Immediate step we can take against Kothar

[Hussain_KSA]

There are two immediate steps and actions you and we all should take.

First, write to SIT – Special Investigating Team which Hon. Prime Minister has formed. SIT is a powerful body and is comprised of very senior jurists and statesmen. By selling various religious titles and collection millions of Rupees in India and around the world, they are both openly money laundering and evading taxes which is most heinous and criminal crime. Write to them how much they collect and many from poor E. African countries, and one such who stands out is Sh. Husseinbhai of Nairobi who terrorizes Bohras in Kenya. Copy to PM office, so he too will come to know the truth. Hon. Shri Modi is no pushover – he will not brook such nonsense.

Second, write to both Hon. Najma Heptulla – Minister of Minority Affairs, and Hon. Shabana Azmi both of whom are Rajya Sabha members. Give them details of how much they extort for Hadiyat, (title for Sheikh – around US $120,000/-), Mafsiyat (title for Mulla between US $ 5,000/ +), for Mishak, Ziyaafat and all other tools of collections. Also write to them how during Ramadan, a Holy month of supplication and forgiveness, the clergy and priest class is busy twisting arms, using threatening weapons of mass ex-communication, etc., they collect millions throughout the world and then money launder these collections. Under the guise of religious fear and lies, the innocent gullible Bohras fall prey to their dubious means. Many sincerely believe that the Syednas will take them to Jannat, and this is what these leaders preach, and so this is the price they must pay to curry their favors.

Also post all the recent and past Safari photos and also list latest real estate acquisitions, and how in the month of Ramadan in many Masjids, the places for prayers are sold. List all and give addresses of people who can be contacted for various explanations and testimonies.

Also copy to " <mughda.variyar@hindustantimes.com>, who has latent sympathy for all mazloomeen like us. They have bought huge real estate in Europe and N. America under different companies names – difficult to trace. ……………………………..”

[Sufi monk]

also write how fake mojiza and fake stories are circulated in bohras almost every day to play with emotions of poor momeenin and finally they are black mailed in the name of religion.

and how bohras are denied in masjid and kabrestan when they fail to pay unislamic dues, small kids are brain washed in madressas and fake stories are installed in their brain.

[tasneempati]

Very doubtful .... if Modi will initiate any action, as he is very good friend of SMS. Nazma & Shabana will not like themselves to get involved in internal matter of Bohras.

[SBM]

Very doubtful .... if Modi will initiate any action, as he is very good friend of SMS. Nazma & Shabana will not like themselves to get involved in internal matter of Bohras.

Tasneempatti
Do you have any other ideas or you are here just to discourage people to take any action. Instead of atleast taking some positive steps suggested by Br Hussain, all you did is to discourage others to atleast do some thing. How do you know Shabana Azmi will not do anything,she and her husband were in the forefront when Ashgar Ali Engineer was beaten and his property was damaged by Kothari Goons. Narendra Modi may also look into it because since he is PM he could care less for Kothari Goons. Kothari Mafia gave $ 250,000 for Bush and after he became POTUS he did give a damn about any of the Dawat E Hadiyah people and did not even acknowledge them. In politics friendship and enmity has a very short life
The least you can do is SHUT up instead of discouraging people.

[james]

Very doubtful .... if Modi will initiate any action, as he is very good friend of SMS. Nazma & Shabana will not like themselves to get involved in internal matter of Bohras.

Tasneempatti
Do you have any other ideas or you are here just to discourage people to take any action. Instead of atleast taking some positive steps suggested by Br Hussain, all you did is to discourage others to atleast do some thing. How do you know Shabana Azmi will not do anything,she and her husband were in the forefront when Ashgar Ali Engineer was beaten and his property was damaged by Kothari Goons. Narendra Modi may also look into it because since he is PM he could care less for Kothari Goons. Kothari Mafia gave $ 250,000 for Bush and after he became POTUS he did give a damn about any of the Dawat E Hadiyah people and did not even acknowledge them. In politics friendship and enmity has a very short life
The least you can do is SHUT up instead of discouraging people.

Your harassment rears it ugly head again.On this board,attack/challenge the stupidity of the old guard and you pounce on them like a greyhound.

tasneempati has put forward his opinions which seem to have some validity to it.You have no right to yell "Shut up" at him.Frankly,that is disgraceful behavior and I feel you should apologize to him.

