Why Bohra's are not allowed to read Quran with translation

The one and only free public forum for Bohras. The focus of this forum is the reform movement, the Dawoodi Bohra faith and, of course, the corrupt priesthood. But the discussion is in no way restricted to the Bohras alone.
badrijanab
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Joined: Fri Jun 15, 2012 3:19 pm

Re: WHY BOHRA'S ARE NOT ALLOWED TO READ QURAN WITH TRANSLAT

#31

Unread post by badrijanab » Tue Aug 27, 2013 11:16 am

AMAFHH wrote:Once a maid of our 2nd Imam, Imam Hasan ibn Ali (A) dropped a hot bowl of soup on Imam (A).
Dawoodi Bohra Ismailiya Shia: Imam Hasan a.s. is the first Imam.

Ithna Asheri: Imam Hasan a.s. is second Imam.

Nizari (Aaga Khani): Imam Hasan a.s. is not Imam, first is Mola Ali a.s. and 2nd is Imam Hussain a.s.

Sunni: Imam Hasan a.s. is the 5th rightful caliph

AMAFHH
Posts: 274
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Re: WHY BOHRA'S ARE NOT ALLOWED TO READ QURAN WITH TRANSLAT

#32

Unread post by AMAFHH » Tue Aug 27, 2013 3:11 pm

badrijanab wrote:
AMAFHH wrote:Once a maid of our 2nd Imam, Imam Hasan ibn Ali (A) dropped a hot bowl of soup on Imam (A).
Dawoodi Bohra Ismailiya Shia: Imam Hasan a.s. is the first Imam.

Ithna Asheri: Imam Hasan a.s. is second Imam.

Nizari (Aaga Khani): Imam Hasan a.s. is not Imam, first is Mola Ali a.s. and 2nd is Imam Hussain a.s.

Sunni: Imam Hasan a.s. is the 5th rightful caliph

i think for dawoodi bohri also imam ali is the first imam you can go and read the Salaam Recited in the ziyarat of Ali ibne abu talib (a.s) published by dawoodi bohra's

badrijanab
Posts: 809
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Re: WHY BOHRA'S ARE NOT ALLOWED TO READ QURAN WITH TRANSLAT

#33

Unread post by badrijanab » Tue Aug 27, 2013 5:48 pm

AMAFHH wrote:
badrijanab wrote: Dawoodi Bohra Ismailiya Shia: Imam Hasan a.s. is the first Imam.

Ithna Asheri: Imam Hasan a.s. is second Imam.

Nizari (Aaga Khani): Imam Hasan a.s. is not Imam, first is Mola Ali a.s. and 2nd is Imam Hussain a.s.

Sunni: Imam Hasan a.s. is the 5th rightful caliph

i think for dawoodi bohri also imam ali is the first imam you can go and read the Salaam Recited in the ziyarat of Ali ibne abu talib (a.s) published by dawoodi bohra's
Produce the salam here?

The matter of fact is we Dawoodi Bohra; as prescribed by Allah and Prophet Mohammed saww consider Mola Ali as "Wasi" position superior than Imam.

For DB, molana Hasan a.s is the first Imam. Period.

porus
Posts: 3594
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2001 5:01 am

Re: WHY BOHRA'S ARE NOT ALLOWED TO READ QURAN WITH TRANSLAT

#34

Unread post by porus » Tue Aug 27, 2013 8:23 pm

AMAFHH wrote: i think for dawoodi bohri also imam ali is the first imam you can go and read the Salaam Recited in the ziyarat of Ali ibne abu talib (a.s) published by dawoodi bohra's
According to Bohras, Imam Hasan is the First Imam. You can readily count 21 Imams from Imam Hasan to Imam al-Tayyib.

Ali is "Foundation of Imamat". His position is between that of the Prophet and Imams.

Aga Khanis, until recent times, followed the same order. Aga Khan III, present Aga Khan's grand father, suddenly decided to demote both Ali and Hasan. He made Ali the Imam and removed Hasan from the rank of Imams. In this he clearly went against history. I believe that the explanation he gave was that Imamat cannot go from brother to brother but must go from father to son. He then did not follow his own dogma and nominated his grandson rather than his son for Imamat.

