Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics)

The one and only free public forum for Bohras. The focus of this forum is the reform movement, the Dawoodi Bohra faith and, of course, the corrupt priesthood. But the discussion is in no way restricted to the Bohras alone.
white_pigeon
Posts: 105
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 12:37 pm

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#631

Unread post by white_pigeon » Sun Jan 26, 2014 6:46 am

admirer wrote:Just another thought..
Dai would be the sole owner of all trusts and properties. Shouldn't there be any official written proof of who is dai? Because it today's world if the matters go for arbitration, just a word of mouth would't suffice!

Any comments?
SKQ has proof. SMB has violent abusing gangsters who boycott everything they see rising against them.

Due to all these boycotting nonsense abd Majlis E Lannats in masjids daily. We have a new score.

Score 4-0 to SKQ

skater87
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2013 8:22 am

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#632

Unread post by skater87 » Sun Jan 26, 2014 8:00 am

The community is the biggest joke! Every ine is laughing at the community. This is a battle for power and money. Its pure politics. Religious leaders do not need to fight for the seat but automatically end up with followers as long as they are guiding them in the right path. But than again what is the right path? This is wrong and utterly unislamic. May Allah guide us all.


Lamiya
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2014 12:42 pm

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#634

Unread post by Lamiya » Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:06 am

seriousnessisamess wrote:Must read.
http://believesyednaqutbuddin.com/
i think this is a very good read .. answers quite a lot of question! Also related to some posts earlier about Abdeali clearly accepting the NASS makes me feel that the KQ camp either forgot that this was said or just conveniently overlooked it. These are not two different bayans, its the same bayan, where he clearly accepts that "NASS nu azeem amal farmayu" and he goes on to describe on who the NASS was performed and then the dua for tul al umar. How is one supposed to ignore this?

* i can write the whole clip here in english if someone was not able to hear it clearly, do let me know*

In any case, there are some lingering questions in this thread that i really feel have not been given importance. I also really feel that people in this thread have raised some valid points (valid in the eyes of a unbiased person) are pushed away conveniently and are either not commented on or are just forgotten. But honestly, two fundamental questions which i think we all should ponder upon before we make accusations:
1) Why did KQ not go to SMB right after the NASS at RAUDAT TAHERA? Yes, he wasn't present there like many other such instances, but well keeping all that aside, am I really supposed to believe that the second in command was not "allowed" to go meet the DAI (in person) for two years! The ruthba of mazoon is very elevated and i do believe that if he actually made an attempt he would be able to. Was he afraid of something? I have heard arguments that Abdeali tried to reach or something like that, not really sure, but why would abdeali want to reach SMB to talk about this? Where was KQ himself in the two years of the NASS?
2) As per the information on the website, the claim is that SMB asked KQ to keep the apparent nass to himself until it is time to disclose. So that raises a few questions in my head. But the most important is that a few months back, times of india published an article discussing a split within the community and that some people felt that KQ was the heir apparent. Saying so, how did times of india get this news? Inside job? If so then how could this inside person have known such a thing? Was it made up by them or was it shared by KQ himself? If made up by some people, then this whole discussion and the thread in fact is an absolute waste but if in fact KQ did reveal this to someone, he did break a vow to SMB! The DAI that he claims to succeed.

One final point before i wrap up, i do appreciate some of the users raising some logical points. I in no means acknowledge that its true i am merely saying that its logical and i respect it. However, it seems that over the past few days the logical discussions have taken a more hateful approach. It is very obvious that some users have a predefined notion in their head and are digging for proofs, words, actions that would justify their beliefs. But if this is to be dealt with logically than i guess keeping an open mind is a pre-requite.

seriousnessisamess
Posts: 91
Joined: Fri Oct 11, 2013 11:13 am

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#635

Unread post by seriousnessisamess » Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:22 am

@Lamiya
is it not beating them at thier own game?

ammar
Posts: 68
Joined: Wed Nov 16, 2005 5:01 am

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#636

Unread post by ammar » Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:25 am

I just want to point out that SKQ wrote a letter to SMS informing him the nass.

In the letter,SKQ swore to ALLAH,to SMB and to STS that the nass took place 50 years ago.

Can SMS swear too?

