Stuck in the middle after sayedna's death

[Gulaame Islaam]

Bahen, 24 yrs to gani nani umar kahewai. Hun pan 24 waras no hato tyaare die hard woro hato. Hawe to hun 65+ waras no thayo. Ganu joyu, ganu shikhyo, . Hawe aankh ugdi. Bahen Bluesky ni waat sachi nathi. Hu ane gana khara open minded wora diwas ma 10 thi bar kalaak kam karye che. Hard work che. Enaj lidhe duk thaiche ke apna wadilo ubha ubha hath lambo kare and paisa lai laiche, kai kam karya wagar, e wyajbi ke Just nathi lagtu. Khuda ni aankhma aapnama ane aa wadilo ma kai ferek nathi.

[Gulaame Islaam]

Mojizas do not define a holy man. A holy person is a person who lives a holy life and does holy deeds. We are Shiites, which means we follow the example of Imam Ali. And why did our forefathers decide that? Because he was a truly holy person. Read what historians have to say about him, and this was written about him by his compatriots :Remember he was an Emperor of Islaam which was a huge empire then:
"He was very pious and God fearing person and often such people avoid society and do not mix with people who are sinful and men of wrath. Similarly kings and emperors are arrogant and haughty, and they consider it below themselves to mix with the poor , lowly and humble people. But Ali was different. He was friend to all. As a matter of fact he had a tender spot in his heart for poor and humble and for orphans and cripples. To them he was always a kind friend, a sympathetic guide and a fellow sufferer; he was meek unto them but arrogant against famous warriors and generals , so many of whom he killed in hand to hand combat. He was always kind but strict. He always smiled and passed happy comments. He was full of knowledge , wisdom, and a great orator."
What has happened to such ideals in our so called Shiite community? All we see is worship of money and elevating the rich to positions of power so that the poor have no say in anything. Your character and wisdom and love of God and the needy seem to have no place in the society. You are good Bohra so long as you pay what they ask for not what you can afford! Maulaana Ali would not like such a society If he were alive today.

[ghulam muhammed]

How come Syedna Burhanuddin could not perform Mojiza on himself and cure his ill health instead of going to Germany. He could have performed Mojiza to clear his voice when announcing the Nuss on Muffadal.
It is a Mojiza that he could not speak so that son in law and Quaid CHOR can do instead of him

SMB could not perform mojiza on his own daughter Sakina who was diagnosed with CANCER and she ultimately died !!

[Bohra_by_birth]

I believe I was a die hearted abde believer and was tthe same like other abdes. Did not wanted to hear anything against them. Still my heart doesnt allow me to say or hear anything abt aqa moula but on the other hand my mind now is not allowing me to accept muffadal moula as dai after reading all the stuff on this forum
I am a lady and for me to go against the norms and my family is very hard. Cannot say my views to anyone so decided to write on this forum.
I have brains and really now want to know and stop the ayyashi of kothar.

I so identify with you sister. I too am a bohra woman. God give us courage.

[msdubai]

Great to see ladies on this forum because i believe that we are the ones who can bring most of the changes. But then also most of the bohra ladies main work in the whole day is to talk what was said in the waaz or who was able to do maoulas deedar or we should accept blindly whatever is said to us from Kothar. We as ladies should not put any questions just accept what is said.
My husband doesnt want to hear a single word about kothar and so is the case with my in laws. But still there is one thing which I noticed that is that even they are talking that Moula has not done nass in his own words and we should not scold or send lanats to Mazoon as he is also son of Dai.
Today in Dubai they made it compulsory to attend the live relay vaaz of muffadal moula. They send mails like you have to close your shops, you have to take leave from your office and not to send children to school as this vaaz is so important. ITS cards will be scanned and action will be taken against those who will not attend
Now my question is that religion is something which you accept from your heart and not from force. So why do you force. if someone wants to come they will for sure come but there should not be any force. I think kothar is really afraid now and thats why just want to gather all the public daily and make them emotional so that they dont divert from there path.

[Free_Spirit]

msdubai, I too am a lady and thank God I went to school and college before reign of Muffadal Bhaisaab, or else I would have been sitting in a corner lapping up whatever lies I was fed, happily crocheting topis ! My mum is not ready to listen. I have said elsewhere as well on this forum that our women are holding our men back ! If an entire family were to change allegiance, it would set an example for the rest of us ordinary people. Take Khorakiwalal's for example. I personally feel that at this moment in time, SKQ is more well equipped to reform kothar as he knows what and who he is dealing with.

