Looking for 2 books

[zinger]

1. The Book of Namaz
It is complied by Mohammed Shaikh Sajjadhussain
Published by Nairobi Group Charitable Society

2, Kitabus Salaat - The Book of Five Daily Prayer
Compiled by Ahmed Luqmani
Published by 1986 Bohra Reformist Trust UK

If anyone has a scan copy of these, i would be much obliged

[SBM]

Here it is

[DisillusionedDB]

I have one which I got it from here itself. It was in 2 parts which I combined into one file. Hope it helps.

[zinger]

Many thanks to both.

Looks like many people wanted it besides just me

[DisillusionedDB]

You are welcome

[zinger]

ok another question now.

We started Nabi na naam from last night right.

i know that the nabi na naam is for Adam AS, Eve AS, Noah AS, Abraham AS, Moses AS, Jesus AS, RasulAllah SAW and all the other prophets Jameeil Ambiye

My query was what are the meaning of the words in bold

Abeena Adama Saifillahe wa alehi ajmeein

Hawwah al motah harrate minarijse wa alehi ajmeein

Nueehin Najiyeeyilahe wa aalehi ajmein

Ibrahim Khallilahewa aalehi ajmein

Moosa Kaleemilahe wa aalehi ajmein

Isa Roohellahe wa aalehi ajmein

jameeil ambiye wa mursalina wa aalehi ajmein

please excuse the spelling mistakes

replies will be much obliged

[Bohra spring]

You are welcome

There was a book authored by an mulla who was leading reformist in Nairobi, about 30 years ago that had English meaning of what we recite in wudoo,namaz and duas. I remember was sold by the late owner of central dairy & meat owners at cost as service to the reformist and enlightened orthodox community . I had a copy but it was lost when I moved around cities, countries

Does anyone have scanned copy of it ?

secondly is there similar books authored in India that give meaning of wazae foona ,etc ?

[dal-chaval-palidu]

ok another question now.

We started Nabi na naam from last night right.

i know that the nabi na naam is for Adam AS, Eve AS, Noah AS, Abraham AS, Moses AS, Jesus AS, RasulAllah SAW and all the other prophets Jameeil Ambiye

My query was what are the meaning of the words in bold

Abeena Adama Saifillahe wa alehi ajmeein

Hawwah al motah harrate minarijse wa alehi ajmeein

Nueehin Najiyeeyilahe wa aalehi ajmein

Ibrahim Khallilahewa aalehi ajmein

Moosa Kaleemilahe wa aalehi ajmein

Isa Roohellahe wa aalehi ajmein

jameeil ambiye wa mursalina wa aalehi ajmein

please excuse the spelling mistakes

replies will be much obliged

I am no expert but I know (hopefully) a little, so I will tell you what I think.

Ibrahim Nabi: Khallilallah (Khalil means a friend), and he is referred to as a friend of Allah. This comes from [Surah 4: Verse 125], the last part of which can be translated as "For Allah did take Ibrahim for a friend".

Musa Kaleemillah (One to whom Allah spoke directly). [Surah 4: Verse 164]: And to Moses Allah spoke direct. Hence he is referred to by the respected title "One to whom Allah spoke direct". Also [Surah 19: Verse 52]: And we called him From the right side of Mount (Sinai), and made him draw near to Us for mystic (conversation).

Isa Nabi: I am guessing Roohillah as one supported by the Holy Spirit (my guess).
Mohammad (SAW) Rasullah, as the Rasul (messenger) through whom Allah brought forth the book (Holy Quran), that being the most important miracle of Prophet Mohammad's ministry.
-----------

I want to be clear that I am just a starting student of Islam. Am no expert. This is just my humble effort, and if I am wrong, I will appreciate being corrected. Also, the translation is from Abdullah Yusuf Ali.

[DisillusionedDB]

You are welcome

There was a book authored by an mulla who was leading reformist in Nairobi, about 30 years ago that had English meaning of what we recite in wudoo,namaz and duas. I remember was sold by the late owner of central dairy & meat owners at cost as service to the reformist and enlightened orthodox community . I had a copy but it was lost when I moved around cities, countries

Does anyone have scanned copy of it ?

secondly is there similar books authored in India that give meaning of wazae foona ,etc ?

The book that SBM uploaded is by Mohammed Shaikh Sajjadhusain from Nairobi. Maybe it's the one you are referring to.

