Eden. Original Sin or Original Virtue?

[Greatest I am]

Eden. Original Sin or Original Virtue?

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http://dish.andrewsullivan.com/2013/10/ ... -theodicy/
“Judaism preaches the Rise of man: and instead of Original Sin, it stresses Original Virtue, the beneficent hereditary influence of righteous ancestors upon their descendants’.”
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http://aynrandlexicon.com/lexicon/original_sin.html
From John Galt's speech, in Atlas Shrugged.
“What is the nature of the guilt that your teachers call his Original Sin? What are the evils man acquired when he fell from a state they consider perfection? Their myth declares that he ate the fruit of the tree of knowledge—he acquired a mind and became a rational being. It was the knowledge of good and evil—he became a moral being. He was sentenced to earn his bread by his labor—he became a productive being. He was sentenced to experience desire—he acquired the capacity of sexual enjoyment. The evils for which they damn him are reason, morality, creativeness, joy—all the cardinal values of his existence. It is not his vices that their myth of man’s fall is designed to explain and condemn, it is not his errors that they hold as his guilt, but the essence of his nature as man. Whatever he was—that robot in the Garden of Eden, who existed without mind, without values, without labor, without love—he was not man.
Man’s fall, according to your teachers, was that he gained the virtues required to live. These virtues, by their standard, are his Sin. His evil, they charge, is that he’s man. His guilt, they charge, is that he lives.”

Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.
Gen 3;22 And the LORD God said: 'Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil;

Do you see Eden as our Original Sin or as our Original Virtue?

Regards
DL

[anajmi]

Islamically speaking, it is neither. "Original Sin" is a christian concept and "Original Virtue" might be a jewish concept.

[Greatest I am]

Islamically speaking, it is neither. "Original Sin" is a christian concept and "Original Virtue" might be a jewish concept.

True but Islam follows those traditions. At least in part. Or so I thought.

What is your creation story then?

Regards
DL

[anajmi]

Not sure what you mean by "Islam follows those traditions". What traditions?

[Greatest I am]

Not sure what you mean by "Islam follows those traditions". What traditions?

The tradition that we need redemption from God. That hints of Original Sin.

You did not seem to agree and that is why I asked about your creation myth and Eden.

Care to inform me of those so that I might learn what you guys think of creation and why we need redemption?

I am here to learn.

Regards
DL

[anajmi]

Islam doesn't follow this tradition of "redemption that hints at the original sin". Where are you getting your information about Islam from?

[Greatest I am]

Islam doesn't follow this tradition of "redemption that hints at the original sin". Where are you getting your information about Islam from?

What do you not understand about the words, "I am asking".

You are good at telling me what you do not adhere to but do not follow through with what you do adhere to.

I see Muslims having to submit to Allah as about the same as Original Sin because you have to do that to be saved, which means that you are condemned for some reason and need saving, by yourself submitting.

Seems you need to be your own savior. Right?

Regards
DL

[anajmi]

Nope. The big elephant in the room during the "original sin" was the devil. Remove him from the picture and we all go to heaven. Everything is the devil's fault. And then there is free will. Which isn't really free. For example, I am not free to commit murder even if there isn't any original sin. So no, we are not all "condemned for some reason". You might be.