How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

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freebhora
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How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#1

Unread post by freebhora » Wed Jun 04, 2014 5:00 pm

Since childhood I was always listening to these cliche "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad" , but I did not find a single rational reason as to how the martydom of Imam Hussain lead to the savings of teachings of Islam? How is that possible when the tragedy killed the very person who was the embodiment of teachings of Islam. People may get frustrated on reading this but going to Karbala was clearly a bad decision which actually proved to be the most detrimental effect on all Muslims. On further reading I was glad that I am not alone in thinking this. Umme Salamah RA, Muhmmad bin hanafia a.s the brother of Hussain a.s also cried and asked him not to goto karbala. He could have strategically gathered people and preached like how this happened even after the martydom event. Many reliable sources say that He did not went to wage a war , which is fairseeming as no one takes his own family , small chldren to a war. From my extensive readings I found that Hussain a.s did not want to wage a war but only wanted to meet the person who was the dawedar of caliphate for reconciliation. Most likely the dawedar was also ready to meet him but the likes of overzealous ibn ziyad,shimr etc wanted to earn recognition and approval from their masters which caused this grave tragedy. What is more perplexing is that two contrary stories appear from various sources, one in which the dawedar approves the killing and other in which the dawedar cries on hearing this news.

Another angle is that karbala caused many schism and broke the ummah into pieces like now how even most of the shia sects are bitterly divided.

I would rather rephrase the cliche as "Musalmaan bikharjata hai har karbala ke baad".

bohrikaka
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#2

Unread post by bohrikaka » Thu Jun 05, 2014 1:04 am

Yes. it did prove detrimental to so called Muslims who still pray and praise for a beast like Yazeed LA and his forefathers.

freebhora
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#3

Unread post by freebhora » Thu Jun 05, 2014 1:36 am

I think this had a detrimental effect on all Muslims ,Muslims should be very embarrassed of this tragedy and not something to show this in public.More specifically the group who honestly supported Hussain a.s was most affected and prosecuted , whereas the power hungry ones continued their monarchy for many decades to come. It only worsened the matters. I deeply regret saying that the martydom of Hussain a.s did not bring out any change like how RasulAllah SAW did, even to this day. Most of the shia sects who claim to love Hussain are themselves dont even practise the essentials of Islam and many likebohras, khojas,alavi etc have altogether abolished the essentials of Islam.




Allah knows best

bohrikaka
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#4

Unread post by bohrikaka » Thu Jun 05, 2014 2:47 am

It worsened as so called majority Muslims sided by Yazeed LA instead of supporting Imam Husain AS. Your only attempt by this post seems to be shifting blame away from Yazeed LA.

tasneempati
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#5

Unread post by tasneempati » Thu Jun 05, 2014 4:47 am

Allah ki Lanat on Yazeed & Yazeed like lanatis such as this freebohra.

Aaj Islam zinda he to sirf Karbala me 72 shuda's (AS) ki azeemo shan Qurbani ki vajeh se.

tasneempati
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#6

Unread post by tasneempati » Thu Jun 05, 2014 4:48 am

tasneempati wrote:Allah ki Lanat on Yazeed & Yazeed like lanatis such as this freebhora.

Aaj Islam zinda he to sirf Karbala me 72 shuda's (AS) ki azeemo shan Qurbani ki vajeh se.

freebhora
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#7

Unread post by freebhora » Thu Jun 05, 2014 5:22 am

dhongipati:
Islam to hamesha zinda tha or rahega , Islam ko kisi ki zaroorat nai hai.