[zinger]

You are welcome

There was a book authored by an mulla who was leading reformist in Nairobi, about 30 years ago that had English meaning of what we recite in wudoo,namaz and duas. I remember was sold by the late owner of central dairy & meat owners at cost as service to the reformist and enlightened orthodox community . I had a copy but it was lost when I moved around cities, countries

Does anyone have scanned copy of it ?

secondly is there similar books authored in India that give meaning of wazae foona ,etc ?

i think that that is the same one that im referring to. one of the books here was correct, the other wasnt.

It was
2, Kitabus Salaat - The Book of Five Daily Prayer
Compiled by Ahmed Luqmani
Published by 1986 Bohra Reformist Trust UK

i think you are referring to the same book that i am. i remember the last page was ayat al kursi written phonetically in english and the english translation

[zinger]

ok another question now.

We started Nabi na naam from last night right.

i know that the nabi na naam is for Adam AS, Eve AS, Noah AS, Abraham AS, Moses AS, Jesus AS, RasulAllah SAW and all the other prophets Jameeil Ambiye

My query was what are the meaning of the words in bold

Abeena Adama Saifillahe wa alehi ajmeein

Hawwah al motah harrate minarijse wa alehi ajmeein

Nueehin Najiyeeyilahe wa aalehi ajmein

Ibrahim Khallilahewa aalehi ajmein

Moosa Kaleemilahe wa aalehi ajmein

Isa Roohellahe wa aalehi ajmein

jameeil ambiye wa mursalina wa aalehi ajmein

please excuse the spelling mistakes

replies will be much obliged

I am no expert but I know (hopefully) a little, so I will tell you what I think.

Ibrahim Nabi: Khallilallah (Khalil means a friend), and he is referred to as a friend of Allah. This comes from [Surah 4: Verse 125], the last part of which can be translated as "For Allah did take Ibrahim for a friend".

Musa Kaleemillah (One to whom Allah spoke directly). [Surah 4: Verse 164]: And to Moses Allah spoke direct. Hence he is referred to by the respected title "One to whom Allah spoke direct". Also [Surah 19: Verse 52]: And we called him From the right side of Mount (Sinai), and made him draw near to Us for mystic (conversation).

Isa Nabi: I am guessing Roohillah as one supported by the Holy Spirit (my guess).
Mohammad (SAW) Rasullah, as the Rasul (messenger) through whom Allah brought forth the book (Holy Quran), that being the most important miracle of Prophet Mohammad's ministry.
-----------

I want to be clear that I am just a starting student of Islam. Am no expert. This is just my humble effort, and if I am wrong, I will appreciate being corrected. Also, the translation is from Abdullah Yusuf Ali.

wow that was awesome. thanks. could you take a guess at the other names please?

thanks. much appreciated

[SBM]

This is for Biradar or Porus if he is still reading
Can you put the translation of Haazehis Salaat and the significance why one has to do this on their cheeks since now Sajda to Dai has become very common.
Secondly also the translation of the writing by STS Tau Baale Mann Mautaa Maadi..and....Waza efuna Tasbih..

[Biradar]

This is for Biradar or Porus if he is still reading
Can you put the translation of Haazehis Salaat and the significance why one has to do this on their cheeks since now Sajda to Dai has become very common.
Secondly also the translation of the writing by STS Tau Baale Mann Mautaa Maadi..and....Waza efuna Tasbih..

I don't understand what is the relevance of your statement "since now Sajda to Dai has become very common." is. In any case:

Haazehis Salat is simply a small du'a which gifts the Lailatul Qadar washeq namaaz that one has just concluded to the Prophet and Maulatuna Fatema. No mention of da'i or anything to do with him. Here is the translation:

"I dedicate the salaat [Laulatual Qadar washeq] to Mulana Mohammad [Prophet] and Maulatuna Fatema. May this be accepted and may its reward be manifold"

You can find the translation of "Waza’ifuna" on the Fatemidawat website:

http://www.fatemidawat.com/prayers/qasi ... ifuna.html

I have no clue what you mean by "Tau Baale Mann Mautaa Maadi". Perhaps you heard some garbled words? Sorry. Perhaps you mean the munajaat one recites after the Istiftah namaaz. In that case, the translation is also on the Fatemidawat website:

https://fatemidawat.files.wordpress.com ... jaat-1.pdf

I should say that many of the dua's are very beautiful, written over a very long period of time. In fact, some are attributed to Maulana Ali, some to Imam Zain al-Abedeen, some to S. Moayaad Shirazi, to various other da'is etc. Many of these du'as are also found in Shia collections also.

