The Myth of Intercession

[brother]

DANISH,

What happened? Couldn't find any material to copy & paste as a RESPONSE to my VERY SIMPLE questions asked of you?

And, by the way - by calling prophet's sunnah & hadiths as compiled by esteemed scholars - DEVIL'S INNNOVATION, you have DESTROYED the Sunni and wahabi madzhabs - based 100% on these sunnahs & hadiths. And, very DESERVEDLY so!

It was a SIMPLE question that I asked or to Substantiate How "your allah" is the Most Graceful & Merciful according to your teachings that you are here to PREACH?

Obviously - you couldn't and NEITHER can your esteemed scholars. Suufice it is to say that what you PREACH & FOLLOW is based on lies & SHAM!

If you are not a follower of:
AHLE E SUNNAH (SUNNIS)
AHLE E HADITH (WAHABIS)

then what do you follow?

Here comes that bull of a response!

Finally - THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS:
"no god but allah"

There is only love- No God but LOVE or as Runi puts it:

"Expressions are many
but Thy loveliness is one;
Each of us refers
to that single Beauty."

[Danish]

In the name of GOD, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.
I seek refuge in GOD from Satan the cursed.

Salaams:

Common sense says that surely as Quran is preserved and protected by Allah(swt), the practical implementation of Quran that is the life of prophet(pbuh) needs to preserved and protected...Here lies the concept of Imamat/Khilafat ...The Imam or the true descendent of prophet(pbuh) will have a life similar to the prophet(pbuh), the way prophet(pbuh) has implemented the Quran...So today when i need to know how to pray i look at the lives of the ahlulbait(as) and i find all of them having a similar life which when traced back cud be found similar to the life of prophet(pbuh), the life which Quran wants us to follow...

If your common sense is based upon Imamat/Khalifat, then why are there vast differences amongst Imaams themselves? Besides, how do you know that only your Imaam is right while all others are wrong? Lastly, from where and how did thousands of Imaams/khalifas/leaders all over the world got their own versions of Salaat?

Quran and Imamat go hand by hand...Pophet (pbuh) has repetively said this "i leave behind two weighty things, quran and ahlulbait(as)......."

How do you know this for fact? I absolutely agree that Muhammad left the Quran behind (alive), but "ahlulbait" are all dead.

In day to day life also we have seen that the best form of guidance is book and a teacher...

Absolutely, the book is the Quran and the teacher GOD.

How cud the religion so close to Allah(swt) leave u without perfect Guidance..

Perfect Guidance can NEVER be found in imaams or khalifas. Guidance comes from GOD Alone and nothing else.

So what do we do

My advice for you is to read, study, ponder, understand and perceive what Quran and GOD's creation is all about.

Your concerns are just as significance to many as they were to me at one point. Let me ask you then; if the entire mankind understood the Quran in one simple easy way, then what would be the point of GOD’s plan in the first place, starting from Adam, Eve and Satan.

Can you show me just one solid proof from any of the so-called "sahih hadiths" (satanic displays) as to the whereabouts of the most accurate and complete Salaat? If you can't, then stop guessing, confusing and twisting everything around. You said you have a common sense, please use it wisely because that is all you've got.

Once again, I will, Insha-Allah, hold on to my statement:
If one understands it correctly and thinks deep, then there is absolutely no calculated way of performing Salaat or to supplicate.

PEACE.

[porus]

There is no God except Allah.

In order to say there is no God, there must be pre-existing concept of God. The concept is that God is the omniscient, omnipotent, omni-present entity, not created but the creator of universe. The entity is known by many names and there are many ways of representing it. Some do it by idols, some by symbols, and some by sounds.

Muslims like to represent it by symbol and sound of word Allah, in Arabic.

Then there is this issue of worshipping God. Some bow down to idols, some to symbols. Muslims also bow down towards Makka. This is a ritual.

Muslims claim that God can only be called Allah and he can only be worshipped by prostrating towards Makka.

This is much like saying “There is no orange except burtaqaal”. Burtaqaal is Arabic for Orange. You will only taste orange if you call it “burtaqaal”. Otherwise, what you taste is denying Burtuqaal and associating orange with it.

[Danish]

In the name of GOD, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.
I seek refuge in GOD from Satan the cursed.

Salaams:

What happened? Couldn't find any material to copy & paste as a RESPONSE to my VERY SIMPLE questions asked of you? It was a SIMPLE question that I asked or to Substantiate How "your allah" is the Most Graceful & Merciful according to your teachings that you are here to PREACH?