I am all in for SKQ! Zindabad! :mrgreen:

seriousnessisamess
Posts: 91
Joined: Fri Oct 11, 2013 11:13 am

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#637

Unread post by seriousnessisamess » Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:28 am

Look at what these dumb would are doing...

Mumbai Mirror Editor: Apology for the ill framed article against Dawoodi Bohra Community Leader - https://secure.avaaz.org/en/petition/Mu ... b&mobile=1

KM1
Posts: 66
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2013 5:25 am

CAN YOU TRUST KHUZAIMA?

#638

Unread post by KM1 » Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:34 am

kHUZAIMA

He ran way when the community needed him when their leader was no more is this a leadership Quality?

he first tried to secure is goods and is stuff and went to Thane. with 20 bags.

Today except is own family not a single brother or sister is supporting him or with him.

infact almost everyday her real sister written Qasida s are been prayed in Mola s shaan and saying ill things about her.

What betterment or upliftment has he done in 50 years in dawat.

All his waaz were mostly in praises of is own children then good teaching.


CAN WE TRUST HIM WHO S JUST LIVING FOR IS OWN SELF AND EGO

Lamiya
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2014 12:42 pm

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#639

Unread post by Lamiya » Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:43 am

seriousnessisamess wrote:@Lamiya
is it not beating them at thier own game?

@seriousnessisamess

Thanks for the prompt response. You are one of the only personnel on this thread i feel that has some common sense, the others seem to be pushing their own agenda.

Firstly, "Game" is too casual a term. By some of the posts it clearly seems that the PGDB have infact "chosen" who to follow based on some facts that are not even confirmed. Now seriously, when KQ launched his site, this forum was all WOW. Did anyone take a step back and question? Why would someone? Because it was something that was fitting the already predefined notions. Brother, Einstein would have never achieved what he did if he still believe Newton was correct :p :)
And, believe you me, if you do take an objective look at the site, keeping all the religious stuff aside and analyzing this solely from a third person point of view. you may also question the claims...the two most important ones i have written above.

Lastly, you ONLY answered the last bit brother :) :) ... and once again the main points were forgotten.

AMAFHH
Posts: 274
Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2012 3:19 am

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#640

Unread post by AMAFHH » Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:44 am

seriousnessisamess wrote:Sharmnaak haalaat
Aaj bohra community us tiraahe per khadi hai jiska ek raasta seyedna muffadhal ki taraf ,ek raasta seyedna khuzaima ki taraf aur teesra raasta sirat e mustaqeem ka hai . ab ya to qoum aankho per patti baandh kar pehla ya doosra raasta ikhtiyaar kare ya allah ki ashraf al makhlooq hone ka haq ada karte hue apni jismani , ruhaani aankhe khol kar teesra raasta ikhtiyaar kare.
Bhai
Dil ki Puri baat aap ne Likh di Jazakallah Khair
Allah (s.w.t) sab Dawoodi Bohra's ko Soch kar faislaa lene ki Taufeeq aata karay aur is Tyrant hukumat se najaat de
Ameen
Last edited by AMAFHH on Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:46 am, edited 1 time in total.

Lamiya
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2014 12:42 pm

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#641

Unread post by Lamiya » Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:45 am

ammar wrote:I just want to point out that SKQ wrote a letter to SMS informing him the nass.

In the letter,SKQ swore to ALLAH,to SMB and to STS that the nass took place 50 years ago.

Can SMS swear too?

I am all in for SKQ! Zindabad! :mrgreen:

How many politicians do we know that swear to give us all we need UNTIL the elections!

seems that KQ is no less than a politician :)

Also, swearing is not proof! Does he have any SHAHIDS! It is our imaan that when NASS takes place there are 3 shahids (whether this NASS is a private nass or a public nass)! Maybe, you need to think about this a little bit more. Don't shout out names, lets be civil about this!
Last edited by Lamiya on Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

seriousnessisamess
Posts: 91
Joined: Fri Oct 11, 2013 11:13 am

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#642

Unread post by seriousnessisamess » Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:46 am

@KM1
you are talking other way around
Skq is a very down,to earth guy.have never seen him coming with an,army of mullas even when he use to come,for ziarat.Just with 1 or 2 ppl.He is not even money greedy like muffi.
muffi in other hand is a investor.Look at his team.All curropted known people.Look wat he teaches.And read wat Skw teaches.
muffi scores 10 / 100
Skq scores 70 / 100