[Biradar]

Some points about the munajaat one recites after the istiftah namaaz. It is split into two parts. The first describes the spiritual journey of the believer to prostrates himself in front of Allah, in the darkness of the night, when everyone else is sleeping. (These prayers are meant to be said in the middle of the night). The second half changes voice and is written from the perspective of Allah. One way to think about this is that the believer is so confident in the mercy of Allah to succor him/her that he is confident that Allah has heard his requests and will respond to him directly. The second half of the munajaat (from the perspective of Allah) are as follows:

"Labbayk, servant of mine, you are in my
protection I know of everything you speak

My angels savor your voice. Enough for you that I, too, hear it

Your prayer penetrates my veils I forgive your sins

Ask me without fear or trepidation. Do not be afraid: I am Allah"

I have to say that when I hear this munajaat recited, or read it, it sends a electric feeling in my heart. There is no fear of hell, no worry about punishment. Just forgiveness and love, and utter and complete understanding.

[SBM]

Biradar
Shukran
I meant the Munajat
The reason I said about Sajda is that in my earlier upbringing I was told that we do it on right and left cheek was to avoid having Sajda since anything we say in Sadja was meant for Allaha and that is why we recite Hazhe Silat on the side cheeks
Yes you are right some of the Duas and Munajats after Istiftah are really heart warming and beautiful be ut since many are aware of its translation they can not appreciate it.
Thank you

[Biradar]

This is in response to the question posed by zinger about "Nabi na naam".

Some background is first needed. As is well known, Islam has a cyclical conception of prophetic cycles. Each cycle is started by Aadam, followed by Nooh, Ibrahim, Moosa, Isa and then Muhammad. These are major prophets, each ending the previous era, and bringing in a new shaaria and scripture. The Ismailis take this to the next logical development by asking what happened before Aadam? In this conception of the prophetic cycles, the name Aadam is actually a cypher for a prophet to ends the previous cycle and inaugurates the current cycle of prophecy. However, he is just one among the many "Aadam" figures who have gone before, stretching back into the deep past. The whole Earthly cycle was started by the First Aadam, who was also the mustaqar Imam of his time. Before that the physical world did not yet exist and physical time did not yet exist. Yet, an "Aadam" did exist and his "fall" led to the creation of the Earth and its inhabitants.

The names of various prophets recited in the last few days after the last Friday of Ramadan are symbolic of this. Each prophet is designated by his key attribute. All prophets before Muhammad were limited in their scope (so to speak) and brought in a shaaria that would be eventually abrogated by the following prophet. Each represents a stage of development, incomplete till the arrival of the Seal of Prophets, Muhammad. After Muhammad (who represents perfection in the prophetic chain) there won't be any prophets in this era, till the saaheb of Qiyaama arrives and brings to end this grand cycle of prophecy, and inaugurating an era of open knowledge. That in turn will eventually end, and a new "Aadam" will being the whole cycle again.

Now, it may seem odd that Hawwaa, the wife of Aadam, is included in this list. There are several levels of meaning here. The most obvious is that Hawwaa represents the mother of all humanity. However, as I said above, Aadam of this era was not really the "first" human (like in the Biblical story of Eden) but one among many. Hence, the significance of his "wife" is actually different than that.

In any case, the recitation of "Naabi na naam" is divided into several parts. First, one praises Allah and seeks forgiveness. Then one recites the names of the prophets. Then one offers two rakat namaaz and then ends with a couple of du'as. The translation of the salawaat are as follows:

1. O Allah send salawaat upon our father Aadam the Chosen One of Allah, and upon his descendants
2. O Allah send salawaat upon out mother Hawwaa the One Purified and upon her descendants
3. O Allah send salawaat upon Nooh the One Saved from the Flood, and upon his descendants
4. O Allah send salawaat upon Ibrahim the Friend of Allah, and upon his descendants
5. O Allah send salawaat upon Moosa the One to Whom Allah Spoke, and upon his descendants
6. O Allah send salawaat upon Isa the Spirit of Allah, and upon his successors
7. O Allah send salawaat upon Muhammad, the Messenger of Allah, and upon his descendants.
8. O Allah send salawaat upon all the [non-canonical] prophets and messengers and their descendants.

