Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

The one and only free public forum for Bohras. The focus of this forum is the reform movement, the Dawoodi Bohra faith and, of course, the corrupt priesthood. But the discussion is in no way restricted to the Bohras alone.
Mumin_52
Posts: 3
Joined: Thu May 26, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#61

Unread post by Mumin_52 » Tue May 31, 2005 11:34 am

Very true Akeel ... When people dont have words to prove their point .. they looks for ways to escape (like ..May God Bless U ).. Its for sure that god will bless us only, as we follow the right path.
To follow a scholar who guides you to straight path is ok, but to worship him is no no. True Muslim is required to worship only Allah SWT. Worshipping Moulana br. Mumin_52, is not the path shown by Rasullah S.A which leads to Jannat.
Dear "Muslim First" .. answer my 1 question.. who taught you about Allah? Did you get any kind of enlightment or prechings directly from Allah ?..
If you belive that there is Allah .. and you pray namaz and read quran which was taught by Rasullah S.A.. why dont you belive in Rasullah?

Its always mentioned that Rasullah is Messanger of Allah ... and we workship him as a leader who knows the path which leads to god. Never any muslim or even Rashullah himself mentioned he is God.. He is person who always shows the right path and without his prechings you cant reach the final destination.

akeel
Posts: 31
Joined: Tue May 31, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#62

Unread post by akeel » Tue May 31, 2005 11:49 am

please stop making your own conclusions about what the bohras believe and not believe and if they should be muslims or not. First of all if you think bohras would not be considered muslims due to their practices then i ask one thing what are you trying to reform then. First of all you trying to just force your point of view on everyone else . You all claim that more than 70 % are supporters of your cause i actually read that somewhere and it was the biggest dis-illusion i ve seen. You say that most of them support your cause but are scared to come forth in fear of actions taken by the clergy. So i ask you one thing ....why would so many people turn out in thousands every where Syedna (TUS) goes. No one keeps a track of who is coming and who is not . people can easily avoid coming if they don not sincerely beleive in Syedna (TUS ). I have been for every live coverage that took place recently and it was packed. out of the total population of bohras which is 15000 here i would say a 1000 may have not turned up and we have a good estimation of how many ppl did come and it was a working day early in the morning people took an off and all that and kids missed exams . so if all the ppl turning out according to you is just 30% then i have surely missed the sudden rise in Bohra population in the recent past.
And Syedna(TUS) himslef has never refered or implied that he is anything more than the servant of the Imam. He is the sole representative of the office of the Imam. Now if you don believe in the Imam then thats a totally different ball game. But i do and a million other ppl do too and for us and nothing you or your so called reformist people can ever change that. Think about it

Agnostic
Posts: 15
Joined: Tue May 24, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#63

Unread post by Agnostic » Tue May 31, 2005 2:18 pm

Something for Bohras to be proud of:

http://s91211913.onlinehome.us/saifeehospital/index.htm

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#64

Unread post by Muslim First » Tue May 31, 2005 2:19 pm

Br. Mumin_52

Question: who taught you about Allah? Did you get any kind of enlightment or prechings directly from Allah ?..

I was born into Islam, so I naturally I know Allah as only God,who is to be worshipped. Prophet SAW was messenger of Allah SWT. Allah revealed to him Quran and he showed us correct way to worship Allah SWT. He also forbade us to worship him, or any other human being, Jinns, Holymen, trees, Dead people, Graves etc. etc.

Therfore a Muslim should only worship Allah SWT. Only correct way to worship Allah is in Quran and as shown by our prophet.

It is shirk to invoke anybody except Allah SWT. So to say 'Yaa Maula' or 'Yaa Muhammad' or 'Yaa Ali' or 'Yaa Hussain' is shirk.

Wasallam
.

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#65

Unread post by Muslim First » Tue May 31, 2005 2:33 pm

Shaifee Hospital;

Nice Building, Nice rooms.

Mass Gen. Hospital does not have VIP consulting rooms. VIP and comman person (CP)use same doctors, same waitng area and same patient area. So when we will have integrated facility in India?

May Allah bless those who have contributed to make this hospital.