I already gave you a very simple answer to your very simple question. I don’t need to write a book on it just to educate your caliber.

And, by the way - by calling prophet's sunnah & hadiths as compiled by esteemed scholars - DEVIL'S INNNOVATION, you have DESTROYED the Sunni and wahabi madzhabs - based 100% on these sunnahs & hadiths. And, very DESERVEDLY so!

...and you have vehemently and prejudicially dishonoured and debased GOD’s Words (the Quran) by upholding the DEVIL’S INNOVATIONS (hadiths) 100%.

Obviously - you couldn't and NEITHER can your esteemed scholars. Suufice it is to say that what you PREACH & FOLLOW is based on lies & SHAM!

I only follow the Quran and ponder on HIS creation to the best of my own abilities and nothing else. GOD’s guidance is sufficient, for HE has given me all the "tools" that I need. Personally, I do not know of any scholar nor do I need to. Although I carefully study the words that are said and written by many, including yours, I choose the path that makes sense to me for my own salvation. My own soul is responsible for whatever I say or do, not others. With that said, it is entirely upto an individual to take heed in his/her own dimension and beyond, from where he/she started, in order to carry ones self on the passage towards his/her destiny (the hereafter).

Lies are based upon hadiths, not Quran. If you uphold hadith instead of Quran, then you and all others become stringent LIARS becuase none of you can prove its authenticity and thereby challenge GOD's words. Alhamdu-Lillah.

PEACE.

[Danish]

In the name of GOD, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.
I seek refuge in GOD from Satan the cursed.

Note how Satan twists porus's mind:

There is no God except Allah.

There is no god but GOD. (note the 'g').

Here comes that bull of a response!
Finally - THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS:
"no god but allah"
There is only love- No God but LOVE or as Runi puts it:

Here comes the HORNS of the bull to your response:
There is no god but GOD. Love has many shapes and sounds, GOD has none. HE simply IS. Love can be broken, mended and amended millions of times to the extent of death, GOD CANNOT be broken, mended or amended and HE CANNOT die, for HE is unforeseen, the ALMIGHTY above love and all. Be HE Glorified.

"Expressions are many
but Thy loveliness is one;
Each of us refers
to that single Beauty."

"That the beauty of GOD Almighty".

PEACE.

[porus]

"There is no god but God"

So God is different from god.
And Orange is not the same as orange.
Difference is in capitalization.

Do we have capitals in Arabic?

la ilah illa allah
allah = al ilah
So, la ilah illa al ilah, or perhaps
la ilah illa al Ilah (Note ilah with lower case i)

Thus the mind of Danish, illuminated by God.

[Muslim First]

.
Br. Danish, Salaam

A simple question:

Do you pray Salaat?

How do you pray Salaat?

What are your Salaat times based on?

Straight answers please.

Wasalaam

.

[Danish]

In the name of GOD, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.
I seek refuge in GOD from Satan the cursed.

Salaams:

So God is different from god.

Absolutely, you silly. The problem is not the 'god' or 'GOD', the problem lies in your brains to understand and that's why Satan's representatives bring about all the confusion to distort and fabricate words by giving irrelevant examples. GOD means the Almighty, the ONE and ONLY, while 'god' is an idol you have created such as, bhudha, ram, krishna, sham, sun, moon, cow and GOD knows what not.

PEACE.

[porus]

According to danish (see the 'd')

GOD means Almighty, the ONE and ONLY.

Silly me, I thought 'Almighty' was an adjective that believers use to describe their God.

Krishna is Almighty, avataar of Vishunu and an aspect of Brahama, mightier than anything, ONE and ONLY.

Hey, I am danish. I say Satan has twisted your mind and makes you call Krishna Almighty. only GOD is Almighty. How do I know that? It says so in the Quraan.

I am Hindu. Brahma is Almighty. It is there in the Vedas. Have you studied them?

I am danish. I have read the Quraan. I do not need to study the books of idol worshippers.

Hindu: Brahama is not an idol. We just represent him by an idol. Just like Muslims choose to pray in one direction, we pray in direction of an idol.

danish: Go away, you child of Satan. Only GOD is to be worshipped. You can only call it GOD, not Brahma.

[qiyam]

Indeed it is the plight of the ignorant who quote from the book of God things which they do not understand.

The Ascertain of Intercession per Allah:

[20.109] On that day shall no intercession avail except of him whom the Beneficent God allows and whose word He is pleased with.

[34.23] And intercession will not avail aught with Him save of him whom He permits. Until when fear shall be removed from their hearts, They shall say: What is it that your Lord said? They shall say: The truth. And He is the Most High, the Great.

