Bohra SMS Duniya

The one and only free public forum for Bohras. The focus of this forum is the reform movement, the Dawoodi Bohra faith and, of course, the corrupt priesthood. But the discussion is in no way restricted to the Bohras alone.
maethist
Posts: 152
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2014 3:28 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2161

Unread post by maethist » Sat Oct 18, 2014 12:58 pm

DisillusionedDB wrote:
maethist wrote:Mubarak is a multipurpose word meaning blessed, fortunate or lucky (Hans Wehr dictionary).
It is like saying you are blessed for being alive for Eid, Ashura, or performing Hajj etc. It is not out of place for wishing tehniyat (congratulations) to a person. It is appropriate when addressing a person directly or when describing one person to a third party.
But, although it is going overboard when used as an adjective for hand, feet, places etc., it does not appear completely out of place.
One can play around with all the meanings all day long but if something doesn't sound correct then I suppose it isn't. I do agree with the the meanings that you have given from the dictionary but that doesn't mean the word can used/abused to such an extent that it loses its value. If we were to say mubarak for something that is really good or pleasing for a person or for a happy event, then it is justified. Other than that we would have to huff and puff to explain the term.
Languages are created, mature, evolve and die. Meaning of words and the way they are used in sentences keep changing.

When it comes to linguists and grammarians, there are basically two approaches.

Prescriptivists believe that words have static meaning and do their best to prescribe/teach the 'correct' usage of words with their 'proper' meanings. In non-Western cultures, that is still the approach of educators.

Unfortunately for Prescriptivists, words and their meanings have a habit of evolving continually. Descriptivists, since the middle of the 20th century, do not pronounce on 'correct' usage but simply describe how the meanings of words keep changing. They are comfortable with wide variety of dialects and slang. That is the approach of modern Western linguists and grammarians; and many non-Western educators, particularly the Arabs, are now taking advantage of this approach.

Prescriptivists have a role to play in teaching languages. But mature adults already familiar with their language would prefer to know the current usage of words.

Mubarak is one of those words which have altered meanings when imported from Arabic into Urdu and other languages. Same is the case with the majority of Arabic and Farsi words that make up the modern Urdu language. These words subtly evolve in their new environment. Mubarak, whether you like it or not, will achieve the meaning that people want it to mean. Its value is its usage as commonly understood.

After all, everything in God's universe is Mubarak. Some people even name their children Mubarak.

Etymology is a fascinating subject. Look it up along with Noam Chomsky, founder of Modern Linguistics.


anajmi
Posts: 13402
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2163

Unread post by anajmi » Sat Oct 18, 2014 2:27 pm

words and their meanings have a habit of evolving continually. Descriptivists, since the middle of the 20th century, do not pronounce on 'correct' usage but simply describe how the meanings of words keep changing.
An example is the word "gay". Once upon a time, "gay" used to mean happy. Now if you say you are "gay" you are something different.

Consider also the word "salaah". Arabs used "salaah" to refer to prayer even before Islam. However, "salaah" now refers to the Islamic prayer and not just any prayer. The Quran changed the meanings of many common words in pagan Arabia.

However, "Ashara Mubarak" has nothing to do with language. It has to do with mind control. Has anyone heard someone say "Chalismu Mubarak"? "Warsi Mubarak"? of course not. Why?

The death of Imam Hussain has led to great futures for the Dai and his minions. His death celebration every year results in the filling up of kothari coffers. Hence it is "Ashara Mubarak"!!

maethist
Posts: 152
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2014 3:28 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2164

Unread post by maethist » Sat Oct 18, 2014 3:21 pm

'And only one for birthday presents, you know. There's glory for you!'

'I don't know what you mean by "glory",' Alice said.

Humpty Dumpty smiled contemptuously. 'Of course you don't — till I tell you. I meant "there's a nice knock-down argument for you!"'

'But "glory" doesn't mean "a nice knock-down argument",' Alice objected.

'When I use a word,' Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, 'it means just what I choose it to mean — neither more nor less.'

'The question is,' said Alice, 'whether you can make words mean so many different things.'

'The question is,' said Humpty Dumpty, 'which is to be master — that's all.'

Alice was too much puzzled to say anything; so after a minute Humpty Dumpty began again. 'They've a temper, some of them — particularly verbs: they're the proudest — adjectives you can do anything with, but not verbs — however, I can manage the whole lot of them! Impenetrability! That's what I say!'

'Would you tell me please,' said Alice, 'what that means?'

