Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

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Akhtiar Wahid
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Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#1

Unread post by Akhtiar Wahid » Thu Nov 28, 2013 5:56 am

Asalaam wa laikum,
So in U.A.E they have passed this new law which states that each and every individual residing in U.A.E has to have compulsory health insurance. So people are rushing and getting their insurance policies covered. So for a typical dawoodi bohras this so called Insurance (Moharamat) is haram. Syedna has mentioned several times in waaz and bayans that health insurance is a big NO NO and haram. I remember him saying " tamare khuda par yakeen nathi, kem karo che Bimo ne LIC". Now when I tell bohra people that it is haram, they become hypocrites and say " Hawein su karein yaha nu kanoon follow karwu parse", so it means whatever moula says " jee jaan si nathi uthawatha amal", Either find a different country to live in or any alternative but don't be an hypocrite.

Bohra spring
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Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2012 8:37 am

Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#2

Unread post by Bohra spring » Thu Nov 28, 2013 8:53 am

AW...life insurance is haram where you are trading your death for monetary rewards to your next of kin.

However health insurance is really a pool of money everyone contributes reasonable amount and based on probability of how many fall I'll they access the funds ....eg if you pay $1000 per year in insurance and once in 10 years you fall sick you have access to say $20,000 medical costs....

Many Western countries take health levies from tax and pool it..and we naively think we are getting free medical!

Now if you don't takeout insurance please explain where will you get $20,000 from...if one has to be taken by ambulance assuming you have no savings.

Maqbool
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#3

Unread post by Maqbool » Fri Nov 29, 2013 1:12 am

Akhtiar Wahid wrote: " Hawein su karein yaha nu kanoon follow karwu parse", so it means whatever moula says "
Are bhai su kariye su, Chodi do aavi napak country, je moula na farman ni kadar nathi karti. Moula je kahe che ema hikmat che. Taratj dhandha, nokri chodi ne nikli paro, Moula ghanu aapse.

anajmi
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#4

Unread post by anajmi » Fri Nov 29, 2013 1:53 am

Maula kahan ena bapa na bageecha maan si todi ne aapse? Pele ghanu bewaqoofo paase si lese ane ema si thodu bijaa bewaqoofo ne aapse.

Akhtiar Wahid
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#5

Unread post by Akhtiar Wahid » Fri Nov 29, 2013 5:50 am

Maqbool wrote:
Akhtiar Wahid wrote: " Hawein su karein yaha nu kanoon follow karwu parse", so it means whatever moula says "
Are bhai su kariye su, Chodi do aavi napak country, je moula na farman ni kadar nathi karti. Moula je kahe che ema hikmat che. Taratj dhandha, nokri chodi ne nikli paro, Moula ghanu aapse.
Haha lol :D

JC
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#6

Unread post by JC » Fri Nov 29, 2013 1:30 pm

This all funfare and high talk about interest and insurance came after Bombay Mercantile Bank fiasco. After that Kothar suddenly realized there is lot of money involved here and suddenly 'Maula' realized that interest and insurance were haram (during the time of 51st most bohras use to work as full-time or part-time insurance agents and many were in banks) .......... so they thought of Qardan Hassana scheme and now harping high and loud that interest and insurance are haram so that abdes put their money in Qardan and hence 'savings' of bohras are available to them for their use .......very clever!! As for insurance, why take it, just take out Nazr-ul-Muqam .... so by not having insurance abdes will take out more and more Nazrul, and we all know where this Nazrul money ends.

Kothar and their leader, the Dai do not care about interest or insurance, their sole goal is gather more and more money. as simple.

Bohra spring
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#7

Unread post by Bohra spring » Sat Nov 30, 2013 3:35 am

These con men in white cloaks ...will find any devious method to extract the money from the abdes

They have taken over money they spared for their
charity =wajebat ,
meals, = tiffin and jaman
tourism= ziyarat
Clothing = rida and saya , the profits the abdes make come back as najwa
Schooling = madrassa
Health costs and any savings for a rainy day= kardhan
Fame and feel good money = ziyafat

They know many Bohra traders can find tax evasive methods so they know they are able to skim tax money in small ways.

