus. this was of syedi ismailji bhaisaheb in kismayu, somalia. the actual little town of about 50,000 in the 60's consisted of about 75 bohra houses at its peak. over the years most of them left elsewhere in search of better prospects until when finally somalia disintegrated in 1990, only 18 houses remained.

the upkeep of the kabrastan, masjid and the feeding, housing and all other expenses of the hundreds of pilgrims who attended was borne by the karimbhai family, the only wealthy family in somalia. there used to be a functioning amil in kismayu for many years, but when the numbers dwindled, he had to be sent back as it became no longer viable to bear his expenses. the bohras in kismayu were generally so poor that many of them survived by selling ice made in gas run fridges and/or corn breads made at home. there was no electricity there until 1988! some few families had small groceries and gen. stores, and could hardly afford one good meal. many of them had never travelled outside of their own town in their entire life! the karimbhai family of mogadishu and a few benefactors from kenya and tanzania helped the majority of poor bohras by sending money, providing gas fridges, clothes, and giving them goods to sell without any pre-conditions.

after the electricity came, suddenly after many years, a kothars rep. was sent from kenya to collect the dues from all the bohras of somalia, numbering about 75-80 souls in total. after fleecing the karimbhais, the fellow wanted to go to kismayu, (of course at their expense) to loot the very poor kismayu bohras. he was advised about their condition, but he went and inspite of their extreme poverty, by threats and force, still collected some sums! his argument was where is the vajebaat, zakaat, sabeel etc which is to be gifted to the syedna, of all these past years? by giving it they will earn sawaab and will prosper with the dua of the dai...etc blah blah blah. many of them borrowed money or sold possessions to pay this man.

when i went there soon after, i was shocked to see (with my medical background) that there were about 17-18 old people who were in serious need of expert medical help, but there were hardly any doctors in this god-forsaken place and they had no money anyways. simple things like cataracts could not be removed, some were suffering from dementia and extreme depression due to their isolation, there were atleast 3-4 suspected cases (could not be confirmed because of a lack of resources) of mouth cancer because of their severe habit of chewing supari and paan parag, most of them were malnourished and lacked good education, they could not afford spectacles, hearing aids and dentures.. things we take for granted in our world. their sizes, numbers or needs could not be ascertained so ready made medical specs and hearing aids were sent and they used them as best they could and staggered about like blind men.

all this brought tears to my eyes. how could this bandit have not seen it when he stayed there for a week? the kothar are the type of people who will snatch milk from the mouths of babies! they are so evil. and after looting them this rascal rubbed further salt into their wounds by getting the kothar to issue a farman banning the ziyarat in kismaayu as bakwaas and withdrawing raza for it! the real reason was never given, but of course, they could not control the income from the galla (which the karimbhais utilised to serve the zawaars) and could not swallow it. besides this villain knew that no one could be posted in such a miserable place to oversee all this. so the solution? ban the ziyarat itself! this was shocking news to all the bohras in east africa in those days, but none had the guts to ask for an explanation!

such is this vile and despicable syedna and his evil establishment.

i have many, many more personal eye-witnessed accounts and reports from around the world, which i will post here as and when i have time, inshallah. I would request people like bro. hussain from KSA and others to re-file all their stories here.

[Admin]

We would also like to make these stories available here so that they are accessible from one page:

http://dawoodi-bohras.com/your_story/

But please make sure that your contribution is "clean", meaning no expletives, foul-language and emotional value judgements. (Al Zulfiqar, if you're willing to "clean up" your story we would really like to use it on this page.)

[Al Zulfiqar]

admin,

thanks for yr offer, but no thanks. besides it is not 'my story'. it is something i witnessed personally.

the fire in my belly motivates me to give back as good as i get. the adjectives i use are a fair depiction of the evil characters and personalities mentioned. when fighting criminals i cannot but resort to describing them in the words which suit them best. besides these are perfectly acceptable words in any modern lexicon. words like vile, despicable, etc are not street language.

[Right]

This is a very heart throbbing incident revelaed by Alzulfiqar Bhai.

The site of Progressive Dawoodi Bohra and especially this forum is really very eye opening and it has shown a true face of the evils of the kothar. For the people like me, who have grown up in Abde environment, though had many questions regarding working of the local Jamaat or their boss kothar, were not able to express views, as parents and other family members would always give illogical answers to the questions, as they themselves are totally brainwashed.

But after coming to this forum and reading the views, information, examples from quran, from some of the learned persons, I have got the strenght to stand against the system.

[guy_sam2005]

az,
where are those people now..alive or not(if not may their souls rest in peace),is the status of bohras in Africa still same...are they still poor malnourished suffering from isolation etc.................

[Smart]

^
Why are you bothered?
Aren't you the apologist of the exploiters, the looters and the inhuman establishment?

[Hades]

Is Mr/Ms/Mrs Al Zulfiqar a " Reformist Bohra " ??


I am surprised to see the Reformist Bohras of this forum do not condemn him when he is calling the " Dai " childish names ..

