RAZA

[SBM]

If Aqa Moula has given this person the RAZA to do business why is he asking everyone else for ideas.
I thought Aqa Moula is supposed to know whether this person is capable of doing business or they just took his NAJWA
Wonder what good RAZA does???????

Date: Mon May 29, 2006 2:48 pm
Subject: suggestion important for every mumenin bhai ane behan itsu_4me
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as salaam alekum to all the mumenin bhai ane bahen
my self QUAID JOHAR received raza mubarak from huzur-e-ala (t.u.s.)
for doing business ,but i don't have any specific & previous
business experience for start the business ,presently i am engaged
in job and working as a accountant & export executive in indore in
india

i had done my post graduation in international business (MIB)master
in international business also i have thorough knowledge of complete
export/import procedure,document prepration,custom &
excise,international logistics etc.

i humbly request to all the mumenin bhai ane behan to please give me
your valuabla suggetion for

1) how can i start my business?
2) which product is suitable for me to start the new business?
3)which types of business should have to do?

according to my personal thinking start new business as a suppliers
importer/exporter

retail traders
wholesaller
distributors/c & f agent
any sugetion as you like to give me

may allah gives long life to our aqua mola(t.u.s.)

quaidjohar

indore

[kabeer19922001]

He should ask the person who gave him the raza.
What a sorry state of affairs. The guy is an MBA and Aqa Moula is telling him to do business.

With respect to raza how is this obtained i.e is a case file presented to AMoula? Does AM have the time or the expertise to go through each case.

Take for example this guy, he has been told to do business. AM must or should have known that the guy has no experince or funds(?). So now what. He goes aound asking everyone for help.

AM must have a mechanism to ensure that the a mechanism is set so that each of his raza is carried out. e.g this guy after been told that he should do business should be referred to a Bohri committe of businessmen, who could forumlate a strategy for him. Just telling him to do business would not be of any use.

Regards

[accountability]

I think this Raza episode has gone too far. The rationale that is given for raza is, practice from early age of Islam. That is from Karbala events. There arn't any specific mention even in fatmid theology about raza.

Kabeer, I do not think, every request for raza goes to syedna saheb.

It seems to be a very inteligent mechanism to check on any and everything. Of course it comes with carrot and stick. With raza, your chances of success are "guaranteed". Without raza it is doomed for "failure".

Once I wrote a letter to Jamia in Karachi, about the history of raza, from fatmid perspective. I have not got any reply till now. That was about 3 years ago.

I made sure,it had my correct address, my name, and even I gave them my phone and fax nos.

[SBM]

Dear Pro Pig

The question is if you knew Murtaza Dahodwala personally how come you didnot know that he contributed money to both Saifee Hospital and Boston Mosque.Was it just SPIN you wanted or you really didnot know this gentleman well enough.
The link in Syedna Saheb's Birthday
See Post # 67- and other
Regards

[pongabohri]

AM has standard business plan: HARDWARE STORE
Not "computor hardware".

[Humsafar]

Because Bohras have no use for their 'software', it must all be mortgaged to AM.

[pro_pig]

SWEETY OMABHARATI
I Dont like to spin how u do i know murtuza family frm india and when i was in boston for studies i know him frm that time too.any more details you wanted.i dont dont ask their personally things how much he is donate and how he is gonna do.

[SBM]

Dear Pro Pig
No sweety unless you belong to Non Hetrosexual kind(I am well entrenched to Hetrosexual gender) What school did you go to Boston because I am from Boston and went to one of the healthcare schools.
My or MF's question was not about how much Mr. Dahod gave but as per your quote the person who gave money to Saifee Hospital is not the same as the one who gave to build Boston Mosque and you said you knew the person well.
The question was if you knew him then you should have known that it was the same person.
Just accept your ignorance and stop being spinmeister.

