Prayers in Qur'an

[Muslim First]

So is this Jumma prayer in addition to the other five you pray every day?

Pardesi Bhai

I am sorry you do not have rudimentary knowledge of Islam. I will explain to you.

Muslims have Jumma Prayers every Friday.

Jumma prayers are different then noon prayer. Zohr (Noon Prayer) has 4 obligatory Rakat.

In Jumma Muslim go to Masjid. Immediately after entering Masjid they offer 2 Rakat of prayer for entering Masjid. After Adhan there is time for offering 2 or 4 rakat of Sunna.
Then another Adhan and Imam delivers 2 part Khutba which has some obligatory format.
Then Iqamah is proclaimed and 2 Rakat Fird is prayed. Unlike Zohr prayer (4 Rakat) which are silent, on Jumma Imam recites Al-Fateha and Short Sura loudly.
After that Sunnah and Nafl prayers are offered and then back to work.

If you must travel then a Muslim is oblidge to offer 4 Rakat Fird of Zohr prayer.

I hope this will help you to understand our religion. It is different then Ismailism.

I bid you peace.

[Muslim First]

If he is really travelling then he may shorten Dhor prayer to 2 Rakat and may alos combine it with Asr prayer.

[Muslim First]

I pray Jumma in Boston

Reach Masjid around 12.50
Khutba 1 to 1:30-40
Fird, Sunnah and Nafl about 20 minutes.
Out od Masjid 1:40
In winter months might stick around Masjid to pray Asr at 2 PM

Including travelling I am out of office between 12:30 and 2:30

[anajmi]

Are you also willing to accept whatever else Ali has said?

So you agree that you are not willing to accept what Hazrat Ali said about the 5 prayers because you think he was lying and manipulating his governors because they were Sunnis. So you agree that according to the Ismailis, Hazrat Ali lied and manipulated some people?

I am willing to accept everything Hazrat Ali said which is in line with the quran and the sunnah of the prophet. Everything else is an Ismaili fabrication.

Danish has sent a nice link for MF to enjoy

That is what happens within the Ismaili jamatkhana on jumaa.

[znanwalla]

Najmi,

Then you are a hypocrite and rightfully so ! because you are now alleging that what else Ali said was not in line with the Quran and the Sunnah?

Now let us be very specific here.....let me know if ALL the muslims in ALL the countries they live in are able to ..." say the "Zuhr" (noon) prayers "with the people" (that is to say in congregation "when the shade of the wall of the GOATS' pen is equal to the wall"? Now this is quite specific direction from Ali and so unless you are able to exactly to do this, then you have not done so as directed and so you cannot convince me that this is what you are doing or following Ali's direction ?

Secondly Ali says..." Say the "asr" (afternoon prayers ) when the "sun is still shining" (in a portion of the day enough for covering the distance of "two farsakhs ( i.e. six miles)"....so are you sure you are doing this? or simply claiming you are following Ali? we all know you are known for lying !

Now what about your "Maghrib" (sunset)? Ali is again specific in this regard..."say maghrib prayers when he who is fasting, ends the fast and the pilgrim rushes "from arafat" to Mina....so confirm that you are pursuing this exactly the way you were directed and where is Arafat? and where is "Mina" ?

Okay now lets look at "Isha"? say this when the "twilight disappears"? does this happen uniformly everywhere and in all places and so how do you regulate all this? did you go back to ask Ali or his family or did your Mullahs make a ruling? or do all of you have your own home made adjustments?

And "say the prayers with the people as the weakest of them would do and not be a source of trouble to them?...so do you do this? and how? let us know....as far as I can see you are not following the specifications given by Ali and so your contention that the FIVE you follow is based on this is simply hyperbole and makes no sense as Ali is rather too specific in his design and order...and where is Arafat and Mina btw....zn

[znanwalla]

"That is what happens within the Ismaili jamatkhana on jumaa"


Really ! we thought that is where your mother goes and so has not been able to tell you who your father is upto now because she now does not know as she wasn't able to keep track....maybe we should ask MF he has any idea?...maybe the angels of Iblis whispered something in his ears ....zn

[anajmi]

znan,

Now you are displaying your ignorance about the clock. The more you talk to the Ismailis, the more retarded they prove themselves to be. Not that they were not retarded to begin with. I mean, if you are an Ismaili, you have to be retarded right?

[znanwalla]

Najmi,

So now you have NO real answers !

Hazrat Ali (Amirul Mominnen of the Sh'ias) did not make any exceptions about "clocks" or anything else...he was extremely specific....so your argument is baseless and frivolous..... thus the retardation is at your end as we are more intellignet than you to understand that Islam is an ever evolving and practical faith and need not only be practiced as it was practiced during the "medieval" times....you cannot give a "time-dimension" to Islam and that is what you are trying to preach, ignoramus that you are !