When they run out of all spare change the can squeeze ...it will be interesting what new method they would come up

Population birth rate, steal from tax,

African slavery was not too similar where the master gave sustenance and roof and the slaves worked the whole day and night to serve and make profit for the lords.

The only difference is in kothar case they have to wait for the money to flow through the various schemes ...

israfild
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#8

Unread post by israfild » Sat Nov 30, 2013 4:12 am

As far as i understand, Life Insurance is not trading death for money. Allow me to illustrate with an example below:
eg:
Consider a group of 100 people, each person contributes Re. 1 as a fund because they know that 1 person from their group dies every year and another person joins. When a person dies, they give the 100 rupees collected in the fund to the family of the deceased. This is a typical endowment plan that you can buy from any Life insurance company and the money you pay is known as mortuary charges.

Now, if you have taken in investment plan along with the Life Insurance, then it becomes critical to keep a tab on whether your money is put in such equity / debt where interest is involved or haram products are being manufactured or not. If a person cannot keep a tab, then it is best avoided.

Similarly, when you purchase Health Insurance, the concept still remains the same, just that the calculations become complex.

Coming to the question of having faith in Allah. Well if a person has so much faith in Allah, then he / she should just sit at home and wait for the Rizq to come from Allah because Allah says that it is He who gives the rozi, so why ask from your employer or your client / customer? Why would you want to go to a Doctor if you are ailing, just have faith in Allah and he will cure you.

Well the fact is that Allah give through various forms and ways and the Zaria for you getting cured is the doctor and the zaria for your Rozi is Tijarat / Mulazemat.

incredible
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#9

Unread post by incredible » Mon Dec 02, 2013 10:48 pm

Maqbool wrote:
Akhtiar Wahid wrote: " Hawein su karein yaha nu kanoon follow karwu parse", so it means whatever moula says "
Are bhai su kariye su, Chodi do aavi napak country, je moula na farman ni kadar nathi karti. Moula je kahe che ema hikmat che. Taratj dhandha, nokri chodi ne nikli paro, Moula ghanu aapse.
morla ghanu lootse :roll:

Bohra spring
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#10

Unread post by Bohra spring » Sat Mar 01, 2014 2:55 pm

I thought of reviving this debate because it is of importance

Abdes with the least economic knowledge make ad hoc comments throw a few words like doctrine and haram to make the point and just because it is something your type of people don't understand you should stay out of it. It is pity that you pool money with kardhan for petty events but basic health is not something your SMS can pool regular money to help the thousands who live in regions where the government does not provide accessible quality health, that excludes the expensive not free saifee hospital. You would be a better abde if you went and gave this idea to kothar and if they implemented it reformist will not get in the way even if it was idea as long as poor Bohras benefited.

Is it not a pity too SMB was kept going until a 100 by the best medical facilities and a doctor by his side full time while this is not a dream of thousands of Bohras whose life expectancy is less than 80.

Insurance is the equitable transfer of the risk of a loss, from one entity to another in exchange for payment. It is a form of risk management primarily used to hedge against the risk of a contingent, uncertain loss.


Life insurance where the beneficiary is not the person or is a way of making money on death is questionable and debatable, While health insurance is something different

Health insurance is insurance against the risk of incurring medical expenses among individuals. By estimating the overall risk of health care and health system expenses, among a targeted group, an insurer can develop a routine finance structure, such as a monthly premium or payroll tax, to ensure that money is available to pay for the health care benefits specified in the insurance agreement.

james
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#11

Unread post by james » Sun Mar 02, 2014 12:41 am

Bohra spring wrote:
Insurance is the equitable transfer of the risk of a loss, from one entity to another in exchange for payment. It is a form of risk management primarily used to hedge against the risk of a contingent, uncertain loss.


Life insurance where the beneficiary is not the person or is a way of making money on death is questionable and debatable, While health insurance is something different

Health insurance is insurance against the risk of incurring medical expenses among individuals. By estimating the overall risk of health care and health system expenses, among a targeted group, an insurer can develop a routine finance structure, such as a monthly premium or payroll tax, to ensure that money is available to pay for the health care benefits specified in the insurance agreement.
Islam has ruled Insurance as haram . Perhaps reform is needed in Islam (Nozubillah ) . What do you say ? Let's start by first reforming Islam ( Nozubillah ) . How do you wanna proceed ? Petitions ? CIA ?

