Fatwa against Syedna

The one and only free public forum for Bohras. The focus of this forum is the reform movement, the Dawoodi Bohra faith and, of course, the corrupt priesthood. But the discussion is in no way restricted to the Bohras alone.
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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by Nafisa » Wed Jun 19, 2013 8:29 am

Ghulam Mohammad Saheb's article is very technical,which discovered Dawoodi Bohra clergy's ugly face. It is better to forward such informative details on various Email groups, so majority of the people should know how tyrants these Mullas are?

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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by zinger » Wed Jun 19, 2013 8:45 am

Nafisa ben, why dont you do the honours?

How about Tehelka?

Im sure you are internet-savvy to figure out how and where to get in touch with them. Nonetheless, let me help you along

you can write to them at editor@tehelka.com

and while you're at it, maybe you would like to lead their sting operation too

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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by hypocritebohra » Wed Jun 19, 2013 12:36 pm

When I was in Saudi Arabia I had asked some of my Yemeni Friends to translate the mad eh" Saaajdah Tujhe Waajib Hal' and sent it to some Saudi National acquaintances who were well connected with the Muttawah network there . There were shocked at this blasphemy especially the verse " Tu Hajj e Haquiui Hain, tu Kaaba e azaam hain". This translation must have gone to the concerned authorities, I seem to have lost that translation but similar strategy can be used by reformists here to have this and other such madehs extolling the non existent virtues of the Dai and sent to the ulema of other Islamic countries , this may cause concern in the Kothar camp and maybe force them to drop all un Islamic practices .

ghulam muhammed
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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Wed Jun 19, 2013 7:03 pm

A couple of years back Kothar had faced a similar scenario in Malaysia wherein their alleged deviant teachings came under scanner. The following are the excerpts of an article which appeared in the daily newspaper of Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia :-

HEADLINE: JAIS investigates Muslim sect
BYLINE: By Annie Freeda Cruez

The Syiah Ismailia Taiyebi sect, or better known as the Dawoodi Bohra, is under investigation by the Selangor Islamic Religious Department (JAIS) following allegations of carrying out deviationist teachings and activities.

It is learnt that the sect, with its headquarters in Klang, has 700 to 1,000 members throughout the country, especially in Kuala Lumpur, Penang, Negri Sembilan, Pahang, Kedah and Johor Baru. The present high priest of the Dawoodi Bohra sect is Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin, the 52nd Dai who is based at the Dawoodi Bohra headquarters in Mumbai, India.

JAIS director Mansur Ramli said it would be sending its enforcement team to the sect's headquarters at 1467 Lorong Pokok Sakat 1, off Jalan Dato Dollah here, to investigate allegations of deviationist teachings and activities.

Firstly, Mansur said, they would investigate why the sect's mosque known as Burhani Mosque which was officially opened by their high priest in 1997, had now changed to Pusat Kebudayaan. "We will also investigate why only the sect members are allowed inside and Muslims are discouraged from using the premises for performing their Friday prayers and daily prayers."

There is a signboard outside the building which reads "Taiyebi Park, Pusat Kebudayaan Untuk Ahli-Ahli sahaja". There have been known cases of Muslims having been turned away from the mosque, even in the month of Ramadan. It is learnt the mosque is not under Jais. Some members of the sect told the New Straits Times that the Friday sermon differed from that preached in other mosques.

To run the affairs of the followers, an amil is sent from India usually but the present amil is Sheikh Mansoor Ismailjee Jannuwalla from Tanzania. The members alleged that the amil collected zakat or tithe and fitra from them annually without issuing receipts, and the money was sent to Mumbai, India. When asked to comment on this, Mansur said it was an offence for the amil to collect zakat as only authorised officers were allowed to do so. "How could he collect zakat and send the money to India. First and foremost, he has violated the country's Islamic law by collecting zakat
without the knowledge of the Islamic Religious Department." Some followers of the sect said initially receipts were issued but this was stopped about four years ago.

Many of the followers also voiced their resentment over forcing the men to grow beards, failing which they would not be allowed into the mosque. "Followers are also required to wear a long jubah like an overcoat," said one.

The followers have requested anonymity for fear they would be blacklisted or looked down by their sect members who are mainly engaged in trade and commerce.

Unlike other Indian immigrants, the Bohras are an independent community who made use of their inherent business acumen to establish successful business ventures in their land of adoption. Their business methods, however, are traditional and they restrict themselves to the textile, stationery and furniture business. Today, however, young Bohras are breaking away from traditional family businesses and have become doctors, lawyers, engineers and teachers.

