Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

The one and only free public forum for Bohras. The focus of this forum is the reform movement, the Dawoodi Bohra faith and, of course, the corrupt priesthood. But the discussion is in no way restricted to the Bohras alone.
JC
Posts: 1624
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1591

Unread post by JC » Thu Aug 14, 2014 10:39 am

fustrate_Bohra wrote:As a laymen p.o.v Matam means expressing GRIEF and so its not only restricted to Shiah or Bohra but it can be done by followers of any religion be it Hindu, Muslim, Christians, Sikh, parsis...... I believe when people are in extreme grief matam happens automatically.

How can a person do Matam when he is in Happy mood?
Bohras can do Matam 24/7 ............. who says they do not do it when they are happy ............ they even do it in WEDDINGS .............. :roll:

JC
Posts: 1624
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1592

Unread post by JC » Thu Aug 14, 2014 10:41 am

Frustrated Bohra,

For Bohras Matam is ritual ONLY ............... it has NOTHING to do with grief .............

rational_guy
Posts: 205
Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:21 am

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1593

Unread post by rational_guy » Thu Aug 14, 2014 10:48 am

just heard that kothar made a big deal with indian bank that will bring all bohris in india to open a current account with them. Then they will have a direct debit facility for
1. sabeel, 2. thaali 3. zakaat 4. vajebaat etc

any one who opens a bank account will be in economic slavery of the kothar. Forum readers you might consider warning your relatives.

fustrate_Bohra
Posts: 678
Joined: Mon Nov 25, 2013 6:46 am

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1594

Unread post by fustrate_Bohra » Thu Aug 14, 2014 10:51 am

JC wrote:
fustrate_Bohra wrote:As a laymen p.o.v Matam means expressing GRIEF and so its not only restricted to Shiah or Bohra but it can be done by followers of any religion be it Hindu, Muslim, Christians, Sikh, parsis...... I believe when people are in extreme grief matam happens automatically.

How can a person do Matam when he is in Happy mood?
Bohras can do Matam 24/7 ............. who says they do not do it when they are happy ............ they even do it in WEDDINGS .............. :roll:
Yes they do and thats y I feel How can they express sorrow when their is some functions going on And doing Matam without grief its like clapping on a speech which you dont understand.

Akhtiar Wahid
Posts: 804
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 9:22 am

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1595

Unread post by Akhtiar Wahid » Thu Aug 14, 2014 11:48 am

KOTHAR is a no.1 hypocrite on planet Earth.
first they tell us not to deposit our money in Banks as it is involved with RIBA (INTEREST) and now they are implementing a bank system for bohras in which their DUES get deducted automatically! WAH BHAI WAH, CHIT BHI MERA PAT BHI MERA!

JC
Posts: 1624
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1596

Unread post by JC » Thu Aug 14, 2014 1:52 pm

Akhtiar Wahid wrote:KOTHAR is a no.1 hypocrite on planet Earth.
first they tell us not to deposit our money in Banks as it is involved with RIBA (INTEREST) and now they are implementing a bank system for bohras in which their DUES get deducted automatically! WAH BHAI WAH, CHIT BHI MERA PAT BHI MERA!
Daulat aur Takat Kay Leay KUCH Bee Karay Ga ..............

JC
Posts: 1624
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1597

Unread post by JC » Thu Aug 14, 2014 1:56 pm

Frustrate Bohra,

It has long gone when Bohras use to associate and attach Matam with Grief for Hussain ............ now it is just a mere ritual. Just observe abdes doing Matam after Farz namaz and you will realize what they really believe Matam is ........... it has become a part like bohras have Majlis or Darees on EACH and EVERY occasion; they do matam 24/7 because it is simply NOT something associated with great Gham-e-Hussain .......... or in fact with any Gham, they now believe that 'we have to do Matam for More-La Khushi; because More-La and his henchmen say this'.

seeker110
Posts: 1727
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:01 am

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1598

Unread post by seeker110 » Thu Aug 14, 2014 2:05 pm

The Mola family is like a shark with Dr. degree. An efficient killing machine. They have no education or knowledge to go into religion or books pertaining to religion.

