Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

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garibmumin
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#91

Unread post by garibmumin » Sat Jul 19, 2014 9:51 pm

bro MF youre correct, I said Ali coz they take the name of Ali more than Prophet pbuh, I have come across many who dont even know much about Prophet pbuh nor they even take his name. so even if they really follow Ali they would be following the prophet pbuh himself. But they are not really following Ali.

JavedhJuma
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#92

Unread post by JavedhJuma » Sun Jul 20, 2014 8:17 pm

Muslim First wrote:
javedhjamadar
Quote the hadith and qur'an. If you don't, you are a liar. And don't change the subject. You think you know Islam. You make me laugh.
Why are you worried about Islam? Yes, you are right I am worried about Islam because Islam has some Jahils amongst it and I am worried, because the way your people are killing each other without following Islam, and justifying your shirks about judging people and taking their lives, dignity, etc. in this Holy month of Ramadhan especially, and all the year round, is not Islam. This ismaking me feel that my children will have to pay for it later on life because they are Muslims. All because of you Jahils, Islam is spat upon.
You know who is Muslim according to Prophet SAW? You just pick and choose, huh? And keep repeating it like a rabid DOG chasing its tail.
Here is a Hadith From Bukhari
Book of Salat
Hadith no: 386
Narrated / Authority of: Anas bin Malik
Allah's Apostle said, "Whoever prays like us and faces our Qibla and eats our slaughtered animals is a Muslim and is under Allah's and His Apostle's protection. So do not betray Allah by betraying those who are in His protection." Seriously??? Jahil? When was the last time you had your brain checked? We have been through this many many times.

You and your philandering Imam and all Murids You know Jahil, Muslims, your kind of whom I know many, they always make fun of Prophet SAW, and say, if they were allowed in the west to have four wives, they would easily do so, afterall the Prophet SAW had multiple wives. They drink, do not pray, etc. but they are educated people and respect all people. To me they are million times better than you and your sidekick.

People have written books on Prophet SAW and have called him a Pedophile and a womaniser. They said he authorised four wives for others but he had 3 times more. Now go do the math. Now if these Jahis call Prophet SAW names does that make him so. So a Jahil who calls my Imam names DOES NOT MAKE HIM SO. Looks like your hellhole is getting hotter.

Before I forget, the picture you posted of my Imam with a woman on a sailboat, was doctored. You can see from her right shoulder and neck. This is what you fitnatis do in this Holy month of Ramadan, and call yourselves Muslims? Only Allah SWT is the Judge. I think U Tube has taken it off after it was proved to be doctored. Some lawyers and govt. officials got involved. I was one of them.

Do not pray salat 5 times/ day, nor face Qibla and many eat Pork and Haraam meat.
So according to Prophet you, your Imam and whole cult are non Muslim.
Now get lost.

Sorry Jahil, I am here to stay. So bear with me or get lost. About prayers, etc. we have dealt with it already but if you have 0 IQ, is that my fault. Blame Allah SWT, He created you a Jahil and a rabid dog chasing its tail. And if you claim our people eat pork, then they are no better than you, i.e. jahils.. I swear upon Qur'an , I saw your people eat pork in Middle East like there was never an end to it. And you know how they justified it, that they cannot afford other meats and pork was the cheapest on the market.

Btw did you get Seventeen Zaantas on your so called lail-a-kadr nightit is not Zaantas, it is chantas. And it is Layla tul Qadr. Now, go and teach those kids something. Even though you saw chantas spelled correct, by the time you wrote it down it was mis-spelled like all your crap on this forum. Go figure! LOL!

Here is post from your fellow religionist

From Ismaili.net
Thread lail latul kadr dated 7/19/14
http://www.ismaili.net/html/modules.php ... 5&start=15
agakhani wrote:Ismailis in Amercia and Canada are celebration Laitul Qadra to night, while this night is very important in many ways but many jamati members thinks that this night is just for dasond* only but that is not true besides dasonds we can also take 16 different chhantas tonight, the list of these chhanta are as below, so, please recall these chhanta in your mind before you go for Chhanta.


1, Seeking forgiveness for failing to repent.
Tauba no chhanta

2, Seeking forgiveness for errors in Dasond
Dasond ni Bhul chuk no chhanto.