Another reason attributed to Aga Khan III is that he thought Hasan was only a mustawda (caretaker) Imam for Husain. He did not give any explanation for that. This view is not supported by history either.

porus
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Re: WHY BOHRA'S ARE NOT ALLOWED TO READ QURAN WITH TRANSLAT

#35

Unread post by porus » Tue Aug 27, 2013 8:48 pm

AMAFHH wrote:
below is a Bayan of the Mansoos read this :-

His recent vaaz in Malindi on Sunday 25th Aug 2013 - received via whatsapp - unedited:
- Quote -
"Malindi no halwo gano fine chhe. Macchi gani chhe yaha to barabar haath farawi ne lejo. Bairawo nokri na kare. Muqadas Mowla ye je bayan Malindi ma farmawutu e pachhu bayan karu. Burhanuddin Mowla ni safar ni details. Nairobi jamea ni khidmat. Jabir na be farzando ni zikr. Sifin ma mussa ashari. Quran ni tafsir raza bagair hargiz na parjo. Khaas karine awaam ni kitaabo.
Of course, they do not want you to read without Raza. This applies not only to 'awaam ni kitaabo' but to Bohra religious literature as well.

He need not have bothered. The fact is that the majority of Bohras are not interested in learning about them. Many go to sabaks but do not seriously pursue the subjects they hear about outside of sabaks which tend to be like majlis bayans and quickly forgotten.

Naturally, they want you to accept their tafseer without question. If you are not familiar with other viewpoints, you will unlikely challenge their tafseer. That is what they want.

However, my experience is that if you are among the few who have read this literature, you will not be sanctioned but an attempt will usually be made to offer comparison of the merits of Bohra interpretation vis-a-vis 'awaam' interpretation.

Bohra interpretation has two aspects you will not find in other tafseers. One is the role of Ahlul Bayt in the revelation and its interpretation. The other is the tafseer based on Ismaili/Bohra Metaphysics. They make for interesting reading. (I warn you against the use of tafseer to elevate certain human beings to stations beyond that envisaged by Allah. And in consequence to engage in rituals reserved solely for Allah.)

You will need to ponder over the question of why you want to know this literature. Is it because you have a specific life question or is it because you want to incur Allah's pleasure. You will also need to be wary of an agenda that your 'teacher' may have in interpreting the Bohra classical literature. I personally think that 'incurring Allah's pleasure' should be our sole aim in understanding the Quran.

Finally, this forum could be a good place to discuss tafseers we have heard in majlises. Unfortunately, I do not believe there is sufficient interest here. And, of course, any attempt would soon divert into Shia-Sunni point scoring. So, it is best to find other avenues to pursue this interest.

p.s Tafseers are never uni-dimensional. Even Bohra tafseers will display multiple viewpoints based on discussions of many awliya.

AMAFHH
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Re: WHY BOHRA'S ARE NOT ALLOWED TO READ QURAN WITH TRANSLAT

#36

Unread post by AMAFHH » Wed Aug 28, 2013 12:54 am

Brother Badri
you also have to do some research instead of asking me to produce the salaam Here go at your home and read the Ziyarat and it's translation and try hard to Use your Intellect please
and can you prove that Wasi is a Superior Position ?

porus
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Re: WHY BOHRA'S ARE NOT ALLOWED TO READ QURAN WITH TRANSLAT

#37

Unread post by porus » Wed Aug 28, 2013 1:32 am

AMAFHH wrote: and can you prove that Wasi is a Superior Position ?
No one, including the 21 Imams, has Ali's singular distinction and honor of being the Wasi of Prophet Muhammad. Muhammad described his and Ali's relation like that between Musa and Haroon.

Another difference between Ali and Imams is that Fatima is the mother of all Imams. Fatima is not the mother of Ali, but his wife. While Ali is special, there will be no Imam from Ali except through Fatima. That is the reason why Imam Jafar al-Sadiq described Imams as Aal-e-Muhammad and not as Aal-e-Ali.

However, it is appropriate to refer to Ali as Imam if by Imam you mean generically as the 'Leader of Muslims'. Of course, that does not bring out the nuances that distinguish Ali as the 'Foundation of Imamat'.

p.s. This is not a proof as there can be no such thing. It is a statement and description of dogma.

humanbeing
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Re: WHY BOHRA'S ARE NOT ALLOWED TO READ QURAN WITH TRANSLAT

#38

Unread post by humanbeing » Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:14 am

Please don’t mind my naiveness. But may I know what does these mean or difference

Tafseer ?
Translations of Quran
Transliteration of Quran

humble_servant_us
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Re: WHY BOHRA'S ARE NOT ALLOWED TO READ QURAN WITH TRANSLAT

#39

Unread post by humble_servant_us » Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:36 am

A person could have multiple positions at the same time. He could be a wasi, Imam, khalifa etc. For eg. Ibrahim(as) was a prophet and Imam, Does these different titles change his responsibility and role in the society after the prophet(pbuh) or its just for reverence purpose.

