Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

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badrijanab
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Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#1

Unread post by badrijanab » Thu Jun 28, 2012 2:09 pm

[Note: I am not the author of this article. I merely copied it from other place. Our team is thankful to our sources in other forums and especially to books of Sheikh Ahmed Ali Raj sahab, Udaipur (Rajasthan) wale]

Bismillah hir Rahman nir Raheem

Aadam Safiyullah (a) era was approx 7,000 years ago. He was born in Saran'deev, Ceylon (Sri Lanka). Ceylon has equal number of hours for day and night, it enjoys four season and has the best soil. All 'Ambiya' are born in place with normal geography/climate. Sri Lanka was considered to be part of India only, so Allama Iqbal has rightly said, "Sare jaha se achcha Hindustaan huamara". In Ceylon there is "Adam Peak", which comes after climbing seven mountains, following chimera can be witnessed: before setting sun does prostrate to "Adam Peak".

The first person born on the Earth was Molana Aadam Qulli (a), he was born at the center of Kaaba, the precise spot where Mola Ali (a) was born. When Aadam Qulli (a) was born there were no precincts of Kaaba. Near to his birthplace there were trees of figs (anjeer). Character of anjeer one need not to peel its cover to eat pulp inside nor there are any seeds inside, it is juicy and easily digested. One unique feature of fig: unlike other fruits it pops DIRECTLY out of the wood of branch or main trunk but not from the flowers - the 'haqiqat' to note here is Adam Qulli (a) is the first Imam coming directly and not as a successor of previous Imam - same like anjeer directly popping out from wood of branch/main trunk. So, when Allah says, "Wa't teene, wa zaitun....", Allah is swearing on Fig (anjeer). Anjeer is a fruit consumed by all (muslims/kafirs), it goes in their stomach and turns in stool and gets out - will Allah SUBHANAHU be swearing on such things? Intellect says no. The fig that is refered here is indeed Molana Aadam Qulli a.s. and not the fruit perse. Non-Dawoodi Bohras do not have depth of knowledge; they take only the literal meaning of fig, they should learn from books of Fatimi Dawat, no one is as rich in ilm as we are. It is unfortunate that our mumin brothers/sisters leave our fold because they are unable to get satisfied answers to their queries - all blame is on Kothar selfish policies to sit on Fatimi literature and not let it revealed to common seeker of knowledge.

Molana Aadam Qulli a.s. designation is "Mustakar Imam". And Adam Safiyullah a.s. i.e. Aadam of our era (7000 years back) his title is "Mustoda imam".

Cyclical apperance of Prophet Aadam (a): Adam Safiyullah (a) era re-occurs at interval of every 60,000 years. Our Aadam Safiyullah (a) has came 7,000 years back and Imam Quaim (ala'zikre'his'salam) will come before the 8,000th year starting from Aadam Safiyullah (a). When Imam Quaim (a.z.h.) will come the era of Prophet Mohammed (Shariyat-e-Mohammadi) will be ceased in practice and new Shariyat of Imam Quaim will start.

Aadam of our era: His real name is Tekhoom ibn Molana Bahla (a). Molana Bahla a.s. is the Mustakar Imam and his another son Molana Hunaid (a) is his successor as the Mustakar Imam, he is the first Mustakar Imam of Daur-a-Satr. So, during the life of Aadam (a), Molana Hunaid (a) was the Mustakar Imam and Molana Aadam was Mustoda Imam/Nabi. In the honour of Imam Hunaid (a) our country was named as Hindustaan.

Case of Aadam (a): He was advised not to reveal the name of his successor. Harris bin Murra was the parliamentarian in the court of Aadam (a), he lied and conned Aadam to reveal the name, in the state of con and trusting Harris ibn Murra, Aadam revealed the name of his successor to be Molana Habeel (a). Kabeel in envy, and further influenced by Harris bin Murra murdered Habeel. Aadam (a) felt guilty and went to Arafat mountain and begged for pardon, Allah pardoned Aadam, then Aadam also prayed to Allah do pardon my all offsprings (we all the childrens of Aadam), Allah asserted whoever will come here and seek pardon, I will grant him/her pardon.

Harris bin Murra was expelled from the parliament (Dawat) of Aadam. Dawat is like Jannat so he was expelled from Jannat which bestowed blessings from Allah. Iblees ka matlab hota hai jo Allah ki rehamt se mayoos ho gaya. Harris bin Murra is Iblees.

Parallel in Jannat: Allah gave birth to only Ruhani aalam. In it gave birth to 'Okool', plural of 'Akal'. They are also referred by others as 'Kalam' (pen). Allah gave birth to ten 'Okool'. The numeric/ digit one to nine i.e. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 all are of different shapes but the digit 10 and number onwards are of similar shapes. The first nine 'Akal' were singular and the tenth Akal was in the form of group. 'Akal' means intellect.

