IS IKRAM SO ESSENTIAL DURING DAI'S VISIT ???

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jamat_confused
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat Mar 29, 2014 1:28 pm

IS IKRAM SO ESSENTIAL DURING DAI'S VISIT ???

#1

Unread post by jamat_confused » Sun Jun 08, 2014 2:35 pm

I just want to know whether Ikram i.e. Ikram Fund so essential during the Dai's Visit to any place.
I hail from Burhanpur, Every time i noticed that at the time of arrival of Dai to Burhanpur the Jamat Members used to pressurize the common people for Ikram Fund as people can avail the Kadambosi Passes only by paying such dues, the jamat members rather don't care about the condition of the person, whether he is able to pay such dues or not.
This time also i saw the same scenario even jamat members didn't gave kadambosi passes to the city persons without paying dues and sold the passes to other city people. Don't u think its right of the city people to have kadambosi of dai ? Does the whole thing is money ?
how a common man can arrange a huge sum of money everytime ? should he take money on interest to pay such dues ?

Bohra spring
Posts: 1350
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2012 8:37 am

Re: IS IKRAM SO ESSENTIAL DURING DAI'S VISIT ???

#2

Unread post by Bohra spring » Sun Jun 08, 2014 6:49 pm

The best way to get rid of this problem is get rid of the demand. So if Bohras stop insisting physically greeting the Diai and paying for the chance the price will drop . If fewer people turn up it will force him to visit you to regain popularity.

I did not know ikram stood for visiting fund...where I lived these money were collected the Diai has not visited ever and I don't want him to come too , if he does if it is SKQ , then he should come on his own expenses, if not with arrangements happy to see them via skype or youtube..I ignored ikram , thinking it was one of the many taxes !

Now for the poor souls who live like in Africa and India , he rocks up now and again uninvited , or on his pleasure safaris..and if you have to pay ...don't know what options you have ?.

Sufi monk
Posts: 566
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2012 7:34 am

Re: IS IKRAM SO ESSENTIAL DURING DAI'S VISIT ???

#3

Unread post by Sufi monk » Sun Jun 08, 2014 8:22 pm

dont pay any thing unless you personally have invited him, if he is coming by his will off course he should pay his own bills.

allbird
Posts: 493
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2005 4:01 am

Re: IS IKRAM SO ESSENTIAL DURING DAI'S VISIT ???

#4

Unread post by allbird » Wed Feb 03, 2016 10:05 pm

jamat_confused wrote:I just want to know whether Ikram i.e. Ikram Fund so essential during the Dai's Visit to any place.
I hail from Burhanpur, Every time i noticed that at the time of arrival of Dai to Burhanpur the Jamat Members used to pressurize the common people for Ikram Fund as people can avail the Kadambosi Passes only by paying such dues, the jamat members rather don't care about the condition of the person, whether he is able to pay such dues or not.
This time also i saw the same scenario even jamat members didn't gave kadambosi passes to the city persons without paying dues and sold the passes to other city people. Don't u think its right of the city people to have kadambosi of dai ? Does the whole thing is money ?
how a common man can arrange a huge sum of money everytime ? should he take money on interest to pay such dues ?

Ikram means more of "Welcome with respect". In Dawoodi Bohra terminology its more or less Pay up or shut up. Ikram is done more in terms of money aka Salaam Rakam. Firstly Dai is invited by local Amil with help of local Khidmat Guzaars or Cohorts who are promised unlimited Kadambosi and chances with Dai and Shazada sahebs. Its important to have contacts with shezada saheb, if they know you by your first name then you are considered important and in a way have connections to the FAMILY. "Arre bhai shezada saheb tu tame first name si bulaveche". And if that is done in front of a ghetto then "Tamaro beho paar che". You leave your job profession and family and go gagga over khidmat day and night until they stay in your town, completely exhausted and drained out in khidmat until their stay in your city. You keep doing this every time they come and visit your city or you visit some other city where they are for Qiyaam. If you are poor or middle class then you are their slave or Kidmat Guzaar and they use you like one. If you are rich or Raees of that city then you are coerced either to upgrade your status from Mullah to shaikh by giving faakhir Najwa because by giving X amount of money you have purchased same position in Janaah as you done it in in this duniyah. "Aka Moula once mentioned that mumin in jannah will gather in Dai hazaraat after death in same fashion as in current Majalis" where Kasre- Aali, Bhaisaheb, Mashaikh and mullah are sitting in teer-teeb. In duniyah you can have PhD, Doctorate, LLB etc but on your grave you cannot Etch those degrees, but you can etch "SHAIKH abcd Skh zxy sosowalla" because when Angels visit your grave before giving Dastaar they read your name plates on graves and realise your Azmaat or Duniyawi position. Some person either with slightest ego are self respect is cancelled, sided-out off khidmat because he/she is no use to them. Meaning during khidmat you do things they ask you without question or Dalill. If you question "Kem aam shukaam kaarwa ni zarurat che, Aa tu zamaat anne logi on sabil ni Raqqaam che. Aa logo, bhai-saheb, Shezada saheb na salaam ma na khar chai pun aa rakam mumeen Markaz masjid na upkeep waste aarz kaare che" Then you had it ! You are out out-chaste, munafikeen, mudai jewe waat karo cho. All this money is collected for Dawaat and if spend on Salaam and Diyafaat then its justifiable expenditure and common mumin have to live with it because that is the Nizaam of Dawaat. So bhai in short my advise is if you get chance of Qadaambosi do it with whatever you have in your pocket if they ask for certain amount for pass. Then tell them on their face politely that i will let go this time my Qadaambosi maybe next time i will work hard save more money and if Moula (TUS) visits i will do it and if still can't make it then i will go to Syedi Hakimmuddin Moula RA Raudat and do a FREE Ziyaraat and be content with lesser and cheaper option because current DAI is out of reach of POOR people, tell this to your jamaatis.

