The legacy of Sayedna Mohammed Burhanuddin

[anajmi]

If you accuse He is fallible then you are indirectly accusing Imam to be fallible too.

Actually, the Imam is neither fallible nor infallible. He is invisible. And if he is invisible, then that means he is blind. This is one fact that all sci-fi movies get wrong. An invisible man would be blind because light would pass right through his eyes.

[Bohra spring]

I checked the meaning just to be sure

Some (or all) statements or teachings made by this person can be relied on to be certainly true.
This person always makes good and moral choices, and his actions may never be considered immoral or evil.
This person is always right, and never wrong or incorrect.

This is amazing that a Diai is regarded infallible.

So a Diai meeting a dictator , modi! apologising for insulting Sunni is never considered an error! it must be hiqmat.

Him not leaving a proper successor is not wrong

His administration being corrupt is not unethical if he is infallible

These are fantastic claims

[JC]

Sooner we forget this 'legacy' and move on, better .........

[true_abde]

Dai is infallible coz His actions and choices are by the Ilham of Imam uz Zaman....this is the basic principle in case you have forgotten or chose to ignore....

[zinger]

JC, the legacy of Burhanudidn Maula is such that he is remembered with love and respect the world over today and always will be. the sooner you remember that and move on, better

[DB- MUMBAIKAR]

JC, the legacy of Burhanudidn Maula is such that he is remembered with love and respect the world over today and always will be. the sooner you remember that and move on, better

Agree with the above but he (SMBs) should have during his life time and in his healthy days very clearly informed the community about the next in line after him !!... today our once illustrious community in a butt of jokes especially with non bohras because no clarity for the next in command is there and two claimants are fighting like some common roadside thugs..... The unfortunate part is that the majority followers of SMS are today cursing and abusing the brother of same Burhanuddin Maula whom we used to revere and who himself had appointed SKQ in the position of Mazoon... By saying this, I m not trying to justify SKQs claim of being the 53rd Dai, but the present situation in our community and events after SMBs demise definately raises so many doubts in our minds that it is also impossible to see SMS as the 53rd Dai..... May allah Ta'ala resolve this situation soon or else in the coming period the Dawoodi bohras will be a disintegrated and extinct community..

[zinger]

DBM bhai, wish you would enable your PM facility. some conversations are best had outside the public domain. would like to debate this with you but on a more one-on-one basis

anyways, here it is

Whether Burhanuddin Maula "clearly" appointed a successor or not is a different topic for another day. fact is that who he appointed as his successor is the one who we consider as Dai today, Mufaddal Maula.

Now, whether you chose to accept him or not is again, a different topic for another day.

Ask yourself this. Did you not accept Mufaddal Maula as the rightful Dai in the last 2 years? Ex-Mazun Maula has now claimed to be the next Dai, so now people have an option, but before 17th Jan, there was no option was there?

Basically, what im trying to say is that as of now, for all practical purposes, Burhanuddin Maula had annointed Mufaddal Maula as his sucessor

i completely agree with what you say. many non-muslim business partners of mine are asking me what the hell is going on. they dont laugh on my face, but im pretty sure they do behind my back. and with all this dirty linen being washed in public, im sure other Muslim communites are laughing at us too

[DB- MUMBAIKAR]

DBM bhai, wish you would enable your PM facility. some conversations are best had outside the public domain. would like to debate this with you but on a more one-on-one basis

anyways, here it is

Whether Burhanuddin Maula "clearly" appointed a successor or not is a different topic for another day. fact is that who he appointed as his successor is the one who we consider as Dai today, Mufaddal Maula.

- It is not a fact that Burhanuddin Maula himself appointed SMS as 53rd Dai. This was rather imposed on us by the inner circle...the flood of so called proofs and witnesses that came out (and is still coming out every other day till now !!!) only started after 17th January when one more claimant (SKQ) came in picture... This was because until 17th January, the common bohras had willingly or unwillingly accepted whatever was forced on them. As it is a known fact that the common bohras are not allowed to question anything that the kothar or "Kasre Aali" does and so we rather meekly accept even those edicts which are against us or may harm us materially or spiritually.

Now, whether you chose to accept him or not is again, a different topic for another day.

Ask yourself this. Did you not accept Mufaddal Maula as the rightful Dai in the last 2 years? Ex-Mazun Maula has now claimed to be the next Dai, so now people have an option, but before 17th Jan, there was no option was there?