haqniwaat
Posts: 516
Joined: Wed Aug 06, 2014 6:06 pm

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1599

Unread post by haqniwaat » Thu Aug 14, 2014 2:46 pm

IMG-20140611-WA0008.jpg
The revered mufaddal bs on "shikaar". These photos were sent all over the place - even knowing that in India, the elephant is considered to be a god. Blatant disregard for neighbors and the country of residence.

haqniwaat
Posts: 516
Joined: Wed Aug 06, 2014 6:06 pm

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1600

Unread post by haqniwaat » Thu Aug 14, 2014 2:47 pm

IMG-20140611-WA0009.jpg
Wonder what Mr. Narendra Modi will think of this.

seeker110
Posts: 1727
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:01 am

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1601

Unread post by seeker110 » Thu Aug 14, 2014 2:54 pm

Modi cant help if the community wants to stay hijacked in the name of religion. Besides he is more than happy to partake in the zakat money.

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1602

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Thu Aug 14, 2014 3:12 pm

rational_guy wrote:just heard that kothar made a big deal with indian bank that will bring all bohris in india to open a current account with them. Then they will have a direct debit facility for
1. sabeel, 2. thaali 3. zakaat 4. vajebaat etc

any one who opens a bank account will be in economic slavery of the kothar. Forum readers you might consider warning your relatives.
Received a watsup msg :-

Our Community leaders have tied-up with Kotak Mahindra Bank, who are offering our community members an interest free, free of cost, maintenance-free Current account with Zero Quarterly account balance, yes, you read it right. No hidden charges, all standard banking feature such as Anywhere Banking, Internet & Mobile Banking, Debit Card, Cheque Book, etc.. etc... And what's more exciting is that the account will have a customized ID that is your ITS52 (eJamaat) ID prefixed with 53. Say your ITS ID is 21212121, then your Current account no. with the bank will be "5321212121".
The bank will not credit any interest to your account & will not entertain any services that has interest component associated with it.
How do you open such an account?
Simple, just TEXT an SMS "KDB" & send it to 5676788 & you'll receive a call back from the Bank representative in Mumbai. Your account will be opened with the nearest branch of your preference."

seeker110
Posts: 1727
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:01 am

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1603

Unread post by seeker110 » Thu Aug 14, 2014 3:24 pm

Now what will the bank do with the money?

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1604

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Thu Aug 14, 2014 3:55 pm

seeker110 wrote:Now what will the bank do with the money?
Finance Muffy's upcoming bungalows/palaces worldwide !

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1605

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Thu Aug 14, 2014 4:07 pm

watsup msg :

Money, Money, Money...... Muffy and Kothar dreaming day and night !

Latest sad news that NAKURU Masjid was not opened because the 10 Million was not raised in time by Nakuru Jamat for opening and waqf of Masjid. They could only raise half i.e. 5 Million..... The cost of masjid was 20 Million built and donated by the Royals but Muffy got upset that no contribution came from Nakuru Mumenin and instead could raise only 5 Million instead of 10 Million. So instead the plane was diverted to Nairobi and all over 1000 people returned back to Nairobi from Nakuru (What a Joke !!).

In Nairobi, 40 Ziyafats were performed in 2 hours (3 minutes for each Ziyafat) and Muffy collected 40 Million !!

Over 100 Nakuru people are so frustrated and disappointed that they could not pray in Masjid in the holy month of Ramzan and missed the 25 sawabs by not praying namaz in Masjid. Over half of the 100 upset Mumenin of Nakuru have written a letter to Government of Kenya to stop Muffy in his entourage to enter Kenya !!

Written by a frustrated Nakuru Mumenin.

It is heard that Syedna Khuzema Qutbuddin is willing to open the Nakuru Masjid and in return he will donate 10 Million to Nakuru Mumenin for upliftment in business.

New
Posts: 440
Joined: Fri Jan 24, 2014 9:49 pm

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1606

Unread post by New » Thu Aug 14, 2014 9:02 pm

GM bhai what currency are we taking about? Was he on a chartered plane? Or hijacked a commercial liner? Soon nirali shan che...