Wasalaam
.

tahir
Posts: 1229
Joined: Sat Apr 20, 2002 4:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#66

Unread post by tahir » Tue May 31, 2005 3:02 pm

that was pretty enlightening "muslim first"....but I am afraid u'v got a wrong audience here....those guys want that orgasmic pain from that crooked finger up their asses....u r trying to tell them to worship the moon instead of the self pointing crooked finger...but that crooked finger has plugged their ears too....

porus
Posts: 3594
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#67

Unread post by porus » Tue May 31, 2005 5:06 pm

Originally posted by Muslim First:
...I was born into Islam, so I naturally I know Allah as only God,who is to be worshipped...
With respect, that statement is more appropriate coming from a child. Once you become an adult, you can no longer use it as a statement of faith because it is a statement about having been brainwashed.

Nabi (saw) said that "man arafa nafsa-hu, fa arafa rabba-hu".

So Nabi's instruction is to "know yourself". The reason why Ismaili and Sufi path to Islam is far superior to others is because they emphasize inner quest. By Ismaili, I mean the Fatemi tradition of Gnosis as it existed during the time of the Fatimid Khulafa in Egypt. I do not mean its perversion by contemporary Bohra priesthood into Dai-ism

Humsafar
Posts: 2623
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2000 5:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#68

Unread post by Humsafar » Tue May 31, 2005 5:50 pm

Those who are crowing about the new Saifee Hospital need to consider a few things before they get carried away by their collective sense of communal pride.

The first thing to consider is, who is this hospital for? Is it for the poor and need who otherwise cannot afford expensive health care? Obviously not. The hospital is only for those who can afford its spanking new, state-of-the-art services. In other words, it is for people who would always have access to top-notch health care - because they have the money to buy it. Having a new Saifee hospital makes no difference to them except that they now have a new address to brag about.

And it makes no difference to the poor and needy because they remain as high and dry without access to decent, affordable health care as before the Saifee hospital. If the story about free 30 beds for poor Bohras is true then perhaps that's about the only good thing that can come out of this hospital.

So guys, let's put this in perspective. This hospital is a business venture. It's like building a hotel or setting up a shoe factory. The people who have invested in it intend to turn a profit from its operation.

The hospital is NOT a charity. It is NOT going to be run by donations with nominal user fee. It is NOT a non-profit organisation. But the way every Bohra chest is puffing up with pride it seems as if it were indeed a charity and free for all Bohras.

Yes, the hospital is nice and great (as MF says, and aesthetically/architecturally quite an eyesore in my opinion) but has little social value. Or as much social value as building a mosque or a Rauduhat Tahira. Potentates and powerful men like to build huge, high-profile institutions primarily to massage their egos, pad up their legacy and impress little people. Palaces, cathedrals and the like have the same purpose and effect.

For those who charge as to what have reformists done. Well, nothing as high-profile and exclusive as this. But in Udaipur - where reformists are well established - we've set up clinics to provide primary health care at a very nominal fee and free of charge to those who cannot afford even that. We've two clinics now run by volunteers on donation and whatever little income they can muster and attended by qualified paid doctors. This is the kind of basic, everyday health care people need and communities should provide. If people can get basic and affordable medical attention early on, major complications can be avoided - and thus the need for BIG hospitals.

So, to conclude, what the Sayedna could have done is instead of building this huge, inaccessible facility, he should have built small clinics to provide affordable (if not free) medical care in cities and towns where bohras live. That would have done greater good to the community than Saifee hospital ever will. An that would have been really GREAT. But then, there would be no glory in it for the Sayedna and no prime minister would be needed to inaugurate it.

guest786
Posts: 16
Joined: Mon May 30, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#69

Unread post by guest786 » Tue May 31, 2005 11:57 pm

humsafar.... i totally agree with what u r saying. and thats what i was trying to convey to everyone. that even i as a bohri wud boast to others that we have one of the best hospitals in asia but for whom it is ?? its not on charity (not even for the bohris) so its just showing off and nothing more.

porus
Posts: 3594
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#70

Unread post by porus » Wed Jun 01, 2005 12:48 am

It is all about glory. Why? So the present and future generations of Bohras can hold their heads up high. We built it, you see! Our Dai built it, you see!

But a note of caution. Time levels all. So I quote Ozymandias:

I met a traveler from an antique land
Who said: Two vast and trunkless legs of stone
Stand in the desert. Near them, on the sand,
Half sunk, a shattered visage lies, whose frown,
And wrinkled lip, and sneer of cold command,
Tell that its sculptor well those passions read,
Which yet survive, stamped on these lifeless things,
The hand that mocked them, and the heart that fed,
And on the pedestal these words appear:
"My name is Ozymandias, King of Kings:
Look upon my works, ye Mighty, and despair!"

