Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

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true_bohra
Posts: 719
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#31

Unread post by true_bohra » Sat May 02, 2015 2:12 am

S. Insaf wrote:A day after Baqir Jamaluddin’s death, I met one elderly Miya Sahebji at Mazgaon Mumbai, (whom I knew since my days in Badri and Saifee Mahals during Mukasir, Saleh Bhai Safiyuddin’s time. (I do not want to disclose the Miya Saheb’s name for the sake of his safety.)
Miya Sahebji asked me, “Kayee khabar padi?, Baqir (who was Burhanuddin’s younger brother and his look-alike) gujri gayo.” Have you received the news of Baqir’s death?) “Ji Miya Sahebji Khabar che.( “Yes Sir”.)
He asked me again. “kayee samaj paadi ke kaun mari gayu ane kone dafan kari aviya?” ( Hve you undertood any thing? Who has died and who is buried in his place?) At that time Sayedna Burhanuddin was seriously ill in Saifee Hospital Mumbai and the Bohras were asked to slaughter goats and pray for his recovery.
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true_bohra
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#32

Unread post by true_bohra » Sat May 02, 2015 2:17 am

Mr Insaf, you seriously need to go and check up with the doctor before the situation worsens....and ya take your hallucinating elderly miyasaheb also along with you... :lol: :lol:

araz5253
Posts: 236
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#33

Unread post by araz5253 » Sat May 02, 2015 11:51 pm

Dont worry , it is the sons of MB who used his fathers body, doubles for their own vested interests when they saw the real MB body died then they came up with multiple doubles, they did all this to wait for KQ's death which did not happen and all the doubles were used up. The double was clearly drugged , on heavy medications to behave in the way we saw, and was done to allow Muffy by his side.

I guess MB reaped his own evil deeds, he neither got a funeral, neither died peacefully was ill and bed ridden for a long time untill his death and his body was probably extinguished to hide any evidences and allow his double to takeover.

true_bohra
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#34

Unread post by true_bohra » Sun May 03, 2015 5:26 am

araz5253 wrote:Dont worry , it is the sons of MB who used his fathers body, doubles for their own vested interests when they saw the real MB body died then they came up with multiple doubles, they did all this to wait for KQ's death which did not happen and all the doubles were used up. The double was clearly drugged , on heavy medications to behave in the way we saw, and was done to allow Muffy by his side.

I guess MB reaped his own evil deeds, he neither got a funeral, neither died peacefully was ill and bed ridden for a long time untill his death and his body was probably extinguished to hide any evidences and allow his double to takeover.
Are you backing Insaf in saying that Shz Mohammed al Baqir was used as body double of Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin RA??

Akhtiar Wahid
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#35

Unread post by Akhtiar Wahid » Sun May 03, 2015 6:23 am

Image

Myth Busted........i do not think that this Shezada was exact replica of SMB (RA)

araz5253
Posts: 236
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#36

Unread post by araz5253 » Sun May 03, 2015 7:46 am

not necessarily him , I have myself seen many lookalikes of MB and can vouch that there are lot of facial, bodily, differences in various manifestations of MB puppeted by the kothar, I suspect atleast 3 doubles were used before they all finished.

Adam
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#37

Unread post by Adam » Sun May 03, 2015 7:50 am

Biradar wrote:I think you are getting a bit soft in the head, my friend S. Insaf. You really believe in this body-double nonsense? I have met and seen Muhammad al-Baqir BS several times, and, yes, even though he had a family resemblance with SMB, he was not "his look-alike". If this is the level of evidence which will convince progressives like yourself about such stupidity, then I worry about the overall sanity of the movement. What will you tell us next? Some "Miya Sahebji" told you that SMB was an alien Martian lizard-man trying to take over the world through his followers?
Well said,
This sums up the conspiracy mentality of the PDB movement.
Stop the hatred. Accept the truth

Akhtiar Wahid
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#38

Unread post by Akhtiar Wahid » Sun May 03, 2015 10:31 am

araz5253 wrote:not necessarily him , I have myself seen many lookalikes of MB and can vouch that there are lot of facial, bodily, differences in various manifestations of MB puppeted by the kothar, I suspect atleast 3 doubles were used before they all finished.
Brother i did some research and gave my bit of photographic evidences,
if you say this with full confidence it is better you show some article, photos of those body doubles etc.

This forum is free for all but that does not mean you can say whatever you want and get away with it.