[wise_guy]

Do you think Modi or any other government official will interfere in bohra issues which is a non-issue for them first of all. Bohras don't even make 1% of Indian population and India has far more pressing matters right now that need to taken care of. Do you think bohra issue will be a matter of concern for the government or any of its entity.
Hussain_KSA is just beating around the bush !

[ghulam muhammed]

Do you think Modi or any other government official will interfere in bohra issues which is a non-issue for them first of all.

Your apprehensions are justified but as per the present scenario, Modi is very likely to initiate action against these crooks, not because of his sudden love for Muslims but because he has to prove his secular credentials to the world at large. The recent surprising action by the Central government was during the attacks on the Pune techie who was beaten up by a hindu radical organisation, "Hindu Rashtriya Sena" in which case the central government not only ensured that swift action was taken and the culprits were arrested but they even rejected a biased report submitted by the Maharashtra government and asked for a fresh report.

[ghulam muhammed]

One more avenue is the media which has the power to expose these Saifee Mahal mafias on television and print media. A person like Teesta Setalvad could be apprised of the rot prevailing in the community alongwith the "Tehelka" magazine as they have proved to be fearless in the past, they are the ones who dared to take on the might of Narendra Modi and expose his role in the 2002 Genocide which resulted in many convictions. They had successfully conducted various sting operations wherein the murderers had confessed their crimes on camera, hence a similar sort of sting operation could also be carried out.

[seeker110]

Politician can be your friend before he wins elections. After that campaign, all promises are null and void.

[ghulam muhammed]

Politician can be your friend before he wins elections. After that campaign, all promises are null and void.

I don't deny the fact that Modi is an evil who is responsible for the mass genocide of thousands of Muslims in Gujarat but now he is in a position wherein he urgently needs a makeover and even though his motives are selfish but the same can work in our favour. He desperately wants to prove that he is not anti-Muslim and he will grab any opportunity which comes his way to prove the same, this is for now and we cannot predict the future when he may show his true colours once he establishes full supremacy.

[tasneempati]

Now when the "Criminal is King" do not expect fair judgement from him.

[reformbohra]

hussain_ksa may i know do you even have an ejamat id?

[seeker110]

reform bhora, what an idiot question, say something about steps we can take against kothar. If you want to ask personal questions, get a room.

[reformbohra]

I dont think we can do anything , 75+ years of struggle has only made the bohra clergy more powerful then ever. Only an external force can bring about a change.

[Humsafar]

I dont think we can do anything , 75+ years of struggle has only made the bohra clergy more powerful then ever. Only an external force can bring about a change.

The only external force I can think of is the hidden Imam or the curse of of God, a lightening strike or something. But that is unlikely to happen. Things have not happened in past 75 years is because Bohras like you have been waiting for some external force to change things for them. They have been sitting on their haunches, twiddling their toes, grumbling endlessly, and bending before sub-human, two-bit mullahs, and all the time sighing "su karsu" and doing nothing. No external force will do anything unless Bohras get off their lazy butts and do something about their sorry situation.

[Humsafar]

What Hussain_KSA has suggested are good practical steps. Maybe nothing will come of it, but it is better to do something than nothing. We should use every tactic and means at our disposal to expose this mafia clergy. Only lazy and weak-willed people find excuses for doing nothing. It is always useful to remember what Gandhi said, “Whatever you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do it.” And what the Quran (13:11) says, "Indeed, Allah will not change the condition of a people until they change what is in themselves."

[reformbohra]

Bro Husafar
I think this shows the double standards here. There was a draft letter here which suggested some creative ideas and getting help from powerful people who are not influenced by Money which could sent hiccups throughout the bohra world was deleted from this forum by converting it into shia-sunni diatribe. bro Husain suggests forming SIT , all this wont work at all as the ruling govt is hand in hand with bohra clergy and bohra clergy have donated millions $$ to the modi govt. It will only backfire against the reformists as how it happened during the taher saifuddin court cases. All this was tried and daeee emerged as a powerful winner setting a unforgettable precedent. And by seeking help from external forces not influenced by money is in itself a great achievement as work is required to be done to achieve the Goals.

