Shikar in Zambia

The one and only free public forum for Bohras. The focus of this forum is the reform movement, the Dawoodi Bohra faith and, of course, the corrupt priesthood. But the discussion is in no way restricted to the Bohras alone.
zinger
Posts: 1978
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:40 am

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#241

Unread post by zinger » Wed Jul 02, 2014 7:54 am

Haqparast wrote:what happened brother? why getting personal? what happened with all the logic and arguments you was bringing in?

is this the best reply you can think?

I have already moved on but since you want to defend your master at least do it well.

world is reading and I am sure you dont want to show your master in bad light? so bring the dalil
who is getting personal? me? im not. im thinking of your own good. why burn blood here trying to change people. you have found the answers, good for you. be happy.

The Dai is no ones master. so no question of dalil here.

BTW, i have already said what i wanted to say. i have nothing left to prove. im not defending what Mufaddal Maula did, im just saying dont let it bother you so much if you have decided to move on

zinger
Posts: 1978
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:40 am

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#242

Unread post by zinger » Wed Jul 02, 2014 7:57 am

UnhappyBohra wrote:Zinger don't blame GM and Akhtar Wahid. Mufaddal Saufuddin is digging his own grave with the kinds of bayans done by his aamils and his love for ayyashi. The man is not being guided by any divine inspiration and as a result his administration feels like a game of whack-a-mole. Sorry to say, I see the disillusionment spreading.
where am i blaming gm bhai and akhtiar bhai? im just pointing out the flaw in their argument. besides gm bhai isnt even in the picture

time to go now, or ill be late for maghrib. good day to you.

Roza mubarak to you and all at home

Humsafar
Posts: 2518
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2000 5:01 am

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#243

Unread post by Humsafar » Wed Jul 02, 2014 11:47 am

zinger wrote: the Dai is a spiritual leader and a spiritual father to all Dawoodi Bohras. this may not be the doctrine, so please dont run from here to there asking me to quote an ayah for it, but this is the core belief of all Dawoodi Bohras.
You may ofcourse, not buy into this belief and still be a Dawoodi Bohra, so dont worry too much
You're right, this "spiritual father" thing is not the Dawoodi Bohra doctrine. But in the same sentence you say "this is the core belief of all Dawoodi Bohras". In case you missed it, core beliefs come from core doctrine. Anything that is considered core and is not in the doctrine, in the books, in the scriptures, in the tradition then most probably it is invented and planted. It came form outside. In other words you and all other Bohras have been brainwashed into believing that the Dai is your "spiritual father". He is your leader and your guide and there are qualifications spelled out that he must fulfill to become one. "Spiritual father", "love" and "ignoring his mistakes like you would your own father's" etc etc are all aspects of blind devotion - a practice and a mindset outside of Islam and outside of Bohra faith and tradition.

It's time abdes fessed up to their core practice and their core beliefs and dealt with the contradictions between them.

zinger
Posts: 1978
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:40 am

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#244

Unread post by zinger » Thu Jul 03, 2014 12:29 am

Humsafar wrote:
zinger wrote: the Dai is a spiritual leader and a spiritual father to all Dawoodi Bohras. this may not be the doctrine, so please dont run from here to there asking me to quote an ayah for it, but this is the core belief of all Dawoodi Bohras.
You may ofcourse, not buy into this belief and still be a Dawoodi Bohra, so dont worry too much
You're right, this "spiritual father" thing is not the Dawoodi Bohra doctrine. But in the same sentence you say "this is the core belief of all Dawoodi Bohras". In case you missed it, core beliefs come from core doctrine. Anything that is considered core and is not in the doctrine, in the books, in the scriptures, in the tradition then most probably it is invented and planted. It came form outside. In other words you and all other Bohras have been brainwashed into believing that the Dai is your "spiritual father". He is your leader and your guide and there are qualifications spelled out that he must fulfill to become one. "Spiritual father", "love" and "ignoring his mistakes like you would your own father's" etc etc are all aspects of blind devotion - a practice and a mindset outside of Islam and outside of Bohra faith and tradition.

It's time abdes fessed up to their core practice and their core beliefs and dealt with the contradictions between them.

actually, you are right. the use of the word core in core belief is wrong. what i was trying to say is that it is belief in the heart of every Dawoodi Bohra. i meant core in this context, the core of every person

thank you for pointing out my mistake

true islam
Posts: 44
Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:39 pm

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#245

Unread post by true islam » Thu Jul 03, 2014 3:50 am

james you are a stupid idiot. that Hadith about killing anything larger than a sparrow is on almost every islamic se, it wouldn't be there if it wasn't authentic.

Humsafar
Posts: 2518
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2000 5:01 am

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#246

Unread post by Humsafar » Thu Jul 03, 2014 10:41 am

zinger wrote: actually, you are right. the use of the word core in core belief is wrong. what i was trying to say is that it is belief in the heart of every Dawoodi Bohra. i meant core in this context, the core of every person
thank you for pointing out my mistake
Of course you missed the larger point, and that is that the "belief in the heart of every Dawoodi Bohra" for the Dai as "spiritual father" is an extraneous belief. Superimposed, alien, not part of the core Bohra faith. It is embedded in Bohra hearts through conditioning and brainwashing - and borders on human worship.