It is alleged that marriages conducted by the Kadi is not recognised, except those conducted by the Bohras' own priest. The Dawoodi Bohras have three burial grounds in Malaysia - in Klang, Kuala Lumpur and Penang.

Al Zulfiqar
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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by Al Zulfiqar » Thu Jun 20, 2013 10:05 pm

any news on the impact of this report? any steps taken against the community?

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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by zinger » Fri Jun 21, 2013 12:31 am

@ admin - thank you

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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by seeker110 » Fri Jun 21, 2013 11:10 pm

Anyway to get the newspaper to do a follow up. Can any other newspaper pick up on the story. I miss brother Accounty, hope he is well.

Dawood Qutubshah
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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by Dawood Qutubshah » Sat Nov 16, 2013 10:28 am

Further details here...pls use google to translate.
http://ainaaazizan.blogspot.sg/2013/11/ ... ombak.html

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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by ammar » Sat Nov 16, 2013 10:46 am

its written in some funny language..cant understand even after translate..can u tr in english..tq

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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by Dawood Qutubshah » Sat Nov 16, 2013 10:07 pm

Posted on Thursday, November 14, 2013 by ainaa.azizan with No comments
Today I worked as a replacement for one of the officers.. I arrived at the Bukit Aman police headquarters promptly at 6pm at the mosque in Bukit Aman. OPS Bukit Aman today started at 10pm and went to Klang with ROS (Registrar of Society Malaysia). I was with 5 RELA members headed by 1 (REAL Platoon Leader) in ROS van.

OPS mission is to investigate premises Shia Association of Malaysia, two major areas of the Shi'ites in the search are at Gombak and Klang. I went to the area in Klang while the other three members worked in Gombak. I was traveling with members who worked and continue to South Klang police station and straight into Shia Association of Malaysia Premises in Klang.

The establishment in Klang, we raided a mansion that is quite large, and is equipped with various facilities provided. I entered the compound of the mansion and begins with ROS to see the registration of the organization.

Dawoodi Bohra Muslim Association of Selangor-PICTURE

Based on my understanding, I just know there's Shiite Imamiah alone, dressed in black and likes to pat your head and chest as they calls the "yes Hussien yes ali" but the raid in Klang is Group Dawoodi Borha - a stream of Isma ʿ ili Shi ʿ i Islam . Conclusion This group is Dawoodi Bohra (Urdu: داؤدی بوہرہ) is subsect of Isma ʿ Ili shi ʿ i Islam. Dawoodi Bohra belief system trace them back to Yemen, where it evolved from the Fatimid Caliphate and where they were persecuted because of their differences from mainstream Sunni Islam and Zaydi Shia Muslim. Around 1530 CE, Dawat transferred to India. The word Bohra itself is derived from the Gujarati word vehru
("Trade") refers to their traditional profession, while Dawoodi refers to their support for Dawood Bin Qutubshah in 1592 a divided leadership dispute Tayyibi sect, creating the Dawoodi Bohra.

Spiritual leader of the Dawoodi Bohra community is da ʿ i l-Mutlaq (Arabic: داعي المطلق "unlimited Missionary"), currently Mohammed Burhanuddin. Da ʿ i works as a representative of the Imam, who is now in exile.

Dawoodi Bohras have a blend of cultures, including Yemen, Egypt, Africa, and India. In addition to the local languages, the Dawoodi Bohras have their own language called d-Dā'wat Lisānu ("the Dā'wat language") written in Perso-Arabic script and is derived from Urdu, Gujarati and Persian.The Dawoodi Bohra community is known throughout the world for various projects, including philanthropic efforts, hospitals, schools, and the renovation and restoration of the hallmarks of Islam and Shiite Islam. They have, a very small community that consists of tightly knit about one million followers worldwide, with the majority of adherents residing in India. There is also a large community in Karachi, as well as significant diaspora population in Europe, North America, the Far East and East Africa.

Ops conducted at a time when there were only three to five pilgrims who were there, after police and Regestritation documents were checked, the ROS confirmed this association is valid, I found out when eavesdropped on the conversations of ROS to a Customs officer JAIS . We raid the mansion was empty and the owner seems to know there will be arrests and raids in the night. I patrolled the area around the mansion, and one block seems like a dorm or classes were held outside the area of this home.

Two scenery outside home
Dawoodi Bohra Muslim Association of Selangor-picture

I entered the house from the rear, through a very neat kitchen to the main hall which is very large.