Humsafar
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#39

Unread post by Humsafar » Sun May 03, 2015 12:07 pm

Biradar, Adam et al,
I suggest you guys get off your high horses. Agreed the body-double theory is far-fetched but not new, it's been floating around for quite some time, and for good reason. The fact though is that the mafia clergy for all its wiliness lacks the sophistication to or the imagination of pull such a thing off. Insaf Saheb is relating the story of the miya saheb verbatim, he is neither endorsing or denying it. He left it to the readers to draw their own conclusion. You can question the authenticity of the story if you want or take it with a pinch of salt. But don't accuse Insaf Saheb of going soft in the head or question the sanity of the movement. This movement is not sustained by fanciful rumours but by solid realities that are well documented and lived daily by Bohras.

true_bohra
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#40

Unread post by true_bohra » Mon May 04, 2015 2:32 am

Humsafar wrote:Biradar, Adam et al,
I suggest you guys get off your high horses. Agreed the body-double theory is far-fetched but not new, it's been floating around for quite some time, and for good reason. The fact though is that the mafia clergy for all its wiliness lacks the sophistication to or the imagination of pull such a thing off. Insaf Saheb is relating the story of the miya saheb verbatim, he is neither endorsing or denying it. He left it to the readers to draw their own conclusion. You can question the authenticity of the story if you want or take it with a pinch of salt. But don't accuse Insaf Saheb of going soft in the head or question the sanity of the movement. This movement is not sustained by fanciful rumours but by solid realities that are well documented and lived daily by Bohras.
What do you mean by saying that insaf is not endorsing it. Saifuddin Insaf known to bring a lot of proofs and documents and articles related to Bohra clergy, would be sharing a shaggy story about body doubles & miyasahebs. OMG

and since you say that this movement is not sustained on fanciful rumours then what is this. What solid realities you talking about. All we can see is cooked up stories, issues pertaining to money, abuse to the Dai and bragging about self claimed progressiveness. Saifuddin Insaf has been exposed in many of the forum topics. Go check it out for yourself

Biradar
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#41

Unread post by Biradar » Mon May 04, 2015 11:02 pm

Humsafar wrote:Biradar, Adam et al,
I suggest you guys get off your high horses. Agreed the body-double theory is far-fetched but not new, it's been floating around for quite some time, and for good reason. The fact though is that the mafia clergy for all its wiliness lacks the sophistication to or the imagination of pull such a thing off. Insaf Saheb is relating the story of the miya saheb verbatim, he is neither endorsing or denying it. He left it to the readers to draw their own conclusion. You can question the authenticity of the story if you want or take it with a pinch of salt. But don't accuse Insaf Saheb of going soft in the head or question the sanity of the movement. This movement is not sustained by fanciful rumours but by solid realities that are well documented and lived daily by Bohras.
Friend Humsafar, I know you have a soft spot for S. Insaf. And he has done stellar work for the progressives. But honestly, he is a bit credulous to say the least. He did not just mention this, leaving us to draw the conclusion. He seems to believe many things, some of them pretty strange. I think it is best to be critical of our own, so we don't make ourselves the laughing stock of our enemies. For example, Adam takes this to the extreme and then paints the whole movement as being conspiracy minded. We need to try and avoid this. Thats all.

alam
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#42

Unread post by alam » Tue May 05, 2015 12:18 am

Biradar, Humsafer, et al
This thread is simply another attempt to detract, divide and conquer - part of the same old krafty kasim kalimuddin mafia who inspires bad jack, crack jack, sad jack of the Najmuddin clan. And no, Humsafer, I don't put anything past Kothar to dream up body doubles - they certainly have the capacity and intellect to do so - you underestimate their capabilities. S. Insaf post here seems naïve and irrelevant here . Araz's theory is simply preposterous and brilliant at the same time, and serves to undermine the Reform movement by extreme conspiracy theories. Serves the Kothari agenda quite well.