By calling Maula Ali(as) as First Imam we are not degrading his Status, surely he was the successor of the prophet(pbuh) and his wasi.

porus
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Re: WHY BOHRA'S ARE NOT ALLOWED TO READ QURAN WITH TRANSLAT

#40

Unread post by porus » Thu Aug 29, 2013 2:08 am

humanbeing wrote:Please don’t mind my naiveness. But may I know what does these mean or difference

Tafseer ?
Translations of Quran
Transliteration of Quran
Here is an example:

Orginal: "إِنَّا أَنزَلْنَاهُ فِي لَيْلَةِ الْقَدْرِ (96:1)

Transliteration in English: "inna anzalna-hu fi laylati_l-qadr"

Translation: "We have sent it down on the night of Decree" or "We have sent it down on the night of Power"

Tafseer: May consist of:

Description of the precise time and circumstances of the revelation of this ayat.
References to hadith verifying these
Dictionary meaning of 'anzalna' and Decree or Power
What did Prophet have to say about the ayat
Commentary on interpretations of past mufassireen of the words of the ayat
What does the ayat mean as an advice for living and its use in liturgy
Interpretation of the mufassir and for Bohras, its taawil.

And a lot more...

humanbeing
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Re: WHY BOHRA'S ARE NOT ALLOWED TO READ QURAN WITH TRANSLAT

#41

Unread post by humanbeing » Fri Aug 30, 2013 12:48 am

I was reading translation of Quran from ‘Yusuf Ali’ & ‘Sahih International’ the difference in translations ( meaning of ayats) were not really very different for moral understanding.

However wording and understanding the meaning of ayats are heavy and require strong concentration and maturity. It takes you back in the era of idol worshipping pagans and keeping that context, reading and implication of ayats start to make sense. Ofcourse after reading and pondering over them, one can relate how timeless quran is when not much has changed from those pagan days to today.

AMAFHH
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Re: WHY BOHRA'S ARE NOT ALLOWED TO READ QURAN WITH TRANSLAT

#42

Unread post by AMAFHH » Fri Aug 30, 2013 10:34 am

Reading the Quran with translation and tafseer really opens the mind to think ,and ponder about how we are living in this world and society ,
below is a POST i got on my facebook page from one of my friend and while reading this i was thinking on How many of this Akhlaq i am having in my daily life as it has been nearly 16 years since i am reading the Holy Book and i also have full faith in it ? and speaking Truth the result was very shocking to Me
this is the Real Beauty and knowledge of Quran, that is Why it is very important to Read the translation


Sixty Akhlaq Tips from the Holy Quran

May Allah (swt) reward the brs who complied this.