Plus you have not been able to explain why Ali is making specific mention of "Arafat" in his letter to the governor ? and how it relates to you now, for all intents and purpose?....Now Hazrat Ali in his sermon has said:

"The foremost in religion is the acknowledgement of HIM ! The perfection of acknowledgement in HIM is to testify HIM ! The perfection of testifying HIM is to believe in HIS Oneness !The perfection of believing is HIS Oneness is to regard HIM Pure ! and the perfection of HIS purity is to deny HIM Attributes because every attribute is a proof that is is different from that to which it is attributed and everything to which something is attributed is different from the attribute and then Hazrat continues....Thus whoever attaches attributes to God recognizes his "like" and so who recognizes his "like" regards HIm as TWO and who regards HIm as TWO recognizes PARTS for HIM and those who recognizes PARTS for him mistook GOD (HIM) and who mistook GOD pointed at HIM and who pointed at HIM admitted "limitations" for HIM and who admitted limitations for HIM "numbered" HIM

So Najmi you folks are not foremost in religion as I did say to you that you are idol worshippers and in breach of Real Tawhid as you confine HIM the Supreme God - the Exalted to the limitation what HE is or may be according to your own imagination and then you all contain and hold HIM restricted to it without negation, when HE - the Exalted is much more and beyond your imagination and so is Unique and stands alone ! To add insult to injury you claim you have an "unmediated" relationship with God...now this is hyperbole of the lowest order !

Hazrat Ali says..." praise is due to God whose worth cannot be DESCRIBED by speakers; whose bounties cannot be counted by calculators (and you are talking of clocks to me and us); and whose claim to Obedience cannot be satisfied by those who attempt to do so and you cannot appreciate the height of any intellectual courage nor understand the description of God as NO limits have been laid down; no eulogy exists; no time is ordained and no duration fixed for HE brought HIS creation through Omnipotence and dispersed winds through HIS Compassion and made firm the shaking earth with rocks..."

Najmi, so you guys should stop boasting as what you propagate are just lies and incendiary bull as you don't have any grasp of Tawhid or Islam for that matter and as God says..." Be Prostrate towards Adam and they prostrated EXCEPT Iblis (Satan)..." and Iblis is still barking incessantly all around us in sheer retardation and hypocrisy...so go and ride with MF....after yesterday's "Juma" whisperings he must be feeling charged to sit behind you on the scooter !!!!!............zn

[znanwalla]

MF..."Juma" prayers are for backward and jahalliyya people like you who are always susceptible to the whsiperings of Iblis....looks like your rudimentary knowledge is redundant !...zn

[Danish]

There's no such thing as "Friday prayers" in the Quran.

FRIDAY PRAYER
Qur’an 62:9-11
[Shakir 62:9] O you who believe! when the call is made for prayer on Friday, then hasten to the remembrance of Allah and leave off trading; that is better for you, if you know.
[Pooya/Ali Commentary 62:9]

Yawmil jumu-ah literally means "the day of congregation."

Yes, in 62:9 yawmil jumma means day/time of gathering/congregation and NOT Friday Prayers. The verse simply tells the believers to commit to their obligations/commitments (salat) at times of gatherings (yawmil jumma). Now what do the Arabized Muslims do instead, LOL?

[anajmi]

A letter from Hazrat Ali to his governors - from the Nahjul Balagha

Letter 52
A circular about prayers to the governors of all the provinces
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Lead the Zuhr prayer till the shadow of a wall becomes equal to the height of the wall, the Asr prayers can be performed till the sun is still bright and enough time of the day is left for a person to cover a distance of six miles. The Maghrib prayers should be performed when people break their fasts and when Hajj pilgrims return from Arafat. And the time for Ice (Isha) prayers is when the red glow of the even twilight disappears from the West, till one-third of the night is still left. The morning prayers are to be performed when there appears enough light of the dawn for a man to recognize the face of his companion.

While leading the prayers make them so short that the weakest among you may not feel tired to follow you and his strength and patience may not be over strained.

Can the Ismailis count from 1 to 5?

[znanwalla]

Najmi, Looks like you are defeated ! nothing new to say huh ! so repeating your old trash !

Please don't circumvent the issue with your cheesy remarks.....

Also you desperately picked this info in one of the Sh'ia Books "Nahjul Balagha"....and you are now convincing all of us here that when it suits your agenda you are pleading what Ali said as a basis for you to hang onto your FIVE whatever....now thats great !...shows you are unable to find anything in the Quran or your authentic books...


Your MF shows us an ayat from SHAKIR which you had denounced publicly ! so why is he showing us SHAKIR now ? or did the angels of Iblis do whisperings in his ears ?

Do not argue with them by the Quran because the Qur'an has many faces..." Najmi, why are you not cling to to this part of what Ali is saying?

AND

Ali also said to Malik al Ashtar an Nakha'i who was a close companion of Ali

" Communion with Allah":

" ... when you lead the prayers for the people it should neither be long or boring nor short as to be wasteful because among people there are sick as well as those who have needs of their own. When the prophet of Allah sent me to Yemen I enquired how I should offer prayers with them and he replied..."say the prayers as the weakest of them would say and be considerate of the believers..."