3, Seeking forgiveness for irregularity in performing daily 3 times prayers.
Tran vakht ni dua no bhul chuk no chanto

4, Seeking forgiveness fo our sins
Guna ni Bakshamani no chhanto

5, Seeking forgiveness for secret sins
Gupt guna no chhanto

6, Seeking forgiveness for sins from past four yugs ( lives )
char Jug no chhanto

7, Seeking forgiveness for promise made prior to birth.
Girbhavas no chhanto

8, Seeking forgiveness for having deviated from the straight path.
Pul Sirat no chhanto

9, Seeking forgiveness for acts which prevent us from experiencing noor
Roshnai no chhanot

10,Seeking mercy from the pain of exiting from the body
Ghor Bhid no chhanto

11,Seeking mercy at the time of accountability
Kabar na puchhana no chhanto

12, Seeking mercy during the journey leading to the first destination
Paheli Manzil no chhanto

13, Seeking mercy during the journey leading to the second destination.
Biji Manzil no chhanto

14, Seeking mercy in passing through 19 checkpoints
Ognis tol no chhanto

15, Seeking mercy in passing through 52 narrow passages
Bavan Ghati no chhanto

16, Chhadidar no chhanto ( specialy for Mukhi?Kamadia Saheban)

17, Mahadan no chhanto ( day of judgment )

-It is also true that if you do Bandgi/Ibadat tonight you will receive 1000 nights benefits.[
- AS per Rai Abu Ali. recite Allah's 99 names 101 times if possible and if it not possible then recites at least 3 times Allah's names tonight, you will receive a big swab for reciting 99 names.


* One important clarification about Dasond:-

Many peoples think that "dasond no chhanto" is for they missed dasond from their income , but actually this chhanta is for errors we made in putting correct dasong, not all the dasond. Dasond is obligatory in our sect.
This is no Islam


Who are you to speak about Islam? You do not qualify as a Muslim but like Abu Jahal, you are a Jahil. You know nothin about Islam and neither does your side kick. You only qualify for the Azhab of Sura 104.If you knew True Islam, you would not be so coniving, liar, and gutter mouth. Show me one asahaba, who was a gutter mouth like you.

I really get pleasure out of kicking you where it hurts most. I am sure you can't survive without it and will come back for more. I am ready and waiting.

garibmumin
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#93

Unread post by garibmumin » Sun Jul 20, 2014 9:47 pm

JJ,
Seriously you are bringing Ismailism\Khoja a very bad name , I knew Ismaili khoja although Kafirs were atleast good people like parsi bawas. You prove otherwise. Hey you are not even following your Imam who says "Be nice to everybody" which makes you even a hypocrite. Three traits Kufr+bad person+hypocrite, can you get any worse?

silvertongue
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#94

Unread post by silvertongue » Mon Jul 21, 2014 1:05 am

bro MF youre correct, I said Ali coz they take the name of Ali more than Prophet pbuh, I have come across many who dont even know much about Prophet pbuh nor they even take his name. so even if they really follow Ali they would be following the prophet pbuh himself. But they are not really following Ali.
We take the name of Ali a.s. coz the Prophet himself used to Zikr him countless times. In every stage of his life and spreading Islam Ali a.s was the foremost in actions and his dedication to Islam and to the service of Allah is known to all. Prophet showed the world that after him who was the best deserving person to lead the muslims. For your better understanding here are some sayings of Prophet himself about Ali a.s open up your crazy brain why we love Ali a.s so much coz the prophet himself loved him. We love Ali a.s. alot coz we obey Prophet Mohammed a.s. more than any of you Tom Dicks and Harrys.. You just pretend to obey him.. While we actually DO..

Sayings:
I am the master of the first and the last, and you, O Ali, are the master of the creations after me. I am just like you and you are just like me.

The Messenger of Allah told Ali bin Abi Taleb :
O Ali! I am the Warner of my nation; you are their guide;

The Messenger of Allah said:
When Allah created the heavens and the earth, He called on them and they responded. He presented my Prophethood and the WILAYAT (unconditional, unlimited uauthority) of Ali bin Abi Taleb to them, both of which they accepted. Then Allah created the creatures and entrusted the religious affairs to us. Therefore, the happy ones are those who are happy with us, and the unhappy are those who are unhappy with us. We permit that which Allah has made HALAAL (lawful) and prohibit that which Allah has deemed HARAAM (unlawful).