1. Respect and honour all human beings irrespective of their religion, colour, race, sex, language, status, property, birth, profession/job and so on [17/70]
2. Talk straight, to the point, without any ambiguity or deception [33/70]
3. Choose best words to speak and say them in the best possible way [17/53, 2/83]
4. Do not shout. Speak politely keeping your voice low. [31/19]
5. Always speak the truth. Shun words that are deceitful and ostentatious [22/30]
6. Do not confound truth with falsehood [2/42]
7. Say with your mouth what is in your heart [3/167]
8. Speak in a civilised manner in a language that is recognized by the society and is commonly used [4/5]
9. When you voice an opinion, be just, even if it is against a relative [6/152]
10. Do not brag [31/18]
11. Do not talk, listen or do anything vain [23/3, 28/55]
12. Do not participate in any paltry. If you pass by futile play, then pass with dignity [25/72]
13. Do not verge upon any immodesty or lewdness whether surreptitious or overt [6/151]
14. If, unintentionally, any misconduct occurs by you, then correct yourself expeditiously [3/134]
15. Do not be contemptuous or arrogant with people [31/18]
16. Do not walk haughtily or with conceit [17/37, 31/18]
17. Be moderate in thy pace [31/19]
18. Walk with humility and sedateness [25/63]
19. Keep your gazes lowered devoid of any lecherous leers and salacious stares [24/30-31, 40/19]
20. If you do not have complete knowledge about anything, better keep your mouth shut. You might think that speaking about something without full knowledge is a trivial matter. But it might have grave consequences [24/15-16]
21. When you hear something malicious about someone, keep a favourable view about him/her until you attain full knowledge about the matter. Consider others innocent until they are proven guilty with solid and truthful evidence [24/12-13]
22. Ascertain the truth of any news, lest you smite someone in ignorance and afterwards repent of what you did [49/6]
23. Do not follow blindly any information of which you have no direct knowledge. (Using your faculties of perception and conception) you must verify it for yourself. In the Court of your Lord, you will be held accountable for your hearing, sight, and the faculty of reasoning [17/36]
24. Never think that you have reached the final stage of knowledge and nobody knows more than yourself. Remember! Above everyone endowed with knowledge is another endowed with more knowledge [12/76] Even the Prophet (sawa) was asked to keep praying, "O My Sustainer! Advance me in knowledge." [20/114]
25. The believers are but a single Brotherhood. Live like members of one family, brothers and sisters unto one another [49/10]
26. Do not mock or ridicule others [49/11]
27. Do not defame others [49/11]
28. Do not insult others by nicknames [49/11]
29. Avoid suspicion and guesswork. Suspicion and guesswork might deplete your communal energy [49/12]
30. Spy not upon one another [49/12]
31. Do not backbite one another [49/12]
32. When you meet each other, offer good wishes and blessings for safety. One who conveys to you a message of safety and security and also when a courteous greeting is offered to you, meet it with a greeting still more courteous or (at least) of equal courtesy [4/86]
33. When you enter your own home or the home of somebody else, compliment the inmates [24/61]
34. Do not enter houses other than your own until you have sought permission; and then greet the inmates and wish them a life of blessing, purity and pleasure [24/27]
35. Treat your parents, relatives, orphans and those who have been left alone in society with kindness [4/36]
36. Take care of the needy, the disabled, those whose hard earned income is insufficient to meet their needs, those whose businesses have stalled, and those who have lost their jobs. [4/36]
37. Be kind to your related and unrelated neighbours, companions by your side in public gatherings and while travelling. [4/36]
38. Be generous to the needy wayfarer, the homeless son of the street, and the one who reaches you in a destitute condition [4/36]
39. Be nice to people who work under your care. [4/36]
40. Do not follow up what you have given to others to afflict them with reminders of your generosity [2/262]
41. Do not expect a return for your good behaviour, not even thanks [76/9]
42. Cooperate with one another in good deeds and do not cooperate with others in evil and bad matters [5/2]
43. Do not try to impress people on account of self-proclaimed virtues [53/32]
44. You should enjoin right conduct on others but mend your own ways first. Actions speak louder than words. You must first practice good deeds yourself, then preach [2/44]
45. Correct yourself and your families first [before trying to correct others] [66/6]
46. Pardon gracefully if anyone among you who commits a bad deed out of ignorance, and then repents and amends [6/54, 3/134]
47. Divert and sublimate your anger and potentially virulent emotions to creative energy, and become a source of tranquillity and comfort to people [3/134]
48. Call people to the Way of your Lord with wisdom and beautiful exhortation. Reason with them most decently [16/125]
49. Leave to themselves those who do not give any importance to the Divine code and have adopted and consider it as mere play and amusement [6/70]
50. Sit not in the company of those who ridicule the Divine Law unless they engage in some other conversation [4/140]
51. Do not be jealous of those who are blessed [4/54]
52. In your collective life, make room for others [58/11]
53. When invited to dine, go at the appointed time. Do not arrive too early to wait for the preparation of meal or linger after eating to engage in bootless babble. Such things may cause inconvenience to the host [33/53]
54. Eat and drink [what is lawful] in moderation [7/31]
55. Do not squander your wealth senselessly [17/26]
56. Fulfil your promises and commitments [17/34]
57. Keep yourself clean and pure [9/108, 4/43, 5/6]
58. Dress-up in agreeable attire and adorn yourself with exquisite character from inside out [7/26]
59. Seek your provision only by fair endeavour [29/17, 2/188]
60. Do not devour the wealth and property of others unjustly, nor bribe the officials or the judges to deprive others of their possessions [2/188]

alwan
Posts: 58
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Re: WHY BOHRA'S ARE NOT ALLOWED TO READ QURAN WITH TRANSLAT

#43

Unread post by alwan » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:56 pm

porus wrote:
I believe that the explanation he (Aga Khan 3) gave was that Imamat cannot go from brother to brother but must go from father to son. He then did not follow his own dogma and nominated his grandson rather than his son for Imamat.
what made you believe Aga Khan 3 made that explanation ? did you read or heard from somewhere ?
According to his will,

