Australia - Forgotten Continent

The purpose of this Forum is to highlight and discuss issues pertaining to specific Jamats. Please use this space responsibly and report facts. We reserve the right to edit/delete posts that we find are irrelevant and based on gossip and hearsay.
qutbiranglaya
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun Feb 02, 2014 9:06 pm

Australia - Forgotten Continent

#1

Unread post by qutbiranglaya » Wed Feb 05, 2014 12:20 am

Report from Sydney, Australia
I do not know the facts but Sydney Siders can confirm or deny.

On Saturday 25 January Janab Amilsaheb ordered all to come to masjid at 10:30 in the morning. Only 30% of the Jamaat attended. A resolution was passed at the meeting to confirm and accept that Mufaddalbhaisaheb Saifuddin was the legitimate 53 Dai. Each one present had to put their names and sign against the name.

The same day at night after the magrib isha namaz and during dinner, all who did not attend the morning meeting were asked to get up, go in the masjid and sign against their name on separate sheets of paper. People were not told why they were signing; there was nothing on the paper except names and signatures.

Question remains?
Can one accept signatures of memebrs after the meeting was closed in the morning?
How can people sign without knowing what they are signing for?



DB- MUMBAIKAR
Posts: 52
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 5:20 am

#2

Unread post by DB- MUMBAIKAR » Wed Feb 05, 2014 2:41 am

qutbiranglaya wrote:Report from Sydney, Australia
I do not know the facts but Sydney Siders can confirm or deny.

On Saturday 25 January Janab Amilsaheb ordered all to come to masjid at 10:30 in the morning. Only 30% of the Jamaat attended. A resolution was passed at the meeting to confirm and accept that Mufaddalbhaisaheb Saifuddin was the legitimate 53 Dai. Each one present had to put their names and sign against the name.

The same day at night after the magrib isha namaz and during dinner, all who did not attend the morning meeting were asked to get up, go in the masjid and sign against their name on separate sheets of paper. People were not told why they were signing; there was nothing on the paper except names and signatures.

Question remains?
Can one accept signatures of memebrs after the meeting was closed in the morning?
How can people sign without knowing what they are signing for?
It is shocking that people living in Australia (assumingly they all are well educated and qualified enough to stay there) can do a dumb thing like signing on a blank paper with just their name and signatures... this only reflects how terribly scared and submissive are the common bohras by the kothaar and their cronies (Aamils)...the abde's are nothing but a bunch of slaves who live like slave and will die like slaves... shame on you...!!



qutbiranglaya
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun Feb 02, 2014 9:06 pm

#3

Unread post by qutbiranglaya » Wed Feb 05, 2014 7:17 am

I entirely agree with Mumbaikar. But allow me to explain how this vicious circle of obedience to Kothar and Moula has come about.

Sydney is full of Bohras of Indian and Pakistani origin with few Africans. Rich Indian and Pakistani send their children to study. These orthodox parents have brought up (brainwashed) their children to believe whatever bullshit kothar throws at them. Further brainwashing takes place at the madrasa.
These brainwashed children are then sent to Australia. These then get married to partners of similar beliefs.

On top of these, every year those orthodox parents from both sides come to Australia to visit their off springs and grand children. So any day the masjid is full of these people and what do you expect happens. You see them do sajda, stand with both hands like ‘Namaste’ and shout Moula, Moula.
Every opportunity they get they rush to do salaams to Amilsaheb.

It’s a vicious circle and very difficult to break. These days the madrassa kids are brainwashed to give karze hasana every now and then.



Ozdundee
Posts: 812
Joined: Wed May 29, 2013 6:57 am

#4

Unread post by Ozdundee » Wed Feb 05, 2014 7:39 am

Mash allah . Your courage to speak out is very refreshing . My complements to you and May Allah protect and strengthen your resolve and success. If you are worried or feel unsafe as a result of speaking out PM me.