Adam
Posts: 1261
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1607

Unread post by Adam » Fri Aug 15, 2014 10:39 am

haqniwaat wrote:
1. Yes he was the Mazoon. It has already been proven in court during Syedna Taher Saifuddin's time. That same evidence has been submitter for the current case.
says Adam.
Read mausam e bahar. There's no mention of Ali bin Ibrahim being mazoon. But then who is surprised. Those who will go to all ends creating a twisted theory of zahir batin can create anything and submit it in court. I wonder what the court will say about zahir batin theory. Probably think these guys are looney tunes.
In Mawsam e Bahar does it say he WASN'T the Mazoon? No.
In Muntaza it says he was in the SECOND POSITION. And that term has bee repeated throughout Dawat Books for the Mazoon.
There Evidence during Syedna Taher Saifuddin's time, attested by Syedna Taher Saifuddin saying that Ali bin Ibrahim WAS the Mazoon. This has been submitted to courts. Do you believe Syedna Taher Saifuddin RA or not?

@HAQNIWAAT

Thanks for posting the Hunting Pics.
Maybe you can post some of KQ as well. He is an equally avid fan of hunting!

SBM
Posts: 6444
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1608

Unread post by SBM » Fri Aug 15, 2014 11:53 am

Adam
Maybe you can post some of KQ as well. He is an equally avid fan of hunting!
Adam
I am sure if you had those demeaning pictures of SKQ like SMS you would have already posted it :mrgreen:

haqniwaat
Posts: 516
Joined: Wed Aug 06, 2014 6:06 pm

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1609

Unread post by haqniwaat » Fri Aug 15, 2014 10:11 pm

In Mawsam e Bahar does it say he WASN'T the Mazoon? No.
In Muntaza it says he was in the SECOND POSITION. And that term has bee repeated throughout Dawat Books for the Mazoon.
There Evidence during Syedna Taher Saifuddin's time, attested by Syedna Taher Saifuddin saying that Ali bin Ibrahim WAS the Mazoon. This has been submitted to courts.
says Adam.

Second position in hudood after rasul hudood. Anyways, what difference does it make? Your leaders believe in zahir batin, so with that theory, anyone can be discredited. Very convenient. And as far as what you have submitted in court, if you can dupe up audio and control Burhanuddin Syedna, you can concoct anything. And by the way, the fact still remains that he was Burhanuddin Mola's mazoon. So find all theories you can to bring him down. The more you do, your venomous beliefs and theories appear more and more like a circus.

New
Posts: 440
Joined: Fri Jan 24, 2014 9:49 pm

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1610

Unread post by New » Fri Aug 15, 2014 10:37 pm

Here Abraham Lincoln must be turning over in his grave.

Quote: you can fool some Abdes some time,
you can fool some Abdes all the time,
You can fool all the Abdes some time
Yes you can fool all the Abdes all the time. However, it takes a divine power from Imam and God entrusted in Dial Mutlak.

New
Posts: 440
Joined: Fri Jan 24, 2014 9:49 pm

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1611

Unread post by New » Sat Aug 16, 2014 1:02 am

To all the Abdes, what is Haqq?

If you keep,repeating a lie, it becomes truth. If you keep repeating that truth, it becomes Haqq

maddy
Posts: 73
Joined: Sat Nov 23, 2013 9:12 am

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1612

Unread post by maddy » Sat Aug 16, 2014 3:13 am

Rcvd on what's app.
Any confirmation ??

Mubarak Mubarak
bushra aawi che k london bhi j case thayo to ahma fatehyabi mili che. Mubarak mubarak
UK Charity Commission ma Dawedaar LA ye claim kidu tu ke hamna Dawat e Hadiya ma sole trustee shz Mufaddal nathi kem ke haji faislo nathi thayo ke 53ma dai kon chey.
Charity Commission ye gai kaale letter ma likhaan ma moklavi deedu ke hame aim maanye chey ke 53ma Dai Syedna Mufaddal Saifuddinj chey. Ane yej hamna sole trustee chey.