[DMY]

msdubai, I too am a lady and thank God I went to school and college before reign of Muffadal Bhaisaab, or else I would have been sitting in a corner lapping up whatever lies I was fed, happily crocheting topis ! My mum is not ready to listen. I have said elsewhere as well on this forum that our women are holding our men back ! If an entire family were to change allegiance, it would set an example for the rest of us ordinary people. Take Khorakiwalal's for example. I personally feel that at this moment in time, SKQ is more well equipped to reform kothar as he knows what and who he is dealing with.

It's heartening to see that at least some women from the community are able to think rationally and are not blind followers anymore. For me i have been lucky that my wife is over this hogwash since the past 2 years and i can have open conversations with her about the current issues and happenings in the community. I have distanced myself a lot from the community and pay bare minimum taxes to keep my membership. That too for the fact that my parents health is failing and they are too scared to mess with there final rituals. Not being insensitive but the day they are gone i am gonna walk up to the aamil and surrender my ITS. I also got emails about the strict attendance policy in Sharjah for today but who cares. They can take whatever action they want, doesn't scare me anymore. I am not dependent on the community for my survival.

[bluesky]

I dont belive tht u all r dawoodi bohra else u r not talk like this....n may b u not beliver of Moula syedna Mohammad burhanuddin ...else u not talk like this

or possible

u r not the ladies ...u r some one else out frm the community distracting people as always seen in the forum..:/

[Bohra_by_birth]

I dont belive tht u all r dawoodi bohra else u r not talk like this....n may b u not beliver of Moula syedna Mohammad burhanuddin ...else u not talk like this

or possible

u r not the ladies ...u r some one else out frm the community distracting people as always seen in the forum..:/

You wish bluesky! I am a lady and very much a dawoodi bohra. And its not that I have changed suddenly. I always questioned the system. But couldn't rebel as I love my mum too much (though I can say that she too isn't the oh so orthodox and typical dawoodi bohra lady, but then her circle is). Comes from the genes I guess. My dad is like me too. And luckily my husband is not the guy who would roam in white uniforms. And he is clean shaven! And he too is a dawoodi bohra! And I am just too glad that people like us exist elsewhere too. Like in this forum. Had lost hope otherwise.

[Gulaame Islaam]

I too am so happy that at least some of us are talking. I left the community more than 40 years ago. It was painful and still is but at least I feel free. I am looking for like minded Bohras who are not afraid to talk and get together in my house or in a hall somewhere and practice real Islaam which I have come to Love so deerly. I have grown to love the courage and wisdom of Rasulullah and maulaana Ali even more than ever before by studying Al Quran and Nahjul Balaga on my own. I decided to run away on my own 50 yrs ago when I realized, in E Africa, how our leaders took money out of our jamaat to India to their Kothar when we were struggling to survive after all the political turmoil in E Africa.
They call themselves holy muslims with direct contact with God. That is total rubbish. God as described in Quran is not an entity. It was never born, and it has no projeny. They scare us with death and going to jahannam, but they have created a jahannam for us here by causing so much anguish in our lives. Isa Nabee says jannet and jahannam are right here on earth.
Their main interest is our money. Talk to people who gave them a lot of money once but now cant because they lost it. They dont even recognise them I have a close friend who calls them Robbers now. At one time he was kissing their feet. All these rules they are creating are to create fear, divisions and ignorance so they can continue to loot us. It is really up to us individually to have the courage to walk away from them. Look at what Gandhijee accomplished. He simply ignored the laws of the british and boycoted them. It is hard but it can be done. Pleas let me know if you will join me in statring a group to come together. I live in Chicago and we can figure out how to get together.

[msdubai]

Dear bluesky
I am a lady and dawoodi bohra as well. Firstly I am not against moula I am against the system. Also I think I believe in buhanuddin moula more than you. Still I cannot stop my tears on his death but again im still not happy with the system so atleast on this forum I can speak up my heart. The system of money making is making all of us go against all this

[Gulaame Islaam]

Dear msdubai;
I totally agree. Keep up your strength and patience. We need more people like you to think deeply about what is going on. Religion is practiced to bring us peace and harmony. Our kind of religion is creating nothing but pain and suffering and "bojo".

