La'nat

[Adam]

La'nat is mentioned in the Quran 42 times.

In reply to Gulam Mohammed post he says:

Whereas, Quran generally talks about 'laanat' it means 'rejection' of the ways of the kuffar and the latter's removal from Allah's grace on the day of Judgement.

This isn't totally true, as there are many more categories of people who are worthy of La'nat.
In the Quran, Allah, his Malaekat and the "people" pray La'nat on the following:
-Kafereen (non believers)
-Those who didn't follow Musa
-Who hide & deny the Truth
-Liars
-Zalemeen (Tyrants)
-The followers of Saturday (Jews)
-Killer of a Mumin
-Mushrik
-The people going into hell fire will pray La'nat on each other for leading them astray and also pray La'nat on their so called leaders.
- People of A'ad
-Fir'awn and his people
-Iblees
-Person who accuses someone else
- Those who make life difficult for the Prophet

GM then says:

When Allah invokes laanat on Kuffar, that does not give Muslims a command to do likewise. That encroaches on Allah's privilege, a clear case of arrogance. Only Allah can judge who to reject.

This is also incorrect as in the following chapters, along with Allah, the angels and the PEOPLE pray la'nat. Therefore, even the people can pray La'nat, as long as its justified

161|إِنَّ ٱلَّذِينَ كَفَرُوا۟ وَمَاتُوا۟ وَهُمْ كُفَّارٌ أُو۟لَٰٓئِكَ عَلَيْهِمْ لَعْنَةُ ٱللَّهِ وَٱلْمَلَٰٓئِكَةِ وَٱلنَّاسِ أَجْمَعِينَ
(Those who did Kufr and died as Kafirs, on them is the La'nat of Allah, the angels and the PEOPLE)

لُعِنَ ٱلَّذِينَ كَفَرُوا۟ مِنۢ بَنِىٓ إِسْرَٰٓءِيلَ عَلَىٰ لِسَانِ دَاوُۥدَ وَعِيسَى ٱبْنِ مَرْيَمَ ۚ ذَٰلِكَ بِمَا عَصَوا۟ وَّكَانُوا۟ يَعْتَدُونَ
Dawood Nabi, and Isa Nabi prayed La'at on the Kafirs of Banu Israel

2|159|إِنَّ ٱلَّذِينَ يَكْتُمُونَ مَآ أَنزَلْنَا مِنَ ٱلْبَيِّنَٰتِ وَٱلْهُدَىٰ مِنۢ بَعْدِ مَا بَيَّنَّٰهُ لِلنَّاسِ فِى ٱلْكِتَٰبِ ۙ أُو۟لَٰٓئِكَ يَلْعَنُهُمُ ٱللَّهُ وَيَلْعَنُهُمُ ٱللَّٰعِنُونَ
Those who hid the Truth, have the La'nat of Allah and the LA'NAT prayers (angels/people etc).

So in the above it is clear that Allah, angels and the people can pray La'nat.
GM says:

There is no ayat in the Quran which asks Muslims to invoke 'laanat' on anyone. In any case, that would be against the spirit of the Quran.

This statement is completely false and shows his lack of understanding of the Quran.

We Shias/DBs pray La'nat on those whom we believe fall into the above categories. (Zalim, Kafir, killer, liar, accuser etc etc)

[anajmi]

So in other words it would be ok for me to pray for La'nat on the Dawoodi-Bohra Dai as I consider him a Zalim, a liar, a Mushrik and various other.

May Allah's La'nat be on him. Thankfully, this is an anonymous board and I won't have to apologize for it on national TV.

[Adam]

As long as you've accepted the above. I'm the winner

You're belief is your belief.
لكم دينكم و لي دين

[anajmi]

Winner of what bitch? Have I ever said that you shouldn't curse anyone? I would be the first and foremost to send Allah's curse on the likes of kothar and it's bitches.

If your Dai felt so strongly about cursing the first three khalifas, he wouldn't have eaten his words and apologized on national TV. Shameless!!

[Bohra spring]

Anajmi you have crossed the line please do not use the lanat word...

It is one point to criticise the dial of Abdes but it is not appropriate to use such language , we can be civil in our arguments .

I regret that I will ask the admin to delete the post. As I have stated previously we have to be consistent in our standards .

[anajmi]

bro bohra spring,

Are you saying that when Allah uses the Lanat word in the Quran, he is being uncivilized? It is surprising that you didn't have a problem with my using the word "bitch"!

[Bohra spring]

So in other words it would be ok for me to pray for La'nat on the Dawoodi-Bohra Dai as I consider him a Zalim, a liar, a Mushrik and various other.