dal-chaval-palidu
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#43

Unread post by dal-chaval-palidu » Tue May 05, 2015 1:03 am

true_bohra wrote:
Humsafar wrote:Biradar, Adam et al,
I suggest you guys get off your high horses. Agreed the body-double theory is far-fetched but not new, it's been floating around for quite some time, and for good reason. The fact though is that the mafia clergy for all its wiliness lacks the sophistication to or the imagination of pull such a thing off. Insaf Saheb is relating the story of the miya saheb verbatim, he is neither endorsing or denying it. He left it to the readers to draw their own conclusion. You can question the authenticity of the story if you want or take it with a pinch of salt. But don't accuse Insaf Saheb of going soft in the head or question the sanity of the movement. This movement is not sustained by fanciful rumours but by solid realities that are well documented and lived daily by Bohras.
What do you mean by saying that insaf is not endorsing it. Saifuddin Insaf known to bring a lot of proofs and documents and articles related to Bohra clergy, would be sharing a shaggy story about body doubles & miyasahebs. OMG

and since you say that this movement is not sustained on fanciful rumours then what is this. What solid realities you talking about. All we can see is cooked up stories, issues pertaining to money, abuse to the Dai and bragging about self claimed progressiveness. Saifuddin Insaf has been exposed in many of the forum topics. Go check it out for yourself
True Bohra,

Let me give you one concrete example to what you have asked (in bold above). Asghar Ali Engineer in his book "The Bohras" detailed the treatment of women from Udaipur in Galiyaot. It painted a bad/sad picture of the dawat and the Kothar; even Syedna. He put it down on paper,the book was published sometime in the 1980s, and Mr, Engineer was alive until sometime early in this decade. If there was anything inaccurate in it, I am pretty sure Mr. Engineer would have been sued. He was not, to the best of my knowledge. That makes me beleive that what is wrote about that incident is largely accurate.

That is an example of solid reality that bhai Humsafar may be alluding to. Some folks here can provide the appropriate link to the above mentioned incident.

true_bohra
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#44

Unread post by true_bohra » Tue May 05, 2015 2:40 am

dal-chaval-palidu wrote:
true_bohra wrote: What do you mean by saying that insaf is not endorsing it. Saifuddin Insaf known to bring a lot of proofs and documents and articles related to Bohra clergy, would be sharing a shaggy story about body doubles & miyasahebs. OMG

and since you say that this movement is not sustained on fanciful rumours then what is this. What solid realities you talking about. All we can see is cooked up stories, issues pertaining to money, abuse to the Dai and bragging about self claimed progressiveness. Saifuddin Insaf has been exposed in many of the forum topics. Go check it out for yourself
True Bohra,

Let me give you one concrete example to what you have asked (in bold above). Asghar Ali Engineer in his book "The Bohras" detailed the treatment of women from Udaipur in Galiyaot. It painted a bad/sad picture of the dawat and the Kothar; even Syedna. He put it down on paper,the book was published sometime in the 1980s, and Mr, Engineer was alive until sometime early in this decade. If there was anything inaccurate in it, I am pretty sure Mr. Engineer would have been sued. He was not, to the best of my knowledge. That makes me beleive that what is wrote about that incident is largely accurate.

That is an example of solid reality that bhai Humsafar may be alluding to. Some folks here can provide the appropriate link to the above mentioned incident.
Engineer and his book...do u seriously think that kothar would have given a damn about it...Forget book, he has given many open speeches against Our Dai, but kothar did not put any attention to it.

This does not mean that your versions of facts becomes true.

humanbeing
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#45

Unread post by humanbeing » Tue May 05, 2015 3:20 am

true_bohra wrote: Engineer and his book...do u seriously think that kothar would have given a damn about it...Forget book, he has given many open speeches against Our Dai, but kothar did not put any attention to it.

This does not mean that your versions of facts becomes true.
How about nathwani and Tawetia commission. Any how kothar follower would discredit that as well. Kothar puts their attention only where they know they can win by political clout and arm twisting. Furthermore, why would they finger an argument or debate on fair grounds, where they gonna loose miserably. Intellectually kotharies cannot debate or argue without undue influence and upper hand at their side. They can go all preachy only in safe confines of their sabaks, even in the safe confines of their sabaks, they get offended at slightest uncomfortable question.


Instead of confronting ali asgar engineer’s accusations, they instead executed a well planned strategy to discredit him by deceit, lies, maligning his argument and trivializing the important questions he raised. I remember in one of the sabak discussions, the orator was ridiculing the idea of accountability and forced a lame humor on the captive audience. Everyone could just grin, one could sense discomfort of the orator and the audience. However I raised an objection and asked very politely whats the harm in accountability and audit and gave some advantages,. These was during my young abde days ! I had no intention or a thought of accusing / doubting office bearers –aka- raza na sahebs of theft or embezzlement. But my question offended the orator and some old grumpy sheikhs, they gave me stern look of contempt. The whole scene was handle so well by the mili-bhagat of orator and sheikh mullahs of playing good cop/bad cop routine. Eventually orator questioned my intentions and turned around the question into an accusation. At that point I felt guilty, doing toba - toba back home. Ohh … my silly ole abde days !