Nothing beside remains. Round the decay
Of that colossal wreck, boundless and bare
The lone and level sands stretch far away.

mumineen
Posts: 494
Joined: Sun Dec 10, 2000 5:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#71

Unread post by mumineen » Wed Jun 01, 2005 12:50 am

We said on MAy 24/05:
"Nobody is jealous of the Grand Saifee Hospital. It is the delusion of grandeur and showmanship - at the expense of the gullible and oppressed Bohri Community, by the Kothar and Aqua Moula which is obscene and uncalled for."

Average Bohra
Posts: 924
Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2003 5:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#72

Unread post by Average Bohra » Wed Jun 01, 2005 1:42 am

MOHD HUSSAIN,

Pick your battles and be realistic about the outcome. Asking a politician not to attend the inauguration of a hospital is like asking a fat dog not to fart.

tahir
Posts: 1229
Joined: Sat Apr 20, 2002 4:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#73

Unread post by tahir » Wed Jun 01, 2005 3:53 am

I guess the underlying purpose is not to stop any politician from attending the innaugration but to make him aware of the exploitation within the community which is otherwise tightly veiled by the kothar........the hospital innaugration just provided a good occasion...

mbohra
Posts: 242
Joined: Fri Aug 13, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#74

Unread post by mbohra » Wed Jun 01, 2005 5:29 am

One can freely write to the PM Manmohan Singh Saheb - under the heading of SOCIAL JUSTICE.

http://pmindia.nic.in/write.htm

In the body of the memo, one can also refer to the:

transcripts of Bill S.13 - investigations and the outcome of investigations by the Senate of Canada on HH Aqa Moula:

http://dawoodi-bohras.com/issues/senate_1.htm

http://dawoodi-bohras.com/issues/senate_2.htm

tahir
Posts: 1229
Joined: Sat Apr 20, 2002 4:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#75

Unread post by tahir » Wed Jun 01, 2005 6:59 am

porus,
So Nabi's instruction is to "know yourself". The reason why Ismaili and Sufi path to Islam is far superior to others is because they emphasize inner quest
I was always fascinated by the Sufis and used to think that they do not represent true islam. They were very individualistic and so averse to structure and organisation which stunts personal growth and hinders enlightenment . For learning, they chose their own unique "guru" instead of the entire community having a single(human) head. Can you send me some more of those verses of the prophet (along with the meaning) that encourage "inner quest"?

I have had people trying to convince me that bohris also started off on somewhat similar lines. And if that is true, my take on bohris is that they must have tried to "organise" self enlightenment and self growth by imposing a structure and a common spiritual head for the entire community (forgetting that it is supposed to be a highly individual affair).......over generations, it degenerated into the currupt and greedy dawat of the present day (which is the logical culmination of any rigid organisation).

WiseBohra
Posts: 37
Joined: Fri Dec 22, 2000 5:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#76

Unread post by WiseBohra » Wed Jun 01, 2005 6:05 pm

Dear brother and sister
saifee hospital in mumbai is going to be for rich.If there is 30 bed's reserve for poor bohras that will be nice, but it is to good to be true as more likely it will be reserved for sultan family< kothar and close chamchas will benefit from these 30 beds free treatment!! from this site it is known that it is not charitable hospital please can any one confirm that it is not charitable.
If it is 30 bed reserved for poor bohras i am asking the management of saifee hospital to post the authorised booklet on this message board about the proof that 30 beds are reserved for poor bohras!!why only bohras, any community any religion or faith should be benefited from saifee hospital.On the saifee Hospital management there should be board members from progressive Bohras.
Hamsafar is right to suggest that there should be primary health clinic in every city for the benefit of Bohras.
There is one city in gujarat the Rajkot has the best Bohra clinic for past 31 years and it is well established and run by Rajkot Jumaat and i heard it is true cosmopollitan everyone is getting treatment primary health care whatever faith or religion you belong to you will get the treatment.Even patient's will be seen by specialist consultant on certain day's.and i heard Bohra clinic has got many award for the immunisation programme for the children.
other jumaat has to learn from rajkot how it is run. To sultan Mr mohammed Burhanuddin i know i criticise you but in Rajkot i heard somehow nasty Amil hasn't got much influence over the clinic other wise it will be disaster for the clinic. every jumaat in india should start primary health clinic in small town,villages and cities so Bohra mumineen can benefit and other community will be benefit, instead you the sultan farman demolished old masjid and building new one instead you can build this primary health clinic.
just one thing my source said there is progressive clinic in Rajkot run by Progressive family it is there for 35 years.
wasalaam

babu
Posts: 210
Joined: Thu Jul 01, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#77

Unread post by babu » Wed Jun 01, 2005 6:54 pm

TO
H.E. Engineer Asgher Ali

Respected sir,

This is with the reference of your letter to the Indian President Dr. A.P.J. Abul Kalam for his proposed visit to the Saifee Hospital

Are you honestly trying to say that the charges listed in your letter are genuine?

