Page 6 of 7
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Sat Jul 29, 2006 8:48 pm
by accountability
NO you did not provide an ayah saying, that if you dont pray, you will be thrown in hell.
You did not refute, that why khulfa e rashdeen did not implement strict observance of rituals, as you and MF are suggesting.
You did not refute, that hazrat umer changed the laws of shariat, on circumtancial basis.
You did not refute, that yousuf ali mis translated ayah 112.002.
what you are repeating is only one vision, that you have. you can not bear a challange to your perception, as you subconciously agree, that this will not stand the test of logic. therefore you are rejecting all logics in favour of your percieved vision. Yours problem as well as majority of muslims problem is, they want an easy access to jannah, by observing some rituals, without knowing or understanding the true spirit of relgion. you do not find yourself daring enough to challange the tyranny and injustices, that these relgious dogmas carry.
To say the truth, and then believe in it, requires humungous courage, to stand up against dogmas and status quo is not an easy task. Prophet had the courage to challange the status quo and break the then relgious dogmas. But at that he was also shunned, abused, tortured and maltreated. But time proved him right.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Sat Jul 29, 2006 11:06 pm
by professor
It's too much.
Using the terms such as STUPID, STUPIDITY, IDIOT, FITNATI, FOOLISH against a debater doesn't suit a person of knowledge when he debates. And the most stunning thing is nobody comes on board to condemn the use of foul
language by Mr.ANajami. Not even the admistration intervenes. Very bad.
I request Accountability to stop it here. Let him impose his views on himself. Why do you carry it? If you have your self dignity, you shouldn't even speak to such an abusive person. And leave the board at once.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Sat Jul 29, 2006 11:26 pm
by professor
One more thing for Accountabilty, the word SAMAD means SOLID ,ok, but it further means FIRM, further firm is EVERLASTING and something which is everlasting is ETERNAL.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Sat Jul 29, 2006 11:29 pm
by professor
My answer is based on a dictionary by Dr. Ruhi Baalbaki.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2006 2:46 am
by anajmi
NO you did not provide an ayah saying, that if you dont pray, you will be thrown in hell.
Yes I did, not one but many. I produced Hazrat Ali's saying from the nahjul balagha and Br. Muslim First also gaves kothari references. You can go through this thread to see them.
You did not refute, that why khulfa e rashdeen did not implement strict observance of rituals, as you and MF are suggesting.
I have refuted you for everything, however I cannot refute you about the dreams that you have. One such dream was that the prophet's wife married after she died.
You did not refute, that hazrat umer changed the laws of shariat, on circumtancial basis.
Yes he did, he was in charge. He was the khalifa. What are you?
You did not refute, that yousuf ali mis translated ayah 112.002.
I produced at least 5 different translations which agree with Yusuf Ali and not one of them agreeing with you. So yes, I very much refuted that.
Even the professor agrees with Yusuf Ali. Now that has to count for something right?
By the way, I am still waiting for you to produce a single ayah of the quran that agrees with your point of view. Just one. If you produce that I will shut up and never argue with you.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2006 2:57 am
by anajmi
One typo
Read
I have refuted you for everything, however I cannot refute you about the dreams that you have. One such dream was that the prophet's wife married after she died.
as
I have refuted you for everything, however I cannot refute you about the dreams that you have. One such dream was that the prophet's wife married after he died.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2006 3:12 am
by anajmi
One other thing. It might appear to you that Yusuf Ali mistranslated because your reading abilities are not that one can be proud of. In fact I have shown many times that they are way below average. You might want to start working on that before commenting on works done by others.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2006 3:25 am
by tahir
Professor,
What is more important - exchanging ideas OR guarding a stupid alias from being called stupid?
If you believe in the latter, I'd say personal growth is not your priority.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2006 3:49 pm
by accountability
professor; Samad means solid. so why would a translator take upon himself to find the extended or hidden meaning of the word. His job should not be to translate by finding the exact match for the word he is translating.
How did yousuf ali know, that Allah by samad means eternal and not solid.
