Dawoodi Bohra Forum

zinger wrote:while some would view it as an act of slavery, some would view it as an act of respect. As a Dai, i can guess one is entitled to the respect

This used to be the case in the time of Burhanuddin Maula too, im sure you would remember that.

These days however, it happens in front of Aamils too, which i find quite amusing

MMH wrote:Why do people keep their hands folded at such times?

rational_guy wrote:

MMH wrote:Why do people keep their hands folded at such times?

Also how come Shehzada Qusai Bhaisaheb is not folding his hands and standing panchgani photo. He did that for the 52nd Dai.

zohair1977 wrote:But please note that it is very thin line between act of slavery and act to respect,...

AmmarHussaini wrote:I tried to dig out details and it looks like people behind forum are very professional and operating from USA

ghulam muhammed wrote:Forwarded as received :-

Salam... Aqa Mola tus ye karam ane ehsan farmavi aawti kaal ni Qadambosi ni bethak ma hujaj ne yaad farmaya che. Aap sagla na hastak je sagla hujaj register hoi ye sagla ne aawti kaal ni bethak ni khabar urgently karo ane 11,000, 14,000 and 21,000 na Najwa-as-shukr araz kari bethak ni passes Faiz-e-Huseini Mumbai ni office si aawti kaale levaani rehse. Je sagla mumenin hazir thanar hoi ehna naam, e-jamat ane contact nos email na zariye Faiz ma urgently moklo. Passes limited che tesi jald si jald inform kari hujaj nu confirmation Faiz ni office thi haasil kari le. Koi bhi hujaj potana watan si Faiz si pass nu confirmation kida bagair nikle nahi.. Further instructions will follow.... Shukran.

zohair1977 wrote:

zinger wrote:while some would view it as an act of slavery, some would view it as an act of respect. As a Dai, i can guess one is entitled to the respect

This used to be the case in the time of Burhanuddin Maula too, im sure you would remember that.

These days however, it happens in front of Aamils too, which i find quite amusing

Well Mr, Zinger I don't understand and support any Un-Islamic act encouraged and established by any one including our Aqa Maula(s).

But I fully agree that if a person is genuinely at higher position (in that case at any location such as work, parents, school/college, etc) then that person is entitled to the respect. But please note that it is very thin line between act of slavery and act to respect, and one can easily fall into act of slavery if they don't understand what they are doing and simply blindly follows others.

Be honest and tell be that why almost every abde folds their hands and cry saying maola maola madad (and may other minnants and requests). Is maula really going to help any of us directly? Does not act of respect becomes act of slavery? The strange thing is that they know this very well but they let it go because it gives them more powers and die heart fans.

Hope I am making sense here...

humanbeing wrote:

zohair1977 wrote:But please note that it is very thin line between act of slavery and act to respect,...

Actually the line between respect and slavery is very distinct and thick for one to notice easily. What abdes do is slavery, any truthful leader in any position does not command or expect its followers to stand in such position. What abdes are doing is either slavery or worshipping. They deny worship so they are doing slavery.
There is no respect here, because respect has to be reciprocated by the leader, and a leader who allows, promotes, encourages such expression of slavery is not worth respecting..

zinger wrote:while some would view it as an act of slavery, some would view it as an act of respect. As a Dai, i can guess one is entitled to the respect

This used to be the case in the time of Burhanuddin Maula too, im sure you would remember that.

These days however, it happens in front of Aamils too, which i find quite amusing

zinger wrote:
you are absolutely right. what both parties, the Dawoodi Bohras and the Dai are doing is born out of years of habit.
The Dai is used to being respected and Dawoodi Bohras are used to giving respect.
How much of it is earned and how much is habit is another discussion though

There is no condition that respect has to be reciprocated. NaMo gets respect but never gives any in return. teachers and bosses expect but are not expected to return it (although that would be the right thing to do)

alam wrote:

zinger wrote:
you are absolutely right. what both parties, the Dawoodi Bohras and the Dai are doing is born out of years of habit.
The Dai is used to being respected and Dawoodi Bohras are used to giving respect.
How much of it is earned and how much is habit is another discussion though

There is no condition that respect has to be reciprocated. NaMo gets respect but never gives any in return. teachers and bosses expect but are not expected to return it (although that would be the right thing to do)

Zingerbhai, alas, IM ASSUMING YOU MEANT AT LAST AND NOT ALAS I am pleased to read you recognize this! Others have discussed this at Length also in different ways about mental conditioning. It is not just respect that we do out of habit. This is symbolic, and actually applies to so many areas of Dawoodi Bohra social, behavioral and emotional functioning.
We are creatures of decades of conditioning. How tough is it to break my chai habit! Or my nose picking habit! Or a sugar habit. Addictions to substances - virtually impossible to eliminate , but can be done, smoking, alcohol, overeating, and nowadays internet browsing. YEP, CAN BE DONE How hard is it to recognize these as unhealthy habits? Leave aside getting help? And then actually Changing into more healthy habits.