The Messenger of Allah told me:
O Ali, you are the Commander of the Believers and the Imam of the pious. O Ali, you are the master of all of the successors of the prophets.
You inherit all of the prophets’ knowledge and you are the best of SEDDIQIN (the truthful ones) and the best of those who believed in Allah first.
O Ali, you are the husband of the woman who is the Master of All of the Worlds’ Women, and you are the successor of the best of the prophets.
O Ali, you are the Master of the Believers.
O Ali, you are the evidence that proves Allah’s existence after me on all people. Those who follow you will earn Paradise, and those who are against you deserve Hell.
O Ali, I swear to Allah, who sent me as a Prophet and who chose me from among all of His creatures, if any slave worships Allah for a thousand years, Allah will not accept it unless he believes in your Wilayat and the Wilayat of your sons.

garibmumin
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#95

Unread post by garibmumin » Mon Jul 21, 2014 2:08 am

ST,
No You dont thats a reality which all shia sects themselves should accept. Regarding the hadith you quoted than it is fabricated \ No reliable sources and contradicts with the positions taken by ALI AS after prophet pbuh, No wonder you are so desperate to even concot and fabricate to this extent. But remember the place reserved for people who utter lies. Better be silent than spreading rumors\lies.

silvertongue
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#96

Unread post by silvertongue » Mon Jul 21, 2014 2:27 am

I dont need to prove to you about Ali a.s. even non muslims know better than you do.. I shall leave you with your thoughts then. NOthing to say more..

garibmumin
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#97

Unread post by garibmumin » Mon Jul 21, 2014 4:27 am

Non Muslims also have written tomes of work trying to refute the final prophet pbuh. Infact widely acknowledged Dante's Inferno (Italian for "Hell") is the 14th-century epic poem depicts Ali to be in hell. Will you believe in this too?

silvertongue
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#98

Unread post by silvertongue » Mon Jul 21, 2014 4:35 am

There is good and evil in this world and Allah has given us brains to realize it. Unfortunately only a few use it. Whoever knows Mohammed a.s. and Ali a.s. knows what theyr dealing with. If there is Dante who writes about degrading then there are those as well who writes in favor. Why choose the negative side? Even if I would give you hundreds of Hadiths about Ali from sunni books and his merits, still you or any one wont believe it, jus coz Shias love him. Its the hatred nothing else.

garibmumin
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#99

Unread post by garibmumin » Mon Jul 21, 2014 4:45 am

Bro everybody believes in ALI as , those who believe the falsehood spread by some miniscule groups which is less then 20% of Muslims then in reality they have disbelieved in Ali.

And what you see in these groups like our bohras , do you think even the top daee follows him? No even the Isna asharis dont

Also Sunni books are clear with authentic hadith without denying the fazail of Ali they clear that fazail of Abu bakr is more than Ali and he is the first amirul mumineen , Ali being the fourth. Only the ignorants continue to deny this fact which even Ali practically demonstrated.

silvertongue
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#100

Unread post by silvertongue » Mon Jul 21, 2014 5:08 am

Tell me one greater Fadhail of Abu Bakr L.A. than Ali a.s.

silvertongue
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#101

Unread post by silvertongue » Mon Jul 21, 2014 5:15 am

Comparing the Lion of God, Farzand E Kaaba, Ba'ab ul Ilm, Imam E Muttaqeen, Sirat E Mustaqeem, Siddiqul Akbar, Mazharul Ajaib etcc.c...... to a 60 yr old man is not wise in my opinion..

garibmumin
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#102

Unread post by garibmumin » Mon Jul 21, 2014 7:16 am

See your hatred has come up!

Did Ali himself ever curse the companions? Never he loved them all.

The renegades who left Imam Ali and Imam Jafar sadik were the ones who rejected Abu Bakr only because of blind exaggeration and hatred, Jafar Sadik instead rejected them. The scum we see today is more than apparent in Shia sects . You will only see the false eulogizing and extremism in majlises where even Shirk is commonplace.

Just quoting a few authentic hadiths:
The Companions were well aware of who were the first few Companions in closeness to the Prophet (sas) and the Rightly-Guided Khalifas were chosen on that basis. From Sahih Al-Bukhari, Ibn Umar reports: We used to discuss the best of the people during the time of the Prophet (sas) and we saw the best as Abu Bakr, then Umar, then Uthman ibn Affaan, may Allah be pleased with them all.

Ali ibn Abi Talib (ra) was also very much aware of this and bore witness to it as we see in this narration from his son which is found in Sahih Al-Bukhari also: I said to my father: Who is the best of the people after Allah's Messenger (sas)? He said: "Abu Bakr". I said: And then who? He said: And then Umar ibn Al-Khattab. I was afraid that he would say Uthman next, so I said: And then you? To which he answered: I am nothing but a man among the Muslims."