"Ever since the time of my ancestor Ali, the first Imam, that is to say over a period of thirteen hundred years, it has always been the tradition of our family that each Imam chooses his successor at his absolute and unfettered discretion from amongst any of his descendants, whether they be sons or remote male issue"

The Aga Khans, Will Frischauer, The Bodley Head, 1970, pp 208-209

http://www.nanowisdoms.org/nwblog/wp-co ... ans%27.PDF

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: WHY BOHRA'S ARE NOT ALLOWED TO READ QURAN WITH TRANSLAT

#44

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Sun Oct 20, 2013 6:50 pm

I found it on the net which is relevant to the topic under discussion :-

This 'zaahir-baatin' dogma preached by the misguided self-invented leaders, is only a ploy to confuse and misguide the normal people, and a baseless philosophy invented by the self-declared priestly class to subjugate their followers to become the slaves of man (abde-syedna) rather than become the slaves of Allah Subhanah (Abd-Allah)!!!

If one has heard and studied the taped conversations, he would hear terms like 'Aala-Kitaab' (The books of High), or 'Haqeeqat ni Kitaab' (The books of Truth), etc., which is apparently the source of their mis-guidance; but never would one hear the name of the Blessed and Noble Book of Allah Subhanah: The One and Only Al-Quran Al-Kareem, which incidentally is the only 'Aala Kitaab and the only 'Haqeeqat ni Kitaab'.

These misguided self-declared leaders use these self-invented books and program their followers into the 'zaahir-baatin' concept of absolute misguidance! This is where they get their notions of the 'baatin' (hidden) Imam and the 'zaahir' (open) Dai!!! This is where they propagate the false concept of the 'saamit-kitaab' (silent book, namely the Glorious Quran), and the 'bolti-kitaab' (speaking-book, namely Hadrat Ali ibn Abi Taalib (r.a.)!!!

Thus whatever suits their agenda and helps them in subjugating their ignorant followers, they declare as 'zaahir'; and whatever suits their agenda they declare 'baatin'! And they unashamedly declare that 'normal' people like you and me are not qualified or not worth understanding the 'baatin' knowledge; this 'baatin' knowledge is only for the so-called 'Royal-family' and that too the upper-most crust of the hierarchy!!! These self-invented books are held in such secrecy, that none other than the top-most level of the Bohra Leadership have access to it!!!

And amongst all this self-created, utter and absolute confusion; these evil people declare that the Divine Book which Allah Subhanah Himself revealed for the Guidance of mankind, cannot be understood by normal people like you and me!!!

That is why you will see that the Bohras, be they their leaders, priests, or the normal followers....they will never understand or even try to understand even one Aaayah or Command of the Glorious Quran! In fact, if you invite them to read the Quran with understanding, they will immediately challenge the translation, the author, the language, the motive of the translator, even the authenticity of the Glorious Quran itself! .....basically they will challenge anything and everything, but they will never ever agree to read the Quran with understanding....for that is precisely what they have been told since birth! For them, the knowledge of the Quran is 'baatin' (hidden) knowledge, and its 'taaweel' (real meanings) are known only and only by the priestly class!!!

And once these evil self-invented priests and leaders have taken away the understanding of the Divine Book of Guidance from their followers; they may lead them anywhere they want, and these poor and ignorant followers obey and submit to them like slaves or even worse, like cattle, believing that everything the High Priest and his cronies say and do is absolutely in line with the guidance and teachings of Allah and His Messenger (saws), when nothing could be further than the Truth!!!

These evil priests and misguided leaders have created and propagated this confusion, and have succeeded in taking a multitude of good and honest people away from the deen of Islam! They conceal the clear Aayahs of the Quran for a paltry worldly gain, without realizing the heavy penalty they will occur in the Just Court of Allah Subhanah on the Inevitable Day of Judgement! These ignorant and arrogant leaders have made a mockery of the Divine Commandments of Allah Subhanah and sold their Hereafter for a paltry sum that they extort from their followers in this world! What an evil bargain they have made!!!

If only they knew the Quran, and were guided aright by the Merciful Lord, they would realize that what they are following is absolute and complete disobedience of the Clear Commands of Allah Subhanah; and the reward of disobedience to the Commands of Allah Subhanah is guaranteed Hell-Fire!

May Allah Subhanah have Mercy on our Bohra brethren and guide them to understand, obey, follow, and submit to the clear teachings of the Glorious Quran before they meet with their appointment of death; for after that it would be too late!