Sabse bada nuksan Muslims ko hata hai naki Islam ko. Aur hamesha nuksan ka karan shirk hi rahi hai. jaise christians Mushrik ban gaye usi tarah se shia\barelvi etc bhi Mushrik ban gaye . Aur tum loog bhi Mushrikeen camp se hi ho jisse imam husain, Muhammad pbuh or saare nabi ne jung ki hai.

tasneempati
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#8

Unread post by tasneempati » Thu Jun 05, 2014 5:43 am

Get lost you Lanati Bhora (Scum of Bohra's). You are truly human waste.
freebhora wrote:dhongipati:
Islam to hamesha zinda tha or rahega , Islam ko kisi ki zaroorat nai hai.

Sabse bada nuksan Muslims ko hata hai naki Islam ko. Aur hamesha nuksan ka karan shirk hi rahi hai. jaise christians Mushrik ban gaye usi tarah se shia\barelvi etc bhi Mushrik ban gaye . Aur tum loog bhi Mushrikeen camp se hi ho jisse imam husain, Muhammad pbuh or saare nabi ne jung ki hai.

salaar
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#9

Unread post by salaar » Thu Jun 05, 2014 8:30 am

QATAL E HUSSAIN ASAL MAE MARG (death) E YAZEED HAE..............ISLAM ZINDA HOTA HAE HAR KARBALA KE BAAD.

dal-chaval-palidu
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#10

Unread post by dal-chaval-palidu » Thu Jun 05, 2014 8:40 am

guys,freebohra may be just asking a question. No need to call him names just for that.


freebohra, I had written-up a small piece (a while back) explaining how the martyardom of Imam Husain helped Islam. I will dig it up, re-edit it and post it here. Inshallah it will be useful. It is my understanding of the question that you are asking. May be you may not agree or you might; we can have a civil discussion in this forum.

It may take me several days before I get to it, but Inshallah will try and do it soon.

anajmi
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#11

Unread post by anajmi » Thu Jun 05, 2014 9:47 am

Actually, world war 2, where 40 million people died, did more for the cause of the jews than karbala did for the cause of Islam. And this was after Hitler was defeated. Can you imagine Hitler winning the war and the jews saying - Israel zinda hota hai world war 2 ke bad???

Karbala itself didn't cause any divisions in Islam, but then came the lovers of Hussain who exploited the story of karbala to create these divisions in order to create positions of power and enslave the ignorant amongst us.

Do you know that the bohras do not do a sajda for dua after completing asr namaz. When asked why, the answer is that Hussain was killed doing the asr namaz sajda. These fools have given up that which Hussain died doing!!!

humanbeing
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#12

Unread post by humanbeing » Thu Jun 05, 2014 10:02 am

Those shiaas, bohras and abdes gloat in tall claims believing that islam was preserved or came alive after event of karbala is a mere expression to cover their guilt or convenience. There is no doubt that event of karbala envokes emotions and grief. But people have turned into a insensitive ritual while some self proclaimed leaders have it as a tool to control their empires. None of these leaders live a simple life like ahle bait or live up to virtues of patience, hardships and commitment that event of karbala stands for.

In fact event of karbala has been commercialized; marsiya albums are sold, muharram has become a carnival, shia and bohra leaders charge hefty amount for sermons, while bohras feast instead of mourning hypocritically doing maatam over hungry and thirsty victims of karbala event.

By what integrity, love and piety do these shiaas and bohra claim ? that : “Islam zinda hota hai karbala ke baad”
anajmi wrote: Do you know that the bohras do not do a sajda for dua after completing asr namaz. When asked why, the answer is that Hussain was killed doing the asr namaz sajda. These fools have given up that which Hussain died doing!!!
Quiet a thought ! shias, bohra and if possible abdes must think over it !

Muslim First
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#13

Unread post by Muslim First » Thu Jun 05, 2014 2:17 pm

by bohrikaka on Thu Jun 05, 2014 5:04 am

Yes. it did prove detrimental to so called Muslims who still pray and praise for a beast like Yazeed LA and his forefathers.
Can explain more clearly how did it prove "detrimental to so called Muslims who still pray and praise for a beast like Yazeed LA and his forefathers".?

Show me one Muslim who Pray to "Yazeed"?