Kitchen Division.

I display two columns in the mansion.

I went through every corner of the house, I still remember when in the van and asked the members on duty

"You know Shia?"
'they said – those who tap on head and pat the chest while say "allah allah allah"

Allahu rabbi, apparently they have no understanding of what the Shia is. I then explain my understanding of the terms and Shia faith. Finally they nodded and wondered why they glorify Shia Ali and Hussein and the priest as their faith. They also do not mention Allah on the Day of Ashura festival but celebrate in the manner by hurting themselves especially in malaysia patting the chest and head while singing songs that glorify Ali, Hussein and other priests.

What I can report in this case is simply that there are only two catches for two foreign nationals who do not have valid documents. The members who are working in Gombak, they raided the premises but it was empty as if already knew enforcement will be coming over. This does not mean the operation has failed BUT perhaps our timing was not right. Until after in'syak there were a lot of people in the mansion but on our arrival it was empty suddenly. Where we went wrong, we will correct this situation.

I heard this news from fellow members of the state that Mydin-a powerful indian muslim Compay is financing this organization. To be honest I'm not sure I only just found recently only.
Entering the room there is really big mansion in a section where they stick the hadiths from their history and Imam Hussein,

word "Yes Hussein" hanging on the wall of the mansion.

They were not Hadith Narrated by Abu Huraira but something written in urdu language. I read it but could not understand, Yup I can read Arabic and the meanings but on this one I really did not understand what the wordings meant.

Around the patch information for the benefit of their followers


After finishing this assignment, I understood better what JAIS and the police are doing in addressing the issue of Shiites in Malaysia. Shiites in Malaysia is not a new thing; it appeared after Iranian Revolution era at one time. And it now has expanded; their conflict is a misguided faith and glorifies their Imam/Priest too much even more that the GOD. However, I'm not sure how is Shia Dawoodi Bohra imamiah in Gombak are different than the main Shiite sect. Therefore, I would like to understand this better so that tomorrow if I am asked, hopefully I would be able to answer better with the knowledge I gained.

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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by shehzaada » Fri Apr 11, 2014 9:56 am

Truthseeker wrote:Here is the link :

http://www.alifta.org/Fatawa/FatawaChap ... 1&BookID=7

This link is too old now and is dead any other link to the same fatawa?

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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by shehzaada » Fri Apr 11, 2014 9:56 am

Truthseeker wrote:Here is the link :

http://www.alifta.org/Fatawa/FatawaChap ... 1&BookID=7

This link is too old now and is dead any other link to the same fatawa?

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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by shehzaada » Fri Apr 11, 2014 10:06 am

copied from thread:
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=8319&p=115024&hilit ... wa#p115024
Another 'fatwa' was obtained on 14July 1979 (19 Shaabaan 1399 Hijri) by Sheikh Salehbhai Moosaji of Colombo from the Board of Fatwas of Jaame Azhar, Cairo. It is reproduced below:
Q.l. Does Islam permit a man or woman to worship by prostration anyone whatever his dignity and to kiss his feet?
Islam does not allow any Muslim to perform 'sajdah' (prostration) before anyone other than Allah or to kiss anybody's feet.
Does Islam permit 'baraat' or social ostracism on any Muslim?
A. Islam does not allow any Muslim whatever his social or religious status may be to order any other Muslim to obey his commands blindly. This is in contravention of the commands of Allah. The Prophet said, "No obedience to the created if it means disobedience to Allah."If anyone boycotts a Muslim and calls upon other Muslims to do so, that is to refrain from dealing with him or prevent him from entering a mosque, he commits a great sin.
A. Q.3. Does Islam permit the high priest to take 'meesaaq' or oath of allegiance from believers in his own name?
B. A. No human being has the right to take such an undertaking from anyone.
Q.4. Does Islam allow Sheikhs and leaders to own mosques and waqf properties and thereby hold the power to prevent a Muslim from entering a mosque?
A. Mosques and waqf properties cannot be owned by an individual or institution and no one has a right to prevent anyone from entering them. These are the properties of Allah and can be used by any Muslim without any distinction.
Q.5. Can a sum of money big or small be charged to a man (rich or poor) to ensure his and his relatives' entry into paradise?
A. This is a despicable act of monks and priests who sell a place in paradise to those who can afford to pay a sum of money. These people will receive severe punishment on the day of judgment. Allah will reward everyone according to his deeds and not according to how much money he pays to purchae a share in paradise.
Q.6. Can a muslim dignitary order another Muslim to divorce his wife and boycott his parents and on refusal be prevented from entering paradise?
A. The Prophet said that among all permitted things the most hateful to Allah is 'divorce'. Allah commands the muslims to protect and show kindness to wives and parents. If anyone goes against this he disobeys Allah.