Akal-a-Awwal compared himself and others and inferred: I have not given birth to myself and neither others were born by themselves. There must be someone who gave us birth who is supreme i.e. Akal-a-Awwal acknowledged the Tawheed of Allah. On it he was rewarded and his status was escalated over others. Akal-a-Sani followed the suite of Akal-a-awwal and his status too was raised. Akal-a-Awwal was a leader (a type of Imam) and Akal-a-Sani was his deputy like Mohammed (s) : Mola Ali (a). They both did Daawat (invitation) to other 'Okool', they all acknowledged Tawheed and were elevated in the status.

The tenth Akal, was in form of group, some among them willingly acknowledged Tawheed and the leadership of Akal-a-Awwal (AAA) and his deputy Akal-a-Sani (AAS), however some among them got envy with AAA and AAS, some were in between; mediocre. So, collectively they all were not in unison. - They all have free-will. The good Akal in the group appealed and convinced the mediocre, they got convinced but those 'Okool' who were anti and were not getting agreed for collectively offer pardon to Allah, AAA & AAS. - Punishment was issued, in mean time almost all of them collectively got ready for Tawheed and leadership of AAA & AAS. Their pardon was delayed and punishment was verdicted. However considering their appeal for pardon; they were pardoned but after completing the term. In the fear of punishment they all ran out of Jannat, when they ran they took three dimensional (3D) form - length, bredth and width. Now, the spritual component is changed in material component. AAA & AAS did the settings for bringing them back to Jannat. "Aashir Mudabbir" was appointed leader and he later managed with the help of AAA & AAS to build system so all can return back to Jannat. Because of this happening we say we came from Jannat and will return back to it.

From some component especially from the 'good Akal' good things were made Sun, Moon, Earth, etc. The bad/villain Akal in the group is referred as Satan (Shaitan). All humans or Jinns that have consumed things made from those 'bad Akal' component in the form of food, beverages, noise, visual pictures, etc have proportionate component of Shaitan in them. Shaitan is found in all act/food stuff marked as 'Haram' like: alcohol, tobaco, pig flesh, etc. The component of 'good Akal' are find in all Halal food.

I (not Badrijanaab) once asked to Sheikh Ahmed Ali Raj: what is the single most important lesson he learnt in his eniter life? He replied, this world is like 'Guest House', our real house is there in Jannat. A guest house has register to record "Aaya", "Gaya" = date of birth, date of death. (To do only such type of deeds in this world that will take us to our real home i.e. Jannat. Also the belongins of Guest house is not owned by guest, so we have to get out from here empty hand).

Our soul is conversion of our body's material component into spirtual component. Remeber, our original state was spirit (the 'good Akal'). When we die our soul goes back to Jannat-al Mawa, the original place from where we came.

The parallel that is drawn in reference to Aadam is:
(1) The tenth intellect (Akal-a-Aashir) was in Jannat i.e. good Akal (Aadam), mediocre Akal, and lastly the bad Akal (Shaitan) - all were in Jannat. The bad Akal (Shaitan) in their envy nullified effort of Aadam (good and mediocre Akal) to offer Tawheed and acknowledgement to AAA & AAS.

(2) Good Akal (Aadam) was thrown from Paradise and so was Bad Akal (Shaitaan).

(3) Aadam (Good Akal) apologies were accepted and was pardoned so he will return back to Paradise but the Shaitan (Bad Akal) will not, they will forever be out of Jannat (on the expiry of Earth, they will be converted in black smoke and be locked in 'Rahoo - Ketu'.

Aadam will remain alive in the form of his kids and Shaitan will remain alive in form of his kids. Iblees, as same single human / same single jinn will not remain alive forever. Aadam and Iblees both came opposite to each other. If Allah gives life till eternity to Shaitan then the call of justice is that Aadam (a) too must be given equal footing. If Aadam died then Iblees of his age too must die after living is his age. Hence proved, that Asna ashari Shia contention is incorrect when they claim that that Iblees which was opposite to Aadam (a) is still alive.

When it is said that Allah gave 'mohlat' to Shaitan till the Qayamat, it means the material of 'bad Akal' will be present on the Earth till the last day, so Shaitan will be alive in the form of those humans who are eating or are getting influenced by the Haram things.

Quran miracle: Only Dawoodi Bohras Ismailiya Shia are of the firm belief that Quran can be inferred in tooooo many ways. Quran doles answers according to the intellect of wisdom seekers. To less intellect it teaches via stories and examples, to advance level students it teaches via faculty of "Batin", to further upper level by faculty of "Haqiqat", to further upper level by faculty of "Dakikat", to further by faculty of "Dakikat of Dakikat".