[bluesky]

Dear bluesky
I am a lady and dawoodi bohra as well. Firstly I am not against moula I am against the system. Also I think I believe in buhanuddin moula more than you. Still I cannot stop my tears on his death but again im still not happy with the system so atleast on this forum I can speak up my heart. The system of money making is making all of us go against all this

this is not the forum to talk about the system...u should go to Moula Tus to talk about ur concerns n what do u think...ofcous systm is little shaken due to some people.... but thts we can not blame on Moula...if u r hurted by the system U should talk to Moula Direct ...n if we talk about the SYSTEM ...tell me which system in the world is not shaken...:$

[msdubai]

Dear blue sky

Wow what a reply u have given me. Very realistic. Wilk u take me to moula direct to speak up without paying a single penny from my pocket then I will for sure go with u. Yes systems are shaken everywhere but again there needs yo be control on the ayyashi of kothar. Dont u think so. Think from ur mind and not from ur heart.

In our community where its hard to get deedar of moula ur advising me to directly go to him. Will u take me im ready to come

[AgnosticTheist]

if u r hurted by the system U should talk to Moula Direct ...n if we talk about the SYSTEM ...tell me which system in the world is not shaken...:$

Wow, the first system in the world where you need lakhs and crores of rupees in your pockets to file a direct complaint. I am impressed!

Brother, even in personal Ziyafats they don't give you more than a minute to talk with the Dai directly.

[Gulaame Islaam]

I have always been amazed by the reply I get from Bohra brothers when I raise this issue. They say that it is not the fault of Sayyedina that all these atrocities are going on. It is the people below him. He has no idea about what is going on!
How is this possible?

[ghulam muhammed]

I have always been amazed by the reply I get from Bohra brothers when I raise this issue. They say that it is not the fault of Sayyedina that all these atrocities are going on. It is the people below him. He has no idea about what is going on!

And sill these dumb fools believe that he is "Ghaib na Jankar" !!

[Free_Spirit]

I dont belive tht u all r dawoodi bohra else u r not talk like this....n may b u not beliver of Moula syedna Mohammad burhanuddin ...else u not talk like this

or possible

u r not the ladies ...u r some one else out frm the community distracting people as always seen in the forum..:/

You can think what you like, hun:)

[Gulaame Islaam]

I am amazed at how masterful the so called religious leaders can be in brain washing innocent people for ages. So much of what we have been told makes no sense and is totally against the tenants of Islaam. Yet people do not question. I now understand why they did not teach us Arabic, did not allow us to read Al Quraan translations, or read other religious books like the Bhagavat Geeta, one of the oldest religious writings! Our ignorance is their bliss.

[think]

b.s. dont blame the leader as you say . It is only a few rotten apples. In my life everywhere i went ,whether in the jamaats of africa, india, pakistan, england or u.s. i saw thugs everywhere. So it is not a few bad apples. The whole system is corrupt to the core. And it is understandable because the price to become a so called khidmat guzar i.e. a volunteer to help is not ones character or conduct but who can shout mola the most and who spends money the most.

[Free_Spirit]

I am amazed at how masterful the so called religious leaders can be in brain washing innocent people for ages. So much of what we have been told makes no sense and is totally against the tenants of Islaam. Yet people do not question. I now understand why they did not teach us Arabic, did not allow us to read Al Quraan translations, or read other religious books like the Bhagavat Geeta, one of the oldest religious writings! Our ignorance is their bliss.

Well said Sir !

[Gulaame Islaam]

b.s. dont blame the leader as you say . It is only a few rotten apples. In my life everywhere i went ,whether in the jamaats of africa, india, pakistan, england or u.s. i saw thugs everywhere. So it is not a few bad apples. The whole system is corrupt to the core. And it is understandable because the price to become a so called khidmat guzar i.e. a volunteer to help is not ones character or conduct but who can shout mola the most and who spends money the most.