SBM
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#12

Unread post by SBM » Sun Mar 02, 2014 1:27 am

Islam has ruled Insurance as haram . Perhaps reform is needed in Islam (Nozubillah ) . What do you say ? Let's start by first reforming Islam ( Nozubillah ) . How do you wanna proceed ? Petitions ? CIA ?

james
Islam also ruled to celebrate Dead Person's birthday as Haram and collecting Najwa on dead person's body ,(Nozubillah) What do you suggest.
Islam also prohibited sending Lanaats to their own relatives (Nozubillah) Even Syedna Taher Saifuddin in his Nashihat said not doing Ghibat of any Mumin. What do say to Muffadal and his elks sending lanaat to their own Blood, What do you say JAMES more Nozubllilah

true_abde
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#13

Unread post by true_abde » Sun Mar 02, 2014 1:28 am

@akhtiar wahid - you are one of the dumbest persons i have come across in a long time...

SBM
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#14

Unread post by SBM » Sun Mar 02, 2014 1:34 am

true_abde wrote:@akhtiar wahid - you are one of the dumbest persons i have come across in a long time...
Really I thought that you can find them in thousand folding hands and doing Sajda at Raudat Tahera :twisted:

Bohra spring
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#15

Unread post by Bohra spring » Sun Mar 02, 2014 1:55 am

Jim stay on the topic...you have limitation or mental deficiency to answer debates and throw tantrums like desktop warrior.

I said health insurance is not regular insurance. I suggested takaful ..you know what that is ? Pooled funds . But the topic is bigger than you so I will address the general reader

I am waiting for your response why SMB deserved better medical facility then an aam admi ? Will SMS promise his abdes better health ?
What is Takaful?

All human activities are subject to risk of loss from unforeseen events. To alleviate this burden to individuals, what we now call insurance has existed since at least 215 BC. This concept has been practiced in various forms for over 1400 years. It originates from the Arabic word Kafalah, which means "guaranteeing each other" or "joint guarantee". The concept is in line with the principles of compensation and shared responsibilities among the community.

Takaful originated within the ancient Arab tribes as a pooled liability that obliged those who committed offences against members of a different tribe to pay compensation to the victims or their heirs. This principle later extended to many walks of life, including sea trade, in which participants contributed to a fund to cover anyone in a group who suffered mishaps on sea voyages.

In modern-day conventional insurance, the insurance vendor (the insurance company) sells policies and invests the proceeds for the profit of its shareholders, who are not necessarily policyholders. There is therefore a clear disjunction between policyholders and shareholders. Payouts to policyholders may vary depending on financial performance, but a minimum positive return is always contractually guaranteed.

Takaful is commonly referred to as Islamic insurance; this is due to the apparent similarity between the contract of kafalah (guarantee) and that of insurance.

However, takaful is founded on the cooperative principle and on the principle of separation between the funds and operations of shareholders, thus passing the ownership of the Takaful (Insurance) fund and operations to the policyholders. Muslim jurists conclude that insurance in Islam should be based on principles of mutuality and co-operation, encompassing the elements of shared responsibility, joint indemnity, common interest and solidarity.

In takaful, the policyholders are joint investors with the insurance vendor (the takaful operator), who acts as a mudarib – a manager or an entrepreneurial agent for the policyholders. The policyholders share in the investment pool's profits as well as its losses. A positive return on policies is not legally guaranteed, as any fixed profit guarantee would be akin to receiving interest and offend the prohibition against riba.

For some time conventional insurance was considered to be incompatible with the Shari’ah that prohibit excessive uncertainty in dealings and investment in interest-bearing assets; both are inherent factors in conventional insurance business.

However, takaful complies with the Shari’ah (which outlines the principles of compensation and shared responsibilities among the community) and has been approved by Muslim scholars. There is now general, health and family (life) takaful plans available for the Muslim communities.
Many scholars criticise the system of conventional insurance as exploitative and unjust. They point out that paying money for something, with no guarantee of benefit, involves high ambiguity and risk. One pays into the program, but may or may not need to receive compensation from the program, which could be considered a form of gambling. The insured always seems to lose while the insurance companies get richer and charge higher premiums.