Imam Jaffer Sadik (a) said we can present inferences/deductions of single Aayat of Quran in 7 ways, in 70 ways, in 700 ways. Because of above characteristic no one is past forteen (1400) years could have produce even one Aayat similar to that of Quran. Only we Dawoodi Bohras believe in the above characteristic of Quran. Non-DB believes in opposite to above characterisitcs of Quran - Non Bohras believe that Quran has only one open and explicit meaning and it has no hidden meaning and it can be inferred in only one way which is explicit in first reading by men of common intellect. Should non-Bohras be believed then any enemy of Islam can produce any Aayat similar to Quran, indeed anyone can produces book like Quran - in this case enemies of Islam defeated the challenge of Quran. It is impossible and no one can beat the challenge of Quran - this state can only be true if one acknowledges character of Quran per Dawoodi Bohra's dimension.

The End

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Foot Notes:
Characteristics of Mustakar Imam: They are born as Imam, they are the supreme authority, infalliable, Masoom, he cannot make any mistakes, knows all faculties of knowledge, he know past; present and future and he is omnipotent. Son after father, this chain of Mustakar Imam will run without break, they go to seclusion (purdah) and otherwise as and when they deem fit. Example of Mustakar Imams) Nabi Ibrahim (a), Imam Ismail (a) ibn Prophet Ibrahim (a), Imam Molana Abi Talib (a), Molana Hussain (a), Imam Ismail (a) ibn Imam Jaffer Sadik (a), Imam Tayyeb (a), etc - this chain will keep on running without break till the last moment of humans on Earth.

Present Imam-uz-zaman is Mustakar Imam and he is in seclusion (pardah), we cannot see them but they do their job; in night though we cannot see sun but it is present and does it job. They live their life and die, when they die they take arwah (rooh) of all 'guzarnaar' mumineen with them to Jannat-al-Mawa.

Mustoda Imam's/Nabi: are a rank below Mustakar Imam. Example) Imam Hasan (a) is Mustoda Imam, Prophet Isaac ibn Prophet Ibrahim (a) is the Mustoda Nabi.

Wa aakhiro dawana anil hamdo lillah hai Rabbil aalameen.

Muslim First
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Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#2

Unread post by Muslim First » Thu Jun 28, 2012 2:36 pm

Foot Notes:
Characteristics of Mustakar Imam: They are born as Imam, they are the supreme authority, infalliable, Masoom, he cannot make any mistakes, knows all faculties of knowledge, he know past; present and future and he is omnipotent. Son after father, this chain of Mustakar Imam will run without break, they go to seclusion (purdah) and otherwise as and when they deem fit. Example of Mustakar Imams) Nabi Ibrahim (a), Imam Ismail (a) ibn Prophet Ibrahim (a), Imam Molana Abi Talib (a), Molana Hussain (a), Imam Ismail (a) ibn Imam Jaffer Sadik (a), Imam Tayyeb (a), etc - this chain will keep on running without break till the last moment of humans on Earth.
Imam Hussain being Mustakar Imam knew "he know past; present and future" .
Who in his right mind will sacrifice himself, his family and supporters knowing they will parish?

badrijanab
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Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#3

Unread post by badrijanab » Thu Jun 28, 2012 2:45 pm

Muslim First wrote:
Foot Notes:
Characteristics of Mustakar Imam: They are born as Imam, they are the supreme authority, infalliable, Masoom, he cannot make any mistakes, knows all faculties of knowledge, he know past; present and future and he is omnipotent. Son after father, this chain of Mustakar Imam will run without break, they go to seclusion (purdah) and otherwise as and when they deem fit. Example of Mustakar Imams) Nabi Ibrahim (a), Imam Ismail (a) ibn Prophet Ibrahim (a), Imam Molana Abi Talib (a), Molana Hussain (a), Imam Ismail (a) ibn Imam Jaffer Sadik (a), Imam Tayyeb (a), etc - this chain will keep on running without break till the last moment of humans on Earth.
Imam Hussain being Mustakar Imam knew "he know past; present and future" .
Who in his right mind will sacrifice himself, his family and supporters knowing they will parish?
Prophet Ibrahim a.s. (KNOWINGLY) took his beloved son Ismail a.s. to cut his throat! - Refer Quran.

anajmi
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Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#4

Unread post by anajmi » Thu Jun 28, 2012 4:12 pm

The prophet (saw) has categorically denied that he has no knowledge of the Ghayb. The future is ghayb. As per the Quran only Allah has knowledge of the future. Hence this entire story of the mustakar Imam can be flushed down the toilet!!

6:50 Say: "I tell you not that with me are the treasures of Allah, nor do I know what is hidden, nor do I tell you I am an angel. I but follow what is revealed to me." Say: "can the blind be held equal to the seeing?" Will ye then consider not?

6:59 With Him are the keys of the unseen, the treasures that none knoweth but He. He knoweth whatever there is on the earth and in the sea. Not a leaf doth fall but with His knowledge: there is not a grain in the darkness (or depths) of the earth, nor anything fresh or dry (green or withered), but is (inscribed) in a record clear (to those who can read).