'Now you talk like a reasonable child,' said Humpty Dumpty, looking very much pleased. 'I meant by "impenetrability" that we've had enough of that subject, ..................................

anajmi
Posts: 13402
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2165

Unread post by anajmi » Sat Oct 18, 2014 3:43 pm

So which one are you? Humpty Dumpty or Alice?

DisillusionedDB
Posts: 379
Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 7:20 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2166

Unread post by DisillusionedDB » Sun Oct 19, 2014 1:26 am

maethist wrote:
DisillusionedDB wrote: One can play around with all the meanings all day long but if something doesn't sound correct then I suppose it isn't. I do agree with the the meanings that you have given from the dictionary but that doesn't mean the word can used/abused to such an extent that it loses its value. If we were to say mubarak for something that is really good or pleasing for a person or for a happy event, then it is justified. Other than that we would have to huff and puff to explain the term.
... Mubarak, whether you like it or not, will achieve the meaning that people want it to mean ...
That's exactly what I said. You can twist and turn the word whichever way you like to mean what you like. But then, it does sound silly when used in certain sombre circumstances.

ParisBohra
Posts: 9
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2014 4:11 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2167

Unread post by ParisBohra » Sun Oct 19, 2014 5:16 am

Bayaan of Syedna Mufaddal Saifuddin and Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin - as going around on Whatsapp
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(5.14 MiB) Downloaded 3749 times

MMH
Posts: 312
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 2:22 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2168

Unread post by MMH » Sun Oct 19, 2014 6:24 am

ParisBohra wrote:Bayaan of Syedna Mufaddal Saifuddin and Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin - as going around on Whatsapp

what's the point?

Truth-Prevails
Posts: 146
Joined: Sat Feb 08, 2014 1:02 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2169

Unread post by Truth-Prevails » Sun Oct 19, 2014 6:42 am

No comparison between the Father and the "pretender" son. This audio file makes it clear as night and day.
Syedna Burhanuddin RA oratory and confidence is amazing. Hear how he says that "Mey Moiyad shu, Imam uz Zaman ni tayeed maney awwe che".

Also for all the those naysayers. See in what clearly Syedna Burhanuddin RA addresses SKQ. He calls him first by his relationship (Simul Ajal - My worthy Brother) and then addresses him as (Al-Walad-ul-Ahab - The Beloved Son). This is clear indication that he had done nass of SKQ and is now showing the relationship between him the Naas (Nass giver) on his Mansoos (Nass receiver), the spritual relationship of the true beloved son.

Also, Aqa Burhanuddin RA clearly says that "Satar ma teen rutba, em Ahed (misaaq) ma sharat levai che, Dai al-Mutlaq ane ehna Zehredast Mazoon ane Mukasir"

And now the new philosophy is Misaaq sharat is only for Imam and Dai. Welcome to the new innovative YN/MS dawat.

WiththenameofAllah
Posts: 230
Joined: Sat May 24, 2014 9:13 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2170

Unread post by WiththenameofAllah » Sun Oct 19, 2014 11:19 am

Ac wali bagi for SMS .. Lannat on him, where imam Hussain died in heat in karbala and this man is enjoying Ac Wagon .
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WiththenameofAllah
Posts: 230
Joined: Sat May 24, 2014 9:13 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2171

Unread post by WiththenameofAllah » Sun Oct 19, 2014 11:20 am

How much has he spent on this ?
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WiththenameofAllah
Posts: 230
Joined: Sat May 24, 2014 9:13 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2172

Unread post by WiththenameofAllah » Sun Oct 19, 2014 11:33 am

To this extended family , I love this forum so much atleast there are people who think and are not following SMS blindly.
I have a question to ask from elderly and experienced people here . Is it ok for a girl who does not believe in SMS an is aware of his frauds to marry a man who believes in him ? is life easier ? And are there Any hopes for changes in his belief ?
Need prayers .
JazakAllah kahir

SBM
Posts: 6241
Joined: Sun May 09, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2173

Unread post by SBM » Sun Oct 19, 2014 11:47 am

WiththenameofAllah wrote:How much has he spent on this ?
Correction Sister
HOW MUCH COMMUNITY SPENT ON THIS?

y-kuc
Posts: 47
Joined: Thu Apr 03, 2014 11:10 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2174

Unread post by y-kuc » Sun Oct 19, 2014 1:47 pm

WiththenameofAllah wrote:How much has he spent on this ?
2hp in front and 2hp it seems for the AC at the back..
Compare it with a -
Maruti 800 around 3 lac for 45-50 hp. :twisted:

Now lets guess what it cost.

saminaben
Posts: 132
Joined: Thu Jan 16, 2014 7:57 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2175

Unread post by saminaben » Sun Oct 19, 2014 4:55 pm

WiththenameofAllah wrote:To this extended family , I love this forum so much atleast there are people who think and are not following SMS blindly.
I have a question to ask from elderly and experienced people here . Is it ok for a girl who does not believe in SMS an is aware of his frauds to marry a man who believes in him ? is life easier ? And are there Any hopes for changes in his belief ?
Need prayers .
JazakAllah kahir
Sister WiththenameofAllah, PM me if you wish, I am happy to discuss this with you privately.
Generally, my question to you would be would you be willing to marry someone who is Hindu, Christian, Sunni, Jew,, with the idea of Changing his beliefs? Would life be easier for you if he didn't change his beliefs? Would life be easier for him if did change his beliefs? Do you have open and honest communication with each other about the things that matters most to you both?

dal-chaval-palidu
Posts: 547
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 12:46 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2176

Unread post by dal-chaval-palidu » Sun Oct 19, 2014 10:50 pm

Sister WiththenameofAllah,

Typically, the chance that somebody will change his beliefs is small, but not impossible. My understanding from your posts is that you follow basic Islam (Masallah) and not all the additions that have (recently) come in to the Bohra deen. If your future husband is a strong follower of SMS, it may cause conflict in the future. It would be best to have an open discussion with him.

This is just my 2 bits worth; it is possible my judgement could be totally off. I sincerely wish you all the best. May Allah guide you to what is good for you and grant you happiness. Ameen.

haqniwaat
Posts: 516
Joined: Wed Aug 06, 2014 6:06 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2177

Unread post by haqniwaat » Sun Oct 19, 2014 10:50 pm

WiththenameofAllah wrote:To this extended family , I love this forum so much atleast there are people who think and are not following SMS blindly.
I have a question to ask from elderly and experienced people here . Is it ok for a girl who does not believe in SMS an is aware of his frauds to marry a man who believes in him ? is life easier ? And are there Any hopes for changes in his belief ?
Need prayers .
JazakAllah kahir
If anyone cares about this girl, they should say no. Simply because SMS and gang are extremists.

WiththenameofAllah
Posts: 230
Joined: Sat May 24, 2014 9:13 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2178

Unread post by WiththenameofAllah » Mon Oct 20, 2014 1:35 am

dal-chaval-palidu wrote:Sister WiththenameofAllah,

Typically, the chance that somebody will change his beliefs is small, but not impossible. My understanding from your posts is that you follow basic Islam (Masallah) and not all the additions that have (recently) come in to the Bohra deen. If your future husband is a strong follower of SMS, it may cause conflict in the future. It would be best to have an open discussion with him.

This is just my 2 bits worth; it is possible my judgement could be totally off. I sincerely wish you all the best. May Allah guide you to what is good for you and grant you happiness. Ameen.
JazakAllah khair brother for your help :) and ameen to your duas. I follow Islam only and not bohra deen. I will discuss it with him and find out his belief in SMS.

May Allah shower you with his blessings ameen.

kimanumanu
Posts: 607
Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2014 2:16 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2179

Unread post by kimanumanu » Mon Oct 20, 2014 5:13 am


Akhtiar Wahid
Posts: 804
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 9:22 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2180

Unread post by Akhtiar Wahid » Mon Oct 20, 2014 11:23 am

Imam hussain (AS) ke naam pe kya kya sitam huey,
khuch bekasoor log Mola Hussain (AS) ke dai pe yuhi shaheed huey,

Shezadey Imam ke Dai ke ek dusre se ladte rahey,
Ek buzurg auraat ko sahara na mila, bas dukh mein mar gaye,

Imam Hussain (AS) ka kafila taras gaya tha pani ke liye
Yeh toh AC ki thandi hawa ke beena naa chal sakey

Kehtey hain humko Hussain (AS) ke waaris hami hain
Tumhari aukaad toh Hussain (AS) ke dushman ki bhi na ho sakey,

Yazeed ne Phir bhi thoda afsos jataya hoga, Hussain (AS) ko katal karke
Tum toh pyaase kho paani bhi naa pilaao aesey mardood paida huey!

truth seeker100
Posts: 165
Joined: Tue May 20, 2014 5:54 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2181