You are a professor of islamic history, pardon me if i am wrong. Can you elobrate, why did umer the 2nd caliph change the shariat. If we take his actions right, then the logical conclusion will be that, shariat is not a rigid, unchangable codes, rather may evlove accroding to time and space.
I agree with hazrat umer, that he could not have the hands of hungry masses chopped off, as they were trying to just meet their natural demands.
This notion, that islam provides all the answers to all the question for all times to come, is not justified by any quranic logic. Allah says, that this book contains guidance for human race, but did not prohibit evoloution.
99% of a staunch observant muslim's daily life differs that of prophets daily life fourteen hundred years ago. But not one mullah or ayatullah will deem it non islamic, or they can not dare declare it unislamic. Brushing teeth at the begining of the day is one such ritual, Prophet used to miswaak, but no one has termed brushing tooth, as un islamic. Miswaak was a fourteen hundred years old phenomenon, while brushing is contemprerory evoloution.
The natural law of justice, appreciates, that whatever is not forbidden is allowed. Suggestions do not carry panelties, and any act which is suggested is not an ordinance.
in a previous thread, I was discussing the limit of individual ownership allowed in islam. While islam puts no barrier on ownership or pocessions, does it mean, that an individual can own entire planet. Now here it begets one more argument, that though islam allows un limited ownership, but can a modern society allow or empower an individual, so as to be completely manupulated by an individual. Let the whole society be a hostage to one individual's whim.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2006 4:44 pm
by anajmi
accty,
How did yousuf ali know, that Allah by samad means eternal and not solid.
That is because he is way smarter than you are. A smart translator would be able to make a better guess about which synonym would make sense and where, taking into consideration all the factors like the attributes of the author, or what is being said in the entire work of the author.
By the way, please present a link as to where you found the meaning of samad as solid.
Brushing teeth at the begining of the day is one such ritual, Prophet used to miswaak, but no one has termed brushing tooth, as un islamic.
Right, no one has termed brushing teeth as un-Islamic. Although I am not sure how you, in your infinite wisdom, extrapolated that into - prayers are not mandatory or zakat is not mandatory or hajj is not mandatory or roza is not mandatory. Can someone else on this board please explain this logic?
Suggestions do not carry panelties, and any act which is suggested is not an ordinance.
I am assuming that you are saying here that prayer is just a suggestion and it is not neccessary. So can you produce a single ayah of the quran which supports your point of view? An ayah which says that praying is not mandatory and that it is just a suggestion, a nice to have? Just one ayah. Please, pretty please. You know if I had been in your place and if I hadn't been able to produce any evidence backing my belief even after being asked so many times, I would've been pretty ashamed of myself.
One other thing, I have presented a lot of ayahs which state the exact opposite. That not performing prayers would lead to hell fire. Hazrat Ali says the exact same thing in Nahjul Balagha.
in a previous thread, I was discussing the limit of individual ownership allowed in islam. While islam puts no barrier on ownership or pocessions, does it mean, that an individual can own entire planet. Now here it begets one more argument, that though islam allows un limited ownership, but can a modern society allow or empower an individual, so as to be completely manupulated by an individual. Let the whole society be a hostage to one individual's whim.
In that thread your query was answered by Br. Muslim First very well with references from the quran which you decided to brush aside as advisory in nature and nothing else. You've dismissed the laws of Allah as advises that need not be followed. You can do that, just that, you are not a muslim anymore.
Here is Br. Muslim First's reply
Br. AC
Islam does not forbid enormous wealth.
I understand two of Sahabas, who were relatives of Prophet SAW (By Marriage), were pretty well off. Islam requires you to make Halaal living. Pay your minimum dues (Stipulated Zakat) and do as you wish with your wealth. So long as you spend it in Halaal ways.
Qur’an has very strict sanction or warning for those who want to just amass wealth and count it. As in Sura 104
1 Woe to every slanderer and defamer,
2 who amasses wealth and keeps on counting it.
3 He thinks that his wealth will insure his status forever!
4 By no means! He shall be thrown into Hotamah.
5 What will make you understand what Hotamah is?
6 It is the fire kindled to a blaze by Allah Himself.
7 The one which will rise right to the hearts,
8 closing in upon them from every side
9 in outstretched columns.
