Dr. Zakir Naik says "Yazid may Allah be pleased wit

[Zeal]

I would also object if Zakir Naik has said yazid peace be upon him and he is a good person etc,

this may be a mistake or a misconception in his mind, or his research on karbala is not enough.

Karbala is surely an event to take sabaq from and Imam hussain and his kunba are surely the people from where dawoodi bohras should learn lessons of patience and tolerance(rather than just pujosh maatam)

But it is surely a pity that people like Hozefa want to throw scholars like Zakir Naik in jahannam for his good teachings about Islam to a wide range of audience around the world.

And there are tens of thousands of people who follow a person who supports and admires a clearly evident tyrant and cruel ruler like Modi.

Are we still living in a age of jaahilia(ignorance)?

[Nobigotry]

this may be a mistake or a misconception in his mind, or his research on karbala is not enough.

If his knowledge can be so deficient when it comes to a defining moment in the history of Islam then he can hardly inspire any confidence in any of his "teachings" unless of course you are as undiscerning as Zeal.

I give this man the benefit of the doubt and try and watch his programmes but usually give up after a few minutes as what he rants on about is an insult to anyone's (well almost anyone as we have to exclude our regular wahabis/salafis) intelligence. The other day someone asked him whether it was OK for a muslim to socialise with his non-Muslim neighbours and Dr No replied that he goes to many non-Muslim parties where alcohol is served and tries to convert his hosts and other guests because it is incumbent upon every Muslim to spread the Dawah! I am sure he gets a lot of repeat invitations

[Zeal]

Nobigotory,
You can continue with going to darees and keep yourself spiritually charged with purjosh maatam.

Zakir Naik types are not for you people who only just try to find faults with good people and reject them...
I try to concentrate on good things he preaches, for instance he emphasizes that Salaat is the most important type of ibadaah amongst others which Dawoodi Bohras and many other muslims fail to understand.

To send peace or Laanat on yazid might or might not benefit any muslim but Salaat with definitely insha-allah.

[Nobigotry]

You can continue with going to darees and keep yourself spiritually charged with purjosh maatam

Zeal - you are indeed very diserning! You do need preachers like Dr Naik as without them spelling out things for you you would remain untutored - you have rushed off with your response without even knowing that I am a Nizari Ismaili!

In the 70s there was a movie called "The Newscasters" in which there is a memorable line from Faye Dunaway: "the schooling I am getting is not worth the s***ing I am getting". You my brother are happy to tolerate a ton of nonsense for an ounce of good sense. As Dr Naik says only Islam says 2+2=4 - he would no doubt hold you up as proof of that statement

[Nobigotry]

for instance he emphasizes that Salaat is the most important type of ibadaah amongst others which Dawoodi Bohras and many other muslims fail to understand.

Care to elaborate on that statement?

[Zeal]

You my brother are happy to tolerate a ton of nonsense for an ounce of good sense.
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Sorry brother nizari,
I am no magician to know the faith of the people without they telling themselves.

I forgot for you guys salaat makes an ounce of good sense, for me its much more than a ton!

[anajmi]

I do not agree with what Zakir Naik says regarding Yazid, but Zakir Naik has done more to spread Islam than any shia leader anywhere on earth. What has the Dai done to spread Islam? Zilch. What has the Hazar Imam done to spread Islam? Nada. These are the followers of Hussain who can only throw money which they have a lot of.

[Nobigotry]

Zeal,

No point arguing with you - we will not find a common language to conduct a debate in! Little wonder Dr No has a hold over you. Continue flying the flag for Islam! Your impeccable logic should send shudders down the spine of the non-believers

[Zeal]

Little wonder Dr No has a hold over you.
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You got it slightly wrong,

Islam and its good things has a hold over me , just like Dr Aga ad his royalness has a hold over your baatin! (big wonder)

[Nobigotry]

Perhaps the topic should have been renamed Why Islam is hated so much Part 2. With Dr Naik spreading Islam and his zealots practicising his preaching how can Muslims be anything but hated?

[SBM]

Anjami quote
"No Shia leader had done more to spread Islam"
Till Aytullah Khomeini came in power, Hijab and Rida were not necessarily part of Islamic dress code. Khomeini gave Muslims more pride and self confidence than any Islamic leader in RECENT history

[Zeal]

Nobigotry,
You disclaimed maatam and darees, for you salaat is just an ounce of good, you do not seem to understand or appreciate the beauty of Islam , you hate preachers like Zakir Naik.