[guy_sam2005]

actually its not reformist bohras..its anti-syedna bohras....

[Smart]

Is Mr/Ms/Mrs Al Zulfiqar a " Reformist Bohra " ??


I am surprised to see the Reformist Bohras of this forum do not condemn him when he is calling the " Dai " childish names ..

All said and done, he does not indulge in gaali galoch as abdes do. Ridiculing anybody's pretensions is fair game, gaali galoch is not. However, the distinction would leave you cold, because it is your culture and is promoted from the top.

[SBM]

GUY_SAM
when would you find time to answer to all the questions posted by me? Seems like you do have lot of time to post nonsense replies but a very lousy excuse to engage in replying to the questions? A cowardly example of an ABDE same as HN who has been banished by Kothari Goons

[guy_sam2005]

Is Mr/Ms/Mrs Al Zulfiqar a " Reformist Bohra " ??


I am surprised to see the Reformist Bohras of this forum do not condemn him when he is calling the " Dai " childish names ..

All said and done, he does not indulge in gaali galoch as abdes do. Ridiculing anybody's pretensions is fair game, gaali galoch is not. However, the distinction would leave you cold, because it is your culture and is promoted from the top.

ya ya its your site ,watever u guys do is rules,whatever ppl who dont fall in your point of view does is wrong and condemnable.........

[S. Insaf]

Caution: A clear attempt to derail the topic please do not fall in their usual trap.

[master.b00t]

guy_sam2005 Frustration.

[Hades]

GUY_SAM
when would you find time to answer to all the questions posted by me? Seems like you do have lot of time to post nonsense replies but a very lousy excuse to engage in replying to the questions? A cowardly example of an ABDE same as HN who has been banished by Kothari Goons

Just out of curiousity where are these questions ???


And I am surprised you are not shouting on this thread with CAPS LOCK on.... Were you angry at the time you made a post fully in CAPS LOCK in another thread ??

[Hades]

Is Mr/Ms/Mrs Al Zulfiqar a " Reformist Bohra " ??


I am surprised to see the Reformist Bohras of this forum do not condemn him when he is calling the " Dai " childish names ..

All said and done, he does not indulge in gaali galoch as abdes do. Ridiculing anybody's pretensions is fair game, gaali galoch is not. However, the distinction would leave you cold, because it is your culture and is promoted from the top.

Ridiculing anybody's pretensions is fair game according to you ??? Including the Prophets and the Imams ??

[SBM]

Hades
Just out of curiousity where are these questions ???

Why do not you ask Guy_Sam, he knows the question, those questions were posted for him.
The reason I write in Block since Aqa Moula and all other Aamils only read the LARGE fonts, I thought you might be used to that only

[Hades]

Hades
Just out of curiousity where are these questions ???

Why do not you ask Guy_Sam, he knows the question, those questions were posted for him.
The reason I write in Block since Aqa Moula and all other Aamils only read the LARGE fonts, I thought you might be used to that only

It is you who is stalking/following guy_sam in threads which have nothing to do with your questions posted to him on other threads..... It is you who is whinging about guy_sam not answering your questions... so you should provide the link where your questions are posted when someone asks for it... Common decency.....

And your pathetic excuse for typing in Caps Lock is really laughable.... Thanks for a great laugh ... Though don't mind that I am laughing at you ....

[SBM]

^
Hades are you an Abde of Sam-Guy or is SAM-GUY is your MOULA who has given you the authority to speak on his behalf
Or is it Sam Guy is incapable of answering the questions and has asked you to be his Chamcha Which one is it?

[guy_sam2005]

Caution: A clear attempt to derail the topic please do not fall in their usual trap.

and a clear attempt to create topics which has nothing to do with reality............

[guy_sam2005]

guy_sam2005 Frustration.

no...but reality......

[guy_sam2005]

^
Hades are you an Abde of Sam-Guy or is SAM-GUY is your MOULA who has given you the authority to speak on his behalf
Or is it Sam Guy is incapable of answering the questions and has asked you to be his Chamcha Which one is it?

first frustration on moula(tus)...now on his followers..the problem is with u not others....you are trying to look for dirt whre there is one........and if u have a lil bit of working condition mind,you could have figured out the answers for your questions yourself.the only reason you want me 2 answer is you can catch flaws in that and start a new argument..
ok 100 vaat ni 1 vaat...when dont agree why bother at all..worls is a open horizon..follwo any religion u want or make asgar your moula(for namesake)just pray behind him.dont give him any money ............dont kiss his hand or feet..dont call him big names...why bother to change wjere you nt asked for

[Smart]

All said and done, he does not indulge in gaali galoch as abdes do. Ridiculing anybody's pretensions is fair game, gaali galoch is not. However, the distinction would leave you cold, because it is your culture and is promoted from the top.

Ridiculing anybody's pretensions is fair game according to you ??? Including the Prophets and the Imams ??

