can reformist appoint there own dai like sulaimanis n alawi did if not than what is the reson for that as reformist did the same as other two
n if reformist dont like sayedna then why dont they join sulaimans or alawi as they to have there own dai
can reformist appoint there own dai
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
dear bro this progs do not want to leave us and appoint their dai or whoever othewise who will they abuse,thay have nothing to do with reforms its all about adawat
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
Indeed Bro. prof is absltly correct, adawat and infidelity in their (progssvs) blood.
-
like_minded
- Posts: 1260
- Joined: Fri Oct 20, 2006 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
One jerk starts a stupid topic, and the rest follow him.
To keep these jerks busy.. I suggest abde syedna, profrog and gulf.. to conduct a competition amongst you all.. as to who is a bigger fidayeen of your bhagwan.. lets kick start with a matam competition... are u jerks ready??..
The winner will get a chance to lick their bhagwans feet.. wash his piglets (shahzadas) under-wear..
To keep these jerks busy.. I suggest abde syedna, profrog and gulf.. to conduct a competition amongst you all.. as to who is a bigger fidayeen of your bhagwan.. lets kick start with a matam competition... are u jerks ready??..
The winner will get a chance to lick their bhagwans feet.. wash his piglets (shahzadas) under-wear..
-
abde sayedna
- Posts: 108
- Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
why dont u reply the post instead of showing ur comedy skills
-
abde sayedna
- Posts: 108
- Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
and i hope that by reading the post ur mind may have become unlike mimnded
-
like_minded
- Posts: 1260
- Joined: Fri Oct 20, 2006 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
I dont know about reformists, as I am not one... and I personally dont need a dai.Originally posted by abde sayedna:
can reformist appoint there own dai like sulaimanis n alawi did if not than what is the reson for that as reformist did the same as other two
n if reformist dont like sayedna then why dont they join sulaimans or alawi as they to have there own dai
It is syedna, who does not like democracy, freedom, transparency, accountability, so my suggestion is that he should immediately resign from the post.
-
abde sayedna
- Posts: 108
- Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
ok know u rnot a reformist so what ru doing here my post was for reformist
-
like_minded
- Posts: 1260
- Joined: Fri Oct 20, 2006 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
I wonder if the orthos have blood flowing in their veins.. Long years of slavery and conditioning has perhaps turned their blood into water., No wonder they take all the garbage thrown at them, happily and take pride in calling themselves "slaves of syedna" DISGUSTING!!!Originally posted by Gulf:
Indeed Bro. prof is absltly correct, adawat and infidelity in their (progssvs) blood.
-
like_minded
- Posts: 1260
- Joined: Fri Oct 20, 2006 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
slave of syednaOriginally posted by abde sayedna:
ok know u rnot a reformist so what ru doing here my post was for reformist
Most members here are not reformists, they do not belong to any reformist group.. They are here on individual level. Do you understand that?
-
abde sayedna
- Posts: 108
- Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
than i think ur all kabab mein haddi please get lost
-
like_minded
- Posts: 1260
- Joined: Fri Oct 20, 2006 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
yes surely, we are haddi in your bhagwans kabab... He and his thugs have lived lavishly at our expense.. now its pay back time.Originally posted by abde sayedna:
than i think ur all kabab mein haddi please get lost
-
abde sayedna
- Posts: 108
- Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
if ur not n reformist than who r u who always act as a reformist or r u afraid or u dont have any ans to my post
-
abde sayedna
- Posts: 108
- Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
i would like i serious ans to the post and what does ur contitution say in the matter
-
abde sayedna
- Posts: 108
- Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
this is what our moula does for us
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
u all must be knowing mr dahodwala who gave 52 crore in safiee haspital i will tel u how he earned it
he made a barcoding software a wanted sell for some little amt so he did arazz in moula but moula denied the he did arazz for 2 3 times but reply was same he too was wondering what in this than suddenly the demand for that software increased n with razaa of moula he sold the software n i dont know how much amt he n today also he is recieving so much in royalty
this all was said by him in ashara mudarak
that faith prompted him to araaz such huge amt
why cant u all can also appoint a dai for ur self who can do a great service like this for u all guyz
and it should be ur democratic rigth to appoint a dai because rasullulah said the where there is ali there is haq and in these zaman where there is dai of ali there is haq
but u all curse sayena like others did to ali in his time so they where not on haq , so it means u all r not on haq so why dont u appoint a dai of ali of ur choice n be on the side of haq
this is what our moula does for us
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
u all must be knowing mr dahodwala who gave 52 crore in safiee haspital i will tel u how he earned it
he made a barcoding software a wanted sell for some little amt so he did arazz in moula but moula denied the he did arazz for 2 3 times but reply was same he too was wondering what in this than suddenly the demand for that software increased n with razaa of moula he sold the software n i dont know how much amt he n today also he is recieving so much in royalty
this all was said by him in ashara mudarak
that faith prompted him to araaz such huge amt
why cant u all can also appoint a dai for ur self who can do a great service like this for u all guyz
and it should be ur democratic rigth to appoint a dai because rasullulah said the where there is ali there is haq and in these zaman where there is dai of ali there is haq
but u all curse sayena like others did to ali in his time so they where not on haq , so it means u all r not on haq so why dont u appoint a dai of ali of ur choice n be on the side of haq
-
abde sayedna
- Posts: 108
- Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
see dear like minded i know u dont like sayedna so i kindly request u to please reply properly n increase my knowledge in the matter
-
like_minded
- Posts: 1260
- Joined: Fri Oct 20, 2006 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
abde syedna
If Mr.Dahodwala had asked me for advise, I would have done the same thing which your bhagwan did, with the help of professionals.
Considering the demand of software... one simply needs basic economic sense to make a pile of jack.. He (Dahodwala) must have been an idiot to seek arzi from your bhagwan, perhaps he is dull headed.. or does not have self confidence, which majority of orthos like you lack.
And what haq are you talking about? Fooling people in the name of religion and amassing wealth, is what you call haq?? Your bhagwan is robbing you in broad day-light.. are you blind not to see it??
If Mr.Dahodwala had asked me for advise, I would have done the same thing which your bhagwan did, with the help of professionals.
Considering the demand of software... one simply needs basic economic sense to make a pile of jack.. He (Dahodwala) must have been an idiot to seek arzi from your bhagwan, perhaps he is dull headed.. or does not have self confidence, which majority of orthos like you lack.
And what haq are you talking about? Fooling people in the name of religion and amassing wealth, is what you call haq?? Your bhagwan is robbing you in broad day-light.. are you blind not to see it??
-
abde sayedna
- Posts: 108
- Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
i like to inform u that we r ignoring u n this is the last reply to u from my side so please dont waste time dear
-
abde sayedna
- Posts: 108
- Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
dear oma where r u now come on show all ur knowledge and ans the post
show that how much leterate u are show how much democratic right u enjoy show how much advance ur than of orthodox show us who is right who is wrong r u gone blind by not reply to my post come show me ur love for ur refor movement
show that how much leterate u are show how much democratic right u enjoy show how much advance ur than of orthodox show us who is right who is wrong r u gone blind by not reply to my post come show me ur love for ur refor movement
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
abde sayedna:
posting your myths about Dahodwalla's donation on numerous other posts and missives on this site do not make it a truth. You appear to believe in the adage that "if one flings so much sh,,t on a wall, some of it will definitely stick.... but it still remain sh..t"
posting your myths about Dahodwalla's donation on numerous other posts and missives on this site do not make it a truth. You appear to believe in the adage that "if one flings so much sh,,t on a wall, some of it will definitely stick.... but it still remain sh..t"
-
abde sayedna
- Posts: 108
- Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
i think u reformist r a parrot who r just taught how to curse sayedsna but ur taught notning abt religion n its basic that why u all have kept mum on the post
n u all must be feeling the heat as u all must have never came acrooss such a question in ur life
so start thinking who all r u and to which way u all r heading
n u all must be feeling the heat as u all must have never came acrooss such a question in ur life
so start thinking who all r u and to which way u all r heading
-
abde sayedna
- Posts: 108
- Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
S. Insaf
Active
Member # 532
posted March 10, 2008 10:36 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dawoodi Bohras are living as close-knit community attached with its hierarchical centre since many centuries. They see any movement of independence as centrifugal and disruptionist. The lack of education and economical freedom among Dawoodi Bohra women has further aggravated the process of independence in the community.
Look at the situation in Udaipur for example. Udaipur has sizable Dawoodi Bohra population. Many of them had realised the importance of modern education in order to secure government and other jobs. There are many graduates even among Dawoodi Bohra women and they are found in high positions in jobs. The education did not make them rational. But it did make them conscious of their individual rights and human dignity. Till 1970 Udaipur Bohras remained under strict discipline imposed by its central authority.
It is important to note that the entire revolt in 1970 in Udaipur centred on democratic rights of Bohras to contest Election and to Establish Social Institutions like Bohra Youth Association and the co-operative Bank. There was absolutely no religious issue involved in that revolt.
Dawoodi Bohras religious establishment under domination of uncompromising and arrogant Yusuf Najmuddin (YN) was fully responsible for this revolt. Firstly because the so-called religious and spiritual Dawat had no business in interfering in a social issue of election and instructing to dissolve social institutions. Secondly because the establishment and its head committed the biggest blunder in the history of the community by assaulting the innocent and devote women of Udaipur publicly and in front of the head priest who considered him as ‘Khamma Maula’. The establishment further declared a full-scale war against the Bohras of Udaipur calling them as enemy of Dai and Dawat, thus antagonising them and shattering their age-old faith in him.
Still the Udaipur Bohras feared independence and made all possible efforts to reconcile with the central authority. In order to resolve the dispute 750 Bohras from Udaipur went to meet Sayedna at Rampura on 12 April 1973 but in their arrogance YN and Sayedna refused to meet them. They had not committed any ‘sin’ but they were prepared to apologise. But Sayedna’s secretary, Yamani emphatically told them that there was no question of granting them an apology. From Bombay I, Husaini Sanchawala and Mohsin Nagri went to Udaipur to express our support the Bohras of Udaipur in their struggle for independence but we were turned down.
For two years the Bohras of Udaipur kept writing letters to Sayedna. They even went to the then Prime Minister of India, Indira Gandhi requesting her to intervene in the matter. Some 300 couples were waiting to get married in 1975. Letters were sent to Sayedna requesting him to depute his person to solemnise the Nikah. But he refused.
Therefore a de facto independence was imposed on the Bohras of Udaipur by non other than Sayedna himself.
Today after almost 35 years the Bohras belonging to Bohra Youth in Udaipur have learnt to live independently and have reaped the fruits. They have trained their own Mullas to perform all traditional religious rites. They have learnt to celebrate and commemorate Idd, Ramadan, Muharram, Hajj, Majalis, Urs independently. They are running a ‘School of Dini Talim’ imparting basic religious education. They have come out of a very narrow intellectual base. Though they believe in the Fatemi Dawat but do not confirm to the rigid discipline imposed by its today’s priestly class. The strict conformism under totalitarian had hampered their intellectual creativities. Strict intellectual conformism always serves the interest of authoritarian rulers. The entire city of Udaipur witnesses their intellectual creativities now and the country’s intellectual class praises their progress. Even Bohras of Shabab (orthodox group) are taking benefit of the schools, medical care centres, Udaipur Urban Co-op. Bank and library set up by the reformists.
Taher Saifuddin, Ibrahim Zainuddin, Saleh Safiuddin and Yusuf Najmuddin have all gone and are parts of a forgotten history. Sharp and shrewd Sayedna is too old to play any part. The Dawat’s establishment is stinking with corruption and has lost control over its staff, Amils and Jamat members.
There is an undercurrent of dissidence every where in the community. The writings on the walls are bold and clear: “Do not fear independence”.
IF UALL CAN DO THIS WHY CANT U APPOINT A DAI KINDLY SOMEONE PLEASE REPLY
Active
Member # 532
posted March 10, 2008 10:36 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dawoodi Bohras are living as close-knit community attached with its hierarchical centre since many centuries. They see any movement of independence as centrifugal and disruptionist. The lack of education and economical freedom among Dawoodi Bohra women has further aggravated the process of independence in the community.
Look at the situation in Udaipur for example. Udaipur has sizable Dawoodi Bohra population. Many of them had realised the importance of modern education in order to secure government and other jobs. There are many graduates even among Dawoodi Bohra women and they are found in high positions in jobs. The education did not make them rational. But it did make them conscious of their individual rights and human dignity. Till 1970 Udaipur Bohras remained under strict discipline imposed by its central authority.
It is important to note that the entire revolt in 1970 in Udaipur centred on democratic rights of Bohras to contest Election and to Establish Social Institutions like Bohra Youth Association and the co-operative Bank. There was absolutely no religious issue involved in that revolt.
Dawoodi Bohras religious establishment under domination of uncompromising and arrogant Yusuf Najmuddin (YN) was fully responsible for this revolt. Firstly because the so-called religious and spiritual Dawat had no business in interfering in a social issue of election and instructing to dissolve social institutions. Secondly because the establishment and its head committed the biggest blunder in the history of the community by assaulting the innocent and devote women of Udaipur publicly and in front of the head priest who considered him as ‘Khamma Maula’. The establishment further declared a full-scale war against the Bohras of Udaipur calling them as enemy of Dai and Dawat, thus antagonising them and shattering their age-old faith in him.
Still the Udaipur Bohras feared independence and made all possible efforts to reconcile with the central authority. In order to resolve the dispute 750 Bohras from Udaipur went to meet Sayedna at Rampura on 12 April 1973 but in their arrogance YN and Sayedna refused to meet them. They had not committed any ‘sin’ but they were prepared to apologise. But Sayedna’s secretary, Yamani emphatically told them that there was no question of granting them an apology. From Bombay I, Husaini Sanchawala and Mohsin Nagri went to Udaipur to express our support the Bohras of Udaipur in their struggle for independence but we were turned down.
For two years the Bohras of Udaipur kept writing letters to Sayedna. They even went to the then Prime Minister of India, Indira Gandhi requesting her to intervene in the matter. Some 300 couples were waiting to get married in 1975. Letters were sent to Sayedna requesting him to depute his person to solemnise the Nikah. But he refused.
Therefore a de facto independence was imposed on the Bohras of Udaipur by non other than Sayedna himself.
Today after almost 35 years the Bohras belonging to Bohra Youth in Udaipur have learnt to live independently and have reaped the fruits. They have trained their own Mullas to perform all traditional religious rites. They have learnt to celebrate and commemorate Idd, Ramadan, Muharram, Hajj, Majalis, Urs independently. They are running a ‘School of Dini Talim’ imparting basic religious education. They have come out of a very narrow intellectual base. Though they believe in the Fatemi Dawat but do not confirm to the rigid discipline imposed by its today’s priestly class. The strict conformism under totalitarian had hampered their intellectual creativities. Strict intellectual conformism always serves the interest of authoritarian rulers. The entire city of Udaipur witnesses their intellectual creativities now and the country’s intellectual class praises their progress. Even Bohras of Shabab (orthodox group) are taking benefit of the schools, medical care centres, Udaipur Urban Co-op. Bank and library set up by the reformists.
Taher Saifuddin, Ibrahim Zainuddin, Saleh Safiuddin and Yusuf Najmuddin have all gone and are parts of a forgotten history. Sharp and shrewd Sayedna is too old to play any part. The Dawat’s establishment is stinking with corruption and has lost control over its staff, Amils and Jamat members.
There is an undercurrent of dissidence every where in the community. The writings on the walls are bold and clear: “Do not fear independence”.
IF UALL CAN DO THIS WHY CANT U APPOINT A DAI KINDLY SOMEONE PLEASE REPLY
-
abde sayedna
- Posts: 108
- Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
S. Insaf
Active
Member # 532
posted March 13, 2008 03:25 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
When social customs are made a part of religious belief, their years of practice conditions the minds of practitioners and they start considering them as essential to fulfil.
In Udaipur in the initial stages of liberation from domination of exploitative religious establishment even the educated class was unable to carry out the social customs like burial, Nikah, mujlis etc. without ‘Raza’ of the local Amil. The Jamiyah products like Shaikh Ahmed Ali Raj and Shaikh Yaqoob Ali were also not ready to lead prayers in the mosques without Kothar’s ‘Raza’.
The leaders of reformed movement then adopted a policy to solve the problem temporarily till the mind set is changed. They used to send some one to Dalan (Amil’s resident) for ‘Raza’. The person concerned use to clime some steps of Dalan, stay on the staircase for while without meeting the Amil and come down and used to announce ‘Raza hai’ (permission given). This used to satisfy every one and they used to carry on social and religious rites on their own.
THIS IS A SHEER JIHALIYAT OF PRESENT DAY
IT IS LIKE WITHOUT MARRIGE A CHILD IS BORN
Active
Member # 532
posted March 13, 2008 03:25 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
When social customs are made a part of religious belief, their years of practice conditions the minds of practitioners and they start considering them as essential to fulfil.
In Udaipur in the initial stages of liberation from domination of exploitative religious establishment even the educated class was unable to carry out the social customs like burial, Nikah, mujlis etc. without ‘Raza’ of the local Amil. The Jamiyah products like Shaikh Ahmed Ali Raj and Shaikh Yaqoob Ali were also not ready to lead prayers in the mosques without Kothar’s ‘Raza’.
The leaders of reformed movement then adopted a policy to solve the problem temporarily till the mind set is changed. They used to send some one to Dalan (Amil’s resident) for ‘Raza’. The person concerned use to clime some steps of Dalan, stay on the staircase for while without meeting the Amil and come down and used to announce ‘Raza hai’ (permission given). This used to satisfy every one and they used to carry on social and religious rites on their own.
THIS IS A SHEER JIHALIYAT OF PRESENT DAY
IT IS LIKE WITHOUT MARRIGE A CHILD IS BORN
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
Abde
Can you tell us about Syedna's mother once we know the progeny then we can discuss about appointing a Progressive Syedna too.
BUT TELL US WHERE IS CURRENT SYEDNA'S MOTHER IS BURIED I AM PUTTING THIS IN BLOCK SO YOU CAN SEE THE QUESTION WE HAVE BEEN ASKING
Can you tell us about Syedna's mother once we know the progeny then we can discuss about appointing a Progressive Syedna too.
BUT TELL US WHERE IS CURRENT SYEDNA'S MOTHER IS BURIED I AM PUTTING THIS IN BLOCK SO YOU CAN SEE THE QUESTION WE HAVE BEEN ASKING
-
abde sayedna
- Posts: 108
- Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
i think my question more important for both of us so please reply n i will reply for ur question
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
abde syedna, either u have totally ignored it or u jus dint care to read on this website....
the refrormists are not looking to break to community by appointing a dai of their own...the hope tht the corruption both moral and financial in the community cmes to an end.....forming another "firka" is surely not the solution....
to give u an example something similar happened in the aga khani community as well when many questioned the aga khani imam for mishandling of community funds.....those who believed he did, broke off from the community and became ithna ashari.....
the reformists dont wish to split the community...they have faith in the tenents of the ismaili dawoodi bohra faith and wish to preserve it......
the refrormists are not looking to break to community by appointing a dai of their own...the hope tht the corruption both moral and financial in the community cmes to an end.....forming another "firka" is surely not the solution....
to give u an example something similar happened in the aga khani community as well when many questioned the aga khani imam for mishandling of community funds.....those who believed he did, broke off from the community and became ithna ashari.....
the reformists dont wish to split the community...they have faith in the tenents of the ismaili dawoodi bohra faith and wish to preserve it......
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
ONLY slaves need a Master .......
ONLY animals need a Master .........
And look at current Bohra Master, can not even go to pee himslef ..... cannot talk, speak, keep his head up, walk ...... what a Master - this master will take sheep to Janat ........ hahahahaha
ONLY animals need a Master .........
And look at current Bohra Master, can not even go to pee himslef ..... cannot talk, speak, keep his head up, walk ...... what a Master - this master will take sheep to Janat ........ hahahahaha
-
abde sayedna
- Posts: 108
- Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
dear m akberi it cant be possible that there is no true propet or imam or dai of the zaman as per out islamis teaching so for me it our moula n for u who is it if it is not moula
please note before repling that since adam we r having imama n prophet till muhammad and after muhamaad there is no prophet n and if allah is there then there has to some one on earth who will spread his dawat and allah can never choose a wrong one
please note before repling that since adam we r having imama n prophet till muhammad and after muhamaad there is no prophet n and if allah is there then there has to some one on earth who will spread his dawat and allah can never choose a wrong one
-
abde sayedna
- Posts: 108
- Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
makberi
Active
Member # 5642
posted April 02, 2008 08:55 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
abde syedna, either u have totally ignored it or u jus dint care to read on this website....
the refrormists are not looking to break to community by appointing a dai of their own...the hope tht the corruption both moral and financial in the community cmes to an end.....forming another "firka" is surely not the solution....
so my dear wher is haq today because what ever rasul said is said for the coming years till qayamat
so who is having haq today
and as per my knowledge if it is not sayedna then who is it do know any one like that
Active
Member # 5642
posted April 02, 2008 08:55 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
abde syedna, either u have totally ignored it or u jus dint care to read on this website....
the refrormists are not looking to break to community by appointing a dai of their own...the hope tht the corruption both moral and financial in the community cmes to an end.....forming another "firka" is surely not the solution....
so my dear wher is haq today because what ever rasul said is said for the coming years till qayamat
so who is having haq today
and as per my knowledge if it is not sayedna then who is it do know any one like that
-
like_minded
- Posts: 1260
- Joined: Fri Oct 20, 2006 4:01 am
Re: can reformist appoint there own dai
Abde syedna (burhani ghulam)
You are the master of your ownself.. why the hell do you need a dai to show you the path?? Creation is the biggest miracle and humans are already blessed with everything.
Remember, all are same in the eyes of God.. there is absolutely no scope of discrimination, If you people bow down before your master and happily accept his diktats.. then you are going against God.
You are the master of your ownself.. why the hell do you need a dai to show you the path?? Creation is the biggest miracle and humans are already blessed with everything.
Remember, all are same in the eyes of God.. there is absolutely no scope of discrimination, If you people bow down before your master and happily accept his diktats.. then you are going against God.