[43.86] And those whom they call upon besides Him have no authority for intercession, but he who bears witness of the truth and they know (him).

[53.26] And how many an angel is there in the heavens whose intercession does not avail at all except after Allah has given permission to whom He pleases and chooses.

Allah has said over and over again...nothing shall intercede for salvation...EXCEPT those He permits.

Danish quoted the following ayats:
39:44 To believe that anyone, other than God, can intercede on our behalf to have our sins forgiven or our wishes fulfilled, is to set up partners with God. This is idolatry. The Quran proclaims that "All intercession belongs to God"

---this is of course correct...but incorrectly used. The context of the ayat relates to those who take intercessors ALONG WITH Allah. No muslim does this. Intercession in Islam relates to a plea by an intercessor TO Allah....whereas Allah decides if the intercession is accepted.

then Danish quotes
2:254 ...and that there will be "no intercession on the Day of Judgment".

---It would have been nice if Danish had quoted the entire passage and the ayat after as follows:

[2.254] O you who believe! spend out of what We have given you before the day comes in which there is no bargaining, neither any friendship nor intercession, and the unbelievers-- they are the unjust.

[2.255] Allah is He besides Whom there is no god, the Everliving, the Self-subsisting by Whom all subsist; slumber does not overtake Him nor sleep; whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth is His; who is he that can intercede with Him but by His permission? He knows what is before them and what is behind them, and they cannot comprehend anything out of His knowledge except what He pleases, His knowledge extends over the heavens and the earth, and the preservation of them both tires Him not, and He is the Most High, the Great.

[Danish]

In the name of GOD, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.
I seek refuge in GOD from Satan the cursed.

Krishna is Almighty, avataar of Vishunu and an aspect of Brahama, mightier than anything

One day I entered a hindu friend's house and saw him doing "puja" and other "rasms" in front of this colorful decorated pictoral Krishna, Vishunu and a few others made of clay. The one that most impressed me had many hands and legs. I asked my friend as to what they were doing and he very politely said, "praying to our gods". Astonished, I asked him that how could you pray to these little bitty man made sculptures and treat them as your gods. He said that this is how are gods look like and this is our belief. Then he said that the multi-legged/handed one was the best and the biggest, their so-called al-mighty. After quite an argument as to his false belief and his insistence upon his gods, I took the best and the biggest in the palm of my hands and crushed it into bits and pieces. Then I took all the rest of the man-made "putlas" (gods) and threw them out the door, each putla scattered in pieces all over the place. Finally, I said to him, "Is this what your god is all about", pointing to the crushed putlas. I told him that these are nothing but Satanic innovations and asked him if he could do the same to my GOD, the Almighty, the ONE and ONLY. He obviously couldn't and was simply stunned, ashamed and disgusted. After a little struggle, I calmed him down and after few months of constant nig-nags, he started reading the Quran and finally became a true submitter.

The Vedas :
The Vedas are the ancient scriptures or revelation (Shruti) of the Hindu teachings. They manifest the Divine Word in human speech. They reflect into human language the language of the Gods, the Divine powers that have created us and which rule over us.

There are four Vedas, each consisting of four parts. The primary portion is the mantra or hymn section (samhita). To this are appended ritualistic teachings (brahmana) and theological sections (aranyaka). Finally philosophical sections (upanishads) are included. The hymn sections are the oldest. The others were added at a later date and each explains some aspect of the hymns or follows one line of interpreting them.

The Vedas were compiled around the time of Krishna (c. 3500 B.C.), and even at that time were hardly understood. Hence they are very ancient and only in recent times has their spiritual import, like that of the other mystery teachings of the ancient world, begun to be rediscovered or appreciated even in India. Like the Egyptian teachings they are veiled, symbolic and subtle and require a special vision to understand and use properly.

The great compiler of the Veda and Puranas was Vyasa Krishna Dwaipayana. He was said to be the twenty-eighth of the Vyasas or compilers of Vedic knowledge. He was somewhat older than the Avatar Krishna and his work continued after the death of Krishna. Perhaps he is symbolic of a whole Vedic school which flourished at that time, as many such Vedic schools were once prominent all over India and in some places beyond.

This is simply a part of the vedas with no heads and tails of its authenticity whatsoever. Besides, note the plurality of God (Gods), thus the ONENESS of it becomes questionable. Read on about this veda thingy at www.hindunet.org/vedas/

[Danish]

[18:57] Who are more evil than those who are reminded of their Lord's proofs, then disregard them, without realizing what they are doing. Consequently, we place shields on their hearts to prevent them from understanding it (the Quran), and deafness in their ears. Thus, no matter what you do to guide them, they can never ever be guided.