120 m Shia pray to Ali, Hussin etc. instead of Allah SWT.
Bohras pray to Hussein and beg favors from him and dead saints.
15 to 20 m Aga Khani Ismailis do not pray Salat/Namaaz, No Wadu, do not fast in Ramadaan, call Quran corrupted etc. etc.
Bohri Dai pays chores of Rupee to modern day Yazeed who allowed Muslims to be murderd, Sisters raped property distroyed.
Do Shia deserve laanat for Shirk? Aga Khan deserve laanat for maling Ismailies Kaafir? Do Dai deserve Laant for betraying Muslims of Gujarat?

salaar
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#14

Unread post by salaar » Thu Jun 05, 2014 3:26 pm

SHABBIR KO KHANJAR KE NEECHAY KIA JAANIYE KIYA KIYA YAAD AAYA........ABBAS KA MARNA YAAD AAYA AKBAR KA TARAPNA YAAD AAYA.........JAB TEERO KI BOCHAAR HOI PHAL PARNAY LAGAY JAB BARCHI KAY.........NAANA KI MOHABBAT YAAD AAI BACHPAN KA ZAMANA YAAD AAYA.........NAEZAY PAE BULAND HOTAY DEKHA BHAI KE JO SARR KO ZAINAB NE........SHABBIR KO APNAY KAANDHAY PAR NAANA KA BITHAANA YAAD AAYA..........KHAALI JO KOI JHOOLA DEKHA JIS WAQT RUBAB E BAEKAS NE.........ASGHAR KE LIYE DIL TOOT GAYA CHAY MAAH KA BACHA YAAD AAYA...........PIYAASO KO DIKHA KAR PHAENK DIYA PAANI JO YAZEEDI LASHKAR NE........SEHMAY HUE NANHAY BACHO KO AASHUR KA SAQAA YAAD AAYA...........BAAZAR SAJA WOH KUFAY KA AUR AALAE MOHAMMAD BAE PARDAH..........SAYDANIO KA DIL YOUN TARPAA HAIDER KA ZAMAANA YAAD AAYA...........TAKBEER E AZAN E ASAR KI JAB DARBAR E YAZEEDI MAE GOONJI..........MAIDAN E BALAA MAE ZAINAB KO SHABBIR KA SAJDAA YAAD AAYA..........ROUZAE PAE NABI KE JAB POHNCHI PARDAIS MAE LUTT KAR BINTE ALI..........BATHAA SE WOH RUKHSAT YAAD AAI KARBAL MAE WOH LUTNA YAAD AAYA...........KEHNAY KO SAHAARA KOI NA THA DUNIYA MAE SAROOSH E BAEKAS KA............LEKIN JO KOI AAFAT AAI AHMAD KA NAWAASA YAAD AAYA.

anajmi
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#15

Unread post by anajmi » Thu Jun 05, 2014 3:27 pm

Damn it. Now that salaar has said it in shayri, it has to be true!!!!

salaar
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#16

Unread post by salaar » Thu Jun 05, 2014 3:46 pm

sometimes the message touches the heart more effectively in shairi, mr anajmi and believe me this does not concern you so dont try to waste your time here go and bark somewhere else

anajmi
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#17

Unread post by anajmi » Thu Jun 05, 2014 3:56 pm

If there were more truth in the message, shayri wouldn't be needed.

ISLAM ZINDA KARNE HUSSAIN GAYE SAJDE MEIN
CHAD GAYE WAAR PE SHIMR KE
BOHRE DAR GAYE MAUT SE AUR
BHOOL GAYE SAJDE KO HUSSAIN KE

WAH WAH, WAH WAH!!

freebhora
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#18

Unread post by freebhora » Fri Jun 06, 2014 12:03 am

Actually these people , have more hatred for Muslims then love of ahlebayt. They just cant accept the clearly proven fact that their forefathers and the entire chain of dai was fraud. I know its very difficult to digest this truth. But truth is what free us from the shackles of fraud and darkness.

