why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

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Sufi monk
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why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#1

Unread post by Sufi monk » Sat May 03, 2014 3:26 am

Bismillah,

if mazoon and mukasir are nothing and they are not given any importance in dawat, why these rutbas are created?

how many books are written on them? how much do we know about them?

if they were just supposed to be sideline, why these rutbas even exists?

if there is some nass issue who can be the best person after dai to resolve it?

how many mazoon or mukasir in past have gone astray and claimed daiship?

true_bohra
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#2

Unread post by true_bohra » Sat May 03, 2014 4:21 am

Mazoon and Mukasir of the past....ask the guy who takes your online sabaq about them...

and these rutbas exist to help the Dai but unfortunately there was a mazoon who never understood it and always ran for self glorification.

humanbeing
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#3

Unread post by humanbeing » Sat May 03, 2014 4:29 am

What are the KRAs ( KEY RESPONSIBILITY AREAS) of these positions ?

DAI, MAZOON and MUKASIR

humanbeing
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#4

Unread post by humanbeing » Sat May 03, 2014 4:30 am

true_bohra wrote: always ran for self glorification.
Who from Kothar is not into self glorification ?

Sufi monk
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#5

Unread post by Sufi monk » Sat May 03, 2014 4:38 am

Numbers of books are written on SMB, number of videos and birthday occasions are well known of SMB, isn't this self glorification?

DAI/MAZOON/MUKASIR are most important people in dawat, if DAI is glorified why not other positions?

and in absence of proof of NASS, why MAZOON cant be considered best person to solve this issue?

such a big rift happened in dawat, yet no official statement has came from MUKASIRE dawat? normal bohris dont even know what mukasir sahab has to say about all this.

as far as I know from online research there is NOT a single incident in which MAZOON or MUKASIR has claimed daiship and gone astray, but there are incident when son of DAI has gone blind in hunger of wealth and power.

is this a joke?

true_bohra
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#6

Unread post by true_bohra » Sat May 03, 2014 4:50 am

Syedi Mukasir Saheb has clarified his stand very well and you guys have commented on the same...HAVE YOU FORGOT THAT.

The position of Dai is far ahead in comparison to that of Mazoon and Mukasir. So if book is written on him then it is no wonder. But writing a book and eulogies about Mazoon and not for Dai is strange.

Sufi monk
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#7

Unread post by Sufi monk » Sat May 03, 2014 5:10 am

true_bohra wrote:Syedi Mukasir Saheb has clarified his stand very well and you guys have commented on the same...HAVE YOU FORGOT THAT.

The position of Dai is far ahead in comparison to that of Mazoon and Mukasir. So if book is written on him then it is no wonder. But writing a book and eulogies about Mazoon and not for Dai is strange.
what was his clarification? please provide video//text of his statement?

this is my question is, if mazoon or mukasir are so miserable in nature that even a book cant be written on them, why such rutba exists?

Sufi monk
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#8

Unread post by Sufi monk » Sat May 03, 2014 5:16 am

SMB chose hindu person to come in his dream and testify about muffy daiship? while I am still waiting to hear statement from mukasire dawat?

a hindu person is trusted over mazoon and mukasir?

what is going on?

Rebel
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#9

Unread post by Rebel » Sat May 03, 2014 3:11 pm

They choose Hindu person in his dream because they themselves are ancestors of Hindus, there forefathers were all Hindus...why do ever direct their lineage to the progeny of Prophet and Imams...progeny of Imams cannot be dictators like them...descendants of Imams would never live the life as they are living at the expense of the community. What is wrong with my head? How can I ever accept these stooges running my life...following them so blindly.

salaar
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#10

Unread post by salaar » Sat May 03, 2014 4:28 pm

let us be honest to ourselves, if you read history the mazoon and mukasir e dawat have always played active role, its like when the battle is going on you always see the king observing his forces giving commands and the siph e salaar fights in the centre of the battle directly confronting the enemy, this is the real role of mazoon and mukasir e dawat, maula is the final authority and mazoon and mukasir are his hujjat, they are there to do khidmat e ilmia and amaliya for dai, however there has never been a comparison of powers between these rutbas and mazoon and mukasir always stand in front of maula with folded hands, not to forget about syedi khanjee feer who stood on the gates of daewrih of syedna for a little mis presentation of the accounts considering himself as a ghulam and not boasting to be a mukasir e dawat, during present time these rutbas were there and must be doing their jobs accordingly but the public focus had always been on the dai, one more thing, as this is a period when scores of people are ready to do all kind of khidmats therefore the focus is divided otherwise in history there were such difficult times that dai has to remain in hidings for days and during that period these sahibs played their active roles in running dawats day to day affairs.

y-kuc
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#11

Unread post by y-kuc » Sat May 03, 2014 4:35 pm

Sufi monk wrote:
true_bohra wrote:Syedi Mukasir Saheb has clarified his stand very well and you guys have commented on the same...HAVE YOU FORGOT THAT.

The position of Dai is far ahead in comparison to that of Mazoon and Mukasir. So if book is written on him then it is no wonder. But writing a book and eulogies about Mazoon and not for Dai is strange.
what was his clarification? please provide video//text of his statement?

this is my question is, if mazoon or mukasir are so miserable in nature that even a book cant be written on them, why such rutba exists?


TB, I do not know how many "dawat na kitabs" you have had a chance to study but what I have read in these kitabs is that -
During SATR of Imam there are some 'n' number of hudood of imam (the exact number escapes me) who take care of his Dawat na umoor, of which the DAI, MAZOON and MUKASIR are the last three.
Note they are "Imam na Hudood"

Now about the position of Dai being Far Ahead of Mazoon is anyone's guess if they are the last three of the Imam's Hudoods minding his Dawat.

Sufi monk
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#12

Unread post by Sufi monk » Sat May 03, 2014 11:11 pm

Thank you all for replying to this thread, now it is clear MAZOON is the best person to rely at this moment when things are unclear.

no matter how hard muffy stooges try to hide truth, HAQ will prevail by itself.

Sufi monk
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#13

Unread post by Sufi monk » Sat May 03, 2014 11:16 pm

all those who gave misaaq till now including muffy himself has broke misaaq by abusing mazoon e dawat, now all his milqat and his own wife is haraam on them, they must walk to kaba 70 times to ask for forgiveness, even then their sins wont be forgiven.

till now they were giving misaaq keeping grudges for mazoon in their heart, they were not sincere in their Misaaq, in short they abused SMB by giving him FAKE misaaq.

Sheikh Moiz
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#14

Unread post by Sheikh Moiz » Sun May 04, 2014 4:38 am

I have been reading this forum from last few months and witnessing mufaddal bhai sahab supporters only responds when they think they can win, as soon as they see they are losing ground they vanish to never come back.

clearly shows how shallow their arguments and logic are compare to SKQ supporters, anyone with open eye can see where the truth stands.

Sceptical
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#15

Unread post by Sceptical » Sun May 04, 2014 5:42 am

Sheikh Moiz wrote:I have been reading this forum from last few months and witnessing mufaddal bhai sahab supporters only responds when they think they can win
Totally agree with you.
No constructive debate can be done.

Sheikh Moiz
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#16

Unread post by Sheikh Moiz » Sun May 04, 2014 5:53 am

most MS abde ridicule call names try to provoke and when see no chance of winning with logic they go underground and only reappear when particular topic goes buried.

very cowardly tactics are used to hide truth.

hasman001
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Joined: Sat Jan 25, 2014 4:40 am

Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#17

Unread post by hasman001 » Sun May 04, 2014 10:50 am

Brother shk moiz: these abdes are moles planted here to collect information from the forum and try to deceive people seeking truth with their lies

true_bohra
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#18

Unread post by true_bohra » Sun May 04, 2014 2:20 pm

Seriously are you seeking truth??

Truth has place in such filthy and rotten thoughts??

And is this forum really informative so that we can collect information??

james
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Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:06 am

Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#19

Unread post by james » Sun May 04, 2014 3:52 pm

It is hilarious to see incredible troll this forum. :lol:

Sheikh Moiz
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#20

Unread post by Sheikh Moiz » Sun May 04, 2014 7:07 pm

hasman001 wrote:Brother shk moiz: these abdes are moles planted here to collect information from the forum and try to deceive people seeking truth with their lies
you are correct, yet no one came up with reply on above topic, but they do jump up to divert topics.

Rebel
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#21

Unread post by Rebel » Sun May 04, 2014 8:55 pm

Did they have these rutbas in Prophets time?

Sheikh Moiz
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#22

Unread post by Sheikh Moiz » Sun May 04, 2014 9:29 pm

Rebel wrote:Did they have these rutbas in Prophets time?
rutba of wasi was always in ISLAMIC history, so by this logic mazoon and mukasir are wasi of DAI, we can also call them sucessor.

by this logic, MAZZOON first haq is his to claim for successorship if there is some confusion and people should listen to him.

Rebel
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#23

Unread post by Rebel » Sun May 04, 2014 9:43 pm

Sheikh Moiz wrote:
Rebel wrote:Did they have these rutbas in Prophets time?
rutba of wasi was always in ISLAMIC history, so by this logic mazoon and mukasir are wasi of DAI, we can also call them sucessor.

by this logic, MAZZOON first haq is his to claim for successorship if there is some confusion and people should listen to him.
I understand what you are trying to relate, wasi was Moulana Ali (AS), but did Moulana Ali (AS) have rutba of Mazoon or are these rutbas came into affect after the split between ismailis and isna asheri or during the development of duats in Yemen and India.

Sufi monk
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#24

Unread post by Sufi monk » Sun May 04, 2014 10:22 pm

one thing really amaze me, SMB had 7 son, none of them follows sincerity and simplicity?

I mean none even 1 is willing to follow truth?

usually at least 1 is different from the crowd and he does what is right.

way2go
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#25

Unread post by way2go » Sun May 04, 2014 11:24 pm

Sufi monk wrote:one thing really amaze me, SMB had 7 son, none of them follows sincerity and simplicity?

I mean none even 1 is willing to follow truth?

usually at least 1 is different from the crowd and he does what is right.
Sufi monk bhai..... There was one.....who definately was better than the rest but unfortunately he is no more. :(

ghulam muhammed
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#26

Unread post by ghulam muhammed » Mon May 05, 2014 4:38 pm

way2go wrote:Sufi monk bhai..... There was one.....who definately was better than the rest but unfortunately he is no more.
Are you referring to Huzefa bhaisaab ? I have met him on a few occasions and had lengthy discussions with him at his Badri Mahal office on 4th floor, details of which I cant reveal. He seemed to be OK, probably as he was educated and well versed. He had studied law and was an LLB and even worked with a leading law firm in Mumbai, I think it was M/s.Mulla & Mulla (Muffy's lawyers in the current succession case in Mumbai) or M/s. Little & Co. I didn't find him arrogant or harsh, he was quite cool !!

true_bohra
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Re: why mazoon and mukasir rutbas?

#27

Unread post by true_bohra » Mon May 05, 2014 11:45 pm

Softer side for shz Huzefa bs....

He was quite cool for you but if i am not mistaken then quite recently all shehzadas were arrogant and rude for you.