Intercession as per the Quran:

[2:48] Beware of the day when no soul can avail another soul, no intercession will be accepted, no ransom can be paid, nor can anyone be helped.

[2:123] Beware of the day when no soul will help another soul, no ransom will be accepted, no intercession will be useful, and no one will be helped.

[2:254] O you who believe, you shall give to charity from the provisions we have given to you, before a day comes where there is no trade, no nepotism, and no intercession. The disbelievers are the unjust.

[2:255] GOD: there is no other god besides Him, the Living, the Eternal. Never a moment of unawareness or slumber overtakes Him. To Him belongs everything in the heavens and everything on earth. Who could intercede with Him, except in accordance with His will? He knows their past, and their future. No one attains any knowledge, except as He wills. His dominion encompasses the heavens and the earth, and ruling them never burdens Him. He is the Most High, the Great.

[6:51] And preach with this (Quran) to those who reverence the summoning before their Lord - they have none beside Him as a Lord and Master, nor an intercessor - that they may attain salvation.

[6:70] You shall disregard those who take their religion in vain, as if it is a social function, and are totally absorbed in this worldly life. Remind with this (Quran), lest a soul may suffer the consequences of its evil earnings. It has none beside GOD as a Lord and Master, nor an intercessor. If it could offer any kind of ransom, it would not be accepted. They suffer the consequences of the evil works they earn; they have incurred hellish drinks, and a painful retribution because of their disbelief.

[6:94] "You have come back to us as individuals, just as we created you the first time, and you have left behind what we provided for you. We do not see with you the intercessors that you idolized and claimed that they will help you. All ties among you have been severed; the idols you set up have abandoned you."

[7:53] Are they waiting until all (prophecies) are fulfilled? The day such fulfillment comes to pass, those who disregarded it in the past will say, "The messengers of our Lord have brought the truth. Are there any intercessors to intercede on our behalf? Would you send us back, so that we change our behavior, and do better works than what we did?" They have lost their souls, and their own innovations have caused their doom.

[9:80] Whether you ask forgiveness for them, or do not ask forgiveness for them - even if you ask forgiveness for them seventy times - GOD will not forgive them. This is because they disbelieve in GOD and His messenger. GOD does not guide the wicked people.
*9:80 If Muhammad could not intercede on behalf of his own uncles and cousins, what makes strangers who never met him think that he will intercede on their behalf? Abraham could not intercede on behalf of his father, nor could Noah intercede on behalf of his son (11:46 & 60:4).

[10:3] Your only Lord is GOD; the One who created the heavens and the earth in six days, then assumed all authority. He controls all matters. There is no intercessor, except in accordance with His will. Such is GOD your Lord. You shall worship Him. Would you not take heed?

[10:18] They worship beside GOD idols that possess no power to harm them or benefit them, and they say, "These are our intercessors at GOD!" Say, "Are you informing GOD of something He does not know in the heavens or the earth?" Be He glorified. He is the Most High; far above needing partners.

[19:87] No one will possess the power to intercede, except those who conform to the laws of the Most Gracious.

[20:109] On that day, intercession will be useless, except for those permitted by the Most Gracious, and whose utterances conform to His will.

[21:28] He knows their future and their past. They do not intercede, except for those already accepted by Him, and they are worried about their own necks.
*21:28 The myth of intercession is Satan's most effective bait (see Appendix . *21:30 The Big Bang Theory is now supported by the Creator's infallible mathematical code (Appendix 1). Thus, it is no longer a theory; it is a law, a proven fact.

[26:98] "How could we set you up to rank with the Lord of the universe? [26:99] "Those who misled us were wicked. [26:100] "Now we have no intercessors.

[30:13] Their idols will have no power to intercede on their behalf; on the contrary, they will disown their idols.

[32:4] GOD is the One who created the heavens and the earth, and everything between them in six days, then assumed all authority. You have none beside Him as Lord, nor do you have an intercessor. Would you not take heed?

[34:23] Intercession with Him will be in vain, unless it coincides with His will. When their minds are finally settled down, and they ask, "What did your Lord say," they will say, "The truth." He is the Most High, the Most Great.

[36:23] "Shall I set up beside Him gods? If the Most Gracious willed any harm for me, their intercession cannot help me one bit, nor can they rescue me.