Unread post by truth seeker100 » Mon Oct 20, 2014 2:01 pm

The great mufatlal
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truth seeker100
Posts: 165
Joined: Tue May 20, 2014 5:54 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2182

Unread post by truth seeker100 » Mon Oct 20, 2014 2:03 pm

Orders from kothar mubarak
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Akhtiar Wahid
Posts: 804
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 9:22 am

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2183

Unread post by Akhtiar Wahid » Mon Oct 20, 2014 5:43 pm

YES SIR YES SIR QARZ HASANA 3000 BAGS FULL
YES SIR YES SIR PURJOSH MATAM
YES SIR YES SIR

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2184

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Tue Oct 21, 2014 5:21 pm

While on the subject of "Ashara Mubaraka", there was an interesting post from Bro porus as under :-

`When I use a word,' Humpty Dumpty said in rather a scornful tone, `it means just what I choose it to mean -- neither more nor less.'

Yes, the greeting 'ashura mubarak' may mean, for you, 'a great opportunity to cleanse your sin'. But that is not what the word 'Mubarak' means.

It means that the day is/was blessed. This contradicts the whole tenor of the day when all marsiyas lament the day as calamitous and 'manhooz'.

Either you celebrate 'victory' of Imam Husain or commemorate his martyrdom. Celebration of Eid al Adha is Allah's grace on Nabi Ibrahim and Ismail. Grace of Allah on Shuhada at Karbala was absent. Only revisionist historical interpretation can describe the event as marked by Allah's grace.

Celebration is what Bohras do. Commemoration is best done in silence. Remembrance Day or Veteran's Day are commemorated with 'silence' for the memory of those who gave their lives in wars.

Crying for martyrs and rhythmic beating of breasts in tune with marsiya find no sanction in the Quran, nor in the main book of the Bohra fiqh, Daaimul Islam. And at least one Dai has banned the practice in the past.

By the way, the change from 'Ashura' to 'Ashara' is instructive. While Ashura refers to the day of the 10th Muharram, 'Ashara' refers to the 10 days. This is in keeping with reducing the significance of Ashura by maatam everywhere and everywhen. We can look forward to the time when the whole year will be described as 'mubaraka', such as 'sanaa mubaraka' or 'aamma mubaraka'.

confusedaboutnass
Posts: 15
Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 10:42 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2185

Unread post by confusedaboutnass » Wed Oct 22, 2014 3:47 am

Waaz timings in Hongkong:

For Khidmat Husainiyah in Hong Kong, Huzurala TUS has granted Raza to Shaikh Mohammed bhai Shaikh Zakiuddin bhai Sabir, Masool in MSB Nagpur.
Arrival details of Shaikh Mohammed bhai will be advised as soon as it is finalised.

Insha'allah Program in HK will be as follows, starting from Tuesday 2 Moharammul Haraam 1436H (25 October 2014), which please note:
1) Waaz to begin at 3:30pm
2) Maghrib/Isha Imaamat Namaaz
3) Matam Majlis
4) Salwaat Jaman.

Why Hongkong is allowed to do be-farmani of Mufaddal Moula and hold waaz in the afternoon???

Other jumaats must take the example of Hongkong and insist that waaz to be held in afternoon so that people can work too. Otherwise if waaz is at 10:30am then whole day is waste!!

Let others rise up too and reject the fatwa of morning-only waaz. Stay strong and insist on reasonable waaz timings like Hongkong people.

thesource
Posts: 60
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2014 2:26 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2186

Unread post by thesource » Wed Oct 22, 2014 3:26 pm

Received:
Why this pomp and show put up at the time of MS's arrival in Surat?
Its a fact that the residents of Surat are cursing MS for arriving as the whole schedule of their routine work is upset except for those who are going to make money by involving them in several committees.
I being a Kapadwanji and Sidhpuri from my both the parents' side have always noticed that the real Surtis try to stay away totally and those involved like Sh. Mazhar Motiwala, Yusuf Jelly, Tapia, Limewala, Imtiaz Kherulla, his brother, Mustan Motiwala, Vasi brothers, Imtiaz Shipchandler will
Make a fortune.

Vasi brothers, Imtiaz Shipchandler handle Crores of investment of MS in their business. Motiwala brothers in estate business in Alibaug. Imtiaz kherulla is known swindler who has duped new mukasir saheb and other people in Stock Market. Also known for swindling Sh. Mustafa Godhrawala, one trader in Bhajipala, Mumbai for 32 Lakhs and Sh. Abdulhusain Sh. Ebrahim Yamani saheb of eighty lakhs.
Now in Surat he bosses over all the Surtis for issuing Passes of Esufi Hall (Airconditioned) specially for reserved for Surtis who come begging to him for passes. Why such importances to Surtis? Why this discrimination?
This is the time for these Surtis to make most in Ashara.

