The 48th to the 49th Imam..descendency???

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<br>answer is simple.<br>So called HI is from Allah. That is 99.9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 percentAllah. Therefore he can make any rules he dam'n pleases.<p>Wasalaam<br>

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Hazar Imam is the one vested with everything.<p>36:12 – <br>“And WE HAVE VESTED EVERYTHING IN THE MANIFEST IMAM.”]<p>Notice the word "EVERYTHING".<br>All authority on earth belongs to him.<p>

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Qiyam,<p>My question:<p>How can an Imam disappear for 800 years without a trace?

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Dear Nizari,<br>You did not answer the question...I already know the qualification of the Imam.<p>The thing that makes an Imam is first being the son of present Imam...thus being from his seed. The current Nizari Imam is the son of the son of an Imam...not the son of the Imam.

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How can an Imam disappear for 800 years without a trace? <p>---The same way the Imam went in to hiddening for 200 years the first time. Imam is commanded by Allah and Allah can do anything He wants.

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qiyam<p>The 48th Imam designated his grandson because, per his memoirs, he wanted a modern Imam to lead the imammate - one that was born in the atomic age.<p>

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br. nizari<p>The ayath 36:12 that you quoted or the "MANIFEST IMAM" has been translated as <br>"MANIFEST BOOK" in major english translations.(courtesy of the sunnis)<br>

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Hey Qiyam<p>You answered your own question:<br>"Imam is commanded by Allah and Allah can do anything He wants."<p>If according to you the Imam can go disappear for a near millenium, then surely without doubt, the Imam can appoint his grandson to succeed him.<br>

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Qiyam, once again i ask you<p><br>Who was the Imam before Abraham?<br>Who was the Imam before Ali?

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Abraham received Imamat from his holy ancestor Melchizedek - The Priest of God Most High.<p>Despite your claims of Melchizedek being insignificant, he is highly revered in Judaic, Christian, and Islamic traditions.

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Dear Hafeez,<br>The both sons of the 48th also lived in the atomic age. In fact, Prince Aly Salomone (d. 1970) was a fighter pilot.<p>Dear Nizari,<br>We've had this discussion...and you know very little about Biblical history.<p>Between Shem and Abraham..there were 8 descendants...named by Judaic scriptures...and Melchizik is one of them!!!<p>I already written Imam Jafar Sadiq's lineage back to Adam Nabi...according to Imam Jafar Sadiq...and Melchizik is one of them!!! <p>You still have not answered the question...the 48th Imam picked then grandson over the living two sons. Why?

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Qiyam<p>You are full of ignorance regarding Melchizedek. <br>You have never quoted any source on him.<br>Plz. quote on Melchizedek's genealogy if you say you know so much.<p>"Between Shem and Abraham..there were 8 descendants...named by Judaic scriptures...and Melchizik is one of them!!!"<p> - No, according to Judaic traditions Melchizedek and Shem were the same person. <br>In the Bible, Melchizedek - blesses Abraham and collects tithes from him, showing his superiority over Abraham. <br>Then in the Quran we see the Imamat being given to Abraham.<br>Thus the Imamat was passed on to Abraham from his holy ancestor Melchizedek (the first pre-flood Priest/Imam, who by the way, lived into Abraham's time). That leaves a gap of 8 generations. Surely if the Imamat skips 8 generations, why should it not be able to skip one generation. <p>