[S. Insaf]

This reminds me of a old incident of my friend Asghar Anees from Nagpur who did B.E. Mechanical from V.J.T.I. from Bombay. He did not get a job for almost for one year though he had with hounor. Then he did B.E. Electrical but did not get a job again after applying to various firms. His Phupa (uncle) took him to Sayedna Burhanuddin Saheb and said Moula he has done B.E with hounors but not getting any job since last three years. And do you know what Sayedna Saheb asked him. "Tame B.A. karoo che?" Asgar said 'No'. So Sayedna Saheb advised him to do 'B.A.' and assured him that then he would defenitely get a job.
This shows how limited is Sayedna Saheb's knowledge!
Today Asghar Anees is in Sharja very well placed without doing B.A.

[AFirmBeliever]

Originally posted by kabeer19922001:
He should ask the person who gave him the raza.
What a sorry state of affairs. The guy is an MBA and Aqa Moula is telling him to do business.

With respect to raza how is this obtained i.e is a case file presented to AMoula? Does AM have the time or the expertise to go through each case.

Take for example this guy, he has been told to do business. AM must or should have known that the guy has no experince or funds(?). So now what. He goes aound asking everyone for help.

AM must have a mechanism to ensure that the a mechanism is set so that each of his raza is carried out. e.g this guy after been told that he should do business should be referred to a Bohri committe of businessmen, who could forumlate a strategy for him. Just telling him to do business would not be of any use.

Regards

[AFirmBeliever]

MBA got a better hold of business. You should be more aware of the careers around you. Business person with MBA got a better understanding and management. The person who gave the Razaa if you don't know - Aqa Maula knows why this man should go for a business and its up to the person ability to thrive his business and take it to the next level with Maulana's dua!

[AFirmBeliever]

Its hard to expl,ain ignorant people who doesn't know the importance of razaa!

[AFirmBeliever]

Whats "well placed" means to you? Just a decent job with average salary not owning your own property! How would you predict his future if he did his B.A.!

[accountability]

FB: You are right, How would anyone predict his future, if he didn't do his B.A.

By the way you know, BE is a post graduate programme, and BA is a graduate programme. How can you go back. Any university in the world wont give you admission for a graduate programme, if you already have a post graduate degree.

A little knowledge wont hurt much.

[SBM]

Hello Firmbeliever
You are right, how would one know the importance of Raza
SO DID YOU GET THE RAZA TO VISIT THIS SITE

[kabeer19922001]

GOOD CATCH - OMA

Waiting for FB reply

[tahir]

Acc'ty,
AS per my knowledge, BE (Bachelor of Engineering) is a graduate programme just like BA (Bachelor of Arts). This however doesn't dilute the point that advising someone to pursue BA after BE is pretty strange.

Mechanics and Arts are two diagonally opposite areas of interest. But then, dawoodi bohras can alternate "kharas" with "mithas" in the same meal !

[accountability]

Tahir,
You are right, BE is a graduate Programme. But it is quiet different from an arts graduate. It almost is equivelent to post graduate studies. After BE, one can do master in specific fields. BA requires 14 years of schooling, while BE requires 16 or 18 years (if done after B.Sc.)of schooling.

[tahir]

Originally posted by kabeer19922001:

What a sorry state of affairs. The guy is an MBA and Aqa Moula is telling him to do business.

....Take for example this guy, he has been told to do business. AM must or should have known that the guy has no experince or funds(?). So now what. He goes aound asking everyone for help.

To be fair to sayedna, there are more success stories of MBAs venturing into business than the ones joining corporates.

And no one has an inherent experience of funds. It comes only when you get into the thing.

[AFirmBeliever]

Raza is very important, if you know the meaning of it. It is upto individual how far one wants to go to take Raza for.

yes, the point I was going to make was commented by tahir. Maybe he wasn't fit what he was doing as a BE graduate. What would be his future as BA. How would one know! Would you guys? We as normal human being give advice from a our experience, our instinct and our knowlege.
So would you imagine Maulana with such great power and instinct can do!

yes, I still say : go look into your believes and try gaining some knowledge. Not saying be a fanatic but see what the foundation of your relion is based upon rather just blaming our Dai for hatred!

[accountability]

Firm believer: The point I am going to make, will require a thoughtfull venture.

"Raza" as we know it became known, or common since last two decades. There may be a concept before then, but not very forceful one.

The concept of raza, is very ambigeous for ordinary folks. Most of the bohras do it, for the sake of doing it, or most probably, they think that this in some strange way will help them achieve what they aspired.