So does the above show one has to be rigid in any way? No !

Ali told Muawiya...."Thus We are superior first because of Kinship and secondly because of Obedience"

" And blood relations have the better claim in respect of one to the other, according to the Book of Allah..." ( Najmi check if you can find this ayah in your text)

Ali also told Muawiya..."Ummayyah cannot be like Hashim, nor Harb like Abd al Muttalib, nor can Abu Sufyan be like Abu Talib.....besides we have the distinction of Prophethood amongst us, by virtue of which we subdued the strong and raised up the down trodden and when Allah made arabia enter the fold of HIS religion and the people submitted to it willingly or unwillingly. you (muawiya) were amongst those who entered the religion either from Greed or from FEAR....." ( did you not read this Najmi)

In describing his family, Ali says..." They are the life for Knowledge and death for Ignorance and their forbearance tells you of their knowledge and their silence of their wisdom...they are the Pillars if Islam....and the asylums of its protection....they have understood the relgion.....NOT by heresy or from RELATERS becaue the RELATERS are many but those who udnerstand are few..."

" They (the opposers) have entered the ocean of disturbance and have taken to innovations instead of the Sunnah of the prophet and so whilst the believers have sunk down, the misguided and the liars are talking....We are the near ones, companions, treasure holders and the doors to the Sunnah and Houses are NOT entered save through our doors and so whoever enters from another door is a thief....the delicacies of the Quran are about the Ahl al Bayt and they are the treasures of Allah.."

So now Najmi, as you seem to follow Ali so fervently, do please listen to what he says huh....and this is a SERMON - not just a Caliph's letter - SERMON is given as the Imam...get the drift....

"Men whom neither merchandise nor any diverteh from the REMEMBRANCE of Allah and CONSTANCY in Prayer......" (24:37)

" And enjoin prayer on thy followers and adhere thou steadily unto it...." (20:132) and so the prophet used to enjoin his followers to prayers and to exert themselves for it...so where is the FIVE whatever?

Ali said..." Pledge yourself with prayer and remain steady on it...offer prayers as MUCH as POSSIBLE and seek nearness of Allah through it..."

So please go to sleep and don't waste our time unduly...Your FIVE are not sanctioned but just a general practice of Muslims....just the way it is your practice to subjugate women and keep them retarded veggies !


zn

[znanwalla]

"I pray Jumma in Boston

Reach Masjid around 12.50
Khutba 1 to 1:30-40
Fird, Sunnah and Nafl about 20 minutes.
Out od Masjid 1:40
In winter months might stick around Masjid to pray Asr at 2 PM

Including travelling I am out of office between 12:30 and 2:30..."

**************

So what you are saying MF is that as long as Najmi sanctions it for you you are free to do your innovations and adjustments and yet Najmi pretends that FIVE means FIVE the way prescribed by his Mullahs and yet you are saying there does exist flexibility and fluidity as long as the objectives are there and this is what we are saying to and I asked a clear question about "Jamabain us salaitan" and none of you answered...which means you too are following this and now hiding from the public and acting up and giving us a lie of the land...which means we are right !It is a Prophet's tradition ! so why are you guys barking at us....and your accusations are all false as you too follow the same practice we do...of "Jamabain us salaitan" procedure ....zn

[anajmi]

so repeating your old trash !

So now you are calling Nahjul Balagha trash? What a shame.

[znanwalla]

Najmi,

You can twist and turn as much as you want ! Show me my posting where I have said what you allege?...don't you have any rebut left then go to sleep.....Nahjul Balagha is OUR Book....you showed a letter sent to a Sunni dominated governors who were against Ali and even rebelled - also you have NOt been able to explain why Arafat was mentioned?...I also asked you a simple question...did Ali write as a caliph or as an Imam ! You have NOT answered !....why ? you have no answer !

I asked you clarifying questions.....you started to chase your tail....now you are again doing so as you have no steam left !...zn

[anajmi]

All those questions are irrelevant. The fact is Hazrat Ali (a big sunni as he was following the sunnah of the prophet) ordered the performance of 5 prayers. A practice that the Ismailis have rejected and hence are disbelievers of Hazrat Ali and worshippers of the fake Imam.

[znanwalla]

he was following the Sunnah of the prophet ! NOt of Umar and Uthman ! and NOt of the Umayyads ! or of the Abbassids ! Even the past Prophets brought their own Sunnah.....so were they muslims? or Sunnis? or what? as far as I know those who betrayed the prophet ! and those who are the enmies of the prophet ! and those who do not belong to the Umma of the prophet and are fake muslims are people like you....now can Amir ul Momineen follow such fake religion or sunnah? Nah...keep on dreaming pal....go and take MF for a ride....he is waiting....zn

[anajmi]

More incoherent blabber. Time to go to sleep.

[znanwalla]

Make sure you wear the bangles today and next week I will prescribe her knickers for you...you don't deserve anything else...you are not a man...zn