hello to my Ismaili brother's

[Ja'afari]

first of all i want know about u guy's idea abou Aisha... and do u guys have proof's as us that she made war against imam Ali alih el salam... and what ur views about abu baker and othman and omar??

and how many time u guys pray each day?? thanks... and i hope u accept me here as brother ( im here not to show off my ja'afari way im just here to get info about Ismaili shia brother's)

[asif786]

first of all i want know about u guy's idea abou Aisha... and do u guys have proof's as us that she made war against imam Ali alih el salam... and what ur views about abu baker and othman and omar??

and how many time u guys pray each day?? thanks... and i hope u accept me here as brother ( im here not to show off my ja'afari way im just here to get info about Ismaili shia brother's)

Br Jafari

Welcome on this board

The bohras have the same view about Aisha and the 3 khalifas as the Jafaris have , The bohra combined there 5 times salah and pray in 3 times .

wasalam

[Ja'afari]

thanks for the welcome


well that great... but i would like to know the proof's for example if sunni come to u and ask u what is ur proof that aisha did that and about other khalifas

we have our way in show them the proofs i would like to know ur proofs way


thanks

[labbaikyaHussain]

thanks for the welcome


well that great... but i would like to know the proof's for example if sunni come to u and ask u what is ur proof that aisha did that and about other khalifas

we have our way in show them the proofs i would like to know ur proofs way


thanks

we don't need proof,if our DAI says its night in morning or morning in night we believe it.

we dont have excess to any single book of our fiqah,we are just spoon feeded orally by our local priest and we have no rights to cross check if the information provided to us is authentic or not.

we are not even allowed to read translation of Quraan,coz our DAI thinks we are too amateur and moronic to understand word of GOD.

this is how ismaili faith works.

[Ja'afari]

oh ok so u guys never take proof's from books just take the ideas from the dai...

so u guys not allowed to understand the quran?? i have bohra freind before told me that most bohra kids read quran and save it in thier brain, so they just save it in thier brain without understand it??
(sorry for bad english)

so im confuse now and i dont know who to beleive.. i hope u give more explain for me


thanks...

[laloo]

dear jafaribhai,

as for religion we only know that we must send laanat,must show hatred against people of other sects.

thinking is prohibited on any issue ,the copyright of thinking is reserved with our high priest.

Our identity in the world is as business community.we are day and night busy earning money and buying comforts of this life. For after life we pay money to our dai who assured us to recieve us on the gates of heaven.

so we are happy ,why do we need to read quran or prophet life or even maula ali's life when everything can be bought from money.

for the readings we have stories to listen without verfying it,generation after generation.

we dont want to kn ow why muhammad came to this world ,what was his mission,why he suffered a lot?

we are money making machines ,we buy anything,just offer us if it is profitable...this is only hope remains.isnt it?

[Ja'afari]

oh ok now i see so u guys faith is built on money u make money and pay for the dai

thank u alot for explain and i respect all views from all people

[labbaikyaHussain]

oh ok now i see so u guys faith is built on money u make money and pay for the dai

thank u alot for explain and i respect all views from all people

Not exactly...

many pious mumeen still exists in DB (ismaili) faith.

[Ja'afari]

thanks for whom respond to me .. again im here not to .argument im here just to know about dawoodi bohra beleifs and im not here to Criticism ur beleifs every person have his freedom to chose and beleive in what he want and i respect every one view i just liked to know about dawoodi bohra shia brother's and how they think

i know how sunni muslim's think and idea's and as well the Ibadi muslim's and Sufi muslim's and Zaidi shia

so im here to collecet idea and info from ur belives that's all


and i dont conclusions by my self he said ''we r money making machine's''


so if some one tell u that what will ur conclusions will be??


but now im clear that now dawoodi bohra not allow to understand quran and not allow to resarch about any book

all them need shall be taken from dai

i hope i get more explain from brothers here thanks and good lcuk for u all

[Muslim First]

This is DB web site with Raza of Maulana
http://www.mumineen.org/archive/

DBs are only permitted to learn meaning of Quran only in private sabaks.

[Ja'afari]

thanks for answer bhai but what dose DB means? sorry for my bad english

[Muslim First]

DB = Dawoodi Bohra

[Ja'afari]

Thanks for explain

[asif786]

This is DB web site with Raza of Maulana
http://www.mumineen.org/archive/

DBs are only permitted to learn meaning of Quran only in private sabaks.