- No I and many like me just could not accept SMS as Dai from the day it was announced or rather imposed on us. His arrogant attitude and behaviour does not make him fit for the position of a Dai. He is exactly opposite of Burhanudin Maula. The compassion and Noor of Burhanuddin Maula is completely missing in SMS. He is more like a shrewd monopolistic businessman who only talks tough and tries to justify that the common bohra are merely slaves who are suppose to serve only him and his extended family till qayamat.

Basically, what im trying to say is that as of now, for all practical purposes, Burhanuddin Maula had annointed Mufaddal Maula as his sucessor

- Dont know about what others say or what videos (Doctored or authentic only Allah knows best !!!) and other sources depict or try to impose on us but one thing is very clear that none have clearly heard from Burhanuddin Maula himself that SMS is annointed as next Dai... what was told was either heresay or misconveyed (by Dr Moiz !!!)


i completely agree with what you say. many non-muslim business partners of mine are asking me what the hell is going on. they dont laugh on my face, but im pretty sure they do behind my back. and with all this dirty linen being washed in public, im sure other Muslim communites are laughing at us too

[MMH]

DBM bhai, wish you would enable your PM facility. some conversations are best had outside the public domain. would like to debate this with you but on a more one-on-one basis

anyways, here it is

Whether Burhanuddin Maula "clearly" appointed a successor or not is a different topic for another day. fact is that who he appointed as his successor is the one who we consider as Dai today, Mufaddal Maula.

Now, whether you chose to accept him or not is again, a different topic for another day.

Ask yourself this. Did you not accept Mufaddal Maula as the rightful Dai in the last 2 years? Ex-Mazun Maula has now claimed to be the next Dai, so now people have an option, but before 17th Jan, there was no option was there?

Basically, what im trying to say is that as of now, for all practical purposes, Burhanuddin Maula had annointed Mufaddal Maula as his sucessor

i completely agree with what you say. many non-muslim business partners of mine are asking me what the hell is going on. they dont laugh on my face, but im pretty sure they do behind my back. and with all this dirty linen being washed in public, im sure other Muslim communites are laughing at us too

Zinger



Zinger, you might not agree with me on this but there was an element of doubt in everyone’s mind about SMS’s capabilities right from the time he was even ‘rumoured’ to be the next in line. Come on, none of Aqa Moula’s son’s were renowned for their deeni ilm or of being visionary leaders.

When their ‘wrong doings’ came to the forefront, call it KQ’s propaganda or whatever but that’s when people were more comfortable to voice their opinion about their observations of how misfit SMS seems for the job. The doubt was always there.

And yes, the successor cannot be appointed from ‘practical purposes’ as you would like. There is a spiritual connection with the daai, people would look at him for his wisdom, his foresightedness and his ability to influence his followers and he should be a reservoir of ilm and mind you, these aren’t trivial requirements…these are major components of the job which are clearly missing!!!

[DB- MUMBAIKAR]

DBM bhai, wish you would enable your PM facility. some conversations are best had outside the public domain. would like to debate this with you but on a more one-on-one basis

anyways, here it is

Whether Burhanuddin Maula "clearly" appointed a successor or not is a different topic for another day. fact is that who he appointed as his successor is the one who we consider as Dai today, Mufaddal Maula.

Now, whether you chose to accept him or not is again, a different topic for another day.

Ask yourself this. Did you not accept Mufaddal Maula as the rightful Dai in the last 2 years? Ex-Mazun Maula has now claimed to be the next Dai, so now people have an option, but before 17th Jan, there was no option was there?

Basically, what im trying to say is that as of now, for all practical purposes, Burhanuddin Maula had annointed Mufaddal Maula as his sucessor

i completely agree with what you say. many non-muslim business partners of mine are asking me what the hell is going on. they dont laugh on my face, but im pretty sure they do behind my back. and with all this dirty linen being washed in public, im sure other Muslim communites are laughing at us too

Zinger



Zinger, you might not agree with me on this but there was an element of doubt in everyone’s mind about SMS’s capabilities right from the time he was even ‘rumoured’ to be the next in line. Come on, none of Aqa Moula’s son’s were renowned for their deeni ilm or of being visionary leaders.