[SBM]

Bro Husafar
I think this shows the double standards here. There was a draft letter here which suggested some creative ideas and getting help from powerful people who are not influenced by Money which could sent hiccups throughout the bohra world was deleted from this forum by converting it into shia-sunni diatribe. bro Husain suggests forming SIT , all this wont work at all as the ruling govt is hand in hand with bohra clergy and bohra clergy have donated millions $$ to the modi govt. It will only backfire against the reformists as how it happened during the taher saifuddin court cases. All this was tried and daeee emerged as a powerful winner setting a unforgettable precedent. And by seeking help from external forces not influenced by money is in itself a great achievement as work is required to be done to achieve the Goals.

Reform Bohra
So if you agreed with that letter, did you sent it to Saudi Authorities under your own name, What are you waiting for. No one stopped you from using that letter and sending it yourself.
All I read from your post is whining and complaining. Many members did not agree with that letter and the source it was going to, with happening in Iraq, it will give more ammunition to the people create more hardship, do you think Saudi do not know about it already as mentioned by Hussain KSA,
Still if you want to send that letter to Saudi, google Saudi Shura and you will find addresses of many organization and you can send it to them. Do not ask others to do your work.

[Humsafar]

reformbohra,
I agree that letter too was a good idea, and although we know that seeking Saudi help is like asking the fox to take care of the henhouse, it was still worth the effort. The thread was removed, I believe, not because it suggested a good practical tactic but because as usual it degenerated into a sectarian catfight. And of course you missed the point of my post, which was that we must do everything we can within our means and not worry about the results (as Lord Krishna said). It's better to find reasons to do something rather than find excuses for not doing them.

[reformbohra]

Bro SBM
More then the letter the participation of people was more important in drafting the letter, Nafisaben went overboard and exaggerated a lot , but such a letter can never be successful unless a group of reputed people also support it and that was the main aim of the letter. The Letter would also help the Central Board to get more prominence as people are not even aware such a central board exists. Ideally the central board should leave no stone unturned to take over the bohra properties by any means possible even if it involves getting help from saudi arabia which is the only state that does not recognize or respect the bohra clergy.

[Ummul Bani]

I believe we know ourselves much better than anybody else does. We know how our daily lives have been impacted , the way the system has been and how it works. In that case, we are the best people to bring about change in our own lives rather than an external force.
Also, we would be more concerned about our own problem than an external force may be.
There is no need to wait for an external force to come into our lives and start changing things for good. What is it that an external force can do and we cannot?
If we can trust an external force and depend upon it to bring about a change, we might as well depend on ourselves and do it.

The steps suggested above give us a direction on how we can initiate this change for ourselves.
Here , we are taking support from external people who have the authority and power to change things and not waiting for an external force to change things for us.

It is equally important to bear in mind whom we approach for support. Taking support from someone who is extreme in nature may bring more harm than good.

[SBM]

More then the letter the participation of people was more important in drafting the letter

That is classical cope out. now you say that participation was more important is like saying talking is more important then action. so all you want people to do is just talk and when asked for action, just cope out. Again I will repeat what President Kennedy said " Donot ask what your country can do do for you--ask what you can do for country"
So Br.Reformbohra, tell us what practical steps have you taken or would take to change the situation.

[reformbohra]

I asked participation in drafting the letter and just a written approval of the central board. I deliberately left most of the letter blank with outlines to be filled in by reformist. My responsibility is only to get the letter passed to the higher ups in saudi.

[ghulam muhammed]

Saifuddin Mogri
Treasurer
Dawoodi Bohra Association
23653 Gerrad Way
West Hills, CA 91307

Ref: Sabil-ul-Khaire-Wal-Barakat

Your so called religious administrators should be ashamed of asking the hard working Dawoodi Bohras to contribute to your theft. The LA district Attorney is being informed by my council informing them of the conspiracy and mixing the law of the state with law of your organization. I am surprised at the obnoxious amount that Anjuman-e-Burhanee, Los Angeles is asking of its faithful. It seems like the organization wants members to borrow money against their credit card and pay interest to meet their objective, even though they know that paying interest is not Kosher in the Sharia. You are indirectly telling the die-hards that paying this obnoxious $ 3,000 is more important than violating the sharia of not paying interest.

I do not know if you know or not but it is illegal to ask money from followers of a faith to subscribe to money that will be laundered to the organization’s leaders of the community in India. Your name is also being forwarded as a co-conspirator to the human rights and the State Attorney General Kamla Harris for promoting Female Genital Mutilation and carrying this activity with innocent young girls and forcing their parents to subscribe to your diktats

You know what has happened in Australia to a member of your organization when he and a lady Bohra doctor and a mid wife were arrested and the West Hills police are being informed of your activity. In addition I have asked my attorney to file a notice with the IRS informing them about the unethical activities carried out by your organization and ensure that your Tax exempt status is revoked.