JC
Posts: 1624
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2004 4:01 am

#5

Unread post by JC » Wed Feb 05, 2014 10:01 am

This 'slavery' is like addiction; nobody is even trying to get rid of this; nobody worries about cure ..... this slavery is giving them pleasure ........ the mentality is 'sadist' ..... they love to chant Maula Maula, cry for no reason and stand like a cheap slave in front of any Kothari goon .......... and they love this!! Nothing can be done. The only hope is new generation due to more and more exposure, knowledge and meeting people of other faith and beliefs. May be the generation of people in 20s will not drift away as much but for sure generation of 10s will move ...... Muffy has 20 some years to rule .............. lets hope for the best though.



bohra_manus
Posts: 162
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2009 7:37 pm

#6

Unread post by bohra_manus » Wed Feb 05, 2014 12:00 pm

JC wrote:This 'slavery' is like addiction; nobody is even trying to get rid of this; nobody worries about cure ..... this slavery is giving them pleasure ........ the mentality is 'sadist' ..... they love to chant Maula Maula, cry for no reason and stand like a cheap slave in front of any Kothari goon .......... and they love this!! Nothing can be done. The only hope is new generation due to more and more exposure, knowledge and meeting people of other faith and beliefs. May be the generation of people in 20s will not drift away as much but for sure generation of 10s will move ...... Muffy has 20 some years to rule .............. lets hope for the best though.
Sadly, I don't expect any changes soon even from the young generation as the youngsters are already being brain washed via Madressa and there is a huge pressure to send your kids (4 and up) to madressa where they are served healthy does of Maula and made to do projects on Maula. Heck, they are even encouraged to do araz for Wajebaat and some places the madressa children have been encouraged to do a Daris.



New
Posts: 440
Joined: Fri Jan 24, 2014 9:49 pm

#7

Unread post by New » Wed Feb 05, 2014 5:20 pm

JC bhai, you really put your finger. "Religion is opium of masses", Karl Marx. Very hard to get out of the system. This nasho has its withdrawl system. You are being fed and some one sets your routine. A caged bird has hard time surviving outside. I wonder who invented the Matam which appeals to your emotions by passing the brain.



alam
Posts: 712
Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2013 8:15 pm

#8

Unread post by alam » Wed Feb 05, 2014 5:22 pm

qutbiranglaya wrote:Report from Sydney, Australia
I do not know the facts but Sydney Siders can confirm or deny.

On Saturday 25 January Janab Amilsaheb ordered all to come to masjid at 10:30 in the morning. Only 30% of the Jamaat attended. A resolution was passed at the meeting to confirm and accept that Mufaddalbhaisaheb Saifuddin was the legitimate 53 Dai. Each one present had to put their names and sign against the name.

The same day at night after the magrib isha namaz and during dinner, all who did not attend the morning meeting were asked to get up, go in the masjid and sign against their name on separate sheets of paper. People were not told why they were signing; there was nothing on the paper except names and signatures.

Question remains?
Can one accept signatures of memebrs after the meeting was closed in the morning?
How can people sign without knowing what they are signing for?
I had posted this elsewhere a few days ago that might be relevant to you folks in Australia or any other location.


Re: Khuzema Qutbuddin (and related topics)
by alam on Wed Jan 29, 2014 3:56 am

To ALL OF you and especially For those of you afraid of signature campaign at your doorstep, or if they are in your face. Here are some options other than Just saying no ( and risk a backlash):
Step 1. Do a fake signature -such as Mickey Mouse, Narendra Modi, or simply sign SMS after your usual signature. Seriously, though, just sign completely different from the way you normally do. Or sign as yourself.
Step 2. Write a letter with the following text in it, date it, sign it with your real name and usual signature, make a copy of it, seal it and send to a trusted friend, a lawyer or yourself by postal mail. Or the police.

Here is the text : TO WHOM IT MAY CONCERN
I, (your name) signed a document on ( date), at (location), in the presence of (who asked you to sign) because I felt either forced or pressured to do so, or I feared extreme social harassment, boycott, humiliation and threat of excommunication, etc.. If I failed to sign this document or petition. I further declare that I do not have a copy of the petition, I did not get a chance to read it thoroughly, nor did I have the option to take my time to read it before i was asked to sign it. . To the best of my knowledge, this petition that I supposedly signed against my freewill basically had to do something About " I believe SMS to be the true and rightful successor and heir as the 53rd Dai'l Mutlaq, and that I would be further declaring that SKQ's claim to be the 53 rd Dai is fraudulent".
I am now declaring that I did not agree with the views set form in that petition.
Finally I declare that everything I am stating right now is true, and I am signing this declaration of my own free will.



If ANY of you have already signed a petition and are unhappy about it, you can always write up this declaration and take it to your local authorities.

If ever this goes to court or has any teeth to it, which most people doubt it would, this might turn out to discredit it.