dawedaar
Posts: 844
Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2014 4:40 pm

Re: IS IKRAM SO ESSENTIAL DURING DAI'S VISIT ???

#5

Unread post by dawedaar » Tue Feb 09, 2016 4:10 pm

Can you live another day without qadambosi -> Yes -> Then it is not essential

Essential is anything without which you cannot survive!
jamat_confused wrote:I just want to know whether Ikram i.e. Ikram Fund so essential during the Dai's Visit to any place.
I hail from Burhanpur, Every time i noticed that at the time of arrival of Dai to Burhanpur the Jamat Members used to pressurize the common people for Ikram Fund as people can avail the Kadambosi Passes only by paying such dues, the jamat members rather don't care about the condition of the person, whether he is able to pay such dues or not.
This time also i saw the same scenario even jamat members didn't gave kadambosi passes to the city persons without paying dues and sold the passes to other city people. Don't u think its right of the city people to have kadambosi of dai ? Does the whole thing is money ?
how a common man can arrange a huge sum of money everytime ? should he take money on interest to pay such dues ?

Kaka Akela
Posts: 403
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 4:01 am

Re: IS IKRAM SO ESSENTIAL DURING DAI'S VISIT ???

#6

Unread post by Kaka Akela » Tue Feb 09, 2016 8:18 pm

Bro. Dawedaar:
Ikram fund as exorbitant as it is, is only the tip of the iceberg. This include Dai's salaam plus all other expenses associated with his arrival, the lighting, the decorations, the horse & buggy (may even be an A/C Buggy), food for the visitors for a few days, and all other amenities. Then you salaams and ziyafats from the many sansthao (s) that are formed in all jamaat with the sole intention of extracting monies when Dai comes to town. there are at least 10 sansthao(s) in every town, they don't even spare the little children of the madrassas. the head of the family has to pay the ikram fund but then has to pay for hizbul mashaik(if he is shaik) or hizbul Mafasih(if he or his wife is aMulla), BWA, TNC, Zakereen, rasme saifee,Shabab,Tolaba and talebaat (if he has college age boys and girls) and the list is never ending as all this sansthao(s) are pressured by aamil to do ziyafat. Aamil is only the front man that we see and get upset with, but some higher ups are pulling his strings. Few days before Dai comes to any town a shahzada comes and wants guarantee from aamil as to how many ziyafats and qadams will be done, how much other funds would be collected with threats if we didn't get this much money we will cancel the Dai's visit. aamils neck is on the line, and he has to toe the line or get transferred or demoted . It is sinful to have this much greed, and then they preach to us that the greed is one of the 4 roots of evil. All bunch of hypocrites.

ajamali
Posts: 570
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2015 11:51 am

Re: IS IKRAM SO ESSENTIAL DURING DAI'S VISIT ???

#7

Unread post by ajamali » Sat Feb 13, 2016 12:08 pm

Jamat_confused, my views on Dunbosi are well known on this forum. There is very little point to doing the so called Dai's dumbosi. You will wait for a long time, you will pay huge sums of money, you will be at the fake dai's feet for a few seconds, he will give his fake smile (if you are lucky) and then someone will egg you to move on. So don't pay up in the ikram fund just so you can do kadambosi. It may be difficult to do when all around you are "bragging" that they did dumbosi 3 and four times. Lie if you feel compelled to keep up with the Jamalies :D I used to be in the same trap, paying for this and that because of the pressure to keep up with those around me. Now my eyes are opened and I have seen the light.

The point of religion is to offer a moral compass for your life. The shenanigans around kadambosi are all about extortionism and are completely devoid of any morals. They are all about getting your money by hook or by crook. Don't promote this degradation of human values. Kadambosi is a fake product with an artificially pumped up demand. Don't buy into it. Go for a holiday with your family instead. At least you will enjoy something for real.

jamat_confused wrote:I just want to know whether Ikram i.e. Ikram Fund so essential during the Dai's Visit to any place.
I hail from Burhanpur, Every time i noticed that at the time of arrival of Dai to Burhanpur the Jamat Members used to pressurize the common people for Ikram Fund as people can avail the Kadambosi Passes only by paying such dues, the jamat members rather don't care about the condition of the person, whether he is able to pay such dues or not.
This time also i saw the same scenario even jamat members didn't gave kadambosi passes to the city persons without paying dues and sold the passes to other city people. Don't u think its right of the city people to have kadambosi of dai ? Does the whole thing is money ?
how a common man can arrange a huge sum of money everytime ? should he take money on interest to pay such dues ?