Here the word "descendants" is for the ones who succeeded to the particular prophet's mission. Sometimes it was physical descendants, sometimes not.

I should also mention that the final prophet, Muhamaad is unique in that to him belongs all attributes of perfection, which were only incompletely revealed in the previous prophets. Hence, Muhammaad, on the night of Meraj, leads all the assembled prophets in prayers, symbolically indicating his superiority to all the prophets who have gone before him.

Hope this helps.

[zinger]

This is in response to the question posed by zinger about "Nabi na naam".

Some background is first needed. As is well known, Islam has a cyclical conception of prophetic cycles. Each cycle is started by Aadam, followed by Nooh, Ibrahim, Moosa, Isa and then Muhammad. These are major prophets, each ending the previous era, and bringing in a new shaaria and scripture. The Ismailis take this to the next logical development by asking what happened before Aadam? In this conception of the prophetic cycles, the name Aadam is actually a cypher for a prophet to ends the previous cycle and inaugurates the current cycle of prophecy. However, he is just one among the many "Aadam" figures who have gone before, stretching back into the deep past. The whole Earthly cycle was started by the First Aadam, who was also the mustaqar Imam of his time. Before that the physical world did not yet exist and physical time did not yet exist. Yet, an "Aadam" did exist and his "fall" led to the creation of the Earth and its inhabitants.

The names of various prophets recited in the last few days after the last Friday of Ramadan are symbolic of this. Each prophet is designated by his key attribute. All prophets before Muhammad were limited in their scope (so to speak) and brought in a shaaria that would be eventually abrogated by the following prophet. Each represents a stage of development, incomplete till the arrival of the Seal of Prophets, Muhammad. After Muhammad (who represents perfection in the prophetic chain) there won't be any prophets in this era, till the saaheb of Qiyaama arrives and brings to end this grand cycle of prophecy, and inaugurating an era of open knowledge. That in turn will eventually end, and a new "Aadam" will being the whole cycle again.

Now, it may seem odd that Hawwaa, the wife of Aadam, is included in this list. There are several levels of meaning here. The most obvious is that Hawwaa represents the mother of all humanity. However, as I said above, Aadam of this era was not really the "first" human (like in the Biblical story of Eden) but one among many. Hence, the significance of his "wife" is actually different than that.

In any case, the recitation of "Naabi na naam" is divided into several parts. First, one praises Allah and seeks forgiveness. Then one recites the names of the prophets. Then one offers two rakat namaaz and then ends with a couple of du'as. The translation of the salawaat are as follows:

1. O Allah send salawaat upon our father Aadam the Chosen One of Allah, and upon his descendants
2. O Allah send salawaat upon out mother Hawwaa the One Purified and upon her descendants
3. O Allah send salawaat upon Nooh the One Saved from the Flood, and upon his descendants
4. O Allah send salawaat upon Ibrahim the Friend of Allah, and upon his descendants
5. O Allah send salawaat upon Moosa the One to Whom Allah Spoke, and upon his descendants
6. O Allah send salawaat upon Isa the Spirit of Allah, and upon his successors
7. O Allah send salawaat upon Muhammad, the Messenger of Allah, and upon his descendants.
8. O Allah send salawaat upon all the [non-canonical] prophets and messengers and their descendants.

Here the word "descendants" is for the ones who succeeded to the particular prophet's mission. Sometimes it was physical descendants, sometimes not.

I should also mention that the final prophet, Muhamaad is unique in that to him belongs all attributes of perfection, which were only incompletely revealed in the previous prophets. Hence, Muhammaad, on the night of Meraj, leads all the assembled prophets in prayers, symbolically indicating his superiority to all the prophets who have gone before him.

Hope this helps.

yes, it helped immensely altough while it cleared one confusion it created more...

So.. Adam (as in Adam and Eve of the Garden of Eden) are not the original Adam? Was there an Adam before him? Or are you saying that he was the first Adam and thence came other Adams after him?

I have more queries, but will take them one step at a time.