SBM
Posts: 6444
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#643

Unread post by SBM » Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:47 am

seems that KQ is no less than a politician :)
And what do you think about Mufffadal and his Goons. Felicitating Modi-Thackrey-and inviting Rajhastani CM to Taj Tower.
Why would a Religious leader invite and felicitate Yazids of the time :roll:

seriousnessisamess
Posts: 91
Joined: Fri Oct 11, 2013 11:13 am

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#644

Unread post by seriousnessisamess » Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:54 am

SBM
And what do you think about Mufffadal and his Goons. Felicitating Modi-Thackrey-and inviting Rajhastani CM to Taj Tower.
Why would a Religious leader invite and felicitate Yazids of the time :roll:....

when you are running a corporate show all over the world.When your branches are spread out in all the states,You have to have CMs and all in ur gloves so that the whole money laundering goes smoothly...

Lamiya
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2014 12:42 pm

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#645

Unread post by Lamiya » Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:55 am

SBM wrote:
seems that KQ is no less than a politician :)
And what do you think about Mufffadal and his Goons. Felicitating Modi-Thackrey-and inviting Rajhastani CM to Taj Tower.
Why would a Religious leader invite and felicitate Yazids of the time :roll:

@SBM: I liked you post for sheer lack of comprehension that you showed!

Firstly, we were talking about giving false promises and false swears. But you diverged AGAIN on something else.

SO just to indulge you, by facilitating the YAZIDIS of our time, SMS is walking on the foot-steps of SMB. SMB also meet and invite dignitaries of various castes. He shared meals with them, attended their gatherings. Would you say the same about him? On a wider note, Rasul (SAW) kept the three laeens with him, took them where he went, married their daughters? Was that facilitation a means to keep Islam alive or a mere intention of pleasure in your comprehension.

Now since i hope i have given you a fitting reply to your condescending question. Please be kind to reply to mine :)

Lamiya
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2014 12:42 pm

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#646

Unread post by Lamiya » Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:57 am

seriousnessisamess wrote:SBM
And what do you think about Mufffadal and his Goons. Felicitating Modi-Thackrey-and inviting Rajhastani CM to Taj Tower.
Why would a Religious leader invite and felicitate Yazids of the time :roll:....

when you are running a corporate show all over the world.When your branches are spread out in all the states,You have to have CMs and all in ur gloves so that the whole money laundering goes smoothly...

@seriousnessisamess

Is this your style of humor, cause it does crack me up :)

Anyways, you have some real unsubstantiated claims brother. But again, i do invite you to answer to my questions a few posts earlier.

SBM
Posts: 6444
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#647

Unread post by SBM » Sun Jan 26, 2014 10:03 am

Lamiya
First of all you are out of line comparing Rasullaha with Dai and his Goons What Prophet did was a direct command from Allaha. Rasul never lived the life of Ayaash and big Palaces.
Prophet gave up his business and his life to spread ISLAM, CAN MUFFADL GIVE UP HIS SAIFEE MAHAL AND ALL THE GALLAS AND EVERYTHING UP AND GET IN TRENCHES TO SPREAD DAWAT, INSTEAD OF FIGHTING SKQ HE CAN DO THE WORK OF RASUL AND AHL E BAYT (sorry for shouting to get attention- that is what I learned from Kothari Goons which they are doing now)
And if SMS is doing what SMB did felicitating Yazids of the time then definetly SMB was not infallible or Masoom and neither is SMS
Lamiya
Pl answer did SMB erred by appointing SKQ, if SMB is infallible and Ghaib na Jankar how did he appoint the wrong person for the position of Mazoon and then SMS took Misaq on that Mazoon for 50 years
So do you think both SMB and SMS are not Infallible and Masoom and were tempted with worldly pleasures

seriousnessisamess
Posts: 91
Joined: Fri Oct 11, 2013 11:13 am

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#648

Unread post by seriousnessisamess » Sun Jan 26, 2014 10:05 am

Oh yes,The whole money laundering issue is based on facts,These guru of my city was caught and questioned about the investment (huge sum of money) from mumbai which and how it was invested in a super housing estate,which had nothing to do with dawat.It was immediately settled beaneath the table and named were changed on the papers.Thanks it was unfolded.