A typically irrelevant answer to my post. Where have you come across Reformists ridiculing the prophet and Imams. Why are you calling them pretentions? Do you have your master's razaa to do so?

[Human]

Hades,

Shame on you. Did you even read AZ's post? I almost had tears in my eyes. You don't even have good words for those poor people. If you don't want to learn anything from the educated people of truth here, atleast learn some humanity lessons from your brother guy_sam, who atleast showed some sympathy. Doesn't matter if he can't question moula or kothaar about why don't they take a drop from their ocean of wealth and help out the bohras in miserable conditions there.

Let us leave dai, imam, prophet aside. Just as a core of humanity, is it humane to exploit the already poor people who are struggling to survive? I haven't read all the religious books, but the summaries of most if not all religions teaches the principles of humanity. Next time, try to skip the aamil's salaam and give that money to a charity, trust me you'll feel good. Oh then maybe you're an aamil or a bhai saheb yourself, in that case, try to give one of your salaams as charity to African countries, you'll feel good as well. Let me know if you need websites or charitable trust contacts, I have heaps.

guy_sam, its good to see sympathy come out from you. Infact it was the same when we had a discussion about Haiti earthquake, where you said you did your part. But tell me truly, why can't kothaar help out these poor people? About Haiti, you and HN said there are no bohris there and they are voodoo black magic people, okay, agreed. How about the bohris mentioned above in AZ's post? And if they can't help, why are they going to collects more monies from the people who are already in trouble. Please answer.

[guy_sam2005]

human,
i never said haiti is all voodoo n so,and nor do i think its kothar's job to help them out either.nevermind that topic,
there is lot in community to be done..
and i believe az's story to be true too as it might be,but i dont agree that kothar didnt do wats required.and nor do i agree thats the story is completely free from az's spices(where kothar is involved).
today all our people(read as majority) are in pretty good condition in african countries.even in some places where economy is not so favourable.............

[guy_sam2005]

i asked for the status of those people today to az,but didnt get any reply,generally az doesnt leave a chance to pounce on me,then why silence here.......
hope its not 1 more figment of his vast imagination...

[Human]

human,
i never said haiti is all voodoo n so,and nor do i think its kothar's job to help them out either.nevermind that topic,

and i believe az's story to be true too as it might be,but i dont agree that kothar didnt do wats required.and nor do i agree thats the story is completely free from az's spices(where kothar is involved).
today all our people(read as majority) are in pretty good condition in african countries.even in some places where economy is not so favourable.............

guy_sam,
HN said about voodoo, you said that there are no bohris in Haiti.

there is lot in community to be done..

Yes you are correct, a lot needs to happen

but i dont agree that kothar didnt do wats required

Please tell me what did kothaar do if anything at all? As a human, I would think any wealthy institutions donates money to charitable trusts or the needy people. These were bohris too.

today all our people(read as majority) are in pretty good condition in african countries.even in some places where economy is not so favourable

I do not agree at all. Please refer to all the emails going around about help needed for poor bohra families. Maybe you've always been lucky and have never experienced the rough side of life. But many bohras are not so fortunate as you or I and I know a few families personally who are poor and are struggling to keep up with their daily food. They are not exempted from our regular taxes, although they are minimal but the aamil doesn't spare them the salaam and all that. The one specific family I'm referring to is actually helped by other neighbouring bohras with old clothes, etc. But they have stopped sending their son to school at a young age and the younger daughters (x2) never made it to school because of poverty. Mind you, they still pay all the taxes be it minimal and have to do salaam to aamil. Please tell me, is it fair?

[guy_sam2005]

human,
i have experienced poverty first hand........wouldnt like to go in details,see good and bad times are way of life,
every year enough(probably) money is sent to all towns.
i know some people(few) who get these money every year.hefty sum.if utilised wouldnt have to be in the same queue next year,but they dont,so the point is,
one cant be taken out of poverty just by giving him money...and all the religious taxes(salaam,najwa,sabil etc)are considerable provided who is theaamil or even important who from your own town are in the seats.
dont tell me about funds for education and all..everything is done as it is supposed to be...i know people who are studying sponsored by kothar in reputed institutions.

[SBM]

Guy Sam
.i know people who are studying sponsored by kothar in reputed institutions.

Can you provide the names and the institutions (reputed) other than Shezaadas and Shezzadis who have benefited from this
This will definitely changed some minds if true. This is your time to shine and show the positive for Kotharis
Do not repeat that I will find nothing good. I have been on record on this forum about the positive contribution like Rasm-e-Saifee (only thing I disagreed was requirement of Rida and STD in western culture) I also agreed about interest free loan(as long as they are not called Qard-e-Hasanah)

[guy_sam2005]

no i wont give names.i am not here to change any minds...its one of my friend only.and the amount was 1.5lakh rupees.
and no he is not at all influential.his mom made a request to local jumaat,

[SBM]

Guy
You always ask for proofs so whatever you are saying in nothing but a HOAX
Thanks for being an Hypocrite