When their ‘wrong doings’ came to the forefront, call it KQ’s propaganda or whatever but that’s when people were more comfortable to voice their opinion about their observations of how misfit SMS seems for the job. The doubt was always there.

And yes, the successor cannot be appointed from ‘practical purposes’ as you would like. There is a spiritual connection with the daai, people would look at him for his wisdom, his foresightedness and his ability to influence his followers and he should be a reservoir of ilm and mind you, these aren’t trivial requirements…these are major components of the job which are clearly missing!!!

Well said....... I entirely agree with you......

[zinger]

that, MMH bhai, is the beauty of the democracy that we live in, we are all entitled to our opinions

anyways, jokes apart.

what were the doubts that people had about Mufaddal Maula capabilities? Has it not been mentioned somewhere on this forum that compared to Malek Ul Asthar BS and Quaid Johar BS, he was relatively unknown? i remember reading this some time back, honestly dont know when.
anyways, if he was unknown, how could people form an opinion about him?

you can form an opinion about someone after you see them in action, ill give you that, but how is it possible before? anyways, you can call these semantics

next point

what wrong doings came to the forefront? you think we are blind? you think we dont know how corrupt they are? believe me bro, no one is any kind of stranger to the corruption there, but agian, you say that doubts were always there, so im wondering how is it possible. or are they semantics again?

and i do believe you misunderstood my context of practical purposes. what i meant is that in the eyes of the world today, Mufaddal Maula IS the Dai, there is no denying that. whether you chose to have any kind of attachment to him is a secondary topic.

nobody is saying that foresightedness and ilm is a trivial matter, far from it, i COMPLETELY agree that these are integral, but i feel that in due course of time, it will become clear whether this is true or not (have edited this last line of mine)

[zinger]

DBM bhai, wish you would enable your PM facility. some conversations are best had outside the public domain. would like to debate this with you but on a more one-on-one basis

anyways, here it is

Whether Burhanuddin Maula "clearly" appointed a successor or not is a different topic for another day. fact is that who he appointed as his successor is the one who we consider as Dai today, Mufaddal Maula.

- It is not a fact that Burhanuddin Maula himself appointed SMS as 53rd Dai. This was rather imposed on us by the inner circle...the flood of so called proofs and witnesses that came out (and is still coming out every other day till now !!!) only started after 17th January when one more claimant (SKQ) came in picture... This was because until 17th January, the common bohras had willingly or unwillingly accepted whatever was forced on them. As it is a known fact that the common bohras are not allowed to question anything that the kothar or "Kasre Aali" does and so we rather meekly accept even those edicts which are against us or may harm us materially or spiritually. DBM bhai, i am not denying nor accepting what you say. see, i agree, there is no proof except what we were told. when nuss was done, but fact remains that it was accepted by all, reformists even, that Mufaddal Maula is the next Dai. you said it yourself, the word is ACCEPTED. now, unless it is proven to be otherwise, it doesnt look like we have a choice does it? Mufaddal Maula is currently the Dai of the Dawoodi Bohra community and ex-Mazun Maula is the person who is making the claim. the onus of proving it therefore, lies on Mazun Mauala. i have no doubt that if proven true, many will switch loyalties to ex-Mazun Maula but that is not because of a sense of loyalty but because he would be the leader. im not sure if im making myself clear, which is why i ask you to enable your pm facility, although the choice is yours

Now, whether you chose to accept him or not is again, a different topic for another day.

Ask yourself this. Did you not accept Mufaddal Maula as the rightful Dai in the last 2 years? Ex-Mazun Maula has now claimed to be the next Dai, so now people have an option, but before 17th Jan, there was no option was there?

- No I and many like me just could not accept SMS as Dai from the day it was announced or rather imposed on us. His arrogant attitude and behaviour does not make him fit for the position of a Dai. He is exactly opposite of Burhanudin Maula. The compassion and Noor of Burhanuddin Maula is completely missing in SMS. He is more like a shrewd monopolistic businessman who only talks tough and tries to justify that the common bohra are merely slaves who are suppose to serve only him and his extended family till qayamat. see DBM bhai, this is a personal choice. if truth be known, i never accepted Mufaddal Maula as our next Dai because for me, as long as Burhanuddin Maula was there, i refused to accept anyone else even as his next in line. however, today, no one is disputing it. yes, disputes have arisen because a new player has entered the fray, but again, whether you chose to accept him as your dai or not, if asked, im sure you would say that the dai of dawoodi bohras today is Syedna Mufaddal Saifuddin. mind you, im not forcing you to accept him as the dai, but you cannot deny that he was the Dai of the Dawoodi Bohra community either