Also, from Sahih Al-Bukhari: Once, there was a problem between Abu Bakr and Umar. Eventually, Umar came to the Prophet (sas) and said: O Allah's Messenger, I was wrong. He repeated it twice. Then, the Prophet (sas) said: "Allah sent me to you and you said: 'You lie.' but Abu Bakr said: 'He speaks the truth.' And he supported me with his life and his property so could you please leave for me my companion?" He said it twice. Abu Bakr was never mistreated after that.

Abu Bakr was the quickest of the Companions to rush to any good deed. From Abu Daud (with an authenticity of "hassan"): Umar ibn Al-Khattab said: The Prophet (sas) ordered us to give sadaqa. It happened to coincide with some wealth I had just acquired and I said to myself: If I will every surpass Abu Bakr, this is the day I will surpass him. And so I cam to the Prophet (sas) with half of my wealth and he (sas) said to me: "What have you left for your family?" I said: The same amount. Then Abu Bakr came with all of his wealth. The Prophet (sas) said to him: "What have you left for your family?" He said: I have left them Allah and His Messenger." I said: I will never surpass you in anything."

silvertongue
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#103

Unread post by silvertongue » Wed Jul 23, 2014 1:34 am

Ali ibn Abi Talib (ra) was also very much aware of this and bore witness to it as we see in this narration from his son which is found in Sahih Al-Bukhari also: I said to my father: Who is the best of the people after Allah's Messenger (sas)? He said: "Abu Bakr". I said: And then who? He said: And then Umar ibn Al-Khattab. I was afraid that he would say Uthman next, so I said: And then you? To which he answered: I am nothing but a man among the Muslims."

Also, from Sahih Al-Bukhari: Once, there was a problem between Abu Bakr and Umar. Eventually, Umar came to the Prophet (sas) and said: O Allah's Messenger, I was wrong. He repeated it twice. Then, the Prophet (sas) said: "Allah sent me to you and you said: 'You lie.' but Abu Bakr said: 'He speaks the truth.' And he supported me with his life and his property so could you please leave for me my companion?" He said it twice. Abu Bakr was never mistreated after that.
Brother, You are quoting Hadiths from Bukhari & Muslim who were the compilers of NOT all the Hadiths. Many Many are fabricated in that books but coz of the hatred of Ali by Bani Umayya they have been approved and added. Those people who had jealousy towards Ali and who made Fatima a.s. angry by taking Fadak. We all know that, so I wouldnt hesitate to even claim this as a fabricated one. Do you think Ali a.s. would support someone who angers Fatima a.s. and who knows what Rasulallah said about her," That whoever makes Fatima .a.s angry has made me Angry and whoever makes me angry has made Allah angry". Study the authenticity of Hadiths first. Dont quote hadiths whose narrators or collectors are his enemies for they would no doubt narrate in denouncing his attributes. Of course they want to remove the name of Ali a.s from the history. I hope you know how Muawiya paid thousands of Dinars to fabricate Hadiths so that Ali a.s. name should be removed from history. And if you are so keen on Hadiths my friend then let me post some of the Hadiths from Al Jami at Tirmidhi:

3713. Abu Sarihah, or Zaid bin Arqam narrated, from the Prophet "For whomever I am his Mawlã then 'All is his Mawla."

3716. Al-Bard' bin 'Azib narrated that the Prophet said to 'All bin Abi Talib: "You are from me, and I am from you."

3717. Abü Sa'eed AI-KhudrI said: "We, the people of the Ansãr, used to recognize the hypocrites, by their hatred for'Ali bin AbI Talib."

3721. Anas bin Mãlik said: "There was a bird with the Prophet, so he said: 'O Allah, send to me the most beloved of Your creatures to eat this bird with me.' So 'Ali came and ate with him."

3731. Jãbir bin 'Abdullah narrated that the Prophet said to 'All: "You are to me in the position that Hãrün was to MUsã, except that there is no Prophet after me."

3732. Ibn 'Abbas narrated: "The Prophet ordered that the gates be closed, except the gate of 'All."

3737. Umm 'Atiyyah said: "The Prophet sent an army in which was 'All." She said: "While he was raising his hands I heard the Messenger of Allah saying: 'O Allah! Do not cause me to die until You allow me to see 'All."