Question - what brings you here to this board and what are you debating for?

[Nobigotry]

I come to this board:

For the laughs I get from comedians like the zealots

To remind myself to be grateful to Allah for making me different from the zealots.

To realise how pathetic an individual can become if he is constantly fed unadulterated rubbish from the preachers like Naik.

Zeal - why don't you reread what I wrote (a clue - understand the Faye Dunaway line and you might realise how very wrong you are in stating I consider Salaat an ounce). If you are still struggling to get my drift then ask and someone with the patience will explain!

[tahir]

Originally posted by anajmi:
I do not agree with what Zakir Naik says regarding Yazid, but Zakir Naik has done more to spread Islam than any shia leader anywhere on earth. What has the Dai done to spread Islam? Zilch. What has the Hazar Imam done to spread Islam? Nada. These are the followers of Hussain who can only throw money which they have a lot of.

Here I have to agree with Anajmi. Even I cannot relate with Dr Zakir Naik's reasoning or his brand of Islam but the man is taking initiatives to ameliorate the Islamophobia in such a charged atmosphere.

On the other hand, the concept of interfatith debates is compelling the hitherto insulated muslims to open up to and atleast respect the other streams of faith (which they hitherto thought have no right to exist). The way Naik draws parallels between Quran and Hindu religious books is going to broaden muslim perspective in the long run.

Remember, it is very difficult to stand up and speak out when it is a fashion to hate and snigger you everywhere in the world.

[porus]

Originally posted by tahir:
[QBThe way Naik draws parallels between Quran and Hindu religious books is going to broaden muslim perspective in the long run.

[/QB]

He does not draw parallels. He says, using linguistic sleight of hand, that events and names in early Islamic history in Arabia were prophesied in the Vedas. He peddles that as truth, inferring that Hindus should heed their scriptures and become Muslims.

You must identify Muslim Scholars outside wahhabi/deobandi circle who will vouchsafe his "research". Hindu and Western scholars will only snigger.

[Nobigotry]

Totally agree with Pardesi and not because he is an Ismaili; I have already suggested before that the verses that he quotes from the Ved and the Puraan have been taken out of context and juxtaposed and stretched to fit his argument - a sleight as Pardesi says. Last night I was listening to one of his junior scholars talking about Christ in Islam. He stated that in not one of the 73 scriptures of the Roman Catholics or the 66 books of the Protestants did Christ say he was God but billions worship him as God. No they don't - they think he was the son of God! It is this sort of misinformation that makes the man dangerous.

[Zeal]

He stated that in not one of the 73 scriptures of the Roman Catholics or the 66 books of the Protestants did Christ say he was God but billions worship him as God. No they don't - they think he was the son of God! It is this sort of misinformation that makes the man dangerous.
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Nobigotory, now I think,
you have taken out the above out of context and juxtaposed and stretched to fit your argument !

I have watched this episode and when he says billions worship him as god , even a fool can interpret what he is trying to convey.
Do you think he believes christians consider jesus as god and no one above him??
Come out of your laughs Nobi...and take Islam and salaat seriously.

Ask allah to grant you a zealous attitude atleast when it comes to Islam(because if islam is not followed in its fundamentals, a muslim is not a true muslim),

come on this board to realise how pathetic an individual can become (like u)if he is constantly rules out the scholarly talks from the preachers like Naik.

[aftabm]

Seems like "my soap is better than yours" kind of tussle going on.

[Nobigotry]

even a fool can interpret what he is trying to convey.

Don't you mean only a fool can interpret?

Seems like "my soap is better than yours"

I was hesitant to call Peace TV a soaps channel but that is probably the genre in which it falls!

Brother Zeal - if you learn the nuances of the English language and understand my previous posts you might realise the folly of "preaching to the converted". Do not be stubborn; ask for help if you do not understand. Salaam

[tahir]

Originally posted by porus:
He says, using linguistic sleight of hand,

Agreed. Infact I was the first on this board to call him a 'charlaton'. My point is that with the 'sleight of hand', he is creating an interface where:
One, the world will become a less hostile place for muslims to live.
Two, Muslims will become more adaptive to their non islamic surroundings.