If these are topics that are taught in sabaks and cannot be discussed in open, then please do let me know, we can end it here, or better yet, we can take it in PM

[SBM]

If these are topics that are taught in sabaks and cannot be discussed in open, then please do let me know, we can end it here, or better yet, we can take it in PM

Why not share with everyone and educate everyone instead of hiding behind TAWEEL AND SECRETIVE SABAKS.

[Biradar]

If these are topics that are taught in sabaks and cannot be discussed in open, then please do let me know, we can end it here, or better yet, we can take it in PM

Why not share with everyone and educate everyone instead of hiding behind TAWEEL AND SECRETIVE SABAKS.

There nothing really "secret" about these ideas. As I have said numerous times before, Ismaili (and in general Islamic) philosophical ideas are very complex, and need a significant effort and investment to understand. Specially, as a lot of ideas in these "haqa'aiq" books are only alluded to, the assumption being that one has some grounding in the subject already. No book, as far as I am aware, is written for "beginners". The assumption was that the transition to understanding these text for oneself would be guided by a teacher, who would explain difficulties and obscurities of language and ideas. For example, an allusion to say "Aalam-e-Ibda" was to show up in a text. How would one understand that without someone to tell you what it meant, or where to look ?

Now, I am not suggesting you can't learn these things on your own. I did. However, it takes time and effort and not superficial reading on an internet forum.

Incidentally, I should say a good summary of early Tayyebi beliefs is available in summary translation into English, prepared by V. Ivanov. The translation was copied on the Alavi Bohra website (without attributing it to Ivanov). You can read it:

http://alavibohra.org/Taj-ul-Aqaa'id.htm

This book was originally written by the 5th da'i al-mutlaq, S. Ali b. Muhammad al-Waleed. The history of S. Ali is interesting, and also relevant to the present schism. Perhaps one should recall it at some point. For now, the above link should be enough for curious folks to get started.

[Biradar]

If these are topics that are taught in sabaks and cannot be discussed in open, then please do let me know, we can end it here, or better yet, we can take it in PM

Why not share with everyone and educate everyone instead of hiding behind TAWEEL AND SECRETIVE SABAKS.

Also, how many times do I have to tell you that taweel is a level of knowledge, in which realities are revealed symbolically in the various acts of shaaria? I mean, it is not something one "hides behind". Sabaks are not secretive either. Sometimes one is instructed not to talk about it openly, but it is not to maintain some secret. As I keep repeating, ideas are complex, and just because you heard it in sabaak does not mean you actually understand it.

Now, I should mention that 90% of Amils are ignorant know-nothing buffoons. Its not possible to ask them anything as they themselves are ignorant. Best to leave them alone.

[SBM]

Biradar
That comment about secretive sabak was meant for Zinger who clearly said if it is in Sabak I want to end the conversation or PM him.
there was a time in our local Markaz when the Sabak was going on and after Sabak there was supposed to be a Majlis. Sabak went a little longer and when other who were not part of the Sabak arrived for Majlis were sternly told not to enter Markaz and stay out in hot sun. So please donot take it personally, Abdes and Amtes have taken Oath not to talk about what they discussed in Sabak and I know many who would tell me their personal life history but will not discuss an iota of learning in those secretive Sabaks.

[zinger]

If these are topics that are taught in sabaks and cannot be discussed in open, then please do let me know, we can end it here, or better yet, we can take it in PM

Why not share with everyone and educate everyone instead of hiding behind TAWEEL AND SECRETIVE SABAKS.

i have never attended a sabak so i dont know the rules that govern them. thats why im saying if there are some things that cant be revealed, then i will understand and not take it further.

[anajmi]

Ismaili (and in general Islamic) philosophical ideas are very complex, and need a significant effort and investment to understand.

Actually, Islam is very simple and easy to understand. This has been clarified by Allah in the Quran. The complexity has been introduced by humans to keep the subjects confused. Nothing that biradar mentions about the cyclical prophets and multi-adams is from the quran.

[Biradar]

Ismaili (and in general Islamic) philosophical ideas are very complex, and need a significant effort and investment to understand.

Actually, Islam is very simple and easy to understand. This has been clarified by Allah in the Quran. The complexity has been introduced by humans to keep the subjects confused. Nothing that biradar mentions about the cyclical prophets and multi-adams is from the quran.

Islam in its essence is simple, yes. Not in its details and in its deeper meanings. For example, lets take the tafseer of the Quran. Leave alone the whole taweel/haqiaat part out for the moment. The most famous Sunni tafseer is by Ibn Kathir. It is in 10 volumes, full of copious footnotes and references to other books. If, things were so simple, why would one need so much ink to explain?

Also, as usual, those who are blind can't understand how others can see beautiful colors when all they see is darkness. Sadly, spiritual blindness has no cure. No need to elaborate further.

[anajmi]

And yet, in none of those 10 volumes will you find the multi-adams or the concept of cyclical prophets.

By the way no one can be more spiritually blind than one who uses science to provide doubt about the existence of God.

There is a difference between using ink to explain and using ink to confuse. The tafseer of ibn katheer explains. Multi-adams and cyclical prophets creates confusion and doubt.

[Biradar]

And yet, in none of those 10 volumes will you find the multi-adams or the concept of cyclical prophets.

Exactly. First, once one understands the external aspects of the shaaria, then one can open ones eyes to the internal aspects. Sadly, those who are spiritually blind won't understand. Ibn Kathir stopped at the external aspects, but did not delve deeper. Like goats and sheep who eat the skin and not the fruit. Others did delve deeper, based on the Quran and the teachings of the prophet and the imams. Sadly, it is hard to convince someone who is blind that really, colors do exist. But its okay, one can continue to believe that the world is really as dark and dreary as the blind make it out to be.

[anajmi]

The Quran or the prophet does not talk about multi-adams or cyclical prophets. Multi-adams and cyclical prophets have no basis in the quran or in the teachings of the prophet (saw). Ask biradar to provide a reference from the quran or sunnah and he will ask you to hit the library. Although if you end up with the tafseer of ibn katheer in the library it will be far more beneficial than this color of biradar. This color was added later by fiction writers. And this color has created the hidden imams, talking horses, dabba thalis, roti makers, thigh kissing payments, massallah spaces for sale, Hussain for sale, Ali for sale and above all, SMS, the representative of this colorful Imam. In short everything that is wrong with the bohra version of islam is because of this "color" added later!

[Biradar]

The Quran or the prophet does not talk about multi-adams or cyclical prophets. Multi-adams and cyclical prophets have no basis in the quran or in the teachings of the prophet (saw). Ask biradar to provide a reference from the quran or sunnah and he will ask you to hit the library.

All these are based on the Quran. Obviously. The Quran is not a simple book. There are many things which are alluded to in the Quran in a tangential way. In fact, bulk of the things we do are not found the Quran explicitly. If it was so, there would be no need to for the sunnah of the prophet. As this blind fellow anajmi has mentioned "sunnah" also, let me say that all these ideas are 100% based on the sunnah of the prophet and the imams. For the Shia, the divine inspiration of the prophet extends to his successors also. In particular, Ali was the one who revealed the inner aspects of the Quran and this role has subsequently taken up by the imams.

Also, look at this anti-intellectual blind man. He mocks going to the library. I mean, come on. Where else can you learn? Did you learn computer programming by staring at the Quran? Or listening to mad rants of your local mullah? Where else can you learn if not a library?

Of course, there is the possibility that anajmi is a prophet and knows everything himself. If so, he should let us know. Perhaps he is the awaited maahdi and the seventh naatiq? Or, perhaps anajmi is Allah himself? He must be, as he seems so confident that the world must be as dark and dreary as his sightless eyes make it out to be. Come on, anajmi, fess up and tell us: are you a prophet?

[anajmi]

Still waiting for a reference from the Quran or Sunnah or even Ali referring to the multi-adams and cyclical prophets. Anything coming after them can be attributed to a vivid imagination and frequent trips to the fairy tale aection of the library.

Remember, what is true for the biradari "shia" isnt necessarily true unless it can be traced back to the quran and the sunnah of the prophet. Otherwise even SMS is receiving divine inspiration! Such divine inspiration would be valuable in hollywood or bollywood. Not on the day that matters most.

[anajmi]

Obviously. The Quran is not a simple book.

Actually Allah himself says in the quran that He has made it easy to understand. I am sure biradar, with his frequent trips to the library doesnt need a reference. Or does he?

So anyone who claims that the quran is not easy to understand is a liar. And once you put in a little effort you will understand that cyclical prophets are there only to take you around in circles.