Dear think;
Here i hvae to beg to disagree in one way. A leader is a leader because he has agreed to lead the organization. The organization consists of his assistants who carry out his policies and the lay people (who He claims are His people) who, like the workers in a beehive, are out busy working for themselves and the organization. It is His duty that everyone works according to the leader's dictates and vision of the society. If someone is abusing his position and creating suffering in His people, then He needs to get rid of that person. The quality of the system is His responsibility. People pay HIm very well for that position and responsibility. If he sits in his chair and is not paying attention to what is going on in his society, then He does not belong in that position; He does not deserve that position. To claim that God gave Him that position, and it should not be questioned, is very hard to believe in this day and age. If one does believe that, then one is living in the Dark ages.
Unfortunately They have made sure that Bohras are stuck in the Dark ages. Worse still, we have allowed ourselves to bury our heads in sand and disappear in the Dark basements of todays world. We have stopped thinking and questiong (hard work) and allowed our so called leaders to play with us like puppets.

[AgnosticTheist]

Whenever the company succeeds, its CEO is praised and rewarded. And when the company goes down, the blame goes to the same CEO (whether its his own fault or not).

This is the common and well acknowledged norm since ages. A leader is the one who takes all the praises and he is also the one who takes all the blames. He is responsible for everyone under him.

[think]

Mr. Hassan ali; it is the chosen staff of the dai that makes sure the mumineen are under submission. It has to be per his dictats. Take for eg. Ziafat. the dai never asks the host as to how much salams and najwa would he give him. It is the Dai's staff that will harass you to the hilt to get the maximum out of you. i have seen it and have endured it. not only that, big money salam envelopes have to be given out to a staff member of the dai's party for all his children and wives etc even if they are not present in the ziafat. such are the facts. do you still believe that the dai is masoom and is unaware of the high handedness of his staff. I beg to differ. The Dai's behaviour will be according to the money purse given. Little time and a handkercief for little money and more time for more money.

[Gulaame Islaam]

Dear think. I totally agree with you. I think Dai has to feel responsible for what is happenening and like you , I think he knows what is happening. After all he was a young man and a subordinate to the previous Dais at one time.

[silvertongue]

this is not the forum to talk about the system...u should go to Moula Tus to talk about ur concerns n what do u think...

Answer me one simple thing. Do u think Rasulallah (s.a.w.w) or Maula Ali (a.s) used to ask money from people who come for their help. If so then they wouldev been the most wealthiest person in the world. But the thing is they were God fearing people and the world knows it. Muffi and his gang only knows how to use the name of Allah.. o sorry.. theyev forgotten him long back.. the name of Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin bawa i shld say.. and earn money from the followers.. I simply salute the Dai how he has brainwashed them all. What a technique. Even Dajjal might be wondering how will he tackle these group.. Bst of luck Future Bohras...

Jazakallah.

[Al-Muizz]

Dear bluesky
I am a lady and dawoodi bohra as well. Firstly I am not against moula I am against the system. Also I think I believe in buhanuddin moula more than you. Still I cannot stop my tears on his death but again im still not happy with the system so atleast on this forum I can speak up my heart. The system of money making is making all of us go against all this

this is not the forum to talk about the system...u should go to Moula Tus to talk about ur concerns n what do u think...ofcous systm is little shaken due to some people.... but thts we can not blame on Moula...if u r hurted by the system U should talk to Moula Direct ...n if we talk about the SYSTEM ...tell me which system in the world is not shaken...:$

Hahahahaha.....and how will you get to Moula? via the so called khidmat ghuzarooos;)

Lady, you have been sleeping for far too long, or you are loaded with cash and can bribe and buy your way to salvation.....

[Bohra spring]

Dear bluesky
I am a lady and dawoodi bohra as well. Firstly I am not against moula I am against the system. Also I think I believe in buhanuddin moula more than you. Still I cannot stop my tears on his death but again im still not happy with the system so atleast on this forum I can speak up my heart. The system of money making is making all of us go against all this

Lady who owns the system...Maula , who nominates the administrators.....Maula ....who gets credit for all the so called positives....Maula , whose arrogant princes control the dawat....Maula ....whose name do we assign all complements...Maula

But when things don't go well....ok so in this case it is not Maula .

I like that discipline .

We are completely staggered by realisation the stupidity in some of the community people.

[Mkenya]

Bohra Spring:
You could not have said it better!
dubai lady:
Just wait; you have seen nothing yet!