The Mushrikeen e Mecca themselves gave these arguments that they are following what their forefathers did, these shayeris also come from their forefathers who were in error.

salaar
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#19

Unread post by salaar » Fri Jun 06, 2014 2:45 am

freebohra there is no mention of dai in here as you are saying, you laantis have been trying your best to coverup the fazaails of Panjatan and i tell you it is not just now it is going on since the time of RasoolAllah, you call yourself MUSLIM yes Yazeed also called himself a muslim, the tongue of Maisam e Tammar was chopped only because he would not stop in reciting the fazaails of Maula Ali, in the name of islam the followers of Muawiya and Yazeed butchered so many shia kholosa of Ali Murtaza that the floor of masjid e nabavi was covered red, after the shahadat of Maula Hussain yazeed proudly said Today we have taken the revenge of our relatives who were killed in Auhad and Badar, had Hussain not exposed the real intentions of these people by sacrificing his life in karbala you people would have been following the traits of yazeed by drinking wine and playing with dogs...... but then who knows those who envy Hussain might still be doing that.

salaar
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#20

Unread post by salaar » Fri Jun 06, 2014 2:52 am

"Actually these people , have more hatred for Muslims then love of ahlebayt" No the fact is you wahabies bore more hatred for Ahle Bayt then the hatred for Yazeed

Muslim First
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#21

Unread post by Muslim First » Fri Jun 06, 2014 6:35 am

had Hussain not exposed the real intentions of these people by sacrificing his life in karbala you people would have been following the traits of yazeed by drinking wine and playing with dogs..
All Ismailis are alike. Have you seen your Dai's family doing Ash on your money. Have you seen pictures of Aga khan with his dogs and half naked women? Hippocrate!

salaar
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#22

Unread post by salaar » Fri Jun 06, 2014 7:09 am

why talk irrelevant things whos discussing dai or agha khan here?

freebhora
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#23

Unread post by freebhora » Fri Jun 06, 2014 7:21 am

Well I was born and bought up a bohra shia, I used to goto noha khanis, Mughal Masjid, Mehfil Khurasan, matam etc , And Alhamdulillah after readin the Quran and history from oriental sources I found that Shia versions are full of masala \ shaeyri \emotions with little regard to the actual truth. Dont think that truth cant be reachable , its not truth which is not rechable\verifiable . What you call as wahhabi I found them to be the best people , they practiced the sunnah, pray, good to the neighbours , help fellow beings and many more, gentle etc. Where as I see the shia \barelvi etc full of bad manners, lack of sunnah, kufr, shirk, biddah, false emotions etc. (of course the barelvi beat the shia in this).

Muslim First
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#24

Unread post by Muslim First » Fri Jun 06, 2014 9:58 am

salaar wrote:why talk irrelevant things whos discussing dai or agha khan here?
It is all about Shia M.O.
Shia come in all colors.
Only common thread is their over the board love for Ahl e Bait.

Instead of any justification they will shout Wahabi, Wahabi.

freebhora
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#25

Unread post by freebhora » Fri Jun 06, 2014 11:29 am

salar are you a Zionist agent?

salaar
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#26

Unread post by salaar » Fri Jun 06, 2014 11:42 pm

Ha ha ha well mannered good human beings you are calling wahabies has. I call them tyrants who supported Muawiya in siffin I call them those who are responsible for demolishing the roza of maulatena Fatima I call them zalimeen who prevent shias doing ziarats and visiting Ghadeer I call them people always ready to spit venom on the mention of Alis fazails I call them looters who attacked the roza of Imam Hussain and Abbas Allamdar and plundered everything I call them rafzi who did rafz in the hadees of Rasoolallah I call them the bunch who tried to demote the martaba of Rasoolallah and consider him as an ordinary human I call them people who tries to label the sacrifices in Karbala as political tussle I call them the munkireen of Aulia Allah in short I call them jahannami. Now you understand what I call these wahabies

anajmi
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#27

Unread post by anajmi » Fri Jun 06, 2014 11:45 pm

Now please say it in shayri.