[39:43] Have they invented intercessors to mediate between them and GOD? Say, "What if they do not possess any power, nor understanding?"

[39:44] Say, "All intercession belongs to GOD." To Him belongs all sovereignty of the heavens and the earth, then to Him you will be returned.

[40:18] Warn them about the imminent day, when the hearts will be terrified, and many will be remorseful. The transgressors will have no friend nor an intercessor to be obeyed.

[43:86] None of those whom they idolize beside Him possess any power to intercede, unless their intercession coincides with the truth, and they fully know.

[53:26] Not even the angels in heaven possess authority to intercede. The only ones permitted by GOD are those who act in accordance with His will and His approval.

[74:48] The intercession of the intercessors will never help them.

[porus]

Bigotry has a new name. It is called Danish.

[brother]

>>Bigotry has a new name. It is called Danish. <<<

Porus,
BIGOTRY is -> ORTHODOX Islam!

Any creed that brings out such behaviour EXEMPLIFIED by muslim first and now danish has to be -> GARBAGE!

[qiyam]

Dear Danish,
You've gone to great to misquote many ayats out of context. So who is playing the role of Satan again? Did you even read the entire passages or did you use a browser?

2:48 & 2:123 refers to the calf bani israel took as a idol for Allah.

2:254 & 2:255 support what I stated earlier...and defies your argument.

6:51 refers to those who reject the Prophet and the communications (Quran) of Allah.

6:70 & 6:94 refers to those who takes other BESIDE Allah.

7:53 refers to people after death who didn't believe in Allah and the Prophet before dying.

9:80 doesn't refer to muslim but to the non-believers who didn't believe in the Allah and the Prophet...God doesn't forgive the kafir after their death.

10:3, 10:18, 19:87, 20:108, & 21:28 support what I wrote..and defies your argument.

As you can see you have either misquoted or misrepresented the ayats you referenced. I would caution you to stop quoting from the Book you don't have a basic understanding for! You are misrepresenting the words of Allah by doing so.

[Danish]

Qiyam:

In case you didn't notice: the crux of the matter is focused on "intercession". I quoted basically all the verses out of the Quran in ENGLISH, so how can they be misquoted. Besides, the quotations were GOD's Words, not Satan's role. That’s a pretty darn statement from a weak Muslim like you.

I would caution you to stop quoting from the Book you don't have a basic understanding for! You are misrepresenting the words of Allah by doing so.

Your understanding of the Quran is a mix-match with hadiths. You can’t seem to leave GOD and Quran Alone. It seems to me that you and the majority of the Muslims think that GOD needs the support of Muhammad/Ali (the innovated Shahada) and that the Quran (GOD’S Words) need the support of hadiths (shcolars). In other words, you have made Muhammad/Ali partners with GOD and all the hadiths partners with Quran. An unforgiveable sin.

Because you can’t understand yourself the message of GOD as portrayed in the Quran, you and all other weak Muslims bring in the support of Muhammad (already dead) and other books (ahadiths, Satan’s bait), to prove your cause. By the way there is no where in the Quran that says, "La Illaha Illallah, Muhammadur Rasoolallah". Later the Shia community added, "Aliun Waliallah" (nowhere mentioned in the Quran). These Satanic innovations were done by the unscrupulous scholars after the death of Muhammad and against his will. Not only you guys disobeyed and discredit Muhammad but also degraded GOD Almighty (forgive me O GOD, be YOU Glorified). For me, there is only GOD Alone and Quran Alone and nothing else.

Because of your egoistic, arrogant and persistent mind in upholding ahadiths and other idols, such as Muhammad, Ali, etc, the following does make sense referring to the majority of weak Muslims as well the disbelievers:
[18:57] Who are more evil than those who are reminded of their Lord's proofs, then disregard them, without realizing what they are doing. Consequently, we place shields on their hearts to prevent them from understanding it (the Quran), and deafness in their ears. Thus, no matter what you do to guide them, they can never ever be guided.

COME BACK TO GOD ALONE BY UPHOLDING ONLY QURAN ALONE.

PEACE.

[Muslim First]

.
Salaam Br. Danish

So whoever converts (or reverts) to your creed says " Ashhado La Illaha Illallah" and omits second part of Shahada "Muhammadur Rasoolallah" ?

Do you pray Namaaz (SAlaat) ?

What do you base it on?

You made a statement elsewhere on this board:

No doubt Muhammad was the last prophet (Nabi) but not the last messenger (rasool). Muhammad was only a human being just like the rest of the homosapiens.

If Muhammad SAW was not last Rasool then do you have new one after him?