May Allah's La'nat be on him. Thankfully, this is an anonymous board and I won't have to apologize for it on national TV.

I have issue with these statements....the lanat that bohras use against the ashaba is hurtful and if you mean to use the same intent on SMB it is derogatory . If they throw mud on our leaders we should not necessary that we throw dirt on them.

I think you know what i meant.

[anajmi]

I do not agree with you. People who deserve to have dirt thrown on them, should get dirt thrown on them. I've had enough of this goody two-shoes bs.

[anajmi]

There is a tradition, I think it is from the prophet (saw) but I cannot confirm right now, that when someone sends a baddua (I think we can replace it with a Lanat) to someone who doesn't deserve it, the lanat eventually comes back onto the person who uttered it. So one has to be very careful before seeking baddua for someone. That is the reason people advise others to stay away from Lanat. What if the person is undeserving of it? But we are certain of the deeds of the Dai his leeches and we have seen the amount of pain and oppression they have caused and the damage that they have done, amongst the abde idiots, as far as the teachings of Islam is concerned. I think they are very well deserving of our baddua.

[ghulam muhammed]

In the Quran, Allah, his Malaekat and the "people" pray La'nat on the following:-
Kafereen (non believers)
-Those who didn't follow Musa
-Who hide & deny the Truth
-Liars
-Zalemeen (Tyrants)
-The followers of Saturday (Jews)
-Killer of a Mumin
-Mushrik

1) WHO HIDE AND DENY THE TRUTH - Doesnt the Dai do this very often although abdes may not agree to it as they are blinded but there have been many posts on this forum which if viewed with a rational and unbiased mind will confirm the same.

2) LIARS - The LIES spoken by the 51st Dai in the Chandabhai Gulla Case is well documented on this forum, hence is he not entitled for a Laanat ?

3) ZALEMEEN (Tyrants) - The extortionist ways, the terror of baraat and the threat to refuse burial of dead inflicted on bohras who refuse to pay money to the Dai and his zaadas amounts to them being a Zalemeen and hence are they not eligible for Laanat ? This may also be difficult for abdes to digest but is Narendra Modi not a tyrant ?? And what does the Dai do to him who is the most eligible candidate for Laanat..................... He felicitates him, gives a cheque of over Rs.One crore and drapes a shawl around him.

4) KILLER OF A MUMIN - One doesnt need to know rocket science to figure out as to how Narendra Modi fits the bill. He is not only responsible for the killings and rape of over 2000 muslims who according to the brain washed abdes may not be Mumins but what about the bohras who too were killed ?

WHY DOESNT THE DAI AND HIS FOLLOWERS HAVE THE BALLS TO UTTER LAANAT ON NARENDRA MODI, BAL THACKEREY AND L.K.ADVANI WHO FIT THE ABOVE MENTIONED CATEGORY AS SPECIFIED BY ADAM. WHY ARE THE ONES WHO DESERVE LAANAT ARE 'FELICITATED, HONOURED BY THE DAI" ?? THE SAUDI KING TOO FITS INTO THE ABOVE CATEGORY AS HE IS RESPONSIBLE FOR THE DEMOLITION OF VARIOUS HOLY PLACES IN THE KINGDOM. WHY IS LAANAT NOT SHOWERED ON HIM BUT THE CARS GIFTED BY HIM ARE PROUDLY USED BY THE DAI ??

The above cases are for everyone to see whereas the past cases of khalifas are only pieces of history penned down by people some 1400 years ago, many of whom must have had some hidden agenda and prone to distort, fabricate and manipulate history.

[anajmi]

Great points raised by you bro GM.

How about saying Lanats on Mushriks? Who is a mushrik? Once who associates partners with Allah. Bohras claim that the Dai is a partner with Allah since you won't be able to enter Jannah without the permission of the Dai. Hence bohras who believe such are mushriks. Hence they are deserving of Lanats.

Then we have Person who accuses someone else . The kothar and it's bitches accuse the progressives of misdeeds all the time when it they themselves who are the culprits. Hence they become deserving of Allah's Lanats.

[KhalifatulRahman]

thankyou for posting these qualities of a lanati....and when I compare them, mb and Mufaddal perfectly matches with a lanati quality....so let the lanat of ALLAH,ANGELS,JINS,HUMAN be on all tyrants......

[Fateh]

How a humanbeing prove that this or that human is liar or musharik or munafiq or jalemin etc.?As no one know internal belief of any human besides Allah.So in my pov no one besides Allah & haq na saheb who is naib of Allah can utter lanat on any human.so we should not utter lanat to any one.