It seems like your organization is not satisfied with milking the poor followers with undue pressure of ex communication and other social boycott activities and trying to exhort from individuals like me to pay a heavy price for getting a piece of land 6'x2' for my father's burial and as a sane individual used the auspices of the Ishnasiri Shia Muslims, with the help of my Iranian neighbor. Also as a sane individual, I decided to give a translation of the Misak to my 16 year old, a senior next year at a prestigious Ivy School, asked him if wanted to go through the ritual and after he read the translation, He said dad I am no stupid guy who will follow this ritual in blind faith. Even some of the off-springs of the members of Jamat who are at school with my son, concur with him, but because of their respect of their parents went through the rituals and regret it. As a family we have incurred a huge debt with a student loan. My first obligation is to pay off his student loan instead of paying this insane tax, which is not going to be used for the welfare of the followers in Los Angeles, but will go into the treasury of the Priesthood in India.

It seems like the Dawoodi Bohra Organization under the assumed leadership of Muffadal Saifuddin is bent on bilking the community to pay for his leisure villas in Zambia and kill Living beings ( Elephant) to fulfill his personal pleasure of seeing blood of the animals. It seems that his thirst of blood has not been quenched after the blood he and his cronies have sucked of the followers of the faith since his illegal accession to the seat of the Head Priest. By this mail, I have informed all members of the local congregation that falls under the local Chapter of both the Los Angeles and Orange County chapter that this threat should be registered with the local Police and Sheriff in Los Angeles county. I will ensure my attorney will file a complaint on behalf of several followers of the Dawoodi Bohra Faith who reside in the Los Angeles and Ventura county

Best Regards:

A Concerned Bohras

[ghulam muhammed]

The above mentioned letter was in response to the following farman :-

Sabil-ul-Khaire-Wal-Barakat

Afzalus-Salaam

Sabil-ul-Khaire-wal-barakat is one of the Hasanaats of Syedi-wa-Moulai Abdul Qadir Hakimuddin A.Q. to organize and finance the day-to-day running of the Jamaat activities and functions. It really helps the Jamaat operate more efficiently when members pay full Sabil on time.

The Sabil for Anjuman-e-Burhanee, Los Angeles is $3,000.00 per calendar year, that is, from January to December 2014.

Jamaat expenses have increased significantly over the last few years, specially with the construction of the Masjid. Although Masjid Iftetah has not occurred, there are expenses that have increased, such as, utilities and maintenance. This has resulted in an increase in Sabeel for all Mumineen of the Jamaat.

The Board of Directors of Anjuman-e-Burhanee request you to please promptly pay the Sabil or provide installment checks. If you have any questions, please call me at (818)348-5661.

Wassalaam

Abde Syedna (TUS)

Saifuddin Mogri
Treasurer

[Mkenya]

While Saifuddin Mogri has signed and provided a contact phone number in his letter, Ghulam Mohammed hides his identity by signing his reply 'A Concerned Bohras' (quoted as written).

Poet Daag Dehlvi's apt sher fits perfectly:
Khoob parda hai chilman se lage baithe hain
Saaf chupte bhi nahin saamne aate bhi nahin.

As litmus test I dare Ghulam Mohammed to first sign the letter himself and solicit signatures from forum members, reformists and well wishers.

When will people accept the fact that Kothar, Kasre Ali, Bhaisahebs, Sheikhs, Mullas and others have such a vicious grip on the majority of the Bohras that whatever we say or propose is simply venting our frustration.

The holy month of Ramadhan will soon be upon us and, that my friends, is the prime month when 53A and 53B are going full out to suck up billions of dollars from Bohras all over the world.

From the 51st to the present all Dais have hypnotised Bohras in such manner that their hold will remain 'ta kayamat tak'.

[ghulam muhammed]

Ghulam Mohammed hides his identity by signing his reply 'A Concerned Bohras' (quoted as written).

Kindly note that the subject letter was sent to the Amil by someone residing in USA and the same was mailed to me by a friend and I have only reproduced it on this forum. However, after I posted this letter, it seems that Asghar Vasanwala too has circulated it to Bohras worldwide. FYI, I reside in India and not in USA.

[Sufi monk]

acchi baat hain, this is a war, and war cant be fought alone, need a good and educated team work.