What we are doing please leave it on us; You just worry about yourself and your followers,

A slight exaggeration of the truth is no longer truth.

This is Nothing more than a cheap publicity stunt of you.

Never waste jealousy on a real man: it is the imaginary man that supplants us all in the long run. ~George Bernard Shaw

Thanx , Hope you will mind it, Who cares?

ILAHEE MERE DOST HO KHAIRYAT SE
YE KYUN GHAR MAIN PATHTHAR NAHIN AA RAHE HAIN ....

Truely Not yours

babu

trance
Posts: 28
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2004 4:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#78

Unread post by trance » Thu Jun 02, 2005 3:01 pm

Oi ajghar and lanat na tukdas , what have you remotely achieved in comparison to our beloved aka mola ! Any hospitals, education facilities, masjids, mazaars, madresah, roza, donations to relief aid, quardan hasana ,betterment for the community, uplifment programs and showering mumineen with barakaat ?

exactly jack all, Apart from making your presence in jahanam more stronger together with dragging your materialistic entourage , muddais. and gaining few poxy awards nothing. very materialistic !!!!!!!!

So how come you non belivers are misled by ajghar and his bull. You make yourself to be highly intelectuals but you seem to be following a path to nowhere, think again.

gtg

mumineen
Posts: 494
Joined: Sun Dec 10, 2000 5:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#79

Unread post by mumineen » Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:27 am

The Un-Truth by the Toronto Jamaat



Dear Mumineen of Toronto:



Baad Afzalusalaam

…………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………..



It is an important day in Dawat's history. Inspite of the incessant attempts by mukhalefeen for the last 25 years to stall the project, the judgement came in our favour and as soon as the judgement came, Aqa Moula(TUS) embarked on this ambitious project of building one of a kind hospital where mumineen and gher mumineen will benefit and get treated.

...............................................................................................................

................................................................................................................

Abeede Syedna(TIS)

Anjumane Burhan





The Real Truth





SIR ADAMJI PEERBHOY SANATORIUM CASE
SUPREME COURT'S FINAL JUDGEMENT

---------------------------------------------------------
The following is the final judgement delivered by the Supreme Court of India in Sir Adamji Peerphoy Sanatorium Case (1999 S.O.L Case No. 826) on 3rd February 2000 before judges S.B. Majumdar and AP Misra. Appelant - Hatim Merchant v/s respondent - Salehbahi Saifuddin
---------------------------------------------------------

JUDGEMENT
Umesh C. Banerji, J -

The Orders of the City Civil Court Application No. 18 of 1976 dated 5.8.1991 and 22.10.1991 as modified by the Order of the Bombay High Court dated 15.7.1993 in Letters Patent Appeal No. 103 of 1991 are confirmed save and except as modified by the following directions:
Thirty (30) beds in the proposed Saifee Hospital shall be reserved for the treatment of members of the Dawoodi Bohra Community free of charge. Such beds to be provided to economically needy Dawoodi Bohras regardless of whether they have taken the Oath of allegiance (Misaq) or not and regardless of whether they have been excommunicated or not.
{This must be noted here that the trustees of Sayedna who are going to built a commercial Hospital on the Trust Property of the Bohra Community and who are going to collect crores of rupees again from the community to construct this hospital, were not ready to give a single bed free for the needy Dawoodi Bohras, it is by the efforts of the reformists that they are now compelled to give 30 beds free in hospital of around 300 beds. These greedy trustees were also intending to use Sir Adamji Peerbhoy's Sanatorium for hospital purpose but the reformists have succeeded in retaining the Sanatorium for charitable and religious purpose as per the earlier objects of and name of Sir Adamji Peerbhoy- Editor}

3. Wing A and B of the Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium Trust shall not be demolished unless and until a sum of Rs. 1 Crore is deposited by the Trustees of Saifee Hospital Trust in a separate Bank Account to be opened for this purpose. The utilization of the said sum of Rs. 1 Crore shall be in accordance with the Orders (construction of Sanatorium building). It is placed on record that a sum of Rs. 1 Crore has already been deposited by the Saifee Hospital Trust on 23rd November, 1999.