There are plenty of such instances, where a commoner is under undue influences when interacting with jamat or kothar. These guys will never come out of their safe confines for a fair and legal debate or a simple discussion with honest intellect.

araz5253
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#46

Unread post by araz5253 » Tue May 05, 2015 6:49 am

According to a highly placed source Burhanuddin died long back and had not made any nass publicly which landed the shezadas in a dilemma and they knew that the mazoon would takeover hence this plot was designed to get the mazoon out of the community. The plan worked out brilliantly. Don't underestimated the kothar they have MIT ,Harvard and oxford grads in their payroll . I have personally heard this. The kothar often takes services of these think tanks to satiate their political appetite. The mazoon himself was not aware of this and he was severely restricted to meet the double.
The double himself was tortured and drugged to submission ,he himself knew little about what was happening and was extensively trained to read scripts and obey orders using various psychological treatments . The double was made to read scripts prepared by the higher ups. Even the nass ceremony at raudat was scripted and the double was given a script to read which he did manage to read . This was also exposed in one of the YouTube videos as to how dr Moiz put the script in front of the double to read it. What ever their plans they did leave some evidences that can expose this racket , stay tuned for further updates with evidences.

true_bohra
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#47

Unread post by true_bohra » Tue May 05, 2015 8:04 am

araz5253 wrote:According to a highly placed source Burhanuddin died long back and had not made any nass publicly which landed the shezadas in a dilemma and they knew that the mazoon would takeover hence this plot was designed to get the mazoon out of the community. The plan worked out brilliantly. Don't underestimated the kothar they have MIT ,Harvard and oxford grads in their payroll . I have personally heard this. The kothar often takes services of these think tanks to satiate their political appetite. The mazoon himself was not aware of this and he was severely restricted to meet the double.
The double himself was tortured and drugged to submission ,he himself knew little about what was happening and was extensively trained to read scripts and obey orders using various psychological treatments . The double was made to read scripts prepared by the higher ups. Even the nass ceremony at raudat was scripted and the double was given a script to read which he did manage to read . This was also exposed in one of the YouTube videos as to how dr Moiz put the script in front of the double to read it. What ever their plans they did leave some evidences that can expose this racket , stay tuned for further updates with evidences.
After reading this forgot about the orthodox bohras, even the reformists' reaction would be like this
Attachments
2008.10.21_facepalm.jpg

true_bohra
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#48

Unread post by true_bohra » Tue May 05, 2015 8:08 am

araz5253 wrote:According to a highly placed source Burhanuddin died long back and had not made any nass publicly which landed the shezadas in a dilemma and they knew that the mazoon would takeover hence this plot was designed to get the mazoon out of the community. The plan worked out brilliantly. Don't underestimated the kothar they have MIT ,Harvard and oxford grads in their payroll . I have personally heard this. The kothar often takes services of these think tanks to satiate their political appetite. The mazoon himself was not aware of this and he was severely restricted to meet the double.
The double himself was tortured and drugged to submission ,he himself knew little about what was happening and was extensively trained to read scripts and obey orders using various psychological treatments . The double was made to read scripts prepared by the higher ups. Even the nass ceremony at raudat was scripted and the double was given a script to read which he did manage to read . This was also exposed in one of the YouTube videos as to how dr Moiz put the script in front of the double to read it. What ever their plans they did leave some evidences that can expose this racket , stay tuned for further updates with evidences.
and since when is this body double been used for Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin RA...your so called highly placed source must have told you this also... :roll: :roll:

SBM
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#49

Unread post by SBM » Tue May 05, 2015 10:06 am

Oh Boy TB
You need additional proof
Read the thread "Inside Saify Mahal" and this was posted by some one from inside.

true_bohra
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#50

Unread post by true_bohra » Tue May 05, 2015 10:26 am

SBM wrote:Oh Boy TB
You need additional proof
Read the thread "Inside Saify Mahal" and this was posted by some one from inside.
Does this thread mentions body double theory also?? with a reply like this are you backing up the non sensible post of araz5253