It has never been explained by dawat, how does it work, does syedna saheb personelly look into all arzis, or someone on his behalf gets to look at it. I do not think, it is not possible for syedna saheb to look at all the arzis, so who ever is deputed to look into the matter, what position he is in, what is the spiritual value of that particular person.

I am a bit privy to how it works,(I mean someone who was privy told me) as a common practice syedna saheb is presented with all the list, syedna saheb gives it a quick glance of approval.
Then the reply is dispatched to various mozas (towns).

The concept of raza began in the later stage of daihood. That too in strictly religious obligations. It is not in Daim ul Islam or in fatmid doctorine.

You talked about knowing the relgion and its philosophy. But you did not elobrate. In none of your post, you even touched the real subject or any insight into it.

I am ready to ask questions, and I do not think that it amounts to any less respect for institution of dai.

We are all adults, sane enough to understand and be understood.

First I want to know, why sould we treat ourselves as slaves to syedna saheb. Do you think that slavery is appreciated in Religion Islam or in fatmid doctorine.

Second, why, asking about financial accountability amounts to infidelity or dis respect. According to which doctorine, if amil is asked why did he spend or asked so much money, will result in negation of religion.

Presious Toronto Amil Sh: Zuhair Bhai was asked about two cars, one for him and one for his wife. He did not answer.

The same thing applies to Muala's immediate family. Why are they free to go on a spending spree and not be accountable.

Our religion has three spritual positions, Dai, Mazoon and Mukasir. That do not include Dai's sons and grand sons and his inlaws.

Muala is a relgious leader and spritual one, why should his sons be called prince and shahzadas.

[tahir]

Originally posted by AFirmBeliever:

yes, I still say : go look into your believes and try gaining some knowledge. Not saying be a fanatic but see what the foundation of your relion is based upon rather just blaming our Dai for hatred!

Firm believer,
Are you sure you know the foundation of our religion? I can guess you don't since the modern dawat has either banned or tempered most of the fatimid literature to suit its greed.

In case you want to understand bohri history and religion well, there are many good articles on this site. I can understand that this sounds repulsive to you since most of your species are brainwashed into believing dawat's lies. But still try to shed the baggage for once and read them with open mind.

[AFirmBeliever]

Raza doesn't mean only Maulana has to give. As I said before (if you read carefully) Raza is important in "ISLAM" religion. We take Raza from our religious leader, our parents, grandparents to do things, as we look upon them and respect them. Why do we ask our elders for advice, to see if this is right/wrong. It is up to one mumineen to whom he or she wishes to take raza. Most of us go to Maulana as much as possible if not then we go to our local Amil or Shehzaada saheb. Yes, every raza that goes to Maulana is approve by Maulana. Remember, in any organized religion with structured administration (same as it would be in any political party) you will bound to come across fake people, people who loves playing politics etc. It seems to me that you listen to others more than what you see for yourself.
Why is Amil call Amil. Because he got that post to serve our mumineen. Maula can't ve everywhere at the same time. You talk about why so much of spendiff from Amil or Maulana's family. But haven't you heard about how much Maulana gives every masjid, every ashara, every visit, he announces millions for mumineen and that goes to give for Karzan. We ask for Karzan so we don't have to pay interest, where does all that Karzan money come from? So many mumineen bought houses, can start their business and for whatever reason, they get the money from karzan Hasana.

Yes, I talk about a great deal about knowing my religion. But where do you wnat me to start, its an ocean of information. And you keep learning (not what other tells you) but from Dawoodi books and literatures. You leatn about our culture not reform it. Let me tell you I like you have lots of questions on my religion you just have to find someone who can answer them. Like queries, doubts, suspects etc. Religion is not an easy path to foloow, we always as "adults" suspect, have our doubts, go clarify the,. You can ask me but I think its better you ask a better experience person, a person who are capable of giving sabak, who can open your mind to a greater length.

Originally posted by accountability:
Firm believer: The point I am going to make, will require a thoughtfull venture.

"Raza" as we know it became known, or common since last two decades. There may be a concept before then, but not very forceful one.