[KhalifatulRahman]

How a humanbeing prove that this or that human is liar or musharik or munafiq or jalemin etc.?As no one know internal belief of any human besides Allah.So in my pov no one besides Allah & haq na saheb who is naib of Allah can utter lanat on any human.so we should not utter lanat to any one.

do u think yazeed was lanati?

[Adam]

@Gulam Mohammed

Thank you for your post and expressing your opinions.
It doesn't seem you are competent to understand you are missing the point you raised. Instead, you are jumping to a different discussion If you recall, your comment as actually saying that saying La'nat is not justified, if I may quote you:

Whereas, Quran generally talks about 'laanat' it means 'rejection' of the ways of the kuffar and the latter's removal from Allah's grace on the day of Judgement.

When Allah invokes laanat on Kuffar, that does not give Muslims a command to do likewise. That encroaches on Allah's privilege, a clear case of arrogance. Only Allah can judge who to reject.

There is no ayat in the Quran which asks Muslims to invoke 'laanat' on anyone. In any case, that would be against the spirit of the Quran.

Your above 3 statements are to to deny the practice of La'nat by people completely. I have proved you wrong in my above statement. By your last statement namely talking about my religious leader, you have in turn ACCEPTED that La'nat is justified. Therefore, accepted that I am right, and you were wrong.

The whole discussion is about LA'NAT and how it is justified (In the Quran, Allah, the Angels, Prophets and people pray La'nat).
Now, it is a seperate discussion as to whom is worthy of this La'nat, and it is based on each persons belief and opinion, as to whom it should be said on, and why.

First accept the root, then move to the branch.
Concluding: La'nat is Justified. You are wrong.

[Fateh]

How a humanbeing prove that this or that human is liar or musharik or munafiq or jalemin etc.?As no one know internal belief of any human besides Allah.So in my pov no one besides Allah & haq na saheb who is naib of Allah can utter lanat on any human.so we should not utter lanat to any one.

do u think yazeed was lanati?

yes of course he was a lanti,because his deed clearly said he was lanti.

[anajmi]

It looks like Adam has accepted the fact that they have been cursing the wrong people. That is why he wants to steer clear of that discussion. It has been proven beyond a doubt that the practice of lanat followed by the Dai and his Kothari bitches is a complete reversal of what has been advised by the Quran. They sleep with the real killers of muslims and curse the great sahaba of the prophet (saw). Every time this idiot brings the Quran into the picture, the Quran gives us more material to hammer him with.

[Al Zulfiqar]

Concluding: La'nat is Justified.

so if the dai's actions are well-proven to be unislamic, unethical, immoral and kufr-filled, then according to your own conclusion, its ok if 99.99% of muslims who are not slaves of the dai, utter laanats against him? kaisi lagi mirchi?

[ghulam muhammed]

"Laanat" has now become like Matam...24x7. Iam reminded of an incident which took place in early "90s. A dawoodi bohra named Husaini Bhagat had once invited Zain Rangoonwala, the Padma Shree award winner and Managing Director of Bombay Mercantile Co-op Bank Ltd, for his son Huzefa's wedding reception held at Parish Hall, Christ Church School, Byculla, Mumbai. As Rangoonwala was excommunicated from the community by the Dai for not allowing the zaadas to take control of the cash rich bank, Mr.Bhagat was severely reprimanded alongwith many rich sidhpuri bohras including Fakhrudin and Saifudin Khorakhiwala of Akbarallays/Wockhardt and Taher Tambawala, owner of Atlas Mill Compound. The filthy rich sidhpuri bohras had to face a very hard time as all of them were boycotted by kothar and eventually they alongwith their family had to go to to the Dai with a "Maafi naama" and take fresh Misaq after paying lakhs of rupees by way of penalty.

To further humiliate Husaini Bhagat who was a resident of Chennai, the then head amil of Chennai Syed ul Khair (Brother-in-law of Mansoos and son of Yusuf Najmuddin) gathered all the bohras of chennai in the masjid after maghrib and showered "Laanat" on Husaini Bhagat which was echoed by all the abdes in chorus !!! Now this is how Laanat is USED by the Dai and his henchmen !!

[Adam]

Above is a perfect example of GulamMohammeds ways of flooding the talk with nonsense.
He was was asked a direct question, but doesn't answer. I will post it again just in case he missed it:
Summary is, GM tried to say La'nat cannot be said by a man, which was proven wrong.
First accept that, then move on.

@Gulam Mohammed

Thank you for your post and expressing your opinions.
It doesn't seem you are competent to understand you are missing the point you raised. Instead, you are jumping to a different discussion If you recall, your comment as actually saying that saying La'nat is not justified, if I may quote you:
Whereas, Quran generally talks about 'laanat' it means 'rejection' of the ways of the kuffar and the latter's removal from Allah's grace on the day of Judgement.

When Allah invokes laanat on Kuffar, that does not give Muslims a command to do likewise. That encroaches on Allah's privilege, a clear case of arrogance. Only Allah can judge who to reject.

There is no ayat in the Quran which asks Muslims to invoke 'laanat' on anyone. In any case, that would be against the spirit of the Quran.


Your above 3 statements are to to deny the practice of La'nat by people completely. I have proved you wrong in my above statement. By your last statement namely talking about my religious leader, you have in turn ACCEPTED that La'nat is justified. Therefore, accepted that I am right, and you were wrong.

The whole discussion is about LA'NAT and how it is justified (In the Quran, Allah, the Angels, Prophets and people pray La'nat).
Now, it is a seperate discussion as to whom is worthy of this La'nat, and it is based on each persons belief and opinion, as to whom it should be said on, and why.

First accept the root, then move to the branch.
Concluding: La'nat is Justified. You are wrong.
Adam

Posts: 826
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2011 7:50 am

[ghulam muhammed]

Above is a perfect example of GulamMohammeds ways of flooding the talk with nonsense.
He was was asked a direct question, but doesn't answer.

I have flooded the debate with articles that are relevant to the subject, I havent pasted articles of the dai's hunting spree here but only those which shows how laanat is delibarately misused by the dai on various occasions. You got disturbed because of your master's exposures and not because the topic was irrelevant. Hence anything that has to do with the subject issue will be posted whether you like it or not.

[ghulam muhammed]

@ Adam,

Kindly quote from your authentic sources, the number of times that laanat has been showered on the 3 khalifas and ummul mumenin by Mola Ali (a.s.), Imam Hassan (a.s.), Imam Hussain (a.s.) and other Imams. Kindly also give references wherein the earlier dais have showered laanats during sermons and which were echoed by his followers.

[Al Zulfiqar]

bro. gm,

you have posted a direct question to adam. now let us see if he answers to the point, or invents a lame excuse to avoid doing so.

[Adam]

@GM
Good question. I do have a few examples of the same.
But can you please clarify whether you believe and accept that in the Quran, Allah, the angels and the People pray La'nat on the wrong do-ers (which ever category they fall into).
We can proceed once we know you accept the Quran or not. If you don't, then there's really no point continuing.

[Al Zulfiqar]

bro. gm,

you have posted a direct question to adam. now let us see if he answers to the point, or invents a lame excuse to avoid doing so.

[Adam]

Just incase you missed my earlier post:

@GM
Good question. I do have a few examples of the same.
But can you please clarify whether you believe and accept that in the Quran, Allah, the angels and the People pray La'nat on the wrong do-ers (which ever category they fall into).
We can proceed once we know you accept the Quran or not. If you don't, then there's really no point continuing.

[Al Zulfiqar]

bro. gm,

you have posted a direct question to adam. now let us see if he answers to the point or invents a lame excuse to avoid doing so.

[Adam]

Haha. What a child.
GM.
I'm sure you're reading my question. It questions your source of believing the Quran or not.

[SBM]

Adam
But can you please clarify whether you believe and accept that in the Quran, Allah, the angels and the People pray La'nat on the wrong do-ers (which ever category they fall into).

Adam
Why any time a question is posted to you you want to know the belief of the person. Previously when confronted you asked whether a person believes in Dawat or not and now you want some one to believe in Quran before you can answer
WHAT IF I DO NOT BELIEVE IN ANYTHING BUT I WANT TO LEARN. WHAT IF A NON MUSLIM COMES TO YOU AND WANT TO KNOW ABOUT ISLAM SO HE CAN DECIDE TO REVERT BACK TO ISLAM YOU ARE GOING TO ASK HIM TO FIRST BELIEVE AND THEN YOU WILL TALK IS THIS HOW THEY DO IN KOTHARI SABAAKS

[humanbeing]

Dear SBM
“What is you belief ?”
This is a lousy and boring tactic used in sabaks when uncomfortable questions are asked. Idea is to make the questioner feel guilty of raising questions to these thugs.
First they will ask what is your belief type question and when a person answers in “yes” they will say “this is how it is - take it or leave it” .. and when person says “No” they will say “why answer, when you dont believe !”