4. The Trustees of Saifee Hospital Trust undertake to this Court and are accordingly directed to complete the construction of the Sanatorium Wing of minimum built up area of 16,000 square feet within five years from the date of commencement of demolition of Wing A and B of the Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium Trust property.

The plans annexed to the Affidavit of Mudreka T. Zakiuddin dated 8.10.1997 at Volume XIV page 2237 to 2262 filed in this Court shall be amended to bring the entrance of the sanatorium Wing to the front of the building facing Maharishi Karve Marge.

The cost of the construction of the Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium Wing of the proposed building with minimum built up area of 16,000 square feet and within the time frame (5 years) as indicated above shall be born by the Saifee Hospital Trust. The Trust would also furnish the Sanatorium fully so as to make it a comfortable living and resting place for the Musafirs. It is further clarified that the entire maintenance of Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanitarium also Durdah and the open space shall be effected by the Saifee Hospital Trust in the same way and manner so of the Hospital.

(The vindictive Trustees of Sayedna were trying to use Sanatorium Wing as extension of Saifee Hospital for pre and post operation patients. This was very clearly mentioned in the affidavit of Ali Asghar Kalimuddin and in the earlier plans by Baqir stating Sanatorium as Nursing Home. That is why the Supreme Court has to direct so clearly and emphatically. That is Sanatorium must be named as Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium and must be reserved only for Musafirs. -Editor)

5. The open area adjacent to the Mosque and Darghah of Adamji Peerbhoy in the Adamji Peerbhoy Trust property which is shown in green colour in the plan annexed to the Affidavit of Respondent No. 11 (Mudreka Zakiuddin) dated 8.10.1997 at page 2253 of volume XIV filed herein shall be used exclusively for the purpose of the Mosque and shall always be available to the Mosque for the use of devotees (Namazees).

(It should be noted here that the vindictive Trustees had shown this open area as garden and children's play ground in the plans submitted to the Supreme Court. It was obvious that they wanted to hide Sir Adamji Peerbhoy's Dargah behind the trees in the garden so that his memory is wiped out once for all. So the Court had to give this clear and emphatic direction to the Trustees.)

6. Upon completion of the project, an open able gate shall be placed on the East and West sides the newly constructed property for the purpose of distinguishing separately the area of the Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium, his Mosque and Dargah from the area of the Hospital. These gates which shall be ordinarily be kept locked shall be designed and placed in a manner so as to facilitate without any obstruction the entry, exit, passage and movement during emergencies of the fire-brigade vehicles, ambulances and hearses around the property. The however shall be kept under the care and custody of the Saifee Hospital Trust but a set of duplicate keys would be kept with the Caretaker of the Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium for use during emergency.

7. The gates and entrance to the Sanatorium and Mosque portions of the building shall bear the name of Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium and/or Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium Trust. The gates and entrance to the Hospital portion of the building shall bear the name of Saifee Hospital and /or Saifee Hospital Trust on the gate posts, and the name of Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium and or Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium Trust on the opposite gate posts in letters of equal size and prominence. If the name of Saifee Hospital or Saifee Hospital Trust is put up on any exterior surface of the Hospital Wing then the name of Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium Trust shall be placed alongside the same or one after the other with due regard to the Anesthetics of the Building with equal size and prominence.

(It should be noted that in the plans submitted by the Mudreka Zakiuddin in the Supreme Court and the Model of the new building exhibited in the Saifee Masjid in Sept. 1999 the entrance of the Saifee Hospital was shown in the center with 'Saifee Hospital' written on it and without mentioning the name of Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium, so as to fool the public that the entire building is for Saifee Hospital. The Supreme court has rejected that plan and has directed the Trustees to make new plans with the entrances and the names of Saifee Hospital and Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium with equal prominence. Trustees review petition in this regard was also rejected by the Supreme court. Editor)

8. It is placed on record that the State Government is prepared to renew the lease. The details and the particulars in this regard thereto would appear herein below under the head directions. ( It is to be noted that when the plans of Sayedna's trustees to construct a Modern Commercial Complex after demolition of Mosque, Dargah of Sir A.P. and Sanatorium failed, they came for Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium, his Mosque and Dargah from the area of the Hospital. These gates which shall be ordinarily be kept locked shall be designed and placed in a manner so as to facilitate without any obstruction the entry, exit, passage and movement during emergencies of the fire-brigade vehicles, ambulances and hearses around the property. The however shall be kept under the care and custody of the Saifee Hospital Trust but a set of duplicate keys would be kept with the Caretaker of the Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium for use during emergency.