7:188 Say: "I have no power over any good or harm to myself except as Allah willeth. If I had knowledge of the unseen, I should have multiplied all good, and no evil should have touched me: I am but a warner, and a bringer of glad tidings to those who have faith."

10:20 They say: "Why is not a sign sent down to him from his Lord?" Say: "The Unseen is only for Allah (to know), then wait ye: I too will wait with you."

11:123 To Allah do belong the unseen (secrets) of the heavens and the earth, and to Him goeth back every affair (for decision): then worship Him, and put thy trust in Him: and thy Lord is not unmindful of aught that ye do.

11:31 "I tell you not that with me are the treasures of Allah, nor do I know what is hidden, nor claim I to be an angel. Nor yet do I say, of those whom your eyes do despise that Allah will not grant them (all) that is good: Allah knoweth best what is in their souls: I should, if I did, indeed be a wrong-doer."

27:65 Say: None in the heavens or on earth, except Allah, knows what is hidden: nor can they perceive when they shall be raised up (for Judgment).

badrijanab
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Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#5

Unread post by badrijanab » Thu Jun 28, 2012 5:17 pm

anajmi wrote:The prophet (saw) has categorically denied that he has no knowledge of the Ghayb. The future is ghayb. As per the Quran only Allah has knowledge of the future. Hence this entire story of the mustakar Imam can be flushed down the toilet!!

6:50 Say: "I tell you not that with me are the treasures of Allah, nor do I know what is hidden, nor do I tell you I am an angel. I but follow what is revealed to me." Say: "can the blind be held equal to the seeing?" Will ye then consider not?

6:59 With Him are the keys of the unseen, the treasures that none knoweth but He. He knoweth whatever there is on the earth and in the sea. Not a leaf doth fall but with His knowledge: there is not a grain in the darkness (or depths) of the earth, nor anything fresh or dry (green or withered), but is (inscribed) in a record clear (to those who can read).

7:188 Say: "I have no power over any good or harm to myself except as Allah willeth. If I had knowledge of the unseen, I should have multiplied all good, and no evil should have touched me: I am but a warner, and a bringer of glad tidings to those who have faith."

10:20 They say: "Why is not a sign sent down to him from his Lord?" Say: "The Unseen is only for Allah (to know), then wait ye: I too will wait with you."

11:123 To Allah do belong the unseen (secrets) of the heavens and the earth, and to Him goeth back every affair (for decision): then worship Him, and put thy trust in Him: and thy Lord is not unmindful of aught that ye do.

11:31 "I tell you not that with me are the treasures of Allah, nor do I know what is hidden, nor claim I to be an angel. Nor yet do I say, of those whom your eyes do despise that Allah will not grant them (all) that is good: Allah knoweth best what is in their souls: I should, if I did, indeed be a wrong-doer."

27:65 Say: None in the heavens or on earth, except Allah, knows what is hidden: nor can they perceive when they shall be raised up (for Judgment).
The future is not always ghayab, even we common men can forecast to some extent, Example) with precision of seconds one can forecast tomorrow at what time will the sun/moon raise/set, etc.

In my other post I gave you example of Sunni books which have quoted forecast by Prophet Mohammed about coming of Imam Mehdi (Quaim).

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The aayat you quted are all correct. But please be advised these verses have nowhere indicated Allah Ta'ala to say that He does not grant this Knowledge of Unseen to anybody. Indeed he did bestowed that knowledge to his selected servants refer to verses below:

(1) Surah Jinn (72): 26-27
(2) Surah Naml, 27:16;
(3) Surah Yusuf, 12:68;
(4) Surah Yusuf, 12:96;
(5) Surah Qasas, 28:14.
(6) Surah Baqarah, 2: 251;

Surah Nisa 4:113 - "... has taught you what you did not know and great is the Grace of Allah upon you." This verse proves that not a single thing in both worlds is left excluded from the knowledge of the Prophet Mohammed.

Hence, lets throw your incorrect preconceived notion about Dawoodi Bohras into toilet.

anajmi
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Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#6

Unread post by anajmi » Thu Jun 28, 2012 5:24 pm

even we common men can forecast to some extent,
Correct. I forecast that we will see Qayamat in the future. Now that I have been able to forecast the future (this knowledge of the ghayb was granted to me by Allah), I have the same power as the Dawoodi Bohra Imams.

badrijanab
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Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#7

Unread post by badrijanab » Fri Jun 29, 2012 10:35 am

anajmi wrote:
even we common men can forecast to some extent,
Correct. I forecast that we will see Qayamat in the future. Now that I have been able to forecast the future (this knowledge of the ghayb was granted to me by Allah), I have the same power as the Dawoodi Bohra Imams.
By the same token you can claim to have same power as Prophet Mohammed s.a. and Allah himself!!! (mazallah)

anajmi
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Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#8

Unread post by anajmi » Fri Jun 29, 2012 10:47 am

But I do not claim to have the same powers as the prophet (saw) or Allah. I only claim to have the same powers as the Dawoodi Bohra Imams. I can tell you the future. Here are some examples of me predicting the future and this is only by the knowledge given to me by Allah.