qutub_mamajiwala
Posts: 1025
Joined: Tue Jul 23, 2013 4:17 am

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1613

Unread post by qutub_mamajiwala » Sat Aug 16, 2014 3:16 am

adam bhai
ur assuming 2+2 = 4
this is not maths
mazoon is in second position--right
but second position does not automatically mean he is mazoon
there is vast difference
it is not vice versa
anybody can be in second position, if mazoon is not there--but he doesnt become mazoon
only because he was in second position.
but if someone is mazoon, he automatically becomes second in position.
mazoon is a rutba, while second position is not rutba.
in todays time, there is no mazoon of muffy, but many may claim second in position
but once he appoints mazoon, he will automatically will become second in position.
so ali bin ibrahim may be in second position but not necessarily mazoon

Adam
Posts: 1261
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1614

Unread post by Adam » Sat Aug 16, 2014 10:14 am

@qutub_mamajiwala
1. There was already a Mukasir at the time, so Ali bin Ibrahim was the Mazoon, as he was in the second position.
2. Syedna Taher Saifuddin has already stated in court that he was the Mazoon. This evidence has been provided in the current case. Now, do you wan to reject what the 51st Dai said as well?

Ali bin Ibrahim WAS the Mazoon.
Mazoon is not infallible.


SBM
Posts: 6444
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1615

Unread post by SBM » Sat Aug 16, 2014 10:54 am

Mazoon is not infallible.
Wow if Mazoon is not infallible so you are saying that SMB was not infallible when he was Mazoon of STS and all of sudden he became infallible just by announcing Nuss on him. So SMB did have some impurity in him before he became DAI

rational_guy
Posts: 205
Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:21 am

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1616

Unread post by rational_guy » Sat Aug 16, 2014 11:30 am

Adam wrote:@qutub_mamajiwala
1. There was already a Mukasir at the time, so Ali bin Ibrahim was the Mazoon, as he was in the second position.
2. Syedna Taher Saifuddin has already stated in court that he was the Mazoon. This evidence has been provided in the current case. Now, do you wan to reject what the 51st Dai said as well?

Ali bin Ibrahim WAS the Mazoon.
Mazoon is not infallible.

Adam very curious about your statement. Since you are stating from Syedna Taher Saifuddin's testimony, can you upload the relevant pages on this forum/thread

truth seeker100
Posts: 165
Joined: Tue May 20, 2014 5:54 pm

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1617

Unread post by truth seeker100 » Sat Aug 16, 2014 12:40 pm

Adam I am asking you again
Do you think dai is required for salvation?

New
Posts: 440
Joined: Fri Jan 24, 2014 9:49 pm

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1618

Unread post by New » Sat Aug 16, 2014 7:56 pm

Let me ask truth seeker 100, is salvation required? What happens if your salvation is runs afoul?

truth seeker100
Posts: 165
Joined: Tue May 20, 2014 5:54 pm

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1619

Unread post by truth seeker100 » Sun Aug 17, 2014 3:44 am

Yes salvation is requires or else you will go to hell.
Also let me ask you Mr. New what does "runs afoul" mean
Please speak in a normal language that everybody can understand

Adam
Posts: 1261
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Mufaddal Saifuddin (and related topics)

#1620

Unread post by Adam » Sun Aug 17, 2014 4:11 am

SBM
Wow if Mazoon is not infallible so you are saying that SMB was not infallible when he was Mazoon of STS and all of sudden he became infallible just by announcing Nuss on him.

Correct. Mazoon is not infallible.
The Dai and his Mansoos are infallible.
If the Mansoos also happens to be the Mazoon, then he is infallible as well, because he's the Mansoos.
But not all Mazoons and Mansoos, thus not all Mazoons are infallible.
Clear?

rational_guy
Adam very curious about your statement. Since you are stating from Syedna Taher Saifuddin's testimony, can you upload the relevant pages on this forum/thread

I don't have a copy of it, i'm just aware of a few facts.
Since you are fro the KQ group, you can ask them to show it to you since they have all the documents submitted to court. If they don't show it to you, you'll know they are hiding something.

truth seeker100
Adam I am asking you again
Do you think dai is required for salvation?

Sorry, didn't know you had asked me this.

Yes. The Imam is required for salvation, and during his Satr the belief in the Dai Mutlaq is required for salvation.
If the KQ clan accept KQ as their Dai, they should have the similar belief.