9. The gates and entrance to the Sanatorium and Mosque portions of the building shall bear the name of Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium and/or Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium Trust. The gates and entrance to the Hospital portion of the building shall bear the name of Saifee Hospital and /or Saifee Hospital Trust on the gate posts, and the name of Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium and or Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium Trust on the opposite gate posts in letters of equal size and prominence. If the name of Saifee Hospital or Saifee Hospital Trust is put up on any exterior surface of the Hospital Wing then the name of Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium Trust shall be placed alongside the same or one after the other with due regard to the Anesthetics of the Building with equal size and prominence.

(It should be noted that in the plans submitted by the Mudreka Zakiuddin in the Supreme Court and the Model of the new building exhibited in the Saifee Masjid in Sept. 1999 the entrance of the Saifee Hospital was shown in the center with 'Saifee Hospital' written on it and without mentioning the name of Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium, so as to fool the public that the entire building is for Saifee Hospital. The Supreme Court has rejected that plan and has directed the Trustees to make new plans with the entrances and the names of Saifee Hospital and Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium with equal prominence. Trustees review petition in this regard was also rejected by the Supreme Court. Editor)

10. It is placed on record that the State Government is prepared to renew the lease. The details and the particulars in this regard thereto would appear herein below under the head directions.

(It is to be noted that when the plans of Sayedna's trustees to construct a Modern Commercial Complex after demolition of Mosque, Dargah of Sir A.P. and Sanatorium failed, they came for ward with a 'noble project of building a public hospital in the name of Saifee Hospital. It was a commercial project for which they entered with the State Government for commercial lease, lease rent being more than Rs. 99 lakh per year. The reformist fought against this high rate lease as Sayedna's sole intention was to sale of this land of worth 200 Crores, which is clear from the lease document. Supreme Court thus called the representatives of the State Government and gave orders to renew the lease as per the original terms of lease rent of Rs. 247/- per year instead of more than Rs. 99 lakh per year.)

11. The Trustees of Saifee Hospital Trust undertake that the entire ground rent for the Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium Trust property will be paid by the Saifee Hospital Trust for and on behalf of Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium Trust.

However, in the event of non-payment of such a rent for a period of three months the State Government being the less or will intimate Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Trust and call the latter to pay the arrears within further period of three months together with the current rate of rent and in the event, however, if there is any failure to pay on the part of Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium Trust, within the period, as aforesaid, the property lease deed shall stand automatically terminated and the land and the constructions thereon shall stand vested on the State Government excepting however, the area for the Dargah of Sir Adamji Peerbhoy and his Mosque and the open and adjacent thereto as earmarked in the plan.

In the event, however, on payment by Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Trust the property shall stand vested on to Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium Trust.

12. Save and except the modifications in the Scheme of the Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium Trust as granted by the City Civil Court at Bombay in its Order dated 5.8.1991, the Original Scheme of the Trust as settled by the Bombay High Court in 1931 stands confirmed and thus shall remain operative and in force in all other aspects.

(It must be noted here that the original Scheme of Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Trust was framed by the Bombay High Court in 1931 wherein the Bohra Religious head (Sayedna) is kept absolutely out of this Sanatorium. The Sanatorium's Mosque, according to the original Scheme is not under control of Sayedna and there he wanted to destroy this Mosque by fraud. Editor).

13. The confirmation of Orders as above of the City Civil Court at Bombay and the High Court of Judicature at Bombay by this Court are however without prejudice to the right of the parties to adopt such remedies as are available in law against the concerned Trustees for any malfeasance (misconduct especially in official capacity) or misfeasance (detrimental to the interest of the Trust).

(It is to be noted that the Supreme Court was aware of various violations of Court orders and fraud committed by the Trustees and therefore it has kept this option open for the reformist to take legal actions at lower level against the trustees to remove them from the Trust. Late Mansoor Jani on behalf of The Dawoodi Bohra Jamat, Bombay had already taken up the matter at the Charity Commissioner and lower court level which would be followed up the Jamat Insha-Allah)

14. All contentions other than those expressly decided by the City Civil Court and High Court and as dealt with hereinbefore in this order by this Court are kept open.