[Ummul Bani]

It is indeed an undeniable fact that the kothar flourishes on the cash flow coming from the community. One of the major steps then would perhaps be to start cutting down this cash flow.

I think it is about time we started implementing some changes in our routine lives and no matter what, there is always something we can do against the forced practices, however small it may be.


I list here some of the most common practices that are exploited in the name of religion and some ways to deal with it.
If you are already practicing this, well and good. If not, its about time.


1. Wajebat: Although I have already commented in one of the threads regarding this, I feel the need to stress this once more.
It is true that wajebat money is ''demanded'' from people. Do not pay your wajebat during Ramadan. Do so, after Ramadan. You will end up paying at least 50 percent lesser (you will be at peace to know you have incurred only a 50 percent "loss").
The reason being , when Ramadan gets over, one is not bound to pay wajebat. You may even choose to not pay it at all. This fact is known to the clergy and the Jamat. Therefore they decide to rather settle for something lesser compared to nothing at all. They call you upfront and willingly negotiate the amount. In the end, you end up paying substantially lesser. This really works.

2. Salaams: Say NO to salaams ,najwas, Karadan hasanah and all that crap. How do you do that? Its simple. Give them dry, bare covers (no kidding!). Anyone who thinks this sounds low or embarrassing has clearly failed to acknowledge the fact that nothing can ever be more shameful or embarrassing than misusing somebody else's hard earned money in the name of religion and building an empire out of it. Who needs to feel ashamed? You or the filthy rich clergy asking money from people hopping from one masallah to the other collecting salaams? What would you choose, giving away money to an already rich clergy or feeding a poor household yourself? Save that money to help someone in dire need instead !
On an average, a person ends up paying atleast Rs 500 for covers alone just in the month of Ramadan. Multiply that with about 4000 people in your city alone.
This is considering lowest figures.

@"Really scared" abdes : You can do this too. That is because no one dares to open the covers to check it.

3. Madrasa/Jamea : This is very important. This actually determines the perspective from which Islam or the Qur'an is viewed. Do you want to teach them twisted meanings of the Qur'an and make them pay heavy wajebat when they do not even understand the term? When the same children grow up and see these unethical activities going around them, wont it be very difficult to explain to them then? Wont it be too late? It can be very difficult to answer a child's valid questions.
We know for a fact that the Qur'an remains the same. So how will it matter who teaches it? Secondly, this ilm should be free but it is charged. Given these valid reasons, you can either choose to educate them yourself or send them to any other known Madrasa.

Jamea: This is out of question and never to be considered.

4. Thali : The taali has no shifa really. it is just a myth. IF it was really that way, there would have been no sickness in the community (there would be no saifee hospital , for that matter). Think about it.
Also, it is being charged for while it should be free. Adding to that, the food is unhygienic. These are reasons enough to motivate someone from unsubscribing from it. You will not only save your money getting misused but will also get to eat your own home cooked meals that you not only enjoy eating but are also hygienic.

Some people really are too scared to do even such simple things. It is very difficult for them to get out of their trained mindsets that are acclimatized to doing something that is standard even though it is wrong. But you don't have to do anything significant. Just the above simple steps. What are the reasons you wont be able to do the above? Is it the fear of the consequences? Do you really think there would be any embarrassment or threat from kothar if you did the above? NO. And yet, if something as basic as this cannot be implemented, then it is pointless to keep whining about it.

Remember, the kothar is not rich on its own. The people of the community are responsible for making them so. So,do not wait for some miracle to change the situation nor wait for someone to initiate something . It is always only the first step that is difficult and the rest just follows. When one person does it, then it gets noticed by others and gradually it becomes a norm.

I find this particular thread really useful and significant. I would request others to continue adding some measures here , something that can be implemented, however small it may be. It can be anything.

[SBM]

My suggestion for SALAAM and NAJWA COVERS
Stuff SALAAM envelopes with Funny Money (Monopoly Cash).If envelope look thick they do not open and if more than 4-5 people in the same jamaat does at the same time they would not know who did it since all Salaams envelopes get mixed and put in one huge envelope and if Salaam cover looks thick and juicy, Aaamil will overlook what you wrote on Wajebaat form since he already got his commission directly
Warning
You can not do that with Wajebaats since the wajebaat form and the envelope are clearly marked with your name and ID (unless the system has changed again since I am not privy to all these practices for past 4-5 years)