UnhappyBohra
Posts: 568
Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2014 2:23 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2187

Unread post by UnhappyBohra » Thu Oct 23, 2014 12:07 pm

Received this video message in whatsapp today. Even if I am not able to come out in the open right now, I will be listening to the waaz relayed by SKQ side. The morning waaz timings are making it impossible for me to attend the waaz in the masjid anyway!!

https://www.dropbox.com/s/1ybhbjhih4966 ... 6.mp4?dl=0

UnhappyBohra
Posts: 568
Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2014 2:23 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2188

Unread post by UnhappyBohra » Thu Oct 23, 2014 12:12 pm

For those wanting to listen to waaz from SKQ side: Received this from Fatemi Dawat this morning. Looks like Taher Bhaisaheb waaz will be broadcast to mumineen. May we all do buka and matam of Aqa Hussain AS in the manner befitting his great sacrifice.

Salaams,

As we approach ashara mubaraka, we urge all mumineen who are able to attend ashara mubaraka with Syedna Khuzaima QutbuddinTUS in Darus Sakina, Thane-Mumbai and mumineen in North America to attend Shz Taher bhaisab waaz in Bakersfield, California.

For those who are unable to attend we have made the following arrangement:

Syedna QutbuddinTUS has granted raza mubarak for Shz Taher bhaisab waaz to be broadcasted live from Bakersfield. The waaz will begin at 3.30pm Pacific Standard Time everyday (4.00am IST). The waaz link will be available for replay after the live broadcast ends.

For the first day of Muharram and for Aashura those in a time zone ahead of the US, a recording of Syedna's waaz from a few years ago will be available.

Pls check fatemidawat.com for updates and for excerpts from Syedna's waaz mubarak.

The YouTube link for Shz Taher bhaisab first waaz (2nd Muharram - 25th October - live at 3.30pm PST - California time - 4am India time ) is: http://youtu.be/c4YQq49IOeo Waaz link will become a regular YouTube link after live broadcast is complete and will be available for replay.

(recording of Syedna's earlier waaz for those in India for the first day will be available on http://fatemidawat.com/instructions/)

Link for 3rd Muharram will be sent out on second Muharram Inshaallah.

Mumineen who are unable to travel to attend waaz in Mumbai or Bakersfield but are able to get together to listen to waaz and for niyaz jaman in their home town are requested to contact info@fatemidawat.com to coordinate with others in the same area. Where possible contact numbers of those arranging the gathering will be announced. If not possible for all ten days we urge mumineen to gather in the last three days of at the very least on Aashura.

Fiamanillah

think_for_yourself
Posts: 387
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 6:12 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2189

Unread post by think_for_yourself » Thu Oct 23, 2014 3:14 pm

Waaz is scheduled to start at 3:30 pm PT (California time) everyday. Ashura day timings and link to be announced later. For those who cannot see the waaz live, recordings will be available on YouTube for replays. Please feel free to forward.

Ashara Mubaraka 1436H - 2nd Moharram
http://youtu.be/c4YQq49IOeo

Ashara Mubaraka 1436H - 3rd Moharram
http://youtu.be/MItgldeL918

Ashara Mubaraka 1436H - 4th Moharram
http://youtu.be/ns2tfTo4rPU

Ashara Mubaraka 1436H - 5th Moharram
http://youtu.be/vCc_GHa6PpA

Ashara Mubaraka 1436H - 6th Moharram
http://youtu.be/gT0W-bKR74I

Ashara Mubaraka 1436H - 7th Moharram
http://youtu.be/XaVVValSP10

Ashara Mubaraka 1436H - 8th Moharram
http://youtu.be/QQWWGyBZ3Ac

Ashara Mubaraka 1436H - 9th Moharram
http://youtu.be/YGNcEeqqTrY

ghulam muhammed
Posts: 11653
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Bohri SMS Duniya

#2190

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Thu Oct 23, 2014 5:34 pm

Forwarded as received :

To force oneself to believe and to accept a thing without understanding is political and not spiritual or intellectual.

Continuing similar thoughts........ Truth of the day :-

Morality is doing right no matter what you are told: religion is doing what you are told no matter what is right !!