juzerali
Posts: 68
Joined: Mon Jul 23, 2012 3:11 am

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#649

Unread post by juzerali » Sun Jan 26, 2014 10:09 am

I think @Lamiya is clearly pushing his agenda. He is asking for open mindedness, but is not doing so himself. His posts are clearly biased towards SMS. I am actually enamored by the subtlety with which he has put forth his point. I would like to make a point here bro, most people here didn't, and still don't agree with policies of Syedna Muhammed Burhanuddin. SMB was the reason this forum was put in place to begin with.
Moreover people here are experienced enough to understand the nuances of abdes in defending their masters under the cloak of Rasulullah (SWT). But mind you brother Prophet Muhammed (PBUH) and Ahlul-bayt didn't live a lavish life and didn't rob mumins of their money. So it is you who is giving vague replies and diverging from topic and not the @SBM as you claim. He was just making a point against yours, a valid one at that.

Lamiya
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2014 12:42 pm

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#650

Unread post by Lamiya » Sun Jan 26, 2014 10:38 am

SBM wrote:Lamiya
First of all you are out of line comparing Rasullaha with Dai and his Goons What Prophet did was a direct command from Allaha. Rasul never lived the life of Ayaash and big Palaces.
Prophet gave up his business and his life to spread ISLAM, CAN MUFFADL GIVE UP HIS SAIFEE MAHAL AND ALL THE GALLAS AND EVERYTHING UP AND GET IN TRENCHES TO SPREAD DAWAT, INSTEAD OF FIGHTING SKQ HE CAN DO THE WORK OF RASUL AND AHL E BAYT (sorry for shouting to get attention- that is what I learned from Kothari Goons which they are doing now)
And if SMS is doing what SMB did felicitating Yazids of the time then definetly SMB was not infallible or Masoom and neither is SMS
Lamiya
Pl answer did SMB erred by appointing SKQ, if SMB is infallible and Ghaib na Jankar how did he appoint the wrong person for the position of Mazoon and then SMS took Misaq on that Mazoon for 50 years
So do you think both SMB and SMS are not Infallible and Masoom and were tempted with worldly pleasures
Ok. I will answer all those questions. But i guess i was first in the question i asked to all. If these are genuine concerns (and i am sure they are to you with all respect) lets debate it like civilized human beings rather than name callings!

So i will leave this floor to you to answer the questions i raised which are of immediate attention, than we will come to why SMS and the duats before him have lived a certain lifestyle that they do.

paani wala doodh
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Jan 24, 2014 3:40 pm

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#651

Unread post by paani wala doodh » Sun Jan 26, 2014 10:46 am

@ Admin

why were my posts deleted?

awaken
Posts: 11
Joined: Sat Jan 25, 2014 2:42 pm

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#652

Unread post by awaken » Sun Jan 26, 2014 10:51 am

Is Lamiya Male of Female?
How do we address her/him?

seriousnessisamess
Posts: 91
Joined: Fri Oct 11, 2013 11:13 am

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#653

Unread post by seriousnessisamess » Sun Jan 26, 2014 10:53 am

Also add.When SBM came to Kolkata few years back,There was a proper rate chart 52Lakh to become a Shaikh.And whoever became one ,dont even know I of islam.
So many learned people who have such a deep roots to deeni taleem are sitting behind the big businessmen who have paid 52 Lakh to become so call Shaikh.

Lamiya
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2014 12:42 pm

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#654

Unread post by Lamiya » Sun Jan 26, 2014 10:54 am

juzerali wrote:I think @Lamiya is clearly pushing his agenda. He is asking for open mindedness, but is not doing so himself. His posts are clearly biased towards SMS. I am actually enamored by the subtlety with which he has put forth his point. I would like to make a point here bro, most people here didn't, and still don't agree with policies of Syedna Muhammed Burhanuddin. SMB was the reason this forum was put in place to begin with.
Moreover people here are experienced enough to understand the nuances of abdes in defending their masters under the cloak of Rasulullah (SWT). But mind you brother Prophet Muhammed (PBUH) and Ahlul-bayt didn't live a lavish life and didn't rob mumins of their money. So it is you who is giving vague replies and diverging from topic and not the @SBM as you claim. He was just making a point against yours, a valid one at that.

Maybe being sexist is part of your agenda brother. My name suggests my gender clearly. However, no point in discussing this with you right?