Naik's audience is not you and other intellectuals but the people who participate in communal riots. As long as he is getting success with his rhetoric 'Islam is a religion of peace', he doesn't care about the sniggers.

If you look at him as a 'scholar' you cannot help radicule him but if you look at him as a social worker you'll appreciate what he has achieved.

[Nobigotry]

[QUOTEIf you look at him as a 'scholar' you cannot help radicule him but if you look at him as a social worker you'll appreciate what he has achieved. ] [/QUOTE]

That is precisely the problem here - he is being treated as a scholar, and a scholar of the highest esteem, on these boards. I do not dispute that he is providing a "social" service but relying solely on people like him to educate the Muslim masses would be a dangerous solution. Have you heard him recommending that Muslims should "terrorise" wrongdoers?

[Zeal]

I do not dispute that he is providing a "social" service but relying solely on people like him to educate the Muslim masses would be a dangerous solution.
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Now this is where I think you assume certain things and then jump on you toes that you have said something exclusive.

who on the earth told you that people are relying solely on him to educate themselves? Believe me its only your immature interpretation (just like when u assumed he is preaching people that christians are wrong because they believe Jesus is their 'God')

I can see you kept quite on other points...so you are now thinking !:-)

I am definitely asking for help as you suggested to Allah to save me from your nizari nuances of english.

[Zeal]

That is precisely the problem here - he is being treated as a scholar, and a scholar of the highest esteem
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If you search in the dictionary the meaning of scholar you will find :
a learned person, esp. one who is engaged in research or study

He is engaged in the study of Quran(which he has by-hearted) and other religious books like veds, puran and bible, you can see him quoting verses from all of these books very frequently.

That proves he is a scholar.

Now remains the other point that he is being treated as a scholar of highest esteem....
Again a immature comment coming out of your mind.

I started writing on this topic saying that I like him when he preaches simple things to common muslims(which any good practicing muslim can do)

[Nobigotry]

Zeal,

I am sorry - I had not realised from your posts (although Allah alone knows why not) that you are so mature that during your school days English was not common amongst your community. You will not understand us imbeciles who were taught (yes at school!) to assess and analyse and where appropriate criticise "scholars". Its time to close this exchange with you - may Naik and Co guide you towards more terrorising of Hindus, Christians and Shias.Ameen.

Salaam

[Zeal]

may Naik and Co guide you towards more terrorising of Hindus, Christians and Shias.Ameen.
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May Allah forgive you for thinking so...

[anajmi]

Notbig

billions worship him as God. No they don't - they think he was the son of God!

Actually, christians do believe Jesus is God. They also believe that he is the son of God. They also believe that he is the Holy Ghost. They believe in Trinity. They believe that there are three and that the three are one. Now for someone like you, that will be difficult to understand. I guarantee you, if you were to debate Zakir Naik, he would make you wet your pants.

[porus]

Trinity is that God is One but simultaneously in three manifestations:
Father
Son = Jesus
Holy Spirit

Jesus is Son. He is neither Father nor Holy Spirit.

Nobigotry is correct.

[anajmi]

No, he is not. I am correct. And you can validate that by talking to a christian. I am not interested in your interpretation of the christian faith.

Now coming back to Zakir Naik. It is fortunate for most Muslims that their fate is not linked to scholars like Zakir Naik. All of them can turn out to be corrupt wahhabis and it still wouldn't matter. Now imagine the condition of the Ismailis. They have been linked to their Imam in such a way that they won't be separated even if they discover about their Imam's gambling, drinking and partying ways. Has anyone outside the jamatkhana ever heard the Hazar Imam talking about the Ismaili faith and why it is better? It is almost as if he wants to hide the fact that he leads a bunch of idiots.

[turbocanuck]

Originally posted by anajmi:
No, he is not. I am correct.

This is the attitude at home or else.......i'm gonna pull a 4:34 woman!! My way or the Mullah way...

[Nobigotry]

Porus,

Now you are being pedantic Facts must NEVER be allowed to come in the way of a good wahhabi theory.

And if a Christian, any Christian, says Jesus is all 3 elements of the Trinity then a pious and scholarly Muslim must accept it.

Does not the Quran make a reference to Trinity as Three and also that the Christians say that Jesus was a son of God?

Dr Naik already wets my pants - I cannot stop laughing at his explanations - heard the one about why polygamy is good?