It also has warned us not to pile up wealth in compaction with others as in Sura 102
1 O mankind, you have been distracted by the rivalry of piling up worldly gains against one another.
2 You will never be satisfied until you get into the grave.
3 Nevertheless, soon you shall come to know.
4Again, nevertheless, soon you shall come to know.
5 Nay! Would that you knew through the real knowledge provided to you in this Qur'an and care about your life in the Hereafter.
6 Because on the Day of Judgment when you shall see the hell,
7 and see it with the certainty of your own eyes
8- You shall believe it, but that belief is going to do you no good because - on that Day, you shall be questioned about the blessings (faculties and resources that you were given in the worldly life - as to how you used them?)
You must also read Sura al-Maun (107)
Here is list of Ayahs where Economic activities are referred
ECOMOMICS AND RELIGION
Q 62.9
Q16.116
Q11.87
Q24.37
7.10
ECONOMIC ACTIVITY WITHIN AN ISLAMIC FRAMEWORK
A: Affirmation of life and the pursuit of what is Good in it
Q 7.32
Q 31.20
Q 28.77
Q 67.15
Q 6.145
Q 16.114-115
B: The Happy Medium.
Q 7.31
Q 5.88
Q 2.168
Q 57.27
Q 6.141
Q 17-26-27
Q 25.67
Q3.180
C: The spirit of Economic effort
Q4.29
Q102.1-3
Q28.58
Q34.34-35
PRIVATE PROPERTY: ITS LIMITATIONS AND PURPOSES
Q4.7
Q36.71
Q61.11
Q24.27
Q51.19
PROTECTIONOF ECONOMIC RIGHTS
Q4.5-6
ECONOMIC DISTINCTIONS
Q6.165
Q16.71
Q42.12
SOCIO-ECONOMIC RESPONSIBILITIES
Q4.7-8
Q4.36
Q98.5
Q8.2-4
Q5.55
Q9.103
Q70.24-25
Q76.8-9
Q2.245
RECIPIENTS OF WELFARE DUE
Q9.60
LAWS OF INHERITANCE
Q4-11-12
Q4.176
ILLEGAL ECONOMIC ACTIVITIES
(a) Bribery and Deceit Q2.188
(b) Breach of Trust Q2.283 and Q3.161
(c) Misappropriating Orphans’ Property Q4.10
(d) Fraudulent Weights and Measures Q83.1-3
(e) Indecency, Pornography and Prostitution Q24.19 Q24.23
(f) Usury and Interest Q2.275 and Q2.278-280
(g) Hoarding Q104.1-4 and Q9.34
Discuss it if you wish.
Wasalaam
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2006 7:25 pm
by anajmi
Since we were discussing the meaning of the word samad, I came across this site, which is probably the site referred to by accountability for his twisted interpretation of the quran.
He did not post the complete message on the site and chose a few words to mislead us on this board. This is the link
Chapter on the Interpretation of al-Samad, Self-sufficient
Here is the complete sentence. The part that accountability chose to deceive us is in italics.
Al-Kulayni has said that this is the correct meaning of al-Samad but not what al-Mushabbihah (people who consider Allah similar to certain things) believe.
Al-Samad literally means solid as opposed to hallow which applies only to physical objects. Allah, the Most High, is far above such attributes. Had such attribute applied to Allah, the Most High, it would have contradicted with Allah’s statement that says, "There is nothing similar to Him."
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2006 8:39 pm
by accountability
Anajmi: you are like those people in pakistan, who, after failing to collect their debt, accuses the debtor of tauheen e risalat.
I did visit this site, or anyother site for meaning of samad, it is in arabic dictionery, if you can access any arabic to english dictionery, you can find the meaning of samad.
I have discussed this with allama syed mohd razi, he used to be our professor of islamic studies in university.
I do not use bragging attributes. You are no match for allama razi in knowledge and wisdom. But if you can believe, he was not able to satisfactorily answer, why shouldn't samad be translated as its original meaning.