Allah says in the Holy Quran Chapter 2 Surah Baqarah verse 159: Those who conceal the clear (Revelations) and Guidance We have sent down, after We have made it clear for the people in the Book, on them shall be Allah's 'laanah' and the 'laanah' of those who are entitled to curse!

Allah says in the Holy Quran Chapter 2 Surah Al-Baqarah verse 174: Indeed those, who conceal the commands that Allah has sent down in His Book and barter them away for paltry worldly gains, fill their bellies with fire. Allah will not speak to them on the Day of Resurrection, nor will He regard them as pure and there is a painful torment for them!

Please read the following Aayahs of the Glorious Quran, and decide for yourself who has a bigger right to be believed: Allah Subhanah or these self-made priests?

Allah says in Chapter 2, Surah Baqarah aayat 185: "Ramadan is the month in which the Quran was sent down: this Book is a perfect guidance for mankind and consists of CLEAR teachings which show the Right Way, and are a Criterion of the Truth and falsehood."

Allah says the Book is a perfect guidance and consists of clear teachings and is a barometer for the Truth and falsehood! But some men say this Book is incomprehensible and impossible to understand.

Allah says in the Holy Quran Chapter 16 Surah Nahl verse 89: We have sent down to you this Book, which makes everything plain, and is a guidance, blessing and good news to those who have surrendered themselves entirely.

Allah Subhanah has Himself declared that this Glorious Quran makes everything plain, is a guidance, and a blessing and good news for the believers who have surrendered themselves. But some unfortunate people unjustly claim that this Message of Allah is not supposed to be understood!!!!

Allah says in the Holy Quran Chapter 41 Surah Ha Mim As Sajdaah verse 2-4: This is a Revelation from the All-Compassionate, the All-Merciful Allah. A Book whose verses are well-expounded, an Arabic Quran for the people who want to understand, and a giver of good news and a warner.

Allah Subhanah Himself declares that this Glorious Quran is a Book whose verses are well-expounded, and a guidance for the people who 'want' to understand it! May Allah have mercy on the people who declare that this Book is not supposed to be understood.

Allah says in the Holy Quran Chapter 30 Surah Rum verses 58-60: We have set forth in this Quran every sort of argument to make the people understand; but whatever 'aayah' you may bring, the disbelievers will certainly say, "You are following falsehood". Thus does Allah seal up the hearts of those who understand not. So, patiently perservere; for surely the promise of Allah is True. And let not those who have no certainty of faith, shake your firmness.

The people who refuse to understand the Glorious Quran are always the foremost in accusing the believers of the Quran of following falsehood! Little do they realize that Allah Subhanah has sealed up their hearts for their obstinence!!

Allah says in the Holy Quran Chapter 43 Surah Zukhruf verses 43-44: So, hold fast to the Book that has been revealed to you, you are surely on the Siraat al Mustaqeem. The fact is that this book is a great honor for you and your people, and soon you shall be CALLED TO ACCOUNT for it.

Some people say that the Book of Allah should not be understood, and obviously if one never understands it, he will not obey and follow its clear commands! But Allah guides the believers to hold fast to this Glorious Quran, for those who do, are surely on the Straight Path of Islam. And on an Inevitable Day, Allah shall surely call all of mankind to account for it.

Allah says in the Holy Quran Chapter 6 Surah Anaam verse 157-158: Now that a clear proof, a Guidance and Blessing, has come to you from your Lord, who can be more unjust than the one who treats Our Revelations as false and turns away from them? We will inflict the severest torment on those who turn away from Our Revelations because of their aversion. Do the people now await that the angels should come down before them? Or that your Lord may Himself come down? Or that the manifest Signs of your Lord should appear?

Some people declare that the Book of Allah is not for us to understand!!!! Allah Subhanah declares that those who treat His Revelations as false and thus turn away from them are unjust, and will come under the severe Wrath and Punishment of Allah Subhanah.

So, what will make these people understand the Message of the Quran? Are they awaiting that the angels of Allah should come down before them? Or that the Majestic and Supreme Lord of the Universe should Himself come down before them? Or that some of the Lord's Manifest Signs or Miracles should appear before them? Will these unjust people who refuse to understand and accept the Guidance of the Quran, believe only then?

We seek the refuge of Allah Subhanah from the people who refuse to accept and understand the Message of the Glorious Quran!