So to the point .. just a background about myself .. i was born into a hindu family! .. but then my religion dint really make sense to me. So i did go out in search for truth. At first Islam put me off, how can a religion claiming to be righteous have so many separation. Then i did my OWN research and NOT believed on hear say that clearly a lot of people hear tend to incline themselves to. Based on years of research on cross religious studies, I decided to convert to ISLAM (SUNNI ISLAM). This was not enough as we all know the loop holes in their version of islam. And it goes on anyways, i do not want to bore you and other here on the forum, you must have got where i was going with this. So just to sum it up, it is very unfair on your part if not utterly shallow to say that i was pushing my agenda and not having an open mind. I left my family and faced the world alone and you have no right to be so disrespectful. Maybe some soul searching is necessary for you brother.

However, i dont want to talk to people like you on this forum. i have been following your nonsense and feel its a total waste of my time (and i hope others feel too) that your arguments are either full of biased, self developed nonsense. You are better off claiming to be a dai yourself.
But just to answer your question in one sentence and i am sure you will have some rather rubbish thing to say about it but nonetheless .. there were imams who ruled misr for generations? did they not live a lavish lifestyle? What about Nabi Sulaiman? He was a king? well to the wise, a connection here is enough.

I am not interested in talking to you, so please dont bother replying cause i am not answering to shallow disrespectful person like you! Btw .. SBM can respond by himself and does not require any support by the likes of you to validate his point!

To all those who feel like having a genuine conversation you are more than welcome.
Last edited by Lamiya on Sun Jan 26, 2014 11:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

Lamiya
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2014 12:42 pm

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#655

Unread post by Lamiya » Sun Jan 26, 2014 10:55 am

awaken wrote:Is Lamiya Male of Female?
How do we address her/him?

Female .. :) you can address me by "her".

taz52
Posts: 16
Joined: Sun Jan 26, 2014 12:33 am

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#656

Unread post by taz52 » Sun Jan 26, 2014 11:01 am

For those who feel imam didn't live a kings life. Have a look at Imam Moiz if you deny that fact. Either you people have no knowledge or you don't consider Imam Moiz as an Imam

Admin
Posts: 678
Joined: Fri Dec 08, 2000 5:01 am

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#657

Unread post by Admin » Sun Jan 26, 2014 11:15 am

Please keep posts relevant to the topic. Thank you.

seriousnessisamess
Posts: 91
Joined: Fri Oct 11, 2013 11:13 am

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#658

Unread post by seriousnessisamess » Sun Jan 26, 2014 11:15 am

Extract from Late Dr,Asger ali engineer.
All prophets in the Qur'an were from very poorer sections of people. <br>They were mostly from amongst those who grazed cattle in pastoral economy <br>or those who were carpenters, masons etc. There are only two <br>exceptions: Prophets Daud and Sulayman who were kings. Allah made them prophets <br>to show that even kings, if they do not oppress and lead exemplary life according to His teachings, can be entitled to be prophets. Otherwise Allah made all other prophets from weaker sections of society to help weaker sections. Muhammad Rasulullah (PBUH) also was from weaker section of the society.<p>Imam Moiz was also a ruler like other Fatimid rulers who were Imams. But if you study his private life it was full of zuhud (piety). Syedna Qadi al-Numan has written his diary Al-Majalis wa al-Musairat which <br>describes some of the conversations with Imam Moiz which gives us insight about his life. Frtankly speaking the Imams and dais should have nothing to do with politics to provide real guidance and for enriching spiritual life of their followers. That is why all prophets with two exceptions were from weaker sections of socety.

paani wala doodh
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Jan 24, 2014 3:40 pm

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#659

Unread post by paani wala doodh » Sun Jan 26, 2014 11:20 am

@ admin

one post was in reply to someone asking proof nabi is nabi, i understand u deleting that.

but the second post, was a very logical presentation of facts in a simple manner concluding Khozema Qudbuddin technically has the upper hand in seeking the post of Dai. Isnt that what all the discussion on this thread about?
lol, why was that deleted as well??

Admin
Posts: 678
Joined: Fri Dec 08, 2000 5:01 am

Re: Khuzema bhaisaheb Qutbuddin is 53rd dai

#660

Unread post by Admin » Sun Jan 26, 2014 11:24 am

That must be by mistake. Sorry. Please post it again.