Waslaam

.

[Danish]

porus and brother (one and the same):

Your gods and all the decorated 'almighty ones' (Krishna, etc.) have been crushed and have been dead thousands of years ago. Some of them were crushed personally by me. So don't be fools! Haven't you learned your lessons yet? The "death of Krishna" by the Vedas. You don't have any room to play around here with your dead gods.

Bigotry has a new name. It is called Danish.

Doesn’t the vedas talk about Krishna’s BIGOTRY and thus his death? You don’t seem to know your own methodology, Wow. Better check again?

BIGOTRY is -> ORTHODOX Islam!

Hinduism is perhaps the oldest methodology and Islam is fairly NEW. Thus Hinduism becomes ORTHODOX and a BIGOTRY - Ha! Ha!

Enjoy temporarily while you still can, and unless you repent and ask forgiveness from GOD Almighty, the ONE and ONLY, the UNFORESEEN, the MOST GRACIOUS, the MOST MERCIFUL, the GOD of the gods, for you and all rest of your kin will, by GOD's Will, burn in Hell forever.

[porus]

Danish, the ignorant and lying bigot says :

" By the way there is no where in the Quran that says, "La Illaha Illallah, Muhammadur Rasoolallah".

47:19 La ilah illa allah
48:29 Muhammadun Rasulullah

[qiyam]

Dear Danish,
The crux is that you've quoted from the Quran regarding "intercession" without quoting the context in which the word is used.

My understanding was based on the ayats and the context in which they were quoted FROM THE QURAN. I did not quote one hadith. You didn't do the same...which is misrepresentation of the Quran.

You quote portion of ayats or an ayat that is part of a several ayats which purport an incorrect statement.

Every description I gave was related in the ayat or the ayat before or afer. It was your poor desecration that lead you not to quote the context. For example your first quote was

[2.48] And be on your guard against a day when one soul shall not avail another in the least, neither shall intercession on its behalf be accepted, nor shall any compensation be taken from it, nor shall they be helped.

This taken alone and out of context would support your view...but to look at the context and the actual meaning..look at the ayats before and after:

[2.47] O children of Israel! call to mind My favor which I bestowed on you and that I made you excel the nations.

2.49] And when We delivered you from Firon's people, who subjected you to severe torment, killing your sons and sparing your women, and in this there was a great trial from your Lord.

[2.50] And when We parted the sea for you, so We saved you and drowned the followers of Firon and you watched by.

[2.51] And when We appointed a time of forty nights with Musa, then you took the calf (for a god) after him and you were unjust.

[2.52] Then We pardoned you after that so that you might give thanks.

[2.53] And when We gave Musa the Book and the distinction that you might walk aright.

[2.54] And when Musa said to his people: O my people! you have surely been unjust to yourselves by taking the calf (for a god), therefore turn to your Creator (penitently), so kill your people, that is best for you with your Creator: so He turned to you (mercifully), for surely He is the Oft-returning (to mercy), the Merciful.

[2.55] And when you said: O Musa! we will not believe in you until we see Allah manifestly, so the punishment overtook you while you looked on.

[2.56] Then We raised you up after your death that you may give thanks.

---So as you can clearly see...the verse 2:48 refers to the bani israel who, when Musa brought them the taurah, turn to calf BESIDE Allah and asked to see Allah manifest. The intercession refered to in this case is the intercession of an idol beside Allah.

Regarding "COME BACK TO GOD ALONE BY UPHOLDING ONLY QURAN ALONE."

[3.32] Say: Obey Allah and the Apostle; but if they turn back, then surely Allah does not love the unbelievers.

Obeying the Apostle is a requirement...ACCORDING TO THE QURAN...as Obeying Allah.

[Danish]

In the name of GOD, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.
I seek refuge in GOD from Satan the cursed.

Salaams Muslim First:

So whoever converts (or reverts) to your creed says " Ashhado La Illaha Illallah" and omits second part of Shahada "Muhammadur Rasoolallah" ?

Let me first assure you that I do not have any special nor man-made creed. I am a simply a true believer (submitter, a Muslim) in GOD, HIS Absoluteness, the creator of the Heavens and the Earth and everything within and everything without and everything beyond. Thus my strong belief in "La Illaha Illallah" (NO other god but GOD).

Do you pray Namaaz (SAlaat)?