You could write these up as your journal entries too as a written record of the day to day atrocities you observe or experience in your Jamaat.
Never know.



awaken
Posts: 11
Joined: Sat Jan 25, 2014 2:42 pm

#9

Unread post by awaken » Wed Feb 05, 2014 8:03 pm

It is not only Australia... same things happening in New Jersey.
children have to pay Vajebat
children have to do darees
children do Matam without any emotions and laughing to each other.
all jumat members are toothless,sold-out for their personal rewards and treats local Aamil like king,



JC
Posts: 1624
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2004 4:01 am

#10

Unread post by JC » Thu Feb 06, 2014 11:22 am

I know all this crap of Wajebat, Darees and Matam by kids ......... my hope is ........ as I see them 'laughing' and 'having fun' .......... once they are adults, due to exposure and knowledge and their interaction with other people they will eventually realize what Kothar has done to them (hope, hope!!) They will be under very limited social or emotional duress and will be easier for them to question, argue and leave .......... we can see some signs these days when boys on their 20s have started questioning and have even refused to attend recent vaeezes...

As I see it kids today take all this as FUN, they seem to ENJOY all this ....... only flip side is what if this becomes addiction and they would 'love' to do all this when they are adults.

Matam started as a sign of 'guilt', an expression of 'grief', acceptance of fact of 'betrayal' by people of Kufa and around (Iraqis) ........... this developed day by day as 'purjosh matam' ........... and Kotharis pick this up. They have turned this into something which will FETCH janat to them ............ this is an 'emotional blackmail' ....... when masses are 'charged' they can agree to do many a things and will do many a things which otherwise they may not. When 'chanting slogans' masses can march towards tanks too and we have seen that ............ this is same strategy!!



think
Posts: 1768
Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2011 10:15 am

#11

Unread post by think » Thu Feb 06, 2014 11:51 am

n.j. is the pot hole of solomn. He is the one to blame. The jamaat zombies he created are now finding out that the young generation has had enough of this brainwashing and abde/amte attitude. they also have self respect and cannot be pushed around by these two penny jamaat goondas.



Ozdundee
Posts: 812
Joined: Wed May 29, 2013 6:57 am

#12

Unread post by Ozdundee » Fri Feb 07, 2014 5:53 pm

I received this and have removed a few statements as the matter is in court

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: J Ali <xxx@yahoo.com.au>
Date: Saturday, February 8, 2014
Subject: Sayedna Qutbuddin vs Sayedna Mufadal a private decision
To: xxx@hotmail.com, shk_xxx@yahoo.com.au, xxxx@gmail.com


Salams Brothers

You are aware Mumineen are choosing their destiny of who their Diai-ul-Mutlaq is . The Australian laws guarantees freedom of choice, expression and association in public and private property.

I will put on notice the Amils, Secretary and Ayan of official communication to be mindful of not acting , relating instructions from overseas without considerations of local laws. I also suggest you seek legal advise from Xxxxxxxx . All communications and public gathering will be recorded and monitored .

As in India we caution you not to intimidate or threaten excommunication to any Australian resident or citizen who does need more time to decide their destiny, and allow them the personal freedom to make a private decision of who their spiritual leader is.

Do not attempt to deny or threaten to deny them access to the
masjid or markuz while the matter is not finalised in India. These facilities belong to the Diai and at present both Qutbuddin and Mufaddal claim the position of Diai, hence the followers of both have full access to it until advised further by the courts or appropriate arbitrators

Contents of the misaq are up for review as office of the mentioned Diai, Mazoon Mukasir are up for resolution, children of misaq below age of 18 are not to be influenced without their guardians consent in Madarassa, interim loyalty is to be explicitly voluntary and not under peer pressure. Please cease all further taking of public signatures .

If you continue these breaches of law or Australian values such matters will be reported to appropriate law enforcement authorities in various states and territories. I advise both Sydney and Melbourne jamaats to be on notice, please advise Mumbai regarding my notice.

InShallah you will heed this caution
and we do not do any more harm to the community reputation beyond the. Xxx case or seek external intervention. masalam.