1) Chicago will get very cold in December
2) 52nd Dai will be replaced by the 53rd Dai
3) Qayamat is approaching
4) You will die in the near future (within a 100 hundred years)

I guarantee you that none of this will be proven wrong. Hence I have the same powers as the Dawoodi Bohra Imams. Powers given to me by Allah!!

badrijanab
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Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#9

Unread post by badrijanab » Fri Jun 29, 2012 11:19 am

Your main hypothesis was per Quran Allah know the future/ghayab. I proved from Quran that that's true but this also true that Allah has taught the same to his selected servants.

You do not do intellectual discussion but arguments. Because you are defeated in RELIGIOUS ARGUMENTS(refer above sentence)so to save your face you are traying to pull me in your rat race - by attacking on my personal opinion, "Every humans can do little forecast" - even you cannot negate the same so, you dragged Bohra Imam in between claiming you have same power like him. I advised by the same token you can claim to have same power like Prophet and Allah. Having failed again in argument, you subjectively says "no", the token is only for Bohra Imam but not for Prophet and Allah! It proves you cannot face truth. You are scholarly dishonest.

I do not like to do arguments, discussions are welcome. So, this was my last reply to you.

Your main hypothesis was per Quran Allah know the future/ghayab. I proved from Quran that that's true but this also true that Allah has taught the same to his selected servants.

Peace
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Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#10

Unread post by Peace » Fri Jun 29, 2012 11:44 am

Dear Badrijanab,

Your copy paste articles are very unique and informative.

Only Allah knows how much authentic they are.

Can you please ask your source to prove Imamat concept from the Quran?

badrijanab
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Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#11

Unread post by badrijanab » Fri Jun 29, 2012 11:53 am

Peace wrote:Dear Badrijanab,

Your copy paste articles are very unique and informative.

Only Allah knows how much authentic they are.

Can you please ask your source to prove Imamat concept from the Quran?
Ok

anajmi
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Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#12

Unread post by anajmi » Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:27 pm

badrijanab,

The prophet (saw) says in the Quran that he doesn't have the knowledge of the unseen. Are you calling the prophet (saw) a liar?

Read these again.

11:31 "I tell you not that with me are the treasures of Allah, nor do I know what is hidden, nor claim I to be an angel. Nor yet do I say, of those whom your eyes do despise that Allah will not grant them (all) that is good: Allah knoweth best what is in their souls: I should, if I did, indeed be a wrong-doer."

10:20 They say: "Why is not a sign sent down to him from his Lord?" Say: "The Unseen is only for Allah (to know), then wait ye: I too will wait with you."

27:65 Say: None in the heavens or on earth, except Allah, knows what is hidden: nor can they perceive when they shall be raised up (for Judgment).

What is wrong with you people? Are you so dumb that you are unable to put 2 and 2 together to come up with 4? We also have the knowledge of the unseen that is given to us by Allah. For eg. I know that there are gardens in heaven with rivers of milk and honey and wine flowing underneath. What other knowledge of the unseen does your Imam have? Did he have the knowledge that he will have to go into hiding and the kothari goons will hijack his abde idiots? Every human has some knowledge of the unseen and your Imam is in that same category. He doesn't have anything more. For eg. your Imam will not be able to tell you the exact date and time of your death or the exact date and time of the day of Qayamah. Even the prophet (saw) didn't have that knowledge. Get rid of the Imam worship ideals that have corrupted your thinking.

badrijanab
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Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#13

Unread post by badrijanab » Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:04 pm

anajmi wrote:badrijanab,

The prophet (saw) says in the Quran that he doesn't have the knowledge of the unseen. Are you calling the prophet (saw) a liar?

Read these again.

11:31 "I tell you not that with me are the treasures of Allah, nor do I know what is hidden, nor claim I to be an angel. Nor yet do I say, of those whom your eyes do despise that Allah will not grant them (all) that is good: Allah knoweth best what is in their souls: I should, if I did, indeed be a wrong-doer."
Anajmi,

You are Mr. Jahil.

Surah Nisa 4:113 - "... has taught you what you did not know and great is the Grace of Allah upon you." This verse proves that not a single thing in both worlds is left excluded from the knowledge of the Prophet Mohammed. So, the Prophet says in the Quran that he does have knowledge of unseen. Are you telling the Prophet (saw) a liar?
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Now I will tell you why I called you Jahil: because you try to ARGUE not discuss, without thoroughly understanding the depth of matter. Both aayat's are correct but later negates the former. When 11:31 that was the state of Prophet as you said. But when 4:113 came it negated the state of 11:31 and taught all which includes unseen.