salaar
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#28

Unread post by salaar » Sat Jun 07, 2014 12:02 am

Here the blunt mssg is good enough to smash your faces in nasar don't worry I will use shairi wherever needed

freebhora
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#29

Unread post by freebhora » Sat Jun 07, 2014 2:22 am

Why you have so much hatred when Islam itself means "Peace" and submission to Allah alone.
What happened was Allah's will and Allah will judge the wrongdoers , our duty is only to follow the commands of the prophet pbuh and not history. Noone is infalible except prophet pbuh hence he alone is the role model to be followed. Just tell me what positive contribution did the event of karbala had on Muslims? It only had worse outcomes. Whereas you see the events of RasulAllah SAW like jung -e badar , Uhud etc . It was all victory which gained more converts to Islam and gave a lot of benifits to Muslims. The Karbala incident , siffin,etc did not have any positive contribution apart from creating schisms, unlawful killings of the best personalities in Islam, killing muslims etc. Hence such incidents shoud be better forgotten and work towards getting positive contributions in Islam which are measurable like:
-Convince non muslims to come to Islam
-establish righteos shariah law with justice to all
-bring more land under islamic rule

Did the events of siffin,karbala, etc helped in any of the above? NO

On the contrary compare with other events :
Jung khaibar by Ali
conquest of byzantine, persia by Umar
Hundreds of conquests by Khalid bin Walid

In most of the above conquest Imam husaain himself was in the army at various positions.

badrijanab
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Re: How come "Islam zinda hota hai karabala ke baad"?

#30

Unread post by badrijanab » Sat Jun 07, 2014 3:30 am

freebhora wrote:Why you have so much hatred when Islam itself means "Peace" and submission to Allah alone.
What happened was Allah's will and Allah will judge the wrongdoers , our duty is only to follow the commands of the prophet pbuh and not history. Noone is infalible except prophet pbuh hence he alone is the role model to be followed. Just tell me what positive contribution did the event of karbala had on Muslims? It only had worse outcomes. Whereas you see the events of RasulAllah SAW like jung -e badar , Uhud etc . It was all victory which gained more converts to Islam and gave a lot of benifits to Muslims. The Karbala incident , siffin,etc did not have any positive contribution apart from creating schisms, unlawful killings of the best personalities in Islam, killing muslims etc. Hence such incidents shoud be better forgotten and work towards getting positive contributions in Islam which are measurable like:
-Convince non muslims to come to Islam
-establish righteos shariah law with justice to all
-bring more land under islamic rule

Did the events of siffin,karbala, etc helped in any of the above? NO

On the contrary compare with other events :
Jung khaibar by Ali
conquest of byzantine, persia by Umar
Hundreds of conquests by Khalid bin Walid

In most of the above conquest Imam husaain himself was in the army at various positions.
Previously (during era of Prophet s.a.w.w.) enemy of Islam was not-masked - Islam was saved by Ahlul Bayt (Mola Ali a.s. & progeny) by killing those open enemies.

Enemies of Islam changed tactics, now they attack Islam by cladding the Islamic mask over their un-Islamic face (Talha, Zubair, Mawiya, daughter of 1st, etc) - Ahlul Bayt too changed their tactics, previously they killed enemies and saved Islam, now they got martyred and saved Islam.

"Zabardasti" and "Zulm" is against core tenets of Islam. Karbala unravel the fact that who is with Islam and Islam is with whom = line of Imam Hussain a.s. (Mohammed - Fatima - Hasan - Hussain a.s.) is where the Islam is. Yazeed line (1-2-3-Mawiya-Yazeed) is line of enemy of Islam.