Also Sermons of Ali a.s himself from Nahjul Balgaha about these events:

Beware! By Allah, the son of Abu Quhafah (Abu Bakr) dressed himself with it (the caliphate) and he certainly knew that my position in relation to it was the same as the position of the axis in relation to the hand-mill. The flood water flows down from me and the bird cannot fly upto me. I put a curtain against the caliphate and kept myself detached from it. Then I began to think whether I should assault or endure calmly the blinding darkness of tribulations wherein the grown up are made feeble and the young grow old and the true believer acts under strain till he meets Allah (on his death). I found that endurance thereon was wiser. So I adopted patience although there was pricking in the eye and suffocation (of mortification) in the throat. I watched the plundering of my inheritance till the first one went his way but handed over the Caliphate to Ibn al-Khattab after himself.

(Then he quoted al-A`sha’s verse):

My days are now passed on the camel’s back (in difficulty) while there were days (of ease) when I enjoyed the company of Jabir’s brother Hayyan.

It is strange that during his lifetime he wished to be released from the caliphate but he confirmed it for the other one after his death. No doubt these two shared its udders strictly among themselves. This one put the Caliphate in a tough enclosure where the utterance was haughty and the touch was rough. Mistakes were in plenty and so also the excuses therefore. One in contact with it was like the rider of an unruly camel. If he pulled up its rein the very nostril would be slit, but if he let it loose he would be thrown. Consequently, by Allah people got involved in recklessness, wickedness, unsteadiness and deviation. Nevertheless, I remained patient despite length of period and stiffness of trial, till when he went his way (of death) he put the matter (of Caliphate) in a group and regarded me to be one of them. But good Heavens! What had I to do with this “consultation”? Where was any doubt about me with regard to the first of them that I was now considered akin to these ones? But I remained low when they were low and flew high when they flew high.

One of them turned against me because of his hatred and the other got inclined the other way due to his in-law relationship and this thing and that thing, till the third man of these people stood up with heaving breasts between his dung and fodder. With him his children of his grand-father, (Umayyah) also stood up swallowing up Allah’s wealth like a camel devouring the foliage of spring, till his rope broke down, his actions finished him and his gluttony brought him down prostrate.

I believe in HIS words. But would never believe in fabricated Hadiths.

morela
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#104

Unread post by morela » Wed Jul 23, 2014 4:10 am

See both have presented hadith from their views ,but I think it is dishonesty for shias to quote sunni hadith of their interest and reject other authentic hadith which dont align with their interest , this is called cherry picking according to the lowly desires. I am myself amazaed there are many hadith in sahihs which praise Ali A.S but there is not a single hadith which praises muawiya. If he really manipulated we would not find these hadith. From my study the scholars were highly apolitical and their job was to just report things as is like journalism , the only difference being that they were grounded in early Islam which ensured that they had high moral standards and infact this is the reason there are10 times more daeef\fabricated hadith then sahih hadith, as many people did fabricate hadith on both sided i.e nusairis, khawarijis., nasibis all these three groups hadith were deemed fabricated after proper scrutiny. Ismailis did no care to preserve hadith as they all relied on the Imam which finally disappeared with all this knowledge!

silvertongue
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#105

Unread post by silvertongue » Wed Jul 23, 2014 4:38 am

There are Hadiths of Muawiya as well and many fabricated ones that when one reads it would know it simply that its false. The point that I post from Sunni books is that NOT even Sunni authors or compilers were able to remove the name of Ali a.s. and his fadhail from their books. Thanks to Imams like Shaafi, Nasai and scholars like Al Hakim al Nisaboori that gave their lives defending the name of Ali a.s in their time..

Muslim First
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#106

Unread post by Muslim First » Wed Jul 23, 2014 7:49 am

Pro and con Ahadith on , by or against Ali presented and argued now.