15. We do feel it expedient to issue the following directives to the State Government of Maharastra:-

i. The orders given under the government Memorandum No. S-30/91/21 1923 CR No. 46/J-2, dated 28.2.1994 for renewal of lease in favour of the Trust stands cancelled by this order.

ii. The Policy laid down under Government Resolution No. IND 1085/134222 CR No. 184/J-2, dated 5.10.1999 for renewal of the expired Gov. lease is made applicable in this matter as a Special Case and the lease is being renewed from the date 1.7.1983 in favour of Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Trust. The ground rent at the rate of 1% on 50% concessional value of the value calculated as per the market value prevailing at the time of expiry of the lease i.e. on the date 1.7.1983 shall be charged at the time of the renewal.

iii. The lease shall be renewed for the further period of 30 years from the date 1.1.1999 and for that purpose, the ground rent at the rate of 1% on the amount arrived at after calculating 50% concessional value of the land at the market rate prevailing on 1.1.1999 shall be charged as the said land would be used for hospital/religious purpose.

iv. The ground rent rate shall be hiked by 10% after every 10 years.

v. The State Government is hereby directed to accord permission to sub-lease the land for building Saifee Hospital.

vi. The documentation of the said lease shall be prepared by the Government Solicitor and Joint Secretary, Law and Judiciary Dept.

vii. 25 beds shall be reserved for Government employees in the Saifee Hospital.

viii. Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Trust and the Saifee Hospital Trust shall take precaution, while carrying out new construction for the Hospital to see that no, let or hindrance is caused to the religious place as well as the graveyard located there.

(It is important to note that Sayedna's trustees who claim to be religious went to the extent of demolishing the Mosque, then they tried to cut down the mosque area in the set back and finally they showed the open area of the mosque for garden. Similarly first they included the entire adjoining Bohra graveyard for construction of the Hospital, then they brought car-parking for hospital on that graveyard and finally they wanted cars run-way on that graveyard. The reformist objected strongly to all such devilish proposal. And therefore, the Supreme Court has strongly warned the Hospital Trust to due care to see that no let out or hindrance is caused to the Mosque and the graveyard. It is shame that the Supreme Court needs to remind our Sayedna the regard and respect which the religious places required.-Editor)

ix. While renewing the lease of Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium due regard to be given to the convent, provisions and stipulations as are available in the lease deed of 1888 excepting, however, the rate of rent as mentioned hereinbefore.

16. We do feel it fit and proper to record that needful should be done to see that the solemn objects with which Sir Adamji Peerbhoy Sanatorium Trust was created are respected and in the same way the requirements of the Hospital also be met on essential terms, on the expectation of which this order is passed as above.

Parties are directed to bear their own costs.

.........................J

(S.B. Majmudar)

..............................J

(A.P. Misra)

..............................J

(Umesh C. Banerjee)

moomin052
Posts: 96
Joined: Tue May 24, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#80

Unread post by moomin052 » Fri Jun 03, 2005 6:39 am

to all muddais and their leader ajgar, when you claim to champion for the poor what have you done for them and do you mean that that the rich do not get sick or feel hungry and for the record this hospital will serve also the poor and we also have small clinics in all major towns where we recide and this clinics also serve other communities as well ,get off this envy wagon and stop being poisoned by ajgar(the only python in world with poison in him)othewise we all know what will happen to you

saifss
Posts: 1
Joined: Sat Jun 04, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#81

Unread post by saifss » Sat Jun 04, 2005 4:51 am

It is so sad to see that the topic of discussion was if the president is coming to inaugrate or not.

Lets all take it that there is no free meal in this world. The best is available to those who can afford it so why single out on Saifee hospital.

I would request you that religion is a matter of personal preference. You may choose what u wanna follow.

Ask not what others can do for you. Ask what you can do for others.

I have a small article which i want to share.

One fine day, a bus driver went to the bus garage, started his bus, and drove off along the route. No problems for the first few stops - a few people got on, a few got off, and things went generally well.

At the next stop, however, a big hulk of a guy got on. Six feet eight, built like a wrestler, arms hanging down to the ground. He glared at the driver and said, "Big John doesn't pay!" and sat down at the back.

Did I mention that the driver was five feet three, thin, and basically meek? Well, he was. Naturally, he didn't argue with Big John, but he wasn't happy about it.