Learn the chronology:
11:31 - is a (mid) Meccan revealation, no Islamic state.

4:113 - is early Madina revelation, Islamic state.

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It is unfortunate that Kothar has selfishly closed doors to access the Fatimi literature that resulted in making people like Anajmi. You are not alone to blame for what you have become, Kothar is majorly responsible. If Kothar do not lift the gates and let the Fatimi Ilm/literature (on which they are illegitimately sitting) flow to common Bohra mumin I am afraid we may have many more Anajmi's in time ahead!

anajmi
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Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#14

Unread post by anajmi » Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:38 pm

وَلَوْلاَ فَضْلُ اللّهِ عَلَيْكَ وَرَحْمَتُهُ لَهَمَّت طَّآئِفَةٌ مُّنْهُمْ أَن يُضِلُّوكَ وَمَا يُضِلُّونَ إِلاُّ أَنفُسَهُمْ وَمَا يَضُرُّونَكَ مِن شَيْءٍ وَأَنزَلَ اللّهُ عَلَيْكَ الْكِتَابَ وَالْحِكْمَةَ وَعَلَّمَكَ مَا لَمْ تَكُنْ تَعْلَمُ وَكَانَ فَضْلُ اللّهِ عَلَيْكَ عَظِيمًا


004.113
YUSUFALI: But for the Grace of Allah to thee and his Mercy, a party of them would certainly have plotted to lead thee astray. But (in fact) they will only Lead their own souls astray, and to thee they can do no harm in the least. For Allah hath sent down to thee the Book and wisdom and taught thee what thou Knewest not (before): And great is the Grace of Allah unto thee.
PICKTHAL: But for the grace of Allah upon thee (Muhammad), and His mercy, a party of them had resolved to mislead thee, but they will mislead only themselves and they will hurt thee not at all. Allah revealeth unto thee the Scripture and wisdom, and teacheth thee that which thou knewest not. The grace of Allah toward thee hath been infinite.
SHAKIR: And were it not for Allah's grace upon you and His mercy a party of them had certainly designed to bring you to perdition and they do not bring (aught) to perdition but their own souls, and they shall not harm you in any way, and Allah has revealed to you the Book and the wisdom, and He has taught you what you did not know, and Allah's grace on you is very great.
Asad: And but for God's favour upon thee and His grace, some of those [who are false to themselves] would indeed endeavour to lead thee astray; yet none but themselves do they lead astray. Nor can they harm thee in any way, since God has bestowed upon thee from on high this divine writ and [given thee] wisdom, and has imparted unto thee the knowledge of what thou didst not know. And God's favour upon thee is tremendous indeed.

As can be seen, you have completely misunderstood the ayah that you based your faith upon. There is a reason why people like you never quote the full ayah but only bits and pieces from here and there. Which is the reason why you are going to go into hiding like your Imam pretty soon. The ayah 4:113 is referring to the Quran. Not to the the full unseen. The prophet (saw) didn't have the knowledge of the Quran but that was given to him by Allah. Understand first and then discuss. Go to your hidden Imam and see if he knows where he is going to be hiding next year!! No new revelation is coming to your Imam. Allah says in the Quran that his knowledge is so much that if all the trees were pens and all the oceans were ink even then it would not capture his full knowledge and wisdom. Out of that, a small portion was given to the prophet (saw) which was then transmitted to us. We have the information but lack the understanding as you have amply demonstrated.

One other thing, this knowledge was revealed to the prophet (saw) and not to your Imam. Your Imam has brought nothing new but infact has gone into hiding. So to say that your Imam has knowledge of everything is foolishness.

anajmi
Posts: 13403
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#15

Unread post by anajmi » Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:53 pm

6:59 With Him are the keys of the unseen, the treasures that none knoweth but He. He knoweth whatever there is on the earth and in the sea. Not a leaf doth fall but with His knowledge: there is not a grain in the darkness (or depths) of the earth, nor anything fresh or dry (green or withered), but is (inscribed) in a record clear (to those who can read).
Here is another ayah where Allah is talking about himself saying that none know about the treasures of the unseen but HE alone. Is Allah also negating himself as well? What you fools smoking?

These are just a sample. There are dozens of such ayah which according to Imam worshippers have been negated!!

badrijanab
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Joined: Fri Jun 15, 2012 3:19 pm

Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#16

Unread post by badrijanab » Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:20 pm

anajmi wrote: The ayah 4:113 is referring to the Quran. Not to the the full unseen. The prophet (saw) didn't have the knowledge of the Quran but that was given to him by Allah. Understand first and then discuss. We have the information but lack the understanding as you have amply demonstrated.
Lets assume your inference is correct, though it is not complete truth, but lets assume your contention that Aayat 4:113 is referring to Quran is correct.