Allah says in the Holy Quran Chapter 7 Surah Aaraaf verses 2-3: This is a Book which has been sent down to you. So, let there be no hesitation in your mind about it. This has been sent down that you may thereby warn (the disbelievers), and that it may be an Admonition to the believers. O people, follow what has been sent down to you from your Lord, and do not follow other 'auliyaas' besides Him. But you seldom take Admonition!

The unjust people who refuse to accept and understand the Revelations of Allah Subhanah have done so, only because some of their 'auliyaas' or self-declared holy men have told them to do so!

These ignorant people refuse to accept what Allah has commanded them to do; but are ever-ready to accept every command of their self made 'auliyaas'!


Allah says in the Holy Quran Chapter 10 Surah Yunus verses 40-44: Some of these people will believe in (The Quran), and others will not. Your Lord knows these mischief-makers very well indeed. If these people deny you, say to them: "I am responsible for my deeds and you are for yours. You are not accountable for what I do, nor am I for what you do." There are many among them who hear what you say, but will you make the deaf to listen to you, even though they be incapable of understanding this? Then there are many others among them who see you. But will you show the way to the blind, even though they be bereft of sight? The fact is that Allah does not in any way wrong the people, but they wronged themselves!

Our duty was only to convey the Message of the Glorious Quran to you.....Allah Subhanah Himself declares that some people will believe in it, and some others will reject it!

These Bhaisahebs, and Aamils, and the 'raza na saahibs', etc. know how to perform the rituals of darees, waaz, jaman, niyaaz, nikaah, janaaza, etc. but they have absolutely no idea of the clear commandments of the Quran! Simply because in their schools and universities, that is exactly what they have learnt! Neither do they know the Quran, nor do they encourage their followers to understand the Quran!

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: WHY BOHRA'S ARE NOT ALLOWED TO READ QURAN WITH TRANSLAT

#45

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Mon Oct 21, 2013 6:05 pm

The Dawoodi Bohra leadership have actually changed the Quran in about four or five places! And one of them is in the Surah Alam-Nashrah as stated by you.

Allah says in the Holy Quran Chapter 94 Surah Alam-Nashrah verses 7-8: Therefore, when you (O Prophet) are free (from your task), ‘funsub’ (still labor hard), And to your Lord turn all your attention.

‘funsub’ in Arabic would mean to make ‘oneself’ labor hard or make effort to stand straight (in this case for prayer, etc.)

‘funsib’ would mean to make ‘someone else’ labor hard or make effort to make ‘them’ strand straight.

The correct meaning of the above aayahs would be that Allah is commanding the Prophet (saws), that when he is free from all the duties and responsibilities he (saws) has to deliver to the believers and his family, to make effort and labor hard and stand in the worship of His Lord, and turn all his attention to Allah Subhanah.

To change the word to ‘funsib’ would mean that Allah is commanding the Prophet (saws), that when he is free from his responsibilities, he should tell the ‘others’ to make effort and labor hard to stand straight. (Actually it just does not make any sense!)

I know of one more word that they have changed in Chapter 37 Surah Saafaat verse 130, where instead of saying when the Quran says ‘ill Yaaseen’, the Bohras say, “aa’le Yaaseen”!

The reason is very obvious and very effective for their needs. These unscrupulous leaders, by saying that the Quran has been changed in 4-5 places, put doubts into their followers; that this Quran is not complete and has some errors… These are the same leaders who regularly say to their followers that they should never try to understand the Quran, because they might get mis-guided! How can This Book, which was revealed by Allah Himself for the guidance of mankind, misguide its readers? These are the same leaders who say that each word and each aayah of the Holy Quran has 10 meanings! These are the same leaders who say that it is impossible to understand the Quran! These are the same people who say, that only one man, or only his ‘chosen’ family can understand the Quran; and their followers just have to obey them in whatever they say! These are the same people who stress that the Quran can and should only be read in Arabic, thereby guaranteeing that no common Bohra will ever understand the clear guidance and teachings of the Holy Quran! These are the same leaders who say that there is a hidden meaning, and the names of their ‘pious’ holy men ‘deep’ inside the aayahs of the Quran, which only they know! These are the same leaders who say that the Quran has several meanings: the ‘zaahir’(open); the ‘baatin’(hidden); the ‘taaweel’ (the real meaning); etc. which are known only to one man or his family!