Br MF

You have so much knowledge about DBs and Ismailis that you should be made an amil of DBs or Ismailis just joking

[laloo]

jafri bhai,

the poor ,uneducated people of nepal can change their century old royal masters. when talkative egyptians can overthrow their loooooong lived dictator cum money sucker.

why cant we? plz give me the answer before leaving.

[Ja'afari]

u mean that about ur dai?? or some one else?? in ja'afari way we just pay khums to sayed as quran said that

[Muslim First]

You have so much knowledge about DBs and Ismailis that you should be made an amil of DBs or Ismailis

No thanks, I prefer to be plain Muslim.
I am friends with DBs since 8 th grade. I have eaten lots of Daal, chaval and palidu. I have read most of forums of DB and Ismailis.

[israfild]

im just here to get info about Ismaili shia brother's)

Dear All,
Let us present the right perspective before one presents the concerns that one may have with the current leadership and its followers.

Brother Jaffari,

I would like to present a part of information that I have. Please feel free to update my knowledge and if possible, add to it.

We believe, after Rasoolallah (SAW) the rightful leader of Islam is Maula Ali (AS). He (AS) is the Wali of Allah and Wasi of Raoolallah (SAW), Hand of Allah, Haider-e-Qarrar, Mushkil Kusha. He is most high in stature after Rasoolallah (SAW). However, we do not believe him to be the 1st Imam.

The 1st Imam is Imam Hasan (AS). From here till Imam Jaffer-e-Saadiq (AS) the belief in succession is the same as other Shia’s.

After imam Jaffer-e-Saadiq (AS) we believe that the rightful Imam is Imam Ismail (AS) till Imam Tayyeb (AS), the 21st Imam (AS).

Between these(AS), we share a common belief in Imam Mahdi (AS) who is our 11th Imam.

The 21st Imam (AS) went into hiding (satar) and appointed one Dai as his representative to spread the message of Allah.

All the Imams (AS) are Masoom (infallible).

We believe that Imam Tayyeb (AS) was not taken up alive by Allah (like Isa Nabi (AS) as believe by other shias) but lived in hiding, guiding the then Dai in the matters of religion.

The sucession after Imam Tayyeb (AS), like the succession of Imams (AS) before him, has continued till date and will continue till Qayamah, And the Imam-Uz-Zamaan (AS) before Qayamah, will come forward with the proofs of him (AS) being the true successor of Rasoolallah (SAW).

This is how the succession of Dai’s began and has continued till date. It is true that there have been factions but the base belief remains the same for all Bohras.

Who is a Dai?
The Dai is supposed to be a person with very high levels of piousness and good character and as just as he can, he avoids any mis-deeds and actions that are harmful to others / Islam. His role is to convey the message of Allah to the people and lead his fellow muslims by example like the Imams (AS) did. There is a detailed thread on what are the guidelines for a Dai. I would suggest you search for it.

In most factions of Bohras, there are 2 segment of followers,
1) Those who follow the Dai and the system,
2) Those who oppose the Dai and the system

There are arguments and counter arguments from both the flanks and at most times it is difficult to ascertain who is right. It is advisable for the non-bohra to listen to both sides of the story with caution. People might exaggerate in their zeal to prove themselves right.

I hope this has helped you in your endeavor to understand our beliefs.

I would like to also mention that all the information above is from the various dialogues I have had with several of knowledgeable persons including my grand-parents and parents etc, cannot produce any reference from any books.

[Ja'afari]

Big thanks for the explaining brother,

and there r some question's

some one here in forums said that bohra not allow to understand the quran (translate it)

and bohra r make money and give to dai to be sure that they will go to heaven (dai open gates for them)

that is true?

thanks

[israfild]

Big thanks for the explaining brother,

and there r some question's

some one here in forums said that bohra not allow to understand the quran (translate it)

and bohra r make money and give to dai to be sure that they will go to heaven (dai open gates for them)

that is true?

thanks

You are most welcome...

Regarding your queries:
1.) Reading translation of Quran:
Unfortunately its true. The reasons given are as follows:
- Common people cannot understand the baatin (hidden) meaning of the quran
- The translator may add his dimensions to the translation and make you go astray
- Only the one with divine knowledge can properly understand the quran
- The Quranic Arabic cannot be correctly translated into any other language

My thoughts:
- One should learn the Quranic Arabic to understand the quran
- However, this does not stop one from reading the translation to get a fair idea of the verses we read, this will help you in understanding the religion better. He should consider the translated meaning as full and final.

