Dear Anajmi,
Hunting if for food or trade is allowed Islamically. The registered gaming parks in Africa sell these animals to the persons shooting them...this is trade. It is no different than the zabiha butcher killing sheep to potentially sell to a customer. The meat, that is not taken from the hunt, is then given away for free to poor of the area. Hunting in a gaming park is different than just pouching.
The so-called hunting trip.
-
Muslim First
- Posts: 6893
- Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
.
Br. qiyam wrote
"---Actually, rich muminin in Dars Salam footed the bill to take the Dai and his son's on the excursion. It was also rich muminin who begged Maulana (tus) to come back to Dars Salam. So you ask..what does my conscience tell me?? If my fellow brother in faith asked me to go on a trip, doing something I enjoy, and he would foot the bill...why in my right mind would I refuse??? What would you say?"
OK so rich muminin of Dars Salam requested Maulana to come back. Did these rich muminin of Dars Salam gave some thing more then just travel expenses?
I bet Maulana and his managers extracted maximum price for his trip. Do you agree or not?
Unlike other religious leaders, Syedana does not go where people need him but goes to places where he gets paid most.
.
Br. qiyam wrote
"---Actually, rich muminin in Dars Salam footed the bill to take the Dai and his son's on the excursion. It was also rich muminin who begged Maulana (tus) to come back to Dars Salam. So you ask..what does my conscience tell me?? If my fellow brother in faith asked me to go on a trip, doing something I enjoy, and he would foot the bill...why in my right mind would I refuse??? What would you say?"
OK so rich muminin of Dars Salam requested Maulana to come back. Did these rich muminin of Dars Salam gave some thing more then just travel expenses?
I bet Maulana and his managers extracted maximum price for his trip. Do you agree or not?
Unlike other religious leaders, Syedana does not go where people need him but goes to places where he gets paid most.
.
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Qiyam,
""The Law of the Jungle"...this is an darwining law...which has yet to be proven."
You are confusing the Law of the Jungle with Darwin's evolutionary theory. I am speaking in terms of "survival of the fittest" and going down the food chain, one specie hunting another (for food) just as nature intended. I am personally against hunting, but respect another's right to do so. Getting back to the point...
"Firstly, what you call taxes are things required by Islam..not the Dai. Allah says to pay the zakat and khums."
You have disagreed with pretty much everyone on this board regarding this. Your assumption is that this money can be used for personal family wealth accumulation because Allah says to pay it but not how to spend it. My conscience says ...wrong. No quotes or proof needed.
"So you ask..what does my conscience tell me?? If my fellow brother in faith asked me to go on a trip, doing something I enjoy, and he would foot the bill...why in my right mind would I refuse??? What would you say? "
This question was in reference to the Dai going on the trip, not you or I personally. Hell if they paid for your trip, I would ask you to take me along
...but I can afford my own, and do not like freebies. Getting back to the Dai, in his position perhaps he should ask these generous mumineen to sponsor a child's college tuition, support a family in need, instead of accepting the freebies. Again, a matter of principal, ...and consciece, and I do not need any proof that you may provide otherwise.
Peace...
""The Law of the Jungle"...this is an darwining law...which has yet to be proven."
You are confusing the Law of the Jungle with Darwin's evolutionary theory. I am speaking in terms of "survival of the fittest" and going down the food chain, one specie hunting another (for food) just as nature intended. I am personally against hunting, but respect another's right to do so. Getting back to the point...
"Firstly, what you call taxes are things required by Islam..not the Dai. Allah says to pay the zakat and khums."
You have disagreed with pretty much everyone on this board regarding this. Your assumption is that this money can be used for personal family wealth accumulation because Allah says to pay it but not how to spend it. My conscience says ...wrong. No quotes or proof needed.
"So you ask..what does my conscience tell me?? If my fellow brother in faith asked me to go on a trip, doing something I enjoy, and he would foot the bill...why in my right mind would I refuse??? What would you say? "
This question was in reference to the Dai going on the trip, not you or I personally. Hell if they paid for your trip, I would ask you to take me along
...but I can afford my own, and do not like freebies. Getting back to the Dai, in his position perhaps he should ask these generous mumineen to sponsor a child's college tuition, support a family in need, instead of accepting the freebies. Again, a matter of principal, ...and consciece, and I do not need any proof that you may provide otherwise.Peace...
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
As the matter of conscience has been brought up, I'd like to ask a somewhat tangential question here:
If you do something which you consider morally wrong, but in fact the act is not haraam, have you still committed a crime?
Basically, is it inherently wrong (Islamically speaking and otherwise) for someone act against their conscience, even if that act is not an immoral one?
If you do something which you consider morally wrong, but in fact the act is not haraam, have you still committed a crime?
Basically, is it inherently wrong (Islamically speaking and otherwise) for someone act against their conscience, even if that act is not an immoral one?
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Qiyam
You are a disgrace to humanity. You are lacking not only religious knowledge but on top of that intelligent.
Where did Allah swt say you could hunt wild animal for trade? Are you starting a new religion?? Next you will be saying we can sell drugs for trading purpose!
Use your brain and stop lying in this holy month lest your fast becomes null and void.
----
Dear Anajmi,
Hunting if for food or trade is allowed Islamically. The registered gaming parks in Africa sell these animals to the persons shooting them...this is trade. It is no different than the zabiha butcher killing sheep to potentially sell to a customer. The meat, that is not taken from the hunt, is then given away for free to poor of the area. Hunting in a gaming park is different than just pouching.
You are a disgrace to humanity. You are lacking not only religious knowledge but on top of that intelligent.
Where did Allah swt say you could hunt wild animal for trade? Are you starting a new religion?? Next you will be saying we can sell drugs for trading purpose!
Use your brain and stop lying in this holy month lest your fast becomes null and void.
----
Dear Anajmi,
Hunting if for food or trade is allowed Islamically. The registered gaming parks in Africa sell these animals to the persons shooting them...this is trade. It is no different than the zabiha butcher killing sheep to potentially sell to a customer. The meat, that is not taken from the hunt, is then given away for free to poor of the area. Hunting in a gaming park is different than just pouching.
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Morality, haraaam and criminal behavior are all relative to a specific society, religion, and country, respectively, therefore, the answers have to be taken in that context.
1."If you do something which you consider morally wrong, but in fact the act is not haraam, have you still committed a crime?"
If the act is morally wrong, but not haraam, the criminality aspect depends on where you live. Example: Marrying 4 women or having sex with a 10 year old bride in the US, then yes. In Pakistan or Saudi Arabia, then no.
"Basically, is it inherently wrong (Islamically speaking and otherwise) for someone act against their conscience, even if that act is not an immoral one? "
Yes, specific again to "my" sense of wrong and right (conscience) which I hold in much higher regard than generally accepted morality, criminal laws or haraam (religious) behavior. Laws generally are the lowest common denominator, and hopefully one does not judge their behavior based on the criminality or religious aspect.
An excellent question, Khairan.
1."If you do something which you consider morally wrong, but in fact the act is not haraam, have you still committed a crime?"
If the act is morally wrong, but not haraam, the criminality aspect depends on where you live. Example: Marrying 4 women or having sex with a 10 year old bride in the US, then yes. In Pakistan or Saudi Arabia, then no.
"Basically, is it inherently wrong (Islamically speaking and otherwise) for someone act against their conscience, even if that act is not an immoral one? "
Yes, specific again to "my" sense of wrong and right (conscience) which I hold in much higher regard than generally accepted morality, criminal laws or haraam (religious) behavior. Laws generally are the lowest common denominator, and hopefully one does not judge their behavior based on the criminality or religious aspect.
An excellent question, Khairan.
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Hunting if for food or trade is allowed Islamically.
Even if one were to buy this argument, Sayedna does not travel thousands of miles and wasting thousands of dollars of the community's money to (one would hope) satisfy his desire for elephant stew or to trade in elephant products. His primary motive is hunting for pleasure, so this argument is BS. What happens to the animal afterwards is a matter of convenience for disposal.
It is not true that Islam allows for the senseless killing of endangered animals. Verse 6/38 talks of animals being communities like ours and there are countless traditions which warn against cruelty to animals:
<a href="http://www.themodernreligion.com/an_mai ... ain.htm</a>
Even if one were to buy this argument, Sayedna does not travel thousands of miles and wasting thousands of dollars of the community's money to (one would hope) satisfy his desire for elephant stew or to trade in elephant products. His primary motive is hunting for pleasure, so this argument is BS. What happens to the animal afterwards is a matter of convenience for disposal.
It is not true that Islam allows for the senseless killing of endangered animals. Verse 6/38 talks of animals being communities like ours and there are countless traditions which warn against cruelty to animals:
<a href="http://www.themodernreligion.com/an_mai ... ain.htm</a>
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Qiyam
you talk of islamic taxes and so on in nairobi we pay a new tax for "gunha maf" i.e money to forgive your sins this amount is fixed by the mafia jamat officers so am i right to deduce that by paying this money your sins are forgiven and does the dai have the right to forgive sins or is that allahs task!
Hunting is not cool when you procalim to be a religeoes leader which ever way you look at it he is clearly out of touch with the world and maybe should pay more attention to community needs then galavant around the world.
Alos the qarza hassanat fund is onl;y for the rich when has a poor east african bihra benefitted from this fund its impossible to get anything from it and if youi give your jewely as security chances are it will be stolen or replicas madewhen you pay back the loan this has happpened in nairobi to so many people.
you talk of islamic taxes and so on in nairobi we pay a new tax for "gunha maf" i.e money to forgive your sins this amount is fixed by the mafia jamat officers so am i right to deduce that by paying this money your sins are forgiven and does the dai have the right to forgive sins or is that allahs task!
Hunting is not cool when you procalim to be a religeoes leader which ever way you look at it he is clearly out of touch with the world and maybe should pay more attention to community needs then galavant around the world.
Alos the qarza hassanat fund is onl;y for the rich when has a poor east african bihra benefitted from this fund its impossible to get anything from it and if youi give your jewely as security chances are it will be stolen or replicas madewhen you pay back the loan this has happpened in nairobi to so many people.
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Dear MuslimFirst,
Actually, no he goes where he is called by the people.
Dear Muddai,
Darwin's theory include "survival of the fittest" as the reason for evolution.
Regarding zakat and khums, I disagree because you all are basing your entire argument on your opinion...not what the Prophet taught.
Regarding the trip...why is it ok for you and I to be treated to a trip and not the Dai? What people do with their money is up to them and Allah judgement. It is not for me to tell them what is morally right or not. It's not my money. Oh and by the way..they do sponsor children's tuition to Jamia and other colleges...but again...that's none of your business...just as it's none of my business what charitable thing you do with your money.
Dear Khairan,
Morality is totally subjective...that is why I based my argument on known proofs. What we call moral today was immoral 50 years ago.
Dear Jinx,
Correct me please, but keep your opinion of me to yourself. By just making empty claims and names of me...doesn't help you any.
Dear Muslim,
There many hadiths allowing game hunting. It is you who call it a sport or not. Either way...gaming hunting is not cruel by any measure. Once shot, the animal must by put down immediately.
Dear Mo,
I haven't heard of the "tax" you describe. Regarding Qardhana Hasanah...if in fact only the rich are receiving it...is that a problem with your amil or with the fund?
Actually, no he goes where he is called by the people.
Dear Muddai,
Darwin's theory include "survival of the fittest" as the reason for evolution.
Regarding zakat and khums, I disagree because you all are basing your entire argument on your opinion...not what the Prophet taught.
Regarding the trip...why is it ok for you and I to be treated to a trip and not the Dai? What people do with their money is up to them and Allah judgement. It is not for me to tell them what is morally right or not. It's not my money. Oh and by the way..they do sponsor children's tuition to Jamia and other colleges...but again...that's none of your business...just as it's none of my business what charitable thing you do with your money.
Dear Khairan,
Morality is totally subjective...that is why I based my argument on known proofs. What we call moral today was immoral 50 years ago.
Dear Jinx,
Correct me please, but keep your opinion of me to yourself. By just making empty claims and names of me...doesn't help you any.
Dear Muslim,
There many hadiths allowing game hunting. It is you who call it a sport or not. Either way...gaming hunting is not cruel by any measure. Once shot, the animal must by put down immediately.
Dear Mo,
I haven't heard of the "tax" you describe. Regarding Qardhana Hasanah...if in fact only the rich are receiving it...is that a problem with your amil or with the fund?
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MOHD HUSSAIN
- Posts: 443
- Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2001 4:01 am
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Br Qiyam: you wrote- "Oh and by the way..they do sponsor children's tuition to Jamia and other colleges...but again...that's none of your business" -You enjoy defending Syedna & Kothar at any cost even if you have to lie & give morally wrong statements or references !Which other colleges do they support,please give me the list & the recepients!& you heard what is going on with your Karze haasna fund from Mo & Jariwala! You love to say "ALLAH SAYS OR ALLAH DIRECTS US" Looks like your Allah is different than rest of us! Atleast my Allah leads me to the moral path which is more or less standardized for all human beings & not for a few chosen bohras like you!
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Dear Mhd. Hussain,
Before calling me lier...please prove it so. I myself give money (though not enough for person to go through entirely) to fellow bohra to help them. I know many others that do this. It is wrong for you to make negative statements with absolute no proof. Let me reverse your statement. You will do anything to liabel and defame Sayedna..whether lying or not.
If you don't believe my statements...prove me wrong. But don't assume. And regarding Allahs statements...I can back mine up with actual ayats...you can't..so I am not sure what God you follow..maybe the Mhd. Hussain God.
Before calling me lier...please prove it so. I myself give money (though not enough for person to go through entirely) to fellow bohra to help them. I know many others that do this. It is wrong for you to make negative statements with absolute no proof. Let me reverse your statement. You will do anything to liabel and defame Sayedna..whether lying or not.
If you don't believe my statements...prove me wrong. But don't assume. And regarding Allahs statements...I can back mine up with actual ayats...you can't..so I am not sure what God you follow..maybe the Mhd. Hussain God.
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
"...why is it ok for you and I to be treated to a trip and not the Dai?"
You can't have it both ways, either he is just like us or he is not. It is not OK for him because you and I don't speak to hidden Imams, lead the faith of one million Bohris, people don't line up to kiss your feet or mine, and more importantly Allah hasn't sanctioned us to receive taxes and do whatever we please.
Again, it is not his money ! Just as the taxes you pay into a political system.
I can already tell this is going nowhere.
You can't have it both ways, either he is just like us or he is not. It is not OK for him because you and I don't speak to hidden Imams, lead the faith of one million Bohris, people don't line up to kiss your feet or mine, and more importantly Allah hasn't sanctioned us to receive taxes and do whatever we please.
Again, it is not his money ! Just as the taxes you pay into a political system.
I can already tell this is going nowhere.
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Yo faggot,
""Wow ! You seem to attempt a twisted recollection of history ! ""are you saying this because it is not explicitly prohibited in the quran, or is it explicitly allowed in the quran?"
Get a brain Scarecrow....."or is it explicitly allowed in the quran?" ""
This is what happens to those whose ass pains through too much of you know what!! They start spewing shit through their mouths.
Kicking a faggots ass is not explicitly prohibited in the quran and in fact it is explicitly allowed too. But then what is the point in kicking an ass that has taken a lot in any case?
""Wow ! You seem to attempt a twisted recollection of history ! ""are you saying this because it is not explicitly prohibited in the quran, or is it explicitly allowed in the quran?"
Get a brain Scarecrow....."or is it explicitly allowed in the quran?" ""
This is what happens to those whose ass pains through too much of you know what!! They start spewing shit through their mouths.
Kicking a faggots ass is not explicitly prohibited in the quran and in fact it is explicitly allowed too. But then what is the point in kicking an ass that has taken a lot in any case?
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
"But then what is the point in kicking an ass that has taken a lot in any case? "
""are you saying this because it is explicitly allowed in the quran?"
""are you saying this because it is explicitly allowed in the quran?"
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Brother Qiyam,
I am not sure if you answered my question cause I cannot find it in all the shitty mess the faggots created. If you have, please be kind enough to post it again.
I am not sure if you answered my question cause I cannot find it in all the shitty mess the faggots created. If you have, please be kind enough to post it again.
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
GodBless,
Yep, Quran says forgiving is better, even if it concerns people like you and the faggot.
Yep, Quran says forgiving is better, even if it concerns people like you and the faggot.
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Brother Qiyam,
Found your reply. Please tell me what you mean when you say hunting is allowed for trade. What kind of trade.
If I were to pay someone to be able to hunt an animal, do you classify that as trade?
Found your reply. Please tell me what you mean when you say hunting is allowed for trade. What kind of trade.
If I were to pay someone to be able to hunt an animal, do you classify that as trade?
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Yo faggot,
You didn't answer my question about the number of civilians killed by your white masters amongst 40 million, i.e. 40,000,000 (in case you can't count over 3000)
You didn't answer my question about the number of civilians killed by your white masters amongst 40 million, i.e. 40,000,000 (in case you can't count over 3000)
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
it is not explicitly prohibited in the quran, Scarecrow.
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Dear Anajmi,
Killing for trade is defined as killing for the sake of selling meat or an indirect function of selling an animal to be killed (whether for sport or not).
In the US, animals are killed by the hundreds of thousands daily for the sake of possibility selling the meat to a customer. It is the same in other countries as well, whether via zabiha or not. Whatever is not sold is either given away or trashed (in the US the meat must be trashed).
So how does this relate to hunting. Hunters kill animal; most for the meat...other for the sake of hunting. In gaming parks, those that don't take the meat, the meat is given to the locals (either free or sold). The intention throughout is selling an animal to be killed and then meat sold again.
This is not an issue of killing endangered animal or not...the gaming park owns the animal (elephant for example)..with the sold intention of killing it; they're just selling the rights to others to kill it. If it is issue of not killing the endangered animal...then the gov't should not have given the right to the gaming park to kill the animal. This part is regarding morality/ethics and is a totally subjective issue.
Killing for trade is defined as killing for the sake of selling meat or an indirect function of selling an animal to be killed (whether for sport or not).
In the US, animals are killed by the hundreds of thousands daily for the sake of possibility selling the meat to a customer. It is the same in other countries as well, whether via zabiha or not. Whatever is not sold is either given away or trashed (in the US the meat must be trashed).
So how does this relate to hunting. Hunters kill animal; most for the meat...other for the sake of hunting. In gaming parks, those that don't take the meat, the meat is given to the locals (either free or sold). The intention throughout is selling an animal to be killed and then meat sold again.
This is not an issue of killing endangered animal or not...the gaming park owns the animal (elephant for example)..with the sold intention of killing it; they're just selling the rights to others to kill it. If it is issue of not killing the endangered animal...then the gov't should not have given the right to the gaming park to kill the animal. This part is regarding morality/ethics and is a totally subjective issue.
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MOHD HUSSAIN
- Posts: 443
- Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2001 4:01 am
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Br Qiyam;You still did not answer my question about which colleges Syedna donates- I didn't question your donation !So this is the point tthat you make some nonsensical statements & don't provide any proofs or support!
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Brother Qiyam,
Are you saying that the meat of the elephant that Syedna slaughter is distributed to people for consumption? Does Syedna pay for the elephant that he slaughters?
Yo faggot,
I didn't ask if it was allowed, cause I know you know jack shit about what is allowed and what is not. I just asked for a number, apparently you wouldn't know, cause to know you'd have to be able to count more than 3000, which you cannot!!
Are you saying that the meat of the elephant that Syedna slaughter is distributed to people for consumption? Does Syedna pay for the elephant that he slaughters?
Yo faggot,
I didn't ask if it was allowed, cause I know you know jack shit about what is allowed and what is not. I just asked for a number, apparently you wouldn't know, cause to know you'd have to be able to count more than 3000, which you cannot!!
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Qiyam has changed The Trading part to killing animals for supporting Parks that provide avenue for Games. In another word if the park is providing whoring, drugs and alcoholic drink..Qiyam said we must participate in order support such trades. Can't really think of anyone who is that stupid/ignorant.
Qiyam, Does your Dai share the same understanding?
Dare I hope your Dai Burhanuddin know a little bit about Islam and the teaching of our holy Prophet?
Qiyam, Does your Dai share the same understanding?
Dare I hope your Dai Burhanuddin know a little bit about Islam and the teaching of our holy Prophet?
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Dear Mhd. Hussain,
Sayedna donates yearly to the Jamiya as well as to many of the poorer madrassa. Money is also given to private islamic universities. These moneies are always reports in akbars.
And actually I did answer your question...you even quoted my answer. You did not clarify wanting specifics.
Dear Anajmi
"Are you saying that the meat of the elephant that Syedna slaughter is distributed to people for consumption? Does Syedna pay for the elephant that he slaughters?"
---distribution of the meat to locals in a standard practice for gaming parks. Some parks will leave part of the carcus for scavenger animals in the park to eat. I believe the elephant (as well as the trip) is sponsored by a family in Dars Salam...though I have no proof for this. I assume this because this is what happened last year.
Dear Jinx,
"Qiyam has changed The Trading part to killing animals for supporting Parks that provide avenue for Games. In another word if the park is providing whoring, drugs and alcoholic drink..Qiyam said we must participate in order support such trades. Can't really think of anyone who is that stupid/ignorant."
---Actually, your statement and correlation is pretty stupid on it own. What of my statements led you believe of the correlation??? Hunting is allowed in Islam...whoring, drugs, alcohol are haram. My statement for supporting trade was solely based on the topic at hand, hunting, not a general statement. I thought I made the abundantly CLEAR.
Sayedna donates yearly to the Jamiya as well as to many of the poorer madrassa. Money is also given to private islamic universities. These moneies are always reports in akbars.
And actually I did answer your question...you even quoted my answer. You did not clarify wanting specifics.
Dear Anajmi
"Are you saying that the meat of the elephant that Syedna slaughter is distributed to people for consumption? Does Syedna pay for the elephant that he slaughters?"
---distribution of the meat to locals in a standard practice for gaming parks. Some parks will leave part of the carcus for scavenger animals in the park to eat. I believe the elephant (as well as the trip) is sponsored by a family in Dars Salam...though I have no proof for this. I assume this because this is what happened last year.
Dear Jinx,
"Qiyam has changed The Trading part to killing animals for supporting Parks that provide avenue for Games. In another word if the park is providing whoring, drugs and alcoholic drink..Qiyam said we must participate in order support such trades. Can't really think of anyone who is that stupid/ignorant."
---Actually, your statement and correlation is pretty stupid on it own. What of my statements led you believe of the correlation??? Hunting is allowed in Islam...whoring, drugs, alcohol are haram. My statement for supporting trade was solely based on the topic at hand, hunting, not a general statement. I thought I made the abundantly CLEAR.
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MOHD HUSSAIN
- Posts: 443
- Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2001 4:01 am
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Br Qiyam: You wrote"Sayedna donates yearly to the Jamiya as well as to many of the poorer madrassa. Money is also given to private islamic universities. These moneies are always reports in akbars". & "I believe the elephant (as well as the trip) is sponsored by a family in Dars Salam...though I have no proof for this. I assume this because this is what happened last year."You agreed you DON"T have the proof so why do you keep lying ?Which universities? Which MAdressas? Which Akhbar? Last chance for you to tell the truth!
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Brother Qiyam,
Is it ok for the Syedna to ask somebody (say the park officers) else to slaughter the animal and distribute the meat.
If the sole purpose of the hunting is for trade then this is the right thing to do.
But I am assuming that trade is not the sole purpose. Recreation is the sole purpose of hunting the animal and it doesn't matter what you do with the animal later on. Niyyah is what matters.
Is it ok for the Syedna to ask somebody (say the park officers) else to slaughter the animal and distribute the meat.
If the sole purpose of the hunting is for trade then this is the right thing to do.
But I am assuming that trade is not the sole purpose. Recreation is the sole purpose of hunting the animal and it doesn't matter what you do with the animal later on. Niyyah is what matters.
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Brother Qiyam,
Yes you are right, Hunting is allowed if you want to trade, but I don't think that is what the Syedna is doing. There is a difference between hunting because you want to trade and trading because you want to hunt.
Syedna is in the elephant trading business only because he wants to hunt and not the other way around.
Yes you are right, Hunting is allowed if you want to trade, but I don't think that is what the Syedna is doing. There is a difference between hunting because you want to trade and trading because you want to hunt.
Syedna is in the elephant trading business only because he wants to hunt and not the other way around.
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Dear Mhd. Hussain,
This is silly. I said the Jamiyas, in surat and karachi, the Madrasas in poorer countries, like yemen, india, oher universites, like Aligarh and Al'Azhar. These donations are regularly announced in the akbar of sites like mumineen.org and malumaat.com
Let me list a current example of his donations:
On the 24th Shaaban il Karim, 1423 in Dars Salam,
Huzurealla (TUS) with karam and ehsaan donated the sum of US $ 252,000 to the Burhani Qarzan Hasanat fund.
19 Rajab al-Asab 1423 in Mumbai,
Aqa Moula(TUS) also prayed for progress of Saify Hospital construction and granted a sum of Rs 2crore, 91 lakhs, 52 thousand for Burhani Qardan Hasanah Scheme.
15 Rajab al-Asab 1423 in Khandala,
In the Qardan Hasanah Scheme, Aqa Moula(TUS) gifted approximately Rs 2 crores.
I said I don't have proof of who sponsoredhe hunting trip for Sayedna...not the schools.
This is silly. I said the Jamiyas, in surat and karachi, the Madrasas in poorer countries, like yemen, india, oher universites, like Aligarh and Al'Azhar. These donations are regularly announced in the akbar of sites like mumineen.org and malumaat.com
Let me list a current example of his donations:
On the 24th Shaaban il Karim, 1423 in Dars Salam,
Huzurealla (TUS) with karam and ehsaan donated the sum of US $ 252,000 to the Burhani Qarzan Hasanat fund.
19 Rajab al-Asab 1423 in Mumbai,
Aqa Moula(TUS) also prayed for progress of Saify Hospital construction and granted a sum of Rs 2crore, 91 lakhs, 52 thousand for Burhani Qardan Hasanah Scheme.
15 Rajab al-Asab 1423 in Khandala,
In the Qardan Hasanah Scheme, Aqa Moula(TUS) gifted approximately Rs 2 crores.
I said I don't have proof of who sponsoredhe hunting trip for Sayedna...not the schools.
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MOHD HUSSAIN
- Posts: 443
- Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2001 4:01 am
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Br Qiyam: May be you are unaware of the intricacy of so called Karze Hassana Fund- Is n't this suppose to lend the money to the needy people at no interest but with a deposit which is seldom returned to the donnne? We had several people discussed this at various length in different columns at this site! I don't know why do you keep repeating this? I have been reading Malumaat.com site for past two years but found No reference of any large scale donation to any of the Universities you mentioned- Besides the above web site is run by Syedna"s cronies whom you can not ask any proof -So Don't do THOKA-THOKS for the sake of defending kothar!
Re: The so-called hunting trip.
Qiyam wrote
Dear Mo,
I haven't heard of the "tax" you describe. Regarding Qardhana Hasanah...if in fact only the rich are receiving it...is that a problem with your amil or with the fund?
who appoints the amil its maulana so he is then responsible for what his amils do as if he did not appprove of how his amils behave he would replace them but they obviuosely they have a green light from seyedna to squeez mumineen dry.
you see it makes more sense to mke the rich richer as you get a better return on money as using the fund for ordinary bohras is not guarnteed to generate extra income for the kothar.
Dear Mo,
I haven't heard of the "tax" you describe. Regarding Qardhana Hasanah...if in fact only the rich are receiving it...is that a problem with your amil or with the fund?
who appoints the amil its maulana so he is then responsible for what his amils do as if he did not appprove of how his amils behave he would replace them but they obviuosely they have a green light from seyedna to squeez mumineen dry.
you see it makes more sense to mke the rich richer as you get a better return on money as using the fund for ordinary bohras is not guarnteed to generate extra income for the kothar.