Basically, what im trying to say is that as of now, for all practical purposes, Burhanuddin Maula had annointed Mufaddal Maula as his sucessor

- Dont know about what others say or what videos (Doctored or authentic only Allah knows best !!!) and other sources depict or try to impose on us but one thing is very clear that none have clearly heard from Burhanuddin Maula himself that SMS is annointed as next Dai... what was told was either heresay or misconveyed (by Dr Moiz !!!) again DBM bhai, i have had conversations in private with many from my side of the fence and i agree with you. i too, have not been able to make out the words but fact remains that Mufaddal Maula always, from that day on, was for all practical purposes, for the world to see, the next Dai in waiting. yes, there are and always will be conspiracy theories about Burhanuddin Maula being drugged and all, but neither you nor i know this to be true or false


i completely agree with what you say. many non-muslim business partners of mine are asking me what the hell is going on. they dont laugh on my face, but im pretty sure they do behind my back. and with all this dirty linen being washed in public, im sure other Muslim communites are laughing at us too

sorry, missed your posts. my replied in bold and blue

[humanbeing]

It is better to remain neutral and follow the path of righteousness, common sense and conscience. Rather than tag along any leader for practical purposes ! It is more difficult to live with suppressed conscience by denying the truth.

[DB- MUMBAIKAR]

sorry, missed your posts. my replied in bold and blue

thank you for your response.. My PM is enabled........ just a thought...isn't it is frustrating to live in this dilemma ?

[JC]

Zinger,

MB was a successor of an usurper, his father Taher Saifuddin who 'hijacked' bohra community and started running this is as their Jageer. If there is any legacy it is that how a conman hijacked a community and turned it into a cult and drifted them away from Islam. You think world recongnizes and remembers, WRONG ........... today majority of Muslims consider bohras non-Muslims (which was not the case till TS took over). In future years people will take lesson (and Ebrat) from this as soon this cult is going to disintegrate.

And for your comment that he appointed his successor in Muffadal is also totally wrong. This has been discussed at length and I do not intend to repeat.

So it is better you open your eyes, use your mind, realize the truth, accept a True Religion and then move on.

[MMH]

that, MMH bhai, is the beauty of the democracy that we live in, we are all entitled to our opinions

I am not bhai….probably your ben  and this is a more global forum so we definitely need to be tolerant of other people’s opinion.
anyways, jokes apart.

what were the doubts that people had about Mufaddal Maula capabilities? Has it not been mentioned somewhere on this forum that compared to Malek Ul Asthar BS and Quaid Johar BS, he was relatively unknown? i remember reading this some time back, honestly dont know when.
anyways, if he was unknown, how could people form an opinion about him?

If someone on this forum mentioned that he was unknown, that was not the opinion of the majority and the people who were in the close circle around this cartel of people who hung around the qasre aali….

I know he was heir apparent because our family does interact with them closely (the qasre aali people) and the rumours were quite strong at the time when mazoon saab faced physical assault in Surat.
you can form an opinion about someone after you see them in action, ill give you that, but how is it possible before? anyways, you can call these semantics
I don’t know what semantics means but haven’t we seen enough of SMS in action
e.g forgetting dafil aafaat doaas
forgetting the date when nass was revealed to him
Allowing laanat for weeks on his uncle
No sufficient matter in his waaz

The list goes on.

next point

what wrong doings came to the forefront? you think we are blind? you think we dont know how corrupt they are? believe me bro, no one is any kind of stranger to the corruption there, but agian, you say that doubts were always there, so im wondering how is it possible. or are they semantics again?


Yes, most of us are like the horses in a race whoe eyes are covered, so yes we are blind in a way.Wrong doings….the biggest of them all…laanat on his uncle who had the second highest position in the last 50 years in the daawat. Isnt that shameful enough?
How can you accept corruption in the least bit. This is not politics, this is not an educational system for God sake, this is about religion!!!

and i do believe you misunderstood my context of practical purposes. what i meant is that in the eyes of the world today, Mufaddal Maula IS the Dai, there is no denying that. whether you chose to have any kind of attachment to him is a secondary topic.
I don’t think there is a choice of having a spiritual connect my friend….you got my point wrong too. It is a pre-requisite!

nobody is saying that foresightedness and ilm is a trivial matter, far from it, i COMPLETELY agree that these are integral, but i feel that in due course of time, it will become clear whether this is true or not (have edited this last line of mine)

So be it…let the best man win!