Ozdundee
Posts: 812
Joined: Wed May 29, 2013 6:57 am

#13

Unread post by Ozdundee » Thu Mar 06, 2014 7:18 am

This letter is doing the rounds
On Wednesday, 5 March 2014 11:01 PM, J Ali <sxxxxxxl@yahoo.com.au> wrote:
Members of the Dawoodi Bohra Community
245 - Canterbury Road, Blackburn VIC 3130
2 Argyle St, Auburn, NSW 2144


After the sad passing away of the 52nd Diai Mutlaq Sayedna Mohammed Burhanudin (SMB) , we have been faced with a choice between Sayedna Mufadal Saifudin (SMS) and Sayedna Khuzema Qutbudin (SKQ), who have both claimed to be the next supreme leaders of our community, the 53rd Diai of the Dawoodi Bohra Community. We have all seen and heard the over the top claims by proponents justifying who is the legitimate heir of SMB, and who is not, that is the Mazoon ( his former deputy) or Mansoos ( his son).

Currently SMS has monopoly and control over the community facilities including the Murkuz centre in Melbourne and Masjid (Mosque) in Sydney, he has control over appointments of Amils (expatriate priests) and committees managing the affairs, thereby, SMS has obtained more airtime to push his case to campaign his legitimacy as the heir. We have also witnessed the Walimullas (secretaries) without pre-warning or time to reconsider obtained signatures of community members thereby claiming majority support for SMS, Misaq (oath of allegiance) was taken by the Amils under the condition of registering community identity cards, thus consequence of not taking the oath, would lead to denial of community services, and in India the media on several occasions (http://www.mumbaimirror.com/mumbai/othe ... 661224.cms)
has reported the brother of SMS, Shazada (Prince) rallying loyalists to denounce those who support SKQ and threats to classify opponents of SMS as non-Bohra, history is evident that this means excommunication for those who disagree with the establishment.

Obviously this makes plenty of community members scared to openly show support for SKQ and hence silenced. It is important in a democratic society, as in Australia, Australians of Dawoodi Bohra decent or affiliation are able to discuss the issues and make their own minds of their religious beliefs without threats or persecution.

On the other hand SKQ has operated in almost lock down and relied on internet to broadcast and propagate his case. Both SMS and SKQ have the equal right to claim to be the Diai. That means at present the position of Diai Mutlaq is not fully resolved, as the two claimants are out in public challenging one another. As the community facilities belong to the position of Diai Mutlaq, and while the legal owner of community facilities and services remains unresolved , I urge the SMS loyalists to not hinder or block access to members of the community discussing the validity of the SKQ claim, and also provide members who may have formed a temporary loyalty to SKQ while the matter remain to be resolved, access to community facilities regardless to their spiritual and ideological loyalty and alignment.

Gradually people are aligning, as myself to SKQ as many have reviewed his character and capability while he held the position of the Mazoon (deputy) of SMB , his principles, character , vision and hope of improving the Dawoodi Bohra community. I and many others regard SKQ is a better leader to take the community forward in the 21st century. SKQ is currently considered open, approachable, and competent with modern Islamic views for addressing some of the issues facing the community that at present is in contrast to socially acceptable attributes of a modern Islamic community. Many like myself , hope that SKQ to be a better leader to assist gradually abolishing practises that are considered a crime like the practise of Female Genital Mutilation, delaying until adulthood ideological indoctrination of children between the age of 12-14 where they pledge in public an oath of subjugation and loyalty (misaq), eliminating corruption and money laundering by collecting taxes (wajebat, najwa, hoob and random levies) and exporting community funds overseas or without accounting for it at local member level, that is to mention only few of the critical issues tainting the image of the Dawoodi Bohra Community in broader society.

There are others who view SMS approach of conservatism and orthodoxy as their leader and that is a valid democratic choice too, since we all live in a multicultural multi-religious Australia and we are duty bound to be respectful and tolerant for each other’s vision of the community and aligning with a specific type of religious leadership, however this privilege needs to be equal for all sides.

Hence as we go through the leadership transition, while not rule out potential sectarian split based on ideological differences or where people change their loyalty over time, with more information and strategic decisions are made to resolve the leadership dispute formally at a global level, I urge all sensible community leaders and members of Dawoodi Bohra Community to live peacefully and respect one another’s rights and freedom provided under the Australian constitution and values. I also urge that both sides provide immunity from persecution at local and overseas level where our extended families reside when we make a spiritual choice that is in disagreement with the leaderships desires.