2.)Dai takes bohras to heaven
- The money part is not exactly like you have put it. It is said that there are several offerings(sabil, najwo, salaam, hoob etc) that you should give the Dai and his appointed people which will earn the contributor alot of sawab. Also doing, without any questions, whatever the dai says will earn them even more sawaab therefore they can go to heaven.
Therefore you give in the guise of giving in the name of Allah to the Dai in return of Sawaab. Many fanatics exaggerate this and say that this will ensure Jannah.

Money like Sabil, Zakaat etc has been collected for several centuries from Bohras but always used for the communit and rarely used for the leaders themselves. However, looking at the current lifestyle of the leadership, it seems that the money is not completely being used for the community. This is where the progressives take objection and are different.

- I have also heard that there is some kind of a letter given by the authorities that has to be placed in the grave to ensure Jannah.

My thoughts:
There is no way of ensuring Jannah. People have to do their bit and just hope and pray that their actions / prayers are accepted.

The letter in the grave thing, if true, is complete bogus.

I hope this helps...

[Muslim First]

Those who wqnt to understand Qur'an should read multiple translation including word by word translation.

here are some list

Quran
http://quran.com/
The Noble Quran (Shia site)
http://quran.al-islam.org/
Tafseer Ibn Kathir
http://www.tafsir.com/

Tafheem ul Quran (Maudidi)
http://www.islamicstudies.info/tafheem.php

Md Asad Quran
http://www.islamicity.com/quransearch/

Al Quran: Word for Word Translation (Arabic and English)http://www.studyquran.co.uk/Quran_Arabi ... lation.htm

Search and down load pdf file for Yusuf Ali Qur’an and commentary

Learn Arabic on line
http://searchtruth.com/arabic/lessons/u ... dlist2.php

You may also serch for Qaduyani Qur'an translation

Good reading, Good learning

Wasalaam

[Muslim First]

Al Quran: Word for Word Translation (Arabic and English)http://www.studyquran.co.uk/Quran_Arabi ... lation.htm

This link does not work

just google
Al Quran: Word for Word Translation (Arabic and English)

Click first link

[Ja'afari]

thank u all for the great explaining , its very kind of u guys

and by the way im iraqi and Arabic is my mother langauge so i can understand but thanks for ur duty in posting these benfite links i can use in other way's

and last question how many milion bohra ? and in wich state in india have huge pouplation of bohra?

thanks

[porus]

I have a pdf version of complete Muhammad Asad's English translation of the Quran, "The Message of the Quran". It is bookmarked with all the appendices. However, unlike the printed edition of the book, it does not have the Arabic Quran side-by-side on every page.

If anyone is interested in receiving a copy, send me a PM including an e-mail address.

[anajmi]

Is it searchable?

[anajmi]

While reading the first few pages of Asad's translation, I realized that I have read a famous work by the author called "The Road to Mecca" a couple of decades ago. Has anyone read that book?

[Muslim First]

"The Road to Mecca" a couple of decades ago. Has anyone read that book?

Yes I have

Muhammad Asad's English translation
Go to
http://www.islamicity.com/quransearch/
Go to Right hand Box 'Chapter Index'
Pick "English-M. Asad"

You will get everything you want to read

[Muslim First]

Opposing False Attacks on the Qur'an

6/15/2011 - Interfaith Opinion - Article Ref: IC1106-4727

http://www.iviews.com/Articles/articles ... C1106-4727

[Muslim First]

Brilliant 10 min presentation on reading the Qur'an
By an "agnostic Jew":
http://www.ted.com/talks/lang/ara/lesle ... koran.html

Benifits of reading multiple Qur'an

[porus]

"The Road to Mecca" a couple of decades ago. Has anyone read that book?

Yes I have

Muhammad Asad's English translation
Go to
http://www.islamicity.com/quransearch/
Go to Right hand Box 'Chapter Index'
Pick "English-M. Asad"

You will get everything you want to read

I suppose that with the link MF has provided no one would need a pdf version of the translation. However, unlike the pdf version, Foreword and Appendices are not available at the Islamicity website, unless I have overlooked something.

The pdf can be searched using standard pdf 'Find' function. You can search for a specific ayat such as 52:21, which is very topical because it clearly refers to Sayedna and his Mansoos with the blessing of Imam al-Tayyib.

I have a print copy of Asad's 'Road to Mecca'. It is a great autobiographical and almost a 'travel' book. His description of the Bedouin culture is unmatched. He does take a swipe at Wahhabis somewhere in the book.