The concept of raza, is very ambigeous for ordinary folks. Most of the bohras do it, for the sake of doing it, or most probably, they think that this in some strange way will help them achieve what they aspired.

It has never been explained by dawat, how does it work, does syedna saheb personelly look into all arzis, or someone on his behalf gets to look at it. I do not think, it is not possible for syedna saheb to look at all the arzis, so who ever is deputed to look into the matter, what position he is in, what is the spiritual value of that particular person.

I am a bit privy to how it works,(I mean someone who was privy told me) as a common practice syedna saheb is presented with all the list, syedna saheb gives it a quick glance of approval.
Then the reply is dispatched to various mozas (towns).

The concept of raza began in the later stage of daihood. That too in strictly religious obligations. It is not in Daim ul Islam or in fatmid doctorine.

You talked about knowing the relgion and its philosophy. But you did not elobrate. In none of your post, you even touched the real subject or any insight into it.

I am ready to ask questions, and I do not think that it amounts to any less respect for institution of dai.

We are all adults, sane enough to understand and be understood.

First I want to know, why sould we treat ourselves as slaves to syedna saheb. Do you think that slavery is appreciated in Religion Islam or in fatmid doctorine.

Second, why, asking about financial accountability amounts to infidelity or dis respect. According to which doctorine, if amil is asked why did he spend or asked so much money, will result in negation of religion.

Presious Toronto Amil Sh: Zuhair Bhai was asked about two cars, one for him and one for his wife. He did not answer.

The same thing applies to Muala's immediate family. Why are they free to go on a spending spree and not be accountable.

Our religion has three spritual positions, Dai, Mazoon and Mukasir. That do not include Dai's sons and grand sons and his inlaws.

Muala is a relgious leader and spritual one, why should his sons be called prince and shahzadas.

[AFirmBeliever]

[Muala is a relgious leader and spritual one, why should his sons be called prince and shahzadas.[/QB][/QUOTE]

Why is prince Charles called "Prince" since childhood?

[AFirmBeliever]

QUOTE]Firm believer,
Are you sure you know the foundation of our religion? I can guess you don't since the modern dawat has either banned or tempered most of the fatimid literature to suit its greed.

In case you want to understand bohri history and religion well, there are many good articles on this site. I can understand that this sounds repulsive to you since most of your species are brainwashed into believing dawat's lies. But still try to shed the baggage for once and read them with open mind.[/QB][/QUOTE]

You seem to only guess taht dawat has banned the literatures. Guessing is what you believe in? I have my sourece, dawoodi books I can learn alot from, you keep learning there's no end to it. I don't need to get literatures from a non-religious (reformist) site to learn about my religion!
It takes alot to follow a path and nothing to divert from it!

[tahir]

Originally posted by AFirmBeliever:
QUOTE]
It takes alot to follow a path and nothing to divert from it!

On the contrary, its damn easy for the sheep to follow the herd but very difficult to break away.

The bohri sheep are herded by a con artist so it is even more difficult to divert.

[tahir]

Originally posted by AFirmBeliever:
QUOTE]I don't need to get literatures from a non-religious (reformist) site to learn about my religion!

Plzz keep those windows shut....light is harmful for you...

[Humlog]

They only make the bohris call them Shehzadas and shehzadis. Outside of the Bohrah community no body calls them Pinces's opr Princesses. If they did, They 'd be be laughed out of the society.

[AFirmBeliever]

You need to have a sense of togtherness which Reformist don't on the contrary! lol! Seems all reformist do is bark for their own personal issues. They reform 'coz they can't stick to the originality!

Originally posted by tahir:

Originally posted by AFirmBeliever:
QUOTE]
It takes alot to follow a path and nothing to divert from it!

On the contrary, its damn easy for the sheep to follow the herd but very difficult to break away.

The bohri sheep are herded by a con artist so it is even more difficult to divert.

[AFirmBeliever]

As long as my light is strong, other light don't do anything!

Originally posted by tahir:

Originally posted by AFirmBeliever:
QUOTE]I don't need to get literatures from a non-religious (reformist) site to learn about my religion!

Plzz keep those windows shut....light is harmful for you...