in that case none of the reformists will bother to reply. thanks!
the agenda is very simple:
the dai and his establishment must be fully accountable to the community. all accounts and actions must be transparent, honest and above board.
Excommunication is an Islam/Fatimid act. Read up your Fatimid texts if you claim to be a "Bohra".the dai and his establishment cannot intimidate and bully members and threaten with excommunication and denial of services and facilities.
Islam is NOT just for religious deeds, it's a way of life, and that includes everything. The Prophet was a part of every Muslims "secular lives", he even taught/commanded the followers how to go to the toilet! That is the deed of every Imam AS after the Prophet. Same thing.dai has no business in the secular lives of his followers, he is only a spiritual guide and should remain within that sphere only.
You consider yourself a "reformist Bohra", so do you believe the Nabi Sulaiman & Fatimid Imams living pomp incorrect?dai and his family should lead a life of simplicity and avoid pomp, show, glamour and ayyashi, whereby he and his family act as if they are blue blooded 'royals' and his subjects are treated as slaves.
dai's family has no role in the religious lives and routine of bohras.
The Fatimids did. Same system.they cannot demand to be treated as 'royals'.
Justice is being served.dai should act responsibly and resolve to prevent the present corruption, nepotism and abuse of authority in our community.
They function independantly under the guidance of the Leader. Just like the Fatimids did.dai should return the powers of each individual jamaat and let them function independently as was the practice before 51st dai.
i believe that the dai's office is neccessary to lead the bohra community, but purely as their spiritual and religious guide only, that it is the founding principle of a bohra's faith. but that does not mean that the dai cannot be held responsible and accountable. he is not above man-made or divine laws.
there goes the prize idiot again, chasing his own tail...!!!Adam wrote:
Which sect do you follow/authority and sources (because they sure aren't DB sources and authority!!)? Religion? Imam Ali? Fatimids?
Prophet was accountable over his preaching inspired from Quran, Prophet provided references from Quran before advising, guiding, instructing his followers, Prophet provided accounts of funds used/collected from the community. The word accountable is a neutral word. Allah doesn’t needs accounts, Imam doesn’t need accounts, Morever secluded Imam doesn’t need accounts. People who have pledged their beliefs, trust and faith in the leader require accounts to strengthen their trust in the leader.Adam wrote:The Dai is accountable only to his Leader the Imam. The Prophet was only accountable to Allah.
Rules of Islam is more important than that of Bohra Doctrines. Bohra faith is set of rules and regulations for organizing and managing people within ambit of Islam.Adam wrote:Excommunication is an Islam/Fatimid act. Read up your Fatimid texts if you claim to be a "Bohra".
This rule applies to one and all, Mullahs should practice what they preach ! Islam preaches equality of human kinds. Then why in bohra masjid / markaz are they segregated in the treatment (special passes, spaces and dining privileges) .Adam wrote:Islam is NOT just for religious deeds, it's a way of life, and that includes everything. The Prophet was a part of every Muslims "secular lives", he even taught/commanded the followers how to go to the toilet! That is the deed of every Imam AS after the Prophet. Same thing.
Where ? to whom ? Embezzlers and fraudsters still walking amongst us with respect and no remorse, that is what you call justice ?Adam wrote:Justice is being served.
You claim to be a Bohra (I think), but you don't stand for it's beliefs and practices.
Thus, concluding, either you Aren't a Bohra, you're lying, or just confused. Which sect do you follow/authority and sources (because they sure aren't DB sources and authority!!)? Religion? Imam Ali? Fatimids?
there goes the prize idiot again, chasing his own tail...!!!
Before harping on the fatimid imams just like your master who wants to legitimise his pompous and extravagant lifestyle by giving these examples out of context, just read their history and you will know that they were RULERS who governed provinces and by virtue of which they were required to maintain a certain decorum.
You claim to be a Bohra (I think), but you don't stand for it's beliefs and practices.
Thus, concluding, either you Aren't a Bohra, you're lying, or just confused. Which sect do you follow/authority and sources (because they sure aren't DB sources and authority!!)? Religion? Imam Ali? Fatimids?
you think that you should, but you cant, because YOU are the prize idiot chasing his own tail..!!Adam wrote:I should say the same to you.there goes the prize idiot again, chasing his own tail...!!!
Well, Al Zulfiqar? Are you going to keep running away?