SBM
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#51

Unread post by SBM » Tue May 05, 2015 11:26 am

true_bohra wrote:
SBM wrote:Oh Boy TB
You need additional proof
Read the thread "Inside Saify Mahal" and this was posted by some one from inside.
Does this thread mentions body double theory also?? with a reply like this are you backing up the non sensible post of araz5253
And neither Did Engineer talked about Body Double then why did you bring him in this conversation?

araz5253
Posts: 236
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#52

Unread post by araz5253 » Tue May 05, 2015 12:37 pm

true_bohra wrote:
araz5253 wrote:According to a highly placed source Burhanuddin died long back and had not made any nass publicly which landed the shezadas in a dilemma and they knew that the mazoon would takeover hence this plot was designed to get the mazoon out of the community. The plan worked out brilliantly. Don't underestimated the kothar they have MIT ,Harvard and oxford grads in their payroll . I have personally heard this. The kothar often takes services of these think tanks to satiate their political appetite. The mazoon himself was not aware of this and he was severely restricted to meet the double.
The double himself was tortured and drugged to submission ,he himself knew little about what was happening and was extensively trained to read scripts and obey orders using various psychological treatments . The double was made to read scripts prepared by the higher ups. Even the nass ceremony at raudat was scripted and the double was given a script to read which he did manage to read . This was also exposed in one of the YouTube videos as to how dr Moiz put the script in front of the double to read it. What ever their plans they did leave some evidences that can expose this racket , stay tuned for further updates with evidences.
and since when is this body double been used for Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin RA...your so called highly placed source must have told you this also... :roll: :roll:
Since atleast 20 years and that two atleast 2 doubles. MB himself approved the use of the double for convinieance purposes, later they were continued by the kothar.

alam
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#53

Unread post by alam » Tue May 05, 2015 4:02 pm

Araz5253 - you are here to make mischief and undermine legitimate concerns and complaints that bohras have of the clergy. I urge forum members to not let this body double theory go any furhrer than it already has. There is no credibility in this theory whatsoever.

I suggest Admin move this topic to Humor.. Where it belongs.

JC
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Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#54

Unread post by JC » Tue May 05, 2015 5:06 pm

The whole bohra community is humor!! the current state of affairs is the laughing stock to everybody. Just look at the way this so-called religious leader moves about and speaks ......... nothing further has to be said.

araz5253
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#55

Unread post by araz5253 » Tue May 05, 2015 11:38 pm

Dont worry I will soon post some pictures in this regard using forensic image enhancement tools which allow us to analyze images wrt age. There are tools which allow us to see an image after "n" years and also find body doubles who have different static features compared to the original. Use of body doubles is very common in mafia familes. Are you even aware that there are professional organizations who supply body doubles to the super rich.


read this
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_ ... ences.html

true_bohra
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#56

Unread post by true_bohra » Wed May 06, 2015 2:56 am

SBM wrote:
true_bohra wrote: Does this thread mentions body double theory also?? with a reply like this are you backing up the non sensible post of araz5253
And neither Did Engineer talked about Body Double then why did you bring him in this conversation?
I didn't bring engineer into all this...read my previous replies....I just replied to some one who raised the topic of engineer

SBM
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#57

Unread post by SBM » Wed May 06, 2015 10:11 am

Here is a youtube video of George Bush Look alike during White House Correspondent Dinner
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4N93jLVPIA

araz5253
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#58

Unread post by araz5253 » Thu May 07, 2015 2:44 am

SBM wrote:Here is a youtube video of George Bush Look alike during White House Correspondent Dinner
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4N93jLVPIA
nice

true_bohra
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Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#59

Unread post by true_bohra » Thu May 07, 2015 4:50 am

SBM wrote:Here is a youtube video of George Bush Look alike during White House Correspondent Dinner
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4N93jLVPIA
I know you have a very good R&D abilities but with posting this are you backing up the whole matter?

araz5253
Posts: 236
Joined: Fri Jan 23, 2015 1:18 pm

Re: Evidences for Body doubles of Burhanuddin

#60

Unread post by araz5253 » Thu May 07, 2015 7:04 am

true_bohra wrote:
SBM wrote:Here is a youtube video of George Bush Look alike during White House Correspondent Dinner
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4N93jLVPIA
I know you have a very good R&D abilities but with posting this are you backing up the whole matter?

Dont hide it , this is a common understanding since atleast 10 years I am hearing about this. And PDB forum is a clearing house. PDB was the first to break news that mazoon would claim daiship when nobody could even imagine it, almost all predictions coming from this forum came out to be true. So just be patient.