UnhappyBohra
Posts: 607
Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2014 2:23 pm

Re: IS IKRAM SO ESSENTIAL DURING DAI'S VISIT ???

#8

Unread post by UnhappyBohra » Sat Feb 13, 2016 12:19 pm

Moral of the story:

There is nothing special about Dumbosi. Don't advertise your reasons for not doing qadambosi to your fellow citizens unless you feel the need to do so and unless you feel it will have an impact. And DO NOT pay money just for a dumbosi pass.

Don't fall into the trap of keeping up with the Jamalies.

Nicely done A Jamali :lol:

allbird
Posts: 493
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2005 4:01 am

Re: IS IKRAM SO ESSENTIAL DURING DAI'S VISIT ???

#9

Unread post by allbird » Sat Feb 13, 2016 11:52 pm

Good write up ajamali. I am pleased the way your put it. The pressure and false promise of Jannah if you do Fakhir salaam. Just like any baba from other religion we are taken for it.

:D :D

objectiveobserver53
Posts: 524
Joined: Sat Nov 08, 2014 2:29 pm

Re: IS IKRAM SO ESSENTIAL DURING DAI'S VISIT ???

#10

Unread post by objectiveobserver53 » Sun Feb 14, 2016 1:01 pm

Very well said ajamali. Dumbosi is a fake product with a trumped up demand. It provides negative benefit to the doer and much to the receiver. If you want sawab, go and give the money to a homeless or hungry person. Your worth will be much increased in Allah's eyes.

Al-Noor
Posts: 1075
Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2015 9:55 am

Re: IS IKRAM SO ESSENTIAL DURING DAI'S VISIT ???

#11

Unread post by Al-Noor » Sun Feb 14, 2016 1:17 pm

IKRAM - my defination to this word :lol:

I - I take your money
K -dont do kanjoosi
R - rota haro warso sudhi
A - Aaya cho afat maa tame
M - mein to chu manmoji

humanbeing
Posts: 2195
Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2011 2:30 am

Re: IS IKRAM SO ESSENTIAL DURING DAI'S VISIT ???

#12

Unread post by humanbeing » Mon Feb 15, 2016 1:44 am

Well put Ajamali, good one !

It is hilarious to see people complain for Qadambosi passes. Stand in long line to kiss the pheronic maula’s feet.
I’d rather kiss my father and mother’s feet in the convenience of my house.. but guess what, they don’t let me .. everytime I bow down, they lift me up, kiss my forehead and hug me .. and I call that humility loaded with love.

And this jagat daddy, shafeek bawa sits on a throne watching in delightful arrogance long queues of men, women, children, elderlies and crippled jostle over to kiss his feet, shoved over to the side in split seconds. What a waste of time, emotion and faith.

Liberalguy
Posts: 35
Joined: Thu Mar 22, 2012 9:10 am

Re: IS IKRAM SO ESSENTIAL DURING DAI'S VISIT ???

#13

Unread post by Liberalguy » Sat Feb 20, 2016 3:07 pm

kaka Akela wrote:Bro. Dawedaar:
Ikram fund as exorbitant as it is, is only the tip of the iceberg. This include Dai's salaam plus all other expenses associated with his arrival, the lighting, the decorations, the horse & buggy (may even be an A/C Buggy), food for the visitors for a few days, and all other amenities. Then you salaams and ziyafats from the many sansthao (s) that are formed in all jamaat with the sole intention of extracting monies when Dai comes to town. there are at least 10 sansthao(s) in every town, they don't even spare the little children of the madrassas. the head of the family has to pay the ikram fund but then has to pay for hizbul mashaik(if he is shaik) or hizbul Mafasih(if he or his wife is aMulla), BWA, TNC, Zakereen, rasme saifee,Shabab,Tolaba and talebaat (if he has college age boys and girls) and the list is never ending as all this sansthao(s) are pressured by aamil to do ziyafat. Aamil is only the front man that we see and get upset with, but some higher ups are pulling his strings. Few days before Dai comes to any town a shahzada comes and wants guarantee from aamil as to how many ziyafats and qadams will be done, how much other funds would be collected with threats if we didn't get this much money we will cancel the Dai's visit. aamils neck is on the line, and he has to toe the line or get transferred or demoted . It is sinful to have this much greed, and then they preach to us that the greed is one of the 4 roots of evil. All bunch of hypocrites.
I am interested in how you explained the role and the dilemma of local amil in the whole ikram tamasha. The hierarchical system of kothar and so called khidmatguzars have been created to have strong grip over the community. The amils, masools and other such designations are paid employees whose livelihood depends on following guidelines from above. Being brainwashed in jamea for 11 years is their only qualification.
Now this thing points towards the factory for creating legions for the autocratic system. It's interesting Jamea is never discussed here. It's the training and brainwashing camp to prepare cogs to run this machinery of power greed and oppression