But then Mr. Jahil Anjmi, Quran contains all knowledge (refer Sura 6:59), including that of unseen, and now Prophet Mohammed per your inference via Aayat 4:113 knows everything about Quran = Prophet knows every facaulties of knowledge including that of unseen.

***************************************************************************************************************************
Foot note:
Sura 6:59 (translation by Abdullah Yusuf Ali): With Him are the keys of the unseen, the treasures that none knoweth but He. He knoweth whatever there is on the earth and in the sea. Not a leaf doth fall but with His knowledge: there is not a grain in the darkness (or depths) of the earth, nor anything fresh or dry (green or withered), but is (inscribed) in a record clear (to those who can read).

anajmi
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Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#17

Unread post by anajmi » Fri Jun 29, 2012 4:05 pm

Your lack of knowledge about the Quran is astonishing. The Quran doesn't contain all knowledge. It contains only that which Allah wanted to share with us.

If the Quran contains all knowledge, can you tell me from the Quran the exact date of the day of Qayamah? Anyone who has even a little knowledge of Islam knows that the Quran is a part of the clear record which is with Allah. The clear record is where the deeds of everyone are captured. They are not captured in the Quran. Have you even read the Quran? Or do you just copy and paste junk from others?

The quran is in the clear record known as lauhim mahfuz

085.021
YUSUFALI: Day, this is a Glorious Qur'an,
PICKTHAL: Nay, but it is a glorious Qur'an.
SHAKIR: Nay! it is a glorious Quran,

085.022
YUSUFALI: (Inscribed) in a Tablet Preserved!
PICKTHAL: On a guarded tablet.
SHAKIR: In a guarded tablet.

بَلْ هُوَ قُرْآنٌ مَّجِيدٌ
فِي لَوْحٍ مَّحْفُوظٍ

salim
Posts: 406
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Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#18

Unread post by salim » Sat Jun 30, 2012 3:02 am

badrijanab, your article is interesting.
Can you tell me where did you posted this article from. How did the author know that our age Adam was born in Srilanka? Aadam Safiyullah - where did they name came from? I did a good search but did not find anything there.

Is there a way you can also post the source of many of the claims in this article?

Thanks

profastian
Posts: 1314
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2009 9:00 am

Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#19

Unread post by profastian » Sat Jun 30, 2012 3:13 am

salim wrote: Is there a way you can also post the source of many of the claims in this article?

Thanks
Stolen books + Faulty understanding

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am

Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#20

Unread post by Muslim First » Sat Jun 30, 2012 6:30 am

salim wrote:badrijanab, your article is interesting.
Can you tell me where did you posted this article from. How did the author know that our age Adam was born in Srilanka? Aadam Safiyullah - where did they name came from? I did a good search but did not find anything there.

Is there a way you can also post the source of many of the claims in this article?

Thanks
Ismailis have been manufacturing legends for long time. These are all fakery.
For Muslims Qur'an and Sunnah is true source.

badrijanab
Posts: 809
Joined: Fri Jun 15, 2012 3:19 pm

Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#21

Unread post by badrijanab » Mon Jul 02, 2012 2:53 am

profastian wrote: Stolen books + Faulty understanding
Ulta chor kotwal ko daante! The fact of matter is Kothar has stolen the books from the possession of Bohra mumineen.

Kothar is presently afraid of only one type of person = Knowledgable person. Person with knowledge can audit action of Kothar with commands of Fatimi books. As Kothar action is not in compliance with commands of Fatimi Dawat so Kothar in state of fear has stolen all Fatimi books, sitting on top of it and not letting its access to seeker of knowledge.

badrijanab
Posts: 809
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Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#22

Unread post by badrijanab » Mon Jul 02, 2012 3:18 am

anajmi wrote:The Quran doesn't contain all knowledge. It contains only that which Allah wanted to share with us.
Correct, and that includes the knowledge of future/unseen as well. Example) Forecast by Prophet Mohammed about coming of Imam Quaim/Mehdi before Qayamat, I have already cited source from your own Sunni/Wahabi authentic books.
anajmi wrote: If the Quran contains all knowledge, can you tell me from the Quran the exact date of the day of Qayamah?
Aayat 6:59 says Quran has all faculties of knowledge (including unseen/forecast) - like most matters this rule too have its exception: Qayamat date is unknown - it is commanded by Allah so, date of Qayamat cannot be found in Quran - WHY WILL ALLAH BREACH HIS OWN COMMAND! Similarly, if one will search for about Allah's character like height, weight, bredth and mass - one cannot get this knowledge in the Quran, they all form as exception. Besides, exceptions (per command of Allah) all knowledge is in Quran (6:59) and Allah has taught them to Prophet (4:113 and many other aayat's quoted earlier) so, Prophet Mohammed s.a.w.w. has all knowledge including that of unseen/future with exception as per Allah's command.