Yes I do, as per the Quran. Although its not that easy to explain by mere words, I will, Insha-Allah, nevertheless try my best to explain it. Please give me some time to compile and perhaps ‘format’ my explanation. In the meantime, to get an educated guess, please visit www.submission.org. Remember, in my own understanding, I do not believe everything that the site has presented, many of its subjects do carry some weight. Probably, the best site that I’ve ever come across and this is how I became a true submitter, by GOD’s Will, Masha-Allah, Alhamdu-Lillah.

What do you base it on?

By envisioning the collective concept of GOD, HIS Creation (signs, provisions, miracles, past/present/future, revelations, prophets/messengers, etc.) and ofcourse the Quran. I negate the falsehood and ponder only upon the infallibility that surrounds me, such as my very own unimaginable being, the trees, the oceans, the sky, the birds, the animals, the fishes, the sun, the moon, the mountains, the solar system, the universe, the galaxy, the Milky Way, etc., etc.

Just to quote a ‘small wonder’ with my very own anecdote: "even if you pee on a plant, it will still bloom its own sweetness". Or another’s anecdote: "every rose has a thorn".

If Muhammad SAW was not last Rasool then do you have new one after him?

Remember, Muhammad was not the last ‘Rasool’, but the last ‘Nabi’. Perhaps many more messengers will, by GOD’s Will, come and go, to preach to the world the Oneness of GOD and correct some of the distortions and fabrications made by mankind in general, such as Rashad Khalifa.

A point to ponder: NO HUMAN BEING WAS/IS/WILL BE, INFALLIBLE!!!

PEACE.

[Danish]

Danish, the ignorant and lying bigot says :

" By the way there is no where in the Quran that says, "La Illaha Illallah, Muhammadur Rasoolallah".

47:19 La ilah illa allah
48:29 Muhammadun Rasulullah

Neither the 47:19 nor the 48;29 mentions what I quoted above IN BOLD AS ONE SENTENCE.

This is how Satan's representatives cherry-pick words/verses and thus distort and fabricate to take you out from lightness to darkness.

Surprisingly, they keep on coming back and this is what the Quran has to say about people like porus/brother who challenge GOD Almighty. They can NEVER WIN:
[7:17] "I will come to them from before them, and from behind them, and from their right, and from their left, and You will find that most of them are unappreciative".

[113:0] In the name of God, Most Gracious, Most Merciful
[113:1] Say, "I seek refuge in the Lord of daybreak.
[113:2] From the evils among His creations.
[113:3] From the evils of darkness as it falls.
[113:4] From the evils of the troublemakers.
[113:5] From the evils of the envious when they envy".

I TAKE REFUGE IN GOD FROM SATAN THE CURSED.

[Muslim First]

.
Br.Danish, Salaam

So your new messenger is "Rashad Khalifa"

I would love to find out Namaaz he has prescribed for you and on which Aya's of Quran he based it on.

Wasalaam
.

[qiyam]

Dear Danish,
A lesson in semantics...last nabi mean last of those who will bring news, info, messages from God. Rasullah mean one who brings a risalah or book (of messages or info) from God. You cannot bring a risalah without the ability to receive messages (wahi) from God. Therefore, if you cannot have a message to give....because Muhammad was the last receiver of messages (khatimun nabi) you cannot be a bringer of risalah (rasul).

Summation...you must first be a nabi in order to be a rasul.

[qiyam]

I should clarify being a shiah.

When I say "message"...I am referring to the laws, belief and rites of God. This is different from what messages or inspiration of directions come from Allah to Imams and people regarding clarifications on the established laws, belief and rites of Islam.

[Danish]

In the name of GOD, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.
I seek refuge in GOD from Satan the cursed.

Salaams:

It seems to me that I need to either baby-sit or hold your little fingers to perhaps explain the entire scenario. Let me make myself clear; I am not here to insist upon anyone to believe in whatever I have to say. I am conveying the message of Quran as I perceive it be, but then I could be wrong as well. I will, Insha-Allah, hold on to certain beliefs as I envision them to be logical based upon the facts and figures and the "tools" that GOD Almighty has bestowed upon me for HE is my witness and the Ultimate Judge.

To start with, on the context of the entire Quran and not just few words and verses here and there, I therefore conclude that Nabi means prophet and Rasool means messenger. While the word ‘risalah’ itself means book or scripture, the word ‘rasool’ itself means messenger. Thus risalah and rasool are two separate words.

I will, Insha-Allah, try to make it very simple, the rest is up to your own "level of perception", "depth of understanding" and the wisdom that you may have:
Point to Ponder: Concentrate upon the "MESSAGE" of the prophet/messenger and of the entire Quran, NOT the messenger or the book itself. If you cannot do that, then there lies no purpose of the messenger or the book.