My plea for calm and diplomacy should not be regarded as inferiority complex, being timid or desperation of a minority view of those supporting SKQ, but also a caution that I and others are willing to escalate the situation and seek external law enforcement, judicial and media intervention if our basic human rights, freedom of religion and association are denied or abused by fundamentalists and extremists in the community. Like wise we the supporters of SKQ commit to be tolerant , civil and working within local laws in our approach in determining our leadership choice. Therefore with basic freedoms guaranteed by both side, I expect more community members to come out publicly to support SKQ and we can discuss the choices of leadership and express the loyalty towards the 53rd Diai, in more fair and objective process.

Your sincerely and respectfully
Bohra Community Member
Email: sxxxxxl@yahoo.com.au

Cc
OFFICIALS CONTACTED NAMES DELETED INTENTIONALLY




alam
Posts: 712
Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2013 8:15 pm

#14

Unread post by alam » Thu Mar 06, 2014 12:52 pm

This is a model for other jurisdictions. Thanks ozdundeebhai for sharing.



qutbiranglaya
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun Feb 02, 2014 9:06 pm

#15

Unread post by qutbiranglaya » Sun Mar 09, 2014 8:09 am

It looks like Australia is ready and willing. SQK where are you? Ozdundee any underground movement ready to strike? We are all ears.



way2go
Posts: 181
Joined: Thu Feb 06, 2014 10:30 pm

#16

Unread post by way2go » Sun Mar 09, 2014 3:02 pm

Ozdundee wrote:This letter is doing the rounds
On Wednesday, 5 March 2014 11:01 PM, J Ali <sxxxxxxl@yahoo.com.au> wrote:
Members of the Dawoodi Bohra Community
245 - Canterbury Road, Blackburn VIC 3130
2 Argyle St, Auburn, NSW 2144


After the sad passing away of the 52nd Diai Mutlaq Sayedna Mohammed Burhanudin (SMB) , we have been faced with a choice between Sayedna Mufadal Saifudin (SMS) and Sayedna Khuzema Qutbudin (SKQ), who have both claimed to be the next supreme leaders of our community, the 53rd Diai of the Dawoodi Bohra Community. We have all seen and heard the over the top claims by proponents justifying who is the legitimate heir of SMB, and who is not, that is the Mazoon ( his former deputy) or Mansoos ( his son).

Currently SMS has monopoly and control over the community facilities including the Murkuz centre in Melbourne and Masjid (Mosque) in Sydney, he has control over appointments of Amils (expatriate priests) and committees managing the affairs, thereby, SMS has obtained more airtime to push his case to campaign his legitimacy as the heir. We have also witnessed the Walimullas (secretaries) without pre-warning or time to reconsider obtained signatures of community members thereby claiming majority support for SMS, Misaq (oath of allegiance) was taken by the Amils under the condition of registering community identity cards, thus consequence of not taking the oath, would lead to denial of community services, and in India the media on several occasions (http://www.mumbaimirror.com/mumbai/othe ... 661224.cms)
has reported the brother of SMS, Shazada (Prince) rallying loyalists to denounce those who support SKQ and threats to classify opponents of SMS as non-Bohra, history is evident that this means excommunication for those who disagree with the establishment.

Obviously this makes plenty of community members scared to openly show support for SKQ and hence silenced. It is important in a democratic society, as in Australia, Australians of Dawoodi Bohra decent or affiliation are able to discuss the issues and make their own minds of their religious beliefs without threats or persecution.

On the other hand SKQ has operated in almost lock down and relied on internet to broadcast and propagate his case. Both SMS and SKQ have the equal right to claim to be the Diai. That means at present the position of Diai Mutlaq is not fully resolved, as the two claimants are out in public challenging one another. As the community facilities belong to the position of Diai Mutlaq, and while the legal owner of community facilities and services remains unresolved , I urge the SMS loyalists to not hinder or block access to members of the community discussing the validity of the SKQ claim, and also provide members who may have formed a temporary loyalty to SKQ while the matter remain to be resolved, access to community facilities regardless to their spiritual and ideological loyalty and alignment.