He gave me a refrence from allama tabatabai's work and tafseer, but my question was unanswered, how could allama taba tabai translata samad as eternal, when it means solid.
The problem with you is, your whole research is google based. I would suggest, for thorough understanding and delibrations, you should read books on various subjeccts, so the devil in detail can be captured.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2006 8:40 pm
by accountability
please read did not instead of did.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2006 10:32 pm
by anajmi
accty,
Please do not consider yourself to be a scholar whose questions nobody can answer. You are just a scholar who cannot understand anybody's answers be that a simpleton like myself or a scholar like Allama Razi. I am absolutely certain Allama Razi must've given a satisfactory reply.
You want to capture the devil in the detail and still you fail to understand why samad was translated as eternal and not solid. Looks like you will need to read a few more books.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2006 10:54 pm
by anajmi
accty,
Can you give me the name of the dictionary that you are using? or a link to it?
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 12:34 am
by anajmi
I went to Barnes and Noble to look at Arabic English dictionaries and I found a couple but only one mentioned the word.
It is the Hippocrene Standard Dictionary by John Wortabet and Harvey Potter.
Here are the translations.
Samad - Solid.
As-samad - The Eternal.
The quran uses As-samad.
Now we have on one side,
Allama Razi who according to you is great in knowledge and wisdom, Yusuf Ali, Pickthal, Shakir, T.B. Irving, Khalifa, Sher Ali, J.M. Rodwell, the Ahmaddiya and even our very own professor and on the other side we have you.
I think it is pretty easy to figure out who is right and who is wrong. Only a person with an IQ either the same or lower than yours would be able to agree with you and finding such a person would be damn near impossible unless he decides to find us.
Please post the quranic ayahs that agree with you and please post the reference where you found the prophet's wife remarried after he died. Also post the name of the Arabic English dictionary that you are referring to.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 12:36 am
by accountability
Anajmi: I can not dare call myself even learned, let alone scholar, actually you are right, I should not be so obsitinate in my approach. Religion is even not area of my expertise, only my curiousity feeds me to find out the reality behind it. As I was always politically active that too on the left of it, through my experience, and information, i found religion being used as tool of exploitation by all dictators and manipulators. so i was trying to find more by digging in deeper, and the reason why religion is used as such.
I am not against relgion. I just want it to be used as saviour and not in opposite way. It should be a saviour in this world too, and for weak and hungry.
I am against the false attribution to relgion and god, mixing and matching one's own intrest with that of divine revelation.
I could not find any link arabic to english dictionery, when i tried to search the internet. there are links for english to arabic, but not vice versa.
the dictionery I used was published by feroz sons in pakistan .It was twenty five years ago, when I was first reading quranic translation, In urdu translation, samad was translated as be niyaz. I was curious, so i wanted to know the meaning of samad, that was why I bought that dictionery, I have asked my brother to look into my books in pakistan.
May be professor can confirm.
yes I remember, mododi saheb's tafheemul quran jild 2 deals with this. He has also interpreted samad, acknowledging, samad means solid, but this can not attributed to allah for reasons, and he has also quoted examples of daily usage of word samad, that it was also used for recourse. He has translated in urdu as be niyaz.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 12:38 am
by anajmi
This is your quote.
I do not use bragging attributes. You are no match for allama razi in knowledge and wisdom. But if you can believe, he was not able to satisfactorily answer, why shouldn't samad be translated as its original meaning.
Normally we quote big scholars when they agree with our point of view. You are the first person who actually quotes big scholars who didn't agree with your point of view. Is there something wrong with this picture?
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 12:40 am
by anajmi
accty,
I think we should end this debate now. The result is there for everyone to see.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 12:50 am
by anajmi
i found religion being used as tool of exploitation by all dictators and manipulators. so i was trying to find more by digging in deeper, and the reason why religion is used as such.
So you decided to find issues with religion itself rather than with those dictators and manipulators!! Don't you think you are just the same as those dictators and manipulators and nothing else?
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 1:02 am
by professor
Account.