[alam]

It is better to remain neutral and follow the path of righteousness, common sense and conscience. Rather than tag along any leader for practical purposes ! It is more difficult to live with suppressed conscience by denying the truth.

This is precious advice.

[zinger]

It is better to remain neutral and follow the path of righteousness, common sense and conscience. Rather than tag along any leader for practical purposes ! It is more difficult to live with suppressed conscience by denying the truth.

HB, no one is denying the truth bro, but fact remains, the Shia belief is based on the funda of a leader.
If you choose to deny it, then you best choose the other sect of Islam...

You always claim that you want to hold on the belief of the Duats 50 and earlier, yet in the same time, you refuse to follow a leader...???? you cant have it both ways bro

BTW, i completely buy into your last point!

[zinger]

@ MMH:


Sorry ben, my mistake. just assumed you were a man.

tolerance of other people's point of view is unfortunately, extreeeeeeemely rare a quality here. except for Porus, i cant think of anyone else. which is why i wish he would come back

the majority of people here actually had no idea who Mufaddal Maula was. go back to the topics of 3 years ago when news of the nuss on him broke. and if you were the "privileged" few who hung around the kothar, then you should have been here 3 years ago to enlighten us

never mind what semantics means, its besides the point (which by the way, is exactly the context of 'semantics' used here )

i can safely say that i hang around saner people. no one i know (except 1 jamaat member) said lanat on ex-Mazun Maula

after a certain point of time, corruption becomes part of our lives. you live in mumbai? if you do, then you will know exactly what i mean

i agree about the spiritual connect. i said attachment. the 2 can be safely placed in 2 separate bins, atleast in my head

yes, may the best man win!

[zinger]

@ DBM

its not enabled yet bhai. will continue this chat when it does

[anajmi]

HB, no one is denying the truth bro, but fact remains, the Shia belief is based on the funda of a leader.

It is ironical, that with one stroke from the master of us all, all of the dawoodi bohras have become disgraced. Let us say that the split between the two is 90/10. 90% believe that the 10% are disgraced and 10% believe the 90% are disgraced. And the best thing is that the sunnis didn't even have to do anything. So in the best case scenario, 10% of the followers of SMB are screwed and the worst case, 90% are screwed. If we go back to the beginning of this mess 50 generations ago and extrapolate, I think it would be safe to say that one way or another, all these followers of this "leader funda" are screwed.

[MMH]

@ MMH:


Sorry ben, my mistake. just assumed you were a man.

NP 


tolerance of other people's point of view is unfortunately, extreeeeeeemely rare a quality here. except for Porus, i cant think of anyone else. which is why i wish he would come back
Strange aint it, since we bohras are known to be tolerant and I am assuming that a majority on this forum are bohras. But yes! You are right, we aren’t the tolerant sorts- we did pray laanat on a man who dared to defy. We do not tolerate KQ because he is on the path of Haqq.

the majority of people here actually had no idea who Mufaddal Maula was. go back to the topics of 3 years ago when news of the nuss on him broke. and if you were the "privileged" few who hung around the kothar, then you should have been here 3 years ago to enlighten us

Forget this forum baba, Most of the people who probably don’t visit this forum knew he was 1st in line to the ‘throne’

never mind what semantics means, its besides the point (which by the way, is exactly the context of 'semantics' used here )

I shall ignore this as I haven’t yet found out what semantic means.

i can safely say that i hang around saner people. no one i know (except 1 jamaat member) said lanat on ex-Mazun Maula

Oh no, I have cousins in different parts of India (Mumbai and Gujarat and South and even Calcutta) who confirmed that laanat was said. Don’t limit your information to your group of people.

after a certain point of time, corruption becomes part of our lives. you live in mumbai? if you do, then you will know exactly what i mean

I am from Mumbai, don’t live there, even then not acceptable- at least not when it comes to having the right daai in place.

i agree about the spiritual connect. i said attachment. the 2 can be safely placed in 2 separate bins, atleast in my head
Hold your heart and ask yourself if you do have that spiritual connection with SMS. And if there is one, then good for you!

yes, may the best man win!