We in the Bohra culture have been habituated to "perceive" and "assume" the essential "black vs white" nature of our religious doctrine. We are programmed into taking for granted as TRUTH and NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH, whatever is said by our Dai. Because of this, abuses and excesses have been committed by Aqa Maula's family, agents Kothar, Aamil. That is precisely how our religion and beliefs have been so gradually hijacked. Becaue we are habituated to "not question anything", we have become Habituated to "Accept everything".THAT IS TRUE. EVEN NOW, IT IS NOT THAT I DONT BELIEVE IN THE DAI, I BELIEVE MUFADDAL MAULA IS, AS OF NOW, THE LEGALLY APPOINTED DAI, THERE IS PROOF, UNCLEAR AS IT MAY BE, BUT PROOF NONETHLESS THAT HE IS THE NEXT DAI, BUT YES,I CANNOT TOLEARTE SOME OF HIS POLICIES. PUT IT DOWN TO HIKMAT, BUT I HAVE DECIDED TO TAKE HIKMAT WITH SOME DOUBT

The first step is to RECOGNIZE that we are on auto-pilot mode, in robotic mode. You, me, our bhaio and behnos, our parents and grandparents, etc. etc..
Of course, there are many, many more steps to take. . .

After all, our prophet (PBUH) was unlettered

dal-chaval-palidu wrote:truth seeker100,

I have my doubts about the nass and some of the bayans and actions of Muffadal Moula have really turned me off, but I must admit that passing more than 7th grade or the ability to speak good English is not the criteria for a dai. That Muffadal Moula does not have either of the two attriutes is not good, but it is not clear that is any basis of disaqualification for this position. After all, our prophet (PBUH) was unlettered, most of the dais up until now were not formally educated either.

Akhtiar Wahid wrote:@MMH bhai or Bhen, i do not know your gender sorry,
So you mean to say that Ladies from Muslimeen Ummah the Whole Ummah e ahle sunna and Shias who wear Burkha as there religious decent clothing (Their Jewel) are not the chosen, SMB (RA) was a Dai he was not any manifestation of god messenger or his representative, so Whatever he said about Rida as a selected outfit for chosen people like us bohras is it completely right!?!
At the time of Prophet there was Hijab and Burkha and yes all the companions and Muminaat during that time were also the chosen one.
So this specifically pointing out Rida factor, is complete Bull crap!
and the funny part is SPORTS RIDA, ridiculous!

canadian wrote:^
MMH ben:
Long ago in the fifties there was a movie song (if my memory serves right the film was “saiyan”) which said some thing like “When you die and go to your grave, God will ask you: ‘I gave you such beauty- why did you hide it behind a burqa?’"
Sorry, unlike others (AZ, GM, Mkenya, et al), my Urdu/Hindi language skills are poor; but the gist of the song was: beauty is to be appreciated and not to be hidden from people. I consider burqa or rida to be an abomination imposed by dirty old powerful men upon women to subjugate them.

canadian wrote:^
MMH ben:


Long ago in the fifties there was a movie song (if my memory serves right the film was “saiyan”) which said some thing like “When you die and go to your grave, God will ask you: ‘I gave you such beauty- why did you hide it behind a burqa?’"
Sorry, unlike others (AZ, GM, Mkenya, et al), my Urdu/Hindi language skills are poor; but the gist of the song was: beauty is to be appreciated and not to be hidden from people. I consider burqa or rida to be an abomination imposed by dirty old powerful men upon women to subjugate them.

This year, during Ashara Mubarakah, In waaz talaqqi session in Fatemi Masjid, Raudat Tahera, one muminaat bahen gave a very nice example, an eye openerfor those who wear Rida on western outfits.
She said, just imagine if right now suddenly Aqa Maula TUS gives Qadambosi Sharaf to Muminaat baheno,then will you be able to go forward for Qadambosi knowing the fact what you are wearing inside?.

humanbeing wrote:One of the latent idea in the promotion of rida was to drill down the “ehsaan” and “karam” of the maulas ! phew, these guys don’t get tired in their self glorification !

This year, during Ashara Mubarakah, In waaz talaqqi session in Fatemi Masjid, Raudat Tahera, one muminaat bahen gave a very nice example, an eye openerfor those who wear Rida on western outfits.
She said, just imagine if right now suddenly Aqa Maula TUS gives Qadambosi Sharaf to Muminaat baheno,then will you be able to go forward for Qadambosi knowing the fact what you are wearing inside?.

Why would anyone care what a woman is wearing inside the rida ?