The term five pillars of Islam as a whole is confuses you, I guess. Experts began to call them as pillars of Islam as they were the most important tenets of Islam though Quran itself isn't specific about the term. Some people have taken it for granted saying doing only them is enough.
Please. Try to understand.
Let's forget the term FIVE PILLARS OF ISLAM. Let's put it in this way:
Some commands of Quran are must. None can go away with them if he or she is a muslim.
They include:
1. Iman, Sawm, Hajj, Zakat, Salah according to sunnis.
2. Vilaya, Sawm, Hajj, Zakat, Salah, Taharat, Jihad, Khums according to MOST of shias.
3. All other commands:
To do such as helping poor, orphan, slaves; Bearing patience; Being steadfast; Preaching tuth; Doing justice etc.
4. All other commands where we have been commanded not to do:
Such as doing Gibat; backbiting; cheating; Eating away shares of others; Piling of wealth ; YUKADHIBO BI DIN falsifying His Din etc.
In all above four points, Quran often says us to do them MANDATORILY and if done then only one is rewarded and not done then is WAILILEKULLE (woe to all those). All the muslims Shias, Sufis, Sunnis, all and sundry agree on them (Except on WILAYA, TAHARA, KHUMS)and treat them as MANDATORY and not SUGGESTIVE. You have to do them. That's why all the muslims of the world whether they are shias or sunnis perform salah, do sawm, hajj, give zakat. How to do is a different matter but YOU HAVE TO DO.
Ask any sheikh or allama or mulla.
Even our own syedna's diehard enemies can't deny the fact that he always does and preaches all bohras to do those basics which are must in islam. It may be Zahiri or batini in its meaning but the fact remains that we all do perform.
II part:
Most of Mecca suras deal with all the above four points.
Medini suras mainly deals with governance, laws for islam which are mainly political in its nature, legal distribution of wealth etc.
I believe, again I say I BELIEVE that changes in above is not punishable after death though you are expected to follow. Not only Umar but our own Imams during their rule in Egypt didn't get the hands chopped off of a thief. It tells that they are SUGGESTIVE. That's why a country such as Pakistan is an Islamic country yet it's not incumbent upon it to implement those laws which are very much political in nature.
Thus dear forget about the political part and look at only the spiritual part of Islam .
As we reopen, friends, I may not be able to come on board. I will miss you all.
All the best. Nice to be with you all.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 1:34 am
by anajmi
professor,
I apologize for asking but re-open what? You shouldn't say that you won't be coming back. We need people like you on this board. Won't you have access to a PC and the internet?
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 1:36 am
by anajmi
professor,
You said you were a professor of humanities in the middle east. Can you describe briefly what it is that you do?
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 2:03 am
by professor
Br. Anajmi,
I am so sorry, I don't want to reveal my identity.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 3:00 am
by anajmi
professor,
I wasn't actually asking you to reveal your identity. Just the nature of your work. But that is ok.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 11:46 am
by Muslim First
Br. AC
AS
I think your post about Shrat Ikhlas is a diversionary tactic. You just do not want to confess that you made mistake when you said two=ice that Prophets widow remarried,
And how about posting Ayah from Qur’an?
As far as Yusuf Ali’s translation of samad is concerned, did you ever read his comments about it.
Let’s see:
Yusuf Ali:
112:2 Allah the Eternal Absolute; 6298
6298 Samad is difficult to translate by one word. I have used two, "Eternal" and "Absolute". The latter implies: (1) that absolute existence can only be predicated of Him; all other existence is temporal or conditional; (2) that He is dependent on no person or things, but all persons or things are dependent on Him, thus negating the idea of gods and goddesses who ate and drank, wrangled and plotted, depended on the gifts of worshippers, etc. (112.2)
Muhammad Asad: Translates:
112:2 “ God the eternal, the uncaused cause of all being. (1)
(1) This rendering gives no more than an approximate meaning of the term as-samad, which occurs in Qur’an only once, and is applied, to God alone. It comprises the concept of Primary Causes and eternal, independent Being, combined with the idea that everything existing of conceivable goes back to Him as its source and is, therefore, dependent on Him for its beginning as well as for its continued existence.
N,J Dawood: Translates:
112:2 The Eternal God.
Picthall: Translates:
112:2 Allah, the eternally besought of all!
Maudidi: English translators of Maudadi’s Urdu work:
112:2 Allah is independent of all and all are dependant on Him.
Word-by-Word translation of Qur’an Complied by DARUSSALAM
As-samad = the Self-Sufficient
Malik: Translates:
112:2 Allah is the Self-Sufficient (independent of all, while all are dependent on Him);
In the Shade of Qur’an- Sayid Qutub:
112:2 the Eternal, Absolute.
Tafsir Ibn Kathir
Allah As-Samad: ‘Ikrimah reported that Ibn Abbas said, “This means the one Who all of creation depends upon for their needs and their requestsâ€
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 9:59 pm
by Anwar
Its a pity that we muslims are still in this 21st century,fighting and cannot agree on our differences, between shia /sunni/wahabi/ and god knows what other factions.
Its a pity, because we all belive in the same Prophet,in the same Quran, and yet we fight like cats and dogs and even kill each other in the name of religion, the same religion that we follow.
No wonder the jews, who are just a minor percantage of us, are beating the shit out of muslims.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 11:29 pm
by accountability
Professor: Anajmi is right, we need people like you on this board. I dont know, what to do to keep you coming back. I shall request you not to leave this board.
I am really thankful to you, anajmi, mf, and others. every day on this board I am learning.
Well, beacuse of you guys, I am really re thinking, about rituals of namaz etc. I did think, that these rituals are not mandatory, as they were only suggested in quran. well my take was, that, as there was no penalty for non observance, then it is not mandatory.
I am re thinking about it. But professor, it is happening, because i am discussing it with people on this board. So, if you were not here, anajmi was not here, mf was not here, I would not be able to discuss this.
As I have time and again said, that I do perform these rituals, and quiet regularly.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 11:44 pm
by anajmi
Anwar,
My message has always been, love both, Hazrat Ayesha and Hazrat Ali. That is the message of the quran. Who is it that wants to continue the hatred? Let us look deep within ourselves, before we start blaming others.
Muslims are getting butchered because they either lack or have given up their faith in Allah, his message and his messenger. They are afraid more of Israel and America than of Allah. Even after all the killings in Lebanon, they still think that America is the only country that can get a cease fire. This is the state of the muslim slave today.
Re: Why do Shias hate Bukhari so much
Posted: Tue Aug 01, 2006 1:15 am
by Average Bohra
Originally posted by anajmi:
Anwar,
Muslims are getting butchered because they either lack or have given up their faith in Allah, his message and his messenger.
I challenge you to stand in front of the Lebanese families and spew this anti-Muslim venom. Tell them that they lost their sons, daughters or parents because they somehow
either lack or have given up their faith in Allah, his message and his messenger. All the while moving your family to the US and taking advantage of the benefits we provide. They have the balls to stay where they are and bear the brunt of your self-serving preaching and wimpy hollow words. They don’t need your advice; they need you to move your family into the same bunkers that the missiles are being fired from. Then they want you to stand on crushed concrete and tell them that you will fight for them, and how you love Allah more than they do, and then let the Hezbollah deal with you.
they still think that America is the only country that can get a cease fire Why not ? Should they rely on Wahabis in Michigan ? Saudis ? Kuwaitis ? Syrians ? Iranians? Pakistanis ? Egyptians ? Most of them have been bought, just like you,
Originally posted by anajmi:
Even after all the killings in Lebanon, they still think that America is the only country that can get a cease fire. This is the state of the muslim slave today.
You are the slave. They are fighting the fight…… What is the alternative you provide ? Are they mistaken ? Are the Wahabis lined up at the Lebanese border ready to defend them, or have the moved to the US with their families and posting messages in chat rooms ?
Never mind...I forget....they don't have faith in Allah like you do. If that is a gauge of faith in your imbecilic and primitive thinking, Israelis have more faith in Allah than all Muslims combined.