[alam]

. . .

i can safely say that i hang around saner people. no one i know (except 1 jamaat member) said lanat on ex-Mazun Maula

!

Zingerbhai, you got to admit you are privileged if you in Mumbai and know only 1 person who said lanut on ex-Mazun Maula. What bubble of a neighborhood to live in!

[way2go]

that, MMH bhai, is the beauty of the democracy that we live in, we are all entitled to our opinions

anyways, jokes apart.

what were the doubts that people had about Mufaddal Maula capabilities? Has it not been mentioned somewhere on this forum that compared to Malek Ul Asthar BS and Quaid Johar BS, he was relatively unknown? i remember reading this some time back, honestly dont know when.
anyways, if he was unknown, how could people form an opinion about him?

you can form an opinion about someone after you see them in action, ill give you that, but how is it possible before? anyways, you can call these semantics

next point

what wrong doings came to the forefront? you think we are blind? you think we dont know how corrupt they are? believe me bro, no one is any kind of stranger to the corruption there, but agian, you say that doubts were always there, so im wondering how is it possible. or are they semantics again?

and i do believe you misunderstood my context of practical purposes. what i meant is that in the eyes of the world today, Mufaddal Maula IS the Dai, there is no denying that. whether you chose to have any kind of attachment to him is a secondary topic.

nobody is saying that foresightedness and ilm is a trivial matter, far from it, i COMPLETELY agree that these are integral, but i feel that in due course of time, it will become clear whether this is true or not (have edited this last line of mine)

Mufaddal Bhaisaheb was NEVER unknown. Twenty eight years ago....when I got married I was told by my in laws to call the said person Mufaddal Moula. When I questioned why as I understood he was just Shezada Mufaddal Bhaisheb, I was told very firmly to call him so as he was going to be the next Syedna. They even had pictures of him along with Muqaddas Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin around their homes. I questioned my spouse about this ridiculous assumption and was told that everyone knows that he is going to be the next Moula. Mind you, this was 28 years ago and we all know the fitnat that was started against SKQ the Mazoon of the time was around the same time give or take a few years.
Fortunately for me my spouse supported me and hence I only called him Shezada Mufaddal Bhaisaheb.
Today, he still is only Mufaddal Bhaisaheb for me as I strongly believe the entire Nass episode to be fully orchestrated.

[james]

i can safely say that i hang around saner people. no one i know (except 1 jamaat member) said lanat on ex-Mazun Maula

Make no mistake. We would have done the same in the era of Prophet Mohammed (PBUH) if anyone else had claimed to be a Prophet of Allah SWT. (Nauzobillah)

[SBM]

i can safely say that i hang around saner people. no one i know (except 1 jamaat member) said lanat on ex-Mazun Maula

Make no mistake. We would have done the same in the era of Prophet Mohammed (PBUH) if anyone else had claimed to be a Prophet of Allah SWT. (Nauzobillah)

So you are comparing your FAKE DAI to the Prophet Mohammed (Nauzobillah)
And other thing Prophet Mohammed never sent laanaats on his enemy forget his own relatives,

[zinger]

. . .

i can safely say that i hang around saner people. no one i know (except 1 jamaat member) said lanat on ex-Mazun Maula

!

Zingerbhai, you got to admit you are privileged if you in Mumbai and know only 1 person who said lanut on ex-Mazun Maula. What bubble of a neighborhood to live in!

haa haa haa... who knows bhai, maybe i limit my circle of friends to good people only.

[zinger]

that, MMH bhai, is the beauty of the democracy that we live in, we are all entitled to our opinions

anyways, jokes apart.

what were the doubts that people had about Mufaddal Maula capabilities? Has it not been mentioned somewhere on this forum that compared to Malek Ul Asthar BS and Quaid Johar BS, he was relatively unknown? i remember reading this some time back, honestly dont know when.
anyways, if he was unknown, how could people form an opinion about him?

you can form an opinion about someone after you see them in action, ill give you that, but how is it possible before? anyways, you can call these semantics

next point

what wrong doings came to the forefront? you think we are blind? you think we dont know how corrupt they are? believe me bro, no one is any kind of stranger to the corruption there, but agian, you say that doubts were always there, so im wondering how is it possible. or are they semantics again?