Gradually people are aligning, as myself to SKQ as many have reviewed his character and capability while he held the position of the Mazoon (deputy) of SMB , his principles, character , vision and hope of improving the Dawoodi Bohra community. I and many others regard SKQ is a better leader to take the community forward in the 21st century. SKQ is currently considered open, approachable, and competent with modern Islamic views for addressing some of the issues facing the community that at present is in contrast to socially acceptable attributes of a modern Islamic community. Many like myself , hope that SKQ to be a better leader to assist gradually abolishing practises that are considered a crime like the practise of Female Genital Mutilation, delaying until adulthood ideological indoctrination of children between the age of 12-14 where they pledge in public an oath of subjugation and loyalty (misaq), eliminating corruption and money laundering by collecting taxes (wajebat, najwa, hoob and random levies) and exporting community funds overseas or without accounting for it at local member level, that is to mention only few of the critical issues tainting the image of the Dawoodi Bohra Community in broader society.

There are others who view SMS approach of conservatism and orthodoxy as their leader and that is a valid democratic choice too, since we all live in a multicultural multi-religious Australia and we are duty bound to be respectful and tolerant for each other’s vision of the community and aligning with a specific type of religious leadership, however this privilege needs to be equal for all sides.

Hence as we go through the leadership transition, while not rule out potential sectarian split based on ideological differences or where people change their loyalty over time, with more information and strategic decisions are made to resolve the leadership dispute formally at a global level, I urge all sensible community leaders and members of Dawoodi Bohra Community to live peacefully and respect one another’s rights and freedom provided under the Australian constitution and values. I also urge that both sides provide immunity from persecution at local and overseas level where our extended families reside when we make a spiritual choice that is in disagreement with the leaderships desires.

My plea for calm and diplomacy should not be regarded as inferiority complex, being timid or desperation of a minority view of those supporting SKQ, but also a caution that I and others are willing to escalate the situation and seek external law enforcement, judicial and media intervention if our basic human rights, freedom of religion and association are denied or abused by fundamentalists and extremists in the community. Like wise we the supporters of SKQ commit to be tolerant , civil and working within local laws in our approach in determining our leadership choice. Therefore with basic freedoms guaranteed by both side, I expect more community members to come out publicly to support SKQ and we can discuss the choices of leadership and express the loyalty towards the 53rd Diai, in more fair and objective process.

Your sincerely and respectfully
Bohra Community Member
Email: sxxxxxl@yahoo.com.au

Cc
OFFICIALS CONTACTED NAMES DELETED INTENTIONALLY

Thank you for sharing this.



qutbiranglaya
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun Feb 02, 2014 9:06 pm

#17

Unread post by qutbiranglaya » Mon Mar 10, 2014 3:53 am

way2gobhai why did you quote what Ozdundee has already published. Looks like you are not reading all the posts. my whole idea to Ozdunde was to say "one swallow does not make a summer" is there a movement in Australia for SQK?



Ozdundee
Posts: 812
Joined: Wed May 29, 2013 6:57 am

#18

Unread post by Ozdundee » Mon Mar 10, 2014 6:08 am

Yes there are growing pockets of supporters , the situation is not conducive yet for public movement...I know there have been discussions with fatemi dawat officials how to create an functional jamaat in Australia, when how and where is not finalized ,

can I count on you as an active volunteer who is ready to assist with time, money or energy ? if you are serious about walking the talk send a message via the fatemi dawaat website contact page and let them know what your interest is



james
Posts: 550
Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:06 am

#19

Unread post by james » Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:36 pm

Ozdundee wrote:
can I count on you as an active volunteer who is ready to assist with time, money or energy ?

Oh dear.



Bohra spring
Posts: 1242
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2012 8:37 am

#20

Unread post by Bohra spring » Tue Mar 11, 2014 1:22 am

james wrote:
Ozdundee wrote:
can I count on you as an active volunteer who is ready to assist with time, money or energy ?

Oh dear.
Why, does SMS operations run without money?

What hypocritical , abdes pay sabeel, najwa to SMS who cashes up. But behind the backs say SKQ . Put skin in the game if there is need for success.

So voluntary contributions is ok for SMS but suggesting for SKQ is raising your concern.



fulan ibn fulan
Posts: 51
Joined: Sun Feb 09, 2014 8:39 pm

#21

Unread post by fulan ibn fulan » Tue Mar 11, 2014 8:55 am

JC you're wrong about maatam being something done out of guilt. It is a part of grieving and it is even in the quran that beating youself on the chest has been ordained onto us by Allah. If it was for the people because they felt they betrayed Imam Hussain and the Ahlul Bait, why did Imam Hussain do maatam on every Shaheed when he brought them into the khaimo? It wasn't out of guilt, he cried and did maatam because he was upset and it is how we grieve. The only thing I do question is that if it is for grieving why are we not allowed to do it for people in our houses when they die.
That ideology of betrayal and guilt is a sunni idea not one shared by Shias of any kind, Bohra's twelvers, ishmailis, anyone.



ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

#22

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Tue Mar 11, 2014 5:47 pm

fulan ibn fulan wrote:It is a part of grieving and it is even in the quran that beating youself on the chest has been ordained onto us by Allah.
fulan ibn fulan wrote:why did Imam Hussain do maatam on every Shaheed when he brought them into the khaimo?
I thought you were more rational and logical as compared to other abdes but by your above statements you have proved then you are one of them ! Please provide authentic sources to prove your above contentions.



Sequence
Posts: 121
Joined: Tue Mar 04, 2014 8:49 am

#23

Unread post by Sequence » Tue Mar 11, 2014 10:11 pm

Ozdundee wrote:Yes there are growing pockets of supporters , the situation is not conducive yet for public movement...I know there have been discussions with fatemi dawat officials how to create an functional jamaat in Australia, when how and where is not finalized ,

can I count on you as an active volunteer who is ready to assist with time, money or energy ? if you are serious about walking the talk send a message via the fatemi dawaat website contact page and let them know what your interest is
I would have taken part in this, but as I am migrating to west probably canada in near future, I will do some thing from there.Inshallah Ameen



james
Posts: 550
Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:06 am

#24

Unread post by james » Wed Mar 12, 2014 1:10 am

Bohra spring wrote:
james wrote:
Oh dear.
Why, does SMS operations run without money?

What hypocritical , abdes pay sabeel, najwa to SMS who cashes up. But behind the backs say SKQ . Put skin in the game if there is need for success.

So voluntary contributions is ok for SMS but suggesting for SKQ is raising your concern.
In other words , money is important to run the affairs of Dawat .Good to see you finally talking some sense. :wink:



Sequence
Posts: 121
Joined: Tue Mar 04, 2014 8:49 am

#25

Unread post by Sequence » Wed Mar 12, 2014 1:46 am

offcourse money is important to run dawat affairs, but problem arises when money collected is used for private luxury and frequent flying in business classes, hunting trips for africa, luxury vilas and appartments, while poor momeenin are deprived of basic needs.

I hope finally this will make sense to you. :wink: :wink:

but I have doubts, that any logical thing will ever make sense to you :idea:



qutbiranglaya
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun Feb 02, 2014 9:06 pm

#26

Unread post by qutbiranglaya » Wed Mar 12, 2014 11:01 pm

My intentions are to increase awareness, get mumineen to ask questions and extract answers from the jamaat committee members. These members are the representatives of local mumineen. I report on what is going on in the jamaat via my man/woman in the know. Ozdundeebhai I like your posts but at this stage I am not in a position to support any faction of our dawaat be it SMS or SKQ. So far none of them care for the awam. All I say Jago mumineen Jago. I am expecting a detailed report from Sydney and hope I get it soon.



Ozdundee
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#27

Unread post by Ozdundee » Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:42 am

James and company this is not the topic you should be playing around..go somewhere else.



Ozdundee
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#28

Unread post by Ozdundee » Wed Apr 09, 2014 7:42 am

Bhai Qutbiranglaya can you please help confirm if the Sydney jamaat has again got into trouble with an issue with a local government where a letter has been received as a notice to comply with certain rules and probably penalty has been issued. Not to confuse the issues but the new issue is not related to FGM but something that has happened in the Masjid or neighborhood.

My source mentioned something but seems she cannot pass on information clearly,



qutbiranglaya
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#29

Unread post by qutbiranglaya » Tue Apr 29, 2014 9:08 pm

Ozdunde bhai, I have had no luck so far. My contact says they have closed the circle and info is becoming difficult to come by. However holy months are on us and may be as abdes attend the masjid info may gradually flow out. Will keep all informed.



Ozdundee
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Joined: Wed May 29, 2013 6:57 am

#30

Unread post by Ozdundee » Fri May 09, 2014 7:09 am

I have reports that a neighbor reported to the local city council something that has been erected in the masjid compound that was causing noise or pollution. The city council investigations found it was illegally setup and have sent a notice that it was unauthorized and to remove and comply with regulations. I am trying to find out from my mole more details but she is no longer a jamaat member and is no longer a regular visitor.

Is it not a pity that after FGM case this foolish jamaat committee members keeps on playing with the law.