However, many of these same scholars take into consideration the circumstances. For those living in non-Islamic countries, who are mandated to abide by insurance law, there is no sin in complying with the local law. Sheikh Al-Munajjid advises Muslims about what to do in such a situation: "If you are forced to take out insurance and there is an accident, it is permissible for you to take from the insurance company the same amount as the payments you have made, but you should not take any more than that. If they force you to take it then you should donate it to charity."

In countries with exhorbitant health care costs, one could argue that compassion for those who are ill takes precedence over a dislike of health insurance. A Muslim has a duty to ensure that people who are ill can access affordable health care. For example, several prominent American Muslim organizations supported President Obama's 2010 health care reform proposal, under the belief that access to affordable health care is a fundamental human right.

In Muslim-majority countries, and in some non-Muslim countries, there is often an alternative to insurance available, called takaful. It is based on a cooperative, shared-risk model.

true_abde
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#16

Unread post by true_abde » Sun Mar 02, 2014 1:59 am

yawn !!!

salsabeel
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#17

Unread post by salsabeel » Sun Mar 02, 2014 2:12 am

james wrote:
Bohra spring wrote:
Insurance is the equitable transfer of the risk of a loss, from one entity to another in exchange for payment. It is a form of risk management primarily used to hedge against the risk of a contingent, uncertain loss.


Life insurance where the beneficiary is not the person or is a way of making money on death is questionable and debatable, While health insurance is something different

Health insurance is insurance against the risk of incurring medical expenses among individuals. By estimating the overall risk of health care and health system expenses, among a targeted group, an insurer can develop a routine finance structure, such as a monthly premium or payroll tax, to ensure that money is available to pay for the health care benefits specified in the insurance agreement.
Islam has ruled Insurance as haram . Perhaps reform is needed in Islam (Nozubillah ) . What do you say ? Let's start by first reforming Islam ( Nozubillah ) . How do you wanna proceed ? Petitions ? CIA ?
What do you have to say about the mandatory car insurance and the mandatory health insurance that all bohra in the United States possess, as dictated by law of the land. Maybe you and your puppeteers are planning to have all their followers leave the western lands.

james
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#18

Unread post by james » Sun Mar 02, 2014 2:20 am

SBM

It seems your agenda is to derail topics by going off on a tangent . This thread is about Health Insurance and now you have asked these stupid questions in an attempt to deflect the topic . I will reply to them nonetheless.
Islam also ruled to celebrate Dead Person's birthday as Haram and collecting Najwa on dead person's body ,(Nozubillah) What do you suggest.
It is not haram to celebrate Birthday of Prophet Mohammed SAW unless you subscribe to Wahab fiqh.
Islam also prohibited sending Lanaats to their own relatives (Nozubillah)
Yes , Abu Lahab was not a relative of Prophet Mohammed SAW. Seriously , are you even a Muslim ?
Syedna Taher Saifuddin in his Nashihat said not doing Ghibat of any Mumin.
That's true . The operative word being " mumin " . :wink:

canadian
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#19

Unread post by canadian » Sun Mar 02, 2014 2:23 am

Pardon my ignorance.
1. During Rasllallah's time, no one knew about insurance. There was no such concept as insurance. Then how did it become against Islam?
2. In western countries amils and sheikhs have cars and houses; do they not insure these? In case they do not get insurance coverage, then how can they get licence to operate the vehicles on the road? Also, what about masjids and prayer halls- are they not insured against fire and other liabilities?
3. There are a number of abdes who operate or work for travel agencies- do they not sell travel insurance to their clients?
4. I know a lot of people who work for corporations and government departments- Are they all acting against Islamic practice as they are all covered by group insurance?

james
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#20

Unread post by james » Sun Mar 02, 2014 3:57 am

canadian wrote:Pardon my ignorance.
1. During Rasllallah's time, no one knew about insurance. There was no such concept as insurance. Then how did it become against Islam?
Not according the Bohra Spring's article .
All human activities are subject to risk of loss from unforeseen events. To alleviate this burden to individuals, what we now call insurance has existed since at least 215 BC
Rasulullah SAW said about many events which will happen till the Day of Qayamat . To suggest that no one knew is an accusation on Allah Ta'ala and his noble Prophet SAW .
2. In western countries amils and sheikhs have cars and houses; do they not insure these? In case they do not get insurance coverage, then how can they get licence to operate the vehicles on the road? Also, what about masjids and prayer halls- are they not insured against fire and other liabilities?
canadian and salsabeel ,