Muhammad is dead (pbuh) but his message is not. Quran is a ‘printed book’ of Muhammad’s message revealed to him by Angel Gabriel. Assuming the Quran was never written, who would you obey TODAY, Muhammad or his message? One cannot possibly obey Muhammad because he is dead, but one can obey his message revealed to him, which is what Quran is all about. Thus GOD Almighty sends down HIS message not only via prophets and messengers, but also via many other divinely ways and means. According to the Quran, GOD didn’t send Adam a prophet nor any scripture, what was it then and how did Adam pray and supplicate to GOD then? If you do not take heed on the messenger’s message, then what is the point of obeying the messenger in the first place. Thus the messengers came, conveyed their messages and died. What they leave behind and what we have today (the Quran) is the essence of our belief. Anyone can claim messengership and anyone can claim a book to be authentic or divine? But haven't GOD given us the brains, eyes, ears, etc. to use, if one sincerely and truely wishes. The MAIN theme or epilogue of the message is one and the same; There is no god but GOD and to believe in HIM Alone.

Last but not least, I have neither witnessed nor I have personally known Muhammad or Rashad or any previous prophets/messengers for that matter, but I have certainly taken their messages very "seriously" to ponder upon in order for me to believe in GOD Alone.

Once again, remember: NO HUMAN BEING WAS/IS/WILL BE, INFALLIBLE!!!

PEACE.

[Khairan]

> COME BACK TO GOD ALONE BY UPHOLDING ONLY QURAN ALONE.

Danish,

this simply doesn't work. By saying this, you pretend that a person's understanding of anything (in this case religion) can be shaped by a single factor. However, how you think is tacitly affected by what you know, how you grew up and where, and what language you speak.

To read the Qur'an outside of the time in history when it was written and to divorce it from the rich oral tradition that surrounds early Islam is like reading it only in English - you simply deprive yourself of the full context. You are correct - the Qur'an is the core of Islam, the Message at its most essential. That doesn't mean that it is the only font of relevant knowledge, nor does it mean that we are capable of fully understanding it unless we draw on other sources to expand our minds.

Ritual in religion serves a very important purpose - it is only when we practice ritual for its own sake that it becomes meaningless.

salaam

[brother]

Say Danish,

You have been asked 3 times to explain - How you(Submitters) have come with your namaz & its time - I believe by muslim first. I am surprised that you said that "It is not very easy to explain". Still - no explanation.

Doesn't the quran say:
" It is plain & easy to understand" HQ

So- for a creed based on Quran alone. Why is it hard? The mathematics/numerology doesn't add up!!

Obviously, you know little about what you follow but have come here to PREACH to followers of Imam Jaffer Sadiq and interestingly you suggest that "you are not here to hold our hand".

Go home - man! All you have done is bark like a rabid dog and copy & paste.

[porus]

Danish, the submitter, a Rashad Khalifa cultist.

He probably lied about about entering a Hindu's house and destroying the idols. Now this cultist sets about to destroy Muhammad, whom he calls idol and entire cultural heritage of centuries of Muslim literati of every hue and color. Even the Taliban did not go beyond the dastardly destruction of the Bamiyan Buddha.

In this, the cult wants to do better than emulate Wahabis who descrated the Kaaba and the tomb of Muhammad.

Rashad Khalifa adulterated Quran by deleting the last two ayats of Sura Tauba, claiming that they are satanic innovations. He also translated 3rd ayat of Sura Yaseen as "You (Rashad) are from among the messengers". While Muslims interpret the ayat to refer to Muhammad.

Danish says Quran does not say the kalima in its entirety by having two sentences together. But the ayats of the Quran were not revealed in the order in which it is compiled for us. Most Muslims select passages from Quran freely to recite in their prayers.

Muhammad's life indeed is a message just as important as Quran. Muhammad himself said this. And kalima was recited at the time of Muhammad, with his complete approval.

Cultist make an idol of Rashad Khalifa and know not. They even have instructions on how to compile their "hadith".

Most Muslims are now aware of Rashad Khalifa cultists and wisely ignore them. Silly idea about near eastern numeral mythology presented as absolute truth, 19 times n, where n can be any number you select arbitrarily. Number of ayats in a sura, number of alifs in a sura and so on.

[Danish]

[18:57] Who are more evil than those who are reminded of their Lord's proofs, then disregard them, without realizing what they are doing. Consequently, we place shields on their hearts to prevent them from understanding it (the Quran), and deafness in their ears. Thus, no matter what you do to guide them, they can never ever be guided.