and i do believe you misunderstood my context of practical purposes. what i meant is that in the eyes of the world today, Mufaddal Maula IS the Dai, there is no denying that. whether you chose to have any kind of attachment to him is a secondary topic.

nobody is saying that foresightedness and ilm is a trivial matter, far from it, i COMPLETELY agree that these are integral, but i feel that in due course of time, it will become clear whether this is true or not (have edited this last line of mine)

Mufaddal Bhaisaheb was NEVER unknown. Twenty eight years ago....when I got married I was told by my in laws to call the said person Mufaddal Moula. When I questioned why as I understood he was just Shezada Mufaddal Bhaisheb, I was told very firmly to call him so as he was going to be the next Syedna. They even had pictures of him along with Muqaddas Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin around their homes. I questioned my spouse about this ridiculous assumption and was told that everyone knows that he is going to be the next Moula. Mind you, this was 28 years ago and we all know the fitnat that was started against SKQ the Mazoon of the time was around the same time give or take a few years.
Fortunately for me my spouse supported me and hence I only called him Shezada Mufaddal Bhaisaheb.
Today, he still is only Mufaddal Bhaisaheb for me as I strongly believe the entire Nass episode to be fully orchestrated.

Damn, Alam is right... i've been living in some bubble only.....

[james]

haa haa haa... who knows bhai, maybe i limit my circle of friends to good people only.

On the contrary , faithful say " Auzubillah Samiul Alim Minashaitan Nirajeem " .

[zinger]

@ MMH:


Sorry ben, my mistake. just assumed you were a man.

NP 


tolerance of other people's point of view is unfortunately, extreeeeeeemely rare a quality here. except for Porus, i cant think of anyone else. which is why i wish he would come back
Strange aint it, since we bohras are known to be tolerant and I am assuming that a majority on this forum are bohras. But yes! You are right, we aren’t the tolerant sorts- we did pray laanat on a man who dared to defy. We do not tolerate KQ because he is on the path of Haqq. strangely enough, this forum is a contradiction of sorts i cannot fathom. not only is this forum the epitome of intolerance, but the exact opposite too... let me explain. there is zero tolerance here, towards anything that is Dawoodi Bohra... its cultures, its practices, its faith, its duats, its everything. which is why, you see us constantly fighting and defending it. at the same time, there is so much tolerance here, that it is mind-boggling... thats why we have non-Dawoodi Bohras here who are given free reign to abuse and mock and ridicule all things Dawoodi Bohra. and when people like Badrijanab and Qutbi Hero aka DB Londoner get up to defend it, the reformist bohras here tell them to shut up and treat the ones abusing our faith with utmost respect and reverence

the majority of people here actually had no idea who Mufaddal Maula was. go back to the topics of 3 years ago when news of the nuss on him broke. and if you were the "privileged" few who hung around the kothar, then you should have been here 3 years ago to enlighten us

Forget this forum baba, Most of the people who probably don’t visit this forum knew he was 1st in line to the ‘throne’ strangely enough, i have admitted to being surprised to this

never mind what semantics means, its besides the point (which by the way, is exactly the context of 'semantics' used here )

I shall ignore this as I haven’t yet found out what semantic means.

i can safely say that i hang around saner people. no one i know (except 1 jamaat member) said lanat on ex-Mazun Maula

Oh no, I have cousins in different parts of India (Mumbai and Gujarat and South and even Calcutta) who confirmed that laanat was said. Don’t limit your information to your group of people. no ben, i am not saying that lanat was said, i know it was. im just saying that thankfully i hang out with more mature people who dont

after a certain point of time, corruption becomes part of our lives. you live in mumbai? if you do, then you will know exactly what i mean

I am from Mumbai, don’t live there, even then not acceptable- at least not when it comes to having the right daai in place. agreed.... but im just saying that it has pervaded into the system. gonna take a lot of cleaning to get it out

i agree about the spiritual connect. i said attachment. the 2 can be safely placed in 2 separate bins, atleast in my head
Hold your heart and ask yourself if you do have that spiritual connection with SMS. And if there is one, then good for you!
attachment... maybe not... spiritual connect... maybe, but only because of the rutba, not necessarily the person

yes, may the best man win!

MMH ben, my points are in red