What that has to do with this thread?
Thread is

Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

silvertongue
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#107

Unread post by silvertongue » Thu Jul 24, 2014 1:02 am

Seriously I was thinking the same bro.. Somehow things come to Shia Sunni discussions no matter what.. hehhehe

morela
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#108

Unread post by morela » Thu Jul 24, 2014 5:10 am

because all this boils down to the most common misconception that "Ali was the successor" whereas e know that Ali himself gave bayat to Abu bakr and they all loved each other. How can one even imagine that students whose teacher were RasulAllah SAW , the perfect teacher could indulge in this. I am happy that this deviant beliefs and exaggeration with regards to ALi were held 400 years after Ali himself and is a fringe minority like how now even gay rights group are fringe minority who tend to be more vocal and make most noise.

silvertongue
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#109

Unread post by silvertongue » Sat Jul 26, 2014 1:08 am

common misconception
Do you even read books of history and Hadiths or simply post what you hear from some Tom Dicks and Harry here and there.. The books of Al Tabari, Suyuti, Ibn Shayba are filled with Historical evidences how Ali a.s. was forced by Umar and taken to the mosque to pledge Allegiance to Abu Bakr. If you are not pleased enough check out Bukhari where Umar narrates the whole incident of Saqifa. And tell me how the hell did Abu Bakr got elected if all the Shuras (Electors) were not even present. That was the biggest scam in Islam my friend. Even non muslims writers quote about that tragedy. Go read some authentic books brother. May be its not a misconception of history but somewhat that your mind has created.

silvertongue
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#110

Unread post by silvertongue » Sat Jul 26, 2014 1:11 am

Heres the extracts from Nahjul Balagha about Abu Bakrs Caliphate:

Beware! By Allah, the son of Abu Quhafah (Abu Bakr) dressed himself with it (the caliphate) and he certainly knew that my position in relation to it was the same as the position of the axis in relation to the hand-mill. The flood water flows down from me and the bird cannot fly upto me. I put a curtain against the caliphate and kept myself detached from it.

Then I began to think whether I should assault or endure calmly the blinding darkness of tribulations wherein the grown up are made feeble and the young grow old and the true believer acts under strain till he meets Allah (on his death).

I found that endurance thereon was wiser. So I adopted patience although there was pricking in the eye and suffocation (of mortification) in the throat. I watched the plundering of my inheritance till the first one went his way but handed over the Caliphate to Ibn al-Khattab after himself.

(Then he quoted al-A`sha’s verse):

My days are now passed on the camel’s back (in difficulty) while there were days (of ease) when I enjoyed the company of Jabir’s brother Hayyan.

It is strange that during his lifetime he wished to be released from the caliphate but he confirmed it for the other one after his death. No doubt these two shared its udders strictly among themselves. This one put the Caliphate in a tough enclosure where the utterance was haughty and the touch was rough. Mistakes were in plenty and so also the excuses therefore. One in contact with it was like the rider of an unruly camel. If he pulled up its rein the very nostril would be slit, but if he let it loose he would be thrown. Consequently, by Allah people got involved in recklessness, wickedness, unsteadiness and deviation.


Nevertheless, I remained patient despite length of period and stiffness of trial, till when he went his way (of death) he put the matter (of Caliphate) in a group and regarded me to be one of them. But good Heavens! What had I to do with this “consultation”? Where was any doubt about me with regard to the first of them that I was now considered akin to these ones? But I remained low when they were low and flew high when they flew high.

One of them turned against me because of his hatred and the other got inclined the other way due to his in-law relationship and this thing and that thing, till the third man of these people stood up with heaving breasts between his dung and fodder. With him his children of his grand-father, (Umayyah) also stood up swallowing up Allah’s wealth like a camel devouring the foliage of spring, till his rope broke down, his actions finished him and his gluttony brought him down prostrate.

silvertongue
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#111

Unread post by silvertongue » Sat Jul 26, 2014 2:52 am

Allamah Majlisi confirms the permissibility of praying near the shrines of the Imams ('a). For instance, he narrates that the Prophet (s) said:

{The Prophet (s) said:} “You shall be killed in Iraq and you shall also be buried there!” I (Imam 'Ali ('a) said: O Messenger of Allah! What shall be the reward of the one will visit our graves, beautify them and maintain them?” He (s) said to me: “Your grave and that of your sons are among the edifices of paradise and among its fields.”

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am

Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#112

Unread post by Muslim First » Sat Jul 26, 2014 9:41 am

Br ST
ASAK

By posting various accounts degrading 1,2,3+4 and praising Hz Ali and Ahl e Bait, what are you going to prove?
Open you eye and look at Ummah of 1.5 B Muslims today.
There is turmoil in Sunni and Shia world caused by external and internal forces.

Shia Imams are either Gaib, hiding or Hazir (who largely ignores religious practice of his Murids but cleverly maniplates world by his piety and charity)

Sunni world is experiences similar problems.