Yet another 'fatwa' was obtained by Fidahusein Adamali of Nairobi, East Africa from the Ministry of Justice, Kingdom of Saudi Arabia in 1977 (27 Jamaadil Awwal1399 Hijri). The following are the summarized questions and answers:
Q.l. The Bohra Mullaji insists upon his followers to perform 'sajdah' for him every time they visit him. Was there such practice in the days of the Prophet or the guided caliphs?
A. The 'sajdah' is a form of worship commanded by Allah for Him only and should therefore be offered to none other than Allah. The followers of Mullaji are worshipping him and ascribing a partner to Allah and having their own God above Allah. His ordering the followers to do this or his tacit agreement to it makes him a tyrant (taaghoot).
Q.2. Is it permitted in Islam for women to kiss the hands and feet of Mullaji and other male members of his family?
A. In Islam this is not allowed. No such practice existed in the time. Prophet or the guided caliphs. When the believing women would come to the Prophet to give the pledge of faith and loyalty,he would take the pledge verbally and never touch or shake hands with them. The kissing of hands and feet of Mullaji and others by the women amounts to 'shirk' and is an unpardonable sin.
Q.3. The Mullaji claims that he is the master of the souls of all the followers. Can such a claim be justified?
A. This is false and absurd. It is Allah alone Who is the owner of all the souls because it is He Who has created them.
Q.4. The Mullaji claims that he is the owner of all properties of religious trusts and that he does not have to render account because he is God on earth. Can he make such a claim?
A. The properties of religious trusts cannot be owned. What is owned is the benefit of their yield. The Mullaji does not own any trust property nor is he entitled to any yield except what has been earmarked for him, if he deserves it. Every person must render account of how he uses the trust property according to the Holy Book, the tradition of the Prophet and the general agreement of the Muslim ummah. The Mullaji's claim that he is God on earth is a flagrant infidelity and he will be treated as 'taaghoot'.
Q.5. The Mullaji claims that he has the right to declare the cancellation of people's sins and to apply social boycott against those who oppose any of his actions. Can we accept this claim?
A. The Mullaji is indirectly claiming divinity for himself which is no more than infidelity. In fact he should accept the advice of people if it is for improvement and for the benefit of all instead of applying social boycott against them.
Q.6. Does Islam permit religious persecution? The Bohras are Muslims believing in the glorious Quran and the teachings of Islam. Can persecution be justified against them?
A. Islam does not sanction the persecution of Muslims with sincere belief in the Quran and the tradition of the Holy Prophet. The Mullaji's agreement to persecution amounts to infidelity.

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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by shehzaada » Fri Apr 11, 2014 10:06 am

does anyone have a online link or documented record of the above fatwa?

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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by shehzaada » Fri Apr 11, 2014 10:51 am

Finally got the link to all the fatwa on the ifta site, the fatwaas are from the permanent committe of fatwas in Saudi Arabia and are the highest authority in Saudi Arabia:
http://aliftaweb.org/English/Pages/Fatw ... 1&BookID=7

The following line explicitly declares the syedna as kafir:
http://aliftaweb.org/English/Pages/Fatw ... 1&BookID=7
Consequently, both parties, the followers (Bohras) and the followed (chief of Bohras) are Kafir (disbelievers) in Allah and Islam. We seek refuge in Allah from this.

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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by shehzaada » Sat Apr 12, 2014 6:12 am

Does anyone know how to approach the iftaa and get fatawas? is there a procedure to get fatawas. I would like to ask then why are they allowed to come in saudi arabiia? Does the govt receive bribe from the bohras?

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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by shehzada » Mon Apr 14, 2014 10:07 am

@shehzaada - really?

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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by alam » Mon Apr 14, 2014 10:29 am

IDS too confusing -- Shehzada Vs Shehzaada

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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by shehzaada » Thu Apr 17, 2014 2:28 pm

dont worry we are different peope

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Re: Fatwa against Syedna


Unread post by shehzaada » Thu Apr 17, 2014 2:38 pm

A deobandi fatawa:
http://darulifta-deoband.org/showuservi ... en&id=5192
The Dawoodi Bohra are a subsect of Ismā'īlī Shī'ah; as such, they are non-Muslims[1]. Also, going to their Jamat Khana is impermissible.[2]