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Genesis 14<p>3 “Then MELCHIZEDEK, the King of Salem (SALEM = ISLAM) and THE PRIEST [IMAM] OF GOD MOST HIGH (EL-ELYON, AL-ALYYUN), brought him bread and wine.” <p>4 “MELCHIZEDEK BLESSED ABRAM with this blessing: Blessed be Abram by God Most High, Creator of heaven and earth.” <p>5 “And blessed be God Most High, who has helped you conquer your enemies. THEN ABRAM GAVE MELCHIZEDEK A TENTH OF ALL THE GOODS HE HAD RECOVERED.”<p>Hebrews 7<p>6 This Melchizedek was King of Salem (ISLAM) and Priest [IMAM] of God Most High (El-Elyon). He met Abraham returning from the defeat of the kings and blessed him, <p>7 And Abraham gave him a tenth (ZAKAT) of everything. First, his name means “king of righteousness”; then also, “king of Salem” means “king of peace” (or King of Islam) <p>8 Without father or mother, without genealogy, without beginning of days or end of life, but made [Divine] like the Son of God, ABIDETH A PRIEST CONTINUALLY.<p>This tradition is recorded by the first-century Jewish historian Flavius Josephus in his book, The Great Roman-Jewish War. Josephus writes:<br>"But he who first built (the city of Jerusalem) was a potent man among the Canaanites, and is in our tongue called Melchizedek, 'The Righteous King', for such he really was; on which account he was (there) the first priest of God, and first built a temple (there), and called the city Jerusalem, which was formerly called Salem."<br>The Dead Scrolls A New Translation <br>Wise, Abegg & Cook pp. 455 457:<br>“For our author MELCHIZEDEK is an enormously EXALTED DIVINE Being, to whom ARE APPLIED NAMES that are generally RESERVED FOR GOD ALONE, THE HEBREW NAMES EL AND ELOHIM.”<br>"MELCHIZEDEK IS SUBSTITUTED EVEN FOR THE MOST HOLY NAME OF ISRAEL'S GOD, YAHWEH. YET MORE REMARKABLY, MELCHIZEDEK IS SAID TO ATONE FOR THE SINS OF THE RIGHTEOUS AND TO EXECUTE JUDGMENT UPON THE WICKED ACTIONS USUALLY ASSOCIATED WITH GOD HIMSELF. BY THE POWER OF MELCHIZEDEK, dominion on earth shall pass from Satan (here called belial) to the righteous SONS OF LIGHT. This latter group constitutes those who are predestined to belong to the PARTY OF MELCHIZEDEK, the congregation of the sons of righteousness. These people heed the message of a second figure described in this writing as the messenger. The messenger, also designated ANOINTED OF THE SPIRIT (Messiah), is conceived of as coming with a message from god, a message explicating the course of history (that is, a declaration of when the end shall come) and teaching about god's truths. This figure dies, an event that may correspond somehow with the text's references to jubilee periods. <p>Isaiah 52:7 “How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of the messenger who announces peace, who brings good news, who announces salvation, who says to Zion "Your divine being reigns.”<br>Isaiah 61:2 “to proclaim the year of the LORD`s favour, the day of the vengeance of our God; to comfort all who mourn”<br>Psalms 7:7,8 “Over it take your seat in the highest heaven; A divine being will judge the peoples”<br>Psalms 82:1 “A godlike being has taken his place in the council of God; in the midst of divine beings he holds judgement”<p>The Holy Institution of Imamat is held by an Ever-Living and Present Holy Imam. This practice has continued since the time and revelation of the Eternal High Priest Melchizedek. The Scriptures describe Melchizedek as a Divine Being – and an Eternal Priest for all times – this is the Holy Imamat in biblical terms.<p>So even in the Bible we see Imamat - Priesthood - continuity.<p>

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qiyam,<p>Who the 48th Imam chose was his prerogative and the Imam excersized that and chose the 'Atomic Age Imam' or the grandson.<p>

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Dear Nizari,<br>It ascound mean how little you about biblical scholarship...to misquote so blantantly and reference unreliable dictation. Priest or the actual term rabbi..doesn't mean IMAM. Melchizek was a rabbi. Get through your head. And there were many priest. Every temple had a high priest, with many sub priests. They were not incharge of the community. They didn't give interpretation of the Torah. The only function was to maintain the sanctity of the temple. The custom was to give a tenth of a war booty to the local temple...which was in Jersaleum, which is what Abram did. They weren't even related.<p>I think you NEED to read a more authicated book on the bible!!

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Beavis and Butthead do christianity.

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according to Qiyam<p>The Holy Imam is ONLY a rabbi.<p>In the Old Testament, priests were not ordinary people, they were holy and sanctified. <p>YOU don't know bible history.<p>You have ignored the below from the book on the Dead Sea Scrolls:<p>"For our author MELCHIZEDEK is an enormously EXALTED DIVINE Being, to whom ARE APPLIED NAMES that are generally RESERVED FOR GOD ALONE, THE HEBREW NAMES EL AND ELOHIM.”<br>"MELCHIZEDEK IS SUBSTITUTED EVEN FOR THE MOST HOLY NAME OF ISRAEL'S GOD, YAHWEH. YET MORE REMARKABLY, MELCHIZEDEK IS SAID TO ATONE FOR THE SINS OF THE RIGHTEOUS AND TO EXECUTE JUDGMENT UPON THE WICKED ACTIONS USUALLY ASSOCIATED WITH GOD HIMSELF. BY THE POWER OF MELCHIZEDEK, dominion on earth shall pass from Satan (here called belial) to the righteous SONS OF LIGHT. This latter group constitutes those who are predestined to belong to the PARTY OF MELCHIZEDEK, the congregation of the sons of righteousness. These people heed the message of a second figure described in this writing as the messenger. The messenger, also designated ANOINTED OF THE SPIRIT (Messiah), is conceived of as coming with a message from god, a message explicating the course of history (that is, a declaration of when the end shall come) and teaching about god's truths. This figure dies, an event that may correspond somehow with the text's references to jubilee periods." <p>your ignorance and arrogance will prevent you from ever finding the truth.<br>

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---I think you NEED to read a more authicated book on the bible!!---<p>And, you all should only FOCUS on the Quran and the Sunnah(sahih hadeets) because everything thing else under the heavens has been abrogated including your Ghaib Imam!<br>

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Hafeez,<br>The Imam is not God on earth...he does what Allah commands!!!<p>HI Karim Agha is the seed of Aly Salomone not that of Nizari Imam Sultan Muhammad Shah.<p>It is requirement that the future Imam is a direct descendant...not an indirect descendant of the Imam.<p><p><p>

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Qiyam,<p>at least back up your ridiculous claims with some proof is you think you are so smart.

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Hafeez,<br>I stated that because Nizari loves quoted the bible more than the Quran.

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Butthead says "Owning a Casino does not mean one gambles.<br>That is called doing business, and there is nothing un-islamic about doing business.<br>The Prophet himself was a businessman. Is he a fraud too?"<p>You've now got your own foot in your mouth, butthead.<p>Beavis and Butthead do the HI

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Qiyam,<p>36:12 - "We have vested everything in the manifest Imam."<p>read and reflect<p>Imam has absolute authority on all religious matters.<br>

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Qiyam<br>Thank you for your valued opinion. We shall take that into consideration and get back to you. Pls do not call us; we will call you.<br>

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Qiyam,<p>2:124 – “And remember that Abraham was tried by his Lord with certain commands, which he fulfilled: He said: "I WILL MAKE THEE AN IMAM TO THE NATIONS." He pleaded: "And also (IMAMS) from my offspring!" He answered: "But My Promise is not within the reach of evil-doers."<p>Now if at this moment, Abraham was made Imam, according to you, who held the Imamat before him???

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Nizari,<br>When you've nothing to support your wild theories...you tell me support mine!? Well I already did...how soon you forget.<p>I recorded on a previous thread on this topic the lineage of Abraham back to Adam via biblical source..and the lineage of Imam Jafar Sadiq back to Adam Nabi...with actual Shiah sources. Look for yourself.

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Qiyam,<p>you have a reputation on this board of not quoting anything.<p>If you say you have, show me right here and now.

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Qiyam,<p>you have a reputation on this board of not quoting anything.<p>If you say you have, show me right here and now.

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Nobody, butthead, otherwise Allah did not have to make Abraham an Imam, he would've automatically become one!!

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Nizari and hafeez,<p>I am only one a few people that actually quote thing from book...unlike you.<p>See original discussion<br>http://www.dawoodi-bohras.com/ubb/Forum ... l<p>posted 02-04-2002 07:44 PM ET (US)<p>Chart of Biblical Lineage<br>http://www.creationsensation.com/Creati ... <br>posted 02-04-2002 10:17 AM ET (US) <br>Lineage per Hiyat al'Qulub (part of Bihar Anwar) as per Imam Jafar Sadiq:<p>MUHAMMAD, abdullah, abdul muttalib, hashim, abda minaf, kasy, kalab, merrah, lovay, ghalib, kaher, malik, al'nazar, kananah, hezeemah, mudrakah, ilyas, muzr, nazar, mad, adnan, ad, ader, alyesa, alhamyesa, SALAMAN,albinet, hamel, kaydar, ismaeel, IBRAHIM KHALIL, tarikh, nakhor, sharugh, arghoo, taligh, auber, shalikh, arfahshed, sam, NUH, malik, metushalakh, akhnookh, albariz, mahlaeel, keenan, anoosh, shays, ADAM<br>