zinger
Posts: 1978
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:40 am

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#247

Unread post by zinger » Thu Jul 03, 2014 12:05 pm

Humsafar wrote:
zinger wrote: actually, you are right. the use of the word core in core belief is wrong. what i was trying to say is that it is belief in the heart of every Dawoodi Bohra. i meant core in this context, the core of every person
thank you for pointing out my mistake
Of course you missed the larger point, and that is that the "belief in the heart of every Dawoodi Bohra" for the Dai as "spiritual father" is an extraneous belief. Superimposed, alien, not part of the core Bohra faith. It is embedded in Bohra hearts through conditioning and brainwashing - and borders on human worship.
unfortunately humsafar bhai, i am not as educated as you or as fluent as you to use some boombastic words, so let me try and explain this simply to you.

has it ever occured to you that that belief in the heart of every Dawoodi Bohra of love and faith in the Dai is not an extraneous belief. Superimposed, alien or otherwise? or that it is not embedded in our hearts through brainwashing or conditioning?

Actually, it wouldnt. because if it did, i would not be giving you this explanation

anajmi
Posts: 13403
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#248

Unread post by anajmi » Thu Jul 03, 2014 1:18 pm

:D

Bohras suffer from something called the Stockholm syndrome. That is why they have the love and faith of the dai in their hearts. :mrgreen:

Humsafar
Posts: 2518
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2000 5:01 am

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#249

Unread post by Humsafar » Thu Jul 03, 2014 1:22 pm

zinger wrote:Actually, it wouldnt. because if it did, i would not be giving you this explanation
Where is the explanation?

SBM
Posts: 6250
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#250

Unread post by SBM » Thu Jul 03, 2014 1:46 pm

Humsafar wrote:
zinger wrote:Actually, it wouldnt. because if it did, i would not be giving you this explanation
Where is the explanation?
That is in Taawil

zinger
Posts: 1978
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:40 am

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#251

Unread post by zinger » Fri Jul 04, 2014 12:18 am

Humsafar wrote:
zinger wrote:Actually, it wouldnt. because if it did, i would not be giving you this explanation
Where is the explanation?
the explanation that we are not coerced, brainwashed, bashed etc etc etc into having faith and love for the Dai

zinger
Posts: 1978
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:40 am

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#252

Unread post by zinger » Fri Jul 04, 2014 12:18 am

SBM wrote:
Humsafar wrote: Where is the explanation?
That is in Taawil

Its not Taawil SBM bhai, its just beyond you, thats all

SBM
Posts: 6250
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#253

Unread post by SBM » Fri Jul 04, 2014 6:17 am

^
you are right Zinger, anything stupid and idiotic is beyond me :wink:

Humsafar
Posts: 2518
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2000 5:01 am

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#254

Unread post by Humsafar » Fri Jul 04, 2014 10:15 am

zinger wrote: the explanation that we are not coerced, brainwashed, bashed etc etc etc into having faith and love for the Dai
That is not an explanation, just a denial of what I said. If you have an explanation I really would like to know.

zinger
Posts: 1978
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:40 am

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#255

Unread post by zinger » Fri Jul 04, 2014 11:28 am

Humsafar bhai, please feel free to search this forum. you will find it from not just me but many others even.

i have no time to dig out old posts

SBM
Posts: 6250
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#256

Unread post by SBM » Fri Jul 04, 2014 3:15 pm

zinger wrote:Humsafar bhai, please feel free to search this forum. you will find it from not just me but many others even.

i have no time to dig out old posts
Since Zinger has no answer he is good in coping out by saying he has no time but when he wants to point out something bad for others he always finds time to dig in and search the forum.
Zinger Let me remind you that lying during the month of Ramadan is a sin specially while fasting....

SBM
Posts: 6250
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#257

Unread post by SBM » Mon Jul 07, 2014 3:30 pm

Free at last: Elephant 'cries' while being rescued after 50 years of abuse and being kept in chains in UP
Could this Elephant be SKQ as he was also chained for 50 years as Mazoon

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/arti ... 969465.cms?
Luky for him he did not meet the SMS he would have shot him
Can we ask this group to also get the Abdes unchained by drunk Kothari Goons

rational_guy
Posts: 205
Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:21 am

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#258

Unread post by rational_guy » Wed Jul 09, 2014 12:27 am

I have heard that the Late SHz Yusuf Najmuddin and Shz Aliasger Kalimuddin would encourage Shz Qaid Johar and his brothers to do hunting and spend less time in getting deeni tarbiyat. This has apparently worked for the Uncles, as the nephews come to them if they needed ilm and therefore would be dependent on them lifelong.

This is seen by the apparent lack in content in Shz Muffadal Saifuddin's waaz

DisillusionedDB
Posts: 379
Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 7:20 am

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#259

Unread post by DisillusionedDB » Fri Aug 22, 2014 3:30 am

Truthseeker wrote:
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Su Nirmal Shaan che SMS ni.
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TOI 20-08-2014.JPG

DisillusionedDB
Posts: 379
Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 7:20 am

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#260

Unread post by DisillusionedDB » Fri Aug 22, 2014 3:33 am

Seems we are adding to the tally :(

Hasan
Posts: 31
Joined: Wed May 07, 2014 3:44 pm

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#261

Unread post by Hasan » Sun Aug 24, 2014 2:37 pm

:)
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New
Posts: 440
Joined: Fri Jan 24, 2014 9:49 pm

Re: Shikar in Zambia

#262

Unread post by New » Mon Aug 25, 2014 12:43 am

A new name, Mufaddal Unsafeuddin for bezubaan animals.