It is agreed by most fiqh that it is permissible to pay for an insurance policy where it is the law of the land by a respective Government . Some fiqh say , Take policy , claim for it when any untoward incident happen , then take excess money and give it to charity . Some fiqh say , take policy and claim for it and then donate the entire sum to charity , Bohras are told by their Duat Mutlaqeen to take policy if it is mandatory and if not taking it runs contrary to the law of the land .However, we cannot claim on it . Bohras in USA and other countries take third party vehicular insurance and don't claim even if there is an accident . Ofcourse , there may be individual cases where Bohras may have taken life insurance policy and other variants . May Allah Ta'ala give them tawfeeq to do away with such policies .

3. There are a number of abdes who operate or work for travel agencies- do they not sell travel insurance to their clients?
They may be selling travel insurance . Personal instances shouldn't be a basis for establishing what Islam forbids and allows.
4. I know a lot of people who work for corporations and government departments- Are they all acting against Islamic practice as they are all covered by group insurance?
I have addressed this in my reply to 2)

james
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#21

Unread post by james » Sun Mar 02, 2014 4:06 am

Bohra Spring

Takaful counts for nothing if you cannot bring instances of it adopted by the Seal of the Prophethood Mohammed Mustafa SAW , his Cousin and Wasi e Amin Amirul Mumineen Ali AS , his blessed grandsons Hasan AS and Husain AS , his noble lineage of Imams AS ( Aimmat Tahereen ) and his Duat Mutlaqeen referred by him as " His brothers ".

I am waiting for your response why SMB deserved better medical facility then an aam admi ? Will SMS promise his abdes better health ?
It isn't forbidden by Islam to take medicine . One could argue why certain people are blessed with more wealth than others . One could argue why others are not blessed to be Muslims by Allah Ta'ala . Your argument is just that , for the sake of it .

Akhtiar Wahid
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#22

Unread post by Akhtiar Wahid » Sun Mar 02, 2014 5:00 am

true_abde wrote:@akhtiar wahid - you are one of the dumbest persons i have come across in a long time...
Dear True_abde bhai,

I can understand your pain and suffering after what you have been through, 1st your mental illness, then top of that the extortion of muffy. Now you have come down so low that you cannot comprehend the issues and questions which are of reform by nature, so you ultimately decided to call names and resort to vulgarness.

Sujud
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#23

Unread post by Sujud » Sun Mar 02, 2014 5:04 am

Mr James,
You should return back to stone age. Islam has not made use of common sense Haraam. Its impossible in certain countries to live without health insurance. There are scores of people who cannot get medical help and they suffer from ailments to lack of insurance. Nobody has forbidden the use of common sense. Not returning peopl what you owe them wont put in sin as well ( oh it also makes u a criminal in the court of law) one can definitely lead avery sane islamic life then.
Anyways carry on the great argument you are doing very well. I think standing ovation banta hain.

M Taha
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#24

Unread post by M Taha » Sun Mar 02, 2014 5:05 am

true_abde wrote:@akhtiar wahid - you are one of the dumbest persons i have come across in a long time...
really?

dont you see mirror every day?
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Fatema MN
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#25

Unread post by Fatema MN » Sun Mar 02, 2014 5:14 am

james wrote:
Syedna Taher Saifuddin in his Nashihat said not doing Ghibat of any Mumin.
That's true . The operative word being " mumin " . :wink:
You are wrong James bhai, STS did not limit it to mumin alone...

"na hargiz koi ne gaali de, na hargiz koi ni ghibat kar"

Also, Syedna Hatim has said in his book that ghibat should not be done of any person (mumin or otherwise), irrespective of whether the info about him/her is true or false.

In the last few weeks we have seen that 'gaalis' of the highest(rather lowest) level are being shouted from Saifee Mahal, our masjids and even on social media. Also, it is no secret that ghibat of Syedna Qutbuddin TUS has been done for years in the past... and continues even today.