There is a vast difference between hard earned/self acquired wealth and illgotten wealth derived after exploiting sentiments of gullible followers. If you want to debate on how the dai has acquired wealth thru illegitimate means then there are plenty of threads on this forum and you just need to surf them. By the way, please prove that the wealth of Suleman Nabi and fatimid imams were acquired by exploiting sentiments of their followers and imposing unarbitary taxes outside the realm of Islam.Adam wrote: "dai and his family should lead a life of simplicity and avoid pomp,". Where he doesn't want ANY POMP. Ruler or No Ruler. I just stated that living a wealthy life isn't an issue in accordance to Islamic beliefs.
And which idiot told you that? Any authentic references?humanbeing wrote:Prophet provided accounts of funds used/collected from the community.Adam wrote:The Dai is accountable only to his Leader the Imam. The Prophet was only accountable to Allah.
But Your entire existence is not based upon lies created by your Dai and you ask for authentic references. Can you give me ayah which says that hunting is haraam?anajmi wrote:Abde idiots shouldn't be asking for authentic references. Your entire existence is based upon lies created by your Dai and then you ask for authentic references?
Can you give me an authentic reference that says that your Dai is infallible? Can you quote an ayah from the Quran? I can show an ayah from the Quran that talks about people like your Dai who ask for money in the name or religion and then use it for their own luxurious living and are going to be punished for that. Do you want me to show you that ayah?
Instead of listening to fairy tales fed to you by your Dai you should pick up a book of the seerah of the prophet (saw). You might learn a few things about him and your worthless subserviant existence might derive some purpose.
profastian wrote:But Your entire existence is not based upon lies created by your Dai and you ask for authentic references. Can you give me ayah which says that hunting is haraam?anajmi wrote:Abde idiots shouldn't be asking for authentic references. Your entire existence is based upon lies created by your Dai and then you ask for authentic references?
Can you give me an authentic reference that says that your Dai is infallible? Can you quote an ayah from the Quran? I can show an ayah from the Quran that talks about people like your Dai who ask for money in the name or religion and then use it for their own luxurious living and are going to be punished for that. Do you want me to show you that ayah?
Instead of listening to fairy tales fed to you by your Dai you should pick up a book of the seerah of the prophet (saw). You might learn a few things about him and your worthless subserviant existence might derive some purpose.
the same idiot who said that dai is fallibleprofastian wrote:
And which idiot told you that?
when adam is cornered, he uses the following lame defenses, (in his own words):
1. you are childish
2. i will ignore
3. i only enter into 'serious' debates
4. you are a coward
5. you are a wahabi
6. you are not an abde
7. i am a 'true bohra' ...
And I'm sure nowhere in Fatemid texts you will find evidence to prove the infallibility of Dai.
The Quran says, obey Allah and obey the prophet (saw). The prophet (saw) has cursed the one who harms an animal for sport. The Quran says that the prophet (saw) does not speak out of his own but only that which is a command from Allah. Hence it can be safely concluded that hunting animals for sport is haraam in Islam.But Your entire existence is not based upon lies created by your Dai and you ask for authentic references. Can you give me ayah which says that hunting is haraam?
Dear Al Zulfiqar:
You claim to be a reformist?
What does that mean (in terms of beliefs and followings)?
Which religion does that belong to? Islam?
What is your belief in Imam Ali?
What is your belief in the Fatimid Imams AS and the Duats?
Which sources do you refer to for your understanding on Islam, Shari'at and its practices?
OR
Do you not have any belief? Please clarify that too?
Very simple. Don't dodge again.
if the true imam, who will verify himself, appears and declares that the reformists are his true followers
Dear Al Zulfiqar:
You claim to be a reformist?
What does that mean (in terms of beliefs and followings)?
Which religion does that belong to? Islam?
What is your belief in Imam Ali?
What is your belief in the Fatimid Imams AS and the Duats?
Which sources do you refer to for your understanding on Islam, Shari'at and its practices?
OR
Do you not have any belief? Please clarify that too?
Very simple. Don't dodge again.
since you do not have the intellectual capacity to use your own brains and independent judgement to read between the lines or arrive at sensible conclusions.
Dear Al Zulfiqar:
You claim to be a reformist?
What does that mean (in terms of beliefs and followings)?
Which religion does that belong to? Islam?
What is your belief in Imam Ali?
What is your belief in the Fatimid Imams AS and the Duats?
Which sources do you refer to for your understanding on Islam, Shari'at and its practices?
OR
Do you not have any belief? Please clarify that too?
Very simple. Don't dodge again.