The next day the same thing happened. Big John got on again, made a show of refusing to pay, and sat down. And the next day, the one after that, so forth. This grated on the bus driver, who started losing sleep over the way Big John was taking advantage of him.

Finally he could stand it no longer. He signed up for body building courses, karate, judo, and all that good stuff. By the end of the summer, he had become quite strong; what's more, he felt really good about himself.

So on the next Monday, when Big John once again got on the bus and said, "Big John doesn't pay!" the driver stood up, glared back at the passenger, and screamed, "And why not?"

With a surprised look on his face, Big John replied, "Big John has a bus pass."

Moral of the story:

"Be sure there is a problem in the first place before working hard to solve one."

tahir
Posts: 1229
Joined: Sat Apr 20, 2002 4:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#82

Unread post by tahir » Sat Jun 04, 2005 11:23 am

wish u had read between the lines instead of just the topic of the thread....the point is to register the protest agaisnt the curruption and exploitation of mulla burhanuddin to the political establishment of the country where the mulla's seat is....president's presence is a token gesture in favour of kothar and his absence a token gesture in favour of the reformists....but the real issue is to make them realise that all is not well beneath those angelic milky white kurtas and saayas.. so that next time if they see a whimper of smoke over badri mahal, they know that there is a fire in bohri lives....know what I am saying...these seemingly futile petitions will go a long way in making a solid base for the reformist cause.

ushay
Posts: 2
Joined: Sat Jun 04, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#83

Unread post by ushay » Sat Jun 04, 2005 8:33 pm

y3h to acha hua naam hum ney tera
apni kashti mein pehley sey likhwa liya
dur sey hum ko tufaan takta raha
bach gaye aaj hum dubtey dubtey !
regards to our beloved moula Syedna Mohammad Burhanuddin (TUS) for us he is the true spiritual leader no matter wht other munaafiks say !
DAI KEY DUSHMANO GAUR SEY AB SUNO
RAAH SEEDHI CHALO AKL SEY KAAM LO
AAJ TAK AESA REHBAR NA TUM LAA SAKEY
EK MUDDAT HUI DHUNDHTEY DHUNDHTEY !
dUndhtey reh jAogey :)

akeel
Posts: 31
Joined: Tue May 31, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#84

Unread post by akeel » Sun Jun 05, 2005 12:01 pm

i guess the PM and the presidents mail boxes were full hence your mails didnt reach them ......welll nice to know that all this hurt you all so much .....face it you are following a cause you all will never achieve... find one decent guy of learning that will praise your intentions.
believe me there are none ......all the support you have are of those who don have any purpose in life anyways.....just a bunch of people who from within the committe know everything thats wrong with it and decide oh lets change all that.
its nice we have poeple like you guys . u actually helping us by being even more convinced that we are right

Ajgar_Killer
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#85

Unread post by Ajgar_Killer » Sun Jun 05, 2005 1:08 pm

Joker Mohd.Hussain....what happened to your LETTER to PRESIDENT & PM...shayad HAWA nikal gayi...and also other reformist DOGS stopped BARKING completly... iss forum per pehle kabhi itni shaanti nahi dekhi ....shayad MANMOHAN SINGH ne tumhare KHUWABO ka MUMBAI mein janaza nikal diya isliyeeee...JALO, JALOOOO AUR JALOOOOOOOOO JALNA to hein hi, IDHAR bhi UDHAR bhi !!! :D ;)

akeel
Posts: 31
Joined: Tue May 31, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Please ask India's President to stop his visit to Bomb

#86

Unread post by akeel » Sun Jun 05, 2005 2:44 pm

yeah tahir this futile petitions seems to be helping you a lot. Whats it been since this whole thng you all started ...i cant remember once significant dent you all have made towards your cause. Name one.
And i read somewhere that the charitable hospitals in udaipur is what really helps the community there. well i have been there and i have seen what kind of help its giving. If you wanna compare that then there are saifee hospitals in many small twons of gujarat too and they in a lot better condition and serving the general population as a whole.
No hospital will ever run on only free service and hence there are 44 beds which are free of charge and thats going to be followed with as much accuracy as possible. If someone comes to ther hospital sayin he cant afford when he can then thats something that has to be left to his conscience. And the more people that go there and pay for the medical procedures the easier it will be to cater to the ones who cannot. The idea is to make it self sustaining and not depend on any outside funding all the time and thats the only way to do it.