If every mumin acted on the nasihat of STS (instead of just reciting it), today we would indeed be the most amazing community in this world.

M Taha
Posts: 372
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#26

Unread post by M Taha » Sun Mar 02, 2014 5:22 am

this is a fair example how muffy and his supporters are twisting hidayat of dai and hudood to fix up their own evil plans.

common sense says we should treat nicely to all human being, why would we abuse or do gibat for other human being?

in fact Imam Ali says "chose for others what you chose for your self".

wise_guy
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#27

Unread post by wise_guy » Sun Mar 02, 2014 5:25 am

The diktat was about life insurance n not about health insurance as it is crucial in countries like US with astronomical healthcare costs. Auto insurance is also compulsory so that was also excluded as it is required by the law.

The OPer needs to first listen the bayaan properly..

Bohra spring
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#28

Unread post by Bohra spring » Sun Mar 02, 2014 5:45 am

J what was this all about

Are you using stonewalling when you get cornered , so in 2014 the seal is with who now ?

Do you have a dictionary of the definitions of daily life affairs from 700 ad, because according to you life should be exactly the same...I am waiting for you and your master to be wearing a Bedouin cloth and riding a camel in that case.

You will not get it since your master has made you to stop using logic, he also does not know how to handle jurisprudence , it's too complicated, he does not know how to handle outside the palace life unless it is covered in legal tender or gold. Now what I suggest since this is a reformist site you let us debate and enlighten the people who want to discuss intellectually. But I know I will need to some how meander through your commentary .

No hard feeling I am enjoying your company gives me an insight and confirmation into the modern day abde mind and thought process.
Seal of the Prophethood Mohammed Mustafa SAW , his Cousin and Wasi e Amin Amirul Mumineen Ali , his blessed grandsons Hasan AS and Husain AS , his noble lineage of Imams AS ( Aimmat Tahereen ) and his Duat Mutlaqeen referred by him as " His brothers ".

james
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Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#29

Unread post by james » Sun Mar 02, 2014 6:19 am

Sujud wrote:Mr James,
You should return back to stone age. Islam has not made use of common sense Haraam. Its impossible in certain countries to live without health insurance. There are scores of people who cannot get medical help and they suffer from ailments to lack of insurance. Nobody has forbidden the use of common sense. Not returning peopl what you owe them wont put in sin as well ( oh it also makes u a criminal in the court of law) one can definitely lead avery sane islamic life then.
Anyways carry on the great argument you are doing very well. I think standing ovation banta hain.
Your common sense allows you to take insurance . No problem with that opinion . But why are you forcing your common sense on Allah Ta'ala's religion ? Insurance doesn't come under the gambit of Islam . By all means , do as your heart pleases . Just don't keep pushing it as Islamic .

Does your common sense allow you to believe in the arkan of Namaz ? Or you find it troublesome as well ? Come to think of it , why wake up so early to offer namaz ? What's the sense in that ?

james
Posts: 586
Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:06 am

Re: Health Insurance is'nt it haram according to 52nd Dai

#30

Unread post by james » Sun Mar 02, 2014 7:53 am

Fatema MN wrote:
james wrote: That's true . The operative word being " mumin " . :wink:
You are wrong James bhai, STS did not limit it to mumin alone...

"na hargiz koi ne gaali de, na hargiz koi ni ghibat kar"

Also, Syedna Hatim has said in his book that ghibat should not be done of any person (mumin or otherwise), irrespective of whether the info about him/her is true or false.

In the last few weeks we have seen that 'gaalis' of the highest(rather lowest) level are being shouted from Saifee Mahal, our masjids and even on social media. Also, it is no secret that ghibat of Syedna Qutbuddin TUS has been done for years in the past... and continues even today.

If every mumin acted on the nasihat of STS (instead of just reciting it), today we would indeed be the most amazing community in this world.
It is true Ghibat is extended to others as well .It is incumbent on every mumineen to not indulge in ghibat . Nevertheless , you should try to get views of Syedna Hatim RA and Syedna Taher Saifuddin RA on people who usurped the haq of Ali AS , more recently on Ali ibn Ibrahim who claimed Daiship for himself. :wink: