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Good Samaritan Foundation
Posted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 3:25 pm
by id99
Hello Everyone!!
I am fairly new to the online community and I must say I really enjoy some of the forum topics. Thank you everyone for your valuable thoughts and suggestions.
In general I am not concerned with the oppression of the Kothar and some of their silly fatwas. Most of us don't even care to follow the illogical fatwas and I am quiet sure most of us have a life beyond our own community people and a good social standing within the societies we live in. The fatwas are propagated by the fanatics and the "newly found Bohras" who take pride in their divine Demi-god and ofcourse their are rightly awarded by our clergy class and elevated to positions like NKD, MKD, Mullas and Sheikhs.
I am more concerned about our Morals and Ethics we imbibe to our society. We may pray 5 times a day but the entire day we are involved in unethical and immoral activities, what is the point of being sincere to Allah when you cannot be sincerer to his men. To those living in India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Mayanmar, Sri Lanka, and parts of Africa/ Middle East where societal moral code is at its lowest. Children are taught or are posed with a bad example to break traffic rules, bribe the cop, behave arrogantly with the authorities, be authoritative with maids, drivers or anyone else economically/socially weaker than you, show power and strength with money etc etc ... the list goes on. Is that what was really taught by our Nabis, Imams and social thinks who impact our lives greatly today. The Thora, The Bible and The Quran all stress on the moral codes of life which are sadly forgotten by its followers in the light of political and social gains of the individual in particular and the society in general. We have all divided ourselves in sub groups like Sunni and Shiaa and further sub sects like Bohra, Khojas, Wahabis etc. But all what we have forgotten is humanity and morality. We have forgotten to be good citizens and good Samaritans instead we have cultured ourselves to enjoy cheap thrills of societal problems. None of us want to do our bit to improve our quality of life and help others in need.
I am working on projects for helping children nurture to be good citizens and teaching them morals and ethical values. In a lot of school these basics are missed out in the education curriculum because the kids have to be made competitive. If you just wanted your kid to be the smartest and the brightest without any moral values you should have just bought the latest super computer instead. I urge parents not to pressurize you kids so that they don't end up doing unethical or immoral things to fulfill your demands. Instead respect your child's caliber and accept his strength and weaknesses. A very good example has been rightly shown by Amir Khan in his movie "Taare Zameen Par" and "3 Idiots". We all watch these movie but seldom learn anything from it.
I propose to start a foundation with like minded individuals who can promote this cause and work towards a better tomorrow. I do not appreciate the donation in monetary forms instead I would like people to get involve and donate their time for this cause. I would want members to involve themselves with the community they live in and give back to the community/ society you live in. Lets starts with brain storming a charter for the foundation and as always all your suggestions, comments and concerns are welcome.
Let the forgotten famous slogan be revived again in our hearts "Live like Ali, Die like Hussein"
I look forward for a positive response from the forum & lets works to build a healthy tomorrow.
Re: Good Samaritan Foundation
Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:15 am
by humanbeing
Dear ID99
Your thoughts are initiatives in itself. Concern you raised affects not only in bohra community but the mankind in general.
A small incident I would like to share : My friend and his girlfriend wanted to marry eachother, but they were from different religions, the only reason they did not marry was they were worried what would be their children’s religion ? When I told them to imbibe goodness of both faiths and leave the decision to the child when he/she grows up. They found my suggestion absurd and impractical.
Point is… We are hell bent on becoming good Muslim, Christians, Hindus, Sikh, Jews etc. Focus is on fulfilling religious virtues ( rituals) rather then be a productive member of the society.
Coming to Bohra ideologies, preached by today’ kothar ( as I know it). Most of the times of bohraas are made busy in glorification of human kinds. Every second day there is majlis of someone or other, where people come sing monotonous praises, hog on mithas kharas & go home burping. Most of the times missing out on virtues and values those personalities shall be remembered for.
What is required is action, lot of actions. Let every minutes given away to such majlises and gathering be dedicated to work of charity. Such as :
Recycling of domestic articles (apparels, furniture, equipments etc)
Vocational classes to increase skills and ability amongst lost youth ( sewing, cooking, plumbing, carpentry, computers etc)
Every majlis must have civic, traffic, moral, educational values & virtues presentations relayed, instead of sympathetic display of old fragile Dai.
Financial and administrative accountability from top to bottom.
-----------------------------------------
What I intend to convey is,
Bohra Readers, must spend their time doing worthwhile things rather then sit playing mobile games waiting for ‘ThaaL’ @ Majlises
Attend to a sick friend or relative, orphanage,
Bind notebooks from unused papers and distribute them to poor childrens,
Sit with your children probe their value system,
Spend time tracking your Zakat contribution and Sadaqa donations
Re: Good Samaritan Foundation
Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 3:22 am
by genesis
id99 wrote:Hello Everyone!!
I am fairly new to the online community and I must say I really enjoy some of the forum topics. Thank you everyone for your valuable thoughts and suggestions.
In general I am not concerned with the oppression of the Kothar and some of their silly fatwas. Most of us don't even care to follow the illogical fatwas and I am quiet sure most of us have a life beyond our own community people and a good social standing within the societies we live in. The fatwas are propagated by the fanatics and the "newly found Bohras" who take pride in their divine Demi-god and ofcourse their are rightly awarded by our clergy class and elevated to positions like NKD, MKD, Mullas and Sheikhs.
I am more concerned about our Morals and Ethics we imbibe to our society. We may pray 5 times a day but the entire day we are involved in unethical and immoral activities, what is the point of being sincere to Allah when you cannot be sincerer to his men. To those living in India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Mayanmar, Sri Lanka, and parts of Africa/ Middle East where societal moral code is at its lowest. Children are taught or are posed with a bad example to break traffic rules, bribe the cop, behave arrogantly with the authorities, be authoritative with maids, drivers or anyone else economically/socially weaker than you, show power and strength with money etc etc ... the list goes on. Is that what was really taught by our Nabis, Imams and social thinks who impact our lives greatly today. The Thora, The Bible and The Quran all stress on the moral codes of life which are sadly forgotten by its followers in the light of political and social gains of the individual in particular and the society in general. We have all divided ourselves in sub groups like Sunni and Shiaa and further sub sects like Bohra, Khojas, Wahabis etc. But all what we have forgotten is humanity and morality. We have forgotten to be good citizens and good Samaritans instead we have cultured ourselves to enjoy cheap thrills of societal problems. None of us want to do our bit to improve our quality of life and help others in need.
I am working on projects for helping children nurture to be good citizens and teaching them morals and ethical values. In a lot of school these basics are missed out in the education curriculum because the kids have to be made competitive. If you just wanted your kid to be the smartest and the brightest without any moral values you should have just bought the latest super computer instead. I urge parents not to pressurize you kids so that they don't end up doing unethical or immoral things to fulfill your demands. Instead respect your child's caliber and accept his strength and weaknesses. A very good example has been rightly shown by Amir Khan in his movie "Taare Zameen Par" and "3 Idiots". We all watch these movie but seldom learn anything from it.
I propose to start a foundation with like minded individuals who can promote this cause and work towards a better tomorrow. I do not appreciate the donation in monetary forms instead I would like people to get involve and donate their time for this cause. I would want members to involve themselves with the community they live in and give back to the community/ society you live in. Lets starts with brain storming a charter for the foundation and as always all your suggestions, comments and concerns are welcome.
Let the forgotten famous slogan be revived again in our hearts "Live like Ali, Die like Hussein"
I look forward for a positive response from the forum & lets works to build a healthy tomorrow.
You talk about imbibing morals and ethics ? You must be aware that during hajj, we are officially instructed to become hypocrites - that too in the HQs of allah ! In the Haj sabak in mecca we are told to just "act out" the namaz with the general Jamaath . We are asked to get up and do deedar of Hajre aswadh when everyone else is in sajda !! And in many an arkaan such hypocritical behavior is officially instructed during hajj.
We are told to bribe, coax or bow down to anyone to get the offficial jamaat works done- one amil told " apnu kaam nikalva vaste gadha ne bhi baap banavi lejo " !!
So wheres the question of morals being taught , imbibed, followed and practised ? God save us.
But I must say its a good initiative on your part. All the best.
Re: Good Samaritan Foundation
Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 5:39 am
by id99
@humanbeing: The story you shared is a very common among not just Bohras but most communities around the world. The basic problem is we are afraid of having a an all inclusive society because we all will lose our dominance in our personal domain. I think this type of society will never cease to exist in India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Middle East and most African Countries. USA is technically a Christian country but the only thing Christian left is the US Dollar which says "In God We Trust". The basics of humanity are respected no matter which faith you belong to, no matter what your race or culture be. We should learn the positives of humanity from them.
Re: Good Samaritan Foundation
Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 7:34 am
by Bohra spring
To those living in India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Mayanmar, Sri Lanka, and parts of Africa/ Middle East where societal moral code is at its lowest. Children are taught or are posed with a bad example to break traffic rules, bribe the cop, behave arrogantly with the authorities, be authoritative with maids, drivers or anyone else economically/socially weaker than you, show power and strength with money etc etc ... the list goes on.
Wow brother, sis what is this really..so much prejudice....
I was born in East Africa of small means , my parents did not teach me bad morales, society forces people to survive ...not every one is of bad morale...millions live on small means, poverty and live an honest and decent life. I now live in a wealthy city with the high per capita not in USa but would rather teach my children that everyone has good in them the challenge is to find it and use it for mankind ..everyone has a part to play but some don't have the luxuries like us in the west to worry about secondary essentials , so the poor folks have other priorities on their minds eg food , money to get through day by day, how naive for us to be judgemental
Bribing a cop is not natural...a cop is corrupted by the wealthy and businessmen. Behaving arrogantly is the norm of the wealthy. I think if you compare a common person in the west vs a common person in the less developed you will find most people are good, it is the few bad who are noticed and leave behind a reputation .
Next time try going to the villages and slums you will find honest true people who are kind and surviving in tough conditions.
You may have the best intentions and wish you good luck but that lingering thought of mightier than thou just because we are in the west is regrettable .
It is abde bohras who actively practise deceit by leads from the zadas, however reformists are exposing them so society can know the scandals and overtime look down and make their influence inconsequential .
Re: Good Samaritan Foundation
Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 2:16 pm
by think
other than majlis and darees the bohras form clubs of 6 or 8 couples and they gossip, eat food and pass their time either playing cards or talk about their dai.
Re: Good Samaritan Foundation
Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 2:50 pm
by Mkenya
id99 - A very thought-provoking post!
I had touched on the same subject in my post: "Kothar Juggernaut"; and I append below my thoughts along the lines you suggest.
I will continue to 'take temperature' on this topic as to any 'thons' (substantial/concrete) suggestions that might come up. In simple terms what I mean is that your idea is great and now let us put wheels under it and make it move. I would like to assure you that you can count me 'in' in whatever shape or form your efforts take.
I feel posts and comments on happenings in the Bohra world are only good for venting hot air. I am sure Progressives have achieved a lot. Could someone please inform me about what Progressives have achieved? What is our vision, where do we see ourselves in a few years? Wrongdoings from and about Kothar is a broken-record played over and over by us. Our whining is self-satisfying. Let us collectively come up with suggestions as to what we can offer. We do not have to “build” anything.
I was on an extensive visit to India this year and witnessed the abject poverty there. People in East Africa live better than that. Together with my business associates I donate to societies in Rajkot and Kolkata which do exceptional work to help the poor in slums. They provide inexpensive medical clinics, free education, vocational training for young mothers, small loans for cottage industries, etc. India is a country in which 49% of the population does not have a proper toilet; people urinate everywhere, garbage including dead animals and rotting food can be seen in the streets and alleys. Let us open our eyes, identify areas where help is needed and do something about it.
A Sher, below, by Daag should energize us!
Khoob parda he ke chilman se lage bethe ho;
Saaf chupte bhi nahi aur samne aate bhi nahi
Zist se tang ho to 'Daag' jeete kyun ho;
Jaan pyari bhi nahi aur jaan se jate bhi nahi
Re: Good Samaritan Foundation
Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 5:24 pm
by Al Zulfiqar
brother mkenya,
i know you write with good intentions, but a few points do rankle and cannot be let go without comment.
1. your comment about this site being only an outlet for venting 'hot air' is unfair, in that it heaps scorn on bohras and it makes it appear as if only disgruntled, but cowardly, bohras come here who have nothing better to do other than taking a dump against a monster, immovable kothar. (juggernaut as you term it). actually, that is what this site is for. give it credit in that atleast it provides a free and fearless platform where bohras can expose the corruption, nepotism and mockery made of our faith by that 'juggernaut'. it gives them a public outlet which is not allowed to them in their own highly restricted settings. yes, they do whine, carp and complain within the narrow confines of their social circles, but that hardly helps, as it leads to nothing concrete in terms of 'reform'. but surprise, surprise, many hardline abdes who do stray here, even if by mistake, eventually do realise the folly of their fanaticism and the material posted on this site does influence them. i personally know of dozens of previously staunch abdes/amtes, who after spending time here, converted to the progressive school of thought. every bohra enlightened through this forum is a big victory, a candle lit to dispel the darkness of blind faith. one such candle then helps light many other candles, collectively they become a beacon which shows the way to others, like a lighthouse.
2. this site has plenty of sterling articles and documents in its archives. they are an eye-opener to those who bother to read them. they highlight our history, past practices and the original principles of our faith, knowledge which is being deliberately hidden from the community. there are articles on court cases with actual transcripts, facts which have been held back from gullible and naive bohras, or cunningly twisted to mislead and deceive a brainwashed community.
3. can you provide a better site than this? a site which would be more pro-active and have many inter-active platforms, viz. one comprising of lawyers who would collectively fight the kothar? another one of medical doctors who would fan out all over the world to provide medical relief to poor bohras and others? another of a fund-raising body which can tap into a pool of wealthy donors and well-wishers? if you have such ideas, please share them here and get the wheels rolling. its self-defeating to view the efforts of this site and of the reformists, with a detached 'them v/s us' view with colored glasses. make use of this site, get involved, contribute, instead of only offering suggestions. once again, i repeat, your intentions are honorable but they provide only criticisms, nothing constructive.
4. we recently had the same issue with a member, db-londoner, who came in swinging, full of aggression, venom and passion. admin had to remind him that this site functions with extremely limited resources and a team of moderators who function as admin on a voluntary basis. they have never asked for money and have struggled to keep this forum going and on a free basis.
5. the overall poverty situation in india with bohras or the general populace is due to various factors, which would be too lengthy to enumerate. it would require a weighty tome and would diverge from the discussion at hand. it is a country of 1.2 billion where the statistics are mind boggling. yet it not only manages to feed itself, but has surplus to export, that too without approaching western nations with a begging bowl in hand. the reasons why people go hungry are numerous. non-accountability, poor management and corruption is rampant, as it is in all developing countries, even worse in Africa. as for the situation with filth, pollution and public defecation, a lot of it has to do with a culture which tolerates such, (shocking to any outsider) practices. it is degrading in the extreme to see human beings reduced to such abject animalistic behaviour. i have to agree that i have not seen such ignorance and acceptance of unhygeinic conditions anywhere else, although i have been often to africa, pakistan, indonesia, malaysia, bangladesh, all the gulf arab countries, yemen, and many other such poor countries.
6. why bohras and people of non-african origin live better in east africa, that too is obvious. it may sound faintly critical, but nevertheless brutally honest, that people of indian origin have ruled the roost there economically for decades. its a situation of 'andhon mein kana raja'. this does not intend to lessen the efforts of those of our pioneers who opened up the hinterland to trade, manufacturing and commerce, but lets face it, there was also rampant exploitation, discrimination and indulgence in isolationist, exclusionary practices on the part of indian business houses. it is no use claiming that there were many of us who were very benign and kind masters, the relationship was servant-master nevertheless, which has most often remained an uneasy one and has exploded into murderous violence against indians whenever any opportunity presented itself.
i have learnt one important lesson in life. it is easy to be critical when one superficially looks at any problem, be it a country, peoples, practices, etc, from a disinterested/detached point of view. but once you get below the skin of the issues and analyse, try to understand, empathise and get involved, then you see things from an entirely different angle. that is when solutions can be found and intractable problems can be addressed with any measure of fairness and balance.
sir, you are i believe, my senior in age and experience. i hope you will forgive me for this transgression of correcting your views.
Re: Good Samaritan Foundation
Posted: Tue Jul 02, 2013 5:06 pm
by Mkenya
Thank you bro. Al Zulfiqar
I concur with your response and concede I had painted everything with one brush.
Your input is well taken. However the focus of my current post and its predecessor
was to mobilize participants of this Forum to embark on charitable and humanitarian
projects themselves. A case in point is the worthwhile project in Ahmedabad.
No doubt there will always be the 'fringe' on this Forum whose sole purpose is to
regurgitate the maladies of Kothar (Juggernaut!). They do not offer any 'thons' suggestions
or projects. All communities have factions like that; the backbenchers, shit-disturbers,
'diwasri', and so on.
I know it will be foolish for me to expect a ground surge of constructive ideas. However,
I am receptive, and would contribute, to worthwhile humanitarian projects introduced
on this Forum. I would also welcome fellow-posters to bring to my attention any projects on
this Forum.
Re: Good Samaritan Foundation
Posted: Tue Jul 02, 2013 10:53 pm
by Mkenya
Bro. Al zulfiqar
Your 'LIKE' was very comforting and reassuring.
Thank you!
Re: Good Samaritan Foundation
Posted: Wed Jul 03, 2013 6:27 am
by SBM
I would also welcome fellow-posters to bring to my attention any projects on
this Forum.
Currently there are two projects on this forum ,both needs financial help
1- Poverty in Ahmedabad
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=7163
2- How to help this website
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=8412
Please go through the thread on both. both are equally well deserving and can use all your help
Re: Good Samaritan Foundation
Posted: Wed Jul 03, 2013 8:16 am
by asad
deleted
Re: Good Samaritan Foundation
Posted: Wed Jul 03, 2013 7:31 pm
by Al Zulfiqar
Mkenya wrote:Bro. Al zulfiqar
Your 'LIKE' was very comforting and reassuring.
Thank you!
brother mkenya,
you do not have to thank me, your posts are always a pleasure to read. i have close family connections with east africa and easily understand your sentiments and nostalgia tinged with sadness for the days gone by.