By creating these sort of doubts into the minds of their followers, these unscrupulous people have been successful in taking the Quran out of the system of the Bohras! They never use the Quran as their book of guidance… but instead use as their constitution a book called the ‘Daim ul Islam’ by an Egyptian cleric named Qadi Noaman, who incidentally wrote the book some 340 years after the death of the Prophet (saws). They never use the Holy Quran as their evidence for doing something! They never explain the meaning of the Quran from the beginning to the end … they may quote one aayah here and one aayah which suits them, there! But they simply never teach the Quran as a whole!

Even in their university, Al Jamea-tus-Saifeea in Surat, the students apparently go through 13 years of Islamic education, but the meaning and understanding of the Quran is not even one of their subjects or fields of study! Even these graduates have very little knowledge about the Quran, simply because they have never studied the Quran from beginning to end in all their 13 years! Neither do the Bohras have a translation of their own, nor do they endorse any existing translation.

Their plan is simple: Just keep their followers out of the understanding of the Holy Quran. And once any person is kept out of the understanding of this Book of Guidance, they can lead them anywhere they want, make them do anything they want them to do, take from them anything they want, and make them bow down to anyone they want! And the poor Bohras think that everything these leaders and holy men say is apparently from the Quran, and thus obey and follow them religiously!

That is the simple reasoning behind changing the words of the Holy Quran!

These unscrupulous self-made leaders and self-proclaimed holy men, then wear the garb of Islam, but guide their followers far far away from Allah and the True Deen of Islam. They guide them to the obedience and invocation of themselves and their ancestors, rather than guide them to the obedience and invocation of the One Lord Alone, Allah Subhanah! They guide them to bow down to human beings and graves of their ancestors, rather than bowing down to Allah Subhanah Alone! They guide them to become ‘abde-syedna’ (slaves of syedna), rather than guiding them to become ‘abd-Allah’ (slaves of Allah)!

if you don’t believe what I have said, try this simple exercise for yourself. I humbly ask you to go to your nearest bhaisaheb and/or aamil and ask him simply that you want to understand the Quran in its entirety! Go to any institution of the kothar and find out if they have even one ‘sabaq’ or class whereby they teach you only from the Quran! And see for yourself the vague answers you are going to get…..

You must first study so and so books; and once you finish them (which will never finish) only then you can understand the message of the Quran!

You must first go here and there to get the basic knowledge, before you even try to understand the Quran!

You will just not be able to understand the message of the Quran in its entirety!

If you try to understand the Quran in its entirety, you will be misguided!

Each aayah of the Holy Quran has several meanings!

The Quran has ‘zaahir’ and ‘baatin’ meanings and you need to be so and so to understand it!

The Quran has many ambiguous meanings, which can only be understood by ‘the people of knowledge’; ie. Themselves!

We do not have the ‘raza’ (or permission) to start such a class or ‘sabaq’!

Or they will directly attack your belief and ask you questions which automatically put you on the defensive:

Do you believe in the Syedna or not?

Are you a true mu’min, or have you become a munafiq?

Do you think you know more than the Syedna?

Who do you think you are, coming and asking us that you want to understand the Quran in its entirety?

http://invite2all.com/?p=2146

seeker110
Posts: 1726
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:01 am

Re: Why Bohra's are not allowed to read Quran with translat

#46

Unread post by seeker110 » Wed Dec 11, 2013 1:25 am

Poppat ki tarah parhna ata hai. Samjhna bhout bhout mushkil hai. Amal karna, wo tuo Allah hi janta hai.

The best among you are those who who read Quran, understand Quran, teach Quran and lastly live by it. I read it somewhere.

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Why Bohra's are not allowed to read Quran with translat

#47

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Fri Feb 21, 2014 5:11 pm

A poem by the Late Shankar Dayal Sharma, President of India :-

Amal ki kitab thi.
Dua ki kitab bana dia

Samajhne ki kitab thi.
Parhne ki kitab bana dia.

Zindaon ka dastoor tha.
Murdon ka manshoor bana dia.

Jo ilm ki kitab thi.
Usay la ilmon ke hath thama dia.

Taskheer-e-kayenaat ka dars denay aayi thi.
Sirf madrason ka nisaab bana dia.

Murda qaumon ko zinda karne aayi thi.
Murdon ko bakhshwane per laga dia.

Aye Musalmano ye tum nay kia kiya?



Meaning :-

It was a Book to understand.
You read it without understanding.

It was a code for the living.
You turned it into a manifesto of the dead.

That which was a book of knowledge;
You abdicated to the ignoramus.

It came to give knowledge of Creation.
You abandoned it to the madrasa.

It came to give life to dead nations.
You used it for seeking mercy for the dead.

O’ Muslims! What have you done?