Nahjahul Balagha like Ahadith were written by others then Hz Ali.
Shia and Sunni arguementors use it or dismiss it as per their whims.
Now one clear question to you

Show me one clear Aya of Quran which says " o Muhammad your progeny will lead Ummah after you"

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am

Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#113

Unread post by Muslim First » Sat Jul 26, 2014 9:52 am

Code: Select all

ST
That was the biggest scam in Islam my friend. Even non muslims writers quote about that tragedy.
so what is your concrete suggestion?
If I accept it
Who do you think I should pledge Allegiance?
Gaib Imam represented by which Ayatollah? Whom I should give my Khums? BTW Khums is due only when certain conditions are met.
Hiding Imam represented by various Dais
Or
Twice divorced Hazir Imam ?

silvertongue
Posts: 578
Joined: Wed Sep 04, 2013 6:34 am

Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#114

Unread post by silvertongue » Sun Jul 27, 2014 1:06 am

If you are confused about todays system of Dai ship and Molvis running the same in other communities then I wont insist you to do anything which is wrong at any point. My point is some people think of the succession as a misconception and so on. And Praising Ali a.s, why not, Allah praised him in the Quran, Nabi a.s. praised him during his entire life. Thousands of Hadiths are in Praise of Ali a.s. Why wont I love a person Whom Allah and his Nabi a.s. loves. The strange thing I find is with you guys. Even If a person shows a little love for Ali a.s. you start shouting your wahabism in. Grow up fellas. its 2014..

JavedhJuma
Posts: 403
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Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#115

Unread post by JavedhJuma » Sun Jul 27, 2014 1:53 am

Muslim First wrote:

Code: Select all

ST
That was the biggest scam in Islam my friend. Even non muslims writers quote about that tragedy.
so what is your concrete suggestion?
If I accept it
Who do you think I should pledge Allegiance?First, you will never accept any suggestion so do not waste our time. You cannot pledge allegiance with your fitnati mind to any of the Shia Imams. They will not even accept it.
Gaib Imam represented by which Ayatollah? Whom I should give my Khums? BTW Khums is due only when certain conditions are met. You can't even give Ushr so don't worry about Khums. Remember according to you many Muslims countries took it upon themselves and abolished Ushr, except for Saudi Arabia. Khums is above your comprehension and your miser mind.
Hiding Imam represented by various Dais
Or
Twice divorced Hazir Imam ?
You will never be accepted here. So don't even contemplate.


Stay with the fitnatis. You do not have to join any of the Shia sects. You belong where you are, in Jahil camp. We don't need you. And the best solution for you, if you cannot still think right, stay with Dawood Nabi SAW and Sulaiman Nabi SAW. That is the trend in your world (women). They did not divorce women, they just added to their consorts. You do not need Imams and Dais. They are above your thinking process and for the likes of you. Follow ISIS, if you become desperate. They just blew up the grave of Yusuf Nabi SAW. Go give your allegiance to Abu Bakar Baghdadi, he can use you well. He needs fitnatis like you to take Muslims to Hell.

morela
Posts: 183
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2014 1:21 pm

Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#116

Unread post by morela » Sun Jul 27, 2014 5:00 am

Please dont divert the topic of the thread

silvertongue
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Joined: Wed Sep 04, 2013 6:34 am

Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#117

Unread post by silvertongue » Sun Jul 27, 2014 6:29 am

To end this here. No muslim ever worships graves. He does sajda and makes a dua. And those who think its worshipping. Keep thinking and abusing. It doesnt make a difference at all. Coz Allah knows better than you so called Knowledgable people here. As for those who have belief in this. May Allah bless you and accept your Dua.

Jazakllah..

morela
Posts: 183
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2014 1:21 pm

Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#118

Unread post by morela » Sun Jul 27, 2014 10:41 am

Well I used to goto the rozas and used to ask directly to the various Molas, and all my friends and relatives used to do this, yes I confirmed this. Also you are lying as it is a very common phrase to say "Mola mane maaf karjo" while doing sajda to the grave . Once I matured, READ Quran and coming to this forum I realized that this is SHIRK indeed.

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am

Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#119

Unread post by Muslim First » Sun Jul 27, 2014 12:10 pm

Allah praised him in the Quran,
Can you quote Sura and Aya please

morela
Posts: 183
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2014 1:21 pm

Re: Hadith from Ahle Bayt prohibiting grave worship

#120

Unread post by morela » Sun Jul 27, 2014 8:36 pm

No.