Thus, non-Bohras dogma is incorrect that Prophet Mohammed s.a. do not know future. (In this matter always keep in mind that Prophet has forecasted about coming of Imam Quaim/Mehdi from the progeny of his daughter Fatima a.s.)

bohraji
Posts: 245
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Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#23

Unread post by bohraji » Mon Jul 02, 2012 3:27 am

profastian wrote:
salim wrote: Is there a way you can also post the source of many of the claims in this article?

Thanks
Stolen books + Faulty understanding
Dear Profastian Bhai,
You take great pains to refute Badri Janaab.Why don't you show a part of the same concern for our less fortunate bretheren in Ahmedabad?
I have posted all on the thread.We now also try to help with medical bills and also surgeries which are otherwise unaffordable.Is your job here just to refute people who seem to be out of sync with your selfish thoughts.
You are keen to correct others who seem progressives ,why do you not want to correct the lives of a few abde dawoodi bohras of Ahmedabad?
If you cannot or refuse to part with money then atleast post some encouraging comments so that others might be convinced to help.
Be true to your community, be true to yourself.Help is needed, a poor mumin needs a cataract surgery some where.
JAK
Bohraji

profastian
Posts: 1314
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2009 9:00 am

Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#24

Unread post by profastian » Mon Jul 02, 2012 3:37 am

bohraji wrote:
profastian wrote: Stolen books + Faulty understanding
Dear Profastian Bhai,
You take great pains to refute Badri Janaab.Why don't you show a part of the same concern for our less fortunate bretheren in Ahmedabad?
I have posted all on the thread.We now also try to help with medical bills and also surgeries which are otherwise unaffordable.Is your job here just to refute people who seem to be out of sync with your selfish thoughts.
You are keen to correct others who seem progressives ,why do you not want to correct the lives of a few abde dawoodi bohras of Ahmedabad?
If you cannot or refuse to part with money then atleast post some encouraging comments so that others might be convinced to help.
Be true to your community, be true to yourself.Help is needed, a poor mumin needs a cataract surgery some where.
JAK
Bohraji
Helping others has a place and there are other forums for that. This is not a forum for charity. Besides there are more important things than charity. What you are doing is commendable and you should keep it going. But don't be a one trick pony and drag every thread into the charity thing.

bohraji
Posts: 245
Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2002 4:01 am

Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#25

Unread post by bohraji » Mon Jul 02, 2012 3:40 am

Dear Profastian Bhai,
Why not?
This is a dawoodi Bohra forum.What is wrong if priorities are sorted? Do you feel it fit that ridiculing Badrijanaab is correct and helping out is secondary?

profastian
Posts: 1314
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2009 9:00 am

Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#26

Unread post by profastian » Mon Jul 02, 2012 3:41 am

bohraji wrote:Dear Profastian Bhai,
Why not?
This is a dawoodi Bohra forum.What is wrong if priorities are sorted? Do you feel it fit that ridiculing Badrijanaab is correct and helping out is secondary?
yes on this forum. On this forum ridiculing badrijanab is primary( :mrgreen: :mrgreen: )and charity is secondary.

bohraji
Posts: 245
Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2002 4:01 am

Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#27

Unread post by bohraji » Mon Jul 02, 2012 3:57 am

profastian wrote:
bohraji wrote:Dear Profastian Bhai,
Why not?
This is a dawoodi Bohra forum.What is wrong if priorities are sorted? Do you feel it fit that ridiculing Badrijanaab is correct and helping out is secondary?
yes on this forum. On this forum ridiculing badrijanab is primary( :mrgreen: :mrgreen: )and charity is secondary.
"Live like Ali, Die like Hussain"
I am sure that you have such a sticker in your house.
Is this what Aqa Mola has taught you?
To ridicule people and let Mumins suffer.Have you forgotten that Rasul Allah went to visit a Jewsih lady because she was sick and this same lay would throw rubbish on him daily.

Grow up.

aliabbas_aa
Posts: 320
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Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#28

Unread post by aliabbas_aa » Mon Jul 02, 2012 4:20 am

You are right we should:
Live like Rasullallah saws Only
(You have indeed in the Messenger of Allah an excellent example for him who hopes in Allah and the Last Day, and who remembers Allah much. (33:21))
and death is not in our control but we all should pray for martyrdom for the sake of ALLAH swt alone.

profastian
Posts: 1314
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2009 9:00 am

Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#29

Unread post by profastian » Mon Jul 02, 2012 5:42 am

aliabbas_aa wrote:You are right we should:
Live like Rasullallah saws Only
The wahabi git spewing venom against the Ahle bait again.

aliabbas_aa
Posts: 320
Joined: Mon Feb 15, 2010 2:21 am

Re: Molana Aadam (a) - Dawoodi Bohra Perspective

#30

Unread post by aliabbas_aa » Mon Jul 02, 2012 6:21 am

did i say anything against ahle bayt, it is u who are just passing banal comments.
Is'nt rasulllallah the best example to follow , better than haz ali a.s?